Subject: WHAt sander to buy?

From: [email-masked] (David Kardelis- I am the NRA)
Date: 21 Feb 1994 18:21:41 GMT

I amlooking at getting some sanders.

I need a palm sander fairly soon. THis will be used mainly on wood to 
refinish furniture.
 I was also thinking on getting a belt sander, this would be used on both 
wood and steel/metals.

Any recommendations on what brand and features to get?

I was looking at the Ryobi corner sander(A small triangular sander for 
small places), Are these useful or just a gimmick.

		Thanks dave
==========================================================================
   David Kardelis		| I am the NRA-NRA Life
   Gradual Student in Physics   |
   Univ. of Ilinois		|	Looking for a new .SIG
   [email-masked]	|
   217-333-0505			|
Not necessarily the views of the ISSC or the UI At UC
==========================================================================

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From: [email-masked] (Michael J. Edelman)
Date: 21 Feb 1994 19:19:38 GMT

>I need a palm sander fairly soon. THis will be used mainly on wood to 

I have a Black and Decker, which is OK but just barely...and a Makita that is
much nicer. I also like the Porter Cable. IN fact, most of the palm sanders
out there are pretty good if you avoid the cheapest...

> I was also thinking on getting a belt sander, this would be used on both 

My 40+ year old Sears works pretty well. 
...
>small places), Are these useful or just a gimmick.
 
I've got one and it's a very handy thing; I used it extensively when I was
remodeling my kitchen to get into corners. I loaned it to a neigbor who was 
refinishing some doors and she loved it. But it's not of the same quality or
functionality as the Fein- of course, it can be had for about 1/6th the price
of the Fein.

--mike

---

From: [email-masked] (JOHN FARMER)
Date: 22 Feb 1994 15:15:25 -0500

>small places), Are these useful or just a gimmick.

Like all tools, everybody has an opinion.  Sometimes, several.

For palm/finishing sanders, I like the Porter-Cable 330.  It's 
reasonably priced and does an excellent job.  It is also very 
well built and should last forever.

I don't have a solid opinion about belt sanders, except to be 
sure to get one that takes one of the standard size belts such
as 3x21, 3x24, 4x24, etc.  The sander that I use (mine & Dad's)
is a 30 year old "Shopkraft" (at least I think that's its name)
that takes 4x21.75 belts.  It's a great sander.  Sometimes
it's lots of fun to find belts.  Side note:  Large batchs of
the same grit, I am ordering from Kingsflor (sp?).  Home Depot
has started carrying some individual belts in this size also.
When This snader dies or my Dad decides that he has to keep
it at his house, I will probably buy the P-C variable speed
belt sander with the dust collector bag.

In reference to the Ryobi corner sander, I thought about it, but
everybody that I talk to and everything read, says that the Fein
is a much better unit.  That the Ryobi will shake your hand off
with vibration.

Later
John T.

Just say I'm glad the flames have/are dying down...

-- 
John T. Farmer, Jr.					[email-masked]
Full-time Daddy, Part-time Grad Student,
Full-time wage slave, Wood butcher when I can.
My son's hero's are Capt. Jean Luc Picard, Norm Abrams, and Mr. Rogers!

---

From: [email-masked] (Steve Bainbridge)
Date: Tue, 22 Feb 1994 22:43:21 GMT

>is a much better unit.  That the Ryobi will shake your hand off

I have both the Ryobi palm sander and the corner model.  Both have done 
much to aggravate my carpal tunnel syndrome.  The Ryobi palm sander is also 
a pain, because it takes a 1/6th sheet size and none of my local vendors carry 
1/6th sheet sizes anymore.

>Just say I'm glad the flames have/are dying down...

Ditto.

Steve Bainbridge
[email-masked]
all standard disclaimers apply

---

From: [email-masked] (Doug Cutler)
Date: Wed, 23 Feb 94 09:23:09 EST

>1/6th sheet sizes anymore.
   The Ryobi corner sander is a _dog_, the vibration is absolutely the pits.
 Also it uses pressure adhesive triangles, when you get much sawdust on the
 pad they do not stick well.  I know it is four time the price but if you
 must have a triangular sander get the Fein, and get the hook/loop pad to
 go with it, about $7 for two.
   The Ryobi was really cheap at Woddworkers Supply about a year ago but the
 salesman taked me into the Fein, he did himself a favour, after handeling
 them both I would have returned the Ryobi.
  For more information on this topic look at rec.woodworking.
 
  Doug. Cutler                       Office of Information Technology,
  VM Systems Programmer              University of North Carolina.

From bigblue.oit.unc.edu!concert!corpgate!news.utdallas.edu!convex!cs.utexas.edu!howland.reston.ans.net!gatech!usenet.ins.cwru.edu!magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu!csn!news.sinet.slb.com!maggie.austin.wireline.slb.com!detroit.austin.wireline.slb.com!user Wed Feb

 23 21:27:39 EST 1994
Article: 3909 of rec.crafts.metalworking
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From: [email-masked] (Terry Mayhugh)
Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking
Subject: Tig Torch Question
Followup-To: rec.crafts.metalworking
Date: 23 Feb 1994 15:14:03 GMT
Organization: Schlumberger, Austin TX
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Message-ID: <[email-masked]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: detroit.austin.slcs.slb.com

I have a question about water cooled TIG torches that maybe someone can
answer. It is very common for shops to cool their torches by connecting the
input side of the torch directly to a water line and then allowing the
output to drain into a floor drain. They usually allow a machine controlled
solenoid valve to control the flow, so the water flows through the torch
only when the arc is ON. I've seen this time and time again and, in fact,
my local community college operates 9 machines this way.
The torch is designed so the water contacts the power conductor along the
entire length of the cable in order to cool the small diameter conductor
normally used in these light-weight torches. This means than the water
supply is connected directly to the welding voltage supply. Normally with
the relatively low voltages used in welding I wouln't think think this
would be a problem. But the high voltage, high frequency involved with the
AC machines while welding, say, aluminum seems like it would create a
problem. The water supply in my area is very alkaline. A ph of 10 is not at
all uncommon in this area. So it would seem that when a welder is set up
like this that either the high frequency would be shorted out by the water
supply when the return lead happens to be connected to earth ground or else
the water column would take on a potential when it isn't. For some reason,
no one seems to observe any problem but I don't understand why not.

---

From: William Erickson <[email-masked]>
Date: 23 Feb 1994 18:02:19 GMT

>small places), Are these useful or just a gimmick.

DisclaimerI read somewhere recently that Bosch has come out with a detail
sander along the lines of the fein and ryobi.  I have not personally seen
nor tried it but the price (around $90-100??) seems about right and might
be worth looking into if you need such a beast. The very brief review of
the Bosch I saw was quite positive (and it seems that Bosch tools are
pretty well built generally). I think they said that the sanding pad was
rotatable so you could get use out of all 3 corners - (unlike the Ryobi)
and that the vibration was not too bad (much less than the Ryobi).

good luck! hope this helps!

---

From: [email-masked]
Date: Tue, 1 Mar 94 17:10:21 -0500

In article <[email-masked]> Tim S. <[email-masked]> writes:
>From: Tim S. <[email-masked]>
>Subject: Re: WHAt sander to buy?
>Date: Thu, 24 Feb 1994 08:03:24 GMT
>If you're not sure whether you want a palm sander or a belt sander, why
>not get a random orbit sander?  It's sort of somewhere in between the two
>(can take off material faster than a palm sander, but not as fast as a
>belt sander; is less likely to gouge your material than a belt sander,
>but more likely than a palm sander; etc).  It's a decent mix of the two.
>
>Wish I'd known this before I got a palm sander.  Hey, I know...the sander
>you should buy is a palm sander - mine.  Then I can use the money to
>replace it with a random orbit sander...  :-)
>
>
>Tim S.
>My opinions are my own. They're my feet and I'll put them in my mouth if
>I want to. Do not expose to open flame. Some Assembly required. Remove
>before flight. Under penalty of law, do not remove this tag. Caution,
>contains silica gel, do not eat.  Do not read while operating a motor
>vehicle or heavy equipment. In case of eye contact, flush with water.
>This supersedes all previous notices.

Just wondering can you use arandom orbit sander on glued up panles.
What's the trade off between it and a belt sander for panels. I can only
buy one and the random orbit sure seems a lot more usefull ??

---

From: [email-masked] (Jeff Reifsteck)
Date: 2 Mar 1994 01:28:42 GMT

I'm kind of a newby at woodworking so please bear with me.  I've been following
the "What sander to buy?" question since I'm looking for one also.  My question
is, is it better to buy a 3x21 belt sander or a 4" belt/6" disc sander like Delta
has.  I just do ocassional work like building storage for the garage etc but
would like to get into bookcases beds and the like.  Any favorite bands?

		Thanks in advance.

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From: [email-masked] (James Foster x2912)
Date: Wed, 2 Mar 1994 16:41:32 GMT

Just to keep things a little cleaner, would anyone following up these
sander articles remove rec.crafts.metalworking from the newsgroups and 
followup lines if your newsreader allows it?  We might as well keep things
in the right place.

---

From: [email-masked] (Jim Seymour - x332)
Date: Wed, 2 Mar 1994 18:01:40 GMT

In article <[email-masked]> [email-masked] (Jay Keller) writes:
>(etc.)
>re: belt sanders, I have also been looking.  I'll probably buy either the
>AEG or the Dewalt.  They both have great fixtures for mounting them upside-
>down on the bench to make a mini stationary tool.
>

Have you looked at Bosch, Jay?  They have a variable-speed
belt sander that has optional sled and a mounting fixture
like you describe.  I think the "upside-downer" includes
a fence.  This is the one I was thinking of going with
when I decide to pop for a belt sander.  I've a woodworking
friend that has one & he's quite pleased with it.  Sorry,
can't remember the part number.  If you've looked at it,
and disqualified it, could you share your reasons with us?

>Chances are I'll go with the AEG, because I have their random-orbit and I
>think it's the best this side of the Fein.  Dewalt is a lot easier to find, 
>however.  (For those in my area Whole Earth Access carries AEG). 
>
>-- 
>Jay Keller <[email-masked]>                                            
>Sunnyvale, California

-- 
Jim Seymour			| Medar, Inc.
...uunet!medar!jseymour		| 38700 Grand River Ave.
[email-masked]		| Farmington Hills, MI. 48335-1563
GEnie: jseymour			| FAX: (810)477-8897

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From: [email-masked] (Jeff Chumbley)
Date: Wed, 2 Mar 1994 20:21:37 GMT

In <[email-masked]>, [email-masked] (Jeff Reifsteck) writes:
>has.  

Well, the obvious difference is that one is portable, and the other isn't.  So
if you can always bring the work to the sander, the belt/disk is fine.  But
it's very difficult to move some, and there a belt sander works better.  Me,
I'd get the belt sander first (or a random orbit sander).

>I just do ocassional work like building storage for the garage etc but
Led Zeppelin

Oh, I guess you meant brands! ;-)  Porter Cable and Bosch.
>		Thanks in advance.

Regards,
Jeff Chumbley

---

From: [email-masked] (Jay Keller)
Date: Thu, 3 Mar 1994 04:15:17 GMT

>and disqualified it, could you share your reasons with us?

I definitely haven't disqualified it, I may change my mind several more times
before I buy. :-)   This is one of those things that I want and could have
used many times if I had it, but I won't actually go out and buy one until a
project comes along that really needs it.

I have 2  Bosch routers and I like them well enough to keep Bosch high on my
list of favorite power tool makers (I also prefer their router bits to any
others I've tried, especially the ones with the "M" suffix).

I see the Bosches (3"x21", 3"x24", and 4"x24") very nicely displayed (a full 
page each) in the new Klingspor's catalog.                 

3"x21" Model 3270D    $157.95  (Sanding Frame $83.95, Stand+Fence $63.90)

4"x24" Model 1273DVS  $229     (Sanding Frame $115.95, Stand+Fence $67.40)
4"x24"   "   1273D    $221.95  (No variable speed) 
3"x24"   "   1272D    $198.95  (3"x24") 

They look great.  I'll definitely look closely at them when I'm ready to buy.
The same catalog has some very awesome-looking models from Porter-Cable also. 
(Including a $360 model dubbed "the freight train").

I saw the AEG at Whole Earth, and I think they said the bench stand was   
included, but I'm sorry to say I've forgotten what the price was (~$175?).

---

From: [email-masked] (Mark Williams)
Date: Tue, 8 Mar 1994 18:38:51 GMT

Porter Cable makes the sanders most tradesmen here use.  Great long lasting
design, heavy bearings, service forever.  These workmen put more use on them
in a month than I do in a year, so I respect their recommendation.

If you want a belt sander, I'd suggest the bigger 4x24 models, since you
may someday want to do large areas and these go much faster than the 
3x21.  Get the models with dust collection.  My fav is the Porter Cable
362, about a $200 machine.  I see no value in variable speed, I want max
when I sand.

I'd skip the orbital finishing sanders, and use a random orbital sander
instead.  Again, it is faster at sanding than the other type.  On blind faith
I bought the Porter cable 7336, with dust collection option.  I have not
regretted it. This displaced an ancient Porter Cable 330, which I use now
only when I want to be really gentle.  It's slow, but seems like it will
be running after I'm gone.  

A while back I also put a 6 inch random orbital head on a 3HP Milwaukee
body grinder just to see how these new fangled ROS sanders worked.
Hey, it was only a $40 kit then.  It sanded well, but ran slower than the
common ROS today.  It also weighed too much and really had no provision
for dust collection, which I think is mandatory for me (they only issue me
one set of lungs per lifetime, unfortunately).  Actually, I need to control
dust to allow better finishing too.  

Summary:
Always buy a sander with dust collection.  I like the PC 362 4x24 belt 
sander and PC 7336 ROS, based on tradesmens recommendations and my own
long experience with PC.