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Date: 8 Mar 1995 08:58:52 -0500
From: nick@vu-vlsi.ee.vill.edu (Nick Pine)
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Subject: Fan power (was: Cube of the wind speed??)
content-length: 1740
Status: RO
X-Status: D

>  The power required to operate a fan varies with the cube of the amount of 
>air moved (usually in CFM, cubic feet per minute). 

I think we might add, "for a given duct size." If we make the air ducts large,
and the airspeed low, we can make the dynamic air pressure and duct friction
and fan power as low as we want, practically-speaking. For instance, 100' of
a 2' x 2' duct with a cross sectional area of 4 ft^2, carrying 2,000 CFM and
500 linear feet per minute (lfm) of air, has a back pressure of only about
0.01" of water, according to my 1993 ASHRAE HOF.

This goes well with the performance of the 16" Grainger 4C861 1600 rpm (max),
high-temp (311 F), high-priced ($359), very reliable (3 year guarantee),
low-power (240 watts, max, with no speed control) fan, which is rated to
deliver 2765 CFM in free air, and 2190 CFM at 0.20 inches of water.

And this pressure and fan power is quite low compared to many hot air heating
systems using more powerful blowers with tiny cheap ducts. One way to make big
ducts is to blow air between multiple studs or joists or rafters... So if
we want to minimize fan power, and use fans instead of more energy-consuming
blowers, we should make the ducts big and the air velocities and rpm's low.
The last two things also minimize acoustical noise.

Norman Saunders recommends that new houses have a 2' x 2' airshaft from
top to bottom, so solar heat can be stored upstairs in the winter, and
easily transported downstairs, and cool air from the basement floor can
easily be transported upstairs in the summer. He says this allows easy
air movement of 1 m^3/sec, which transfers 1 kW/degree Kelvin, or was that
10 degrees Kelvin? Let's see. One Btu can heat 55 ft^3 of air 1 degree F...

Nick

From news@bigblue.oit.unc.edu  Fri Mar 10 17:50:25 1995
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Subject: Fan power (was: Cube of the wind speed??)
content-length: 1740
Status: O
X-Status: 

>  The power required to operate a fan varies with the cube of the amount of 
>air moved (usually in CFM, cubic feet per minute). 

I think we might add, "for a given duct size." If we make the air ducts large,
and the airspeed low, we can make the dynamic air pressure and duct friction
and fan power as low as we want, practically-speaking. For instance, 100' of
a 2' x 2' duct with a cross sectional area of 4 ft^2, carrying 2,000 CFM and
500 linear feet per minute (lfm) of air, has a back pressure of only about
0.01" of water, according to my 1993 ASHRAE HOF.

This goes well with the performance of the 16" Grainger 4C861 1600 rpm (max),
high-temp (311 F), high-priced ($359), very reliable (3 year guarantee),
low-power (240 watts, max, with no speed control) fan, which is rated to
deliver 2765 CFM in free air, and 2190 CFM at 0.20 inches of water.

And this pressure and fan power is quite low compared to many hot air heating
systems using more powerful blowers with tiny cheap ducts. One way to make big
ducts is to blow air between multiple studs or joists or rafters... So if
we want to minimize fan power, and use fans instead of more energy-consuming
blowers, we should make the ducts big and the air velocities and rpm's low.
The last two things also minimize acoustical noise.

Norman Saunders recommends that new houses have a 2' x 2' airshaft from
top to bottom, so solar heat can be stored upstairs in the winter, and
easily transported downstairs, and cool air from the basement floor can
easily be transported upstairs in the summer. He says this allows easy
air movement of 1 m^3/sec, which transfers 1 kW/degree Kelvin, or was that
10 degrees Kelvin? Let's see. One Btu can heat 55 ft^3 of air 1 degree F...

Nick

From news@bigblue.oit.unc.edu  Fri Mar 10 07:20:10 1995
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Date: 8 Mar 1995 04:49:57 -0500
From: nick@vu-vlsi.ee.vill.edu (Nick Pine)
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Subject: Re: Nick's lecture
content-length: 1633
Status: RO
X-Status: 

DAN JOHNSON  <dan.johnson@contrail.com> wrote:
 
>I ... would appreciate any info you can forward [re Monolithic domes.]

The company is called Monolithic Constructors, Inc., of Italy, Texas,
which is about an hour from Dallas, I'm told. They make concrete/foam
domes, up to 400' in diameter and 200' tall, by blowing up a vinyl
balloon ("airform"), spraying an inch or so of polyurethane foam
inside that from the inside of the bubble, placing small metal plates
("skyhooks") with wires attached to them on the foam, spraying some
more foam on top of that, wiring up reinforcing rods to the skyhooks,
and then spraying 2-3" of concrete onto the rebar, all from the inside
of the bubble. They have plans for domes up to 800' in diameter.
Monolithic's phone number is (214) 483-7423.

They are having the First Annual Monolithic Domebuilder's Convention in
Dallas, TX from this Friday morning, 3/10, till Saturday afternoon, 3/11.
There should be at least 100 people there, including most of the Monolithic
staff and customers, along with some exhibitors, architects and engineers.
The convention costs $45, including a banquet and a bus ticket for a field
trip to Italy (TX :-) Saturday afternoon. Most of the conference will be at
the Dallas Holiday Inn Airport North ($65/night--(214) 929-8181.)

Monolithic is an exciting new little company with lots of spirit and a
willingness to try new things, from what I can tell. They also sell T-shirts,
slides, videos, jackets, "Nature's Perfect Shape" ball caps, and a $6/year
bi-monthly newsprint periodical called "Roundup." The number for
ordering this stuff is (800) 608-0001.

Nick

From news@bigblue.oit.unc.edu  Fri Mar 10 07:20:08 1995
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Date: 8 Mar 1995 05:05:31 -0500
From: nick@vu-vlsi.ee.vill.edu (Nick Pine)
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Subject: Re: An insulated ceiling pond house -Reply
content-length: 1213
Status: RO
X-Status: 

Robert Sanders  <AE%SJSUVM1.BITNET@cmsa.Berkeley.EDU> wrote:
 
>>So here's a more conventional house with an insulated pond in the ceiling...
 
>  There is a major problem with this in earthquake areas (most of the
>U.S.).  A ceiling and/or roof needs to be light weight and act as a
>membrane to hold the walls together.  Adding a pond overhead would
>make a dangerous situation as it would add to the forces trying to tear
>the walls apart and, if it fell, would crush those under it.

Thanks for the thought, Robert. I didn't think about that at all. There
is probably some solution, though, like putting the water under the floor,
thus sacrificing natural convection and heat trapping with overhead water,
or designing the building to take earthquakes, eg as a concrete/foam dome
with an integral ferro-cement lenticular diaphram tank above, or putting in
some sort of giant rip cord, like the ones in hot air balloons, that opened up
to let the water out quickly when an earthquake happened...

At the moment, I like the idea of hot water, sewage and rainwater under the
floor, in EPDM rubber/Thermo-Ply tank sandwiches, with a high-temp, low-power
fan to heat it by flowing 500 lfm air underneath... 

Nick

From news@bigblue.oit.unc.edu  Fri Mar 10 07:20:11 1995
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Date: 8 Mar 1995 05:14:39 -0500
From: nick@vu-vlsi.ee.vill.edu (Nick Pine)
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Subject: Re: Oil crisis coming up according to Barrons
content-length: 2073
Status: RO
X-Status: 

Steen H Hviid <shviid@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu> wrote:

>In the current issue of Barrons (March 6, 1995), their "Up & Down Wall Street"
>column (the most prominent column in the paper) deals with the coming oil 
>crises. The writers see an oil shortage coming up soon, with major prices
>increases to follow.

Amory Lovins said in his 12/94 Atlantic article that we probably would not
have invaded Iraq had they only grown broccoli. As I recall, for years, we
shamelessly funded both Iran and Iraq in their war with each other, supplying
weapons and money to both, in an attempt to create a "balance" that would
ensure cheap oil for our wasteful energy habits and make Exxon rich. Kuwait
was more or less created entirely by Standard Oil, setting up some sheiks
to sell us oil cheap in the 50s, no? WE are the international terrorists now,
not the arabs... We walk up to the arabs and point a gun at their heads
and say "You don't REALLY want to raise the price of your oil, do you?"

In private life this would be called extortion or robbery. Imagine going down
to the supermarket with a gun and telling the checkout clerk that the oranges
are too expensive. You would like to pay a bit less... Imagine walking into
the bursar's office with a gun, and saying you don't want to pay more than
$500 for the linear systems course, because the professor is so dull. Even
before George Bush, the five previous presidents, including gentle, Christian,
blessed, peacemaking Jimmy Carter, had publicly threatened war in the middle
east if they "cut off our vital supply of oil," and I believe that included
raising the price significantly... We are addicted to oil in this country,
as well as cocaine.

It's  their  oil, not ours, and they have a basic right to sell it for any
price that they want to sell it for. We have been bullying them into selling
it to us cheaply for years. And killing them, lately, en masse. This is not
a good thing. Killing people is bad, and it cannot go on. For one thing,
there is only a finite amount of oil in the world. It WILL run out...

Nick

From news@bigblue.oit.unc.edu  Fri Mar 10 07:20:09 1995
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Date: 8 Mar 1995 05:34:06 -0500
From: nick@vu-vlsi.ee.vill.edu (Nick Pine)
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Subject: Re: How much glass for solar gain?
content-length: 1269
Status: RO
X-Status: 

Ross M Donald  <AE%SJSUVM1.BITNET@cmsa.Berkeley.EDU> wrote:

>     Guidelines for South facing glass:
>
>     Radical:  as much as possible

I agree. Well, enough to heat the house 100%, anyway, as a low-thermal-mass
sunspace, with a smaller glazed area inside in front of a high-thermal-mass
solar closet/sauna for cloudy days. And not just glass. Alternative sunspace
glazing include polycarbonate plastic (Dynaglas or Replex) or even good old
5 cent per square foot, 3-year greenhouse poly film...
 
>     Now, forget the guidelines.

Good idea...
 
>     Consider 5-20 gallons water in direct gain per
>square foot of glazing.  Too hot, too much temp flux -
>add more mass;  too cold - reduce mass, add movable
>insulation.  Get Mazria:  The Passive Solar Energy Book.

This works pretty well in the southwest, but I'm fairly convinced that
in places with a few cloudy days in a row, direct gain is bad, unless
there is movable insulation. Or at least it is much better to use passive
or low-power active air heaters on the south walls, with a good insulated
wall behind them, and a higher-than-living-space temperature heat battery,
inside the house, that can be well-insulated, vs a masonry floor behind
a big uninsulated picture window in the living room.

Nick

From news@bigblue.oit.unc.edu  Tue Mar  7 06:44:34 1995
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Date: 3 Mar 1995 12:39:35 -0500
From: nick@vu-vlsi.ee.vill.edu (Nick Pine)
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Subject: Re: Nick's lecture
content-length: 2556
Status: RO
X-Status: 

I'm posting this bounced email to Bob from Melbourne, Florida...

Date: Fri, 3 Mar 95 12:10:29 EST
From: Mailer-Daemon@rayleigh.AFTAC.GOV (Mail Delivery Subsystem)
Subject: Returned mail: Service unavailable
To: <nick@nfs.ee.vill.edu>

   ----- Transcript of session follows -----
Connected to tt:
>>> HELO AFTAC.GOV
<<< 553 AFTAC.GOV host name configuration error
554 <bob@tt.AFTAC.GOV>... Service unavailable

   ----- Unsent message follows -----
Date: Fri, 3 Mar 95 12:13:48 EST
From: nick@nfs.ee.vill.edu (Nick Pine)
Message-Id: <9503031713.AA12147@nfs.ee.vill.edu>
To: bob@tt.AFTAC.GOV
Subject: Re:  Your Lecture

Hi boB :-)

>I would be interested in finding out more about your lecture and designs, 
>I don't suppose that you'll be in the Melbourne FL area at all?

I might get down that way some time. Would you like me to lecture there?
I've only been to Florida a couple of times, once for a business meeting
in a posh Naples hotel (nice sailing :-) and once to visit my aunt in
Homestead, who has since moved closer to Miami. If you paid me to come,
I'd be a lot more likely to show up :-)

>Would it be possible to get copies of your lecture and slides?

Maybe. Most of my lecture is comments on slides of local buildings,
with green film pen markings on the back of each slide to show how they
might be improved with solar and insulation retrofits, and comments
about the costs of materials and numerical estimates of the amount of
energy each retrofit would save. I hand out a few copies of postings,
and tape a few large architectural drawings of my designs on the wall,
and I bring along 3 empty 55 gallon drums, a K-mart radiant kerosene
heater used as an infra-red solar simulator and 3 linear parabolic
reflectors made of Thermo-Ply, foil-faced foam and 3M SA-85 solar
reflective film, to aim at the simulator to make a sort of infra-red
whispering gallery, boiling water in a coke bottle at the focus, a
high temp fan and speed control, a bimetallic-coil-spring-operated
automatic foundation vent and a hair dryer to make it work, after I
adjust it for a higher temp range, 200 ft^2 of shadecloth, 140 slides,
12 viewgraphs, 50 lbs of books, some 1 x 3s, large pieces of Thermo-Ply,
various kinds of thermometers and light meters, a laser level, some 12'
pieces of Dynaglas, etc., etc. So this is not a very portable show,
as I have done it so far. I'll be doing a small and different version
again in Dallas, TX next week, at the Monolithic Dome convention, 
and then at 3 or 4 local schools and universities soon after that...

Nick

From news@bigblue.oit.unc.edu  Mon Feb 27 17:07:57 1995
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To: renew-energy@ces.ncsu.edu
Date: 22 Feb 1995 06:23:29 -0500
From: nick@vu-vlsi.ee.vill.edu (Nick Pine)
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Subject: Re: Ammonia Absorption Refrigeration
content-length: 555
Status: RO
X-Status: 

Hi Andy,

This attempted email to you bounced, so I'll post it here...

To: acarter@primenet
In-Reply-To: <acarter.223.00174C15@primenet>
References: <6250.usenet@merckx.graphics.cornell.edu>
Organization: Villanova University

>So what is your point?   I didn't say anything about solar now did I?

I thought you did, but maybe I was wrong. I've only been half-following this
thread, and I thought I heard someone say something about "marrying
concentrating collectors with absorption chillers."  Sorry. Let's not start
a flame war over this...:-)

Nick

From rfoster@nmsu.edu  Sun Feb 26 21:24:19 1995
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Date: Sun, 26 Feb 1995 19:15:22 -0700
To: renew-energy@twosocks.ces.ncsu.edu
From: rfoster@nmsu.edu (Robert Foster)
Subject: El Paso Solar Still Workshops (EPSEA)
Cc: wanthony@adelaide.DIALix.oz.au (Wayne Anthoney)
content-length: 1784
Status: RO
X-Status: 

EL PASO SOLAR ENERGY ASSOCIATION

SOLAR WATER DISTILLATION WORKSHOPS

APRIL 6,7 AND 8 - 1995

El Paso, Texas, USA

SOLAR WATER PURIFICATION PROJECT
Sponsored by the Texas Sustainable Energy Development Council


        The El Paso Solar Energy Association will be sponsoring three days
of lectures and workshops on solar water distillation as part of its
activites related to the Texas Sustainable Energy Development Council's
(SEDC) solar water purification project.  Horace McCracken, a leading solar
still designer in the U.S., will be the principle instructor for this
series of lectures and workshops to be held in El Paso County.

        The preliminary agenda for the coming activities is listed below.
The exact time and location will be given in the upcoming April EPSEA
newsletter.  Please leave a message on the EPSEA voice mail at (915)
772-7657 if you would like to attend a workshop or receive the April EPSEA
newsletter.  There is no registration fee for the workshops, however
attendance is limited.

Thursday, APRIL 6th
7:30 P.M.
EPSEA monthly general meeting presentation on solar stills by Horace
McCracken in the Classroom Building at UTEP, Room C-205.

Friday, APRIL 7th
A.M.
EPSEA solar still presentation to El Paso area community leaders at UTEP.

P.M.
Afternoon solar still workshop scheduled at Montana Vista Community Center,
El Paso County.

Saturday, APRIL 8th
All day solar still workshop scheduled in the Lower Valley of El Paso
(either San Elizario or Socorro).


EPSEA WWW Home Page:

http://www.realtime.net/~gnudd/react/epsea.htm

----------------------------------------------
Robert Foster
Southwest Technology Development Institute
New Mexico State University
Las Cruces, New Mexico          USA
----------- Sin el sol, no hay nada ----------


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Subject: Solar Hotwater
content-length: 537
Status: RO
X-Status: 

>I do not think that our situation is unique, there must be others in the
north who have marginal solar in the winter.  Do you have any suggestions or
better ways to deal with this problem?

We don't have solar hot water in the summer but in the winter we get a lot of
help from a heat exchanger attached to our woodstove. This circulates
(thermosyphon) to a hot water holding tank, then to an Aquastar that accepts
preheated water. 

The man who makes the add-on-boiler is:
Joseph Lyman. 
21 Park Street
Rutland, VT
05701
802.773.8133.

From news@bigblue.oit.unc.edu  Wed Feb 22 16:55:53 1995
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Date: 21 Feb 1995 02:18:57 -0500
From: nick@vu-vlsi.ee.vill.edu (Nick Pine)
Message-Id: <3ic451$cpr@vu-vlsi.ee.vill.edu>
Organization: Villanova University
Sender: london@sunsite.unc.edu
References: <toponos-2002951856080001@slip858.rmii.com>
Subject: Re: STEVE BAUER
content-length: 2322
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John Nicholson <toponos@rmii.com> wrote:

>Many years ago I read about Steve in The Mother Earth News - Steve was the
>driving force behind a company called Zomeworks. Is Steve still out there
>- and is Zomeworks still in business?

Yes :-) Steve BAER still seems to be alive and well and very busy, and even
answers mail sometimes. Altho Zomeworks mostly makes PV-related stuff
these days, which Steve attributes to the fact that "energy is just too
cheap." Or perhaps it's that PV's are trendy or glamorous. (This is
fiddling while the middle-east burns, I think.) Steve's drumwall steel
drums wore out after 20 years, so he has now replaced them with plastic
ones, which he expects will last longer. 

Speaking of which, yesterday I saw an ad in a free ad paper around
here that read "Plastic 55 gallon drums, $5 each. Used once to contain
aloe product." And a local meat packing plant called me, in response
to my "drums wanted" ad in the paper. They are now saving me some (free :-)
plastic-coated steel drums, which they use (~40 a month) for soap,
vegetable oil and glycol...

A couple of interesting phone numbers are: (215) 945-0444 for the $144
Cuppson "Lazer level," a low-power semiconductor laser attached to a
carpenter's level, that shoots a 1/8" red dot at least 60' (500' or so
indoors or at night), that can be used to adjust parabolic reflectors
for solar ovens, etc, made from 3M SA-85 film, and 3M's Solar Optical
Products number, (612) 733-1898, for the SA-85 reflective film itself
(when is Real Goods going to carry this stuff?) 3M's address is
3M Center/St. Paul, Minnesota 54144-1000. Their general phone number
seems to be (612) 733-1110.

To adjust your oven, etc. reflector, you might put it in a darkish room and
move the laser level along to make parallel rays, where you want the sun to
be, and look to see where the reflection spot ends up, and how big and how
bright the spot is (the brightness/reflectivity might be measured with a
digital lightmeter, I suppose, eg the $100 Grainger version.) I've noticed
that the 3M film makes a much smaller spot, than say, foil-covered foamboard,
alumimum foil or Thermo-Ply. Yesterday I managed to boil some water in
a pepsi bottle at the focus of a 3M reflector a foot away from my 10K
Btu/hour radiant kerosene solar simulator...

Nicholson Pine

From news@bigblue.oit.unc.edu  Wed Feb 22 23:50:32 1995
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Date: Tue, 21 Feb 95 02:25:40 GMT
From: bigdog@netins.net (bigdog)
Message-Id: <3ibmfv$s2c@insosf1.infonet.net>
Organization: Stacks 'n' Piles
Sender: london@sunsite.unc.edu
References: <23186.usenet@merckx.graphics.cornell.edu>
Subject: Re: El Cheapo tracker
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X-Status: 

Kerry Miller <ASTINGSH%KSUVM.BITNET@cmsa.Berkeley.EDU> wrote:
->B Dog wrote,
->>  I drilled a hole through each in the center, and welded them
->> into the ends of the 2X2.
->
->Since its a vapor you're trying to get from one tube to the
->other, wouldn't it be better to have your holes above center?

First, I have better luck when I am not trying to weld shut, an unvented
container.  I mean, the material was stout enough to accommodate the
stress, and still have a good weld, maybe....  I never tried.  But, there
has to be holes in the tank somewhere...

Actually, the idea is to drive the water/antifreeze mix from one side to
the other.  It seemed using solely propane, did not have the mass to
overcome the friction.  I went for the *duel* system.  The 50/50 mix
approximates the mass of freon. (If it works with freon, it'll work with
water....  The anitfreeze is for rust inhibition and freeze protection.

The setup is basically, a *U* (or a liquid manometer).  As the sun
advances past the shade trough it hits the east tank.  The temperature
increases.  Pick your favorite Law. (Perfect Gas Law PV=nRT, or the
popular combo Datlton/Charles P(i)T(i)=P(ii)T(ii) + P(i)V(i)=P(ii)V(ii).)
The expansion of the propane shifts the mass to the west tank.

It doesn't matter where the holes are, just as long as the fluid can shift
for the whole E/W swing of the gizmo, without gurgling and going out of
balance.

(Now, I don't know if this would work with propane only in the gas state,
or if there is the actual need for some liquid propane in the system.
I haven't thought that out.  I'm not ready to labor this out on paper, and
I don't want to burden you with me pondering the matter in such a raw
state...it would be hell to follow, and I'd look stupid.)

->  Another thought: if said holes were located near the angle-
->iron cross braces instead of in the end plates, the copper
->tubing would be better protected. I know the risk is small,
->but I know Mr Murphy well...
->   (OTOH, if somebody reaching
->for the frame "to see if it really moves" cracks the tube, maybe
->it would be appropriate to flood them in propane..)

You are absolutely right. This is a problem.  The tube is just sticking out there, aching for attention.
I was moving my beast one day, and it slipped (it's heavy!);
I grabbed the tube!, just as the other end hit the ground, absorbing
most of energy. <Whew!>

However, being dowsed with the tank contents is probable only
in a rupture.  Most likely, unless someone wails on it, is breaking
the seal at the flare and the contents leak out over a period of a few
minutes to a year (just a wild guess).

I think by moving the lower angle down to protect the tube is a
good idea.  This move might even help with weight distribution on
the N/S axis.

->Too, what was your conclusion about the depth of threads for
->the gas fittings?

It seemed the walls of the 2X2 were too thin to accommodate the threads
of the fittings to a comfortable degree.

The rule of thumb is, 5 threads is all that's needed, or some such thing.
The problem is I don't remember if if that refers to straight thread, or
pipe thead.  I also don't remember if that's 5 threads *minimum*, or after
5 threads you're just screwing around.

So, I'm just one step ahead of knowing nothing.

->> I took three pieces of plate steel.  Welded two of them to the
->> pivoting support, with the third piece in between, bored a hole
->> and ran a bolt. This allows for seasonal adjustment.
->
->I didnt get this at all, or see it in the .jpg... are you saying
-> there is a lateral (N-S) tilt adjustment?

Yes there is a tilt adjustment.  However, my last art class was in 7th
grade...let me try to describe it another way.

Take three pieces of cardboard; stack them together; pull the middle
piece out half way; at a point in the center of where these three pieces
overlap, stab a pencil through all three pieces.  Grab the middle piece
of cardboard with your left hand, and the other two with your right.
(Or the other way around, it doesn't make any difference.)

What is in your left hand is affixed to the earth,...your right, to the gizmo.
(This Procedure, however, cannot be changed!;-) The arc is your
latitude adjustment, (N/S).

One item that has been on my mind.  I would like to find a cheap way to
increase the bearing surface on the pivoting axis.  But I run out of room
using  1 1/4" angle irons.

->BTW, what's the significance of the "Flat flies straight..." note?

The *Flat flip flies straight, tilted flip curves. Experiment*...well aside from
being the instructions for a frisbee... means, the thing flies. If you can't
work it one way, try another.  (...or, does it mean, it will work one way,
but if your off, it will smash into your neighbor's window?)

Either way, I thought it was pretty good advice, considering it's on the
bottom of a toy...plus, I get silly and obtuse when I work on things late
into the night.

This is, after all, backwoods engineering.


bigdog@netins.net  *** With a homepage coming to a URL near you ****

      ...just a lying dog, chewing on a stick in the mud...

From news@bigblue.oit.unc.edu  Mon Feb 20 12:20:52 1995
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Date: 18 Feb 1995 04:49:00 -0500
From: nick@vu-vlsi.ee.vill.edu (Nick Pine)
Message-Id: <3i4fqc$d43@vu-vlsi.ee.vill.edu>
Organization: Villanova University
Sender: london@sunsite.unc.edu
Subject: On temperature control
content-length: 3705
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X-Status: 

Here is a quote from Steve Baer's book, _Sunspots_:

  What is it like to live in houses where the temperature changes
  during the day? What is it like to do without a thermostat to
  control the temperature within a degree or two? It is only very
  recently that there have been thermostats for controlling the
  temperature in houses, and still today almost everyone alive in the
  USA has spent some time in buildings without automatic thermostats.

  I believe that it is perfectly satisfactory to have the temperature
  change during the course of each day, from a high in the afternoon
  to a low in the morning, and to have the temperature change from
  week to week according to how cloudy or sunny it is. The variations
  in temperature keep your blood circulating.

  What extremes of temperature within a house are comfortable? In a
  dry climate like Albuquerque, I believe yearly lows and highs of 55 F
  and 85 F are perfectly easy to live with inside a house--especially
  if you have warm spots such as fireplaces or stoves to stand next to
  when it is chilly. But what is the advantage of having temperature
  variation within the house? The advantage of _not_ going to great
  lengths--as most present day heating and colling systems do--to
  achieve something that you don't really need or enjoy that much. Now
  that all of us are plagued with the pollution resulting from the
  overabundance of devices we have purchased, perhaps government or
  church groups should sponsor a series of "you don't need it" commercials.
  Instead of the bright uniformed "service personnel" of the Ace Air-
  Conditioning Company briskly delivering and installing the latest gadgets,
  the commercials would show the expensive equipment misused: a bored
  housewife growing geraniums in her new dishwashing machine; a small child
  casually dismantling a TV-stereo combo with a claw hammer...

  Reptiles need mammal houses. The reptile is at a disadvantage because
  he cannot regulate his body temperature, but, instead, equilibrates
  near to the temperature of his surroundings. If it is cold he cannot
  move fast. The regulatory function of the mammal is a great advantage,
  since he can keep his body temperature constant.

  Does this apply to houses and temperature regulation? Is it the same
  kind of improvement when a thermostat and gas heating system are
  installed? If the temperature outside one's body--the temperature of
  the house--is regulated to within 1/2 degree F, of what use is the
  sophisticated temperature regulating metabolism of the mammal?
  Obsession with temperature control seems more like Reptile Technology
  than Mammal Technology. The reptile badly needs it--the mammal does not.

  This leads to the general question of what view one should take of
  equipment manufactured to do for you what your body is equipped and
  prepared to do for itself. Certainly we are all grateful for the
  discovery of fire, but the thermostat--I don't know. A person's body
  has already incorporated the muscles, organs, etc., to steer him
  through dangers and difficulties. Yet we cleverly make them
  unnecessary by an entirely new level of design and invention. What
  is the result of this? The now unnecessary organs are not removed
  from the body; instead they are simply unemployed--hanging around,
  so to speak, in one's body, talking to the brain, being fed by the
  heart and bloodstream.

  For the utmost in design I can imagine the equipment manufacturers'
  surgical teams removing now unnecessary organs with the installation
  of their automatic control systems. Perhaps the now outdated glands
  and organs could be sold to reptiles on another planet.

From news@bigblue.oit.unc.edu  Mon Feb 20 12:20:57 1995
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To: renew-energy@ces.ncsu.edu
Date: 18 Feb 1995 04:39:27 -0500
From: nick@vu-vlsi.ee.vill.edu (Nick Pine)
Message-Id: <3i4f8f$d2d@vu-vlsi.ee.vill.edu>
Organization: Villanova University
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Subject: Affordable Comfort Conference
content-length: 284
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X-Status: 

Would anyone know when the Affordable Comfort Conference is in PA this year?
April? Howard Reichmuth will be speaking there on instrumentation for energy
conservation in houses. Howard is an engineer, and one of the designers of
the Ecotope concentrating greenhouse...

Thanks,

Nick

From news@bigblue.oit.unc.edu  Mon Feb 20 15:19:21 1995
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Date: 18 Feb 1995 07:52:53 -0500
From: nick@vu-vlsi.ee.vill.edu (Nick Pine)
Message-Id: <3i4qj5$dik@vu-vlsi.ee.vill.edu>
Organization: Villanova University
Sender: london@sunsite.unc.edu
Subject: Indirect-fired, electric-backup water heater?
content-length: 308
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Would anyone know who manufactures a nice, inexpensive, standard, reliable,
indirect-fired water heater (ie a 60 gallon insulated tank with a some
copper tubing in the bottom, to put boiler water through to heat the tank) 
that also has some built-in 220V electric heaters for backup heating?

Thanks,

Nick

From news@bigblue.oit.unc.edu  Tue Feb 21 11:22:15 1995
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Date: Fri, 17 Feb 1995 15:29:11 GMT
From: hatunen@netcom.com (DaveHatunen)
Message-Id: <hatunenD45Hon.DG2@netcom.com>
Organization: As little as you're likely to find anywhere
Sender: london@sunsite.unc.edu
References: <12175.usenet@merckx.graphics.cornell.edu>
Subject: Re: Thermocouples
content-length: 1457
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X-Status: 

In article <12175.usenet@merckx.graphics.cornell.edu>,
PFEIFFER  <AE%SJSUVM1.BITNET@cmsa.Berkeley.EDU> wrote:
>Dave Hatunen says:
>> Again: thermocouples require two junctions, and the emf is a function
>> of the temperature differential between them. So if you already have a
>> source of higher temperature, then, with the other junction at ambient,
>> you can produce a small amount of energy. But if you do not have a
>> temperature differential, then thermocouples are useless.
>>
>In many cases you have already temperature differentials.
>This is the nice thing with thermocouples
>Sources of surplus high temperatures you have for example in  the case of
>power stations or even by some solar applications let alone some
>industries as the steel industry. The question is the efficiency and especially
>the costs per kWh.

Quite true. But I believe the original poster was under the impression
that somehow they generated an emf from only the one temperature.

Once you have a temperature differential there are all sorts of ways to
derive a little power; thermocouples are probably the worst choice
except under very singular circumstances.

-- 


    ********** DAVE HATUNEN (hatunen@netcom.com) **********
    *                Daly City California:                *
    *       where San Francisco meets The Peninsula       *
    *       and the San Andreas Fault meets the Sea       *
    *******************************************************

From dgodwin@freenet.vancouver.bc.ca Fri Nov 25 06:56:06 1994
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Date: Thu, 24 Nov 1994 06:51:57 -0800 (PST)
From: David Godwin <dgodwin@freenet.vancouver.bc.ca>
Subject: Re: radiator heat
To: Malcolm Stebbins <Malcolm.Stebbins@125-53.psybbs.durham.nc.us>
Cc: renew-energy@twosocks.ces.ncsu.edu
In-Reply-To: <d32_9411171111@psybbs.durham.nc.us>
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On 16 Nov 1994, Malcolm Stebbins wrote:

> RA>   I highly advise against the use of Polybutylene tubing in under floor
> RA>   applications. It has been only recently that homes piped with this
> RA>   material have won lawsuits against the manufacturer because the stuff
> RA>   doesn't hold up. It starts deteriorating from the moment water hits
> Boy! did you just make my day - I've got it in my concrete floor; guess I'll 
> just wait for the springs to start popping up.  Any easy fixes to the 
> problem??
> 
>From articles that I have read, the deterioration comes from contact with 
the chlorine or chlorides in "city" water. If you changed the water in 
your heating system to non-chlorinated water, you should be ok. Also add 
an anti-oxinator (sp?) to the water.


David Godwin   dgodwin@Freenet.vancouver.bc.ca
               604 351 4812
        FAX    604 733 3340


From news@bigblue.oit.unc.edu Fri Nov 25 09:33:07 1994
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Date: 22 Nov 1994 10:59:08 -0500
From: nick@vu-vlsi.ee.vill.edu (Nick Pine)
Message-Id: <3at4gc$hie@vu-vlsi.ee.vill.edu>
Organization: Villanova University
Sender: london
Subject: Another drumwall water heater?
Status: RO
X-Status: 

Here is another possible design for a drumwall that might be used
as a solar water heater.

It would use 30 drums, stacked up horizontally in a square array, 20'long x 6'
tall, perhaps behind 120 square feet of single pane glass, with a reflective
insulating shutter that lifts up from the top edge of the drums at a 45 degree
angle, and a reflective floor, inside a shed with a south wall made of,
eg Dynaglas.

It might look like this, not to scale:

.........................................      ...     .
.                                       .                . .
.                                       . south    east  . .   .
.                                       .               d.   .    .
.                                       .               y.  day.     .
......................................... ..   10'      n.      H...... . ..
. D . D .   .   .   .   .   .   .   .   .               a.      n.    . .
.........................................        <--S   g.      i...... .
.   .   .   .   .   .   .   .   .   .   . 6'            l.      g.    . . 6'
.........................................               a.      h...... .
.   .   .   .   .   .   .   .   .   .   .               s.      t.    . .
............................................................................
|                  20'                  |

The D's are drums, H is a horizontal hinge... Day and night shutter positions
are shown...

The numbers below again indicate drum water temperatures in degrees F, from
a small simulation using average Philadelphia weather conditions in January
(ambient temp, 32 degrees, 1200 Btu/day of sun on a south-facing wall,
T^4 heat loss) while extracting 100K Btu/day of domestic hot water from
the wall, using some food-grade, *lined* drums plumbed in series, on
the top row, pressurized with cold water on the way to the input of an
electric hot water in a house. It looks like 4 heat exhanger drums are enough.

Nick

10 'Todd Hall drumwall solar water heater?
20 'est. water temps for rectangular drumwall with 45 degree upward shutter
30 NH=10'number of horizontal drums
40 NV=3'number of vertical drums
50 ND=NH*NV'total number of drums
60 PI=4*ATN(1)'pi...
70 AD=(2*(23/2)^2*PI+23*PI*35)/144'drum area in ft^2
80 DIM T(NV, NH)'array of drum water temperatures
90 OPEN "drumout" FOR OUTPUT AS #1
100 'find steady-state temps
110 FOR R=1 TO NV'1 is top row, nv is bottom row...
120 FOR D=1 TO NH'1 is west drum in row...
130 T(R,D)=150'initialize drum temps
140 NEXT:NEXT
150 AREA=4*NH*NV'effective area of drumwall surface
160 SUNH=1.85*AREA*1000/ND/24'hourly sun energy/drum, inc. by shutter refl.
170 ES=15*5*3*8*55'energy for 15 5 min, 3 gpm, 110 degree showers/day
180 UH=ES/24'useful hourly heat output of drumwall
190 GLOSSF=1.74E-09*6*AREA/ND/24'factor for heat lost thru glazing per drum
200 AMRADF=(32+459)^4'factor for radiation from surroundings to drumwall
210 CP=55*8'thermal mass of a drum full of water
220 CLS
230 HMAX=192
240 PRINT #1,"Charging mode, with sun..."
250 PRINT "Charging mode, with sun..."
260 DT=.1'simulation time step
270 FOR H=0 TO HMAX+.01 STEP DT'hours of use
280 TECON=0'initialize total convection heat from below
290 LB=UH*DT/(T(1,NH)-55)'water moved thru system per time step
300 GOSUB 740
310 'adjust top drum row temperatures
320 FOR D=1 TO NH'drum number in top row
330 TD=T(NV,1)-T(1,D)'temp diff between top drum and lower drums
340 IF TD>0 THEN ECON=TD*AD ELSE ECON=0'convection heat from below
350 TECON=TECON+ECON'accumulate total hourly convection heat
360 HEATFLOW=(SUNH+ECON-((T(1,D)+459)^4-AMRADF)*GLOSSF)*DT
370 T(1,D)=T(1,D)+HEATFLOW/CP'adjust top row drum temp
380 IF T(1,D)>T(NV,1) THEN T(1,D)=T(NV,1)'limit upper drum temp
390 NEXT D
400 ECONA=TECON/(NH*(NV-1))'heatflow to top row from average drum
410 FOR R=2 TO NV'adjust bottom row temps
420 FOR D=1 TO NH
430 HEATFLOW=(SUNH-ECONA-((T(R,D)+459)^4-AMRADF)*GLOSSF)*DT
440 T(R,D)=T(R,D)+HEATFLOW/CP
450 NEXT D
460 NEXT R
470 IF INT(10*H+.05) MOD 480= 0 THEN GOSUB 800'print drum temp array
480 NEXT H
490 PRINT #1,
500 PRINT
510 PRINT #1,"Storage mode, with no sun..."
520 PRINT "Storage mode, with no sun..."
530 FOR H=DT TO 168+.01 STEP DT'hours of use
540 TECON=0'initialize total convection heat from below
550 'adjust top drum row temperatures
560 LB=UH*DT/(T(1,NH)-55)'water moved thru system per time step
570 GOSUB 740
580 FOR D=1 TO NH'drum number in top row
590 TD=T(NV,1)-T(1,D)'temp diff between top drum and lower drums
600 IF TD>0 THEN ECON=TD*AD ELSE ECON=0'convection heat from below
610 TECON=TECON+ECON'accumulate total convection heat
620 T(1,D)=T(1,D)+ECON*DT/CP
630 IF T(1,D)>T(NV,1) THEN T(1,D)=T(NV,1)'limit upper drum temp
640 NEXT D
650 IF INT(10*H+.05) MOD 240= 0 THEN GOSUB 800'print drum temp array
660 ECONA=TECON/(NH*(NV-1))'heatflow to top row from average drum
670 FOR R=2 TO NV'adjust bottom row temps
680 FOR D=1 TO NH
690 T(R,D)=T(R,D)-ECONA*DT/CP
700 NEXT D
710 NEXT R
720 NEXT H
730 END
740 T(1,1)=(LB*55+(CP-LB)*T(1,1))/CP'move 55 degree water into top left drum
750 IF T(1,1)<55 THEN T(1,1)=55'limit lower drum temp to 55
760 FOR D=2 TO NH'move water across top row
770 T(1,D)=(LB*T(1,D-1)+(CP-LB)*T(1,D))/CP'move water from top drum d-1-->d
780 NEXT D
790 RETURN
800 PRINT #1,
810 PRINT
820 PRINT #1,"Day:";INT(H/24+.01)
830 PRINT"Day:";INT(H/24+.01)
840 FOR RS=1 TO NV'display drum temperatures
850 FOR P=1 TO NH-1
860 PRINT #1,INT(T(RS,P)+.5);TAB(6*P);
870 PRINT INT(T(RS,P)+.5);TAB(6*P);
880 NEXT P
890 PRINT #1,INT(T(RS,NH)+.5)
900 PRINT INT(T(RS,NH)+.5)
910 NEXT RS
920 RETURN

Charging mode, with sun...
 
Day: 0 
 149  150   150   150   150   150   150   150   150   150 
 150  150   150   150   150   150   150   150   150   150 
 150  150   150   150   150   150   150   150   150   150 
 
Day: 2 
 95   120   136   146   152   156   156   156   156   156 
 156  156   156   156   156   156   156   156   156   156 
 156  156   156   156   156   156   156   156   156   156 
 
Day: 4 
 96   121   137   146   153   156   156   156   156   156 
 156  156   156   156   156   156   156   156   156   156 
 156  156   156   156   156   156   156   156   156   156 
 
Day: 6 
 96   122   137   147   153   157   157   157   157   157 
 157  157   157   157   157   157   157   157   157   157 
 157  157   157   157   157   157   157   157   157   157 
 
Day: 8 
 97   122   138   148   154   158   158   158   158   158 
 158  158   158   158   158   158   158   158   158   158 
 158  158   158   158   158   158   158   158   158   158 
 
Storage mode, with no sun...
 
Day: 1 
 89   112   128   138   145   149   149   149   149   149 
 149  149   149   149   149   149   149   149   149   149 
 149  149   149   149   149   149   149   149   149   149 
 
Day: 2 
 84   104   118   128   135   139   141   141   141   141 
 141  141   141   141   141   141   141   141   141   141 
 141  141   141   141   141   141   141   141   141   141 
 
Day: 3 
 80   97    110   119   125   129   132   132   132   132 
 132  132   132   132   132   132   132   132   132   132 
 132  132   132   132   132   132   132   132   132   132 
 
Day: 4 
 75   90    101   109   115   120   123   124   124   124 
 124  124   124   124   124   124   124   124   124   124 
 124  124   124   124   124   124   124   124   124   124 
 
Day: 5 
 71   83    93    100   106   110   113   115   115   115 
 115  115   115   115   115   115   115   115   115   115 
 115  115   115   115   115   115   115   115   115   115 
 
Day: 6 
 67   77    85    92    97    101   104   106   107   107 
 107  107   107   107   107   107   107   107   107   107 
 107  107   107   107   107   107   107   107   107   107 
 
Day: 7 
 64   72    78    84    88    91    94    97    99    99 <--hot water temp
 99   99    99    99    99    99    99    99    99    99    supplied to house
 99   99    99    99    99    99    99    99    99    99    after a week w/o
                                                            sun, in January


From news@bigblue.oit.unc.edu Fri Nov 25 10:03:45 1994
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	for renew-energy@twosocks.ces.ncsu.edu (renew-energy@twosocks.ces.ncsu.edu)
To: renew-energy@twosocks.ces.ncsu.edu
Date: 22 Nov 1994 16:24:01 GMT
From: cgood@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Charles W Good)
Message-Id: <3at5v1$ml8@charm.magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu>
Organization: The Ohio State University
Sender: london
Subject: Wood Heat
Status: RO
X-Status: 

I have seen wood heat flamed (excuse the pun) a lot on this newsgroup, and I 
would be interested in a discussion of the pros and cons.  I have been heating 
with wood for 17 years.  The fuel accounts for about 90% of my home heating.  
Consider the following:

1- Although wood smoke is polluting, it probably isn't as polluting in some 
ways as fossil fuel smoke.  Wood contains almost no sulphur and very little 
nitrogen.  Thus wood smoke has no sulphur dioxide and very little in the way of
nitrous oxides.  This means no acid rain.

2- Trees and other forms of biomass naturally decay slowly, releasing all their
carbon hydrogen and oxygen to the environment as carbon dioxide and water.  
Burning biomass fuels just speeds up this process, but the end result is the 
same.  There is no difference in the amount of carbon dioxide released to the 
atmosphere whether biomass burns or decays.  Burning fossil fuels adds EXTRA 
carbon dioxide to the atmosphere which can affect global warming.  Burning 
biomass fuels does not add extra carbon dioxide over and above what is 
naturally cycled between the atmosphere and biomass via photosynthesis (removes
carbon dioxide) and respiration (adds carbon dioxide).

3-  I know that deforestation is a big problem in many parts of the world and 
has been for hundreds of years.  I have read, however, that  currently forest 
land east of the Mississippi in the USA has been gradually increasing.  This is
due to the abandonment of marginal farmland that is difficult to farm with big 
machines.  An example is in southeast Ohio in the area that includes Wayne 
State Forest near Athens Ohio.  This is in spite of the increased use of fuel 
wood.  East of the Mississippi in general (there are local exceptions) I don't 
think deforestation is a problem.  WOOD IS A RENEWABLE FUEL!

4-  Money spent purchasing wood fuel goes into the local economy, not over to 
Saudi Arabia to make some rich person there even richer.

5-  Wood fuel costs less (if you have to buy it) than almost any other form of 
domestic heating fuel.  The only fuel that has a comparably low cost is *yuck* 
coal.  This cost factor is one of the main reasons I heat with wood.   If I had
a new house I would design it from the beginning to take advantage of solar for
much of its heat.  However, I own a nice old victorian house built in 1895, so 
my solar options are limited.

Regards,
Charles W. Good
cgood@lima.ohio-state.edu

P.S.  I have a PV system that powers everything in my bedroom, even though I 
live right next to grid power lines.  I have the PV system not because it is 
cheap but because "its the right thing to do" for the environment.

