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There are 2 messages totalling 93 lines in this issue.

Topics of the day:

  1. USAAF 2 JUL 43
  2. subscribe

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Date:    Fri, 2 Jul 1993 07:16:20 -0400
From:    jem3@CC.BELLCORE.COM
Subject: USAAF 2 JUL 43

COMBAT CHRONOLOGY OF THE US ARMY AIR FORCES
FRIDAY, 2 JULY 1943
FTP SITES
  1. ftp.rutgers.edu in directory pub/wwii/usaf
  2. byrd.mu.wvnet.edu (129.71.32.152) in pub/history/military/airforce/
     wwii_chronology

AIRCRAFT MENTIONED IN THIS REPORT:
  B-17, Boeing Flying Fortress
  B-24, Consolidated Liberator
  B-25, North American Mitchell
  F4U, Vought Corsair (USN)
  P-38, Lockheed Lightning
  P-40, Curtiss
  P-51, North American Mustang
  Wellington, Vickers (RAF)

AMERICAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  ALASKA (Eleventh Air Force)
    3 bombers and 4 P-38's fly 4 reconnaissance missions over Kiska and
Segula Islands. 17 B-24's and 16 B-25's then attack Kiska Island in 5
missions, 2 of them radar-guided. Fires are started at several of the
targets, which include Gertrude Cove, the harbor, and buildings in the
Main Camp area. Intense AA fire damages 3 aircraft. 2 B-25's on a
submarine attack hit the Kiska seaplane ramp after making no contact
with the target. 2 P-40's cover troops which make an unopposed landing
on Rat Island.

MEDITERRANEAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  EASTERN MEDITERRANEAN (Ninth Air Force)
    B-24's bomb airfields at Lecce, Grottaglie and San Pancrazio
Salentino, Italy.  In Sicily, B-25's hit the airfield and surrounding area
at Sciacca; P-40's, escorting bombers to Sciacca, shoot down a fighter and
damage 1. 2 P-40's are lost.

  WESTERN MEDITERRANEAN (Northwest African Air Force)
    In Sicily, Northwest African Strategic Air Force (NASAF) Wellingtons
hit Palermo and Cagliari during the night of 1/2 Jul; and Northwest African
Tactical Air Force (NATAF) B-25's hit Castelvetrano during the day.
Northwest African Coastal Air Force (NACAF) aircraft attack 2 vessels off
the W coast of Italy and fly patrols, reconnaissance, and convoy protection.
    The air echelon of the 111th Reconnaissance Squadron (Fighter), 68th
Reconnaissance Group transfers with P-51's from Bou Ficha, Tunisia to
Korba, Tunisia.

SOUTH PACIFIC THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Thirteenth Air Force)
  B-25's and US Navy F4U's bomb and strafe a small vessel in the anchorage
at Bairoko, New Georgia Island, Solomon Islands.

SOUTHWEST PACIFIC THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Fifth Air Force)
  In New Guinea, B-25's pound defenses in the Kela Point area and a
trail near Logui while a lone B-24 bombs the Salamaua area. The Allied
invasion force (the MacKechnie Force) holds firm a beachhead on Nassau Bay,
and makes contact with Australian forces to the N. B-17's and B-24's again
attack airfields at Rabaul on New Britain Island in the Bismarck
Archipelago.

SOURCES:
AIR FORCE COMBAT UNITS OF WORLD WAR II, Office of Air Force History,
  Headquarters USAF, 1961, ISBN 0-912799-02-1
COMBAT SQUADRONS OF THE AIR FORCE, WORLD WAR II, Office of Air Force
  History, Headquarters USAF 1982
THE ARMY AIR FORCES IN WORLD WAR II: COMBAT CHRONOLOGY, 1941-1945 by the
  Office of Air Force History, Headquarters USAF, 1973
THE MIGHTY EIGHTH WAR DIARY by Roger A. Freeman, ISBN 1-85409-071-2

Jack McKillop
USAF (Airways and Air Communications Service)
1955-59

----------------------------------------------------------------------
|  Jack McKillop      |  Those who have long enjoyed such privileges |
|  Bellcore           |  as we enjoy forget in time that men have    |
|  Piscataway, NJ     |  died to win them.     FDR                   |
|  USA                |  jem3@cc.bellcore.com                        |
----------------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 2 Jul 1993 15:04:14 MDT
From:    Patricia Loghry <FG38@UTEP.BITNET>
Subject: subscribe

subscribe Pat Loghry WWII-L

------------------------------

End of WWII-L Digest - 1 Jul 1993 to 2 Jul 1993
***********************************************

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There are 2 messages totalling 166 lines in this issue.

Topics of the day:

  1. ARC: Archival additions
  2. PARA WINGS

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date:    Sat, 3 Jul 1993 11:23:39 EST
From:    Larry Jewell <jewell@MACE.CC.PURDUE.EDU>
Subject: ARC: Archival additions

F.Y.I:

Date:     Sat, 3 Jul 1993 00:02:35 -0500
Reply-To: Military History <@VM.CC.PURDUE.EDU:MILHST-L@UKANVM>
From: Automatic digest processor <LISTSERV@UKANVM.CC.UKANS.EDU>
Subject:  MILHST-L Digest - 1 Jul 1993 to 2 Jul 1993
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              <MILHST-L@UKANVM.CC.UKANS.EDU>
Status: OR

There are 11 messages totalling 325 lines in this issue.

Topics of the day:

  1. Archival sources (3)

  [balance of articles deleted]
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 2 Jul 1993 11:41:41 -0700
From:    anita cohen-williams <IACAGC@ASUVM.INRE.ASU.EDU>
Subject: Archival sources

      This information is from the 12th issue of the NATIONAL INVENTORY OF
DOCUMENTARY SOURCES IN THE UNITED STATES (NIDS) Newsletter, published by
Chadwyck-Healey, Inc.
       The Manuscript Division of the Library of Congress has received some
3,500 items and 108 volumes (23 cartons) of the papers of John Paul Vann and
Neil Sheehan. The materials relate to the Vietnam War and other military
matters and were used by SHeehan in writing his biography of Vann, A BRIGHT
SHINING LIE (1988). The material includes ring binders and folders containing
the U.S. Defense Department publication, CURRENT NEWS, a daily printed
compilation of news articles and editorials for the period 1964-1975.
       There is a lot more of this type of info in the Newsletter, especially
on new material that the National Archives has accessioned recently. Are
people interested in me passing it along? Let me know.

Anita Cohen-Williams; Reference Services; Hayden Library
Arizona State University, Tempe, AZ  85287-1006
PHONE: (602) 965-4576              FAX: (602) 965-9169
BITNET: IACAGC@ASUACAD    INTERNET: IACAGC@ASUVM.INRE.ASU.EDU

 -----------------------------

Date:    Fri, 2 Jul 1993 14:20:18 -0700
From:    anita cohen-williams <IACAGC@ASUVM.INRE.ASU.EDU>
Subject: More NIDS

      Here is more info from the NIDS Newsletter:
      The National Archives has received 27 cubic feet of Records of the U.S.
Army, Vietnam (R.G. 472), consisting of 5th Special Forces Groups; Detachments
A-502, A-342, and ORLL, 1965-1970; Aviation Section, Aviation Safety Division,
Aircraft Accident Reports, 1969; General Orders, 1962-1965, 1968, and 1971;
Missing in Action Files 1965-1972; 47th Military History Detachment, Riverine
Operations Study, 1968; United States Army, Vietnam, Adjutant General's
Section, Administrative Services Division, Daily Command Strength Reports,
1969.

      From the World War II period, the National Archives has added to its
Records of the Foreign Broadcast Intelligence Service (R.G. 262) 37 cu. ft. of
Transcripts of Monitored Short Wave Broadcasts, 1941-1945.

      The National Archives has accessioned into the Records of U.S. Army
Commands (Record Group 338) 225 cu. ft. of Ports of Embarkation Records;
European Command, Judge Advocate Division, Decimal Files, 1947 and 1951; and
Hawaiian Department, Signal Section, microfilm, 1922-1944.

   More to come (I've got to rest...)

Anita Cohen-Williams; Reference Services; Hayden Library
Arizona State University, Tempe, AZ  85287-1006
PHONE: (602) 965-4576              FAX: (602) 965-9169
BITNET: IACAGC@ASUACAD    INTERNET: IACAGC@ASUVM.INRE.ASU.EDU

 -----------------------------

Date:    Fri, 2 Jul 1993 14:41:06 -0700
From:    anita cohen-williams <IACAGC@ASUVM.INRE.ASU.EDU>
Subject: Part 3 of NIDS

    Here's the last of it...
      The National Archives - New England Region office has added to its
Records of the Bureau of Yards and Docks (R.G. 71) approximately 5 feet of
"Journals of Daily Transaction," or logs for the Boston Navy Yard, 1833-1834,
1836-1843, and 1849-1850; the Portsmouth (NH) Navy Yard, 1836-1841, 1843, and
1845-1851; the New London (CT) Experimental Station, 1919; and the New London
Submarine Base, 1920-1921. This is a chronological record of daily events,
showing weather conditions, type and number or personnel, and work assigned
and accomplished.

       The Pacific Northwest Region (Seattle) of the National Archives has
received 1 foot of Records of the Burea of Yards and Docks (R.G. 71),
containing the air station of the Aviation Division, 1925-1942, for the air
station at Tongue Point, OR. The Seattle office also now has 4 feet of Records
of the Bureau of Aeronautics (R.G. 72) of the Records of the Inspector of
Naval Aircraft, Seattle, WA, 1917-1919.

The National Archives - Pacific Southwest Region has received from the
National Archives - Washington, 57 cu. ft. of the Records of the Army Air
Forces (R.G. 18) consisting of the Records of the Army Balloon School, Ross
Field, Arcadia, CA; general adminstrative files, as well as telegrams, sick
reports, and duty rosters; post returns, 1918-1929; special orders, 1918-1926;
and general orders, 1919-1921. Records of the Air Corps Detachment, Lindbergh
Field, San Diego, CA consist of general administrative files, 1925-1941.
Records of Rockwell Air Depot, Coronado, CA, consist of special orders,
1920-1926; general orders, 1920-1927 and 1935-1938; and mobilization and
planning files, 1923-1939. Records of the Air Service Flying School, Rockwell
Field, Coronado, CA, consist of special and general orders, 1917-1935. Records
of March Field, CA, consist of general administratuve files, daily record of
flights, special regulations, reports of enlistments, telegrams, orders,
1918-1921; post memos; special orders, 1931-1934; and general orders,
1935-1938.

Anita Cohen-Williams; Reference Services; Hayden Library
Arizona State University, Tempe, AZ  85287-1006
PHONE: (602) 965-4576              FAX: (602) 965-9169
BITNET: IACAGC@ASUACAD    INTERNET: IACAGC@ASUVM.INRE.ASU.EDU

------------------------------

Date:    Sat, 3 Jul 1993 13:10:34 -0400
From:    MAX HARE <maxc@URSUS1.URSUS.MAINE.EDU>
Subject: PARA WINGS

>From <@MAINE.maine.edu:owner-milhst-l@UKANVM.CC.UKANS.EDU> Fri Jul  2 17:31:18 1993
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Sender: Military History <MILHST-L%UKANVM.bitnet@MAINE.maine.edu>
From: MAX HARE <maxc@URSUS1.URSUS.MAINE.EDU>
Subject:      PARA WINGS
To: Multiple recipients of list MILHST-L <MILHST-L%UKANVM.bitnet@MAINE.maine.edu>

Folks,

I recently learned that the U.S. Air Force Academy offered both
parachuting and glider flying (I was really shocked to see a Sweizer
2-33 training glider in USAF markings!) to its students.  My question is
...do the cadets earn any special rating badge for either activity?

Also, a prominent insignia dealer is offering "USAF Parachute Wings".
These are identical to the regualr USAF pilots wings except the shield
in the center has been replaced by an open parachute (much like the
Navy/Marine jump wings) and the entire affair is colored silver.  All
jump-rated USAF personnel that I have seen have earned their jump wings
through the US Army jump school and wear the classic chute with
turned-up wings "airborne" badge.  Is this badge spurious?  Would it be
related to the USAF Academy programs?  What / where / how is the USAF
running its own parachute school?

Sorry for all the ??? but this has me stumped.

Max C. Calderwood
University of Southern Maine
Gorham, ME
MAXC@URSUS1.URSUS.MAINE.EDU

------------------------------

End of WWII-L Digest - 2 Jul 1993 to 3 Jul 1993
***********************************************

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Status: O

There are 2 messages totalling 952 lines in this issue.

Topics of the day:

  1. INF: July, 1943, US Army Chronology
  2. REF: "goums"?

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 5 Jul 1993 17:18:49 EST
From:    Larry Jewell <jewell@MACE.CC.PURDUE.EDU>
Subject: INF: July, 1943, US Army Chronology

Let me know if anyone gets this truncated and I'll send the missing pieces
along.
Larry J

From: UNITED STATES ARMY IN WORLD WAR II, Special Studies:
CHRONOLOGY, 1941-1945, compiled by Mary H. Williams, Office of
the Chief of Military History, Department of the Army,
Washington, D.C., 1960

1 July

SOLOMON IS.-43d Div troops on Rendova consolidate beachhead and
continue search for enemy. On New Georgia I., Marines of 4th
Raider Bn seize Viru Harbor in double envelopment maneuver.

NEW GUINEA-Allied troops are consolidating positions along S arm
of Bitoi R in Nassau Bay area.

CHINA-Gen Chennault designates shipping and port installations
as primary targets for Fourteenth Air Force.

2 July

SOLOMOS IS.-43d Div is ordered to proceed with next task in
central Solomons-capture of Munda airfield-and begins movement
of assault force from Rendova to New Georgia. Enemy bombers make
destructive raid on Rendova; subsequent air attacks are much
less effective. Japanese warships shell Rendova, night 2-3.

TROBRIAND IS.-Work is begun on airfield at Woodlark I.

NEW GUINEA-MacKechnie Force holds firm beachhead at Nassau Bay.
Contact is made with Aus 3d Div.

MEDITERRANEAN-Sicilian and Italian ports continue to receive
full attention of NAAF, which, during period 12 June-2 July,
drops 2,276 tons of bombs. Malta-based and Gozo-based fighters
contribute cover and escort. Final phase of pre-HUSKY air
offensive, beginning at this time, is directed toward knocking
out enemy planes and wrecking airfields.

U.K.-Air Marshal Leigh-Mallory establishes air staff at Norfolk
House.

 3 July

SOLOMON IS.-Southern Landing Group (Brig Gen Leonard F. Wing)
of Gen Hester's Munda-Bairoko Occupation Force lands 1st Bn of
172d Inf, 43d Div, on Zanana beach, about 5 air miles E of
Munda, New Georgia I., without opposition. Small defense
perimeter of 1st Bn is gradually strengthened during next few-
days. Wickham Anchorage on Vangunu I., which is to become
staging point for landing craft, falls into American hands.

4 July

SOLOMOS IS.-Co B, 103d Inf, arrives at Viru Harbor and relieves
Marines of 4th Raider Bn. From Zanana, 1st Bn of 172d Inf and Co
A of 169th virtually unopposed move W to Barike R, line of
departure for assault on Munda. As transports carrying Northern
Landing Group (Lt Col Harry B. Liversedge, USMC) of Gen Hester's
Munda-Bairoko Occupation Force proceed toward Rice Anchorage,
night 4-5, accompanying warships bombard Vila and Bairoko Harbor
and intercept Japanese DD's bringing reinforcements to
Kolombangara from the Shortlands. In the ensuing action, USS
STRONG is lost to enemy torpedo, but Japanese effort to land
troops is blocked.

CRETE-Br commandos successfully raid enemy airfields during
night and withdraw safely.

MEDITERRANEAN-Gen Wladislaw Sikorski, CinC of Polish forces, is
killed in plane crash near Gibraltar.

5 July

U.S.-President Roosevelt proposes to Chiang Kai-shek that Maj
Gen George E. Stratemeyer coordinate air forces matters in
India-Burma sector.

SOLOMOS IS -Gen Harmon recommends to Adm Halsey that XIV Corps
staff prepare to take over on New Georgia and free Gen Hester
for operations against Kolombangara. Almost all the New Georgia
Occupation Force is now ashore in central Solomons, main body at
Rendova. Northern Landing Group-consisting of 1st Raider Bn of
1st Mar Raider Regt, reinf by 3d Bns of 148th and 145th Regts,
37th Div-lands without opposition at Rice Anchorage, beginning
at 0130. Leaving elements of 3d Bn, 145th Inf, to defend landing
site, Col Liversedge's force starts S toward Dragon's Peninsula,
between Enogai Inlet and Bairoko Harbor, forward elements
reaching Giza Giza R. Patrol of Southern Landing Group finds
Japanese force blocking Munda Trail between Zanana and Barike R.

BATTLE OF KULA GULF-U.S. naval surface force engages enemy
vessels bringing second echelon of reinforcements to
Kolombangara, night 5-6. Japanese lose 2 DD's and sink USS
HELENA. Force of 850 Japanese succeeds in landing al Vila.

USSR-Germans launch offensive on limited front to reduce Soviet
salient at Kursk, 9th Army pushing S from Orel and 4th Pz Army
and Army Kempf working northward from Belgorod. Limited progress
is made at heavy cost in tanks. By this time, Axis and Soviet
forces have both taken advantage of spring thaw to reorganize
and refit troops. Red Army is greatly superior in strength.

6 July

ALEUTIAN IS.-U.S. naval vessels, for the first time in 11
months, bombard Kiska, supplementing intermittent efforts of
aircraft to neutralize the island. Cruiser-DD TF (Rear Adm
Robert C. Giffen) conducts the action and retires safely.

SOLOMON IS.-Heavy bombers begin series of strikes against enemy
airfields on Bougainville, the next objective. Attacks are
gradually increased in strength and frequency and are
supplemented by medium bomber strikes on enemy shipping in the
area. By this time, 43d Div's 172d and 169th Regts are on New
Georgia I. 172d closes along the Barike R and 3d Bn, 169th,
starts toward the river from Zanana. Japanese repulse attacks
against their road- block on Munda Trail. Col Liversedge's force
reaches and crosses Tamakau R.

NEW GUINEA-3d Bn of 162d Inf, part of U.S. 41st Div's Coane
Force, goes ashore at Nassau beach- head and begins period of
active patrolling. 2d Bn, 162d Inf, takes over positions vacated
by 3d Bn at Morobe.

CHINA-Fourteenth Air Force begins anti- shipping operations off
West R estuary.

7 July

U.S.-Gen Giraud arrives in Washington to confer with President
Roosevelt and military leaders.

SOLOMON IS.-First echelon of 145th Inf ( -3d Bn), 37th Div,
sails from Guadalcanal for Rendova. On New Georgia I., 43d Div
continues futile efforts to eliminate roadblock on Munda Trail
between Zanana and the Barike. Continuing S, main body of Col
Liversedge's force reaches Enogai Inlet and encounters enemy
resistance at Trir; 3rd Bn of 148th Inf reaches Munda-Bairoko
Trail.

NEW GUINEA-Allied planes, in direct support of ground
operations, attack Mubo area in force, dropping over 100 tons of
bombs. MacKechnie Force, having pushed inland from beach to
Napier, begins assault on Bitoi Ridge. Aus 2/6th Bn captures
Observation Hill, an important terrain feature a mile W of Mubo.

USSR-Slow enemy advance in Orel sector N of Kursk is brought to
a halt as Red Army opens counterattacks. Limited progress is
being made by S prong of Axis offensive in Belgorod area.

8 July

NEW GEORGIA IS.-43d Div complete reduction of enemy strongpoint
astride Munda Trail; 169th Inf closes along the Barike, from
which Munda will be attacked on 9th. Col Liversedge's 3d Bn,
148th Inf, establishes roadblock on Munda- Bairoko Trail and
remains there. 1st Raider Bn, turning over positions at Triri to
troops of 145th Inf, tries in vain to reach Enogai.

 9 July

SOLOMON IS.-On New Georgia I., 43d Div, with close air, arty,
and naval gunfire support, attacks W across Barike R toward
Munda with 172d Inf on left and 169th on right. 172d gains about
1,100 yards but 169th makes little headway beyond the Barike and
still has elements E of the river. 1st Raider Bn of Col
Liversedge's force again attacks toward Enogai from Triri, using
another route, but is halted by enemy fire near Enogai Pt. Both
sides are moving reinforcements to central Solomons. Second
echelon of 145th Inf ( -3d Bn), 37th Div, sails for Rendova.
Japanese land 1,200 reinforcements from the Shortlands on
Kolombangara.

SICILY-Tremendous preinvasion air offensive against island
results in Allied air superiority, over enemy. As convoys of
Western (U.S., under Vice Adm Henry K. Hewitt) and Eastern (Br,
under Adm Sir Bertram H. Ramsay) Naval Task Forces, with ground
assault forces of Gen Alexander's 15th Army Group embarked,
approach Sicily in preparation for early morning invasion on
10th, Br and U.S. airborne contingents take off from Tunisia and
are dropped on the island during night 9-10. High winds
prevailing in assault area handicap both sea and airborne
forces, but latter surprise enemy and take assigned objectives,
facilitating forward movement of seaborn forces when they
arrive. 1st Air Landing Brig Gp of 1st A/B Div, 13 Corps, Br
Eighth Army, is dropped near Syracuse to hasten capture of that
port. Most of the 130 odd gliders land wide of drop zone and
nearly 50 fall into the sea, but group of 8 officers and 65 men
reaches and holds objective-Ponte Grande bridge. U.S. parachute
task force under Col J. M. Gavin, consisting of 82d A/B Div's
RCT 505 and 3d Bn of 504th Para Regt, is dropped from 226 C-47's
to take high ground near Ponte Olivo airfield, NE of Gela, and
assist seaborne forces of U.S. II Corps, Seventh Army, in
capture of the airfield. Although drops are very widely
scattered over S Sicily, objective is taken. This is the first
major airborne operation to be undertaken by Allied forces in
World War II and consequently becomes subject of intensive
study.

USSR-Red Army opens counterattacks in Obojan region, S of Kursk.
Although vigorous fighting continues N and S of Kursk for some
time, Axis forces are unable to advance.

10 July

KURILE IS.-Paramushiro is bombed for first time, by B-25's from
Attu.

NEW GEORGIA IS.-Maj Gen Oscar W. Griswold, CG XIV Corps, is
ordered to New Georgia. Momentum of 43d Div's westward drive on
Munda slows, particularly on right, where 169th Inf is brought
to a halt at junction of Munda Trail with trail leading to coast
at Laiana. Jungle terrain makes close air support increasingly
difficult as attack progresses and is also slowing road
construction. Liversedge's force clears most of Enogai area but
by now is dependent upon airdrops for food and water.

NEW GUINEA-U.S. forces from Nassau Bay effect junction with Aus
3d Div troops at Buigap Creek, cutting Japanese communications
between Mubo and Salamaua.

SICILY-15th Army Group: Main invasion forces of U.S. Seventh and
Br Eighth Armies, with close support of Royal and U.S. Navies
and Allied aircraft, land on SE coast of Sicily on broad front
from point W of Licata on W to point S of Syracuse on E between
0245 and 0600; establish bridgeheads without serious difficulty.

U.S. Seventh Army, which Gen Patton activates at sea at 0001,
puts 3 assault forces ashore between Licata and Capo Scaramia.
Gen Truscott commands westernmost TF ( 3d Div, CCA of 2d Armd
Div, and 3d Ranger Bn), which lands in Licata area and makes
Licata and its small port. Gen Bradley, U.S. II Corps commander,
commands the other two U.S. assault force. 1st Div ( - RCT 18)
and 1st and 4th Ranger Bns land at Gela. To E, 45th Div goes
ashore near Scoglitti. Both Gela and Scoglitti, as well as
Vittoria, are taken as troops push inland and along coast
against light resistance. U.S. 82d A/B Div parachutists, upon
making contact with 1st Div, come under II Corps command;
elements take Marina di Ragusa. Floating reserve (RCT 18 of 1st
Div, and 2d Armd Div less CCA) is landed during day in region E
of Gela.

Br Eighth Army (Gen Montgomery) lands to E of U.S. II Corps
between Rozzallo and Syracuse. 30 Corps, with 231st Brig on
right, 51st Div in center, and Cdn 1st Div on left, lands on
Pachino peninsula and clears town of Pachino and airfield. 13
Corps, on E flank, employs 5th Div on right and 50th on left.
While 50th takes Avola, 5th makes contact with airborne forces
of Br 1st A/B Div at Ponte Grande and crosses bridge to capture
Syracuse, night 10-11.

11 July

SOLOMON IS.-Adm Halsey selects Gen Vandegrift, commander of I
Mar Amphib Corps, to head ground forces that are to invade
Bougainville, which lies between S Pacific forces and Rabaul.
Gen Griswold arrives at Rendova by air. On New Georgia I.,
supply problem is growing so acute as 43d Div's attack
progresses toward Munda that 172d Inf starts quietly S to anchor
left Bank on coast at Laiana and shorten supply line. Enemy soon
discovers the move. Command of 169th Inf, which is still held up
by opposition from heights dominating Munda- Lambeti trail
junction, passes to Col Temple G. Holland, former commander of
145th Inf. Liversedge's force is mopping up in Enogai area.
Airfield at Segi Pt is ready for limited use by fighters.

SICILY-15th Army Group: U.S. Seventh Army reaches beachhead line
Yellow (Palma di Montechiaro-Campobello-Mazzarino-Caltagirone-
Grammichele) on W Bank, where Gen Truscott's force expands
Licata bridgehead to include Palma di Montechiaro, Naro,
Campobello, and Riesi. II Corps withstands determined, tank-
supported counter-attacks, main force of which hits 1st Div in
Gela area. 45th Div helps repel enemy and takes town of Comiso
and airport and Ragusa. Airdrop of another contingent of 82d A/B
Div (RCT 504) in Gela area proves costly; drops are scattered
and come under both enemy and friendly fire.

In Br Eighth Army area, 30 Corps expands bridge-head to Awola-
Pozzallo road, seizing Pozzallo. 13 Corps makes main effort
northward along coast toward Augusta.

USSR-In region S of Kursk, Axis 4th Pz Army and Army Kempf join
forces in drive toward Prochorovka and make limited progress.

12 July

NEW GEORGIA-172d Inf of 43d Div, now without food and water,
pushes to within 500 yards of Laiana and learns from scouts that
Japanese are firmly entrenched in vicinity of Ilangana. 169th
Inf, up against outer defenses of Munda position, attempts to
advance behind rolling arty barrage but makes little headway.

BATTLE OF KOLOMBANGARA (Second Battle of Kula Gulf)-Allied
surface force under Rear Adm Walden L. Ainsworth engages enemy
force bringing reinforcements to central Solomons, night 12-13;
sinks Japanese cruiser but loses DD GWIN and suffers damage to
other vessels. Despite this action, Japanese land 1,200 men on
Kolombangara.

NEW GUINEA-Allied troops advancing on Mubo reduce several enemy
strongpoints.

CBI-Generalissimo Chiang Kai-shek consents to TRIDENT
recommendations concerning limited offensive, now called SAUCY,
to reopen land route from Burma to China.

SICILY-15th Army Group: Bridgeheads are firmly established by
end of day. Br and U.S. forces make contact at Ragusa.

Advance U.S. Seventh Army CP move ashore from USS MONROVIA. Gen
Truscott's force takes Canicatti, important road junction. II
Corps, despite further determined efforts of enemy to push it
back to the sea, expands bridgehead. 1st Div takes Ponte Olivo
airport and pushes inland toward Niscemi. Units of 45th Div in
Ragusa make contact with Cdn 1st Div of Br Eighth Army.

In Br Eighth Army area, 30 Corps, overrunning Madica and
Palazzolo, reaches general line Sortini-Palazzolo-Ragusa-Scicli.
13 Corps, though assisted by air and naval gunfire, is stalled
by stubborn opposition at Priolo Gargallo, about half way
between Syracuse and Augusta.

USSR-Red Army opens strong offensive, supported by concentrated
arty fire, to reduce Axis salient at Orel, concentrating on N
and E flanks. The operation is well timed, coming after enemy
reserves have been committed to the unsuccessful offensive
toward Kursk, which has sharply reduced tank strength. During
fierce battle S of Kursk, in Prochorovka area, Axis loses over
400 tanks in vain effort to advance.

13 July

NEW GEORGIA-Adm Halsey directs Gen Harmon to take command of New
Georgia operation, which is falling behind schedule. 169th Inf
of 43d Div, with air and arty support, drives salient into enemy
positions E of Munda with capture by 3d Bn of hill commanding
Munda Trail. Inability of 1st and 2d Bns to advance, however,
leaves 3d Bn in exposed position. 172d Inf reaches coast at
Laiana.

NEW GUINEA-Mubo area is cleared of enemy. Aus 3d Div, assisted
by fire of Americans, finishes clearing Lababia Ridge.

SICILY-First Allied fighters fly to Sicily to operate from
Pachino field. Enemy planes are no longer able to offer
effective resistance over the island and are reducing their
efforts.

15th Army Group: Gen Alexander establishes new boundary between
Br and U.S. forces, giving Eighth Army road Vizzini-Caltagirone-
Piazza Armerina-Enna-S. Stefano.

U.S. Seventh Army orders Canicatti held while rcn is pushed W to
Agrigento on W, where Gen Truscott's assault force has attained
its immediate objective. In II Corps area, RCT 18 is released to
1st Div, from which 1st and 4th Ranger Bns are detached. 2d Armd
Div ( -CCA) and 1st and 4th Ranger Bns are placed in army
reserve. II Corps continues efforts to close along line Yellow.
45th Div pushes N, taking Licodia and Monterosso.

In Br Eighth Army's 30 Corps area, 51st Div is slowed by-enemy
near Vizzini. 13 Corps begins offensive, night 13-14, in effort
to break out into Catania plain. Parachutists of 1st Para Brig
are dropped to seize Primasole bridge over Simeto R, the most
suitable exit to Catania plain, and do so. The operation,
however, is costly, since planes come under enemy and friendly
fire. Seaborne commandos are landed and take another bridge in
the area. 5th Div, followed by 50th, makes ground assault from
vicinity of Lentini and is firmly opposed.

14 July

SOLOMON IS.-On New Georgia, 43d Div's left flank is reinf as 3d
Bn of 103d Inf, with engineers and tanks attached, lands at
Laiana. The bn is not committed to action at once, however. 3d
Bn, 169th Inf, holds its exposed hill position under enemy fire.
On Guadalcanal, 25th Div's RCT 161 is alerted for movement to
New Georgia. TROBRIAND IS.-Airfield on Woodlark I. is ready for
use by C-47's.

SICILY-Messina, a primary target for Allied bombers, is
particularly hard hit. 212 heavy and medium bombers drop about
800 tons of bombs.

15th Army Group: In U.S. Seventh Army area, 82d A/B Div, in army
reserve, is being assembled and reinf in Gela area for
operations on W flank of U.S. sector. 4th Tabor of goums of Fr N
African Army lands at Licata and is attached to 3d Div. In II
Corps area, 1st Div makes substantial progress, taking Mazzarino
and Niscemi. CCB, 2d Armd Div, mops up in Niscemi area. Rangers,
assisted by naval gunfire, seize Butera. On II Corps right
flank, 45th Div takes Biscari airfield and to right reaches line
Yellow near Vizzini.

In Br Eighth Army's 30 Corps area, 51st Div, assisted by U.S.
45th Div, overcomes strong opposition at Vizzini. In 13 Corps
area, main assault force is stoutly opposed near Lentini but
succeeds in pushing through that town toward Primasole bridge.
Parachute force defending the bridge withstands strong enemy
pressure throughout day and at night falls back to ridge
overlooking the bridge.

ITALY-Air offensive against Italy to interdict movement of
supplies and reinforcements to Sicily is intensified by NAAF,
Naples being a primary target.

15 July

SOLOMON IS.-Gen Griswold, CG XIV Corps, takes command of New
Georgia Occupation Force at midnight 15-16, relieving Gen
Hester, who retains command of 43d Div. Adm Turner is relieved
of posts of Commander, S Pacific Amphib Force (III Amphib Force
and TF 32), and Commander, New Georgia Attack Force (TF 31 ),
and leaves for Hawaii. 1st Bn of 145th Inf, 37th Div, lands at
Zanana and is attached to 43d Div to relieve elements of 169th
Inf. Co of 103d Inf is committed on left flank to plug gap in
line of 172d Inf. In air battle over central Solomons, Japanese
lose 45 of about 75 aircraft as against 3 U.S. planes lost. As a
result, Japanese virtually stop daylight attacks.

SICILY-15th Army Group: In U.S. Seventh Army area, Gen Patton
forms Provisional Corps, comprising 3d Div, reinf by 3d Ranger
Bn and supporting troops, and 82d A/B Div, reinf by newly
arrived RCT 39 of 9th Div and supporting troops, all under
command of Maj Gen Geoffrey Keyes, to operate on W flank of U.S.
Seventh Army as it swings NW. 2d Armd Div, to which CCA reverts,
assembles in Campobello area under army control. 3d Div
continues to patrol actively. II Corps reaches line Yellow all
along its front, 45th Div on right flank co-operating with 30
Corps in vicinity of Caltagirone.

In Br Eighth Army's 30 Corps area, Cdn 1st Div, taking the lead
from 51st Div, captures Grammichele and Caltagirone. In 13 Corps
area, main assault force makes contact with paratroopers
commanding Primasole bridge; both forces continue efforts to
establish bridgehead over the Simeto.

16 July

NEW GEORGIA-As 172d Inf of 43d Div, assisted by Marine tanks,
slowly expands Laiana beachhead, 1st Bn of 169th Inf attacks
through 3d Bn, taking hill-later called Kelley Hill for 1st Lt
John R. Kelley-where it is exposed to strong enemy pressure.

TROBRIAND IS.-First Allied plane lands on Woodlark airstrip.

SICILY-Enemy air attacks during daylight virtually cease, but
night attacks are increasing.

15th Army Group: Axis troops are withdrawing to Messina
peninsula, at base of which lofty M. Etna commands entire
island. Gen Alexander issues directive calling for Br Eighth
Army to drive enemy NE along 3 routes into Messina peninsula
while U.S. Seventh Army, protecting rear of Br Eighth Army,
seizes road net at Enna and cuts E-W road at Petralia.

In U.S. Seventh Army's Prov Corps area, 3d Div begins assault on
Agrigento while 3d Ranger Bn takes its port, Porto Empedocle. In
II Corps area, 1st Div seizes Barrafranca. 45th Div begins
movement to left flank of corps.

In Br Eighth Army's 30 Corps area, Cdn 1st Div pushes northward
from Caltagirone, taking Piazza Armerina, night 16-17. To case
pressure on 13 Corps to right, 51st Div is ordered to drive on
Paterno, NW of Catania. 13 Corps establishes small bridgehead
across the Simeto before dawn.

ITALY-Prime Minister Churchill and President Roosevelt make
joint appeal to Italian people to "decide whether Italians shall
die for Mussolini and Hitler-or live for Italy and for
civilization."

USSR-Axis forces go on the defensive, having lost heavily in
futile attempts to reduce Kursk salient and being under strong
pressure in Orel area. Red Army is mounting secondary attacks on
southern front against enemy's Kuban bridgehead, Main Soviet
offensive against Orel salient is gaining ground.

17 July

NEW GEORGIA-43d Div withstands the only organized offensive
attempted by Japanese during Munda operation, beginning night
17-18. The counterattacks at various points are generally
unsuccessful.

NEW GUINEA-From Nassau Bay, Coane Force (2d and 3d Bns of 162d
Inf, U.S. 41st Div, and supporting units) moves out to join Aus
3d Div in drive toward Salamaua. The attack on Salamaua, under
Aus command, is a secondary effort designed to divert enemy from
next main effort, which is to secure Markham Valley and Huon
Peninsula and thus gain control of Vitiaz and Dampier Straits.

MEDITERRANEAN-CCS accept Gen Eisenhower's recommendations of 29
June. At a meeting between Gen Eisenhower and his commanders at
Carthage to consider post-HUSKY operations, it is decided that
the dual mission of knocking Italy out of the war and drawing
off maximum German forces from other areas can best be
accomplished by invasion of Italian mainland.

SICILY-15th Army Group: In U.S. Seventh Army's Prov Corps area,
3d Div, assisted by naval gunfire, completes reduction of
Agrigento. 82d A/B Div is being moved forward to W flank by
motor.

Going into action on W flank of II Corps, 45th takes
Pietraperzia and secures crossings of Salso R, S of
Caltanissetta, while 1st Div seizes crossings 6 miles E of
Caltanissetta.

In Br Eighth Army's 30 Corps area, 51st Div drives to within 10
miles of Paterno, crossing Simeto R. 13 Corps expands bridgehead
over the Simeto in coastal sector and during night 17-18 begins
northward drive on Catania with 2 brigs of 50th Div.

USSR-While continuing reduction of Orel salient, Red Army begins
local attacks in region S of Izyum and SW of Voroshilovgrad.
Moscow announces that positions in Orel sector held before
German offensive of 5 July have been recovered.

18 July

NEW GEORGIA-XIV Corps, while preparing for final push on Munda,
repels Japanese counterattacks at several points. 1st and 2d Bns
of 148th Inf, 37th Div, which have landed at Zanana, try
unsuccessfully to reach and relieve 169th Inf, 43d Div.

TROBRIAND IS.-Airfield on Kiriwina I. becomes operational.

NEW GUINEA-Coane Force secures S headland of Tambu Bay for
supply base.

SICILY-15th Army Group: U.S. Seventh Army is directed to cut N
coastal road after capture of Petralia; upon gaining line across
island from Campofelice on N to Agrigento on S, is to mop up W
part of island. Army advances rapidly all along line as enemy
continues withdrawal to NE part of island. Prov Corps pushes NW
toward Palermo, 3d Div, in the lead, reaching line Raffadali-S.
Cataldo. 82d A/B Div, reinf by RCT 39 of 9th Div, begins
operations on W flank of corps; attacking through 3d Div near
Agrigento, seizes crossings of Fiume delle Canno, about 8 miles
W of Porto Empedocle. II Corps drives NW to attack Palermo from
E. 45th Div takes Caltanisseta and pushes on through S Caterina.
1st Div reaches M. Capadarso area, NE of Caltanissetta.

In Br Eighth Army's 30 Corps area, 51st Div continues toward
Paterno while Cdn 1st Div thrusts toward Leonforte and Adrano.
In 13 Corps area, 5th Div drives toward Misterbianco, W of
Catania, while 50th, on coast, continues efforts to reach
Catania.

19 July

ALEUTIAN IS.-Adm Kinkaid approves plans for invasion of Kiska.

ITALY-Rome undergoes damaging air attack. More than 500 bombers
of USAAF attack military objectives-Lorenzo and Littoria
marshaling yards and Ciampino airfields-with about 1,000 tons of
bombs.

SICILY-15th Army Group: U.S. Seventh Army makes rapid progress
against light resistance. In Prov Corps area, 82d A/B Div,
driving NW along coastal highway, reaches positions beyond
Ribera. Casteltermini and Mussomeli fall to 3d Div. 2d Armd Div
is following in order to exploit possible breakthrough. In II
Corps area, 45th Div patrols actively in S. Caterina area. 1st
Div, advancing on Enna, clears enemy pocket S of objective.

In Br Eighth Army's 30 Corps area, Cdn 1st Div continues toward
Leonforte, bypassing Enna and reaching positions N of
Valguarnera. 51st Div crosses Dittaino R at Sferro, SW of
Paterno. 231st Brig, bridging gap between Cdn 1st Div and 51st
Div, thrusts to within 3 miles of Agira, where it halts to await
clearance of Leonforte. 13 Corps continues to meet firm
resistance near Catania. 5th Div crosses the Simeto to W of 50th
Div, but its supporting weapons remain S of the river.

20 July

U.S.-JCS direct Adm Nimitz to seize bases in the Gilbert Is. and
on Nauru.

NEW GEORGIA-Elements of 145th Inf, 37th Div, relieve hard-
pressed 169th Inf o/f 43d Div E of Munda. 148th breaks through
enemy positions that have been checking it and prepares to
relieve 145th. Trail from Laiana to Munda Trail is completed,
easing supply situation. Liversedge Force, after futile attempt
to take Bairoko, falls back to Enogai.

NEW GUINEA-U.S. forces begin lengthy struggle for heights
(Roosevelt Ridge, Scout Ridge, and Mt Tambu) commanding Tambu
Bay and Dot Inlet.

CBI-Gen Bissell is recalled to U.S. to become Assistant Chief of
Air Staff, A-2, and is replaced as head of Tenth Air Force by
Brig Gen Howard C. Davidson.

SICILY-15th Army Group: Gen Alexander orders U.S. Seventh Army,
upon reaching coastal road (Highway 113) N of Petralia, to
reconnoiter eastward along it and Highway 120 (Petralia-Nicosia-
Cesaro), which parallels it to S; to drive on Palermo, which is
to be a major supply base; and to secure left flank on general
line S. Giuseppe-Corleone-Sciacca.

In U.S. Seventh Army's Prov Corps area, 82d A/B Div, continuing
W along S coast, takes Sciacca and Menfi. 3d Div clears S.
Stefano and heights N of Mussomeli. 2d Armd Div, assembled in
Ribera area, is attached to Prov Corps. TF X is formed to
capture Castelvetrano and airfield W of it; protect left and
rear of corps' drive on Palermo. Lt Col William O. Darbu heads
the TF, which is composed of 1st and 4th Ranger Bns of RCT 39,
9th Div, and supporting units. In II Corps area, 45th Div
clashes with Italian delaying forces in Vallelunga area. 1st
Div, in conjunction with Br units to right, takes Enna,
important supply center, and drives on to Villapriola.

In Br Eighth Army area, Gen Montgomery orders reserve, 78th Div,
to Sicily from Africa. In 30 Corps area, Cdn 1st Div, pushes to
within a few miles of Leonforte. 51st Div, from Sferro area,
attacks Gerbini airfield. 13 Corps is virtually stopped by firm
resistance on Catania plain.

MEDITERRANEAN-Planning for invasion of Sardinia (BRIMSTONE) is
dropped because of successes in Sicilian campaign. Attention of
planners becomes focused next on Naples because of its harbor
and its proximity to Rome.

USSR-Mitsensk falls to Red Army, whose assault against Orel
salient continues.

21 July

SOLOMON IS.-Small U.S. rcn party lands on Vella Lavella at
Barakoma, night. 21-22; in preparation for full-scale invasion.
U.S. control of Vella Lavella would isolate Japanese at Vila,
Kolombangara. On New Georgia, 148th Inf of 37th Div relieves
145th Inf E of Munda.

SICILY-15th Army Group: In U.S. Seventh Army's Prov Corps area,
TF X seizes Castelvetrano and airport, and 2d Armd Div assembles
NE of Castelvetrano prepared to exploit breakthrough, which
appears imminent. 82d A/B Div takes S. Margherita and 3d Div
seizes Corleone. In II Corps area, 45th Div continues NW, taking
Valledolmo. 1st Div clears delaying opposition in Alimena.

In Br Eighth Army area, Gen Montgomery decides to make main
effort on left, where assault forces will push around N side of
M. Etna to take enemy from rear, major assault to begin on 1
August. 13 Corps and 51st Div of 30 Corps are to go on the
defensive. In 30 Corps area, Leonforte falls to Cdn 1st Div,
night 21-22. 51st Div falls back under enemy pressure to
positions S of Gerbini airfield.

22 July

ALEUTIAN IS.-In effort to soften Japanese defenses on Kiska,
U.S. warships and aircraft attack the island in force.

NEW GEORGIA-Gen Griswold orders general attack on Munda by 37th
and 43d Divs on 25th. 37th Div commander takes charge of his
forces on the island. RCT 161, 25th Div, arrives and is attached
to 37th Div.

SICILY-15th Army Group: U.S. Seventh Army takes Palermo, on N
coast, virtually completing second phase of operations. Limited
mopping up must be carried out in W part of island before final
phase-drive to E-can start. Prov Corps takes Palermo without a
fight: While TF X thrusts W along coast protecting left and
rear, 2d Armd Div is committed to action and drives rapidly NE
to outskirts of Palermo. At the same time, 3d Div continues NW
to positions SE of the city. Since there is no show of
resistance, planned attack on Palermo is withheld and 2d Armd
Div enters without opposition. City surrenders at 2000. In II
Corps area, left flank elements of 45th Div make contact with 3d
Div in outskirts of Palermo while others push on toward N coast.
1st Div continues N toward coast on right flank of corps, taking
Bompietro.

USSR-Bolkhov, NW of Mitsensk, falls to Red Army. Soviet troops
begin local offensive on northern front S of Lake Ladoga.

23 July

TROBRIAND IS.-67th Fighter Sq arrives on Woodlark to begin
operations from airfield there.

SICILY-15th Army Group: Gen Alexander orders U.S. Seventh Army
to exert maximum pressure eastward along Highways 113 and 120 as
soon as possible, leaving elements behind to complete mop-up of
W part of island. As a result of this order, preparations are
made to reinforce II Corps with 3d and 9th Divs and arty units.

U.S. Seventh Army mops up in W Sicily, taking many prisoners.
Engineers begin to repair badly damaged port of Palermo. In Prov
Corps area, while 3d Div polices Palermo, 82d A/B Div, to which
control of TF X components passes, clears Marsala-Trapani area
of W coast. In II Corps area, 157th Inf of 45th Div cuts Highway
u p, N coastal road, 6 miles E of Termini Imerese; while
elements push W from there to Termini Imerese, rest of regt
drives E along highway to positions beyond Campofelice. 179th
Inf, 45th Div, takes Collesano and advances toward Castelbuono.
1st Div overcomes resistance at Petralia, cutting Highway 120,
and patrols eastward.

In Br Eighth Army area, 30 Corps is meeting strong resistance as
it attempts to drive E from Leonforte.

24 July

NEW GEORGIA-XIV Corps prepares for assault on Munda on 25th.
161st Inf, attached to 37th Div, runs into tenacious opposition
as it tries in vain to reach line of departure.

SICILY-15th Army Group: In U.S. Seventh Army area, Prov Corps
continues to mop up W part of island, taking record number of
prisoners. II Corps pursues enemy eastward, 45th Div in coastal
sector and 1st Div on S flank. 45th Div takes Cefalu and
Castelbuono. 1st Div overruns Gangi and attacks toward Nicosa.

USSR-Red Army has recovered positions in Belgorod area, which
was held by the Russians at start of German offensive on 5 July.

NORWAY-U.S. Eighth Air Force make its first attack on Norway.
167 B-17's drop 414 tons of bombs on industrial targets at
Heroya while 41 release 79 tons on naval installations at
Trondheim: Only 1 plane fails to return. This is the longest
flight yet undertaken by U.S. planes based in England.

25 July

SOLOMON IS.-Gen Twining replaces Rear Adm Marc A. Mitscher as
COMAIRSOLS. Air strength of this command has increased from 235
to 539 planes since 2 April. Since invasion of Rendova on 30
June, Fighter Command alone has destroyed 316 planes for loss of
71. Enemy discontinues daylight air attacks on Rendova.

NEW GEORGIA-XIV Corps opens final offensive for Munda airfield.
Although supported by naval gunfire and powerful air
bombardment, assault troops can make only slow progress against
strongly entrenched enemy. 43d Div, with 103d Inf on left and
172d on right, attacks on left (S) and gets elements to coast
near Terere but withdraws the salient since it is exposed. 37th
Div, with 145th, 161st, and 148th Regts in line from left to
right, cannot begin general advance until opposition on ridge
(called Bartley Ridge in honor of 2d Lt Martin E. Bartley) in
front of 161st Inf is cleared and then starts to envelop enemy
there. 148th advances without serious opposition but is out of
contact with 161st.

ITALY-King Victor Emmanuel proclaims fall of Mussolini, whose
offices are taken over by Marshal Pietro Badoglio; takes command
of Italian Army.

SICILY-15th Army Group: In U.S. Seventh Army's II Corps area,
45th Div makes limited progress along N coastal road (Highway
113). 1st Div, on Highway 120, repels counterattack E of Gangi.

In Br Eighth Army's 30 Corps area, hard fighting is in progress
in Agira sector.

26 July

U.S.-CCS request Gen Eisenhower to plan at once for AVALANCHE,
invasion of Italy at Salerno, in order to gain Naples and nearby
airfields.

ALEUTIAN IS.-Eleventh Air Force makes heaviest attack to date on
Kiska, dropping 104 tons of bombs.

SOLOMON IS.-Adm Halsey proposes to Gen MacArthur that plans for
invasion of S Bougainville mainland be dropped and that the
Shortlands and Ballale, in Bougainville Strait, be secured as
planned in order to provide airfields and anchorages to support
future operations. Gen MacArthur later approves. NEW GEORGIA-43d
and 37th Divs are assisted by tanks and flame throwers as they
continue attack on Munda after preparatory fire. 103d Inf 43d
Div, takes Ilangana and reaches coast at Kia, but 161st Inf, in
37th Div zone, makes little headway against Bartley Ridge.

SICILY-15th Army Group: In U.S. Seventh Army area, Prov Corps
releases RCT 39, 9th Div, 3d Chemical Weapons Bn, and 4th Tabor
of goums to II Corps to strengthen it for eastward drive. II
Corps makes limited progress astride Highways 113 and 120. On
Highway 113, 45th Div reaches road junction N of S. Mauro.

27 July

NEW GEORGIA-37th Div temporarily suspends attack on Bartley
Ridge in center and begins assault on feature to left called
Horseshoe Hill, reducing several pillboxes. 148th Inf gains
tenuous contact with 161st, but gap remains between the 2 regts.

CBI-Chinese-American Composite Wing (CACW) is activated in
Fourteenth Air Force at Karachi, India. The wing consists of Ch
aircraft and pilots trained under lend-lease.

MEDITERRANEAN-AFHQ directs CG; Fifth Army, to prepare plans for
capture of Naples and nearby airfields from which future
operations in Italy could be supported. D Day, which is to
depend upon phase of the moon and availability of landing craft,
is tentatively set as 7 September. Br planners are already
working on plans for Operation BUTTRESS, invasion of toe of
Italy by 10 Corps.

SICILY-15th Army Group: In the coastal sector of the U.S.
Seventh Army's II Corps area, 45th Div's RCT 180 reaches Tusa, a
few miles W of S. Stefano, and elements cross Tusa R but are
driven back; RCT 179 reaches S. Mauro. 1st Div clears several
strongpoints while pushing toward Nicosia along Highway 120; its
left flank is protected by 4th Tabor of goums and its right by
91st Rcn Sq, which also maintains contact with British.

28 July

ALEUTIAN IS.-Japanese garrison of Kiska is withdrawn by sea
without detection by Allied forces, who are continuing
preparations to invade the island.

SOLOMON IS.-U.S. rcn party returns from Vella Lavella and
recommends that an advance detachment be moved to Barakoma in
preparation for main landings.

NEW GEORGIA-Gen Griswold calls for replacements. 43d Div is
creeping forward in small-scale actions. 145th Inf, 37th Div,
continues to clear Horseshoe Hill. 3d Bn, 161st, occupies some
abandoned enemy positions on Bartley Ridge.

SICILY-15th Army Group: Gen Alexander moves his hq to Sicily.

In U.S. Seventh Army area, coastal cargo vessels begin arriving
at Palermo. In II Corps area, 45th Div, recrossing Tusa R,
pushes a little closer to S. Stefano in coastal sector. 1st Div
takes Nicosia.

In Br Eighth Army's 30 Corps area, Agira falls to left flank
elements of corps.

29 July

NEW GEORGIA-XIV Corps continues to advance slowly toward Munda
airfield, methodically destroying enemy pillboxes with
assistance of tanks and flame throwers. Maj Gen John R. Hodge
takes command of 43d Div, relieving Gen Hester, and commits 1st
and 3d Bns, 169th Inf, between 172d and 103d Regts. In 37th Div
zone, 145th Inf reaches crest of Horseshoe Hill but pulls back a
little to more tenable positions; 161st Inf forces on Bartley
Ridge continue to advance cautiously; 148th pulls back to
establish contact with 161st and protect supply route, but does
not quite succeed in closing the gap and is precariously
situated.

SICILY-15th Army Group: In U.S. Seventh Army area, trains begin
using RR line between Palermo and Cefalu. Prov Corps nearly
completes its mopup task in W Sicily. 3 small islands off
Trapani (Favignana, Marettimo, and Levango) surrender to 82d A/B
Div. In II Corps area, 45th Div meets increasing rear-guard
resistance as it approaches S. Stefano, on N coast road, and
moves elements SE in effort to outflank enemy; other elements
advance to Mistretta, which enemy retains. From Nicosia, 1st Div
probes to outskirts of Mistretta and eastward along Highway 120
toward Cerami without incident; goumiers clear pocket about 3
miles W of Capizzi. RCT 39 is attached to 1st Div.

In Br Eighth Army's 30 Corps area, recently arrived 78th Div,
now in position to attack and reinf by Cdn 3d Brig, opens
assault along axis Catenanuova-Adrano, night 29-30. In 13 Corps
area, 5th Div is reinf by 2 bns of infantry and regt of tanks.

30 July

NEW GEORGIA-Alteration of boundaries gives 43d Div a wider front
and places S half of Bartley Ridge within zone of 145th Inf,
37th Div. 145th Inf repels counterattack on Horseshoe Hill and
shells enemy positions. 161st is reinf by 2d Bn of 145th and
continues to clear Bartley Ridge. Elements of 148th gain
physical contact with 161st, but main body OF 148th is isolated.

SICILY-15th Army Group: In U.S. Seventh Army area, enemy
continues withdrawal eastward across army front. In II Corps
area, 45th Div is strongly opposed by enemy rear guards in S.
Stefano area during day, but enemy withdraws from the town and
from Reitano, to S, night 31-31. On Highway 120, 1st Div
advances toward Troina, its patrols reaching Cerami. In Br
Eighth Army's 30 Corps area, 78th Div takes Catenanuova in
morning; renews attack, night 30-31, securing heights to N and
NE from which to attack Centuripe. 231st Brig, leading eastward
drive on Regalbuto, is meeting severe resistance near this
objective.

USSR-Enemy attempts to recover ground lost on Mius front but is
unable to retain the initiative.

31 July

NEW GEORGIA-2d Bns of 161st and 145th Regts finish clearing
Bartley Ridge. Enemy continues to resist on Horseshoe Hill.
148th Inf tries to return to main body.

SICILY-15th Army Group: In U.S. Seventh Army area, Gen Patton
issues directive for major attack eastward toward Messina,
beginning 1 August. II Corps, which is to contain 1st, 3d, and
9th Divs, and supporting units, will make main effort along
Highways 113 and 120 from line S. Stefano-Mistretta-Nicosia.
Prov Corps is to organize W part of Sicily and protect rear of
II Corps; be prepared to furnish reinforcements to II Corps.
Aircraft and naval TF 88 are to support offensive. In Corps
area, 45th Div is being relieved in S. Stefano sector by 3d Div.
On S flank, 1st Div advances to within 5 miles of Troina,
capturing Cerami; 4th Tabor of goums, on div left flank, takes
Capizzi.

In Br Eighth Army's 30 Corps area, 231st Brig is still fiercely
opposed just W of Regalbuto. 78th Div attacks strong enemy
position at Centuripe.

Transcribed and edited by:
Larry W. Jewell
jewell@mace.cc.purdue.edu

------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 5 Jul 1993 17:43:27 EST
From:    Larry Jewell <jewell@MACE.CC.PURDUE.EDU>
Subject: REF: "goums"?

>From: UNITED STATES ARMY IN WORLD WAR II, Special Studies:
>CHRONOLOGY, 1941-1945, compiled by Mary H. Williams, Office of
>the Chief of Military History, Department of the Army,
>Washington, D.C., 1960

>14 July

>SICILY-...

>15th Army Group: In U.S. Seventh Army area, 82d A/B Div, in army
>reserve, is being assembled and reinf in Gela area for
>operations on W flank of U.S. sector. 4th Tabor of goums of Fr N
>African Army lands at Licata and is attached to 3d Div. ...

Anyone have more information on the "goums"?  What kind of unit,
how armed, history?

Larry (just wondering) J

------------------------------

End of WWII-L Digest - 3 Jul 1993 to 5 Jul 1993
***********************************************

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Status: O

There are 6 messages totalling 528 lines in this issue.

Topics of the day:

  1. PARA WINGS
  2. REF: goums? (3)
  3. USAAF 3-6 JUL 43
  4. Lost solders

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 6 Jul 1993 06:07:47 EDT
From:    Lowe Barrett MAJ <hb9388@USMA6.USMA.EDU>
Subject: Re: PARA WINGS

Reply to Max about the USAF wings:

The US Air Force wears the same jump wings as the Army does.

What you are seeing may be some type of "unofficial" USAF wings for their
skydiving team at the Air Force Academy (???).

I have never heard nor seen anything like you describe here.

There are some old type USAF jump wings that differ from the Army (50's era),
you can look them up in World Parachute Badges and Insignia.

Hope this helps some.

Bear

(I am an Army master parachutist).

Max wrote earlier this week:

>>From <@MAINE.maine.edu:owner-milhst-l@UKANVM.CC.UKANS.EDU> Fri Jul  2 17:31:1
8 1
>993
>Received: from MAINE.CAPS.MAINE.EDU by MAINE.maine.edu (IBM VM SMTP V2R2)
>   with BSMTP id 6818; Fri, 02 Jul 93 17:32:21 EDT
>Received: from MAINE.EDU (NJE origin LISTSERV@MAINE) by MAINE.CAPS.MAINE.EDU
> (LMail V1.1d/1.7f) with BSMTP id 5608; Fri, 2 Jul 1993 17:32:21 -0400
>Date:         Fri, 2 Jul 1993 16:41:43 -0400
>Reply-To: Military History <MILHST-L%UKANVM.bitnet@MAINE.maine.edu>
>Sender: Military History <MILHST-L%UKANVM.bitnet@MAINE.maine.edu>
>From: MAX HARE <maxc@URSUS1.URSUS.MAINE.EDU>
>Subject:      PARA WINGS
>To: Multiple recipients of list MILHST-L <MILHST-L%UKANVM.bitnet@MAINE.maine.e
du
>>
>
>Folks,
>
>I recently learned that the U.S. Air Force Academy offered both
>parachuting and glider flying (I was really shocked to see a Sweizer
>2-33 training glider in USAF markings!) to its students.  My question is
>...do the cadets earn any special rating badge for either activity?
>
>Also, a prominent insignia dealer is offering "USAF Parachute Wings".
>These are identical to the regualr USAF pilots wings except the shield
>in the center has been replaced by an open parachute (much like the
>Navy/Marine jump wings) and the entire affair is colored silver.  All
>jump-rated USAF personnel that I have seen have earned their jump wings
>through the US Army jump school and wear the classic chute with
>turned-up wings "airborne" badge.  Is this badge spurious?  Would it be
>related to the USAF Academy programs?  What / where / how is the USAF
>running its own parachute school?
>
>Sorry for all the ??? but this has me stumped.
>
>Max C. Calderwood
>University of Southern Maine
>Gorham, ME
>MAXC@URSUS1.URSUS.MAINE.EDU
>

Barrett F. Lowe                    RANGERS LEAD THE WAY!
MAJ, IN
Dept of Physics, US Military Academy, West Point, NY 10996

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 6 Jul 1993 06:13:03 EDT
From:    Lowe Barrett MAJ <hb9388@USMA6.USMA.EDU>
Subject: Re: REF: goums?

To Larry J:  Reference French Army Goumiers:

The Goumiers were mountain troops recruited from the hill tribesmen in
Morocco, ALgeria, Western Sahara.  They were extremely hardy and tough
soldiers.  They inflicted fear on the Germans similar to the Gurkhas on the
Japanese by running night patrols that only used their long knives and/or
bayonets as weapons.

They were lightly armed.  Most of their heavy weapons were carried by mule.
In the fighting in Italy in the mountains, they were very valuable, less so
in more mobile combat.

Hope this helps.

Bear


>>From: UNITED STATES ARMY IN WORLD WAR II, Special Studies:
>>CHRONOLOGY, 1941-1945, compiled by Mary H. Williams, Office of
>>the Chief of Military History, Department of the Army,
>>Washington, D.C., 1960
>
>>14 July
>
>>SICILY-...
>
>>15th Army Group: In U.S. Seventh Army area, 82d A/B Div, in army
>>reserve, is being assembled and reinf in Gela area for
>>operations on W flank of U.S. sector. 4th Tabor of goums of Fr N
>>African Army lands at Licata and is attached to 3d Div. ...
>
>Anyone have more information on the "goums"?  What kind of unit,
>how armed, history?
>
>Larry (just wondering) J
>

Barrett F. Lowe                    RANGERS LEAD THE WAY!
MAJ, IN
Dept of Physics, US Military Academy, West Point, NY 10996

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 6 Jul 1993 07:27:40 -0400
From:    jem3@CC.BELLCORE.COM
Subject: USAAF 3-6 JUL 43

COMBAT CHRONOLOGY OF THE US ARMY AIR FORCES
SATURDAY, 3 JULY 1943
FTP SITES
  1. ftp.rutgers.edu in directory pub/wwii/usaf
  2. byrd.mu.wvnet.edu (129.71.32.152) in pub/history/military/airforce/
     wwii_chronology

AIRCRAFT MENTIONED IN THIS REPORT:
  A-20, Douglas Havoc
  B-17, Boeing Flying Fortress
  B-24, Consolidated Liberator
  B-25, North American Mitchell
  B-26, Martin Marauder
  P-40, Curtiss
  Spitfire, Vickers Supermarine
  Wellington, Vickers (RAF)

AMERICAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  ALASKA (Eleventh Air Force)
    6 B-24's bomb Main Camp on Kiska Island and take photos of Segula
Island.

CHINA-BURMA-INDIA THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  BURMA-INDIA (Tenth Air Force)
    B-25's hit the oft-bombed bridge at Myitnge, Burma, knocking the S
end span into the river.

EUROPEAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Eighth Air Force)
  Lieutenant General Jacob L Devers, Commanding General European Theater
of Operations, US Army (ETOUSA), in a report to General Henry H "Hap"
Arnold, praises the proficiency of the VIII Bomber Command bombardiers
but stresses a dire need for high-altitude gunnery training.

MEDITERRANEAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  EASTERN MEDITERRANEAN (Ninth Air Force)
    B-25's hit airfield at Comiso, Sicily. P-40's fly escort over Sicily
and over Pantelleria Island in the Mediterranean, claiming destruction
of 1 fighter.
    The 564th, 565th, 566th and 567th Bombardment Squadrons (Heavy),
389th Bombardment Group (Heavy) based at Hethel, England begin operating
with B-24's from Bengasi, Libya.

  WESTERN MEDITERRANEAN (Northwest African Air Force)
    During the night of 2/3 Jul, Northwest African Strategic Air Force
(NASAF) Wellingtons attack Olbia, Sardinia and Trapani, Sicily. The
following day, B-17's and B-25's hit Chilivani, Italy, and the airfields
at Monserrato and Alghero, Sardinia. In Sardinia, fighters hit radar
stations at Pula and Alghero, while B-26's bomb the airfields at Milis
and Capoterra. In Sicily, Northwest African Tactical Air Force (NATAF)
A-20's hit the area around Marsala and airfields at Sciaccay and
Trapani.
    The ground echelon of the 111th Reconnaissance Squadron (Fighter),
68th Reconnaissance Group transfers from Nouvion, Algeria to Tunis,
Tunisia. The air echelon is at Korba, Tunisia.
    The 309th Fighter Squadron, 31st Fighter Group transfers with
Spitfires transfers from Korba, Tunisia to Gozo Island, Malta.

SOUTH PACIFIC THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Thirteenth Air Force)
  In the Solomon Islands, B-25's bomb the airfield and AA positions at
Munda on New Georgia Island.

SOUTHWEST PACIFIC THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Fifth Air Force)
  B-24's bomb airfields in the Rabaul, New Britain Island area and hit
Kendari Airfield on Celebes Island. Koepang on Timor Island is attacked
by 2 B-25's. A lone B-17 bombs landing strip at Cape Gloucester on New
Britain Island.

SUNDAY, 4 JULY 1943 (INDEPENDENCE DAY)

AIRCRAFT MENTIONED IN THIS REPORT:
  A-20, Douglas Havoc
  B-17, Boeing Flying Fortress
  B-24, Consolidated Liberator
  B-25, North American Mitchell
  B-26, Martin Marauder
  Bf 109, Messerschmitt
  Halifax, Handley Page (RAF)
  P-38, Lockheed Lightning
  P-40, Curtiss
  Wellington, Vickers (RAF)

CHINA-BURMA-INDIA THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  BURMA-INDIA (Tenth Air Force)
    B-24's attack the Shweli, Burma road bridge but fail to cause
appreciable damage.

EUROPEAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Eighth Air Force)
  VIII Bomber Command Mission Number 71: 192 B-17's are dispatched
against aircraft factories at Le Mans and Nanes, France; 166 make a very
effective attack; we claim 52-14-22 Luftwaffe aircraft; we lose 7 with 1
damaged beyond repair and 53 others damaged; casualties are 1 KIA, 9 WIA
and 70 MIA. 83 other B-17's are dispatched against submarine yards at La
Pallice, France; 71 hit the target between 1201 and 1204 local; we claim
0-1-0 Luftwaffe aircraft; we lose 1 and 1 is damaged; casualties are 10
MIA. Bombing is extremely accurate.

MEDITERRANEAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  EASTERN MEDITERRANEAN (Ninth Air Force)
    Royal Air Force (RAF) Halifax aircraft bomb the Catania, Sicily.
railroad yards during the night of 3/4 Jul. B-25's hit the airfield at
Comiso, Sicily. P-40's escort bombers and convoy and fly sea-search for
a missing pilot. Fighters claim 3 Bf 109's shot down. 4 P-40's are lost.
    The 86th and 87th Fighter Squadrons, 79th Fighter Group transfer
with P-40's from Tunisia to Malta.

  WESTERN MEDITERRANEAN (Northwest African Air Force)
    During the night of 3/4 Jul, Wellingtons hit Trapani, Sicily and Lido
di Roma, Italy. Leaflets are dropped in the Rome, Italy area. In Sicily,
B-17's and B-26's hit the airfields at Catania and Gerbini; B-25's bomb 2
satellite airfields near Gerbini; and Northwest African Tactical Air Force
(NATAF) A-20 and medium bombers hit airfields at Comiso, Trapani, Sciacca,
and Castelvetrano.
    The 37th Fighter Squadron, 14th Fighter Group transfers with P-38's
from Telergma, Algeria to El Bathan, Tunisia.

SOUTH PACIFIC THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Thirteenth Air Force)
  B-17's pound Bairoko, New Georgia Island.

MONDAY, 5 JULY 1943

AIRCRAFT MENTIONED IN THIS REPORT:
  B-17, Boeing Flying Fortress
  B-24, Consolidated Liberator
  B-25, North American Mitchell
  P-40, Curtiss
  Wellington, Vickers (RAF)

MEDITERRANEAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  EASTERN MEDITERRANEAN (Ninth Air Force)
    In Sicily, B-24's attack the harbor, harbor installations, railway
yards, and oil storage at Messina while B-25's hit the airfields at
Sciacca and Biscari. P-40's fly uneventful sea patrol. Royal Air Force
(RAF) heavy bombers strike railroad yards at Catania, Sicily.

  WESTERN MEDITERRANEAN (Northwest African Air Force)
    Northwest African Strategic Air Force (NASAF) Wellingtons bomb the
airfields at Villacidro, Sardinia and Catania, Sicily during the night
of 4/5 Jul. In Sicily, NASAF fighters, medium and heavy bombers hit main
and satellite airfields at Gerbini and radar stations at Marsala and
Licata; Northwest African Tactical Air Force (NATAF) light and medium
bombers hit Sciacca and airfields at Trapani, Comiso and Biscari.
Northwest African Coastal Air Force (NACAF) airplanes maintain sea
patrol, reconnaissance, and convoy escort.

SOUTH PACIFIC THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Thirteenth Air Force)
  In the Solomon Islands, 9 B-24's over Buin, Bougainville Island fail to
find shipping and bomb Munda, New Georgia Island, and Ballale Island
instead.

SOUTHWEST PACIFIC THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Fifth Air Force)
  In New Guinea, B-25's bomb and strafe the airfield at Salamaua, Komiatum
Track, and HQ areas at Kela and Salamaua.

TUESDAY, 6 JULY 1943

AIRCRAFT MENTIONED IN THIS REPORT:
  B-17, Boeing Flying Fortress
  B-24, Consolidated Liberator
  B-25, North American Mitchell
  P-40, Curtiss
  PV, Lockheed Ventura (USN)
  Wellington, Vickers (RAF)

AMERICAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  ALASKA (Eleventh Air Force)
    In the Aleutian Islands, 2 B-24's and 2 P-40's on 3 weather
reconnaissance missions report Kiska Island overcast, and take photos of
Segula Island. 6 B-24's bomb Main Camp on Kiska. 8 B-25's abort a radar
run over Kiska Island when 1 has engine trouble and the others fail to
locate a PV Pathfinder. They sight a submarine which crash-dives
immediately.

CHINA-BURMA-INDIA THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  CHINA (Fourteenth Air Force)
    In China, 5 B-25's and 8 P-40's hit runway and revetment area at
Pailochi Airfield.

EUROPEAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Eighth Air Force)
  HQ 385th Bombardment Group (Heavy) and it's 549th, 550th, and 551st
Bombardment Squadrons (Heavy) with B-17's arrive at Great Ashfield,
England from the US joining the 548th Bombardment Squadron (Heavy) which
arrived on 29 Jun 43. The group will fly it's first combat mission on 17
Jul 43.

MEDITERRANEAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  EASTERN MEDITERRANEAN (Ninth Air Force)
    In Sicily, B-24's strike satellite airfields at Gerbini; B-25's hit
the airfields at Biscari and Gerbini while P-40's escort bombers, patrol,
and carry out dive-bombing operations.
    The 85th Fighter Squadron, 79th Fighter Group transfers with P-40's
from Tunisia to Malta.

  WESTERN MEDITERRANEAN (Northwest African Air Force)
    In Sicily, Northwest African Strategic Air Force (NASAF) Wellingtons
hit Gerbini Airfield and 2 satellites during the night of 5/6 Jul; during
predawn hours and throughout the day, light and medium bombers of Northwest
African Tactical Air Force (NATAF) bomb airfields at Biscari, Sciacca,
Trapani, and Comiso; NASAF B-17's again hit Gerbini Airfield and 3
satellite fields; B-25's bomb Biscari Airfield. Northwest African Coastal
Air Force (NACAF) maintains sea patrol and convoy protection.

SOUTH PACIFIC THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Thirteenth Air Force)
  In the Solomon Islands, B-17's and B-24's pound airfields at Kahili,
on Bougainville Island, on Ballale Island and on Buka Island. B-25's hit
a beached destroyer at Bamberi, New Georgia Island.

SOUTHWEST PACIFIC THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Fifth Air Force)
  B-25's attack the airfield at Penfoei on Timor Island and hit Labu
Lagoon area in New Guinea.

SOURCES:
AIR FORCE COMBAT UNITS OF WORLD WAR II, Office of Air Force History,
  Headquarters USAF, 1961, ISBN 0-912799-02-1
COMBAT SQUADRONS OF THE AIR FORCE, WORLD WAR II, Office of Air Force
  History, Headquarters USAF 1982
THE ARMY AIR FORCES IN WORLD WAR II: COMBAT CHRONOLOGY, 1941-1945 by the
  Office of Air Force History, Headquarters USAF, 1973
THE MIGHTY EIGHTH WAR DIARY by Roger A. Freeman, ISBN 1-85409-071-2

Jack McKillop
USAF (Airways and Air Communications Service)
1955-59

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 6 Jul 1993 07:23:25 EST
From:    Larry Jewell <jewell@MACE.CC.PURDUE.EDU>
Subject: Re: REF: goums?

>
> To Larry J:  Reference French Army Goumiers:
>
> The Goumiers were mountain troops recruited from the hill tribesmen in
> Morocco, ALgeria, Western Sahara.  They were extremely hardy and tough
> soldiers.  They inflicted fear on the Germans similar to the Gurkhas on the
> Japanese by running night patrols that only used their long knives and/or
> bayonets as weapons.

  Ah, more psyc-war types :-).
>
> They were lightly armed.  Most of their heavy weapons were carried by mule.
> In the fighting in Italy in the mountains, they were very valuable, less so
> in more mobile combat.

  I'll track Guenther down and see if he ever worked with them.  Sounds like
my kind of unit :-).

> Hope this helps.

  Thanks, I go slowly nuts when I hit a puzzle like that one.  On this thread,
is anyone having trouble with the abbreviations in the Army Chronology?  I
can post the list of abbreviations if so, or email it directly if requested.
I've caught myself scratching my head over a few of them ;-).

>
> Bear
>

Larry J

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 1 Jul 1993 03:43:54 EST
From:    Mark Spadafore <Mark_Spadafore@LPL.ORG>
Subject: Lost solders

I'm looking for some people who were in the 793 MP division in WW II.
Specifically, looking for a man who used to live on the Seneca Indian
Reservation named Paul Jones.  I also have more people to try to find.
Another person's name in Tommy Doyle who used to live in Rochester on Webster
Ave.  How could I know if these people are even alive?  Any listings I might
be able to contact?  I do have some old addresses (that are about fifty years
old).
--
 Views expressed in this posting are those of the individual author only.
==========================================================================
Liverpool Public Library     |                      voice - 315.457.0310
310 Tulip Street             |                        fax - 315.453.7867
Liverpool, NY 13088-4997     |    (return email address found in header)

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 6 Jul 1993 13:08:43 -0400
From:    "Mr. Scott Hannon" <hannon@UMBC.EDU>
Subject: Re: REF: goums?

>>From: UNITED STATES ARMY IN WORLD WAR II, Special Studies:
>>CHRONOLOGY, 1941-1945, compiled by Mary H. Williams

>>15th Army Group: In U.S. Seventh Army area, 82d A/B Div, in army
>>reserve, is being assembled and reinf in Gela area for
>>operations on W flank of U.S. sector. 4th Tabor of goums of Fr N
>>African Army lands at Licata and is attached to 3d Div. ...
>
>Anyone have more information on the "goums"?  What kind of unit,
>how armed, history?
>
>Larry (just wondering) J

Some info on these can be found in the _Rearming the French_ volume of
the US Army in WW2 "green series" book. From memory...

The (free) French had four Moroccan Tabor Groups (GTM's), 1 thru 4. Each
group was approximately a small regiment in size (I think the book said
13000 men in a total for all four groups...but I think that includes the
pack mule companies attached to each group and other support troops).
There was no direct US equivalent to these Tabors (unlike most free French
troops who reorganized using basically US TOEs). The closest US equivalent
was a Ranger regiment.

The troops were mountain men (Berbers?) from the Altas mountains in north
Africa. They were tough and very mobile across rough terrain (as in Italy).
In practice, the French somtimes treated them as "foot cavalry" and tasked
them with cavalry-ish missions in rough terrain.

I forget the TOE...I think basically three battalions of four companies
each, plus a mule company for the group. I'm very unsure of this.

These units were very useful in Italy...especially the mule companies that
operated with them. While rather lightly armed, their mobility and toughness
more than made up for it. On the down side, these troops (as well as many
other French units, such as 4 DMM) were feared by Allied command to be a bit
hard on the Italian civilians, and so care was used in their deployment.

The groups were successful, and so remained much the same until the end of
the war (hmmm...I think parts of 3 GTM may have been absorbed by 10 DI and
27 Alpine div). The 4 GTM stayed in Italy, while the other three fought in
Alsace and then southern Germany.

As I said, this is all from memory...the details may be wrong.

Unfortunately, there is no good source on the French military in WW2 (in
english) that I am aware of (good thing I have a friend in France!). The
_Rearming the French_ book offers little in the way of OoB and TOE info
(the OoB/map at the end has lots of omissions and very little detail).
Rather surprising when you consider that by the end of 1944 the French
army was a bit larger than the British!

One OK book (about minor Allid units in general, not just France) is a
now out of print 2 volume set by J. Lee Ready called _Forgotten Allies_
(from mid-1980s?). It is OK, but has holes and the occasional unit name
typo/error. In the mid-1950s Lattre's book on the operations of French 1st
Army was published in english, but it is very hard to find (I've yet to see
it!). It apparently is fairly well detailed (based on Arnaud's comments on
a French copy he saw), but the OoB is scattered, incomplete and rather hard
to make sense of (many units are introduced without saying they are part of
this div/regiment/whatever or they are independent...quite annoying!).
De Gaulle's multi-volume Memoirs offers little in the way of operational
details. Hmmm...a book called _The Cross of Lorraine_ was supposed to be
about the French army in WW2, but I found it nearly worthless for Alsace.
I think that's about it for english sources.

Sources do exist in France, so the truely interrested will need to visit
the French archives if they desire detailed info.

In a later message, Larry writes:
>On this thread,
>is anyone having trouble with the abbreviations in the Army Chronology?  I
>can post the list of abbreviations if so, or email it directly if requested.
>I've caught myself scratching my head over a few of them ;-).

A word of caution on using this fine book...some of the info is suspect or
wrong. I'm doing research on the operations of 6th Army Group in Jan-Feb
of 1945, and have found lots of typos/errors. Sometimes when the abbrev's
are explained, they are done wrongly

examples:
The 12e Division Blindee (French 12th Armored Division): there was no such
thing...they probably saw a reference to a 12e DB in a French source and
didn't realize it was a US unit (12th Armored Div of XXI Corps). BTW, this
error leaked into _the Times Altas of WW2_ put out in 1989. I think it also
leaked into Shelby Stanton's US Army in WW2 Order of Battle book, which also
seems to have made heavy use of the Chronology. (France had three armored
divs: 1ere, 2e, and 5e DB. Note: a French armored "regiment" was battalion
size...holds for tanks, TDs, and armored cavalry. Hmmm, armored infantry
[mech] too I think).

The 1ere DMI (ex 1ere DFL) is interpreted as the 1st Moroccan Infantry
Division....wrong. It was 1ere Division "Marche" de Infantrie, and was not
Moroccan (nor strictly infantry...sort of semi-motorized infantry
I think). This division included the French Foreign legion's 13e DBLE (two
battalions in 13th Demi-Brigade Legion Estrange). Most of the other
battalions in the division were north African? (France had one Moroccan
Infantry Division, 2e DIM, and one Moroccan Mountain inf Div, 4e DMM).

Another problem I've found with the Chronology is that it sometimes lacks
perspective, as it seems to be based on daily/weekly reports sent by the
units to HQ. The amount of info supplied is not necessarily directly related
to the amount/importance of activity taking place. And non-US Army units
get very little coverage.

Still, its basically a very good book.

Scott.

------------------------------

End of WWII-L Digest - 5 Jul 1993 to 6 Jul 1993
***********************************************

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There are 7 messages totalling 333 lines in this issue.

Topics of the day:

  1. PARA WINGS
  2. USAAF 7 JUL 43
  3. MISC: British Army size was Re: Goums?
  4. Help on Tsushima ??
  5. INF: Basic Gun Data
  6. MISC: British Army size
  7. "Stealth" 'chutes (was PARA WINGS)

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 7 Jul 1993 07:18:48 -0400
From:    MAX HARE <maxc@URSUS1.URSUS.MAINE.EDU>
Subject: Re: PARA WINGS

Bear,

Thanks for the reply.  I do suspect that these were some sort of
unauthorized design..possibly related to the AF Academy.

Also, I have another question related to jumping.  On HALO jumps...which
are by nature "stealthy" how do Army jumpers deal with that gawdawful
noise caused by the slider panel rustling in the breeze. Parachutes make
a prounounced "pop" on opening but the noise caused by the slider must
put the jumper at risk from aware enemy sentries/patrols.  I am a
beginning civil jumper and have noticed that the noise from a couple of
ram airs can be quite loud. Have noticed that some experienced jumper
will somehow  stow their deployed sliders behind their helmets for a
nice quiet ride...but I dont think I could do this on the Strong/Manta
rigs I have been jumping.

Has the Army been able to develop a "stealth" slider...this might be
something worthwhile to develop.

Max C. Calderwood
University of Southern Maine
Gorham, ME
MAXC@URSUS1.URSUS.MAINE.EDU

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 7 Jul 1993 07:32:39 -0400
From:    jem3@CC.BELLCORE.COM
Subject: USAAF 7 JUL 43

COMBAT CHRONOLOGY OF THE US ARMY AIR FORCES
WEDNESDAY, 7 JULY 1943
FTP SITES
  1. ftp.rutgers.edu in directory pub/wwii/usaf
  2. byrd.mu.wvnet.edu (129.71.32.152) in pub/history/military/airforce/
     wwii_chronology

AIRCRAFT MENTIONED IN THIS REPORT:
  A-20, Douglas Havoc
  B-17, Boeing Flying Fortress
  B-24, Consolidated Liberator
  B-25, North American Mitchell
  B-26, Martin Marauder
  P-38, Lockheed Lightning
  P-40, Curtiss
  Wellington, Vickers (RAF)

AMERICAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  ZONE OF INTERIOR (HQ, USAAF)
    The Army Air Forces Training Command is established to take over the
functions formerly assigned to the Technical Training and Flying Training
Commands.

CHINA-BURMA-INDIA THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  CHINA (Fourteenth Air Force)
    7 B-25's and 22 P-40's attack shipping at Canton, China. At least 2
interceptors are shot down.

EUROPEAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Eighth Air Force)
  HQ 7th Photographic Reconnaissance and Mapping Group arrives at Mount
Farm, England from the US.
  HQ 352d Fighter Group and it's 328th, 486th and 487th Fighter Squadrons
with P-47D's arrive at Bodney, England from the US. The group will fly
it's first combat mission on 9 Sep 43.

MEDITERRANEAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  ANTISUBMARINE WARFARE (AAF Antisubmarine Command)
    The German sub, U-95l, is sunk in E Atlantic, 37-40N 15-30W, by
a B-24 of the 1st Antisubmarine Squadron (Heavy).

  EASTERN MEDITERRANEAN (Ninth Air Force)
    In Sicily, B-24's hit airfields at Gerbini and the rail line N of
Brucoli; and B-25's bomb the airfield and surrounding areas at Biscari and
Comiso. P-40's bomb and strafe Lucca Airfield, Italy.

  WESTERN MEDITERRANEAN (Northwest African Air Force)
    Northwest African Strategic Air Force (NASAF) Wellingtons bomb Palermo,
Sicily and airfields at Villacidro, Milis, and Pabillonis, Sardinia during
the night of 6/7 Jul. In Sicily during the day, B-17's, B-25's, and B-26's
bomb Gerbini satellite fields and Bo Rizzo Airfield, as P-40's fly
a diversionary sweep over the W part of Sicily; Northwest African Tactical
Air Force (NATAF) A-20's hit Sciacca during the night of 6/7 Jul, and the
following day bomb airfields at Trapani, Biscari, Comiso, Bo Rizzo, and
Mazara del Vallo, and hit Sciacca, and Marsala radar stations,
Caltanissetta and Porto Empedocle.

SOUTH PACIFIC THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Thirteenth Air Force)
  In the Solomon Islands, B-25's and P-38's attack Vila Airfield on
Kolombangara Island and B-24's bomb Kahili Airfield on Bougainville Island.

SOUTHWEST PACIFIC THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Fifth Air Force)
  In New Guinea, B-24's and B-25's, along with Royal Australian Air Force
(RAAF) airplanes, operate in direct support of Allied ground operations in
the Mubo area, dropping over 100 tons of bombs on numerous targets as
the MacKechnie Force begins an assault on Bitoi Ridge and Australian forces
(2/6 Battalion) capture Observation Hill, an important terrain feature W
of Mubo.

SOURCES:
AIR FORCE COMBAT UNITS OF WORLD WAR II, Office of Air Force History,
  Headquarters USAF, 1961, ISBN 0-912799-02-1
COMBAT SQUADRONS OF THE AIR FORCE, WORLD WAR II, Office of Air Force
  History, Headquarters USAF 1982
THE ARMY AIR FORCES IN WORLD WAR II: COMBAT CHRONOLOGY, 1941-1945 by the
  Office of Air Force History, Headquarters USAF, 1973
THE MIGHTY EIGHTH WAR DIARY by Roger A. Freeman, ISBN 1-85409-071-2

Jack McKillop
USAF (Airways and Air Communications Service)
1955-59


----------------------------------------------------------------------
|  Jack McKillop      |  Those who have long enjoyed such privileges |
|  Bellcore           |  as we enjoy forget in time that men have    |
|  Piscataway, NJ     |  died to win them.     FDR                   |
|  USA                |  jem3@cc.bellcore.com                        |
----------------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 7 Jul 1993 07:53:12 EDT
From:    Robert E George <regeorge@MAGNUS.ACS.OHIO-STATE.EDU>
Subject: MISC: British Army size was Re: Goums?

> Rather surprising when you consider that by the end of 1944 the French
> army was a bit larger than the British!


     Do you mean the French Army in some particular theatre was larger
than the British Army in that theatre?

     "Encyclopedia of the Second World War" by Elizabeth Anne Wheal, p.
173, says that "By 1944 . . . the French armies now numbered about
400,000 men."

     On p.72 the same source says "Total British Army strength had
reached almost two and a half million men by mid-1941, and it rose
steadily . . . "

     Robert George

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 7 Jul 1993 17:13:14 +0300
From:    Ozgur Altinyay <ALTINYAY@TRBILUN.BITNET>
Subject: Help on Tsushima ??

There was a  Japanese film on Port Arthur that I saw some time ago. It looked
rather new.  I am trying to order it from a Japanese video cassette retailer
but can not remember the name  . If anyone knows it , can he also tekk me the
name of the film.
Thanks in advance !
Ozgur St. Altinyay

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 7 Jul 1993 10:32:41 EST
From:    Larry Jewell <jewell@MACE.CC.PURDUE.EDU>
Subject: INF: Basic Gun Data

Here's a short table with the "pdr. to inches" conversion.

From: Encyclopedia of Tanks, Duncan Crow & Robert J. Icks,
Chartwell Books, 1975

Basic Gun Data

NOTE: Various discrepancies may be noted. This is because the
length in calibres is given as ascribed by the country concerned
and the bases used are not necessarily uniform.

M /V is in feet per second.

Country Gun        Calibre  Length  M/V     Year
                   (inches)

USA
        37mm        1.46    L/57    2900    1940
        75mm Pack   2.95    L/18    1270    1930
        75mm M1897  2.95    L/36    2000    1924
        75mm M2     2.95    L/31    1930    1941
        75mm M3     2.95    L/40    2030    1941
        75mm M6     2.95    L/39    2030    1942
        3"   M7     3.0     L/53    3400    1942
        76mm        3.0     L/53    2600    1942
        76mm T91E3  3.0     L/55    3400    1943
        90mm        3.543   L/53    3350    1943
        90mm        3.543   L/73    3750    1943
       105mm How    4.134   L/25    1550    1942
       105mm Gun    4.134   L/67    3700    1943
       120mm        4.7     L/62    3800    1943

Great Britain
        6pdr        2.244   L/45.6  1765    1915
        6pdr        2.244   L/25.4  1350    1916
        3pdr I      1.85    L/35.8  1750    1923
        3pdr II     1.85    L/45.7  1850    1925
        3"   How    3.0     L/28.5   600    1926
        2pdr        1.575   L/57    2800    1935
        6pdr III    2.244   L/49    2800    1941
        6pdr V      2.244   L/57    2965    1942
        3.7" Mortar 3.7     L/17     620    1939
        95mm How    3.7     L/23.7  1075    1942
        75mm V      2.953   L/41.6  2030    1942
        77mm        3.0     L/56    2600    1943
       17pdr        3.0     L/62.9  2900    1942

Germany
         3.7cm      1.46    L/45    2500    l938
         5.0cm      1.97    L/42    3240    1938
         5.0cm      1.97    L/60    3700    1939
         7.5cm      2.95    L/24    1263    1938
         7.5cm      2.95    L/43    2428    1940
         7.5cm      2.95    L/48    2461    1940
         7.5cm      2.95    L/70    3068    1942
         8.8cm      3.46    L/56    2600    1936
         8.8cm      3.46    L/71    3720    1943
        10.5cm      4.134   L/28
        10.5cm      4.134   L/68
        12.8cm      5.039   L/55    3080    1944
        15.0cm      5.90    L/12     780    1933
        15.0cm      5.90    L/29.5

France
         3.7cm      1.46    L/21    1273    1917
         3.7cm      1.46    L/33    2300    1938
         4.7cm      1.85    L/34    2200    1935
         7.5cm      2.95    L/36    1788    1898
         7.5cm      2.95    L/17.1  1500    1932

USSR
         3.7cm      1.46    L/44    2500    1930
         3.7cm      1.46    L/71.8  2900    1935
         4.5cm      1.772   L/46    2700    1936
         7.62cm     3.0     L/18.8          1930
         7.62cm     3.0     L/34.7          1938
         7.62cm     3.0     L/47.3  2l72    l939
         8.5cm      3.346   L/44            1942
         8.5cm      3.346   L/55.8  2600    1944
        10.0cm      3.937                   1944
        12.2cm      4.803   L/49            1939
        15.2cm      5.98    L/31.9          1939

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 7 Jul 1993 11:34:49 -0400
From:    "Mr. Scott Hannon" <hannon@UMBC.EDU>
Subject: Re: MISC: British Army size

I wrote:
>> ...by the end of 1944 the French
>> army was a bit larger than the British!

Robert George writes:
>     Do you mean the French Army in some particular theatre was larger
>than the British Army in that theatre?
[lists French in '44 as 400k, and British Army as 2.5M in 1941 and growing]

Yes, the ETO.

Guess I'll have to dig up the info tonight.

The French 400k figure looks wrong for the end of '44 (too small), as does
the 2.5M figure (too big) for the British (England, Scotland, Wales, and
Ulster, but excludes India, etc). The British army was shrinking as the
manpower pool had dried up, and they resorted to disbanding units to free
up replacements for other units.

More in the next few days (with references).

Scott.

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 7 Jul 1993 11:14:15 PDT
From:    Alan Hepburn <alan@BERLIOZ.NSC.COM>
Subject: Re: "Stealth" 'chutes (was PARA WINGS)

Max Calderwood asked about noise suppession of the slider
during HALO insertions so I asked a friend who has many
hours of free fall to his credit and here's his reply:

***** include message *****

The original F11 sliders (F11 being a type of nylon used for both the
parachute and slider) did make some noise, but not enough to really
bother us "civilian" types (although we never made night penetrations
into hostile area other than the farmer's fields).  With today's
newer "Zero-P" (so called because it has virtually a zero porosity
rating for air flow through the material) the slider makes a hell of
a lot more noise (in part because the forward speed is several mph
higher as well).  Its only on these newer parachutes that people
"stow" their slider after opening, and that's because the slider
is flapping around about 2 feet above your head.

As far as the military, I would guess that they have some way of quieting
the slider down, but I don't know what.  Next time I'm out at the old
DZ (hopefully late this month) I'll inquire with a couple of riggers.
The parachute that is referred to in the original post, the Strong Manta
is a big 288 sq ft F111 parachute originally made almost 10 years
ago.

Now that I think about it, there are things like the "spider slider"
that are used on older slower opening parachutes or parachutes that
like to snivel for a few hundred (thousand) feet while deciding to
open.  This slider has about the same grommet spacing as the original
slider, but instead of being a rectangle of nylon material, its just
a webbing framework.  No material = faster opening.  I'd NEVER consider
it on the newer parachutes (unless you wanted to collect the life
insurance money for, say.... your WIFE).

***** end included message *****


So there you have it.

---

Alan Hepburn           "A man doesn't know what he knows
National Semiconductor       until he knows what he doesn't know."
Santa Clara, Ca
alan@berlioz.nsc.com                              Thomas Carlyle

------------------------------

End of WWII-L Digest - 6 Jul 1993 to 7 Jul 1993
***********************************************

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Subject:  WWII-L Digest - 7 Jul 1993 to 8 Jul 1993
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Status: O

There are 6 messages totalling 380 lines in this issue.

Topics of the day:

  1. USAAF 8 JUL 43
  2. "Stealth" 'chutes (was PARA WINGS)
  3. MISC: French goums, German kampfwert
  4. German combat worth catagories (2)
  5. New Acquisitions on byrd.mu.wvnet.edu history ftp site

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 8 Jul 1993 07:08:05 -0400
From:    jem3@CC.BELLCORE.COM
Subject: USAAF 8 JUL 43

COMBAT CHRONOLOGY OF THE US ARMY AIR FORCES
THURSDAY, 8 JULY 1943
FTP SITES
  1. ftp.rutgers.edu in directory pub/wwii/usaf
  2. byrd.mu.wvnet.edu (129.71.32.152) in pub/history/military/airforce/
     wwii_chronology

AIRCRAFT MENTIONED IN THIS REPORT:
  A-36, North American Apache
  B-17, Boeing Flying Fortress
  B-24, Consolidated Liberator
  B-25, North American Mitchell
  B-26, Martin Marauder
  P-38, Lockheed Lightning
  P-40, Curtiss
  P-47, Republic Thunderbolt
  Wellington, Vickers (RAF)

AMERICAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  ALASKA (Eleventh Air Force)
    9 B-25's fly a special mission to Attu Island in the Aleutian Islands.

CHINA-BURMA-INDIA THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  CHINA (Fourteenth Air Force)
    22 B-24's, escorted by 13 P-40's, attack shipping, docks, and a cement
works at Haiphong, French Indochina.

EUROPEAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  ANTISUBMARINE WARFARE (AAF Antisubmarine Command)
    HQ 479th Antisubmarine Group is activated at St Eval, England  The
group is assigned to the AAF Antisubmarine Command and controls all
Antisubmarine Squadrons in England.

  COMBAT OPERATIONS (Eighth Air Force)
    The 354th, 357th and 358th Fighter Squadrons, 355th Fighter Group,
arrive at Steeple Morden, England from the US with P-47D's. They will fly
their first combat mission on 14 Sep 43.

MEDITERRANEAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  ANTISUBMARINE WARFARE (AAF Antisubmarine Command)
    German sub, U-232, is sunk off Portugal, 40-37N 13-41W, by a B-24 of
the 2d Antisubmarine Squadron (Heavy).

  EASTERN MEDITERRANEAN (Ninth Air Force)
    In Sicily, B-24's attack the Catania railway station, telegraph and
telephone buildings, and industrial area; B-25's hit the airfields at
Biscari and Comiso and nearby areas; and P-40's attack Biscari Airfield,
escort bombers over Sicily, and carry out sea patrols.

  WESTERN MEDITERRANEAN (Northwest African Air Force)
     In Sicily, Northwest African Strategic Air Force (NASAF) Wellingtons
bomb airfields at Comiso and Catania during the night of 7/8 Jul. During
the day, B-17's, B-25's, and B-26's make several strikes against Gerbini
and its satellite fields; P-38's strafe radar installations in the E part
of Sicily; Northwest African Tactical Air Force (NATAF) light bombers hit
Sciacca Airfield while medium bombers hit airfields at Biscari and Comiso;
and A-36's attack trucks, a train, railroads, highways, a sulphur plant,
and a marshalling yard at several points in Sicily.

SOUTHWEST PACIFIC THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Fifth Air Force)
  In New Guinea, B-25's continue to pound enemy positions around Mubo and
along the coast of NE New Guinea, hitting Kela Point and village, Malolo,
Buigap Creek, and trails from Salamaua Airfield and Kennedy's Crossing to
Logui.
  The 319th Bombardment Squadron (Heavy), 90th Bombardment Group (Heavy)
transfers with B-24's from Darwin, Northern Territory, Australia to Port
Moresby, New Guinea.

SOURCES:
AIR FORCE COMBAT UNITS OF WORLD WAR II, Office of Air Force History,
  Headquarters USAF, 1961, ISBN 0-912799-02-1
COMBAT SQUADRONS OF THE AIR FORCE, WORLD WAR II, Office of Air Force
  History, Headquarters USAF 1982
THE ARMY AIR FORCES IN WORLD WAR II: COMBAT CHRONOLOGY, 1941-1945 by the
  Office of Air Force History, Headquarters USAF, 1973
THE MIGHTY EIGHTH WAR DIARY by Roger A. Freeman, ISBN 1-85409-071-2

Jack McKillop
USAF (Airways and Air Communications Service)
1955-59


----------------------------------------------------------------------
|  Jack McKillop      |  Those who have long enjoyed such privileges |
|  Bellcore           |  as we enjoy forget in time that men have    |
|  Piscataway, NJ     |  died to win them.     FDR                   |
|  USA                |  jem3@cc.bellcore.com                        |
----------------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 8 Jul 1993 08:14:22 -0400
From:    MAX HARE <maxc@URSUS1.URSUS.MAINE.EDU>
Subject: Re: "Stealth" 'chutes (was PARA WINGS)

   Alan,

Thanks.  Your reply did answer a lot of my questions.  At our DZ the
noise of the sliders of these "hot" chutes generated many jokes about
"noise abatement".  Im sure the military must have something that cuts
this down when they are using ram-airs.

Thanks again,

Max C. Calderwood
University of Southern Maine
Gorham, ME
MAXC@URSUS1.URSUS.MAINE.EDU

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 8 Jul 1993 10:15:22 -0400
From:    "Mr. Scott Hannon" <hannon@UMBC.EDU>
Subject: MISC: French goums, German kampfwert

>> Rather surprising when you consider that by the end of 1944 the French
>> army was a bit larger than the British!

>     Do you mean the French Army in some particular theatre was larger
>than the British Army in that theatre?

Here's a quote from: J. Lee Ready, _Forgotten Allies: volume 1, The European
Theater_, McFarland, 1985. (D743.R34)

---
   "By the end of the year [1944] on the Western Front, the French Army would
   have fifteen divisions and several brigades in line. The British would
   have twelve divisions and a few brigades. The French therefore not only
   outnumbered the British in fighting strength, but it would be the French
   transport system which sustained the Allies, albeit with American engineer
   aid. Yet the Anglo-Americans continued to control all facets of the war."
---

While the French had more men in line than the British, almost half of those
15 divisions were ex-FFI men, and of limited combat value (many were used to
screen the German troops trapped in their coastal forts). Most of the
remaining units were North African.

To answer Larry's question about 4e GTM (from _Rearming the French_, US
Army in WW2 "green series", pg 111-113) :

---
   "The 4th GTM entering the front line alongside 2d DIM was one of several
   smaller organizations which were not originally planned for under the
   rearmament program, but which the French had activated and made ready
   largely at the urging of AFHQ. These nonprogram units, most of which
   were earmarked for service in Italy, included 4 Moroccan tabor groups
   corresponding to 4 U.S. light infantry regiments, 8 mule pack companies
   corresponding to 16 U.S. mule pack companies, ..."

   "The four Moroccan tabor groups, each consisting of three tabors, or
   battalions, represented a total of approximately 13000 goumiers. The basic
   organization of these robust, fearless mountaineers, most of them Berbers
   from the Atlas region, was the goum, or company, of a strength of
   approximately 220 men including French cadres of 2 officiers and 12
   noncommisioned officiers. Because of its extreme mobility and lightness,
   the goum was regarded by the French military authorities as a sort of
   'foot cavalry' unit able to accomplish, over difficult terrain, some of
   the missions ordinarily assigned to mounted cavalry." ...
---

Anyone familiar with German WW2 sources?...I have questions.

The daily reports of Germany's AOK 19 lists a "Kampfwert" for most of the
divisions in its two Korps. I'm told "Kampfwert" translates to "combat value".
Values of "I" thru "IV" appear for the various divs. This is a bit ambiguous
to me...is this a rating of combat strength regardless of size (ie if two
units are rated the same, they have the same combat strength even if one is
a div and the other a brigade), or a scaled value (ie how close to its full
TOE establishment)?

Another questions. Each unit is rated for "bespannt" (horse drawn?) and
"motorisiert" (motorized). These values are given as a percentage. Fine.
Well in one case, the values add up to more than 100% (95% and 60%)!
Is this likely a typo, or have I misinterpreted what the two percentages
mean?

(Remember ex-list member Arnaud Bouis? He's the one who did the research. He
is now out of the French military and looking for a job. He'll be visiting
the USA in August.)

Scott.

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 8 Jul 1993 09:50:00 CDT
From:    Shawn Robert Woodford <HAL9000@KSUVM.BITNET>
Subject: German combat worth catagories

Scott:  Toward the end of the war, OKH began catagorizing various combat
formations according a four level classification estimating their "combat
ability."  Catagory I units were those capable of serving in battle on the
Eastern Front.  The classifications ranged down to Catagory IV units, good only
for occupation and rear area duties.  Apparently it was a rule-of-thumb tool
for Staff Officers to use in keeping track of the 300+ divisions the German
Army had ballooned to by 1944-45, with many understrength, oddly organized and
combat-reduced formations.

Shawn Robert Woodford, Kansas State
HAL9000@KSUVM.BITNET

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 8 Jul 1993 13:38:28 -0400
From:    "Michael J. McCarthy" <MMCCARTH@MUVMS6.BITNET>
Subject: New Acquisitions on byrd.mu.wvnet.edu history ftp site

WHAT'S NEW on
HISTORY FTP SITE

BYRD.MU.WVNET.EDU
129.71.32.152
pub/history

Managers:
Mike McCarthy, Marshall Univ. (YEA003@Marshall.WVNET.Edu)
Donna Spindel, Marshall Univ. (HST001@Marshall.WVNET.Edu)

Honorary Manager and Major Contributor:
Larry Jewell (jewell@mace.cc.purdue.edu)

UPDATE: 8 July 1993

     We have obtained a large number of new files on byrd.mu.wvnet.edu
since the last update two months ago.  Below is a detailed listing,
by subdirectory.  For a comprehensive listing of all current files on
the FTP site, send me a request through email or retrieve the file
INDEX from the pub/history subdirectory.

Mike McCarthy
History Dept.
Marshall University
MMCCARTH@MUVMS6.WVNET.EDU

======================ATTACHMENT======================================

*DIRECTORY OF pub/history/diplomatic/coldwar:
berlin_brief.txt    JFK Briefing on Berlin Task Force
berlin_wall.txt     Article on Berlin Wall, John Ausland
jfk_berlin.txt      Article on JFK Briefing, John Ausland
us_fp_europe.txt    Honor's thesis, "From the Marshall Plan to
                    the Treaty of Rome:  US Foreign Policy and
                    European Integration" Richard P. Klau,
                    Lafayette College, April 1993

*DIRECTORY OF pub/history/diplomatic/h-diplo:
bio                 Subdir: Subscriber bios, H-DIPLO list

*DIRECTORY OF pub/history/general:
timeline.txt        A timeline of history

*DIRECTORY OF pub/history/internet:
army_war_coll.txt   Guide to databases of Army War College
european.guide_2    Electronic sources for Western European history
                    and culture
hnserver.txt        Announcement of history gopher server
hypertext_sim       Subdir: Hypertext simulation of CICNet Electronic
                    journal archives
ipwin.txt           InfoPop Windows:  hypertext guide to Internet
ipwin.zip           BINARY: InfoPop Windows:  hypertext guide to Internet
nettools.memo       EARN Guide to Network Resource Tools
whatis.internet     Description of internet and its uses

*DIRECTORY OF pub/history/maritime:
american_bat_dir    Subdir: Files from American Battleship Directory
american_naval_dic  Subdir: Files from Dictional of American Naval Ships
german_hclass.txt   Description of German H-Class Battleships

*DIRECTORY OF pub/history/military:
guerilla.txt        Paper:  Psych Operations in Guerilla Warfare,
                    Tayac n
gulf_war            Subdir: Gulf War, 1991

*DIRECTORY OF pub/history/military/airforce:
luftaces.txt        List of Luftwaffe ace fighter pilots
p_series_fighters   Subdir: Descriptions of US P-series fighter planes
swedish_air.txt     List of Swedish military aircraft types
usaf_descriptions   Subdir: Descriptions of US Air Force planes
usaf_fact_sheets    Subdir: Official US Air Force Fact Sheets

*DIRECTORY OF pub/history/military/airforce/wwii_chronology:
jun_43.txt          USAAF Chronology, June 1943

*DIRECTORY OF pub/history/military/civil_war_usa:
us_mem_day.txt      History of US Memorial Day Holiday
civ_war.bib_1       Civil War Bibliography (1)
civ_war.bib_2       Civil War Bibliography (2)
suggested.reading   Suggested reading on Civil War
units_file.txt      Civil War units file

*DIRECTORY OF pub/history/military/gulf_war:
navy.biblio         Bibliography of US Navy in the Gulf War

*DIRECTORY OF pub/history/military/united_states:
medals              Subdir: Commendations graphics files

*DIRECTORY OF pub/history/military/vietnam:
hanoi_hannah.txt    Article:  Voices from the Past, Don North
                    (_Vietnam Generation_, Vol. 3, No. 3)
nvet_archive        Subdir: _NAMVET:  International Newsletter for
                    Vietnam Veterans_ archive
vietnam_glos.txt    Glossary of Vietnam War era terms

*DIRECTORY OF pub/history/military/wwii:
4307.txt            Chronology of events, July 1943
balkans.txt         Files re: German anti-guerilla operations in
                    the Balkans, 1941-44
d_day_letters.txt   _INF: Letters Home: D-Day_, John Ausland
dragoon.txt         Description of Operation Dragoon
japan_expand.txt    Japanese expansion, 1931-41
japan_mil_prep.txt  Japanese economic & military prep, 1931-41
national_arc.txt    National Archives Center for Electronic Records
                    Holdings on WWII
wwii-l_digests      Subdir: Digests of WWII-L@UBVM discussion list

*DIRECTORY OF pub/history/political/united_states/presidency:
fdr.inaug           Text of Roosevelt's Inaugural Addresses
john_adams.inaug    Text of John Adams's Inaugural Address
lincoln.gif         BINARY: Graphic file of Lincoln

*DIRECTORY OF pub/history/science:
host                Subdir: History of Science and Technology Journal
                    Archives

*DIRECTORY OF pub/history/utilities:
chrnos.txt          Chronology determination software
chrnos.zip          BINARY: Chronology determination software
inch_mm.txt         Inches-millimeter conversion table
maya36.txt          Mayan/modern calendar conversion software
maya36.zip          BINARY: Mayan/modern calendar conversion software
nugu93.txt          New User's Guide to Usenet, Windows 3.1
nugu93.zip          BINARY: New User's Guide to Usenet, Windows 3.1
vn_teach_tools.txt  Description of tools for teaching Vietnam
                    Geography (vnmyhome.zip & vnquetoi.zip)
vnmyhome.zip        BINARY: Vietnam Geography (English version)
vnquetoi.zip        BINARY: Vietnam Geography (Vietnamese version)
wtp.txt             We The People, Windows 3.1
wtp.zip             BINARY: We the People, Windows 3.1

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 8 Jul 1993 11:18:02 -0700
From:    Thomas Cardoza <cardoza@HUMANITAS.UCSB.EDU>
Subject: Re: German combat worth catagories

Scott,
If Category I units were those capable of combat on the Eastern front, I
would be interested to know if OKH considered the Western Front (after 6
June 1944) to be "Category II."  In other words, does the Kampfwert system
reflect a German perception of the West as being significantly less
demanding or equally demanding to the East.  What did Categories II and
III signify?

Tom Cardoza


On Thu, 8 Jul 1993, Shawn Robert Woodford wrote:

> Scott:  Toward the end of the war, OKH began catagorizing various combat
> formations according a four level classification estimating their "combat
> ability."  Catagory I units were those capable of serving in battle on the
> Eastern Front.  The classifications ranged down to Catagory IV units, good onl
y
> for occupation and rear area duties.  Apparently it was a rule-of-thumb tool
> for Staff Officers to use in keeping track of the 300+ divisions the German
> Army had ballooned to by 1944-45, with many understrength, oddly organized and
> combat-reduced formations.
>
> Shawn Robert Woodford, Kansas State
> HAL9000@KSUVM.BITNET

------------------------------

End of WWII-L Digest - 7 Jul 1993 to 8 Jul 1993
***********************************************

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Status: O

There are 8 messages totalling 472 lines in this issue.

Topics of the day:

  1. MISC: French goums, German kampfwert (2)
  2. CALL FOR PAPERS (3)
  3. USAAF 9 JUL 43
  4. Online Congressional Hearing
  5. MISC: French army

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 8 Jul 1993 14:56:10 EDT
From:    "William B. Thacker" <wbt@CBEMF.ATT.COM>
Subject: Re: MISC: French goums, German kampfwert

Scott Hannon writes:

> Here's a quote from: J. Lee Ready, _Forgotten Allies: volume 1, The European
> Theater_, McFarland, 1985. (D743.R34)
>
> ---
>    "By the end of the year [1944] on the Western Front, the French Army would
>    have fifteen divisions and several brigades in line. The British would
>    have twelve divisions and a few brigades. The French therefore not only
>    outnumbered the British in fighting strength, but it would be the French
>    transport system which sustained the Allies, albeit with American engineer
>    aid. Yet the Anglo-Americans continued to control all facets of the war."

The French at this point in the war were using the American TO&E for their
formations.  A US Infantry Division of 1944 comprises 16,353 men.  At that
same time, a British infantry division included 18,347 men.   Twelve
British divisions would include enough manpower for 13.5 French divisions,
so the difference is less than it appears.  Scott's assessments of the
combat potentials of the French troops is right on the button.

When Ready speaks of "the French transport system" sustaining the Allies, I
can't figure what he means.  Is he simply stating that we drove on their
roads?  If so, he seems to be an idiot.

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Bill Thacker             AT&T Network Systems       attmail!att!cbemf!wbt
Quality Engineer            Columbus, Ohio              wbt@cbemf.att.com
          "Giving money and power to government is like giving
         whiskey and car keys to teenage boys." - P.J. O'Rourke

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 8 Jul 1993 12:18:18 -0700
From:    Hugh Bartling <BARTLING@NAUVAX.BITNET>
Subject: CALL FOR PAPERS

                         CALL FOR PAPERS

IMAGES OF THE ENVIRONMENT: EVOLVING PERSPECTIVES OF THE GLOBAL
COMMONS

Interdisciplinary Graduate/Faculty Symposium

November 5 & 6, 1993

The Graduate Students of Northern Arizona University invite
students and faculty to attend the Third Annual NAU Graduate
Student Interdisciplinary Symposium.  We encourage graduate
students and faculty from all academic disciplines to present
papers that address issues pertaining to the environment.

Possible Topic Areas:
     Global Environmental Issues
     Environment and Behavior
     Environment and Trade
     Environmental Literature
     Environmental Protection
     Environmental Policy
     Environmental Planning
     Environmental Racism
     Environmental Groups in Politics
     Women and the Environment
     Land Conservation
     Water Issues

Abstracts are due July 16, 1993

For further information, please contact:

Andy Harper or Hugh Bartling
Department of History
Northern Arizona University
Box 6023
Flagstaff, Arizona 86011
(602) 523-6167

E-Mail: Bartling@nauvax.ucc.nau.edu
        Harper@Nauvax.ucc.nau.edu

Please feel free to forward this message to any interested parties.

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 8 Jul 1993 12:52:45 -0700
From:    Hugh Bartling <BARTLING@NAUVAX.BITNET>
Subject: CALL FOR PAPERS

This is a reminder that the deadline for abstracts for this
year's Interdisciplinary Graduate/Faculty Symposium is
approaching (July 16, 1993).  If you are still interesteed
in presenting a paper, please let us know.  Abstract submissions
may be done via e-mail.  If you have problems with this date
please contact one of us and we will discuss possible
alternatives.

Thank you.

                         CALL FOR PAPERS

IMAGES OF THE ENVIRONMENT: EVOLVING PERSPECTIVES OF THE GLOBAL
COMMONS

Interdisciplinary Graduate/Faculty Symposium

November 5 & 6, 1993

The Graduate Students of Northern Arizona University invite
students and faculty to attend the Third Annual NAU Graduate
Student Interdisciplinary Symposium.  We encourage graduate
students and faculty from all academic disciplines to present
papers that address issues pertaining to the environment.

Possible Topic Areas:
     Global Environmental Issues
     Environment and Behavior
     Environment and Trade
     Environmental Literature
     Environmental Protection
     Environmental Policy
     Environmental Planning
     Environmental Racism
     Environmental Groups in Politics
     Women and the Environment
     Land Conservation
     Water Issues

Abstracts are due July 16, 1993

For further information, please contact:

Andy Harper or Hugh Bartling
Department of History
Northern Arizona University
Box 6023
Flagstaff, Arizona 86011
615-523-6167

E-Mail: Bartling@nauvax.ucc.nau.edu
        Harper@Nauvax.ucc.nau.edu

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 9 Jul 1993 07:21:24 -0400
From:    jem3@CC.BELLCORE.COM
Subject: USAAF 9 JUL 43

COMBAT CHRONOLOGY OF THE US ARMY AIR FORCES
FRIDAY, 9 JULY 1943
FTP SITES
  1. ftp.rutgers.edu in directory pub/wwii/usaf
  2. byrd.mu.wvnet.edu (129.71.32.152) in pub/history/military/airforce/
     wwii_chronology

AIRCRAFT MENTIONED IN THIS REPORT:
  B-17, Boeing Flying Fortress
  B-24, Consolidated Liberator
  B-25, North American Mitchell
  B-26, Martin Marauder
  P-40, Curtiss
  P-47, Republic Thunderbolt
  Wellington, Vickers (RAF)

CHINA-BURMA-INDIA THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  BURMA-INDIA (Tenth Air Force)
    B-25's bomb the railroad bridge on the Mu River between Ywataung and
Monywa, Burma scoring 2 direct hits and leaving the bridge temporarily
unusable.

EUROPEAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Eighth Air Force)
  HQ 56th Fighter Group and it's 63d Fighter Squadron with P-47D's transfer
from Horsham St Faith, England to Halesworth, England.
  HQ 355th Fighter Group arrives at Steeple Morden, England from the US to
join the three squadrons that arrived yesterday.

MEDITERRANEAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  EASTERN MEDITERRANEAN (Ninth Air Force)
    B-24's bomb airfields at Maleme, Crete, and Comiso and Taormina, Sicily.
In Sicily, B-25's hit Sciacca landing ground and Biscari Airfield and
dispersal areas while P-40's escort bombers over Castelvetrano, and Milo
Airfields. This pre-invasion air bombardment of Sicily provides air
superiority over the enemy. British and US airborne contingents are dropped
on the island during the night of 9/10 Jul to help facilitate the amphibious
assault of seaborne troops which are to land tomorrow morning. This is the
first major airborne operation to be undertaken by the Allies in World War
II, and subsequently becomes the subject of intensive study.

  WESTERN MEDITERRANEAN (Northwest African Air Force)
    In Sicily during the night of 8/9 Jul, Northwest African Strategic Air
Force (NASAF) Wellingtons bomb the airfields at Catania, Gerbini, and
Comiso, and throughout the following day B-17's, B-25's, B-26's, and
fighters attack other targets, including Sciacca and Biscari Airfields,
Gerbini satellite field, and Cape Passero Island radar stations; and
Northwest African Tactical Air Force (NATAF) planes hit Sciacca and Milo
Airfield during the night of 8/9 Jul, and on 9 Jul hit Milo and Biscari
Airfields, Sciacca, Porto Empedocle, HQ at Taormina, a junction NE of Gela,
the Canicatti area, and targets of opportunity.

SOUTH PACIFIC THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Thirteenth Air Force)
  In the Solomon Islands during the night of 8/9 Jul, B-24's bomb Kahili
Airfield and Buin on Bougainville Island, and Poporang Island. B-25's and
several fighters sent against forces near Vella Lavella Island, fail to
locate the target and strafe Buki and Ganongga Islands, and a destroyer
beached on SE Kolombangara Island.

SOUTHWEST PACIFIC THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Fifth Air Force)
  In New Guinea, B-25's hit forces in the vicinity of Old Bobdubi, Malolo,
and Busama. On Timor Island, B-25's hit landing fields, Dili, and Cape
Chater.

SOURCES:
AIR FORCE COMBAT UNITS OF WORLD WAR II, Office of Air Force History,
  Headquarters USAF, 1961, ISBN 0-912799-02-1
COMBAT SQUADRONS OF THE AIR FORCE, WORLD WAR II, Office of Air Force
  History, Headquarters USAF 1982
THE ARMY AIR FORCES IN WORLD WAR II: COMBAT CHRONOLOGY, 1941-1945 by the
  Office of Air Force History, Headquarters USAF, 1973
THE MIGHTY EIGHTH WAR DIARY by Roger A. Freeman, ISBN 1-85409-071-2

Jack McKillop
USAF (Airways and Air Communications Service)
1955-59


----------------------------------------------------------------------
|  Jack McKillop      |  Those who have long enjoyed such privileges |
|  Bellcore           |  as we enjoy forget in time that men have    |
|  Piscataway, NJ     |  died to win them.     FDR                   |
|  USA                |  jem3@cc.bellcore.com                        |
----------------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 9 Jul 1993 11:29:09 -0400
From:    Lydia Fish <FISHLM@SNYBUFVA.CS.SNYBUF.EDU>
Subject: Online Congressional Hearing

Forwarded from vwar-l@ubvm

***********************************************************************

From:           Leona coffee (NOTES1, NATIONAL ACADEMY OF SCIENCES, CIT100)

Date:           07/08/93 08:54:53 AM

Subject:        ONLINE CONGRESSIONAL HEARING -- CALL TO ACTION

Comment:

        from: Jack Kessler <kessler@well.sf.ca.us>
Subject: Online Congressional hearing July 26 -- help needed!

The following announcement appears to me to be of interest -- perhaps
of vital interest -- to everyone on the networks. Congressman Markey is
one of the leaders in getting all of us an expanded and upgraded
network, and he apparently needs a flood of e-mail to the address shown
below if he is to convince Congress that we are important in this
budgetarily-austere year.

Jack Kessler
kessler@well.sf.ca.us

Subject: On-Line Congressional Hearing

     On July 26 at 9:30AM EDT, the Subcommittee on Telecommunications
and Finance of the U.S. House of Representatives will hold the first
Congressional Hearing ever held over a computer network.  The oversight
hearing on "The Role of Government in Cyberspace" will take place in
the Grand Ballroom of the National Press Club at 14th and F Streets,
N.W., Washington, D.C.  The hearing is open to the public. An open
house will be held from 3-5PM on the same day in the same location and
is also open to the public.

     Chairman Markey has asked that this historic occasion demonstrate
the potential and diversity of the global Internet.  Thirty Sparcstations
will be in the hearing room, allowing members of Congress, staff, and
their guests to read e-mail, use Gopher menus, read testimony in WAIS
databases, browse the World Wide Web, and otherwise use the resources
of the global Internet as part of the hearing.

     Some witnesses for the hearing will testify remotely, sending audio
and video over the Internet.  Audio and video of the hearing will also
be multicast over the Multicast Backbone (MBONE).  We are hoping that
C-SPAN and other traditional media will also carry the event.  *MORE
DETAILS ON MBONE AND OTHER WAYS TO WATCH THE HEARINGS REMOTELY WILL BE
FORTHCOMING SHORTLY.*

     One of the primary points that we are hoping to demonstrate is
the diversity and size of the Internet.  We have therefore established
an electronic mail address by which people on the Internet can communicate
with the Subcommittee before and during the hearing:

          congress@town.hall.org

     We encourage you to send your comments on what the role of government
should be in the information age to this address.  Your comments to this
address will be made part of the public record of the hearing.  Feel free
to carry on a dialogue with others on a mailing list, cc'ing the e-mail
address.

     Your cards and letters to congress@town.hall.org will help
demonstrate that there are people who use the Internet as part of their
personal and professional lives.  We encourage you to send comments on
the role of government in cyberspace, on what role cyberspace should play
in government (e.g., whether government data be made available on the
Internet), on how the Internet should be built and financed, on how you
use the Internet, and on any other topic you feel is appropriate.  This
is your chance to show the U.S. Congress that there is a constituency
that cares about this global infrastructure.

     If you would like to communicate with a human being about the
hearing, you may send your comments and questions to:

          hearing-info@town.hall.org

     Support for the Internet Town Hall is provided by Sun Microsystems
and O'Reilly & Associates.  Additional support for the July 26 on-line
congressional hearing is being provided by ARPA, BBN Communications,
the National Press Club, Xerox PARC, and many other organizations.

     Network connectivity for the Internet Town Hall is provided by
UUNET Technologies.

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 9 Jul 1993 11:48:06 EDT
From:    "William B. Thacker" <wbt@CBEMF.ATT.COM>
Subject: Re: CALL FOR PAPERS

> IMAGES OF THE ENVIRONMENT: EVOLVING PERSPECTIVES OF THE GLOBAL
> COMMONS

I've decided to submit a paper for this.  Thought y'all would be interested
in the abstract.


"The Environmental Impact of The Battle of Kursk"

by William B. Thacker


Abstract:

The Battle of Kursk, fought in July, 1943, was the largest tank battle in
human history, and had a proportionally deleterious environmental impact.
The conflict is widely considered to have been the final turning point of the
Second World War's Eastern Front, and the forces of the USSR prevailed.
Yet, had STAVKA (Soviet Army High Command) possessed the least measure of
environmental consciousness, they would have prevented the geo-organic
trauma of this confrontation by retreating.  Moreover, the findings of this
report can be generalized and extrapolated to armored combat and warfare in
general, with far-reaching global implications.

This presentation will discuss the numerous environmental results of
armored combat, including:

        Soil Topology Reconfiguration by Tank Treads (STRTT) with
          considerations to erosion and soil conservation;
        Effect of heavy transient air pollution by high-viscosity petroleum
          products in combination with gunpowder reaction products;
        Soil iron enrichment via shrapnel and its long-term impact upon
          human body nutrition;
        Spill-over dangers, including downwind effects upon the South
          American rain forest, the Snail Darter, and the Spotted Owl;
        Alteration of water run-off and wind patterns as a result of
          entrenchments and anti-tank obstacle excavation;
        Mitigation of soil cratering by female artillery crews as perceived
          through co-dependency theory.

Alternative historical theories of the battle will be discussed, including
Stalinist eco-terrorism of the Ukraine and the Scorched Earth policy as an act
of environmental racism.  A Twelve-Step approach to reduction and
prevention of recurrences of this form of eco-damage will be prevented.




I'll let you know if they accept my proposal. 8-)

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Bill Thacker             AT&T Network Systems       attmail!att!cbemf!wbt
Quality Engineer            Columbus, Ohio              wbt@cbemf.att.com
          "Giving money and power to government is like giving
         whiskey and car keys to teenage boys." - P.J. O'Rourke

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 9 Jul 1993 12:35:56 -0400
From:    "Mr. Scott Hannon" <hannon@UMBC.EDU>
Subject: Re: MISC: French army

I wrote:
>> Here's a quote from: J. Lee Ready, _Forgotten Allies: volume 1_

>>    [In 1944]...it would be the French transport system which sustained
>>    the Allies, albeit with American engineer aid. Yet the Anglo-Americans
>>    continued to control all facets of the war."

Bill Thacker writes:
>When Ready speaks of "the French transport system" sustaining the Allies, I
>can't figure what he means.  Is he simply stating that we drove on their
>roads?

Ready's paragraph was leading up the book's next chapter, which deals
with Nordwind/Colmar Pocket and the crisis in the Allied high command
in the first few days of Jan 1945.

Briefly...Eisenhower *ordered* the abandonment of Strasbourg (without
consulting his French allies). De Gaulle *ordered* the French to hold
Strasbourg no matter what the Allies said. Annoyed, the US threatened
to cut off supply to the French. The French then threatened to withdraw
from Allied command and deny the Allies use of the French transport
system. The Allied high command soon agreed to the French demand that
Strasbourg be held.

The French transport system refered to was not only the roads, but the
ports and, perhaps most importantly, the railroads. The infrastructure
was French run and operated (with US engineering help...and of course
the US Army trucks had US Army drivers, etc). When the threats were made,
it was indirectly hinted the Allies might face partisans if they tried
and use the French transport system. The Allies would be forced to move
100's of thousands of men to take over the French front lines *and rear
area* (to guard and operate the supply lines thru France). Ouch!

The French perspective was that the loss of Strasbourg without a fight
would probably bring down the gov't and likely lead to civil war. France
would be forced to withdraw from the war as a major anti-Axis combatant.
They were serious about holding Strasbourg. In his _Operation Nordwind_
book, Charles Whiting opines this incident may well have been a large
factor in France's decision to withdrawl from NATO high command.

This crisis in command is covered in most WW2 histories (for example,
the rather short US Army West Point series book on the WW2 ETO even
has a few paragraphs about this).

The campaign in Alsace in Oct 44 - Feb 45 is not covered by the US Army
in WW2 "green series", so finding a detailed campaign history is quite
hard. Whiting's book is the only one easy to find, and while it's OK,
its of the "popularized history" type.

Scott.

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 9 Jul 1993 11:17:31 MDT
From:    Steve Alvin <STEPHEN_ALVIN@DSU1.DSU.NODAK.EDU>
Subject: Re: MISC: French goums, German kampfwert

On Thursday, July 8th William Thacker wrote:

>  If so, he seems to be an idiot.


Hey come on Bill, people can disagree on this list without resorting
to calling people names!


Steve Alvin
Dickinson State University
STEPHEN_ALVIN@DSU1.DSU.NODAK.EDU
**********************************************************************
*Those who fail to remember history are doomed to repeat it.--Proverb*
*Those who fail to remember history are doomed to repeat my class.-SA*
**********************************************************************

------------------------------

End of WWII-L Digest - 8 Jul 1993 to 9 Jul 1993
***********************************************

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There is one message totalling 35 lines in this issue.

Topics of the day:

  1. MISC: French army

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date:    Sat, 10 Jul 1993 14:36:55 EDT
From:    "AD16000@NEMOMUS.BITNET. --Scherrer,
         Tim A." <AD16%NEMOMUS.BITNET@MIZZOU1.MISSOURI.EDU>
Subject: Re: MISC: French army

Can anyone be more specific about port operations by the Allies.  It
would be my guess that the stevedores were military transport types,
while the railroads were probably civilians who operated them before the
Germans arrived, after they occupied France, and after they were beaten
back.

(I'm thinking about ports and ships because I'm getting ready to go to
the San Fransisco Bay area again to look at ports and the Suisun Bay
liberty ships next weekend).

Tim

BTW, if anyone wonders were my quote came from on my signature box: When
I was six, the movie The Battle of the Bulge was on TV, and it was also
my bedtime.  My dad sent me to bed--of course I was very upset at not
being able to watch the end of the movie (at that age I wasn't sure who
won it!!!).  He said to me as I was making vocal my state of mind,
"Don't worry--you'll be fighting World War II for the rest of your life.
Doomed to be a reenactor at the age of six.

************************************************************************
*  Tim A. Scherrer          "You'll be fighting WWII for the rest of   *
*  Facilities Supervisor     your life", Ron Scherrer, 1971            *
*  WP:816-785-5253                                                     *
*  HP:816-665-6704                                                     *
*  ID# AD16%NEMOMUS@ACADEMIC.NEMOSTATE.EDU                             *
************************************************************************

------------------------------

End of WWII-L Digest - 9 Jul 1993 to 10 Jul 1993
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There are 9 messages totalling 383 lines in this issue.

Topics of the day:

  1. MISC: French transport system
  2. German combat worth catagories
  3. WWII-List
  4. German Combat Worth Catagories
  5. WWII casaulties
  6. GERMAN EAGLE VS. RUSSIAN BEAR
  7. Mississippi Flood
  8. Mississippi Flood and WWII (2)

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date:    Sat, 10 Jul 1993 23:19:10 -0700
From:    Thomas Cardoza <cardoza@HUMANITAS.UCSB.EDU>
Subject: Re: MISC: French transport system

Bill Mauldin had some intersting commentaries on the "French"
contributions to the allied transport system. They appear in "Up Front."
Incidentally, I saw that book recommended along with Ernie Pyle's "Brave
Men" some time ago on this list.  I suggest Mauldin's "The Brass Ring" for
a much more candid version of certain events, especially those off duty
moments.

TC

------------------------------

Date:    Sun, 11 Jul 1993 07:51:57 EST
From:    Larry Jewell <jewell@MACE.CC.PURDUE.EDU>
Subject: Re: German combat worth catagories

>
> Scott,
> If Category I units were those capable of combat on the Eastern front, I
> would be interested to know if OKH considered the Western Front (after 6
> June 1944) to be "Category II."  In other words, does the Kampfwert system
> reflect a German perception of the West as being significantly less
> demanding or equally demanding to the East.  What did Categories II and
> III signify?
>
> Tom Cardoza

One of the "Green Books", Cross-channel Attack, has two chapters on German
preparations for invasion.  The status and equipage of the troops on the "West
Wall" are discussed extensively.  I'll move these near the top of the que and
send them to "byrd" this week.

Larry J

BTW, thanks, Pat Hughes, I got your letter with the missing pages, don't
remember if I've said thanks yet.

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 7 Jul 1993 20:21:02 +0100
From:    Tom Holloway <xuegx@CSV.WARWICK.AC.UK>
Subject: WWII-List

Just saw your append to soc.veterans.  I was reading it to
see if there was anything relevent to WW2 and there you were!

I run a charity for children who are hearing-impaired or
speech-impaired and as part of that run Education Exchange
projects to encourage them with their general communications.

Here's something we are putting together for September to
May 1994.  Might you be interested in helping us with it?


 +-------------+  +------------------------------------+
 | MEMORIES OF |  | Moderator - Tom Holloway           |
 | WARTIME     |  | CAMPUS 01:CLK001                   |
 +-------------+  | Internet t.holloway@warwick.ac.uk  |
                  +------------------------------------+

     "Those that do not learn from the past are
      condemned to repeat it"; George Santayana.

 More than 2,000,000 (two million) young people passed
 through England during the years 1943 and 1944.  They came
 from America, Australia, Canada, Ceylon, Fiji, France,
 Papua, Poland...  so many countries.....  They found an
 England quite different from the one we know today.

 Four people who lived in that time will be available to
 share the experience of their everyday lives. They are:-
 THE SCHOOLBOY; THE LAND-GIRL; THE SOLDIER; THE NURSE.

 They will NOT be waving flags, or glorifying war. They
 WILL be paying testimony to those who quietly endured
 and sometimes lost.

 We would like children everywhere to ask Senior Citizens
 who were in England during those years to tell their
 impressions and experiences and to send them to
 MEMORIES@sjuvm.stjohns.edu.  Perhaps old friends will find
 each other again.  Perhaps they will make new friends -- of
 a different age and a different country.

 As part of this project we shall have regular online
 discussions on the St Johns University, New York, UNIBASE
 system.

+--------------------------+
! Tom Holloway             !
! t.holloway@warwick.ac.uk !
+--------------------------+

------------------------------

Date:    Sun, 11 Jul 1993 15:51:00 CDT
From:    Shawn Robert Woodford <HAL9000@KSUVM.BITNET>
Subject: Re: German Combat Worth Catagories

I stand corrected from my earlier post on German "kampfwert" ratings; A
catagory IV division was the highest and a I, the lowest.  Someone else asked
if the Germans also differentiated between combat intensity on the various
fronts.  In fact they did--A catagory IV division was one that could was
capable of fighting on the the Eastern Front.  Perhaps a Catagory III division
was good enough for front line service on the Western Front, but only quiet-
sector or rear area duty in Russia (I am not familiar with the criterion for
making the distinctions).

This raises the question of whether combat was more destructive on the Eastern
than Western front, and if so, why?  It occurs to me that the Germans
considered Eastern front combat more demanding because of the nature of Soviet
tactics.  Although the Russians used large masses of artillery to rend holes in
the German lines, Soviet artillery was notoriously slow to displace and calling
for fire support was a quick way for a Soviet officer to end up in a penal
battallion clearing minefields...Thus, Soviet OMG's were forced to rely on
direct fire support--tanks and dedicated assault guns--to make up for this lack
of firepower.  They were also among the first armies to equip their infantry
formations with SMG's to bolster their firepower.  On of the reasons Zhukov's
counterattack before Moscow failed to encircle Heeresguppe Mitte in Dec-Feb '41
was because the losses in the summer campaign forced Soviet troops to rely on
mortars for fire support; thus they didn't have sufficient combat power to wipe
out the German igelstellen.  The upshot of this is that the Soviets relied on
infantry and direct fire attacks where the Germans and Western Allies woud use
massed and accurate artillery and air support.  Hand to hand infantry
firefights are naturally going to be expensive in terms of lives.  An
interesting statistic I read a few years ago in SPI's old "Russo-German War"
study was that while German artillery inflicted on the order of 70-80% of
Russian combat casualties, Soviet tubes accounted for only about 50% of German
losses.  Unfortunately the work was not footnoted, so I never did discover
where these figures came from.  While this may be interpreted as a disregard of
human life on the part of the Soviets, I might point out that is was a
manifestation of the old Russian concept of "interchangibility of fire."  Where
it came from is unclear, but Marshal Suvorov was a confirmed believer in the
concept as his bayonet charges against French troops in Italy in 1799 ran
contrary to the developing spirit of firepower, but succeeded brilliantly
anyway.  For Soviet tacticians, using infantry attacks in depth as a substitute
for artillery support was a natural adaptation--but it also rendered Eastern
Front battle excessively bloody.

But this also brings up the question of why the Germans considered infantry
combat on the Eastern Front as more destructive than facing the overwhelming
air and artillery assets of the Allies on the Western Front in 1944-45.  The
Allied way of making war was (and is) predicated upon trading time and material
for lives.  Massive amounts of firepower used against the enemy saved lives in
avoiding costly infantry attacks.  Weren't the Germans taking huge casualties
from this firepower in the West?  I tend to disbelieve this notion.  While the
Allies viewed firepower as a killing tool, both the Germans and the Russians
tended to see it as more of a suppresive tool.  Artillery fire did indeed cause
casualties; indeed caused the largest proportion of the casualties, but
troops learned how to protect themselves from its effects.  I suspect that the
Allies used fireower to neutralize the German defenders until they could roll
over them with their conservative infantry/tank tactics.  (Remember, the Allies
did not execute a single operational encirclement until the Ruhr pocket in 1945
--Falaise doesn't count because it wasn't sealed until most of the German
troops in it had escaped).  Thus, combat on the Western Front was seen by the
Germans as less bloody than that on the Eastern Front.

Just a thought.

Shawn Robert Woodford, Kansas State
HAL9000@KSUVM.BITNET

------------------------------

Date:    Sun, 11 Jul 1993 18:07:31 EDT
From:    Robert E George <regeorge@MAGNUS.ACS.OHIO-STATE.EDU>
Subject: Re: WWII casaulties

Posted to milhst-l:
>
> I ran across the following (unattributed) factoid recently,
> and have a hard time believing it:
>
>         "The wealthy died in greater numbers in [WWII],
> proprotionately, than did the poor".
>
> any comments?
>

     Some thoughts (not supported by *any* data):

     1) I would expect peasants to fare better in war than urbanites:
peasants are accustomed to a harsher life, perhaps able to "extract"
more from a difficult environment.

     2) In an occupied nation where hostage-taking occurred, the hostages
seized by the occupying power were likely to be well-known, socially
prominent individuals.

     3) Soviet forces 'liberating' Eastern Europe would have had a
strong predisposition *against* prewar socioeconomic elites.

     All of the above are guesses. Please demolish those which
can be demolished.


     Rob George
     regeorge@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu

------------------------------

Date:    Sun, 11 Jul 1993 20:50:15 CDT
From:    Lou Coatney <MSLRC@ECNUXA.BITNET>
Subject: GERMAN EAGLE VS. RUSSIAN BEAR

Greeting, friends.

As a (fellow?) member of the World War II Studies Association, I'm glad to
  see this usergroup up and running -- and, having finally figured out how to
  sign on to a usergroup without the physical presence of our Academic
  Computing staff, to be signed on finally.

GERMAN EAGLE VS. RUSSIAN BEAR is a SIMPLE Russian Front/Great Patriotic War
  boardgame which was published on ERIC as an instructional aid for
  students middle school level and above.  It nonetheless contains all the
  essential decision-making variables of the campaign -- less such elusive
  intangibles as morale.

Have any of you used it?  in or outside of class?

The ERIC microfiche number is ED 287 786.  The ERIC social studies clearing-
  house will be issuing the 2d edition (eventually).  The 1st is fine,
  though.

In Spring 1991, I received a letter from N. Nachaev -- head of general
  secondary education in the USSR.  He asked for a copy of the game to
  review and consider for possible mass production/dissemination.  For a
  mere $69 I Federal-Expressed a copy to him, pointing out the political
  delicacy of a game about the death of 27 million people -- sobering
  dedication and considerable interest-stimulation/educational-benefits
  of the game notwithstanding.  Then the (attempted) Coup hit.  I've heard
  nothing back.  (For all I know, he's selling pencils now.)

Lou Coatney
Western Illinois University, Macomb, IL

------------------------------

Date:    Sun, 11 Jul 1993 20:54:03 EDT
From:    "AD16000@NEMOMUS.BITNET. --Scherrer,
         Tim A." <AD16%NEMOMUS.BITNET@MIZZOU1.MISSOURI.EDU>
Subject: Mississippi Flood

I realize this is totally unrelated to our topic.  If you aren't
interested in this, please delete it.

As many of you probably already know, the Mississippi River is flooding
the middle of the United States like it never has before.  It is called
the flood of the century.  I grew up in Quincy, IL, on the river, and
have seen several major floods, however none are the scope and scale of
this one.

Today, me and several friends flew the Mississippi from Hannibal, MO to
Keokuk, IA.  We departed Kirksville, MO airport in a Cessna Skyhawk and
turned towards Hannibal.

Approximately 20 miles away from Hannibal we could see the flooding.  As
we flew over Hannibal, we could see that the downtown area was dry,
however the southern portion, called Bear Creek was under about 5 feet
of water, with the flooding extending several miles into the town.  The
western end of the Hannibal bridge was completed under water.  The
railroad bridge, usually about 12 feet out of the water, showed the surf
ace of the river about even with the decking.

Flying north, we approached the area east of Palmyra, with had flooding
from backwater of the Mississippi and flooding from the Fabius River
extending about five miles in-land.  On the opposite bank, the water
extended across the flood plain 3 miles to Marblehead.  We could see
bulldozers busy reinforcing the levies, and people walking the levies to
insure any boils or damage is spotted quickly, and dealt with.

Coming up south to Quincy, Lock and Dam #21 had the locks completely
under water--to include the buildings at the locks.  The water on the
west side of the river had expanded about half a mile.  The Quincy
Memorial Bridge was under several feet of water, while the Bayview
Bridge, the only bridge still open between Burlington, IA, and St. Louis
, showed lots of sandbagging to keep this only route of commerce open.
Quinsippi Island, where I attended a World War II display three weeks
ago, was under several feet of water, with the tops of the buildings
showing.

Flying north, we reached the area near Wyaconda State Park in Missouri.
The park was under water, with the line of water extending about 5 miles
in-land to within several hundred yards of US Highway 61.  As we
continued north, we saw LaGrange, Missouri.  The entire LaGrange
business district was under water, with it extending about four blocks
in-land.  On the Illinois side, National Guardsmen were sandbagging.

As we approached Canton, MO, it became very evident of the heavy price
that Meyer, Illinois has paid.  After gallant efforts at saving the town
for over a week, last Thursday the levy broke, and all that could be
seen of this nice little town was it's grain elevator, and the tops of
several multi-story buildings.  The flooding extended about ten miles on
theIllinois side of the river.  This flooding extended for about 20
miles along the Mississippi.  Canton, Missouri was holding it's own,
thanks to a major effort in suring up the levies, and a seawall to the
north of town.  The north side of the town seawall was under water.
Canton started sandbagging early, and was prepared when the water hit.
Based upon the crest predictions, the area was under maximum strain.  It
appears they will come through it OK.

Flying north, I saw the saddest sight of the trip.  Alexandria,
Missouri, a town I used to deliver to with my father, was completely
under water.  Only the tops of roofs could be seen.  The town was succes
sfully evacuated, however I could not forget the people who I had met
there, and wondering what they were doing.  The water extended a good
10-15 miles in-land on the Missouri side, nearly reaching Wayland,
Misouri.  This, combined with the water on the Illinois side of the
river, made the Mississippi 20 miles wide at this point.  All we could
see from east to west was muddy, brown Mississippi water.

We flew north to Keokuk.  Keokuk is lucky to be on a bluff, and appeared
to only suffer minor damage.  Lock and Dam #19 was mostly under water,
but it appeared the Union Electric power generating station was still
above water, and possibly functioning.  Turning south to head back to
Kirksville, we again flew over Alexandria.  It is difficult to imagine
the challenges of the people of Alexandria and Meyer will face when the
flood waters receed.  It is obvious that it will be weeks before they wi
ll be able to return to their homes, and years bfore their lives will
return to normal.  It will take weeks for the waters to recced, and
months for the fields to dry-up after having been under as much as 12
feet of water.  We could see boats moving around, with people checking
their property.

We were all pretty sobered by the time we landed in Kirksville.  Having
grown up on the Mississippi, we always saw it as a place to water ski,
or boat.  Never did I think that old man river was capable of this.  I
managed to shoot a role of film of places I recognized.  It was a sight
like I have never seen before.  I should probably get going, for it
looks like it is about ready to rain---again.

I hope this hasn't been too self-indulgent on my part.  It was an
unbelievable experience to see this.

************************************************************************
*  Tim A. Scherrer          "You'll be fighting WWII for the rest of   *
*  Facilities Supervisor     your life", Ron Scherrer, 1971            *
*  WP:816-785-5253                                                     *
*  HP:816-665-6704                                                     *
*  ID# AD16%NEMOMUS@ACADEMIC.NEMOSTATE.EDU                             *
************************************************************************

------------------------------

Date:    Sun, 11 Jul 1993 21:22:02 CDT
From:    Lou Coatney <MSLRC@ECNUXA.BITNET>
Subject: Re: Mississippi Flood and WWII

Tim,

     I just returned from Rock Island -- my home town.  I slung a few
sandbags on the levee in 1965, just after I resigned/returned home from
West Point.  Soon after, Rock Island built a high/permanent dike.
Davenport is currently under water (at least its first couple of blocks from
the river are) because it didn't (build such a dike).

     It is very much like the regional emergency I (and my new, young wife)
saw in upper Idaho in Fall 1973 on our way to Alaska.  Fire conditions were
acute and a(nother) electrical storm was starting fires up and down the sides
of the mountains.  Threading our way through convoys of grim/grimy firefighters
was like driving through the middle of the Ardennes in late 1944.

Lou Coatney
Western Illinois University
Macomb, Illinois

------------------------------

Date:    Sun, 11 Jul 1993 21:26:06 CDT
From:    Lou Coatney <MSLRC@ECNUXA.BITNET>
Subject: Re: Mississippi Flood and WWII

Incidentally, what was the name of that great book about the guy who drove
  the two little Jewish kids out of harm's way in the Ardennes.  It contained
  a great segment about Hemmingway.

?

------------------------------

End of WWII-L Digest - 10 Jul 1993 to 11 Jul 1993
*************************************************

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Subject:  WWII-L Digest - 11 Jul 1993 to 12 Jul 1993
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Status: O

There are 2 messages totalling 134 lines in this issue.

Topics of the day:

  1. PARA WINGS
  2. Letter from Einstein to FDR...

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 12 Jul 1993 09:29:12 EDT
From:    Lowe Barrett MAJ <hb9388@USMA6.USMA.EDU>
Subject: Re: PARA WINGS

>Bear,
>
>Thanks for the reply.  I do suspect that these were some sort of
>unauthorized design..possibly related to the AF Academy.
>
>Also, I have another question related to jumping.  On HALO jumps...which
>are by nature "stealthy" how do Army jumpers deal with that gawdawful
>noise caused by the slider panel rustling in the breeze. Parachutes make
>a prounounced "pop" on opening but the noise caused by the slider must
>put the jumper at risk from aware enemy sentries/patrols.  I am a
>beginning civil jumper and have noticed that the noise from a couple of
>ram airs can be quite loud. Have noticed that some experienced jumper
>will somehow  stow their deployed sliders behind their helmets for a
>nice quiet ride...but I dont think I could do this on the Strong/Manta
>rigs I have been jumping.
>
>Has the Army been able to develop a "stealth" slider...this might be
>something worthwhile to develop.
>
>Max C. Calderwood
>University of Southern Maine
>Gorham, ME
>MAXC@URSUS1.URSUS.MAINE.EDU
>

Max,  a few answers that may or may not fit the bill:

1)  As far as I know, there are no "stealth" sliders.  Yes, the parachutes
do make a bit of noise.  But the key is that you want to land where the enemy
is NOT!  You are VERY vulnerable during your approach to land, and then the
next few minutes after you land until you get your gear picked up and put your
weapon into operation.

2)  HALO and HAHO teams in general do not land anywhere near an enemy position.
Depending on the terrain, weather, visibility, etc. they could land 2-3 kms
or as far as 10-25 km from an objective. The best way to be sneaky is to start
off where the enemy isn't, so you know that you are secure, then close in.

3)  Not the same as a jump by the Rangers or the 82nd Airborne.  A low altitude
static line mass tactical jump is made to put the max number of soldiers on the
ground in the quickest time, even on top of an objective (like seizing an
airfield, for example).

See ya,

Bear

------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 12 Jul 1993 18:54:15 EST
From:    Larry Jewell <jewell@MACE.CC.PURDUE.EDU>
Subject: Letter from Einstein to FDR...

Albert Einstein
Old Grove Rd.
Nassau Point
Peconic, Long Island
August 2d, 1939

F. R. Roosevelt
President of the United States
White House
Washington, D.C.

Sir;

Some recent work by E. Fermi and L. Szilard, which has been
communicated to me in manuscript, leads me to expect that the
element uranium may be turned into a new and important source of
energy in the immediate future.  Certain aspects of the
situation which has arisen seem to call for watchfulness and, if
necessary, quick action on the part of the Administration.  I
believe therefore that it is my duty to bring to your attention
the following facts and recommendations.

In the course of the last four months it has been made probable-
through the work of Loiot in France as well as Fermi and Szilard
in America-that it may become possible to set up a nuclear chain
reaction in a large mass of uranium, by which vast amounts of
power and large quantities of new radium-like elements would be
generated.  Now it appears almost certain that this could be
achieved in the immediate future.

This new phenomenon would also lead to the construction of
bombs, and it is conceivable-though much less certain-that
extremely powerful bombs of a new type may thus be constructed.
A single bomb of this type, carried by boat and exploded in a
port, might very well destroy the whole port together with some
of the surrounding territory.  However, such bombs might very
well prove to be too heavy for transportation by air.

The United States has only very poor ores of uranium in moderate
quantities.  There is some good ore in Canada and the former
Czechoslovakia, while the most important source of uranium is
the Belgian Congo.

In view of this situation you may think it desirable to have
some permanent contact maintained between the Administration and
the group of physicists working on chain reactions in America.
One possible way of achieving this might be for you to entrust
with this task a person who has your confidence who could
perhaps serve in an unofficial capacity.  His task might
comprise the following:

a) to approach Government Department, keep them informed of the
further development, and put forward recommendations for
Government actions, giving particular attention to the problems
of securing a supply of uranium ore for the United States.

b) to speed up the experimental work, which is at present being
carried on within the limits of the budgets of University
laboratories, by providing funds, if such funds be required,
through his contacts with private persons who are willing to
make contributions for this cause, and perhaps also by obtaining
the co-operation of industrial laboratories which have the
necessary equipment.

I understand that Germany has actually stopped the sale of
uranium from the Czechoslovakian mines which she has taken over.
That she should have taken such an early action might perhaps be
understood on the ground that the son of the German Under-
Secretary of State, von Weizacker, is attached to the Kaiser-
Wilhelm-Institut in Berlin where some of the American work on
uranium is now being repeated.

Your very truly,
(signed) A. Einstein

------------------------------

End of WWII-L Digest - 11 Jul 1993 to 12 Jul 1993
*************************************************

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There are 7 messages totalling 691 lines in this issue.

Topics of the day:

  1. USAAF 10-13 JUL 43
  2. MISC: French army (2)
  3. WANT: 388th BG Alumni Assoc. Address
  4. Dangers of liberating the French
  5. ADMIN: Introduction to WWII-L
  6. Home: US (German spy plane in America?) ~#

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 13 Jul 1993 07:57:02 -0400
From:    jem3@CC.BELLCORE.COM
Subject: USAAF 10-13 JUL 43

COMBAT CHRONOLOGY OF THE US ARMY AIR FORCES
SATURDAY, 10 JULY 1943
FTP SITES
  1. ftp.rutgers.edu in directory pub/wwii/usaf
  2. byrd.mu.wvnet.edu (129.71.32.152) in pub/history/military/airforce/
     wwii_chronology

AIRCRAFT MENTIONED IN THIS REPORT:
  A-36, North American Apache
  B-17, Boeing Flying Fortress
  B-24, Consolidated Liberator
  B-25, North American Mitchell
  B-40, Boeing Flying Fortress
  P-40, Curtiss
  Wellington, Vickers (RAF)

AMERICAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  ALASKA (Eleventh Air Force)
    The Eleventh Air Force attacks the Japanese Home Islands for the first
time as 8 B-25's raid Paramushiru Island in the Kurile Islands, scoring
hits on the S part of Shimushu Island, Paramushiru Island, Kurile Strait,
and northern Paramushiru Island, in dead reckoning runs when solid cloud
cover prevents a maximum altitude attack.  No AA fire is encountered and no
enemy aircraft are sighted. The B-25's stage through Attu Island on
returning to Adak Island. 6 B-24's, originally slated to accompany the
B-25's to Paramushiru Island and 5 other B-25's are on short notice
dispatched to attack a convoy off Attu Island. They claim 2 medium
freighters sunk in deck-level strikes.

CHINA-BURMA-INDIA THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  CHINA (Fourteenth Air Force)
    9 B-24's bomb the dock area at Haiphong, French Indochina.

EUROPEAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Eighth Air Force)
  VII Bomber Command Mission Number 72: 121 B-17's and 5 YB-40's are
dispatched to the Caen/Carpiquet Airfield and 64 B-17's are dispatched to
the Abbeville/Drucat Airfield, both in France; 34 hit Caen at 0832 hours
while 36 hit Abbeville at 0729-0735 hours; they claim 17-7-6 Luftwaffe
aircraft; 1 B-17 is lost while 33 others are damaged; casualties are 1 WIA
and 10 MIA. In a second raid, 101 B-17's are dispatched against Le Bourget
Airfield, Paris but the mission is abandoned due to cloud cover.

MEDITERRANEAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  EASTERN MEDITERRANEAN (Ninth Air Force)
    In Sicily, B-24's attack the marshalling yard at Catania and airfield at
Vibo Valentia; and B-25's hit Palazzolo, Sciacca, Catania, Agrigento,
Floridia, Giarratana, Biscari, Syracuse, and Piazza Armerina while fighters
cover the assault beach areas.

  WESTERN MEDITERRANEAN (Northwest African Air Force)
    In Sicily during the night of 9/10 Jul, Northwest African Strategic Air
Force (NASAF) Wellingtons bomb Catania, Syracuse, the Syracuse Isthmus
seaplane base and the railroad station at Syracuse, and Caltagirone; North-
west African Air Force Troop Carrier Command flies airborne operations to
drop British and US paratroops; the US Seventh and British Eighth Armies
make amphibious landings on the S and SE coast of Sicily.  Northwest Afri-
can Tactical Air Force (NATAF) A-36's hit railroads, road junctions,
trains, and vehicles while P-40's fly cover for amphibious landings. NATAF
light and medium bombers hit airfields at Sciacca, Canicatti, Ponte Olivo,
and Trapani, and towns and surrounding areas of Caltagirone and Palazzolo.
Throughout the day NASAF B-17's and B-25's bomb Milo and Sciacca
Airfields, Gerbini satellite fields, and towns of Palazzolo and
Caltanissetta, Sicily. P-38's on sweep strafe radar installation.
    HQ 3d Air Defense Wing transfers from Tunisia to Licata, Sicily.

SOUTH PACIFIC THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Thirteenth Air Force)
  In the Solomon Islands, B-24's pound Kahili Airfield on Bougainville
Island. Seabees report a 3,300-feet (1,006 m) airstrip at Segi Point on New
Georgia Island available for limited operations; this provides an emergency
landing field only 40 mi (64 km) from Japanese facilities at Munda, New
Georgia Island.

SOUTHWEST PACIFIC THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Fifth Air Force)
  In New Guinea, B-25's pound Salamaua, Logui, and the SE bank of the
Francisco River as Allied ground forces effect junction at Buigap Creek
cutting communications between Salamaua and Mubo; a single B-24 bombs the
village of Kela. B-24's bomb Boela on Ceram Island in the Moluccas Islands
and Babo, New Guinea.

SUNDAY, 11 JULY 1943

AIRCRAFT MENTIONED IN THIS REPORT:
  A-20, Douglas Havoc
  B-17, Boeing Flying Fortress
  B-24, Consolidated Liberator
  B-25, North American Mitchell
  B-26, Martin Marauder
  P-38, Lockheed Lightning
  P-40, Curtiss

AMERICAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  ALASKA (Eleventh Air Force)
    In the Aleutian Islands, 5 B-24's take off to attack Paramushiru
Island in the Kurile Islands and fly a shipping search but are turned
back by bad weather. A shipping search by 5 B-25's finds nothing. 6
B-25's and 6 B-24's in 3 missions (one by radar) attack North Head and
Main Camp on Kiska Island sighting new excavations near Sredni Point,
strafe a tent near Haycock Rock, and also fly over Segula Island.

CENTRAL PACIFIC THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Seventh Air Force)
  3 B-24's from Funafuti Island in the Ellice Islands fly a photo
reconnaissance mission to Little Makin Island in the Gilbert Islands; 2
of the B-24's bomb the island.

CHINA-BURMA-INDIA THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  BURMA-INDIA (Tenth Air Force)
    A few B-24's hit the port of Haiphong, French Indochina.

  CHINA (Fourteenth Air Force)
    In French Indochina, 3 B-24's bomb the Haiphong harbor area, 3 bomb
shipping in the Campha Port area, and 8 pound positions and barracks area
at Kunlong, China; and P-40's strafe traffic between Lao Kay and Cha Pa,
and hit oil storage area SW of Lao Kay.

MEDITERRANEAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  EASTERN MEDITERRANEAN (Ninth Air Force)
    B-24's hit airfields at Vibo Valentia, Sicily and Reggio di Calabria,
Italy. In Sicily, B-25's hit airfields at Trapani, Milo and Bo Rizzo, and
areas between Sciacca and Enna. P-40's escort bombers and provide beach
cover as invasion forces push inland in Sicily.
    On the ground in Sicily, the US Seventh Army's II Corps is hit by a
counterattack, mainly in the Gela region. The attack is repelled, but an
airdrop of a contingent of 82d Airborne Division troops results in heavy
casualties.

  WESTERN MEDITERRANEAN (Northwest African Air Force)
    In Sicily, Northwest African Strategic Air Force (NASAF) planes hit
Milo and Sciacca Airfields during the night of 10/11 Jul and numerous
tactical targets during the day, including town areas, vehicle convoys,
bridges, trains and roads; NASAF B-17's bomb the Catania marshalling yard
while B-26's hit Milo Airfield and Gerbini satellite airfields; and
B-25's and P-38's hit Sciacca Airfield and the town of Caltanissetta.
Throughout the day NASAF fighters attack truck convoys on Sicilian
highways, and hit gun positions and targets of opportunity.

SOUTH PACIFIC THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Thirteenth Air Force)
  In the Solomon Islands, B-24's and B-17's attack Kahili Airfield on
Bougainville Island, hitting revetments E and W of the strip.

SOUTHWEST PACIFIC THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Fifth Air Force)
  In New Guinea, A-20's and B-25's blast positions in the battle zone
from Nassau Bay inland to the Mubo area, hitting the trail between Logui
and Kennedy's Crossing, the Bobdubi and Bobdubi Ridge areas, Salamaua,
Kela Point and villages scattered through the area. Other B-25's bomb
Penfoei on Timor Island. B-17's and B-24's pound airfields in the Rabaul
area on New Britain Island.
  The 19th Bombardment Squadron (Medium), 22d Bombardment Group (Medium)
transfers with B-26's from Woodstock, Queensland, Australia to Dobodura,
New Guinea. The 19th, which has been in combat in the SWPA since Apr 42,
was pulled out of combat in Jan 43 for R&R. The squadron will fly it's
first combat mission on this tour on 27 Jul 43.

MONDAY, 12 JULY 1943

AIRCRAFT MENTIONED IN THIS REPORT:
  B-17, Boeing Flying Fortress
  B-24, Consolidated Liberator
  B-25, North American Mitchell
  C-47, Douglas Skytrain
  F-4, Lockheed Lightning
  F-5, Lockheed Lightning
  P-40, Curtiss
  Wellington, Vickers (RAF)

CHINA-BURMA-INDIA THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  CHINA (Fourteenth Air Force)
    In French Indochina, 7 B-24's attack docks and shipping at Campha
Port, shipping at Ha Long Bay, and railroad yards, power plant, and
warehouses at Hongay. The B-24's claim critical damage to 2 freighters;
and P-40's strafe trucks S of Ha Giang.
    The flight of the 9th Photographic Squadron (Light), Tenth Air Force
operating from Kunming, China and it's detachment operating from Kweilin,
China with F-4's return to their base at Pandaveswar, India.
    The 21st Photographic Squadron (Light), 5th Photographic
Reconnaissance and Mapping Group dispatches a flight with F-5's from
Bishnupur, India to Kunming and Kweilin, China.

MEDITERRANEAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  ANTISUBMARINE WARFARE (AAF Antisubmarine Command)
    A B-24 of the 1st Antisubmarine Squadron (Heavy) sinks U-506 near
Portugal at 42-30N 16-30W.

  EASTERN MEDITERRANEAN (Ninth Air Force)
    In Italy, B-24's attack the harbor, ferry slip, and marshalling yard
at Reggio di Calabria, and the ferry slip and railroad yards at Villa San
Giovanni. In Sicily, B-25's hit Bo Rizzo Airfield while P-40's patrol
over the Licata area. On the ground in Sicily, with bridgeheads firmly
established by the end of day, British and US troops make contact at
Ragusa. Royal Air Force (RAF) heavy bombers bomb Reggio di Calabria
Airfield, Italy.

  WESTERN MEDITERRANEAN (Northwest African Air Force)
    In Sicily during the night of 11/12 Jul, Northwest African Strategic
Air Force (NASAF) Wellingtons pound Trapani, Marsala, Mazara del Vallo,
and Montecorvino-Rovello Airfield and Northwest African Air Force Troop
Carrier Command drops paratroops in front of the forward lines in the
battle area; more than 20 C-47's fail to return from mission; during the
following day, B-17's hit Messina railroad bridges, medium and light
bombers hit Gerbini satellite field, Agrigento, Canicatti, and Milo
Airfield. Fighters hit trucks, trains, troops, tanks, and other targets
of opportunity during sweeps over Sicily. Northwest African Tactical Air
Force (NATAF) fighters and light bombers hit Milo Airfield, Sicilian
beaches, Termini harbor and town, Ninfa rail junction, several trains,
numerous vehicles, and communications targets throughout Sicily.
Northwest African Coastal Air Force (NACAF) aircraft fly convoy escort
and carry out shipping strikes in Tyrrhenian Sea and W of Corsica and
Sardinia.
    HQ XII Air Support Command transfers from Tunisia to Sicily.

SOUTH PACIFIC THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Thirteenth Air Force)
  In the Solomon Islands, 10 B-25's attack Vila Airfield on Kolombangara
Island, which is hit later in the day by B-24's on armored
reconnaissance. 17 B-24's pound the airfield on Ballale Island. Several
fighters join US Navy dive bombers in strikes on AA and bivouacs in the
Munda area on New Georgia Island.

SOUTHWEST PACIFIC THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Fifth Air Force)
  13 B-24's bomb airfields and the town area in Rabaul, New Britain
Island and vicinity. In the Moluccas Islands, 2 B-25's hit Lingat Air-
field and Selaroe Island villages. A lone B-17 bombs Garove Island in the
Bismarck Archipelago.

TUESDAY, 13 JULY 1943

AIRCRAFT MENTIONED IN THIS REPORT:
  B-17, Boeing Flying Fortress
  B-24, Consolidated Liberator
  B-25, North American Mitchell
  B-26, Martin Marauder
  F-5, Lockheed Lightning
  P-40, Curtiss
  Spitfire, Vickers Supermarine
  Wellington, Vickers (RAF)

CHINA-BURMA-INDIA THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  BURMA-INDIA (Tenth Air Force)
    16 B-25's lay mines in the Irrawaddy River, Burma.

MEDITERRANEAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  EASTERN MEDITERRANEAN (Ninth Air Force)
    B-24's strike airfields at Crotone, Italy and Vibo Valentia, Sicily.
In Sicily, B-25's attack the Leonforte road and harbor at Termini; and
P-40's patrol the Licata area.

  WESTERN MEDITERRANEAN (Northwest African Air Force)
    In Sicily during the night of 12/13 Jul, Northwest African Strategic
Air Force (NASAF) Wellingtons hit Caltanissetta, Gerbini Airfield, and
Enna. During the day, B-17's, B-25's, B-26's, and fighters attack Enna,
Milo Airfield, Carcitella landing ground, Randazzo, and targets of
opportunity. Northwest African Tactical Air Force (NATAF) aircraft hit
truck convoys, trains, railway stations, troops, and numerous targets of
opportunity over wide areas in Sicily. Northwest African Coastal Air
Force (NACAF) continues sea patrols, reconnaissance, and convoy protec-
tion and attack ship convoy NE of Palermo, Sicily.
    On the ground in Sicily, the British effort to break out onto Catania
Plain by establishing bridgehead over Simeto River near Lentini is firmly
opposed.
    HQ 31st Fighter Group and it's 309th Fighter Squadron transfer with
Spitfires from Gozo Island, Malta to Ponte Olivo, Sicily.
    The air echelon of the 23d Photographic Squadron (Light), 5th Photo-
graphic Reconnaissance and Mapping Group arrives at La Marsa, Tunisia from
the US with F-5's. The ground echelon is still at Colorado Springs,
Colorado and will not leave the US until 8 Aug; they will arrive at La
Marsa on 8 Sep.

SOUTHWEST PACIFIC THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Fifth Air Force)
  In New Guinea, B-17's and B-24's, operating individually, bomb the
airfield, town area, harbor, and other targets in the Lae area; B-25's
blast positions in the Salamaua area, along the road between Kela and
MacDonald's Junction, and hit AA guns at Salamaua and MacDonald's Junc-
tion; and ground forces clear the Mubo area and Lababia Ridge of the
enemy.
  HQ 375th Troop Carrier Group arrives at Brisbane, Queensland, Australia
from the US.

SOURCES:
AIR FORCE COMBAT UNITS OF WORLD WAR II, Office of Air Force History,
  Headquarters USAF, 1961, ISBN 0-912799-02-1
COMBAT SQUADRONS OF THE AIR FORCE, WORLD WAR II, Office of Air Force
  History, Headquarters USAF 1982
THE ARMY AIR FORCES IN WORLD WAR II: COMBAT CHRONOLOGY, 1941-1945 by the
  Office of Air Force History, Headquarters USAF, 1973
THE MIGHTY EIGHTH WAR DIARY by Roger A. Freeman, ISBN 1-85409-071-2

Jack McKillop
USAF (Airways and Air Communications Service)
1955-59


----------------------------------------------------------------------
|  Jack McKillop      |  Those who have long enjoyed such privileges |
|  Bellcore           |  as we enjoy forget in time that men have    |
|  Piscataway, NJ     |  died to win them.     FDR                   |
|  USA                |  jem3@cc.bellcore.com                        |
----------------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 13 Jul 1993 12:40:29 EDT
From:    "William B. Thacker" <wbt@CBEMF.ATT.COM>
Subject: Re: MISC: French army

> >> Scott Hannon writes:
> >> Here's a quote from: J. Lee Ready, _Forgotten Allies: volume 1_
>
> >>    [In 1944]...it would be the French transport system which sustained
> >>    the Allies, albeit with American engineer aid. Yet the Anglo-Americans
> >>    continued to control all facets of the war."
>
> Bill Thacker writes:
> >When Ready speaks of "the French transport system" sustaining the Allies, I
> >can't figure what he means.  Is he simply stating that we drove on their
> >roads?

(Aside: Another reader objected to my use of the term "idiot" in reference
to Mr. Ready.  I had presumed that Ready was not a member of this list, but
simply the author of the quoted reference.
   While I stand by my tentative analysis of Mr. Ready's abilities, I do
sincerely apologize if he's a member of the list.  I may think he's an
idiot, but I'm tactful enough only to say so behind his back.)

> Briefly...Eisenhower *ordered* the abandonment of Strasbourg (without
> consulting his French allies). De Gaulle *ordered* the French to hold
> Strasbourg no matter what the Allies said. Annoyed, the US threatened
> to cut off supply to the French. The French then threatened to withdraw
> from Allied command and deny the Allies use of the French transport
> system. The Allied high command soon agreed to the French demand that
> Strasbourg be held.
>
> The French transport system refered to was not only the roads, but the
> ports and, perhaps most importantly, the railroads. The infrastructure
> was French run and operated (with US engineering help...and of course
> the US Army trucks had US Army drivers, etc).


And with this in mind, let us look again at Ready's statement:

> >>    [In 1944]...it would be the French transport system which sustained
> >>    the Allies, albeit with American engineer aid. Yet the Anglo-Americans
> >>    continued to control all facets of the war."

I've used better reasoning than this to fertilize my tomatos.  One might just
as easily say, "it was the French transport system which sustained the
Wehrmacht, albeit with German aid.  Yet the Germans continued to control
all aspects of the defense of France."

For the French to claim a significant participation in the liberation of
their nation simply because they didn't object to our drawing supplies
through their territory is ridiculous.  They granted virtually the same
consideration to the Germans in 1940. (*) And to threaten to undermine that
liberation effort is downright silly; they held themselves hostage.
Reminiscent of a scene from "Blazing Saddles," in fact.

(*) While I'll agree that terrorist activities did hamper the operation of
the French transport system, esp. railroads, from 1940-44, the overall
effect of said resistance only became signficant in a few cases, notably,
causing significant delays to the redeployment of 2nd SS Panzer (Das Reich)
to the Normandy area.  All told, given the choice between suffering a major
defeat (=thousands of casualties) or having Charles de Gaulle and his
supporters in a snit, I'd have given Chuckles the boot in a minute.

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Bill Thacker             AT&T Network Systems       attmail!att!cbemf!wbt
Quality Engineer            Columbus, Ohio              wbt@cbemf.att.com
          "Giving money and power to government is like giving
         whiskey and car keys to teenage boys." - P.J. O'Rourke

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 13 Jul 1993 13:21:43 PDT
From:    Bob Gardner <bgard@ATR-2S.HAC.COM>
Subject: Re: MISC: French army

On a related point:

     In a theater near the top of l'Arc de Triumphe in Paris is a movie
     detailing great moments in the life of the monument.  One feature
     is the liberation of Paris [WWII] by the French Army.  It also
     leads the viewer to the idea that the French Army also liberated
     France.

Gardner @ Hughes

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 13 Jul 1993 15:35:35 CDT
From:    "Robert J. Granvin" <rjg@UMNSTAT.STAT.UMN.EDU>
Subject: WANT: 388th BG Alumni Assoc. Address

A question was posed my way, which I will now forward... :-)

Does anyone know an address or phone number for the 388ths Bomb Group
Alumni Association?

--
Robert J. Granvin                                    Southern Minnesota Wing
rjg@stat.umn.edu                                       Confederate Air Force
  You know you've made a gear-up landing when it takes full power to taxi.

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 13 Jul 1993 15:54:35 CDT
From:    Lou Coatney <MSLRC@ECNUXA.BITNET>
Subject: Dangers of liberating the French

Gallic pride may never recover from Allied liberation -- or was it all
  those beautiful French girls Americans liberated from France
  that upsets them?

Lou

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 13 Jul 1993 19:08:06 EST
From:    Larry Jewell <jewell@MACE.CC.PURDUE.EDU>
Subject: ADMIN: Introduction to WWII-L

Changes: Digest ftp site noted.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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Larry J
Date:         Wed, 16 Sep 1992 18:06:11 CDT
From: DONALD NEWCOMB <NEWCOMB%USMCP6.BITNET@UBVM.cc.buffalo.edu>
Subject:      Getting back articles and the database

From:Larry Jewell <jewell@MACE.CC.PURDUE.EDU>
Larry,
  One of the "niftiest" features of the listserver is the database
search. This allows the user to search for any subject and print
either an index of the "hits" or the articles themselves. For
instance if you mail the command sequence below to "listserv@ubvm.bitnet"
or "listserv@ubvm.cc.buffalo.edu" it will send you an index of all
articles in the archive that deal with weapons (the WEAP: tag).
_
//Job
Database Search DD=Rules
//Rules DD *
sel * in wwii-l where subject contains ("weap:")
index
/*
_
If you change the word "index" to "print" it will return you a copy
of the articles themselves. I think you can start with the listserv
"help" command and find a complete set of instructions  for using the
database. The complete instructions are very complex and should only
be tackled by someone with experience with data searching experience.

Donald R. Newcomb - Univ. of Southern Mississippi - Gulf Park
   <NEWCOMB@USMCP6.BITNET>


Enough talking.  I can be reached at the following addresses;

Larry W. Jewell                      jewell@mace.cc.purdue.edu
2501 Soldier's Home Rd. #58B         JEWELLL@PURCCVM
W. Lafayette, IN, 47906-3571
(317)496-3234


#Larry W. Jewell (ex-USN)  WWII-L Listowner   jewell@mace.cc.purdue.edu     #
#"Sunday's horoscope is noteworthy because of its strange, sudden and wholly#
#unpredictable and inexplicable occurrences, affecting all phases of life." #
#--"Your Horoscope," L.A. Evening Herald Express, Saturday, Dec. 6, 1941.   #

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 14 Jul 1993 03:53:00 -0400
From:    "Helena M. Menezes 30935" <HMENEZES@WORLDBANK.ORG>
Subject: Home: US (German spy plane in America?) ~#

          Friends,
          I am a Brazilian doing some research about the first Brazilian
          ships torpedoed by the Germans on the American coast (Virgina/
          North Carolina). That was the main cause that took us to fight
          that war as many of you may well know.
              The first ship attacked was the steamship "Buarque" on the
          night of the 15th by the U-432 (Kptlt. Schultze, H.O). As I went
          through the "Buarque's" captain report, as well as other members
          of the ship's crew, they all mention about an "airplane flying
          very low and releasing flares to mark the ship's position" right
          before the attack.  The  "Official Account of the Brazilian Navy
          in the WWII" referring to the "Buarque's" attack says: "...as we
          all know today, the Germans had a spy plane based in American
          territory to help guide the U-Boats attacking ships on the East
          American coast..."
             Does anybody knows anything about this?

          Thanks for your help. It sure feels good to be part of this list.
          Claudio Braga
          (Please reply to my wife's E-mail address:
          Hmenezes@worldbank.org@internet)

------------------------------

End of WWII-L Digest - 12 Jul 1993 to 13 Jul 1993
*************************************************

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Status: O

There are 10 messages totalling 594 lines in this issue.

Topics of the day:

  1. MISC: French army (2)
  2. USAAF 14 JUL 43
  3. WANT: 388th BG Alumni Assoc. Address
  4. REF:Elementary School Curriculum
  5. GEN: France late 44 (3)
  6. F.Y.I.
  7. German Combat Worth Catagories

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 14 Jul 1993 06:42:47 EDT
From:    Lowe Barrett MAJ <hb9388@USMA6.USMA.EDU>
Subject: Re: MISC: French army

Adding to Gardner's point below:

>On a related point:
>
>     In a theater near the top of l'Arc de Triumphe in Paris is a movie
>     detailing great moments in the life of the monument.  One feature
>     is the liberation of Paris [WWII] by the French Army.  It also
>     leads the viewer to the idea that the French Army also liberated
>     France.
      ...with just a little help from Ike, George Patton, Omar Bradley,
      the U.S. Army, and Monty and his crew.......   :-)

      I guess after getting their butts kicked by the Germans in 1940
      their politicians don't want to admit to too much help.

      However, after being on an exchange with a French parachute regiment
      (6eme RPIMA in Mont de Marsan) in 1983, their officers sure know
      and appreciate what we did.  In fact, my sponsor also had an
      American flag hanging in his office.

Bear

Barrett F. Lowe                    RANGERS LEAD THE WAY!
MAJ, IN
Dept of Physics, US Military Academy, West Point, NY 10996

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 14 Jul 1993 07:10:42 -0400
From:    jem3@CC.BELLCORE.COM
Subject: USAAF 14 JUL 43

COMBAT CHRONOLOGY OF THE US ARMY AIR FORCES
WEDNESDAY, 14 JULY 1943
FTP SITES
  1. ftp.rutgers.edu in directory pub/wwii/usaf
  2. byrd.mu.wvnet.edu (129.71.32.152) in pub/history/military/airforce/
     wwii_chronology

AIRCRAFT MENTIONED IN THIS REPORT:
  B-17, Boeing Flying Fortress
  B-24, Consolidated Liberator
  B-25, North American Mitchell
  B-26, Martin Marauder
  B-40, Boeing Flying Fortress
  C-47, Douglas Skytrain
  F-5, Lockheed Lightning
  P-40, Curtiss
  P-51, North American Mustang
  Spitfire, Vickers Supermarine
  Wellington, Vickers (RAF)

EUROPEAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Eighth Air Force)
  VIII Bomber Command Mission Number 73: Three targets are struck in
France, i.e.:
    1. 111 B-17's and 5 YB-40's are dispatched against the aircraft works
at Villacoublay, France; 101 hit the target at 0811-0815 hours; they
claim 15-7-16 Luftwaffe aircraft; 3 B-17's are lost and 67 damaged;
casualties are 1 KIA, 3 WIA and 21 MIA.
    2. 64 B-17's are dispatched against Amiens/Glisy Airfield; 53 hit the
target at 0742 hours; they claim 9-0-2 Luftwaffe aircraft; 1 B-17 is
lost, 3 are damaged beyond repair and 34 are damaged; casualties are 6
KIA, 3 WIA and 10 MIA.
    3. 84 B-17's are dispatched against LeBourget Airfield, Paris; 52 hit
the target at 0750-0820 hours; they claim 41-27-32 Luftwaffe aircraft; 4
B-17's are lost, 1 is damaged beyond repair and 50 damaged; casualties
are 16 WIA and 41 MIA.

MEDITERRANEAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  EASTERN MEDITERRANEAN (Ninth Air Force)
    In Sicily, B-24's and Royal Air Force (RAF) heavy bombers hit rail-
road, marshalling yard, harbor, and oil storage facilities at Messina;
B-25's hit the Enna and Palermo areas; and P-40's patrol Licata and
attack the Lentini area.

  WESTERN MEDITERRANEAN (Northwest African Air Force)
    In Sicily during the night of 13/14 Jul, Northwest African Strategic
Air Force (NASAF) Wellingtons bomb Palermo and Messina, and C-47's drop
paratroops in advance of Allied troops to secure a bridge at Primosole.
Northwest African Tactical Air Force (NATAF) aircraft hit ammo dumps,
trains, rail junctions, bridges, vehicle convoys, and other targets of
opportunity in the Sicilian countryside, and bomb several town areas
including Enna and Palermo during several raids throughout the night of
13/14 Jul and the following day. During the day, B-17's, B-26's, B-25's,
and fighters hit Naples, Italy and Messina, Enna, Marsala, and Randazzo,
and numerous targets of opportunity in Sicily. Northwest African Coastal
Air Force (NACAF) continues sea patrols, reconnaissance, and convoy
protection.
    On the ground in Sicily, British forces attempting to establish a
bridgehead at the Primosole bridge on the Simeto River near Lentini
continue to face strong opposition.
    The detachment of the 15th Photographic Squadron (Heavy), 3d Photo-
graphic Reconnaissance and Mapping Group, operating from Le Kroub,
Algeria with B-17's and F-5's returns to it's base at La Marsa, Tunisia.
    The air echelon of the 111th Reconnaissance Squadron (Fighter), 68th
Reconnaissance Group, transfers from Korba, Tunisia to Ponte Olivo,
Sicily with P-51's. The ground echelon will remain at Tunis, Tunisia
until Friday.
    The 307th and 308th Fighter Squadrons, 31st Fighter Group, transfer
with Spitfires from Gozo Island, Malta to Ponte Olivo, Sicily.

SOUTH PACIFIC THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Thirteenth Air Force)
  In the Solomon Islands, B-25's and P-40's strike small craft in Hunda
Cove and Beagle Channel off New Georgia Island; 2 barges and a small
vessel are claimed destroyed. B-24's and B-17's pound airfields on
Ballale Island and Buka Island, and at Kahili on Bougainville Island.

SOUTHWEST PACIFIC THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Fifth Air Force)
  In New Guinea, A-20's bomb and strafe the Orodubi area; and a single
B-17 hits Lae. B-24's bomb Koepang on Timor Island.

SOURCES:
AIR FORCE COMBAT UNITS OF WORLD WAR II, Office of Air Force History,
  Headquarters USAF, 1961, ISBN 0-912799-02-1
COMBAT SQUADRONS OF THE AIR FORCE, WORLD WAR II, Office of Air Force
  History, Headquarters USAF 1982
THE ARMY AIR FORCES IN WORLD WAR II: COMBAT CHRONOLOGY, 1941-1945 by the
  Office of Air Force History, Headquarters USAF, 1973
THE MIGHTY EIGHTH WAR DIARY by Roger A. Freeman, ISBN 1-85409-071-2

Jack McKillop
USAF (Airways and Air Communications Service)
1955-59



----------------------------------------------------------------------
|  Jack McKillop      |  Those who have long enjoyed such privileges |
|  Bellcore           |  as we enjoy forget in time that men have    |
|  Piscataway, NJ     |  died to win them.     FDR                   |
|  USA                |  jem3@cc.bellcore.com                        |
----------------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 14 Jul 1993 09:38:01 EST
From:    Crane Conrad LTC <kc5318@USMA7.USMA.EDU>
Subject: Re: WANT: 388th BG Alumni Assoc. Address

>A question was posed my way, which I will now forward... :-)
>
>Does anyone know an address or phone number for the 388ths Bomb Group
>Alumni Association?
>
>--
>Robert J. Granvin                                    Southern Minnesota Wing
>rjg@stat.umn.edu                                       Confederate Air Force
>  You know you've made a gear-up landing when it takes full power to taxi.
>

8th AF Unit Contact for the 388th BG is Edward Huntzinger, 1925 SE 37 St., Cape
Coral, FL 33904.

                              Conrad Crane
                              LTC, USA
                              Dept. of History, USMA
                              Also Member of 8AFHS

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 14 Jul 1993 09:32:14 EDT
From:    Kurt L <MNHAD007@SIVM.BITNET>
Subject: Re: MISC: French army

My wife grew up in France mostly in and around Nice.  She is very sensitive
about comments about the French.  I was talking to the Mother-in-Law the
other day about the Vichy Govt. and how the french in my opinion would
rather forget their involvement in cooperating with the Nazi German
controlled Vichy.  Who knows how many indictments and convictions were
obtained where the defendants were French working with^[for Vichy?
This topic is interesting and we may never know all.  I wonder how
many war criminals were British or American even.  Lets not leave out
the then Soviets.

Tally Ho! We Have Joy!   H. A. Kurt Luginbyhl
                         MNHAD007@SIVM.SI.EDU
                         National Museum of Natural History

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 14 Jul 1993 08:58:14 -0500
From:    Ellen Pedraza <pedraza@CS.UWP.EDU>
Subject: REF:Elementary School Curriculum

Are there any elementary school teachers on this list who have
incorporated WWII History into their curriculum for Grades 2-6?

I am an academic librarian who will be teaching education majors about
Internet resources and electronic discussion groups.

We will be reading and summarizing this list for about 4 weeks this summer
as an exercise to introduce them to email and electronic discussion
groups.

I chose this list because the focus of their summer classes is on WWII and
minority and ethnic participation.

If you are an elementary school teacher who has used WWII as a theme for
your class curriculum (whether it was history, math, science, geography or
??) I would appreciate hearing about your projects.

Our students will also use traditional resources, like curriculum guides,
and journal literature, for ideas.

You may reply to the address above.  Thank you.

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 14 Jul 1993 12:13:05 -0400
From:    "Mr. Scott Hannon" <hannon@UMBC.EDU>
Subject: GEN: France late 44

Bill Thacker writes:
>For the French to claim a significant participation in the liberation of
>their nation simply because they didn't object to our drawing supplies
>through their territory is ridiculous.  They granted virtually the same
>consideration to the Germans in 1940. (*) And to threaten to undermine that
>liberation effort is downright silly; they held themselves hostage.
...
>(*) While I'll agree that terrorist activities did hamper the operation of
>the French transport system, esp. railroads, from 1940-44, the overall
>effect of said resistance only became signficant in a few cases...

No one makes such a claim. The claim was that the French transport system
was a non-negligable contribution *in addition to the troops*. This is in
the same sense Britain had served as the base of operations for the US
troops, bombers, etc. Was that not a significant contribution?

The supply point seems to have taken off by itself...it is nearly irrelevant.
As France was #2, Britian #3 and US #1 in troops at the front, you'd might
expect the French would get a significant say in devising stategy for said
troops. They did not. Only #1 and #3 made the big decisions, even those with
large repercussions for France. While I'd agree this arrangement was proper
for summer '44, by the fall off '44 it no longer reflected military
participation or political realities.

French participation in the Normandy landings was indeed small. But that was
not the main effort of the French army (ignoring the FFI partisans) in
France's liberation...that came in the south with Dragoon, which came a
couple months [August] after D-Day. French 1st Army liberated much of
southern and eastern France. Usually the only French participation that is
remembered is the 2 DB's liberation of Paris, and that as an example of
allied charity (the allies specifically selected 2 DB to have the honor).

For military as well as political reasons, major French participation in
D-Day was impractical. [The French army was stuck in the Med. theater,
and anyways not-to-friendly with the British]. Nearly the only major
French unit coming thru Normandy was LeClerc's 2 DB in July, attached to
the US forces. Besides liberating Paris, it liberated much of Alsace,
including Strasbourg, in an amazing campaign in the fall.

The operations of French 1st Army are not well covered in most english
language WW2 histories, so France's contribution beyond 2 DB and the FFI
is generally not recognized. [For example, the US Army in WW2 series does
not cover Dever's 6th Army Group]. That 1st Army was mostly North African
may also work against its recognition (the "French" army contained rather
few Euro-Frenchmen until late 1944!).

The manpower of the French troops by Jan 1 1945 was much larger than that
of the Poles, or Canadians, New Zealanders, Dutch, etc. About equal to all
of those combined. While half the French units were brand-new ex-FFI units
barely fit for combat, the other half were seasoned veterans, as good or
better than the typical American div (2 DB may have been the best Allied
armored div of the war).

IMO, France was too important a part of the Allied collition to lock out
of the decision making process in late 1944. The US/UK didn't have to like
them (heck, the French didn't like each other!), but not seeking the input
of a major ally is just plain unwise.

>All told, given the choice between suffering a major
>defeat (=thousands of casualties) or having Charles de Gaulle and his
>supporters in a snit, I'd have given Chuckles the boot in a minute.

If this refers to Nordwind and the early January 1945 command crisis, I
disagree. This was not the choice Eisenhower faced.

[As it turned out, the German's had underestimated Allied strength and so
failed to acheive the desired breakthru and rout. While a few divs of
Allied reinforcments had to be committed, the effort in "the Bulge" was not
too seriously disrupted. But this is hindsight.]

As Alsace was a disputed area (claimed by both France and Germany), the
citizens were considered traitors by the Germans if they acted against
German interest. [BTW, the French had much the same policy. They executed
many Alsatians serving in the German military]. The whole area was deeply
divided...there would be no shortage of finger-pointers. The French were
thus deeply concerned about the region returning to the Germans/Gestapo.

Also, Strasbourg was an important city to the French people (taking 2nd
place only to Paris)...in large part as a symbol of resistance to Germany.
To abandon this symbol to the Germans without a fight would be viewed as
a major disgrace...something that might so damage the prestige of de Gaulle
that his shakey gov't would probably collapse and lead to civil unrest (if
not civil war).

De Gaulle agreed that from a military perspective Eisenhowers plan made
sense, but from a practical viewpoint it was *out of the question*. The
potential cost in French lives and civil unrest was just too great. They'd
go it alone if necessary, and were apparently serious with their threats
(de Gaulles orders to de Lattre are unambiguous...ignore Ike and do as de
Gaulle says *no matter what*).

This did not "threaten to undermine the liberation effort" of France (well,
not as much as Ikes plan), as the only bits not yet liberated were in French
sectors of the front (the fortress ports and part of Alsace). But
Eisenhower's retreat order *did* threaten the liberation in the sense that
Alsace was to be abandoned and civil unrest would likely ensue in most of
France and require the intervention of the French army (those parts that
stayed loyal). In short, Ike ignored political reality and made a purely
military decision...something Generals are wont to do.

Scott.

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 14 Jul 1993 13:34:27 -0400
From:    Lydia Fish <FISHLM@SNYBUFVA.CS.SNYBUF.EDU>
Subject: F.Y.I.

Forwarded from vwar-l

********************************************************************************
   ************************************

>From the San Mateo Times, Tuesday, July 13, 1993.
Reprinted without permission.

"Women Army Vets invited to join up"
(dl San Francisco)
"The Women's Army Corps Veterans Association is seeking
women who served in the Army Corps between 1942 and 1978
to join the organization.
"The group meets the third Saturday of each month to
promot recognition and benefits for women veterans as well
as socialize.  For more information, call membership
chairwoman Ramona Chipman at (415) 897-2627."

I would assume that there are chapters in other cities.
If anyone would like me to call and see if Ramona has
information for your area, send me e-mail and I'll call.

CatWoman
(diana@wetware.com)

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 14 Jul 1993 15:38:55 EDT
From:    "William B. Thacker" <wbt@CBEMF.ATT.COM>
Subject: Re: German Combat Worth Catagories

Shawn Woodford writes:

> Although the Russians used large masses of artillery to rend holes in
> the German lines,Soviet artillery was notoriously slow to displace and calling
> for fire support was a quick way for a Soviet officer to end up in a penal
> battallion clearing minefields...

I've got a lot of questions about the Soviet use of artillery, and this
addresses some of them.  The image I've got is that the Red Army artillery
stuck to a pre-calculated fire plan and had little or no ability to be
directed from the battlefield.  That, mostly, from German accounts.  But
I've never read an actual description of Soviet artillery tactics and
control techniques; can anyone point me to a good reference?

Specifically, was it even practical for a field commander to request
artillery on a target of opportunity?  If so, at what levels (Battalion,
Brigade, etc) was such a mission requested and authorized?  How long would
it take to arrive?

> [The Soviets] were also among the first armies to equip their infantry
> formations with SMG's to bolster their firepower.

And, I would add, the only ones to use SMG's as the basic infantry arm for
large units.  Though I would maintain that this had as much to do with
simplifying training requirements as with increased firepower; the theory,
at least, was that a soldier could be effective with an SMG with much less
marksmanship training than required for a rifle.

> The upshot of this is that the Soviets relied on
> infantry and direct fire attacks where the Germans and Western Allies woud use
> massed and accurate artillery and air support.

As nearly as I can tell, the German artillery, while far ahead of
the Russian in terms of efficiency, was quite a distance behind the US and
Britain.  In part, that's a question of mass, the western Allies simply
having more tubes available.  But it was also a doctrine issue; the German
batteries tended to be parcelled out, whereas we maintained centralized
control so that entire artillery regiments could be called in on a single
target by a single forward observer.

> But this also brings up the question of why the Germans considered infantry
> combat on the Eastern Front as more destructive than facing the overwhelming
> air and artillery assets of the Allies on the Western Front in 1944-45...
> Massive amounts of firepower used against the enemy saved lives in
> avoiding costly infantry attacks.  Weren't the Germans taking huge casualties
> from this firepower in the West?  I tend to disbelieve this notion.  While the
> Allies viewed firepower as a killing tool, both the Germans and the Russians
> tended to see it as more of a suppresive tool.

I think it's important to distinguish artillery's offensive and defensive
applications.  I agree with everything you say above, with that
reservation.

On the offensive, artillery is not very effective for killing, unless the
defenders have no ability to take cover.  It can suppress (by driving them
to cover), but most of the casualties will be delivered in the first few
seconds of the barrage, when the enemy is caught unaware.  Hence the
attraction to rockets, which deliver a massive amount of firepower over a
few seconds.

Defensively, it's another matter.  An advancing attacker cannot take great
advantage of cover, and is likely to be caught in unprotected ground where
artillery casualties will be tremendous.  To accomplish this requires very
close cooperation, however, because you're trying to hit a moving target
with no advance notice.  This, apparently, was beyond the ability of the
Soviets, but the Germans became adept at it.  That alone, I submit, could
account for the quoted statistics:

> while German artillery inflicted on the order of 70-80% of
> Russian combat casualties, Soviet tubes accounted for only about 50% of German
> losses.

Of course, the nature of the Soviet infantry attack, especially in the
early portion of the war when human waves were common, made it particularly
vulnerable to artillery.  Further, I gather that the Germans did more
defending than attacking, particularly after 1943; if artillery is more
effective on the defense, then it would naturally account for an inflated
percentage of German-inflicted casualties, relative to the Soviets.

Returning, then, to the Western Front, we'd expect to find that the Germans
suffered fewer casualties from artillery, because they spent even less time
attacking.  Whenever we *do* find them attacking, however, it seems that as
often as not they were stopped by artillery.  From the very first
US-German encounter, Kasserine Pass, we find that the arrival of effective
Allied artillery support ended the German advance.  Survivors of the German
counterattacks against the Normandy beachheads speak of units being
decimated by artillery and naval gunfire, and other accounts of smaller
German attacks tell the same story; "We advanced, the artillery hit us, and
those still alive retreated."


Back to Kampfwert numbers:  I'd want to assign my poorest troops to places
where they'd never have to attack, or even be especially mobile.  That
means Italy or the Western Front, and Italy presents other problems.
Conditions in the east were more fluid, and demanded the best troops.

But if I needed to attack in the west, I'd be deathly afraid of the
American and British artillery, and only a combat-toughened unit would do.




I'd hasten to add that other considerations must have entered into the
decision to place poorer units in the West.  Psychologically, fighting on
the Eastern front was much more demanding; the sheer scale of the conflict,
the foreignness of the land, the weather, the stress, all would have been
debilitating to Volksgrenadiers and the like.

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Bill Thacker             AT&T Network Systems       attmail!att!cbemf!wbt
Quality Engineer            Columbus, Ohio              wbt@cbemf.att.com
          "Giving money and power to government is like giving
         whiskey and car keys to teenage boys." - P.J. O'Rourke

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 14 Jul 1993 16:38:33 -0500
From:    "Sidney W. Kitchel" <kitchel@OCTOPUS.DPSI.COM>
Subject: Re: GEN: France late 44

        Sorry to seem a devil's advocate, but history training
sometimes gets in the way:

Mr. Scott Hannon writes:
|->
|-> Bill Thacker writes:
|-> >For the French to claim a significant participation in the liberation of
|-> >their nation simply because they didn't object to our drawing supplies
|-> >through their territory is ridiculous.  They granted virtually the same
|-> >consideration to the Germans in 1940. (*) And to threaten to undermine that
|-> >liberation effort is downright silly; they held themselves hostage.
|-> ...
|-> >(*) While I'll agree that terrorist activities did hamper the operation of
|-> >the French transport system, esp. railroads, from 1940-44, the overall
|-> >effect of said resistance only became signficant in a few cases...
|->
|-> No one makes such a claim. The claim was that the French transport system
|-> was a non-negligable contribution *in addition to the troops*. This is in
|-> the same sense Britain had served as the base of operations for the US
|-> troops, bombers, etc. Was that not a significant contribution?

        I think what I want to know is what "French transport system"
really means. I am interested in knowing the manpower and equipment
involved beyond the passive contribution (or accident) of the roads
and ports.

|-> The supply point seems to have taken off by itself...it is nearly irrelevant.
|-> As France was #2, Britian #3 and US #1 in troops at the front, you'd might
|-> expect the French would get a significant say in devising stategy for said
|-> troops. They did not. Only #1 and #3 made the big decisions, even those with

        Well, it's hard to second guess the folks on the ground at the
time. Maybe we would have made the same decisions, if we had to deal
with De Gaulle and some of the other French leaders. I think the French
were viewed for a long time as in the same category as Poland, the
Netherlands, and other occupied countries.
        I am very intrigued by the #2 vs #3 talk above. Just how did
the French and British stack up in terms of effective fighting
formations and equipment?


|-> The operations of French 1st Army are not well covered in most english
|-> language WW2 histories, so France's contribution beyond 2 DB and the FFI
|-> is generally not recognized. [For example, the US Army in WW2 series does
|-> not cover Dever's 6th Army Group]. That 1st Army was mostly North African

        Considering the amazement caused here among WWII buffs, you
have made a tremendous understatment.

|-> The manpower of the French troops by Jan 1 1945 was much larger than that
|-> of the Poles, or Canadians, New Zealanders, Dutch, etc. About equal to all
|-> of those combined. While half the French units were brand-new ex-FFI units
|-> barely fit for combat, the other half were seasoned veterans, as good or
|-> better than the typical American div (2 DB may have been the best Allied
|-> armored div of the war).

        How could an historian verify this claim??

|-> IMO, France was too important a part of the Allied collition to lock out
|-> of the decision making process in late 1944. The US/UK didn't have to like
|-> them (heck, the French didn't like each other!), but not seeking the input
|-> of a major ally is just plain unwise.

        Could Winnie have been at work here or maybe as alluded above
just the human reaction of people to De Gaulle et al.??

|-> As Alsace was a disputed area (claimed by both France and Germany), the
|-> citizens were considered traitors by the Germans if they acted against
|-> German interest. [BTW, the French had much the same policy. They executed
|-> many Alsatians serving in the German military]. The whole area was deeply
|-> divided...there would be no shortage of finger-pointers. The French were
|-> thus deeply concerned about the region returning to the Germans/Gestapo.

        Confusion by outsiders can still occur. Many Alsatian families
still speak German at home and French in public.

                                                        --Sid
--
Sidney W. Kitchel           kitchel@cs.indiana.edu, kitchel@dpsi.com
Data Parallel Systems, Inc.  ============||  DPSI  ||===============
4617 E. Morningside Drive                             (812) 334-8100
Bloomington, Indiana,  47408  USA               FAX:  (812) 334-8121

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 14 Jul 1993 17:44:00 EST
From:    Han Solo <081689614@UCIS.VILL.EDU>
Subject: Re: GEN: France late 44

        O.k.  I've been reading the 'France in WW2' letters and I think I'd
like to throw in my 2 cents.  The last letter I read mentioned that Ike
made a purely military decision instead of acknowledging a political reality.
I'd like to comment on this first.

        How were people to know what the 'political reality' in France was??
You said yourself that the French 'didn't like the French'.  There was a
deep division.  The French government FOR YEARS had collaborated with the
enemy.  They hadn't been a military factor in the war since the very
beginning, and even then, they were insignificant.  I realize that before
the war there were many political and social problems in France, and their
defenceshad really suffered.The point is, who ran the show for the Allies
in the west from '39 to '44?  Obviously the US/UK.  The French were so divided
as '44 went on, that the US/UK couldn't rely on any "leader" of France.  You
had "Chuckles" running around following the American forces declaring each
new town or city as "Free French" just after the Americans liberated it! How
could he be a viable leader?!?!  I don't see it.  Ike ran the show, and I
think he was the best man for the job, and he made the best decisions.  I
know that you weren't really saying he wasn't, but I just wanted to say that.

        I also think that probably the 4th Armored Division in Patton's
3rd Army was the best Allied Armor Division.  The 4th was the spearhead in
the relief of Bastogne.


                                                Don

------------------------------

End of WWII-L Digest - 13 Jul 1993 to 14 Jul 1993
*************************************************

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There are 4 messages totalling 388 lines in this issue.

Topics of the day:

  1. USAAF 15 JUL 43
  2. GEN: France late 44 (2)
  3. ok

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 15 Jul 1993 07:18:56 -0400
From:    jem3@CC.BELLCORE.COM
Subject: USAAF 15 JUL 43

COMBAT CHRONOLOGY OF THE US ARMY AIR FORCES
THURSDAY, 15 JULY 1943
FTP SITES
  1. ftp.rutgers.edu in directory pub/wwii/usaf
  2. byrd.mu.wvnet.edu (129.71.32.152) in pub/history/military/airforce/
     wwii_chronology

AIRCRAFT MENTIONED IN THIS REPORT:
  B-24, Consolidated Liberator
  B-25, North American Mitchell
  L-4, Piper Cub
  L-5, Stinson Sentinel
  P-38, Lockheed Lightning
  P-39, Bell Airacobra
  P-40, Curtiss
  Wellington, Vickers (RAF)
  Zeke, Mitsubishi A6M, Navy Type 0 Carrier Fighter

AMERICAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  ALASKA (Eleventh Air Force)
    In the Aleutian Islands, 1 B-24 and 2 P-39's fly reconnaissance over
Kiska and Segula Islands. 9 B-24's and 14 B-25's bomb Kiska Island
targets including AA batteries at North Head, Jeff Cove and Gertrude
Cove. Fires are started. 1 bomber turns back with 3 engines and jettisons
bombs, another crashes on return. AA fire damages a B-25.

CHINA-BURMA-INDIA THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  BURMA-INDIA (Tenth Air Force)
    The 71st Liaison Squadron is activated at Ondal, India, assigned to
the Tenth Air Force. The squadron will be equipped with L-4's and L-5's
and enter combat in Oct 43.

MEDITERRANEAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  EASTERN MEDITERRANEAN (Ninth Air Force)
    B-24's strike the main airfield and 2 satellite fields at Foggia,
Italy.  In Sicily, B-25's bomb Palermo, Cape Gallo, Salina Island, and
Cape Zifferano; and P-40's patrol over the Licata area.

  WESTERN MEDITERRANEAN (Northwest African Air Force)
    During the night of 14/16 Jul, Wellingtons of the Northwest African
Strategic Air Force (NASAF) hit airfields and docks at Naples, Italy
while Northwest African Tactical Air Force (NATAF) light and medium
bombers bomb Palermo, Sicily and fly armored reconnaissance, attacking
roads and convoys, over extensive areas of Sicily. During the day, NASAF
medium bombers bomb Vibo Valentia, Sicily, while heavy bombers hit Villa
San Giovanni, Italy. NASAF fighters fly numerous strafing and bombing
missions against trains, road junctions, radar installations, truck
convoys, railway stations, and targets of opportunity throughout Sicily.
Northwest African Coastal Air Force (NACAF) airplanes fly sea patrols,
reconnaissance, convoy escort, and hit shipping off the W coast of
Corsica and E coast of Sardinia.

SOUTH PACIFIC THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Thirteenth Air Force)
  In the Solomon Islands, B-25's, P-40's, and P-38's strafe 2 barges NE
of Ganongga Island, leaving them sinking. A large enemy force, estimated
at 27 bombers and 40-50 Zekes, is intercepted over Vella Lavella Island
by USAAF and other Allied fighters, which claim 15 bombers and 30 Zekes
destroyed, against 3 losses.

SOUTHWEST PACIFIC THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Fifth Air Force)
  In New Guinea, A-20's hit positions along the Orodubi-Komiatum Track.

SOURCES:
AIR FORCE COMBAT UNITS OF WORLD WAR II, Office of Air Force History,
  Headquarters USAF, 1961, ISBN 0-912799-02-1
COMBAT SQUADRONS OF THE AIR FORCE, WORLD WAR II, Office of Air Force
  History, Headquarters USAF 1982
THE ARMY AIR FORCES IN WORLD WAR II: COMBAT CHRONOLOGY, 1941-1945 by the
  Office of Air Force History, Headquarters USAF, 1973
THE MIGHTY EIGHTH WAR DIARY by Roger A. Freeman, ISBN 1-85409-071-2

Jack McKillop
USAF (Airways and Air Communications Service)
1955-59

----------------------------------------------------------------------
|  Jack McKillop      |  Those who have long enjoyed such privileges |
|  Bellcore           |  as we enjoy forget in time that men have    |
|  Piscataway, NJ     |  died to win them.     FDR                   |
|  USA                |  jem3@cc.bellcore.com                        |
----------------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 15 Jul 1993 10:09:28 EDT
From:    "William B. Thacker" <wbt@CBEMF.ATT.COM>
Subject: Re: GEN: France late 44

> As France was #2, Britian #3 and US #1 in troops at the front, you'd might
> expect the French would get a significant say in devising stategy for said
> troops. They did not.

Which was form for the time.  The Indians, New Zealanders, South Africans,
and Australians probably lodged the same complaint at the times they
outnumbered the British in the 8th Army.  Number of troops isn't the only,
or even best, measure of war contribution.

For example, the British fleet was a major asset throughout the war;
without it, the war would have been lost.  The French fleet... well, it
shot at us when we launched Op. Torch, so I guess you could say it was a
negative contribution to the Allies.

Then there was the RAF, who provided air cover and strategic bombing
through '44 and '45.  The French equivalent?  Well, there was a French
squadron flying for the Germans earlier in the war, in the Middle East, I
guess.  More seriously, I'm sure there must have been a few French
squadrons, but how much did they help?

Strategic bases?  OK, the French can't be blamed for not owning anything as
important as Gibraltar.  Still, we put more work into helping de Gaulle
occupy more useless chunks of Vichy turf...  Madagascar, even.  We didn't
need these places, but de Gaulle did, and we had to help take them to gain
his cooperation.  And the Vichy troops guarding the French Mediterranean
coast and French North Africa freed up dozens of German divisions for
killing Russians.

And of course, while Britain bankrupted herself producing war materiel, and
the US stretched its economy to the limit, France did not.  Her position
was no different from that of Poland; conquered, she could provide nothing
but manpower and a sleazy government-in-exile.  As the saying goes, beggars
can't be choosers.  Having seen the results of French strategic planning in
1940, I think we were wise to ignore de Gaulle as often as possible.

Quite frankly, after their collaboration with the Germans, the French
should be happy we didn't just consider them enemies and install an
entirely new government at gunpoint.

> IMO, France was too important a part of the Allied collition to lock out
> of the decision making process in late 1944. The US/UK didn't have to like
> them (heck, the French didn't like each other!), but not seeking the input
> of a major ally is just plain unwise.

Any my point is that, despite the manpower provided, France wasn't a major
ally.  There were nowhere near being in Britain's league in terms of total
contribution to the war effort.  The French Army sided with the Germans
until it was obvious they were going to lose, then threw in with the
Allies.

> Also, Strasbourg was an important city to the French people (taking 2nd
> place only to Paris)...in large part as a symbol of resistance to Germany.
> To abandon this symbol to the Germans without a fight would be viewed as
> a major disgrace...something that might so damage the prestige of de Gaulle
> that his shakey gov't would probably collapse and lead to civil unrest (if
> not civil war).

The exact same concerns were voiced regarding Kiev, Kharkov, and
Stalingrad.  At Kharkov, Hitler ordered the SS Panzer Korps to defend the
city to the last bullet; fortunately for the Wehrmacht, Hausser disobeyed
that order.  Even since the war the Germans have been ridiculed for
Hitler's "we have to hold this city at any cost" approach; why should that
argument be any more credible coming from de Gaulle?

I don't know the French people.  It's difficult to believe that the people
who declared Paris an open city and quietly went along with the Armistice
in 1940 would revolt over the temporary loss of Strasbourg.

> De Gaulle agreed that from a military perspective Eisenhowers plan made
> sense, but from a practical viewpoint it was *out of the question*. The
> potential cost in French lives and civil unrest was just too great.

Sounds to me like the issue wasn't the loss to France, but the loss to de
Gaulle.  France would have survived the civil unrest, but de Gaulle would
have been history.


In the event, we held Strasbourg and won the battle.  Had that gone the
other way and the Allies suffered a bloody defeat, Ike would have been
rightly ridiculed for listening to de Gaulle, and history might have
painted de Gaulle as the villain for risking thousands of lives for his own
political interests.

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Bill Thacker             AT&T Network Systems       attmail!att!cbemf!wbt
Quality Engineer            Columbus, Ohio              wbt@cbemf.att.com

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 15 Jul 1993 16:35:32 EDT
From:    Walter_O'Hara_at_SPAWAR-MC1@SMTP-GW.SPAWAR.NAVY.MIL
Subject: ok

          ok

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 15 Jul 1993 18:43:36 -0400
From:    "Mr. Scott Hannon" <hannon@UMBC.EDU>
Subject: Re: GEN: France late 44

Yet more of the thread that won't die...   :^)

me:
>> As France was #2, Britian #3 and US #1 in troops at the front, you might
>> expect the French would get a significant say in devising stategy for said
>> troops. They did not.

Bill:
>Which was form for the time.  The Indians, New Zealanders, South Africans,
>and Australians probably lodged the same complaint at the times they
>outnumbered the British in the 8th Army.  Number of troops isn't the only,
>or even best, measure of war contribution.

True, numbers are not everything, but:
 The above allies were all part of the Commonwealth
 They were not fighting on their homeland
 While their advice might be ignored, it was heard and considered.

Note that Australia behaved much the same as France WRT Alsace when Britain
seemed to be ignoring their interests. They pulled their troops out of north
Africa and told the British where they could file their complaints.

>[The French fleet]...was a negative contribution to the Allies.
>[France had few strategic bases of use to the allies]
>[France's economy didn't help the allies]

Agreed. Britain was a more important partner in the war than France.
Even in 1945.

I was speaking purely of the situation present around Jan 1, 1945, WRT
combat along the western front. Things had changed. Things like Gibralter,
strategic bombers, and a big UK navy no longer mattered much WRT finishing
the defeat of Germany. Troops to clear and occupy Germany were what was
needed.

I'm not saying that France should've replaced the UK as the US's main
partner, nor had a significant say in overall war stategy. Just that they
should not have been almost completely locked out from those decisions
directly affecting both their nation and their troops. The allies had not
only not consulted the French about abandoning Alsace, they had not even
informed them of the decision. The French were supposed to find out about
it when it happened.

Ike's withdrawl order was made against the advice of 6th Army Group's
commander, Devers, who wanted to hold. In fact, he delayed implementing
the order so much so that Ike was quite angry with him.

This crisis came as rather a surprise to those concerned, as usually
Eisenhower was quite adept at considering the political and national
interests at work in collition warfare. Here, he just screwed up IMO.
My guess is he was too preoccupied in recovering US prestige after the
Bulge disaster to give the Alsace matter much thought. "I like Ike",
but here I think he erred.

>Then there was the RAF, who provided air cover and strategic bombing
>through '44 and '45.  The French equivalent?

Yes, the French operated there own tactical airforce by Jan 1, '45. It
supported 1st French Army. I forget how many squadrons...about a dozen?
But no stategic bomber force.

>Madagascar [,etc]...We didn't need these places, but de Gaulle did.

I thought Madagascar had more to with anti-Japan strategy than pleasing
de Gaulle. But I may well be wrong.

Don't underplay the political value of having a slice of national territory
upon which to set up a gov't-in-exile. The Japanese 1944 U-Go offensive in
Burma was in large part based on a desire to grab a worthless slice of India
upon which to set up Bose and his anti-British gov't-in-exile. Bose too had
the "de" gaul to declare co-belligerence status for his small Nat Lib Army :-)

>Having seen the results of French strategic planning in
>1940, I think we were wise to ignore de Gaulle as often as possible.

Yes, 1940 was a disaster, but not of de Gaulle's making.
For some sarcasm, replace "French" with "US", "1940" with "1941",
and "de Gaulle" with "Eisenhower".   :-)

As Devers agreed with de Gaulle about Alsace, a decision to stay and fight
would not have reflected purely "French strategic planning".

>Quite frankly, after their collaboration with the Germans, the French
>should be happy we didn't just consider them enemies and install an
>entirely new government at gunpoint.

Fair enough, if that is restricted to known collaborators and not the
average people.

And the Vichy were not exactly pro-Axis except for few genuine pro-axis
leaders..Laval as you've mentioned, but not Petain as a counterexample.
Most seemed to just be trying to keep as much of France and its territories
intact as possible...at the cost of honor and decency. This issue is still
sensitive in France I'm told (pragmatists or traitors).

>my point is that, despite the manpower provided, France wasn't a major
>ally.  They were nowhere near being in Britain's league in terms of total
>contribution to the war effort.

I agree about the total contribution. But by 1945 France had what the western
allies most needed to finish the war against Germany: manpower in ground
troops. In that sense, they were a major ETO ally in '45, IMO.

>It's difficult to believe that the people
>who declared Paris an open city and quietly went along with the Armistice
>in 1940 would revolt over the temporary loss of Strasbourg.

It was a very different situation. The allies could not save Paris in 1940;
the only decision to make was how to lose it. Many belligerents when faced
with this choice opt for an open city.

The situation in Alsace in early 1945 was very different.
1) Strasbourg was recaptured by the French (2 DB). It was French blood split
  liberating the city. To have the US turn it over to the Germans without a
  fight (and not allow the French to try and defend it themselves) would mean
  all those lives were lost in vain. Very bad for French morale (already low).
2) Abandoning Alsace/Strasbourg was a *choice* (unlike Paris in 1940), made
  so that operations in other sectors of the front wouldn't be hampered (the
  reduction of the Bulge). There was little question of being unable to stop
  Nordwind if the allies wanted to.

Devers thought (correctly) he could do a good job of stopping (or at least
slowing) the Germans without needing a lot of help. The French agreed with
Devers; together 6th Army Group could make a good show of defending Alsace.
Abandoning Alsace might well lead to political disaster because all France
would known:
   US/UK/allies ignores French concerns...they can't be trusted
   De Gaulle is a wimp and incompetent for allowing this to happen
This may have been excuse enough for many disgruntled ex-partisans and their
political backers to start civil unrest. De Gaulle would fall as the last
unifying force in France. Vichy vs communist vs Gaullists vs this click vs
that click. Chaos. France was a mess barely being held together by de Gaulle
and it wouldn't take a lot to shatter. It was more than his ego speaking
when de Gaulle talked about himself being France.

I am only vaguely familiar with French politics of the time, so I am unfit
to make any reasonable judgement about the true likelyness of the Alsace
withdrawl leading to civil unrest. But those few opinions I've read suggest
it was likely.

Political chaos would likely lead to some French army mutinies and other
civil unrest. The French could no longer continue as major active combatant
against Germany as most of the army would be needed to supress rebellions.
[Yeah, this is heading off into unsupported speculation, but...]
This would mean the US/UK/allies would have to take over 100+ miles of new
(ex-French manned) front...there's a drain of a ~10 divs. Plus the rear
area in France will need some garrisoning to protect allied supply lines,
bases, etc...there's another few divs. Suddenly the US/UK/allies are facing
the Germans along a longer front with a lose of ~15 divs and unsecure
supply lines to boot. Not good.

This is mentioned in a none too convincing fashion in Charles Whiting's
book _Operation Norwind_ of a couple years ago. I was inclined to dismiss
it as hype, but furthur readings about the military side of things do seem
to suggest its not as crazy as it sounds. I do think its rather a worst
case scenario, but not pure fantasy.

---
And in another message...
[No more talk about "the French transport system", please :-) ]

Sidney asks:
>Just how did the French and British stack up in terms of effective fighting
>formations and equipment?

As I've mentioned, most French units (after 1943) were clones of American
formations: much the same structure, training, and equipment. Thus its easier
to compare US - French effectiveness than French - British. In general terms
the UK army (ie excludes India, NZ, Canada, etc) was pretty much in decline
by late '44. Too many casualties that could no longer be made good. They
were starting to cannibalize to maintain effectiveness (disband a div and
redistribute the troops as replacements for other divs).

While the north African contingent of the French army (which was the main
fighting part in late '44) was also in decline, the Euro-France portion
was fast growing, so in numbers the French army as a whole was growing.
By the end of the year, the UK and France had roughly the same size army
deployed against the Germans. In terms of quality, the UK maintained a
slight edge (due to all those new/green French ex-FFI units).

Where to substantiate this? This whole thread started with my whining about
the lack of an easily available good book on this subject. If you are a
wargamer, a game covering the fall of Germany shoul at least point out
the who had what where aspects. As for an concise operational book, you're
out of luck (unless you happen to find de Lattre's book from the '50s).

[BTW, it was Churchill who cleared up the crisis between de Gaulle and Ike]

Scott.

------------------------------

End of WWII-L Digest - 14 Jul 1993 to 15 Jul 1993
*************************************************

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Status: O

There is one message totalling 20 lines in this issue.

Topics of the day:

  1. HOME: US (Spy Plane II) ~#

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date:    Sat, 17 Jul 1993 02:06:00 -0400
From:    "Helena M. Menezes 30935" <HMENEZES@WORLDBANK.ORG>
Subject: HOME: US (Spy Plane II) ~#

          In reference to my first message regarding a "possible" spy plane
          operating in American territory during World War II, the
          following is the complement:

          The Brazilian steamship, "Buarque," was torpedoed by the U-432 on
          February 15th, 1942 (00:45 hrs - estimated position: 36-13-00N
          latitude and 74-58-00 longitude.

          Thank you very much for your time and help.

          Please answer to:
          Claudio Braga
          HMENEZES@WORLDBANK.ORG@INTERNET (my wife's address)

------------------------------

End of WWII-L Digest - 15 Jul 1993 to 16 Jul 1993
*************************************************

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There is one message totalling 14 lines in this issue.

Topics of the day:

  1. <No subject given>

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date:    Sat, 17 Jul 1993 08:59:43 EST
From:    Mark Spadafore <Mark_Spadafore@LPL.ORG>
Subject: <No subject given>

SIGNOFF Mark Spadafore
--
 Views expressed in this posting are those of the individual author only.
==========================================================================
Liverpool Public Library     |                      voice - 315.457.0310
310 Tulip Street             |                        fax - 315.453.7867
Liverpool, NY 13088-4997     |    (return email address found in header)

------------------------------

End of WWII-L Digest - 16 Jul 1993 to 17 Jul 1993
*************************************************

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Subject:  WWII-L Digest - 17 Jul 1993 to 18 Jul 1993
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There are 2 messages totalling 35 lines in this issue.

Topics of the day:

  1. KOHL VERSUS MITTERAND
  2. WWII-L Digest - 16 Jul 1993 to 17 Jul 1993

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date:    Sun, 18 Jul 1993 10:41:34 +0200
From:    John Ausland <d_ausland_j@KARI.UIO.NO>
Subject: KOHL VERSUS MITTERAND

  Oslo, July 18.  I have just returned to Oslo from the US, where I
attended a reunion of the 4th Infantry Division in Washington, DC.
When reading the International Herald Tribunes which had gathered, I
found a story saying that Kohl wanted to be invited to the June 6
events next year.  According to this story, French and American
officials were negative.  That the French are unenthusiastic does
not surprise me, but I have been unable thus far to get a statement
regarding the US position.
  K and M are meeting in Bonn on Tuesday and may discuss this question.
  I would be interested in getting the views of users of this list.
Should or should not Kohl be invited?  What are the pros and cons?
  Regards, John Ausland

------------------------------

Date:    Sun, 18 Jul 1993 12:56:00 EDT
From:    ROBERT GANNON <RHG@PSUVM.BITNET>
Subject: Re: WWII-L Digest - 16 Jul 1993 to 17 Jul 1993

I see your address as the Liverpool Public Library.  I wonder if you
know of a directory of public libraries.  There are such directories
of university libraries, of course, but I've never heard of one for
non-academic libraries.  Thanks.
======================================================================
Robert Gannon              |  Bitnet:    RHG@PSUVM
35 Burrowes Bldg.          |  Internet:  RHG@PSUVM.PSU.EDU
Penn State                 |  Phone:     814 355-4800 or 355-0943
University Park, PA 16802  |  Fax:       814 863-7285

------------------------------

End of WWII-L Digest - 17 Jul 1993 to 18 Jul 1993
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Subject:  WWII-L Digest - 18 Jul 1993 to 19 Jul 1993
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There are 8 messages totalling 645 lines in this issue.

Topics of the day:

  1. USAAF 16-19 JUL 43
  2. L-4, Piper Cub or Grasshopper? (2)
  3. The Divine Wind blows strongly...
  4. GEN: Friendly Fire (2)
  5. KOHL VERSUS MITTERAND
  6. REF: Int'l Military Encyclopedia, etc.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 19 Jul 1993 07:17:21 -0400
From:    jem3@CC.BELLCORE.COM
Subject: USAAF 16-19 JUL 43

COMBAT CHRONOLOGY OF THE US ARMY AIR FORCES
FRIDAY, 16 JULY 1943
FTP SITES
  1. ftp.rutgers.edu in directory pub/wwii/usaf
  2. byrd.mu.wvnet.edu (129.71.32.152) in pub/history/military/airforce/
     wwii_chronology

AIRCRAFT MENTIONED IN THIS REPORT:
  B-17, Boeing Flying Fortress
  B-24, Consolidated Liberator
  B-25, North American Mitchell
  B-26, Martin Marauder
  Beaufighter, Bristol
  Wellington, Vickers (RAF)

EUROPEAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Eighth Air Force)
  VIII Air Support Command Mission Number 1: 16 B-26B's are dispatched
against the marshalling yard at Abbeville, France; 14 hit the target at
2000 hours; 10 aircraft are damaged; casualties are 2 WIA. With this mis-
sion, the VIII Air Support Command begins combat operations, having
acquired the 322d, 323d, 386th, and 387th Bombardment Groups (Medium).

MEDITERRANEAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  EASTERN MEDITERRANEAN (Ninth Air Force)
    B-24's attack Bari Airfield, Italy; enemy fighters attack persistently
and 3 B-24's are shot down; they claim 11 fighters destroyed in combat.
B-25's bomb Randazzo and Valguarnera, Sicily. Royal Air Force (RAF) heavy
bombers hit Reggio di Calabria Airfield, Italy.
    HQ 79th Fighter Group transfers from Tunisia to Sicily.

  WESTERN MEDITERRANEAN (Northwest African Air Force)
    During the night of 15/16 Jul, Northwest African Strategic Air Force
(NASAF) Wellingtons bomb the dock, marshalling yards, and airfields at
Vibo Valentia, Sicily and Crotone, Reggio di Calabria, and Villa San
Giovanni, Italy, while Northwest African Tactical Air Force (NATAF) light
and medium bombers carry out numerous missions against Randazzo, Sicily
and roads in Sicily. During the day NATAF fighters, light and medium
bombers bomb Valguarnera, Sicily and targets of opportunity in north
central Sicily.
    On the ground in Sicily, British troops establish a bridgehead across
the Simeto River.
    The ground echelon of the 111th Reconnaissance Squadron (Fighter),
68th Reconnaissance Group, transfers from Tunis, Tunisia to Ponte Olivo,
Sicily joining the air echelon which arrived on Tuesday.
    The air echelon of the 414th Night Fighter Squadron, 2d Air Defense
Wing, which has been training in England with Beaufighters, joins the
ground echelon at Rerhaia, Algeria. The squadron will enter combat on 24
Jul.

SOUTH PACIFIC THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Thirteenth Air Force)
  In the Solomon Islands 30+ B-24's and B-17's pound Kahili Airfield
on Bougainville Island. In the Buin, Bougainville Island-Faisi Island
area, 7 B-24's join 70+ US Navy dive bombers and 100+ USAAF, Royal
New Zealand Air Force (RNZAF), US Navy, and US Marine Corps fighters in
an attack on shipping. Allied airplanes claim 40+ aircraft destroyed
or damaged; 7 vessels, including a destroyer, are sunk.

SOUTHWEST PACIFIC THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Fifth Air Force)
  A single B-24 bombs forces at MacDonald's Junction, New Guinea. Royal
Australian Air Force (RAAF) airplanes hit positions to the SW.

SATURDAY, 17 JULY 1943

AIRCRAFT MENTIONED IN THIS REPORT:
  B-17, Boeing Flying Fortress
  B-18, Douglas Bolo.
  B-24, Consolidated Liberator
  B-25, North American Mitchell
  B-26, Martin Marauder
  B-40, Boeing Flying Fortress
  L-4, Piper Cub
  L-5, Stinson Sentinel
  P-39, Bell Airacobra
  P-40, Curtiss
  Zeke, Mitsubishi A6M, Navy Type 0 Carrier Fighter

AMERICAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  ANTISUBMARINE WARFARE (AAF Antisubmarine Command)
    The 7th Antisubmarine Squadron (Heavy), 26th Antisubmarine Wing, based
at Jacksonville Municipal Airport, Florida with B-18's but operating from
Edinburgh Field, Trinidad, ceases flying ASW missions.

CHINA-BURMA-INDIA THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  BURMA-INDIA (Tenth Air Force)
    The 71st Liaison Squadron, Tenth Air Force, transfers from Ondal,
India to Ramgarh, India and begins training with L-4's and L-5's.

EUROPEAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Eighth Air Force)
  VIII Bomber Command Mission Number 74: The two primary targets are the
rail industry at Hannover, Germany and the aviation industry at Hamburg,
Germany. Both missions are recalled due to weather but the bombers hit
three targets, i.e.:
    1. 205 B-17's and 2 YB-40's are dispatched against Hannover; 33 hit
targets of opportunity; they claim 32-7-3 Luftwaffe aircraft; 1 B-17 is
lost, 2 are damaged beyond repair and 50 are damaged; casualties are 1
KIA, 9 WIA and 3 MIA.
    2. 125 B-17's are dispatched against Hamburg; 1 hits a convoy and 21
attempt to bomb the Fokker plant at Amsterdam, The Netherlands which is
obscured by clouds; the target is missed and 150 civilians are killed;
they claim 28-9-33 Luftwaffe aircraft; 1 B-17 is lost, 1 is damaged
beyond repair and 41 are damaged; casualties are 1 KIA, 3 WIA and 14 MIA.
  VIII Air Support Command Mission Nubmer 2: B-26's fly a diversion to
the Cayeux, France area.

MEDITERRANEAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  EASTERN MEDITERRANEAN (Ninth Air Force)
    About 80 B-24's bomb the Naples, Italy marshalling yard in face of
fierce fighter opposition; 1 B-24 is shot down and several are damaged;
they claim 23 fighters destroyed in combat. In Sicily, B-25's hit Catania
and the rail yards and roads at Paterno; and P-40's fly escort to Gela
and Comiso. Royal Air Force (RAF) heavy bombers hit Reggio di Calabria,
Italy.
    The 87th Fighter Squadron, 79th Fighter Group, transfers with P-40's
from Malta to Sicily.

  WESTERN MEDITERRANEAN (Northwest African Air Force)
    In Sicily during the night of 16/17 Jul and the following day North-
west African Tactical Air Force (NATAF) fighters, light and medium
bombers, hit Catania, Paterno, the Riposto railroad station, and targets
of opportunity (vehicles, tanks, trains, guns). During the day, 200+
B-25's, B-26's, and B-17's bomb Naples, Italy, concentrating on the
marshalling yard.
    On the ground in Sicily, the US 45th and 1st Infantry Divisions cross
the Salso River S and E of Caltanissetta. The British 30 Corps expands
the Simeto River bridgehead and drives toward Catania in the coastal
sector while 51 Division crosses the Simeto River and reaches to within
10 miles (16 km) of Paterno.
    HQ 350th Fighter Group and it's 345th Fighter Squadron transfer with
P-39's from Maison Blance, Algeria to Rerhaia, Algeria.

SOUTH PACIFIC THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Thirteenth Air Force)
  In the Solomon Islands, 7 B-24's and 70+ US Navy and Marine Corps
airplanes, escorted by 100+ USAAF and Allied fighters, attack shipping
off Buin, Bougainville Island. The B-24's claim hits on 2 cargo vessels,
and the dive bombers claim serious damage of 3 destroyers, a patrol ship,
an oiler, a merchant ship, and the 2 cargo vessels. In the air battle,
Allied aircraft claim 40+ Zekes and at least 4 float planes shot down;
5 Allied airplanes are lost.
  The 75th Bombardment Squadron (Medium), 42d Bombardment Group (Medium),
which has been operating from New Caledonia Island with B-25's, returns
to it's base on Guadalcanal Island.

SOUTHWEST PACIFIC THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Fifth Air Force)
  During the night of 17/l8 Jul, B-25's bomb Lautem on Timor Island while
B-24's bomb Adaoet Island in the Moluccas Islands. In New Guinea during
the day, B-25's pound the airfield, Army HQ and defensive positions, and
the general area in and around Salamaua as Allied forces from the Nassau
Bay-Mubo area begin a drive on Salamaua; the drive is a secondary effort
designed to divert enemy attention from a subsequent Allied campaign to
secure the Markham River Valley and Huon Peninsula and thus gain control
of Vitiaz Strait and Dampier Strait.

SUNDAY, 18 JULY 1943

AIRCRAFT MENTIONED IN THIS REPORT:
  A-20, Douglas Havoc
  A-36, North American Apache
  B-24, Consolidated Liberator
  B-25, North American Mitchell
  P-38, Lockheed Lightning
  P-40, Curtiss
  Wellington, Vickers (RAF)

AMERICAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  ALASKA (Eleventh Air Force)
    In the Aleutian Islands, 2 B-24's and 6 B-25's bomb Gertrude Cove and
Main Camp on Kiska Island. 6 B-24's bomb shipping targets between Paramu-
shiru Island and Shimushu Island in the Kurile Islands and completed
runway at Murakami Bay on Paramushiru Island, which is also photographed.
They observe fires among buildings S and E of this runway. Some of the
observed aircraft take to the air and vainly pursue the attackers.

CENTRAL PACIFIC THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Seventh Air Force)
  6 B-24's, flying out of Funafuti Island in the Ellice Islands, bomb
Betio Island, Tarawa Atoll in the Gilbert Islands.  Japanese bombers
raiding Canton Island in the Phoenix Islands are forced to jettison their
bombs at sea because of intense AA and fighter defense.

CHINA-BURMA-INDIA THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  CHINA (Fourteenth Air Force)
    7 B-24's bomb shipping at Haiphong and Hongay, French Indochina.

MEDITERRANEAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  EASTERN MEDITERRANEAN (Ninth Air Force)
    B-25's bomb Randazzo and Catania, Sicily.
    The 85th and 86th Fighter Squadrons, 79th Fighter Group, transfer
with P-40's from Malta to Sicily.

  WESTERN MEDITERRANEAN (Northwest African Air Force)
    During the night of 17/18 Jul, Northwest African Strategic Air Force
(NASAF) Wellingtons bomb airfields at Montecorvino, Sicily and Pomiglian-
o, Italy, while Northwest African Tactical Air Force (NATAF) light
bombers bomb Catania, Sicily and carry out reconnaissance of extensive
areas of Sicily. During the day, NATAF A-36's hit Santa Caterina, Adrano,
Lercara, and Termini Imerese, Sicily.
    On the ground in Sicily, the US Seventh Army makes rapid progress
against light opposition. The British Eighth Army continues their advance,
but 13 Corps continues to meet strong resistance near Catania.
    HQ 27th Bombardment Group (Ligth) and it's 16th, 17th and 91st
Bombardment Squadrons (Light) transfer with A-36's from Korba, Tunisia to
Sicily. The 27th will be redesignated the 27th Fighter-Bomber Group on 23
Aug 43; the 16, 17th and 91st will be redesignated the 522d, 523d and
524th Fighter-Bomber Squadrons respectively.
    HQ 33d Fighter Group transfers from Pantelleria Island in the Medi-
terranean to Licata, Sicily.

SOUTH PACIFIC THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Thirteenth Air Force)
  In the Solomon Islands, 21 B-24's, 20+ P-40's and P-38's, and 140+ US
Navy and Marine Corps dive bombers and fighters thoroughly blast the
Kahili area on Bougainville Island; 15 B-24's concentrate on the air-
field; many AA positions are attacked, as are revetments and runways.
Hits are claimed on 2 destroyers, and a light craft is sunk. The Allied
airplanes claim 21 fighters shot down; 9 US US Navy aircraft are lost. A
B-25 off New Georgia Island strafes a motor launch.

SOUTHWEST PACIFIC THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Fifth Air Force)
  During the night of 18/19 Jul, B-24's bomb the harbor area at Makassar
on Celebes Island. In New Guinea, several B-25's, a B-24, and an A-20 bomb
and strafe Lokanu, Boisi, Tambu Peninsula, Dot Island, Salamaua, and
Komiatum as US forces secure the S headland of Tambu Bay for a supply
base. Other B-25's attack barges and shipping off New Britain Island in
the Bismarck Archipelago sinking a small cargo vessel off Cape Kwoi.

MONDAY, 19 JULY 1943

AIRCRAFT MENTIONED IN THIS REPORT:
  A-24, Douglas Dauntless
  A-36, North American Apache
  B-17, Boeing Flying Fortress
  B-24, Consolidated Liberator
  B-25, North American Mitchell
  B-26, Martin Marauder
  Boston, Douglas (RAAF)
  C-47, Douglas Skytrain
  P-40, Curtiss
  P-51, North American Mustang
  Spitfire, Vickers Supermarine
  Wellington, Vickers (RAF)

AMERICAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  ALASKA (Eleventh Air Force)
    The 633d, 634th and 635th Bombardment Squadrons (Dive), 407th
Bombardment Group (Dive), based at Drew Field, Tampa, Florida begin
operating from Amchitka Island in the Aleutian Islands with A-24's. The
squadron will fly combat missions 4-13 Aug.

  ANTISUBMARINE WARFARE (AAF Antisubmarine Command)
    The 14th Antisubmarine Squadron (Heavy), 25th Antisubmarine Wing, based
at Camp Edward Army Air Field, Falmouth, Massachusetts, begins operating
from Langley Field, Hampton, Virginia with B-24's.

CHINA-BURMA-INDIA THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  BURMA-INDIA (Tenth Air Force)
    B-25's damage the approaches to the Shweli, Burma road bridge.

  CHINA (Fourteenth Air Force)
    4 B-24's attack cement works at Haiphong, French Indochina.

MEDITERRANEAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  EASTERN MEDITERRANEAN (Ninth Air Force)
    100+ B-24's attack the Littoria, Italy marshalling yards and nearby
airfield. On the return flight railroads at Orlando, Sicily and Anzio,
Italy are bombed. B-25's hit Catania and Randazzo, Sicily. P-40's escort
C-47's.
    The 64th, 65th and 66th Fighter Squadrons, 57th Fighter Group,
transfer with P-40's from Malta to Sicily.

  WESTERN MEDITERRANEAN (Northwest African Air Force)
    During the night of 18/19 Jul, Wellingtons drop over 800,000 leaflets
on Rome, Italy. Northwest African Tactical Air Force (NATAF) light
bombers attack Catania, Sicily. During the following day, about 150
Northwest African Strategic Air Force (NASAF) B-17's bomb the Rome, Italy
railroad yards; B-25's and B-26's hit nearby Ciampino Airfield, Italy;
P-40's bomb rail facilities in the Alcamo, Sicily area; and NATAF A-36's
attack trains and motor transport in W Sicily.
    On the ground in Sicily, the US Seventh Army continues to push N and
NW while the British Eighth Army's 13 Corps still faces firm resistance
near Catania.
    The 111th Reconnaissance Squadron (Fighter), 68th Reconnaissance
Group, transfers with P-51's from Ponte Olivo, Sicily to Gela, Sicily.
    The 308th Fighter Squadron, 31st Fighter Group, transfers with
Spitfires from Ponte Olivo, Sicily to Agrigento, Sicily.

SOUTH PACIFIC THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Thirteenth Air Force)
  In the Solomon Islands, B-17's bomb Kahili Airfield on Bougainville
Island. B-17's and B-25's hit the airfield on Ballale Island. B-25's in
support of ground forces hit positions in the Bairoko battle area on New
Georgia Island where enemy resistance is fierce.

SOUTHWEST PACIFIC THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Fifth Air Force)
  In New Guinea, a B-25 bombs a bridge over the mouth of the Francisco
River; a B-17 hits Finschhafen Airfield; and Royal Australian Air Force
(RAAF) Bostons attack a gun position at Komiatum and a military camp at
Erskine Creek.

SOURCES:
AIR FORCE COMBAT UNITS OF WORLD WAR II, Office of Air Force History,
  Headquarters USAF, 1961, ISBN 0-912799-02-1
COMBAT SQUADRONS OF THE AIR FORCE, WORLD WAR II, Office of Air Force
  History, Headquarters USAF 1982
THE ARMY AIR FORCES IN WORLD WAR II: COMBAT CHRONOLOGY, 1941-1945 by the
  Office of Air Force History, Headquarters USAF, 1973
THE MIGHTY EIGHTH WAR DIARY by Roger A. Freeman, ISBN 1-85409-071-2

Jack McKillop
USAF (Airways and Air Communications Service)
1955-59


----------------------------------------------------------------------
|  Jack McKillop      |  Those who have long enjoyed such privileges |
|  Bellcore           |  as we enjoy forget in time that men have    |
|  Piscataway, NJ     |  died to win them.     FDR                   |
|  USA                |  jem3@cc.bellcore.com                        |
----------------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 19 Jul 1993 07:25:30 -0400
From:    jem3@CC.BELLCORE.COM
Subject: L-4, Piper Cub or Grasshopper?

Last week, I included the Piper L-4 Cub in my list of aircraft.  Someone
asked me if the L-4 was the Piper Cub or Piper Grasshopper.  Well, here is
what I have found.

I appears that the name "Grasshopper" was a generic name applied to light
aircraft used for artillery spotting because four different aircraft, i.e,
the Taylorcraft L-2 (ex O-57), Aeronca L-3 (ex O-58), Piper L-4 (ex O-59)
and Interstate L-6 (ex O-63), are all identified as the "Grasshopper"; all
were versions of pre-World War II light, civilian aircraft but the Piper
was the only aircraft with a recognizable name, i.e., the Cub.  That is
probably why my second source calls the L-4 the Piper Cub and the other
three Grasshoppers.

L-4, Piper Cub or Grasshopper?  Take your choice; it appears that both are
correct.

------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 19 Jul 1993 08:12:57 EST
From:    Larry Jewell <jewell@MACE.CC.PURDUE.EDU>
Subject: The Divine Wind blows strongly...

A busy day in the Western Pacific.

From: NAVAL CHRONOLOGY, WORLD WAR II, 1955, GPO, Washington, DC
APRIL, 1945
04/06 Fri. First heavy attack is made by Japanese suicide planes
           on United States ships at Okinawa, Ryukyu Islands;
           similar attacks persist throughout the Okinawa campaign.
            United States naval vessels sunk, Okinawa area:
             Destroyer BUSH (DD-529), by suicide plane,
              27 d. 16'N., 127 d. 48'E.
             Destroyer COLHOUN (DD-801), damaged by suicide plane,
              27 d. 16'N., 127 d. 48'E.;
              sunk by United States forces.
             High-speed minesweeper EMMONS (DMS-22), damaged by
              suicide plane,
              26 d. 48'N., 128 d. 04'E.;
              sunk by United States forces.
             LST 447, by suicide plane,
              26 d. 09'N., 127 d. 18'E.
            United States naval vessels damaged, Okinawa area:
             Battleship NORTH CAROLINA (BB-55), accidentally by
              United States naval gunfire,
              26 d. 41'N., 129 d. 32'E.
             Light carrier SAN JACINTO (CVL-30), by suicide plane,
              26 d. 46'N., 129 d. 43'E.
             Light cruiser PASADENA (CL-65), accidentally by
              United States naval gunfire,
              27 d. 00'N., 129 d. 00'E.
             Destroyer MORRIS (DD-417), by suicide plane,
              25 d. 55'N., 127 d. 52'E.
             Destroyer BENNETT (DD-473), by suicide plane,
              27 d. 16'N., 127 d. 48'E.
             Destroyer HUTCHINS (DD-476), by suicide plane,
              26 d. 00'N., 128 d. 00'E.
             Destroyer LEUTZE (DD-481), by suicide plane,
              26 d. 38'N., 127 d. 28'E.
             Destroyer MULLANY (DD-528), by suicide plane,
              26 d. 24'N., 128 d. 10'E.
             Destroyer HARRISON (DD-573), by suicide plane,
              27 d. 05'N., 129 d. 22'E.
             Destroyer NEWCOMB (DD-586), by suicide plane,
              26 d. 38'N., 127 d. 28'E.
             Destroyer HOWORTH (DD-592), by suicide plane,
              26 d. 32'N., 127 d. 40'E.
             Destroyer HAYNESWORTH (DD-700), by suicide plane,
              26 d. 55'N., 129 d. 29'E.
             Destroyer HYMAN (DD-731), by suicide plane,
              26 d. 45'N., 127 d. 42'E.
             destroyer TAUSSIG (DD-746), by horizontal bomber,
              27 d. 07'N., 128 d. 39'E.
             Destroyer escort WITTER (DE-636), by suicide plane,
              26 d. 04'N., 127 d. 52'E.
             Destroyer escort FIEBERLING (DE-640), by suicide plane,
              26 d. 48'N., 128 d. 04'E.
             High-speed minesweeper RODMAN (DMS-21),
              by suicide plane,
              26 d. 48'N., 128 d. 04'E.
             High-speed minesweeper HARDING  (DMS-28), by horizontal
              bomber,
              26 d. 00'N., 127 d. 00'E.
             Minesweeper FACILITY (AM-133), by suicide plane,
              26 d. 00'N., 127 d. 00'E.
             Minesweeper RANSOM (AM-283), by suicide plane,
              26 d. 48'N., 128 04'E.
             Minesweeper DEFENSE (AM-317), by suicide plane,
              26 d. 38'N., 127 31'E.
             Minesweeper DEVASTOR (AM-318), by suicide plane,
              26 d. 26'N., 127'40'E.
             Motor minesweeper YMS 311, by suicide plane,
              26 d. 38'N., 127 d. 48'E,
             Motor minesweeper YMS 321, by suicide plane,
              26 d. 00'N,, 128 d. 00'E.
             Submarine chaser PCS-1390, accidentally by United States
              naval gunfire,
              26 d. 00'N., 128 d. 00'E.
             Attack transport BARNETT (APA-5), accidentally by United
              States naval gunfire,
              26 d. 21'N., 127 d. 43'E.
             High-speed transport DANIEL T. GRIFFIN (APD-38), by
              collision,
              25 d. 57  N., 127 d. 57'E.
             Attack cargo ship LEO (AKA-60), accidentally by United
              States naval gunfire,
              26 d. 21'N., 127 d. 43'E.
             LST 241, accidentally by United States naval gunfire,
              26 d. 20'N., 127 d. 45'E.
             LST 1000, accidentally by United States naval gunfire,
              26 d. 21'N., 127 d. 44'E.
            Japanese naval vessels sunk:
             Destroyer AMATSUKAZE, by Army aircraft, off China,
              23 d. 55'N., 117 d. 40'E.
             Minesweeper NO. 22, by submarine BESUGO (SS-321),
              Netherlands East Indies area,
              08 d. 13'S., 119 d. 14'E.
             Coast defense vessels NOs. 2 and 134, by Army aircraft, off
              China,
              23 d. 55'N., 117 d. 40'E.


Larry J

------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 19 Jul 1993 08:19:28 -0700
From:    Thomas Cardoza <cardoza@HUMANITAS.UCSB.EDU>
Subject: GEN: Friendly Fire

In his message "The Divine Wind Blows Strongly," Larry jewel mentioned 5
USN ships hit by frinedly fire IN ONE DAY.  This is interesting to me,
since the media seems to have "discovered" the whole phenomenon of
friendly fire during the Gulf War.  (Their precedecssors discovered it in
Vietnam as well, and I'm sure other generations of reporters have also
complained about the FF casualties of their particular war as if they were
something new)  I said loudly and often to the TV
screen two years ago that: A. Freindly fire casualties are not new but
have occured in every war (at least every war where missile weapons have
been used); and, B. that the Gulf War FF casualties, though terrible,
seemed relatively under control considering the number of personnel,
weapons, and nationalities involved, not to mention the fluid conditions
operative during the ground campaign.
        To get to my point, does anyone know of any scholarly or
government studies of friendly fire casualties, specifically WW II but
also throughout the ages?  Sorry to go on, but Larry's mesage picqued my
interest.

Thomas Cardoza

------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 19 Jul 1993 09:11:20 -0700
From:    Thomas Cardoza <cardoza@HUMANITAS.UCSB.EDU>
Subject: Re: KOHL VERSUS MITTERAND

On Sun, 18 Jul 1993, John Ausland wrote:

>   Oslo, July 18.  I have just returned to Oslo from the US, where I
> attended a reunion of the 4th Infantry Division in Washington, DC.
> When reading the International Herald Tribunes which had gathered, I
> found a story saying that Kohl wanted to be invited to the June 6
> events next year.  According to this story, French and American
> officials were negative.  That the French are unenthusiastic does
> not surprise me, but I have been unable thus far to get a statement
> regarding the US position.
>   K and M are meeting in Bonn on Tuesday and may discuss this question.
>   I would be interested in getting the views of users of this list.
> Should or should not Kohl be invited?  What are the pros and cons?
>   Regards, John Ausland


Well,
There is certainly a lot to consider here, and since I'm first into the
breach I will probably miss a lot that others can add or correct me on.
Whether or not France invites Kohl depends on the message he wants to send
and the constituency he wants to serve.  If the desired message is that
France and Germany have put WW II behind them and are fast friends with no
animosity, then Kohl will get his invitation.  Likewise if Mitterand
wants to cater to the advocates of European unity and those who feel close
ties with Germany are indispensable in the coming era.  However, there are
a lot of people in France who still remember the war, the humiliating
defeat, the deportations, and all the horrors of life under the nazis.  For
many of them I doubt it will be a matter of letting the past be forgotten.
Kohl's presence would be an outrage to their continued feelings of
resentment towards Germany, not to mention the memory of their dead
comrades. One need only recall the furor in the US over proposed Japanese
participation in the 50th anniversary ceremonies at Pearl Harbor to see
the problems involved, and the French went through far worse at the hands
of the Germans. Five years ago I spent some time at RAF Manston
talking to a number of veterans of the RAF and Royal Navy,  I was mildly
surprised to hear them all say
independently (i.e. I talked to them at differnt times/places and
they did not know each other) that the Germans were just soldiers
like themselves, doing their jobs, and that they (the Brits) bore
their erstwhile German opponents no ill will.  But considering
that these were men whose country WON, and was never ocupied, their
attitude is more understandable.  Also, being RN and RAF, they never
actually SAW thier enemies in person, nor had to see up close the
results
of nazi brutality in the occupied countries or in Germany itself.(I know
that doesn't hold true for all RN and RAF personnel, but it did for most,
and these were no exception.)
          Despite what anyone can say about the healthful effects
of leting go of one's anger, my guess is that German dignitaries won't be
attending June 6th ceremonies until the French veterans' ranks are
drastically thinned by General Time.  France suffered too much at
Germany's hands, and after all, this will be a commemoration of the
painful, bloody, and drawn-out struggle to kick the Germans out of France.
As for next June, I'll bet a cold Kanterbrau that Kohl won't get his
invitation!

Thomas Cardoza

------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 19 Jul 1993 13:23:08 EST
From:    Crane Conrad LTC <kc5318@USMA7.USMA.EDU>
Subject: Re: GEN: Friendly Fire

>In his message "The Divine Wind Blows Strongly," Larry jewel mentioned 5
>USN ships hit by frinedly fire IN ONE DAY.  This is interesting to me,
>since the media seems to have "discovered" the whole phenomenon of
>friendly fire during the Gulf War.  (Their precedecssors discovered it in
>Vietnam as well, and I'm sure other generations of reporters have also
>complained about the FF casualties of their particular war as if they were
>something new)  I said loudly and often to the TV
>screen two years ago that: A. Freindly fire casualties are not new but
>have occured in every war (at least every war where missile weapons have
>been used); and, B. that the Gulf War FF casualties, though terrible,
>seemed relatively under control considering the number of personnel,
>weapons, and nationalities involved, not to mention the fluid conditions
>operative during the ground campaign.
>        To get to my point, does anyone know of any scholarly or
>government studies of friendly fire casualties, specifically WW II but
>also throughout the ages?  Sorry to go on, but Larry's mesage picqued my
>interest.
>
>Thomas Cardoza


One excellent source on the issue is AMICICIDE: THE PROBLEM OF FRIENDLY FIRE IN
MODERN WAR by Charles R. Shrader, Research Survey No. 1 from the Combat Studies
Institute, available from that organization at the US Army Command and General
Staff College, Fort Leavenworth, KS 66027-6900.

                                        Conrad Crane
                                        Dept. of History
                                        US Military Academy

------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 19 Jul 1993 20:57:13 +0200
From:    Emmanuel Gustin <gustin@EVSDS.UIA.AC.BE>
Subject: Re: L-4, Piper Cub or Grasshopper?

> I appears that the name "Grasshopper" was a generic name applied to light
> aircraft used for artillery spotting because four different aircraft, i.e,
> the Taylorcraft L-2 (ex O-57), Aeronca L-3 (ex O-58), Piper L-4 (ex O-59)
> and Interstate L-6 (ex O-63), are all identified as the "Grasshopper"; all
> were versions of pre-World War II light, civilian aircraft but the Piper
> was the only aircraft with a recognizable name, i.e., the Cub.  That is
> probably why my second source calls the L-4 the Piper Cub and the other
> three Grasshoppers.

Wasn't Taylorcraft the original designer and builder of the Cub? This
might explain the identical names, if the L-4 (-3/-6) was the development by
(an)other compan(y)(ies) of the L-2.

Emmanuel Gustin

------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 19 Jul 1993 18:36:46 EDT
From:    Michael Cotter <LBCOTTER@ECUVM1.BITNET>
Subject: REF: Int'l Military Encyclopedia, etc.

A few months ago, I asked the list readers for information on
the International Military and Defense Encyclopedia (IMADE), ed. Trevor
Dupuy, and the International Military Encyclopedia, ed. Norman Tobias.  Only
one person replied (thanks, Larry Clemens); but now I have seen a review
of the IMADE and two reviews of the IME.  The IMADE is reviewed in the
Wilson Library Bulletin, April 1993 and receives a generally favorable
review by James Rettig of the William and Mary University Library.  He
says, in summary, that it "deserves to be called a classic" in its field.

The IME is reviewed in American Reference Books Annual (ARBA), 1992, by
Eric Nitschke, who writes that "this work should provide a useful reference
and means of entry to military (although not naval) subjects.  Libraries at
all levels will want to consider it."  James Rettig reviewed IME in the Februar
y1993 issue of Wilson Library Bulletin, writes that the emphasis in IME is more
upon weapons (specifications, period of use, the forces which used it,
firepower, and performance in battle) more than in IMADE.

I'll provide more information if anyone doesn't have the reviews at hand;
my interest in these publications is partly due to their cost: IMADE is
$1,250 or so for 6 vols., while IME is $37 per volume for an undetermined
number of volumes.  Hmmm.  Guess I'll try to order both, plus _The Military
History of the United States_, by  Christopher Chant (Cavendish, 1992, 16v.,
$449.00).  Didn't I mention that before?  Well, let's see....

Michael Cotter
Documents Librarian
Joyner Library
East Carolina University
Greenville NC 27858
919/757-6533

------------------------------

End of WWII-L Digest - 18 Jul 1993 to 19 Jul 1993
*************************************************

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Status: O

There are 18 messages totalling 611 lines in this issue.

Topics of the day:

  1. KOHL VERSUS MITTERAND (2)
  2. USAAF 20 JUL 43
  3. L-4, Piper Cub or Grasshopper? (2)
  4. Aircraft deployed life boat? (3)
  5. GEN: Friendly Fire
  6. SCI/GEN - What does it do?
  7. The Garry Owen (5)
  8. S.S. Jeremiah O'Brien
  9. GEN: 50th Anniversaries
 10. GEN: Shameless CAF Commercial Plug Follows.  :-)

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 20 Jul 1993 10:35:00 CET
From:    Fred van Wetten <CRIPFW@RULMVS.LEIDENUNIV.NL>
Subject: Re: KOHL VERSUS MITTERAND

> I found a story saying that Kohl wanted to be invited to the June 6
> events next year.  According to this story, French and American
> officials were negative.  That the French are unenthusiastic does
> not surprise me, but I have been unable thus far to get a statement
> regarding the US position.
>   Regards, John Ausland

If a german representative should be invited, it should be the president
of the Bundes Republik, Herr Von Weissacker.
Helmut Kohl is just a politician, who needs another big succes after
the unification of the 2 germanies.
Kohl is in trouble as a politician, because of his slow and bleach re-
actions concerning the Neo Nazi violence in Germany today.
I am already getting upset by the thought, that Herr Kohl will use the
occasion, on 6 june 1994, as a personal opportunity to gain worldwide
face as one of the great contemporary worldleaders.
So in my opinion Kohl should NOT be invited.
On the other hand, I would cheer the invitation of the german president.
That man is not politicaly bound and of great integrity.


Fred van Wetten           Netadress:CRIPFW@rulmvs.LeidenUniv.nl
CRI, instituut voor telecommunicatie en computerdienstverlening
RijksUniversiteit Leiden, PO BOX 9512, 2300 RA LEIDEN, Netherl.
Tel: +31 (0)71 276933     Fax: +31 (0)71 276967

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 20 Jul 1993 11:59:03 +0200
From:    John Ausland <d_ausland_j@KARI.UIO.NO>
Subject: KOHL VERSUS MITTERAND

  Oslo, July 20.  Thanks to Thomas Cardoza and to others who sent me
EMAIL messages, which were more relaxed about an invitation.  It looks
like Kohl decided he would not get an invitation.  The German Embassy
here tells me the Foreign Office in Bonn is saying "unofficially" that
Kohl does not want an invitation.
  While this evidently takes the pressure off for now, it does not
end the matter.  There will still be the question of how the German
media will deal with the series of anniversaries which will be initiated
by June 6 and will march across Europe until VE Day.
  Regards, John Ausland

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 20 Jul 1993 07:15:46 -0400
From:    jem3@CC.BELLCORE.COM
Subject: USAAF 20 JUL 43

COMBAT CHRONOLOGY OF THE US ARMY AIR FORCES
TUESDAY, 20 JULY 1943
FTP SITES
  1. ftp.rutgers.edu in directory pub/wwii/usaf
  2. byrd.mu.wvnet.edu (129.71.32.152) in pub/history/military/airforce/
     wwii_chronology

AIRCRAFT MENTIONED IN THIS REPORT:
  A-20, Douglas Havoc
  A-36, North American Apache
  B-18, Douglas Bolo
  B-24, Consolidated Liberator
  B-25, North American Mitchell
  F-4, Lockheed Lightning
  P-40, Curtiss
  Wellington, Vickers (RAF)

AMERICAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  ANTISUBMARINE WARFARE (AAF ANTISUBMARINE COMMAND)
    The air echelon of the 7th Antisubmarine Squadron (Heavy), 26th
Antisubmarine Wing, which has been operating from Edinburgh Field,
Trinidad with B-18's since Apr 43, returns to it's base at Jacksonville
Municipal Airport, Florida.

CHINA-BURMA-INDIA THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  BURMA-INDIA (Tenth Air Force)
    B-24's attack Mandalay, Burma.
    The 491st Bombardment Squadron (Medium), 341st Bombardment Group
(Medium), based at Chakulia, India sends a detachment of ground personnel
to Gaya, India.

  CHINA (Fourteenth Air Force)
    In China, 4 P-40's bomb a warehouse area at Tengchung; 6 others strafe
river traffic and railroad targets of opportunity at Sinti, Changanyi,
Tingszekiao, Kaiyu, and near Puchi.

EUROPEAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  ANTISUBMARINE WARFARE (AAF Antisubmarine Command)
    In the Bay of Biscay, a B-24 of the 19th Antisubmarine Squadron
(Heavy) sinks U-588 at 45-10N 09-42W.

MEDITERRANEAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  EASTERN MEDITERRANEAN (Ninth Air Force)
    In Sicily, B-25's attack Randazzo and Taormina; and Royal Air Force
(RAF) heavy bombers hit Vibo Valentia Airfield.

  WESTERN MEDITERRANEAN (Northwest African Air Force)
    During the night of 19/20 Jul, Northwest African Strategic Air Force
(NASAF) Wellingtons bomb Aquino, Sicily and Capodichino, Italy Airfields
while Northwest African Tactical Air Force (NATAF) medium and light
bombers attack vehicles, roads, and town areas around and in Randazzo,
Santo Stefano di Camastra, Orlando, and Nicosia, Sicily. During the day,
NASAF fighter-bombers attack targets of opportunity in W Sicily while
NASAF medium bombers strike Montecorvino Airfield.
    On the ground in Sicily, the US Seventh Army and British Eighth Army
continue to push NW and N. The US 82d Airborne Division takes Sciacca and
Menfi; the US 9d Infantry Division clears Santo Stefano Quisquina and the
heights N of Mussomeli; the US 2d Armored Division, with British units,
takes Enna and drives on to Villapriolo. The Canadian 1 Division pushes
to the Leonforte area; the British 51 Division attacks the German air-
field near Sferro; 13 Corps is halted by strong opposition on the
Catania Plain.
    HQ 86th Fighter Group transfers from Korba, Tunisia to Gela, Sicily.
    The 12th Photographic Squadron (Light), 3d Photographic Reconnaissance
and Mapping Group, based at Ariana, Tunisia begins operating from Gela
and Ponte Olivo, Sicily with F-4's.
    The 309th Bombardment Squadron (Dive), 86th Bombardment Group (Dive)
transfers with A-36's from Tafaraoui, Algeria to Gela, Sicily. The 310th
and 312th Bombardment Squadrons (Dive) of the same group transfer from
Korba, Tunisia to Gela with A-36's.

SOUTH PACIFIC THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Thirteenth Air Force)
  In the Solomon Islands, 18 B-24's bomb airfields at Kahili on Bougain-
ville Island and on Ballale Island. Fighters strafe barges in Pakoi Bay,
New Georgia Island.

SOUTHWEST PACIFIC THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Fifth Air Force)
  In New Guinea US ground forces begin the struggle for the heights
commanding Tambu Bay and Dot Inlet; A-20's and B-25's pound Madang
Airfield and area, the Komiatum, Logui, areas along the Gum River and S
of the Gogol River, the Gori River bridge area, and Bogadjim. On Timor
Island, B-25's bomb Lautem, Dili, and Cape Chater Airfield. A single B-24
bombs Arawe on New Britain Island.

SOURCES:
AIR FORCE COMBAT UNITS OF WORLD WAR II, Office of Air Force History,
  Headquarters USAF, 1961, ISBN 0-912799-02-1
COMBAT SQUADRONS OF THE AIR FORCE, WORLD WAR II, Office of Air Force
  History, Headquarters USAF 1982
THE ARMY AIR FORCES IN WORLD WAR II: COMBAT CHRONOLOGY, 1941-1945 by the
  Office of Air Force History, Headquarters USAF, 1973
THE MIGHTY EIGHTH WAR DIARY by Roger A. Freeman, ISBN 1-85409-071-2

Jack McKillop
USAF (Airways and Air Communications Service)
1955-59

----------------------------------------------------------------------
|  Jack McKillop      |  Those who have long enjoyed such privileges |
|  Bellcore           |  as we enjoy forget in time that men have    |
|  Piscataway, NJ     |  died to win them.     FDR                   |
|  USA                |  jem3@cc.bellcore.com                        |
----------------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 20 Jul 1993 07:22:55 -0400
From:    jem3@CC.BELLCORE.COM
Subject: Re: L-4, Piper Cub or Grasshopper?

        Wasn't Taylorcraft the original designer and builder of the Cub? This
        might explain the identical names, if the L-4 (-3/-6) was the development by
        (an)other compan(y)(ies) of the L-2.

        Emmanuel Gustin

Yes, you are correct about Taylorcraft.  But the name "Grasshopper"
was a USAAF name and was not used for the civilian versions of the
aircraft which pre-dated their military use.

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 20 Jul 1993 07:25:15 -0500
From:    Donald Newcomb <dnewcomb@FALCON.ST.USM.EDU>
Subject: Aircraft deployed life boat?

A recent article in the local paper discussed a 1946 "B" movie that was filmed
on the MS Gulf Coast: "Seven were saved." One of the "stars" of the movie was
a lifeboat (not raft) that was carried under the belly of a B-17 and deployed
(dropped?) near survivors who could then sail the lifeboat to safety. I assume
the boat also had rations onboard. A picture of the boat showed a narrow craft
about 40' long with "Conastoga" type deck covers, a short mast and a jib &
mainsail.

Does anyone have any information about this lifeboat, its development and
any use it may have seen in WW-II?

Donald R. Newcomb              * University of Southern Mississippi
dnewcomb@whale.st.usm.edu      * "The God who gave us life gave us liberty
dnewcomb@falcon.st.usm.edu     * at the same time."  T. Jefferson (1774)

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 20 Jul 1993 09:04:43 -0400
From:    Steve Allen-Shinn <shinn@VIRGINIA.DAB.GE.COM>
Subject: Re: L-4, Piper Cub or Grasshopper?

Emmanuel Gustin wrote:
>
>Wasn't Taylorcraft the original designer and builder of the Cub? This
>might explain the identical names, if the L-4 (-3/-6) was the development by
>(an)other compan(y)(ies) of the L-2.

Ah...  A subject that I can actually contribute to.  :)

Taylor and Piper designed and produced the original Taylor Cubs, the
E-1 and E-2.  After a tiff between the two, Piper took over and
renamed the company as Piper.  The E-2 was followed by the J-2 and
then the J-3. The J-3 Cub was modified slightly to become the L-4.

Meanwhile, C.G. Taylor formed a new company, Taylorcraft.  It was
this company that contributed the L-2.  I can't recall off the top of
my head what the civilian equivalent of the L-2, but it was an all
new design (definitely not a Cub).

I'm not sure which Aeronca was the L-3, but I'd guess it was similar
to the Champ.

I believe (it's been a *LONG* time) that the Interstate Cadet was
converted to the L-6 configuration.

None of these aircraft were based on the same original design.

I will try to find references for this (and more if you wish), but
I make no promises.  I was going to try to find info on the "Cub"
vs. "Grasshopper" name for the L-4, but I haven't had a chance
(thanks Jack).

- Steve
--
Steve Allen-Shinn       shinn@helios.dab.ge.com
Martin Marietta         Daytona Beach, Fla.

------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 19 Jul 1993 16:10:49 +0200
From:    Chris Scogings <cscoging@UNPCS1.CS.UNP.AC.ZA>
Subject: GEN: Friendly Fire

>        To get to my point, does anyone know of any scholarly or
>government studies of friendly fire casualties, specifically WW II but
>also throughout the ages?  Sorry to go on, but Larry's mesage picqued my
>interest.

Does this include the large numbers of allied, ie: French and Belgian
civilians killed by USAAF and RAF bombing?

Chris
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Chris Scogings                      Voice: (27) 331 955645
Computer Science Dept                 Fax: (27) 331 955599
University of Natal
Pietermaritzburg                   E-Mail:cscoging@unpcs1.cs.unp.ac.za
----------------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 20 Jul 1993 10:23:22 -0400
From:    jem3@CC.BELLCORE.COM
Subject: Re: Aircraft deployed life boat?

        A recent article in the local paper discussed a 1946 "B" movie that was filmed
        on the MS Gulf Coast: "Seven were saved." One of the "stars" of the movie was
        a lifeboat (not raft) that was carried under the belly of a B-17 and deployed
        (dropped?) near survivors who could then sail the lifeboat to safety. I assume
        the boat also had rations onboard. A picture of the boat showed a narrow craft
        about 40' long with "Conastoga" type deck covers, a short mast and a jib &
        mainsail.

        Does anyone have any information about this lifeboat, its development and
        any use it may have seen in WW-II?

They were dropped from modified B-17's and later B-29's.  I believe
the B-17's were available late in WWII (1945?) and both aircraft after
the war.  Unfortunately, I know nothing about the boat itself.

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 20 Jul 1993 07:31:23 -0800
From:    John Riegsecker <riegsecker@UPS.EDU>
Subject: SCI/GEN - What does it do?

Last friday I spent some time visiting the TURNER JOY and the Bremerton
Naval Museum.  I have a question about an object I saw at the museum.  It
consisted of a flat disk about an inch thick and about 8-9" in diameter.
There were teeth on the outside edge of the disk so that it looked like a
gear.  There was a small wheel of about 2.5" in diameter mounted
perpendicular to the outside of the larger wheel.  The small wheel had a
little handle or crank on it.  Evidently you turned the crank and the
little wheel moved around the larger wheel.  The caption said it computed B
to the 2/3 power, that is the cube root of the square of the number B.  My
question is, what was this thing used for?  The gentleman at the museum was
very kind, but he had no idea what it was.  Does it have anything to do
with navigation or gunnery?  Is it something a worker in a shipyard would
use?

Thanks in advance.

John Riegsecker
riegsecker@ups.edu

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 20 Jul 1993 09:58:00 CDT
From:    "Roger Safian, (708) 491-4058" <ROGER@NUACC.BITNET>
Subject: The Garry Owen

Greetings,

    I know this is off the subject of this list, but I'm hoping that
one of you might be able to help.  I am going to make a very tenuous
conection to World War II, so I hope Larry will go easy on me!  :-)

    I'm looking for a copy of the Garry Owen.  Preferably on a CD.
(get ready for that tenuous connection)  The Garry Owen is the
regimental theme song for the 7th Cav.  The 7th Cav served proudly
in the South Pacific, and I believe finished the war as part of the
occupational forces in Japan.  The 7th Cav also had a bit of a
reputation with a certain General Custer and a few Indians.  :-)

   I've looked everywhere for this, but no luck.  I'm looking for
ideas, so if you have any please respond.  Thanks in advance.

                                              Roger

P.S.

    Larry - Sorry to go off the charter, I'll try to be a good boy
from now on!

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 20 Jul 1993 10:12:29 EDT
From:    "AD16000@NEMOMUS.BITNET. --Scherrer,
         Tim A." <AD16%NEMOMUS.BITNET@MIZZOU1.MISSOURI.EDU>
Subject: S.S. Jeremiah O'Brien

I again visited the Jeremiah O'Brien this past weekend.  I believe it
was Larry Jewell who forwarded a posting about three MERSHIPS that were
convoying over to Normandy to the 50th Anniversary D-Day ceremonies.
The curator of the O'Brien said this past weekend that they needed to
raise 1.5-2 million to made the trip, and that the money collected was
not significant enough to make a dent in that total.  They are hoping
that maybe they could just go across the San Fransisco Bay and bunker up
at the Navy's expense, however there hasn't been any success in getting
the Navy's support.  At present, they are trying through the French and
British governments, hoping that a request from them to the U.S.
government willbreak the logjam.

I spent an afternoon at Suisun Bay.  I found out that the Liberty
Ship'sreplacement, the Victory Ship, are all expected to be scrapped by
the late '90's.  MARAD is supposed to scrap them due to the results of a
mobility study, showing that we don't need as many breakbulk ships, and
more RORO's.  There are only a couple Liberty Ships still around as
well.  I think there are two left in the James River, and that's it.  It
seems like the end of the line for these ladies of the sea.

Tim

************************************************************************
*  Tim A. Scherrer          "You'll be fighting WWII for the rest of   *
*  Facilities Supervisor     your life", Ron Scherrer, 1971            *
*  WP:816-785-5253                                                     *
*  HP:816-665-6704                                                     *
*  ID# AD16%NEMOMUS@ACADEMIC.NEMOSTATE.EDU                             *
************************************************************************

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 20 Jul 1993 11:50:23 LCL
From:    Tom Shirhall <tshirhal@IDA.ORG>
Subject: Re: The Garry Owen

Date:         Tue, 20 Jul 1993 09:58:00 CDT
From: "Roger Safian, (708) 491-4058"
<ROGER%NUACC.BITNET@UBVM.cc.buffalo.edu>
Subject:      The Garry Owen
To: Multiple recipients of list WWII-L <WWII-L@UBVM.cc.buffalo.edu>

Greetings,

    I'm looking for a copy of the Garry Owen.  Preferably on a CD.
(get ready for that tenuous connection)  The Garry Owen is the
regimental theme song for the 7th Cav.  The 7th Cav served proudly
in the South Pacific, and I believe finished the war as part of the
occupational forces in Japan.  The 7th Cav also had a bit of a
reputation with a certain General Custer and a few Indians.  :-)

   I've looked everywhere for this, but no luck.  I'm looking for
ideas, so if you have any please respond.  Thanks in advance.

Since the title is _The Garry Owen_, I would guess that the theme song is a
Scot regimental tune originally played on the bagpipes. Try that genre.

Tom Shirhall    tshirhall@ida.org

                                              Roger

P.S.

    Larry - Sorry to go off the charter, I'll try to be a good boy
from now on!

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 20 Jul 1993 08:54:27 -0700
From:    Thomas Cardoza <cardoza@HUMANITAS.UCSB.EDU>
Subject: GEN: 50th Anniversaries

On Tue, 20 Jul 1993, John Ausland wrote:

>   Oslo, July 20.  Thanks to Thomas Cardoza and to others who sent me
> EMAIL messages, which were more relaxed about an invitation.  It looks
> like Kohl decided he would not get an invitation.  The German Embassy
> here tells me the Foreign Office in Bonn is saying "unofficially" that
> Kohl does not want an invitation.
>   While this evidently takes the pressure off for now, it does not
> end the matter.  There will still be the question of how the German
> media will deal with the series of anniversaries which will be initiated
> by June 6 and will march across Europe until VE Day.
>   Regards, John Ausland

This raises some interesting questions, such as how will Germany mark the
50th of the fall of Berlin?  Are there any plans for major commemorations
of the Bulge next year?  If so, how will the different countries owning
chunks of the battlefield deal with it?  The shadow of Malmedy will
certainly stalk any attempts to include German participation.
        Also, does anyone know what is happening conerning anniversaries
in the Soviet Union?  (Oops! Former Soviet Union: old habits die hard!)
I'm so wrapped up in my own work that I've completely forgotten to
celebrate Kursk's 50th, but I wonder how much celebrating is going on over
there, given the economic situation and given the strong communist tone
given to Great Patriotic War celebrations for so long.  Has the war lost
its shine for, say, the Ukrainians?

Tom Cardoza

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 20 Jul 1993 13:02:00 CDT
From:    "Roger Safian, (708) 491-4058" <ROGER@NUACC.BITNET>
Subject: Re: The Garry Owen

Tom,

    Thanks for the suggestion.  I had though it was Irish, and looked
in that section of the store as well as marches.  I'll try Scottish.

                                           Roger

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 20 Jul 1993 15:54:00 CDT
From:    Bill Kupersmith <BLAWRKWY@UIAMVS.BITNET>
Subject: Re: The Garry Owen

I have a vague recollection of reading somewhere that the Garry
Owen was originally the regimental march of an Irish regiment
of the British army, the Inniskilling Dragoon Guards, and that
Irish immigrants who had served in that regiment enlisted in
the 7th cavalry later and brought the march of their former
regiment with them.

--Bill Kupersmith
University of Iowa

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 20 Jul 1993 17:33:09 -0400
From:    Max Hare <maxc@URSUS1.URSUS.MAINE.EDU>
Subject: Re: The Garry Owen

Tom,

I think that the Garry Owen is featured as the theme of the old Jimmy
Cagney - Pat O'Brien movie "The Fighting 69th" (1940 or so).  Its now
out in video so if you have trouble getting a copy you could always tape
it off the video sountrack (the video is around $14. or so).  I have
always thought and this movie tends to imply that the Gary Owen is an
Irish tune.  Anybody have any info on this.

Max C. Calderwood
University of Southern Maine
Gorham, ME
MAXC@URSUS1.URSUS.MAINE.EDU

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 20 Jul 1993 17:16:47 MDT
From:    Steve Alvin <STEPHEN_ALVIN@DSU1.DSU.NODAK.EDU>
Subject: Re: Aircraft deployed life boat?

On Tuesday, July 20th, Donald Newcomb wrote:

> Does anyone have any information about this lifeboat, its development and
> any use it may have seen in WW-II?

Edward Jablonski's (sp?) book *Flying Fortress* has a picture of a B-
17 loaded with this life boat and (I think) talks a little bit about
it.  I don't have the book with me, so I can't give a specific
reference.

Wasn't one of the CAF's B-17's "The Sentimental Journey" originally
used in this manner?






Steve Alvin
Dickinson State University
STEPHEN_ALVIN@DSU1.DSU.NODAK.EDU
**********************************************************************
*Those who fail to remember history are doomed to repeat it.--Proverb*
*Those who fail to remember history are doomed to repeat my class.-SA*
**********************************************************************

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 20 Jul 1993 21:32:21 CDT
From:    "Robert J. Granvin" <rjg@UMNSTAT.STAT.UMN.EDU>
Subject: GEN: Shameless CAF Commercial Plug Follows.  :-)

Every once in a blue moon I go into a shameless commercial plug when the
CAF does something positive.  :-)

I occasionally get request for information on membership and mail out
applications as people request (normally I don't ask for interest, though
we're in a campaign at the moment -- If we can sign up 100 new members,
our Wing will save $10,000 (whimper!)).  I _think_ I've got information
out to everyone who has asked recently... If you haven't seen anything yet,
please remind me.  (Except Mr. Christian... I finally got to his just
yesterday... :-)

Anyways, I wasn't really going for that, except I wanted to be the first
to announce that the CAF finally recognized the importance of kids in
preserving WWII history and desire to know by authorizing the "Cadet
Membership."

For $45 per year, a child between the ages of 14 and 17 can join the
Confederate Air Force.  They get all the benefits -- magazine, newsletter,
can wear the uniform, be directly involved, etc.  The only thing they cannot
do is ride on the aircraft (insurance).  The individual Wing policies will
vary.  The Southern Minnesota Wing, for example, will ask for an $18 donation,
but waive it entirely if a parent is a member.  (i.e., we won't send a Wing
newsletter because the family already receives it).

The idea is to get kids much more involved and involved in a real way.  The
CAF and the individual Wings do not financially benefit as the costs are
meant to be "break even."  Therefore, Cadet memberships do not apply toward
our recruitment goals, but kids are what we are really here for.

There are a lot of us around who want to keep the memories alive and burning
in the hearts of everyone.  I never knew WWII.  As a matter of fact, I
hard a hard time understanding why people were giving machine guns to
guerillas... I couldn't believe that big hairy apes could learn to organize
and fire a gun.  :-)  But my parents lived under WWII and under Nazi
occupation.  Many people I know served.  My desires for remembrance burn
bright because I know people first hand who lived through it.

But the generation coming up -- That's their grandparents or great-
grandparents.  Many of them will never know someone personally who can
explain to them this cataclysmic event that changed _their_ world.

My opinion is that this is an excellent opportunity to introduce kids to
WWII history and excite them about it by making them INVOLVED.

There are many youth organizations that are also of importance -- obviously
organizations like the Boy and Girl Scouts develop leadership skills.  The
EAA's Young Eagles program help excite kids about aviation.  But the CAF's
program is one of the few with the desire to plant the seed for remembrance.

Personally, I hope people will flock to this program and make it successful.
I hope parents will consider joining as well and organizing the youth part
of the CAF membership into something positive that provides leadership skills
and excitement about history -- not just WWII, but history in general (it
does NOT need to boring!)

Since it's so new (only officially approved this last Saturday -- even the
application forms haven't been developed yet :-), there's a lot of opportunity
to make it into something extraordinary.

If anyone is interested in trying to help start up this program, please
contact CAF Headquarters or email me -- I have a version of our membership
application geared towards the Cadet (Oh no, more applications to mail! :-)

--- Shameless commercial plug ended.  We now return you to your regularly
scheduled friendly discourse.

(*WHEW* ... Get RID of this guy, eh?  :-)

P.S. If anyone is going to Offutt AFB this weekend, stop by Miss Mitchell,
buy some trinkets and taunt the crew.  Drop my name, tell them I told you
to bother them and then email me that you did it so I know how long I will
need to hide for... :-)

--
Robert J. Granvin                                    Southern Minnesota Wing
rjg@stat.umn.edu                                       Confederate Air Force
  You know you've made a gear-up landing when it takes full power to taxi.

------------------------------

End of WWII-L Digest - 19 Jul 1993 to 20 Jul 1993
*************************************************

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Status: O

There are 19 messages totalling 1011 lines in this issue.

Topics of the day:

  1. WANT: More Uniform Info (Russian)
  2. KOHL VERSUS MITTERAND (2)
  3. USAAF 21 JUL 43 (4)
  4. Aircraft deployed life boat?
  5. The Garry Owen (2)
  6. History Network
  7. KOHL VERSUS MITTERAND - a German view (5)
  8. hi (2)
  9. ADMIN: Intro to WWII-L

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 20 Jul 1993 23:45:48 CDT
From:    "Robert J. Granvin" <rjg@UMNSTAT.STAT.UMN.EDU>
Subject: WANT: More Uniform Info (Russian)

I find myself in possession of at least one complete (or nearly complete)
WWII Russian uniform.  More parts on the way (enough to put together a
parade dress uniform).

I'm looking for detailing info.  Does anyone have any good books or
resource suggestions for photographs, diagrams and -- if possible --
details on Soviet WWII uniforms?  (Air Force in particular?)

Details would also include proper colors and design of things like the
belts, boots, etc.  What kind of sidearm would an _officer_ carry in
the field and anyone have any sources where one could pick up a
replica sidearm (or a de-armed one that can be restored to acceptable
appearance?)  Badge detail, stuff like that.

I am looking for a source for the boots.  I know that modern cavalry/
riding/horse-show boots are VERY close, but I also know that East
German uniforms are beginning to flood the market in some places.  The
East German boots are close enough to be considered authentic.  Any
good sources for CHEAP boots?  (Once they hit the dealers, the price
sky rockets -- They may be able to buy them for $5, but will sell
them for $50.  Ick.)

Email preferred to the address below as the technical trinket details
are probably not of general interest to the list.

(By the way -- the pants and shirt both fit perfectly -- no tailoring
needed -- not even hemming.  Cool.  I even have a driver now, since I
clearly outrank the only other Soviet uniform in the bunch... :-)

[Weird... I'm finding it easier to put together a Soviet officer uniform
than a U.S. one -- Norwegian is proving to be nearly impossible, without
an enormous amount of cash... Oof.]

--
Robert J. Granvin                                    Southern Minnesota Wing
rjg@stat.umn.edu                                       Confederate Air Force
  You know you've made a gear-up landing when it takes full power to taxi.

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 21 Jul 1993 12:34:23 +0200
From:    John Ausland <d_ausland_j@KARI.UIO.NO>
Subject: KOHL VERSUS MITTERAND

  Oslo, July 21.  Thanks to Fred van Wetten and Tom Cardoza for your
July 20 messages.
  Fred, I had never thought about Kohl's not being eligible for that
gathering.  Of course it would have to be von Weizsaecker.  Strange
that no one has mentioned that before, to my knowledge.  I plan to use
this point in my IHT article, giving you credit for thinking of it.
  Tom, there is a staff in Heidelberg which is doing the planning for
various anniversaries, and they certainly include the bulge.  The
sensitive one will be Paris, because of the dispute over who liberated
it.  (I deal with this in my book.)
  You raise an interesting point about whether there will be any
events on German soil.  I have tried to stimulate some interest in
the Huertgen Forest but so far with little result.  The Germans say
they have no interest in recalling this battle but are open minded
to US proposals.  I took this up at the 4th Infantry Division reunion
early this month but evoked no enthusiasm.  (This was in sharp
contrast to the emotions which emerged over Paris.)
  As to the Soviet Union, there were German military present at the
anniversary of Stalingrad.  Regards, John A.

*******************************************************************
* John C. Ausland               Tel: +47 22 14 17 68              *
* Land Productions              Fax: +47 22 16 30 92              *
* Sondreveien 4, Entry 2        CIS: 73240,2704                   *
* 0378 Oslo, Norway             Internet: d_ausland_j@kari.uio.no *
*******************************************************************

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 21 Jul 1993 07:13:44 -0400
From:    jem3@CC.BELLCORE.COM
Subject: USAAF 21 JUL 43

COMBAT CHRONOLOGY OF THE US ARMY AIR FORCES
WEDNESDAY, 21 JULY 1943
FTP SITES
  1. ftp.rutgers.edu in directory pub/wwii/usaf
  2. byrd.mu.wvnet.edu (129.71.32.152) in pub/history/military/airforce/
     wwii_chronology

AIRCRAFT MENTIONED IN THIS REPORT:
  A-20, Douglas Havoc
  B-17, Boeing Flying Fortress
  B-24, Consolidated Liberator
  B-25, North American Mitchell
  B-26, Martin Marauder
  C-47, Douglas Skytrain
  P-40, Curtiss
  Spitfire, Vickers Supermarine
  Wellington, Vickers (RAF)

AMERICAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  ALASKA (Eleventh Air Force)
    In the Aleutian Islands, 9 B-24's bomb Kiska Island targets, includ-
ing the runway, North Head, and Main Camp area where fires are observed.
Poor weather cancels other scheduled missions.

MEDITERRANEAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  EASTERN MEDITERRANEAN (Ninth Air Force)
    In Sicily, about 20 B-25's bomb Randazzo and P-40's escort C-47's to
Licata and return.

  WESTERN MEDITERRANEAN (Northwest African Air Force)
    During the night of 20/21 Jul, Wellingtons of the Northwest African
Strategic Air Force (NASAF) hit Crotone Airfield and the Naples marshal-
ling yard in Italy; Northwest African Tactical Air Force (NATAF) light
bombers hit motor transport convoys in the Randazzo, Sicily area. During
the day, NASAF B-17's bomb Grosseto Airfield, Italy.
    On the ground in Sicily, US Rangers seize Castelvetrano and the
airport; the US 82d Airborne Division takes San Margherita and the US 3d
Infantry Division takes Corleone; the US 45th Infantry Division, pushing
NW, takes Valledolmo; and the US 1st Infantry Division clears Alimena.
In the British 30 Corps area, the Canadian 1 Division takes Leonforte.
    HQ 31st Fighter Group transfers from Ponte Olivo, Sicily to
Agrigento, Sicily.
    HQ 47th Bombardment Group (Light) and it's 84th Bombardment Squadron
(Light) transfer with A-20's from Soliman, Tunisia to Malta. The 307th
and 309th Fighter Squadrons, 31st Fighter Group, transfer with Spitfires
from Ponte Olivo, Sicily to Agrigento, Sicily.

SOUTH PACIFIC THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Thirteenth Air Force)
  In the Solomon Islands in a series of sorties in support of ground
forces, 22 B-25's, 50+ USAAF and US Navy fighters, and 170+ US Navy dive
bombers blast positions in the Bairoko area on New Georgia Island; 135
tons of bombs are dropped.

SOUTHWEST PACIFIC THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Fifth Air Force)
  In New Guinea, 50+ B-25's again thoroughly pound the Madang area;
other B-25's hit the junction of the Gori and Ioworo Rivers and the
village of Bogadjim; and B-26's bomb barges and jetties W of Voco Point.
Single B-24's bomb Finschhafen Airfield, New Guinea and the town of
Rabaul on New Britain Island in the Bismarck Archipelago.
  The 66th Troop Carrier Squadron, Fifth Air Force, arrives at Port
Moresby, New Guinea from the US with C-47's. The squadron will begin
aerial transportation in the theater on 27 Jul.

SOURCES:
AIR FORCE COMBAT UNITS OF WORLD WAR II, Office of Air Force History,
  Headquarters USAF, 1961, ISBN 0-912799-02-1
COMBAT SQUADRONS OF THE AIR FORCE, WORLD WAR II, Office of Air Force
  History, Headquarters USAF 1982
THE ARMY AIR FORCES IN WORLD WAR II: COMBAT CHRONOLOGY, 1941-1945 by the
  Office of Air Force History, Headquarters USAF, 1973
THE MIGHTY EIGHTH WAR DIARY by Roger A. Freeman, ISBN 1-85409-071-2

Jack McKillop
USAF (Airways and Air Communications Service)
1955-59


----------------------------------------------------------------------
|  Jack McKillop      |  Those who have long enjoyed such privileges |
|  Bellcore           |  as we enjoy forget in time that men have    |
|  Piscataway, NJ     |  died to win them.     FDR                   |
|  USA                |  jem3@cc.bellcore.com                        |
----------------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 21 Jul 1993 07:21:59 -0400
From:    jem3@CC.BELLCORE.COM
Subject: Re: Aircraft deployed life boat?

I did a little fast checking last night regarding the Air-Sea
Rescue (ASR) B-17's and B-29's used to deploy life boats.
According to my sources, it was originally planned to modify 150
B-17G's for this role but only 12 were actually modified as
B-17H's; they were redesignated SB-17G's in 1948.  When operating
in a combat zone as they did in WWII and the Korean War, the
aircraft retained their defensive armament; most had to be
retrofitted for the Korean War.  There were also a handful of
TB-17H's used for training in dropping the lifeboat.

About 16 B-29's were modified as SB-29's and my source indicates
that some operated in the Western Pacific in 1945 along the route
that the B-29's took between the Marianas Islands and Japan.  They
also soldiered on after the war.

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 21 Jul 1993 08:31:32 -0400
From:    KAPLAN@DUQ3.DUQ.EDU
Subject: Re: KOHL VERSUS MITTERAND

I agree completely with Mr. van Wetten.  Pres. Von Weissacker is a man of
integrity, and more important, he is the head of state.  Kohl as PM is
"only" the head of the government.  I know its a somewhat obtuse argument,
but I'm not responsible for the way parliamentary democracies establish
their hierarchies.

                                        Richard Kaplan
                                        kaplan@duq3.duq.edu

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 21 Jul 1993 08:40:59 -0400
From:    KAPLAN@DUQ3.DUQ.EDU
Subject: Re: The Garry Owen

you also might be able to record it off of "They Died With Their Boots On",
the Flynn or Fairbanks movie about Custer.

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 21 Jul 1993 07:47:33 EST
From:    Larry & Kim Jewell <jewell@MACE.CC.PURDUE.EDU>
Subject: History Network

For those of you new to the list, here's information on how to access
the History Net's server.  Documents of historical value and electronic
journals are available from this source (the WWII-L digests can be accessed
through this method or by ftp from byrd.mu.wvnet.edu.)  The instructions
below will direct you toward Marshall University's section, where most
of the WWII files can be found.  (Check "maritime" for file on Naval
History, and usaaf for the fly-boy stuff :-).


To access the files at Marshall University's Historical Archive site,

telnet to HNSource.cc.ukans.edu

login: history

Select Resource: Databases

Select America and Africa.


Instruction for using ftp available on request.

Larry J

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 21 Jul 1993 15:15:45 +0100
From:    Mike Hoffmann <Mike.Hoffmann@AP.MCHP.SNI.DE>
Subject: Re: KOHL VERSUS MITTERAND - a German view

Hello!

I've been following the discussion about whether or not Kohl, other
German politicians or other Germans (military or civilian) should
participate in the June 6, 1994 "celebrations".

As a German I had thought it better to hold back, but after some
thinking, I find I might add a bit.

I myself am definitely no friend of that self-righteous, bloated fatso
(called "der Dicke" even in his minstries :-) that we happen to have as
a Chancellor. But opinion about a politician is marginal. Whether you
happen to like or dislike a politician, be he Clinton, Jelzin, Mitterand,
Major or Kohl is of secondary importance.

He is the leading politician. The position of the head-of-state, the
Bundespraesident v. Weizsaecker is only representative. Comparable to
the British monarch, I would say. This has been designed that way ever since
the desaster of the Weimar Republic. But most of you know that well.

So, the question as to who should appear at the memorial act at the beaches
of the Normandy, should be related to what politicians and representatives of
other countries appear. If Clinton and Mitterand appear, then of course
the peer head-of-state of any other invited country should appear.
If the queen shows up, then v. Weizsaecker is the choice.

It has been talked about whether it would be appropriate to invite any
German representatives at all, due to the possible sensitivity of the
survivors.

Sorry, while I am certainly the last to deny the pains that memories of
these grievous times that have been brought on by the Nazi invasions of
its neighbors brings, in this case I must ask as to "who worries about the
sensitivity of the Germans".

Not be cared about? They were the "baddies", the conquerors who lost,
they brought in on them all by themselves? And so on?

Excuse me, are we living in the 90ies or in the vengeful post-war 40ies?

As has been mentioned even the Russians who have suffered incomparably more
than the Western Allies, have invited German representatives to the
memorial days for Stalingrad. This from a country that has suffered in like
manner as can only be compared to the Holocaust. Again, while I by no means
intend to diminish the memory of the fallen on the Western fronts, the
oft-found (and in the discussion of this subject, IMHO, extreme)
exxageration of the valor and suffering of the Allied combattants is
hurtful and one-eyed to the extreme to the dead of the Poles, the Soviets,
the victimes of the Holocaust - and I must also say the German fallen.

If the memorials held in the Normandy are to memorize those who suffered to
bring Europe back its freedom and those who suffered by being led to their
deaths by a criminal and atrocious "government" (... and - as the French
government is just now finally facing - the latter did not just include
Germans and its allies, but also regimes like Vichy or the Ustasha, who
were only too happy to support Himmler's SS in their genocide) then I
applaud this. Otherwise, especially the French, in one-eyed denial might
side very close to hipocrisy.

But to hold "celebrations", even re-enactments of the battles all the way
to the Rhine, then I can only wonder if some people have indeed not learned
what that catastrophe brought on by the Germans and their Nazi leaders
really meant.

In case you wonder, yes, I also despised the memorial for Sir "Bomber" Harris -
while I would have completely agreed with a site of memorial for the
men (& woman) of the Bomber command, who have sacrificed their lives to
bring the Nazi terror to its knees.

As I've said, we are living in the 90ies, and we should be shocked that
seemingly war and genocide are again becoming a means of choice for petty
dictators and the pursueing of political, nationalistic and racist goals.
The modern, free democracies of *today* - and that does include GErmany -
who fought as enemies then, should unite to memorize and make clear that
these events should never happen again.

To celebrate war&battles that should by todays standards be despised and
those that pursued them, I can only call obscene.  There is nothing to
really "celebrate". The dead should be mourned, not celebrated.

Mike

--
Mike Hoffmann - Internet Administrator, Siemens-Nixdorf AG, SNI SU AP 1123
INTERNET: Mike.Hoffmann@ap.mchp.sni.de
"A system admin's life is a sorry one.  The only advantage he has over
Emergency Room doctors is that malpractice suits are rare.  On the other
hand, ER doctors never have to deal with patients installing new versions
of their own innards!"  -Michael O'Brien

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 21 Jul 1993 09:23:03 EDT
From:    Kurt Luginbyhl <MNHAD007@SIVM.BITNET>
Subject: Re: The Garry Owen

"They Died with Thier Boots On" stars Errol Flynn but of course.  Their
is a scene where a jubulant Custer meets a limey in a saloon who introduces
him to the song.  A good hollywood movie in te the old tradition.
Too bad the Natives did'nt have more victories.  <:{  HAKL

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 21 Jul 1993 15:57:06 +0100
From:    Richard Cummings <CUMMINGSR@ADMINA.RFERL.ORG>
Subject: Re: KOHL VERSUS MITTERAND - a German view

I would like to comment on Mike Hoffmann's message and announce
myself to the group.  I have been lurking for a couple of weeks
and have had not much opportunity to join in.  Who am I?  My
name is Richard Cummings, and I am Director of Security for
Radio Free Europe/Radio Liberty in Munich.  I have lived in
Munich for the last 13 years.  Before that I worked for the
U.S. government in Boston.  I graduated from Boston University
in 1971 with an A.B. in Soviet and East European Studies, and
did graduate work in Munich and later at Boston College.

>From my experiences living and working here in Munich, I have to
say that I agree with most of what Mike had to say.  Germany in
the 1990s is not the Germany of almost 50 years ago.  One really
has to live and work here to experience the political and social
system created from the ashes of WWII. I am not saying forgive
and forget what happened, nor am I diminishing the horrors of the
war, but I guess I am trying to say that there is a new
generation in Germany in political and economic control of a
thriving democracy.  Kohl does not need to attend any anniversary
celebration to get re-elected as I read in an earlier posting.
There is no viable candidate
the SPD side to challange him.  If he wanted to attend, he was
not doing so for cheap political gain.  I cannot speak for him,
nor would I presume that I could, but maybe just maybe he was
thinking of attending the anniversary to show the United States
and other European nations, that Germany in the 1990s is ready
and willing to be part of the Western democratic system.  Germany
has for the first time sent troops outside its terrority to fact
combat in Somalia.  Germany has a recent past to be proud of,
and a not so recent past that brought dishonor to Germany of
50 years ago.  Should the anniversary be thought of as only
a political meeting, than I have to ask why even have it?

A little rambling I know, so I'll stop and regards to all.

--==oo00oo==--
cummingsr@rferl.org
RFE/RL Inc
Munich,Germany

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 21 Jul 1993 09:55:51 EDT
From:    Kurt Luginbyhl <MNHAD007@SIVM.BITNET>
Subject: Re: KOHL VERSUS MITTERAND - a German view

after reading your thoughtful reply I have only one thing to offer and to ask.
Are the ceremonies next year at Normandy a celebration? or are they a
Commemeration?  We at the National Museum of Natural History have had an
exhibit titled "Seeds of Change" commerating the facts of the effects of
1492. Columbus, Cristobo Colon, Or just plain Chris.  A great many people
did not understand at first what the meaning and intention was.  The
Director of the project Dr. Herman Viola emphasized the CHANGES since
1492 in the Americas.  Many of these changes were not positive as we all
know genocide and disease are not pleasant occurances.  Really I'm not
being sarcastic.  Our cultures feel a need to celebrate some events such
as independence and to commerate others such as an event like Columbus Day.
Our government however schedules these day to be convenient unto themselves.
I hope that next years events will be a commemeration honoring the war dead.

Sincerly, Hans Alan Kurt Luginbyhl
          Smithsonian Inst.
          Nat. Mus. of Natural Hist.
          ADP 202-357-1955
          Washington D.C.

"Proud that my father served in WWII in the Army Air Corps and the Air Force."

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 21 Jul 1993 10:12:57 CDT
From:    "Robert J. Granvin" <rjg@UMNSTAT.STAT.UMN.EDU>
Subject: Re: KOHL VERSUS MITTERAND - a German view

A good letter, and one difficult to know how to respond to (kept complete
below), raises good questions about commemorations, celebrations and
remembrances.

As part of the CAF, and whose parents suffered for years under occupation
forces, I have my own insights and perspectives -- as we all do.

There are people who simply want to relive their victories or the defeats
of others.  There are many who can't shake the 40's, but there are many
things that also should not be shaken even if extremely painful.

To let 1994 and 1995 pass is to do a disservice to history, even if it
does possibly hurt or offend some people.  To say "let's just let the
history pass" may solve some of the uneasiness or pain of one group of
people but increase the pain of another by essentially telling them they
are less important.

As an organization, we fly aircraft, build museums and develop educational
programs for the purpose of keeping the memories alive.  If you've ever seen
many of these demonstrations, visited the museums or taken part of the
educational programs, you will notice that there is a clear allied bent to
them -- no surprise, being 95% in the U.S. :-), but you will also notice
something else -- none of them deal with a "goodie vs. baddie" or talk about
"how we crushed the evil people of <yourchoice>."

The importance of remembering WWII and the people who served, fought, lived
and died under it is to remember why it happened, what it was for and how --
given all the knowledge so you won't forget -- to PREVENT it from happening
again.  In war, there are no clear innocent combatants -- all have some
measure of belief in their actions and part in the events leading up to the
cataclysm.

The days where one neighbor, without reason, justification or need, brutally
attacks another.  Today, everything has a sequence of events of which all (or
at least most) parties have some involvement in bringing about.  Learning and
remembering those events helps make it possible to recognize it in the
future.

But remembering and understanding what the _individual_ faced will help make
the horrors of war more realistic and again, help further the need and want
to prevent these actions from happening again.

Battlefield recreations are not a celebration of one groups victory over
another.  They are demonstrations that bring an image -- albeit incredibly
tame compared to the real thing -- to life.  That image may be exciting,
intriguing and a whole lot of fun.  But that results in the desire and
excitement to learn more -- to read, research and understand.

Today, nearly all of the warring parties are friends.  Germany and Japan
are friendly allies and cooperative partners.  The Soviet Union has
disintigrated and wants to become part of this community.

It is therefore difficult, sometimes, to stage a recreation, remembrance or
create a museum, display or memorial that puts Germany and Japan in the
position of aggressor, enemy or "evil."  Some things I do not agree with.
The memorial to Bomber Harris leaves me with mixed feelings.  Yet, I do not
condone that a person be forgotten because today the actions are not
"politically correct."  The Axis soldier fought with just as much need and
dedication as the Allied soldier.  What motivated both sides?

It is not wise to forget the atrocities committed upon certain people.  To
do so would be to state that the importance of protecting a friend's feelings
are more important that remembering the millions who were killed and the
reasons that were behind it.

These next couple years are going to be EXTREMELY painful for many.  There
is no way to prevent it, nor should extreme measures be taken to try.

Germany has a lot of painful history and memories.  So does Japan, Italy,
France...  So does Poland, Norway, Russia, England...  There are a lot of
survivors who have a lot of sensitivities...

However, the most important aspect of these next years is not to relive the
victories of one over another, but to remember those who died, what they
stood for, why they died and why it happened.  This means that it is important
to deal with all sides and all issues -- painful though they may be.  What
_were_ the valid points of the Axis side vs. those of the allied?  Why did
this event happen and why couldn't it be prevented.  Once we are in it, what
happened -- from positive and unbearable.

Commemorations (not celebrations) should be encouraged everywhere.  From
Normandy to Dresden.  From Pearl Harbor to Nagasaki.  From Iwo Jima to
the Bulge.  What happened here and _why_ did it happen?  And: What are we
going to do to make sure it doesn't happen again?

To do anything less doesn't do justice to the _history_.  To forget is to
throw away all everyone sacrificed and anything we might have learned from
it.  The cost was just too high.  If we don't remember and learn, all we did
was waste a lot of resources in terms of human attitude, ability, cooperation
and lives.

> Hello!
>
> I've been following the discussion about whether or not Kohl, other
> German politicians or other Germans (military or civilian) should
> participate in the June 6, 1994 "celebrations".
>
> As a German I had thought it better to hold back, but after some
> thinking, I find I might add a bit.
>
> I myself am definitely no friend of that self-righteous, bloated fatso
> (called "der Dicke" even in his minstries :-) that we happen to have as
> a Chancellor. But opinion about a politician is marginal. Whether you
> happen to like or dislike a politician, be he Clinton, Jelzin, Mitterand,
> Major or Kohl is of secondary importance.
>
> He is the leading politician. The position of the head-of-state, the
> Bundespraesident v. Weizsaecker is only representative. Comparable to
> the British monarch, I would say. This has been designed that way ever since
> the desaster of the Weimar Republic. But most of you know that well.
>
> So, the question as to who should appear at the memorial act at the beaches
> of the Normandy, should be related to what politicians and representatives of
> other countries appear. If Clinton and Mitterand appear, then of course
> the peer head-of-state of any other invited country should appear.
> If the queen shows up, then v. Weizsaecker is the choice.
>
> It has been talked about whether it would be appropriate to invite any
> German representatives at all, due to the possible sensitivity of the
> survivors.
>
> Sorry, while I am certainly the last to deny the pains that memories of
> these grievous times that have been brought on by the Nazi invasions of
> its neighbors brings, in this case I must ask as to "who worries about the
> sensitivity of the Germans".
>
> Not be cared about? They were the "baddies", the conquerors who lost,
> they brought in on them all by themselves? And so on?
>
> Excuse me, are we living in the 90ies or in the vengeful post-war 40ies?
>
> As has been mentioned even the Russians who have suffered incomparably more
> than the Western Allies, have invited German representatives to the
> memorial days for Stalingrad. This from a country that has suffered in like
> manner as can only be compared to the Holocaust. Again, while I by no means
> intend to diminish the memory of the fallen on the Western fronts, the
> oft-found (and in the discussion of this subject, IMHO, extreme)
> exxageration of the valor and suffering of the Allied combattants is
> hurtful and one-eyed to the extreme to the dead of the Poles, the Soviets,
> the victimes of the Holocaust - and I must also say the German fallen.
>
> If the memorials held in the Normandy are to memorize those who suffered to
> bring Europe back its freedom and those who suffered by being led to their
> deaths by a criminal and atrocious "government" (... and - as the French
> government is just now finally facing - the latter did not just include
> Germans and its allies, but also regimes like Vichy or the Ustasha, who
> were only too happy to support Himmler's SS in their genocide) then I
> applaud this. Otherwise, especially the French, in one-eyed denial might
> side very close to hipocrisy.
>
> But to hold "celebrations", even re-enactments of the battles all the way
> to the Rhine, then I can only wonder if some people have indeed not learned
> what that catastrophe brought on by the Germans and their Nazi leaders
> really meant.
>
> In case you wonder, yes, I also despised the memorial for Sir "Bomber" Harris -
> while I would have completely agreed with a site of memorial for the
> men (& woman) of the Bomber command, who have sacrificed their lives to
> bring the Nazi terror to its knees.
>
> As I've said, we are living in the 90ies, and we should be shocked that
> seemingly war and genocide are again becoming a means of choice for petty
> dictators and the pursueing of political, nationalistic and racist goals.
> The modern, free democracies of *today* - and that does include GErmany -
> who fought as enemies then, should unite to memorize and make clear that
> these events should never happen again.
>
> To celebrate war&battles that should by todays standards be despised and
> those that pursued them, I can only call obscene.  There is nothing to
> really "celebrate". The dead should be mourned, not celebrated.
>
> Mike
>
> --
> Mike Hoffmann - Internet Administrator, Siemens-Nixdorf AG, SNI SU AP 1123
> INTERNET: Mike.Hoffmann@ap.mchp.sni.de
> "A system admin's life is a sorry one.  The only advantage he has over
> Emergency Room doctors is that malpractice suits are rare.  On the other
> hand, ER doctors never have to deal with patients installing new versions
> of their own innards!"  -Michael O'Brien
>


--
Robert J. Granvin                                    Southern Minnesota Wing
rjg@stat.umn.edu                                       Confederate Air Force
  You know you've made a gear-up landing when it takes full power to taxi.

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 21 Jul 1993 17:25:42 +0100
From:    Mike Hoffmann <Mike.Hoffmann@AP.MCHP.SNI.DE>
Subject: Re: KOHL VERSUS MITTERAND - a German view

> thriving democracy.  Kohl does not need to attend any anniversary
> celebration to get re-elected as I read in an earlier posting.

To which I might add, that in this one case, he could certainly not be accused
of trying to appease the far-right electorate.

Maybe...
Mike

--
Mike Hoffmann - Internet Administrator, Siemens-Nixdorf AG, SNI SU AP 1123
INTERNET: Mike.Hoffmann@ap.mchp.sni.de
"A system admin's life is a sorry one.  The only advantage he has over
Emergency Room doctors is that malpractice suits are rare.  On the other
hand, ER doctors never have to deal with patients installing new versions
of their own innards!"  -Michael O'Brien

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 21 Jul 1993 19:38:05 EDT
From:    Gotta love the summertime! <IO80912@MAINE.BITNET>
Subject: hi

hello all....
how are you ?

I have a question : What good WWII museums are there
on the eastern US ? (i think wwii-l had a list..
can anyone send it to me ? thanks)


Arnaud Bouis
(in New England at the moment)

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 21 Jul 1993 19:48:16 MDT
From:    Steve Alvin <STEPHEN_ALVIN@DSU1.DSU.NODAK.EDU>
Subject: Re: USAAF 21 JUL 43

On Wed, july 21st,  Jack McKillop wrote:

>     On the ground in Sicily, US Rangers seize Castelvetrano and the
> airport; the US 82d Airborne Division takes San Margherita and the US 3d
> Infantry Division takes Corleone;

And were called thereafter the "Godfather Division" :-).

Steve Alvin
Dickinson State University
STEPHEN_ALVIN@DSU1.DSU.NODAK.EDU
**********************************************************************
*Those who fail to remember history are doomed to repeat it.--Proverb*
*Those who fail to remember history are doomed to repeat my class.-SA*
**********************************************************************

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 21 Jul 1993 21:01:43 -0500
From:    Sandra Villarreal <villarre@CS.UWP.EDU>
Subject: Re: USAAF 21 JUL 43

Is San Margherita a correct spelling?

On Wed, 21 Jul 1993, Steve Alvin wrote:

> On Wed, july 21st,  Jack McKillop wrote:
>
> >     On the ground in Sicily, US Rangers seize Castelvetrano and the
> > airport; the US 82d Airborne Division takes San Margherita and the US 3d
> > Infantry Division takes Corleone;
>
> And were called thereafter the "Godfather Division" :-).
>
> Steve Alvin
> Dickinson State University
> STEPHEN_ALVIN@DSU1.DSU.NODAK.EDU
> **********************************************************************
> *Those who fail to remember history are doomed to repeat it.--Proverb*
> *Those who fail to remember history are doomed to repeat my class.-SA*
> **********************************************************************

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 21 Jul 1993 21:04:31 EST
From:    Larry & Kim Jewell <jewell@MACE.CC.PURDUE.EDU>
Subject: ADMIN: Intro to WWII-L

We've had a rush of new members to the list, so I'll repost the Introduction.
Keep a copy of this and it will answer most of you questions about the
day-to-day operation of the list. (I'll repost this as often as needed.)

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Welcome to WWII-L, a list dedicated to the discussion of the
greatest cataclysm of the Twentieth century (and, hopefully,
the last.)

I'm Larry W. Jewell and I'll be listowner until further
notice.  I can be reached at the addresses listed at the end
of this notice.

WWII-L will be self-moderated.  This means that each of you
will always try to remember that there is a human being on the
other end of the net, and the "Golden Rule" is rule number
one!

Our subject is HUGE and not everyone will be interested in
everything that moves over the mails.  To ease YOUR burden of
sorting the items you wish to read I offer the following
"flags".  They will go FIRST on the Subject: line.
(This section will be enforced when traffic get heavy, otherwise
members may use their discretion on the matter.)

SCI (for discussion of science and technology, may overlap
     with WEAP)
WEAP ( for talk of weapons, useage of weapons, and "My favorite
       weapon.")
POL (Political discussions, such as the effects of the Yalta
     Conference)
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ARC  (For discussion of on-line resources and materials, such as those avail-
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      should be posted under this flag.))

Some items will overlap, of course, but the main thrust of the item
should be clear.  Try not to ask so many questions in a single post
that the flags become inoperative.  Several short posts are preferable
to one long one, and are easier to answer and quote.  You should change
the flag in the subject line if the thread takes a new direction.  If
you reply to a posting which didn't have a flag, please insert the proper
flag.  (This can help categorize the subject for people who have to down-
load the mail via slow modem, one of the main reasons for having the flags
at all.)

You'll be hearing from me if you "forget" this system.  I also
solicit additions to this list.  Please keep this table handy
until you're comfortable with the flags.

Abbreviations are another subject that needs attention.  While many of us
will be comfortable with the most arcane and obscure acronyms and abbreviations
many of the readers of this list are here to learn more about the war and
will have trouble decyphering your articles if they are packed with "LAH",
"CinCUS", "StuG III", etc.  PLEASE expand these terms at least once in your
post.  Similarly, since this list is primarily in English, could we please
translate the "foreign" terms?  A long discussion on "Kido Butai" or "Wacht-
am-Rhine" without an explantion of the terms isn't polite if we exclude part
of the list because they have no clue as to the meaning of the terms.


Now we come to the REALLY hard part.

Some subjects have been beaten to death, and I KNOW that they'll
come up almost as soon as the group gets started.  To save us
all time, I'll ask that the following subjects be covered by
private mail (in other words, talk to someone who CARES.)  I'm
not judging the validity of anyone's arguments one way or the
other in these subject, just that I have yet to see one person
change their mind about them.


1. The Holocaust
2. Did Roosevelt Know About The Coming Attack on Pearl Harbor?
3. (Watch this space...)

One last item, STATE YOUR REFERENCES!  You're in tough company
here.  Some of the folks in this list are VERY sharp, and
you'll end up with egg on your face if you haven't done your
homework.


Normally the listserv will want you to subscribe from you own account rather
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Contact me if listserv gives you any problems and we'll seek a solution.

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If I haven't suffciently confused you, send me e-mail and I'll finish the job:-)


Larry J
Date:         Wed, 16 Sep 1992 18:06:11 CDT
From: DONALD NEWCOMB <NEWCOMB%USMCP6.BITNET@UBVM.cc.buffalo.edu>
Subject:      Getting back articles and the database

From:Larry Jewell <jewell@MACE.CC.PURDUE.EDU>
Larry,
  One of the "niftiest" features of the listserver is the database
search. This allows the user to search for any subject and print
either an index of the "hits" or the articles themselves. For
instance if you mail the command sequence below to "listserv@ubvm.bitnet"
or "listserv@ubvm.cc.buffalo.edu" it will send you an index of all
articles in the archive that deal with weapons (the WEAP: tag).
_
//Job
Database Search DD=Rules
//Rules DD *
sel * in wwii-l where subject contains ("weap:")
index
/*
_
If you change the word "index" to "print" it will return you a copy
of the articles themselves. I think you can start with the listserv
"help" command and find a complete set of instructions  for using the
database. The complete instructions are very complex and should only
be tackled by someone with experience with data searching experience.

Donald R. Newcomb - Univ. of Southern Mississippi - Gulf Park
   <NEWCOMB@USMCP6.BITNET>


Enough talking.  I can be reached at the following addresses;

Larry W. Jewell                      jewell@mace.cc.purdue.edu
2501 Soldier's Home Rd. #58B         JEWELLL@PURCCVM
W. Lafayette, IN, 47906-3571
(317)496-3234


#Larry W. Jewell (ex-USN)  WWII-L Listowner   jewell@mace.cc.purdue.edu     #
#"Sunday's horoscope is noteworthy because of its strange, sudden and wholly#
#unpredictable and inexplicable occurrences, affecting all phases of life." #
#--"Your Horoscope," L.A. Evening Herald Express, Saturday, Dec. 6, 1941.   #

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 21 Jul 1993 21:03:15 -0500
From:    Julio Matos <matos@CS.UWP.EDU>
Subject: Re: USAAF 21 JUL 43

       THANKS FOR THE INFORMATION, i WILL NOT REPEAT THE CLASS.

On Wed, 21 Jul 1993, Steve Alvin wrote:

> On Wed, july 21st,  Jack McKillop wrote:
>
> >     On the ground in Sicily, US Rangers seize Castelvetrano and the
> > airport; the US 82d Airborne Division takes San Margherita and the US 3d
> > Infantry Division takes Corleone;
>
> And were called thereafter the "Godfather Division" :-).
>
> Steve Alvin
> Dickinson State University
> STEPHEN_ALVIN@DSU1.DSU.NODAK.EDU
> **********************************************************************
> *Those who fail to remember history are doomed to repeat it.--Proverb*
> *Those who fail to remember history are doomed to repeat my class.-SA*
> **********************************************************************

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 21 Jul 1993 23:25:02 +0100
From:    Bob Smart <bsmart@SMART.COM>
Subject: Re: hi

> hello all....
> how are you ?
>
> I have a question : What good WWII museums are there
> on the eastern US ? (i think wwii-l had a list..
> can anyone send it to me ? thanks)
>
>
> Arnaud Bouis
> (in New England at the moment)

Arnaud,

I got your letter about two weeks ago

I don't have the list handy but will see if I can dig it up.

Aberdeen Proving Grounds ( Just north of Baltimore Maryland) is open every day
but monday. It is a must see, Armor & ordinance heaven.

Uss Intrepid is in the New York City area. I don't have any details.

Washington Navy Yard in DC and the Smithsonian Air & Space museum should have
some interest.

Marine Corps Air & Ground Museum at Quantico ( Just south of DC) I've never
been there but hear it is good

USS North Carolina in Wilmington NC again I don't have details.

USS Yorktown and other ships at Charlestown Soth Carolina, again no details.

Call me at work ( Toll free call) 1-800-873-8237 when customer support answers
ask to be transfered to me.

-- Bob Smart               Net - bsmart@verdix.com
   Verdix Corp.            Fax - (703) 318-9304
   205 Van Buren           Phone - (703) 318-5808
   Herndon, Va 22070

------------------------------

End of WWII-L Digest - 20 Jul 1993 to 21 Jul 1993
*************************************************

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Status: O

There are 16 messages totalling 528 lines in this issue.

Topics of the day:

  1. USAAF 22 JUL 43
  2. LIST (2)
  3. POL: KOHL VERSUS MITTERAND (2)
  4. GEN: 4TH INFANTRY DIVISION REUNION AND BOOK
  5. hi (2)
  6. Addr: gen
  7. Addr: Garry Owen Song
  8. REF: D-Day Dictionary?
  9. GEN: WELCOME TO RICHARD CUMMINGS
 10. GEN: Re: hi
 11. SCI/GEN - What does it do? (2)
 12. GEN: Eastern US Museums

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 22 Jul 1993 07:07:59 -0400
From:    jem3@CC.BELLCORE.COM
Subject: USAAF 22 JUL 43

COMBAT CHRONOLOGY OF THE US ARMY AIR FORCES
THURSDAY, 22 JULY 1943
FTP SITES
  1. ftp.rutgers.edu in directory pub/wwii/usaf
  2. byrd.mu.wvnet.edu (129.71.32.152) in pub/history/military/airforce/
     wwii_chronology

AIRCRAFT MENTIONED IN THIS REPORT:
  A-20, Douglas Havoc
  B-17, Boeing Flying Fortress
  B-24, Consolidated Liberator
  B-25, North American Mitchell
  B-26, Martin Marauder
  C-47, Douglas Skytrain
  P-38, Lockheed Lightning
  P-40, Curtiss
  Wellington, Vickers (RAF)

AMERICAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  ALASKA (Eleventh Air Force)
    In the Aleutian Islands, 26 B-25's, 17 B-24's, 13 P-40's, and 20
P-38's hit North Head, Main Camp, and the submarine base at Kiska Island,
as well as coastal defenses and AA guns at both Kiska and Little Kiska
Islands, starting numerous fires. Intense and heavy AA fire downs one
B-25 (crew saved) and damages 18 aircraft of which another B-25 crashes
at base. 1 B-25 photographs the S and W Kiska Island shores. 1 B-24 flies
radar reconnaissance over Kiska Island.
    The 77th Bombardment Squadron (Medium), 28th Composite Group, based
on Adak Island begins operating from Attu Island with B-25's.

EUROPEAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Eighth Air Force)
  The results of the first phase of the Combined Bomber Offensive (CBO)
are good according to a report of the British Joint Intelligence Commit-
tee. The report maintains the CBO has caused Germany to adopt a defensive
air strategy resulting in more than half its fighter strength being
employed on the Western Front at the expense of the Eastern and Mediter-
ranean Fronts as well as causing considerable damage to transportation,
the synthetic rubber industry, and the fuel, iron, and coal industries of
the Ruhr.

MEDITERRANEAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  EASTERN MEDITERRANEAN (Ninth Air Force)
    P-40's escort C-47's to Ponte Olivo, Sicily.

  WESTERN MEDITERRANEAN (Northwest African Air Force)
    During the night of 21/22 Jul, Northwest African Strategic Air Force
(NASAF) Wellingtons bomb Capodichino Airfield and Salerno marshalling
yard in Italy. In Sicily, Northwest African Tactical Air Force (NATAF)
light bombers hit Randazzo, the railroad at Falcone, and the road W of
Marina. In Italy during the day, 100+ B-17's bomb the Battipaglia mar-
shalling yard and Foggia; B-26's hit a Salerno bridge and marshalling
yard; and fighters fly a sweep over Maddalena Island, strafing factories,
trucks, and small vessels. In Sicily, NATAF light bombers bomb Adrano,
Paterno, Troina, and Misterbianco.
    On the ground in Sicily, US Seventh Army troops take Palermo; and the
1st Infantry Division continues N, taking Bompietro.
    The 85th and 86th Bombardment Squadrons (Light), 47th Bombardment
Group (Light), transfer from Soliman, Tunisia to Malta with A-20's.

SOUTH PACIFIC THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Thirteenth Air Force)
  In the Solomon Islands, 20+ B-17's and B-24's, 40+ US Navy dive bomb-
ers, and 100+ Allied fighter aircraft attack shipping in the area off
Buin, Bougainville Island. A sea-plane carrier is sunk, and damaging
hits are claimed on several other vessels.

SOUTHWEST PACIFIC THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Fifth Air Force)
  In New Guinea, 50+ B-24's, B-25's, and B-26's blast troops, AA guns,
defensive positions, and targets of opportunity in the battle zones at
Komiatum, on Komiatum Ridge, at Kela Mountain, at Salamaua, and along
trails near Komiatum and Salamaua. B-24's bomb an oil refinery, docks,
and railroad yards at Soerabaja, Java. B-25's hit targets of opportunity
on Selaroe Island in the Moloccas Islands.

SOURCES:
AIR FORCE COMBAT UNITS OF WORLD WAR II, Office of Air Force History,
  Headquarters USAF, 1961, ISBN 0-912799-02-1
COMBAT SQUADRONS OF THE AIR FORCE, WORLD WAR II, Office of Air Force
  History, Headquarters USAF 1982
THE ARMY AIR FORCES IN WORLD WAR II: COMBAT CHRONOLOGY, 1941-1945 by the
  Office of Air Force History, Headquarters USAF, 1973
THE MIGHTY EIGHTH WAR DIARY by Roger A. Freeman, ISBN -85409-071-2

Jack McKillop
USAF (Airways and Air Communications Service)
1955-59


----------------------------------------------------------------------
|  Jack McKillop      |  Those who have long enjoyed such privileges |
|  Bellcore           |  as we enjoy forget in time that men have    |
|  Piscataway, NJ     |  died to win them.     FDR                   |
|  USA                |  jem3@cc.bellcore.com                        |
----------------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 22 Jul 1993 11:56:39 +0200
From:    John Ausland <d_ausland_j@KARI.UIO.NO>
Subject: LIST

  FOR LARRY JEWELL.  I am sorry not to have used a heading with my
initial Kohl versus Mitterand message.  I had no idea there would be
such a respone.
  Glad to see you have had a rush of new members.  I have felt this
through EMAIL about my book.  Paticularly for the benefit of the
new members, I am posting a message about the reunion of my WWII
outfit, the 4th Infantry Division.
  Regards, John Ausland

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 22 Jul 1993 11:57:19 +0200
From:    John Ausland <d_ausland_j@KARI.UIO.NO>
Subject: POL: KOHL VERSUS MITTERAND

  Oslo, July 22.  I have read with great interest all the messages
prompted by my original message.  I have been unable to resolve my
ambivalence about whether Germany should be represented next June 6
in Normandy, but evidently this will not be necessary, since Kohl
seems to be dropping the subject.
  The main impression I get is that the anniversaries which will unfold
from D-Day to VE-Day and then to VJ-Day are going to provide some
heavy weather.  We will, however, survive this and, once they are
over, I suspect WWII will finally fade into the background.  The
"heavy weather" will, however, leave behind debris which will com-
licate dealing with our problems.

*******************************************************************
* John C. Ausland               Tel: +47 22 14 17 68              *
* Land Productions              Fax: +47 22 16 30 92              *
* Sondreveien 4, Entry 2        CIS: 73240,2704                   *
* 0378 Oslo, Norway             Internet: d_ausland_j@kari.uio.no *
*******************************************************************

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 22 Jul 1993 11:56:52 +0200
From:    John Ausland <d_ausland_j@KARI.UIO.NO>
Subject: GEN: 4TH INFANTRY DIVISION REUNION AND BOOK

  Recently, I attended a reunion of the 4th Infantry Division Associa-
tion in Washington, DC.  In addition to giving me a chance to see
some of my World War II comrades, my book LETTERS HOME: A WAR MEMOIR
sold briskly.
  I was also happy to see that Sidney Kramer Books was presenting it
prominently in its military section and that a number of Compuserve
users had already ordered it.
  Before I left the US, my ad appeared in the July 15 issue of the
New York Review of Books, in the section for small publishers.
  James Fallows, Washington Editor of The Atlantic, has just sent me
an EMAIL message authorizing me to to use the following as his
reaction to the book:

"John Ausland is known to many readers for his insightful essays about
international relations. 'Letters Home' shows the same sensibility and grace
of expression , applied to the daily reality of life during war. I found this
a vivid and revealing book.  Very well written and engrossing."

  For those of you who have tuned in recently, if you will send me an
EMAIL message, I will be glad to send you a flyer telling you more about
the book and how to order it, if you decide to do so.  If you are living
outside the US, please let me know, for it might be best to get the book
directly from me rather than from Kramer.

*******************************************************************
* John C. Ausland               Tel: +47 22 14 17 68              *
* Land Productions              Fax: +47 22 16 30 92              *
* Sondreveien 4, Entry 2        CIS: 73240,2704                   *
* 0378 Oslo, Norway             Internet: d_ausland_j@kari.uio.no *
*******************************************************************

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 22 Jul 1993 07:25:27 -0400
From:    jem3@CC.BELLCORE.COM
Subject: Re: hi

        Arnaud,

        I got your letter about two weeks ago

        I don't have the list handy but will see if I can dig it up.


        Uss Intrepid is in the New York City area. I don't have any details.

        -- Bob Smart               Net - bsmart@verdix.com
           Verdix Corp.            Fax - (703) 318-9304
           205 Van Buren           Phone - (703) 318-5808
           Herndon, Va 22070

The Intrepid Sea-Air Space Museum is located at Pier 86, West 46th
Street and Twelfth Avenue, in New York City.  There are a number of
aircraft, including a P-2 (P2V) on the deck; the museum itself is
the whole hanger deck from bow to stern with numerous exhibits.
The Intrepid (CV/CVA/CVS-11) is moored on the southside of the
pier; a submarine, which is also part of the museum, is moored on
the north side.  I have been aboard the Intrepid several times but
have not made the submarine yet.  You should allow a minimum of 3-4
hours to see everything the Intrepid.

----------------------------------------------------------------------
|  Jack McKillop      |  Those who have long enjoyed such privileges |
|  Bellcore           |  as we enjoy forget in time that men have    |
|  Piscataway, NJ     |  died to win them.     FDR                   |
|  USA                |  jem3@cc.bellcore.com                        |
----------------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 20 Jul 1993 17:32:54 EDT
From:    RICHARD KING <RKING@VUNET.VINU.EDU>
Subject: Addr: gen

I am submitting the following commentary that was posted
on the new American Studies list (H-AMSTDY). If anyone on the
WWII list would like to respond to it I will try to
send in the commentaries to the H-AMSTY list in reply. I
really don't feel qualified to comment myself, but it just
doesn't seem accurate to me.
    The posting in question concerns concentration camps:
        "The 'liberation' label is problematic...American troops
         did not 'liberate' concentration/death camp prisoners
         who were gay, but in fact committed them to new,
         Americanized institutions like mental hospitals,
         new prisons etc. Liberation was on U.S. terms that
         sometimes echoed Nazi ideology (as in this case)."

Note I am leaving the author of this note anonymous. It
was submitted as part of a very interesting discussion
concerning the new Holocaust Museum in Washing D.C. Anyone
want to tackle it?

*********************************************************
RKING@VUNET.VINU.EDU
Richard L. King, Reference Librarian, Vincennes (IN) Univ.

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 20 Jul 1993 17:51:13 EDT
From:    RICHARD KING <RKING@VUNET.VINU.EDU>
Subject: Addr: Garry Owen Song

According to the POPULAR SONG INDEX the words and music to
"Garry Owen" ("Listen here, laddie boy, said a father one night..."
and the refrain, "Garry Owen was a mighty man...") is to be
found in HAPPINESS IS...70 IRISH SONGS (New York: Big 2 Music
Corp., 1976).
     Another listing is for a song called "Garryowen" ("Let
Bacchus's sons be not dismayed..." and the refrain, "Instead
of spa, we'll drink brown ale") in IRISH SONGS, by Burl Ives
(New York: Duell, Sloan and Pearce, 1958).
     I suggest you check local libraries to see if they have
these books, then at least you will have the sheet music
and words (call the reference desk and ask, to save time--
people often don't realize librarians provide telephone
reference, or for that matter, Internet reference).
     I hope this helps.
**************************************************************
Richard L. King, Reference Librarian, Vincennes (IN) Univ.
RKING@VUNET.VINU.EDU

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 22 Jul 1993 07:48:31 EST
From:    Larry & Kim Jewell <jewell@MACE.CC.PURDUE.EDU>
Subject: REF: D-Day Dictionary?

Two years ago Guenther Rothenberg mentioned to me that he had been
approached for a submission to a proposed D-Day Dictionary/Encyclopedia.

Has anyone else heard of this?  Dr. G. said it was going to be a mulit-
volume work but said little else.  (He was asked to provide information
on Belgian units that took part in the invasion.  He told me that he would
have loved to do so except that there were no Belgian units involved.)

TIA,
Larry J

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 22 Jul 1993 07:53:35 EST
From:    Larry & Kim Jewell <jewell@MACE.CC.PURDUE.EDU>
Subject: Re: LIST

>
>   FOR LARRY JEWELL.  I am sorry not to have used a heading with my
> initial Kohl versus Mitterand message.  I had no idea there would be
> such a respone.

   The flags were developed to handle the almost impossible load of
traffic generated when the list first started up.  150+ messages in one
day motivated me to provide some method of sorting the subject matter.
The alternative to the flags is, of course, a consistent subject line.
During high traffic period I will be more demanding about the flags, but
while traffic is low it's pretty much up to the members as to when to
use them.  As a group you've all been very good about  this matter and I've
seldom felt the need to speak up.  Bravo Zulu to all ;-).

>   Glad to see you have had a rush of new members.  I have felt this
> through EMAIL about my book.  Paticularly for the benefit of the
> new members, I am posting a message about the reunion of my WWII
> outfit, the 4th Infantry Division.

  Glad to have it.

>   Regards, John Ausland

Larry J

#L.W. Jewell WWII-L Listowner JEWELL@MACE.CC.PURDUE.EDU
#"Sunday's horoscope is note worthy because of its strange, sudden and wholly
#unpredictable and inexplicable occurrences, affecting all phases of life."
#"Your Horoscope" L.A. Evening Herald Express, Sat, 12/06/41  #

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 22 Jul 1993 08:09:35 EDT
From:    "AD16000@NEMOMUS.BITNET. --Scherrer,
         Tim A." <AD16%NEMOMUS.BITNET@MIZZOU1.MISSOURI.EDU>
Subject: hi

Sorry to do this to the entire list, but I couldn't do it
personally--Arnaud--give me a call.  Thanks--Tim

************************************************************************
*  Tim A. Scherrer          "You'll be fighting WWII for the rest of   *
*  Facilities Supervisor     your life", Ron Scherrer, 1971            *
*  WP:816-785-5253                                                     *
*  HP:816-665-6704                                                     *
*  ID# AD16%NEMOMUS@ACADEMIC.NEMOSTATE.EDU                             *
************************************************************************

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 22 Jul 1993 15:36:23 +0200
From:    John Ausland <d_ausland_j@KARI.UIO.NO>
Subject: GEN: WELCOME TO RICHARD CUMMINGS

  Oslo, July 22.  Richard, welcome to WWII-L.  I get the RFE/RL
news bulletin each day from the American Embassy Reference Center
BBS.  It is extremely helpful.
  Look forward to your further contributions.
  Regards, John Ausland

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 22 Jul 1993 08:52:58 -0500
From:    "Sidney W. Kitchel" <kitchel@OCTOPUS.DPSI.COM>
Subject: GEN: Re: hi

Gotta love the summertime! writes:
|->
|-> hello all....
|-> how are you ?
|->
|-> I have a question : What good WWII museums are there
|-> on the eastern US ? (i think wwii-l had a list..
|-> can anyone send it to me ? thanks)

        Well, as a Westerner trapped in the Midwest, I'll take
"eastern US" very broadly.

For airplanes:

        1. Dayton, Ohio: the U.S. Air Force Museum

        2. Suitland, Md: the Paul Garber Restoration Facility
                (a part of the Smithsonian Air and Space Museum)

        3. Washington, D.C.: the Smithsonian Air and Space Museum

For naval stuff:

        1. Fall River, Mass.: Battleship Massachusetts, Lionfish, and
                Joseph P. Kennedy

        2. New York City, NY: Intrepid Sea-Air-Space Museum

        3. Groton, Conn.: Submarine Force Museum

        4. Annapolis, Md.: US Naval Academy, Museum run by the U.S.
                Naval Institute, but you have to want to see models


                                                        --Sid
--
Sidney W. Kitchel           kitchel@cs.indiana.edu, kitchel@dpsi.com
Data Parallel Systems, Inc.  ============||  DPSI  ||===============
4617 E. Morningside Drive                             (812) 334-8100
Bloomington, Indiana,  47408  USA               FAX:  (812) 334-8121

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 22 Jul 1993 09:58:06 EDT
From:    "William B. Thacker" <wbt@CBEMF.ATT.COM>
Subject: Re: SCI/GEN - What does it do?

John Riegsecker writes:

> I have a question about an object I saw at the museum.  It
> consisted of a flat disk about an inch thick and about 8-9" in diameter.
> There were teeth on the outside edge of the disk so that it looked like a
> gear.  There was a small wheel of about 2.5" in diameter mounted
> perpendicular to the outside of the larger wheel.  The small wheel had a
> little handle or crank on it.  Evidently you turned the crank and the
> little wheel moved around the larger wheel.  The caption said it computed B
> to the 2/3 power, that is the cube root of the square of the number B.  My
> question is, what was this thing used for?

Hrmm.  Well, such a calculation might be useful for ballistic computations
or navigation, as you suggested.  You mentioned shipyards, and it struck me
that the 2/3 power is the ratio of surface area to volume as an object's
size changes.  (Take a sphere of unit radius:  it's surface area is
proportional to the radius squared, while volume is proportional to radius
cubed.   If the radius goes from one unit to two, surface area increases by
a factor of four, volume by a factor of eight.  The surface area-to-volume
ratio is r ^(2/3).

I still can't figure how that'd be used in construction, but it would be
pretty handy for design.  Anything from the fluid dynamics of the hull form
to the size of the structural members or weight of the armor could be
calculated using this.

But then, the designers wouldn't have rooms full of 8" metal gearboxes to
calculate various exponents, they'd use slide rules and data tables.

Should you learn its purpose, I'd be keen to know.

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Bill Thacker             AT&T Network Systems       attmail!att!cbemf!wbt
Quality Engineer            Columbus, Ohio              wbt@cbemf.att.com
          "Giving money and power to government is like giving
         whiskey and car keys to teenage boys." - P.J. O'Rourke

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 22 Jul 1993 11:42:18 -0400
From:    Max Hare <maxc@URSUS1.URSUS.MAINE.EDU>
Subject: GEN: Eastern US Museums

Someone correct me if Im wrong but I have heard that the naval display
at Fall River, Massachusetts also has a complete PT (torpedo boat)
museum with two complete examples...one is a rare, complete Elco
manufactured boat.  Does anyone know more about this?

Max C. Calderwood
University of Southern Maine
Gorham, ME
MAXC@URSUS1.URSUS.MAINE.EDU

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 22 Jul 1993 13:55:01 CDT
From:    "Robert J. Granvin" <rjg@UMNSTAT.STAT.UMN.EDU>
Subject: Re: POL: KOHL VERSUS MITTERAND

>   Oslo, July 22.  I have read with great interest all the messages
> prompted by my original message.  I have been unable to resolve my
> ambivalence about whether Germany should be represented next June 6
> in Normandy, but evidently this will not be necessary, since Kohl
> seems to be dropping the subject.
>   The main impression I get is that the anniversaries which will unfold
> from D-Day to VE-Day and then to VJ-Day are going to provide some
> heavy weather.  We will, however, survive this and, once they are
> over, I suspect WWII will finally fade into the background.  The
> "heavy weather" will, however, leave behind debris which will com-
> licate dealing with our problems.

For the sake of everyone who served and the inpact WWII had on the world
to date and in the future, I hope that WWII never "fades into the
background."  It is important to keep the knowledge, memories, histories
and lessons alive.  The horrors of WWII today are opening up a highschool
text book and see this huge event reduced to a single chapter.

Ironically, Hitler tried to create a Thousand Year Reich.  The effects of
that attempt will probably still be felt in some manner a thousand years
from now.  One of the biggest, most costly alteration in world politics,
borders and directions has to be remembered.

After 1995, however, a lot of the flag-waving, anniversary symposiums,
major recreations, weekly news specials, etc. will be less obvious.  Some
time after that, we can count on nearly every first-hand account being lost
to the ravages of time.

I just hope that the whole experience does not fade away with it...

--
Robert J. Granvin                                    Southern Minnesota Wing
rjg@stat.umn.edu                                       Confederate Air Force
  You know you've made a gear-up landing when it takes full power to taxi.

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 22 Jul 1993 20:36:05 +0100
From:    Bob Smart <bsmart@SMART.COM>
Subject: Re: SCI/GEN - What does it do?

> John Riegsecker writes:
>
> > I have a question about an object I saw at the museum.  It
> > consisted of a flat disk about an inch thick and about 8-9" in diameter.
> > There were teeth on the outside edge of the disk so that it looked like a
> > gear.  There was a small wheel of about 2.5" in diameter mounted
> > perpendicular to the outside of the larger wheel.  The small wheel had a
> > little handle or crank on it.  Evidently you turned the crank and the
> > little wheel moved around the larger wheel.  The caption said it computed B
> > to the 2/3 power, that is the cube root of the square of the number B.  My
> > question is, what was this thing used for?
>
> Hrmm.  Well, such a calculation might be useful for ballistic computations
> or navigation, as you suggested.  You mentioned shipyards, and it struck me

Sounds like part of the mechanical analog fire control computer.

-- Bob Smart               Net - bsmart@smart.com or bsmart@verdix.com
   Verdix Corp.            Fax - (703) 318-9304
   205 Van Buren           Phone - (703) 318-5808
   Herndon, Va 22070

------------------------------

End of WWII-L Digest - 21 Jul 1993 to 22 Jul 1993
*************************************************

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Status: O

There are 7 messages totalling 735 lines in this issue.

Topics of the day:

  1. POL: KOHL VERSUS MITTERAND
  2. USAAF 23 JUL 43
  3. BIO: Douglas MacArthur
  4. BIO: George Marshall
  5. BIO: Omar Bradley
  6. USAAF 24-25 JUL 43
  7. Ref: Holocaust atlas

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 23 Jul 1993 11:11:34 +0200
From:    John Ausland <d_ausland_j@KARI.UIO.NO>
Subject: POL: KOHL VERSUS MITTERAND

ROBERT GRANVIN SAID:

For the sake of everyone who served and the inpact WWII had on the world
to date and in the future, I hope that WWII never "fades into the
background."  It is important to keep the knowledge, memories, histories
and lessons alive.  The horrors of WWII today are opening up a highschool
text book and see this huge event reduced to a single chapter.

Ironically, Hitler tried to create a Thousand Year Reich.  The effects of
that attempt will probably still be felt in some manner a thousand years
from now.  One of the biggest, most costly alteration in world politics,
borders and directions has to be remembered.

After 1995, however, a lot of the flag-waving, anniversary symposiums,
major recreations, weekly news specials, etc. will be less obvious.  Some
time after that, we can count on nearly every first-hand account being lost
to the ravages of time.

I just hope that the whole experience does not fade away with it...
END QUOTE

I am not talking about what I want to see so much as I what I expect.

While memories of WWII will linger for a long time in Europe, they will
fade more quickly in the US, which was not so directly touched.  For
my generation, WWII was the great event.  For my children's, it was
Viet Nam.  For them, WWII is history, and it is hard to get people
excited about historical events.

Who today suffers because of the Napoleonic wars?  Napoleon, who was
his day's Hitler in the sense he wanted to conquer all of Europe, is
today widely respected.  In France, he is a national hero.

Because of the holocaust, I doubt Hitler will ever become a national
hero.  If he had limited himself to military conquests, I would not
be so sure.  After all, look what happened to Bismarck.

*******************************************************************
* John C. Ausland               Tel: +47 22 14 17 68              *
* Land Productions              Fax: +47 22 16 30 92              *
* Sondreveien 4, Entry 2        CIS: 73240,2704                   *
* 0378 Oslo, Norway             Internet: d_ausland_j@kari.uio.no *
*******************************************************************

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 23 Jul 1993 07:21:04 -0400
From:    jem3@CC.BELLCORE.COM
Subject: USAAF 23 JUL 43

COMBAT CHRONOLOGY OF THE US ARMY AIR FORCES
FRIDAY, 23 JULY 1943
FTP SITES
  1. ftp.rutgers.edu in directory pub/wwii/usaf
  2. byrd.mu.wvnet.edu (129.71.32.152) in pub/history/military/airforce/
     wwii_chronology

AIRCRAFT MENTIONED IN THIS REPORT:
  A-20, Douglas Havoc
  B-17, Boeing Flying Fortress
  B-24, Consolidated Liberator
  B-25, North American Mitchell
  B-26, Martin Marauder
  Beaufighter, Bristol
  C-47, Douglas Skytrain
  P-39, Bell Airacobra
  P-40, Curtiss

AMERICAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  ANTISUBMARINE WARFARE (AAF Antisubmarine Command)
    The 23d Antisubmarine Squadron (Heavy), 26th Antisubmarine Wing, which
has been operating from Langley Field, Hampton, Virginia with B-25's,
returns to it's base at Jacksonville Municipal Airport, Florida.

MEDITERRANEAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  EASTERN MEDITERRANEAN (Ninth Air Force)
    P-40's escort C-47's to Licata, Sicily. Royal Air Force (RAF) heavy
bombers hit Reggio di Calabria, Italy Airfield.

  WESTERN MEDITERRANEAN (Northwest African Air Force)
    Northwest African Strategic Air Force (NASAF) B-17's, B-25's, and
B-26's bomb Leverano and Crotone, Italy, and Aquino Airfield, Sicily. In
Sicily, Northwest African Tactical Air Force (NATAF) medium bombers and
fighters bomb and strafe Misterbianco, transport in the Nicosia-Troina-
Randazzo areas, and bridges and landing craft in the coastal area around
Santo Stefano di Camastra and Orlando.
    On the ground in Sicily, the US Seventh Army mops up in W Sicily. The
British Eighth Army's 30 Corps meets firm opposition as it moves E from
Leonforte.
    HQ XII Bomber Command transfers from Constantine, Algeria to Tunis,
Tunisia.
    The 97th Bombardment Squadron (Light), 47th Bombardment Group (Light)
transfers with A-20's from Soliman, Tunisia to Malta.
    A detachment of the 414th Night Fighter Squadron, 2d Air Defense
Wing, based at Rerhaia, Algeria begins operating from Protville, Tunisia
with Beaufighters. The squadron will fly it's first combat mission
tomorrow.
    A detachment of the 415th Night Fighter Squadron, 1st Air Defense
Wing, based at Monastir, Tunisia begins operating from Protville, Tunisia
with Beaufighters.

SOUTH PACIFIC THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Thirteenth Air Force)
  In the Solomon Islands, B-25's and P-40's, along with US Navy dive
bombers, pound the Rekata Bay area on Santa Isabel Island.
  The 67th Fighter Squadron, 347th Fighter Group, transfers with P-39's
from New Caledonia Island to Woodlark Island off the SE coast of New
Guinea.

SOUTHWEST PACIFIC THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Fifth Air Force)
  In New Guinea, B-25's, B-26's, B-24's, and B-17's again pound targets
in coastal NE New Guinea, hitting Malolo, Asini, Busama, Voco Point, and
Salamaua, blasting barges from Hanisch Harbor to Wald Bay and Cape
Busching, and thoroughly bomb Bogadjim.

SOURCES:
AIR FORCE COMBAT UNITS OF WORLD WAR II, Office of Air Force History,
  Headquarters USAF, 1961, ISBN 0-912799-02-1
COMBAT SQUADRONS OF THE AIR FORCE, WORLD WAR II, Office of Air Force
  History, Headquarters USAF 1982
THE ARMY AIR FORCES IN WORLD WAR II: COMBAT CHRONOLOGY, 1941-1945 by the
  Office of Air Force History, Headquarters USAF, 1973
THE MIGHTY EIGHTH WAR DIARY by Roger A. Freeman, ISBN 1-85409-071-2

Jack McKillop
USAF (Airways and Air Communications Service)
1955-59


----------------------------------------------------------------------
|  Jack McKillop      |  Those who have long enjoyed such privileges |
|  Bellcore           |  as we enjoy forget in time that men have    |
|  Piscataway, NJ     |  died to win them.     FDR                   |
|  USA                |  jem3@cc.bellcore.com                        |
----------------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 23 Jul 1993 07:21:11 EST
From:    Larry & Kim Jewell <jewell@MACE.CC.PURDUE.EDU>
Subject: BIO: Douglas MacArthur

(First in the series, since Kim is a die-hard Dougie Mac fan :-).

Douglas MacArthur was born in Little Rock, Arkansas, on 26
January 1880

*** graduated from the United States Military Academy, 1903

*** was commissioned a second lieutenant of engineers and served
in the Philippines, 1903-1904

*** was promoted to first lieutenant, April 1904

*** was an engineer officer and aide to the commander of the
Pacific Division, 1904-1906

*** served with the 2d Engineer Battalion, attended the Engineer
School and was aide to President Theodore Roosevelt, 1906-1908

*** was troop commander, adjutant, and was Army Service Schools
instructor at Fort Leavenworth, 1908-1912

*** was promoted to captain, February 1911

*** was on the General Staff, 1913-1917

*** took part in the Vera Cruz Expedition

*** was promoted to major, December 1915, and colonel, August
1917

*** was chief of staff of the 42d Division in France, 1917-1918

*** was promoted to brigadier general in the National Army, June
1918, took part in Marne operations and commanded the 84th
Infantry Brigade in the St. Mihiel and Meuse-Argonne offensives

*** commanded the 42d Division in the Sedan offensive, 1918

*** served with the Army of Occupation, 1918-1919

*** was superintendent of the United States Military Academy,
1919-1922

*** became a brigadier general in the Regular Army, January,
1920

*** married Louise Cromwell Brooks, 1922 (divorced 1929)

*** was promoted to major general, January 1925

*** successively commanded the District of Manila, 1922-1923,
the Fourth and Third Corps Areas, 1925-1928, and the Ninth Corps
Area, 1930

*** was promoted to temporary general, November 1930

*** was chief of staff of the United States Army, 21 November
1930-1 October 1935; stressed Army deficiencies in personnel and
materiel, presided over development of plans for industrial
mobilization and manpower procurement, established an Air Force
headquarters, administered Army control over the Civilian
Conservation Corps, and supervised eviction of "bonus marchers"
from Washington

*** resumed his permanent rank of major general and became
military adviser to the government of the Philippines, 1935-1941

*** married Jean Marie Faircloth, 1937

*** retired from active service, December 1937 but continued as
adviser to the Philippine government

*** was recalled to active duty as lieutenant general and named
commander, United States Army Forces in the Far East, July 1941

*** was promoted to temporary general, December 1941

*** led American forces in Pacific campaigns as Supreme Allied
Commander, 1941-1945

*** was promoted to temporary General of the Army, December 1944

*** received the Medal of Honor for Philippine defense
preparations and operations

*** was appointed Supreme Allied Commander, Japan, 1945

*** rank as General of the Army made permanent, April 1946

*** was designated commander in chief Far East Command 1947

*** upon the North Korean invasion of South Korea was designated
commander, United Nations Command in the Far East, July, 1950

*** was relieved of his command by President Truman, April 1951

*** died in Washington, D.C., on 5 April 1964.

From: COMMANDING GENERALS AND CHIEFS OF STAFF, 1775-1982,
William Gardner Bell, Center of Military History, United States
Army, Washington, D.C., 1983

Transcribed and edited by:
Larry W. Jewell
jewell@mace.cc.purdue.edu

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 23 Jul 1993 07:50:44 EST
From:    Larry & Kim Jewell <jewell@MACE.CC.PURDUE.EDU>
Subject: BIO: George Marshall

George Catlett Marshall was born in Uniontown, Pennsylvania, on
31 December 1880

*** graduated from Virginia Military Institute, 1901

*** married Elizabeth Carter Cole, 1902 (deceased 1927)

*** was commissioned a second lieutenant, February 1902, and
served with the 30th Infantry in the Philippines, 1902-1903, and
at Fort Reno, 1903-1906

*** was promoted to first lieutenant, March 1907

*** at Fort Leavenworth, graduated from the Infantry and Cavalry
School (1907) and was a student (1908) and instructor (1908-
1910) at the Staff College

*** was inspector-instructor of the Massachusetts National
Guard, 1911-1912, then served with the 4th Infantry at Forts
Logan H. Roots and Crocket, and the 13th Infantry in the
Philippines, 1913-1916

*** was promoted to captain, July 1917, and then to temporary
major, August 1917, lieutenant colonel, January 1918, and
colonel, August 1918

*** served with the American Expeditionary Forces in France as
operations officer of the 1st Division and the First Army, and
chief of staff of the VIII Corps, 1917-1918, participating in
the Cantigny, Aisne-Marne, St. Mihiel, and Meuse-Argonne
operations

*** was aide to General John J. Pershing, 1919-1924

*** was promoted to permanent major, July 1920, and lieutenant
colonel, August 1923

*** commanded the 15th Infantry in China, 1924-1927

*** was instructor at the Army War College, 1927, and assistant
commandant of the Infantry School at Fort Benning, 1927-1932

*** married Katherine Boyce Tupper Brown, 1930

*** was promoted to colonel and placed in command of the 8th
Infantry at Fort Screven, September 1933

*** was senior instructor of the Illinois National Guard, 1933-
1936

*** was promoted to brigadier general, October 1936, and was
commander of the 5th Infantry Brigade, 1936-1938

*** was head of the War Plans Division, General Staff, 1938

*** was deputy chief of staff, 1938-1939, and acting chief,
July-September 1939

*** was promoted to major general and immediately full general,
September 1939

*** was chief of staff of the United States Army, 1 September
1939-18 November 1945

*** centralized the professional leadership of the Army in the
chief of staff's office

*** exercised control over mobilization, staff planning,
industrial conversion, and personnel requirements

*** streamlined administration and tactical organization

*** mastered grand strategy and was the principal American
military architect of Allied victory

*** was promoted to temporary grade of General of the Army,
December 1944 (made permanent retroactively in April 1946)

*** was special representative of the president to China, 1945-
1947

*** retired from active service February 1947

*** was secretary of state, 21 January 1947-21 January 1949

*** was the architect of the Marshall Plan to aid European
nations, April 1948

*** was restored to the active list, March 1949

*** was president of the American Red Cross, 1949-1950

*** was secretary of defense, 12 September 1950-12 September
1951

*** received the Nobel Peace Prize for the Marshall Plan, 1953

*** was chairman of the American Battle Monuments Commission,
1949-1959

*** died in Washington, D.C., on 16 October 1959.


From: COMMANDING GENERALS AND CHIEFS OF STAFF, 1775-1982,
William Gardner Bell, Center of Military History, United States
Army, Washington, D.C., 1983

Transcribed and edited by:
Larry W. Jewell
jewell@mace.cc.purdue.edu

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 23 Jul 1993 13:44:17 EST
From:    Larry & Kim Jewell <jewell@MACE.CC.PURDUE.EDU>
Subject: BIO: Omar Bradley

Omar Nelson Bradley was born in Clark, Missouri, on 12
February 1893

*** graduated from the United States Military Academy, 1915,
was commissioned a second lieutenant, and assigned to the
14th Infantry, June 1915

*** married Mary Quayle, 1916 (deceased 1965)

*** performed troop duty in the west, 1915-1919

*** was promoted to first lieutenant, July 1916, to captain,
May 1917, and to temporary major, June 1918

*** was on Reserve Officer Training Corps duty in Minnesota
and South Dakota, 1919-1920

*** was instructor in mathematics at West Point, 1920-1924

*** reverted to grade of captain, 1920 and 1922, and was
returned to major, 1922 and 1924

*** graduated from the advanced course at the Infantry
School at Fort Benning, 1925

*** served in Hawaii with both the 19th and 27th Infantry,
1925-1927, and was in charge of National Guard and Reserve
affairs for the Hawaiian Islands, 1927-1928

*** graduated from the Command and General Staff School at
Fort Leavenworth, 1929

*** was instructor in tactics and weapons at the Infantry
School, 1929-1933

*** graduated from the Army war College, 1934

*** was instructor in tactics and plans and training officer
at the United States Military Academy, 1934-1938

*** was promoted to lieutenant colonel, June 1936

*** was chief of the Operations Branch, G-1, war Department
headquarters, 1938-1940

*** was assistant secretary of the General Staff, 1940-1941

*** was promoted to temporary brigadier general, February
1941

*** was commandant of the Infantry School and set up the
Infantry Officer Candidate Program, 1941-1942

*** was promoted to the temporary ranks of major general,
February 1942, and lieutenant general, June 1943

*** successively commanded the 82d and 28th Infantry
Divisions, 1942-1943

*** was personal representative in the field for the
commander of the North African Theater of Operations, 1943

*** commanded II Corps in operations against Axis forces in
North Africa and Sicily, 1943

*** was promoted to permanent ranks of brigadier general
September 1943 and major general, September 1944

*** commanded the First Army and the 12th Army Group in the
invasion and final campaigns of western Europe, 1944-1945

*** was promoted to temporary general, March 1945, a rank
and date made permanent in January 1949

*** was temporary administrator of veterans affairs, 1945-
1947

*** was chief of staff of the United States Army, 7 February
1948-16 August 1949

*** responded to the National Security Act of 1947 by
initiating a study of Army organization that led to
appointment of a vice chief of staff and two deputies and to
consolidation of technical services under the director of
logistics, administrative services under the director of
personnel and administration and financial and management
functions under the comptroller of the Army

*** was the first chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, 16
August 1949-16 August 1953. was promoted to General of the
Army, September 1950

*** was first chairman of the Military Staff Committee of
the North Atlantic Treaty Organization, 1949-1950

*** married Esther Dora Buhler, 1966

*** while attending an Army Association meeting in New York
City, died on 8 April 1981.

From: COMMANDING GENERALS AND CHIEFS OF STAFF, 1775-1982,
William Gardner Bell, Center of Military History, United States
Army, Washington, D.C., 1983

Transcribed and edited by:
Larry W. Jewell
jewell@mace.cc.purdue.edu

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 23 Jul 1993 16:00:06 -0400
From:    jem3@CC.BELLCORE.COM
Subject: USAAF 24-25 JUL 43

COMBAT CHRONOLOGY OF THE US ARMY AIR FORCES
SATURDAY, 24 JULY 1943
FTP SITES
  1. ftp.rutgers.edu in directory pub/wwii/usaf
  2. byrd.mu.wvnet.edu (129.71.32.152) in pub/history/military/airforce/
     wwii_chronology

AIRCRAFT MENTIONED IN THIS REPORT:
  B-17, Boeing Flying Fortress
  B-24, Consolidated Liberator
  B-25, North American Mitchell
  B-26, Martin Marauder
  B-40, Boeing Flying Fortress
  P-40, Curtiss

AMERICAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  ALASKA (Eleventh Air Force)
    In the Aleutian Islands, 62 P-40's fly 9 missions to Kiska Island [2
of them with Royal Canadian Air Force (RCAF) pilots] bombing the runway
and scoring many hits. An AA battery takes a direct hit and explodes. AA
guns are strafed on North Head and Little Kiska Island. Intense AA fire
downs 1 P-40.

CENTRAL PACIFIC THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Seventh Air Force)
  8 B-24's from Midway Island attack Wake Island, bombing oil storage,
barracks, and a gun emplacement. 20-30 Zekes attack the formation; 9
fighters are claimed destroyed; 1 B-24 is lost in a collision with a
falling Japanese fighter.

EUROPEAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Eighth Air Force)
  VIII Bomber Command Mission Number 75: Three targets in Norway are
attacked. This is Eighth's first mission to Norway and its longest (1,900
miles or 3,040 km round trip) to date.
    1. 179 B-17's and 1 YB-40 are dispatched against the nitrate works at
Heroya, Norway; 167 aircraft hit the target at 1317-1414 hours; they
claim 9-2-0 Luftwaffe aircraft; 1 B-17 is lost and 53 are damaged;
casualties are 3 WIA and 10 MIA. Work at the plant is disrupted for 3.5
months, and unfinished aluminum and magnesium plants are damaged and
subsequently abandoned by the Germans.
    2. 45 B-17's are dispatched against the port area at Trondheim; 41
hit the target; they claim 4-2-3 Luftwaffe aircraft; 1 B-17 is damaged
beyond repair and 9 are damaged; casualties are 3 WIA.
    3. 84 B-17's are dispatched against the port area at Bergen; they
find 10/10 cloud cover and return to base with their bombs.
  Crews successfully experiment with a new assembly procedure for occasions
when bad weather conditions prevent ascent in formation. Aircraft take
off individually on instruments, proceed to a designated splasher beacon
for group formation, and then along line of 3 splasher beacons for force
assembly. The method works well and makes possible many future missions
which might otherwise have been abandoned.

MEDITERRANEAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  EASTERN MEDITERRANEAN (Ninth Air Force)
    In Sicily, P-40's fly armored reconnaissance and fighter-bomber
missions over the Adrano and Milazzo areas. The attacks are concentrated
against motor transport targets.

  WESTERN MEDITERRANEAN (Northwest African Air Force)
    In Italy, Northwest African Strategic Air Force (NASAF) B-17's and
B-25's bomb the railroad yards at Bologna and B-26's hit the railroad
yards at Paola. In Sicily, Northwest African Tactical Air Force (NATAF)
fighter-bombers hit barges, warships, and docks in the Messina-Milazzo
area and transport NE of Mount Etna.
    On the ground in Sicily, the US Seventh Army continues to mop up the
W part of Sicily. Further E, the US 45th Infantry Division takes Cefalu
and Castelbuono while the US 1st Infantry Division seizes Gangi and heads
toward Nicosia.

SOUTH PACIFIC THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Thirteenth Air Force)
  On New Georgia Island in the Solomon Islands, 48 fighters join US Navy
and Marine dive bombers in support of ground forces in the Bairoko area.
Later in the day gun positions at Bibolo Hill near Munda are hit, along
with other targets.

SOUTHWEST PACIFIC THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Fifth Air Force)
  B-25's bomb Lautem, Fuiloro, Koepang, and Tenau on Timor Island, the
airfield and surrounding areas at Lae, New Guinea, and attack barges in
the Wapelik and Cape Busching area of New Britain Island and villages on
the Itni River on New Britain.

SUNDAY, 25 JULY 1943

AIRCRAFT MENTIONED IN THIS REPORT:
  B-17, Boeing Flying Fortress
  B-24, Consolidated Liberator
  B-25, North American Mitchell
  B-26, Martin Marauder
  C-47, Douglas Skytrain
  P-38, Lockheed Lightning
  P-39, Bell Airacobra
  P-40, Curtiss
  SBD, Douglas Dauntless (USN)
  TBF, Grumman Avenger (USN)
  Zeke, Mitsubishi A6M, Navy Type 0 Carrier Fighter

AMERICAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  ALASKA (Eleventh Air Force)
    In the Aleutian Islands, 40 P-40's fly 7 attack missions [2 by Royal
Canadian Air Force (RCAF) pilots] against Kiska Island, bombing and
strafing North Head AA batteries, the runway, Main Camp, and Little Kiska
Island.
    HQ 343d Fighter Group transfers from Adak Island to Amchitka Island.
    The 406th Bombardment Squadron (Medium), 41st Bombardment Group
(Medium), based at Elmendorf Field, Anchorage, Territory of Alaska begins
operating from Adak Island with B-25's.

  ANTISUBMARINE WARFARE (AAF ANTISUBMARINE COMMAND)
    The 15th Antisubmarine Squadron (Heavy), 26th Antisubmarine Wing,
based at Jacksonville Municipal Airport, Florida begins operating from
Batista Field, Cuba with B-24's.

CENTRAL PACIFIC THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Seventh Air Force)
  The 72d Fighter Squadron, 318th Fighter Group, transfers from Wheeler
Field, Oahu to Hilo Field, Hawaii, Territory of Hawaii with P-39's.

CHINA-BURMA-INDIA THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  CHINA (Fourteenth Air Force)
    9 B-25's, escorted by 17 P-40's and P-38's, bomb Hankow Airfield,
China.

EUROPEAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Eighth Air Force)
  VIII Bomber Command Mission Number 76: Three locations in Germany are
targetted; 19 heavy bombers are lost, mostly to effective formation
attacks by German fighters. The raid on Hamburg is part of 6 Combined
Bomber Offensive (CBO) missions against that port city and follows a raid
of the previous night during which nearly 750 Royal Air Force (RAF) heavy
bombers did tremendous damage to the target. The three targets are:
    1. 123 B-17's are dispatched against the diesel engine works at
Hamburg but due to cloud cover, 100 hit the shipyard at 1630-1645 hours;
they claim 38-6-27 Luftwaffe aircraft; 15 B-17's are lost and 67 damaged;
casualties are 1 KIA, 5 WIA and 150 MIA.
    2. 59 B-17's are dispatched against the Kiel Shipyard but return
because of cloud cover.
    3. 141 B-17's are dispatched against the aviation industry at Warnem-
unde; 118 hit the Kiel Shipyard at 1630-1700 hours; they claim 6-0-0
Luftwaffe aircraft; 4 B-17's are lost, 1 is damaged beyond repair and 50
are damaged; casualties are 1 KIA, 3 WIA and 40 MIA.
  VIII Air Support Command Mission Number 3: 18 B-26B's are dispatched
against the coke ovens at Ghent, Belgium; 13 hit the target at 1458
hours; 6 aircraft are damaged.

MEDITERRANEAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  ITALY
    King Victor Emmanuel III announces the fall of the Benito Mussolini
government. Marshall Pietro Badoglio becomes premier and takes command of
the Italian army.

  EASTERN MEDITERRANEAN (Ninth Air Force)
    In Sicily, B-25's bomb docks and shipping at Milazzo; almost 100
P-40's strafe and bomb Milazzo, Taormina, and Catania harbor. Other
P-40's escort C-47's.

  WESTERN MEDITERRANEAN (Northwest African Air Force)
    In Sicily, Northwest African Tactical Air Force (NATAF), medium and
light bombers, and fighters during night and day raids, attack shipping
and docks at Milazzo and in the Santo Stefano di Camastra-Orlando area,
and hit roads and motor transport, bridges and armor concentration in the
Orlando-Adrano-Troina-Nicosia areas.
   On the ground in Sicily, the US Seventh Army makes slow progress along
the N coastal road, while the British Eighth Army's 30 Corps takes part
in hard fighting in the Agira area.
    HQ 1st Air Defense Wing transfers from Sousse, Tunisia to Palermo,
Sicily. This unit will be redesignated the 62d Fighter Wing on 7 Aug 43.
    HQ 14th Fighter Group transfers from El Bathan, Tunisia to Ste-Marie-
du-Zit, Tunisia.

SOUTH PACIFIC THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Thirteenth Air Force)
  In the Solomon Islands, Lieutenant General Nathan F Twining, USAAF,
becomes Commander Air Solomons (COMAIRSOLS). Fighter Command and Bomber
Command, Solomons, are taken over by Brigadier General Dean C Strother
USAAF, and Colonel William A Matheny, USAAF, respectively; Strother
retains his position as Commanding General XIII Fighter Command.
  The Japanese try to hit US forces on Rendova Island but Allied fighters
shoot down several Zekes (8 claimed) and force the enemy bombers to drop
their bombs indiscriminately. On New Georgia Island, the final push on
the Japanese base at Munda opens with a bombardment by 7 destroyers and
the heaviest air attack in the South Pacific (SOPAC) Theater to date;
170+ B-24's, B-25's, B-17's, TBF's, and SBD's, covered by 70+ fighters,
pound the target thoroughly, dropping more than 145 tons of bombs in
little more than a half hour; later in the afternoon 10 more B-24's, with
fighter cover, bomb Bibolo Hill, and SBD's and TBF's dive-bomb gun
positions; and later in the day, gun positions NE of Kindu Village are
hit. The 43d and 37th Infantry Divisions open the ground assault against
the firmly entrenched enemy.

SOUTHWEST PACIFIC THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Fifth Air Force)
  Single B-24's attack a large transport vessel WNW of Buka Passage in
the Solomon Islands and bomb Lingat and Adaoet Islands in the Moluccas
Islands, and the area near Finschhafen, New Guinea.

SOURCES:
AIR FORCE COMBAT UNITS OF WORLD WAR II, Office of Air Force History,
  Headquarters USAF, 1961, ISBN 0-912799-02-1
COMBAT SQUADRONS OF THE AIR FORCE, WORLD WAR II, Office of Air Force
  History, Headquarters USAF 1982
THE ARMY AIR FORCES IN WORLD WAR II: COMBAT CHRONOLOGY, 1941-1945 by the
  Office of Air Force History, Headquarters USAF, 1973
THE MIGHTY EIGHTH WAR DIARY by Roger A. Freeman, ISBN 1-85409-071-2

Jack McKillop
USAF (Airways and Air Communications Service)
1955-59


----------------------------------------------------------------------
|  Jack McKillop      |  Those who have long enjoyed such privileges |
|  Bellcore           |  as we enjoy forget in time that men have    |
|  Piscataway, NJ     |  died to win them.     FDR                   |
|  USA                |  jem3@cc.bellcore.com                        |
----------------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 23 Jul 1993 16:23:47 EDT
From:    Michael Cotter <LBCOTTER@ECUVM1.BITNET>
Subject: Ref: Holocaust atlas

Just received in our library:

Martin Gilbert, Atlas of the Holocaust, completely revised and updated.
NY: William Morrow, 1993. 282 pp.  $20.00  ISBM 0-688-12364-3


Several hundred maps of Europe that show the towns and cities of Jewish
settlement and the number in each locale; chronological arrangement of how
the Holocaust evolved and the deportations     from each locale; murders
in each locale and concentration camps; routes of deportations; etc.   Maps
indicate Europe as a whole as well as very specific areas in which specific
atrocities occurred and number of people killed.  A few maps also show
deportations and murders of homosexuals, Jehovah's Witnesses, gypsies, etc.

Michael Cotter
Documents Librarian
Joyner Library
East Carolina University
Greenville NC 27858
919/757-6533

------------------------------

End of WWII-L Digest - 22 Jul 1993 to 23 Jul 1993
*************************************************

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Status: O

There are 7 messages totalling 649 lines in this issue.

Topics of the day:

  1. BIO: MARSHALL AND THE 8TH REGIMENT (2)
  2. hi
  3. Moscow trip notes: May-June '93
  4. STRAT: Prodical Raider? (2)
  5. USN KOHI, and YAGs in the SW Pacific, 1942-3

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date:    Sat, 24 Jul 1993 12:52:54 +0200
From:    John Ausland <d_ausland_j@KARI.UIO.NO>
Subject: BIO: MARSHALL AND THE 8TH REGIMENT

  Oslo, July 24.  FOR LARRY JEWELL.
  In your biographic data of Marshall, you said the following:

*** was promoted to colonel and placed in command of the 8th
Infantry at Fort Screven, September 1933

*** was senior instructor of the Illinois National Guard, 1933-
1936

I have known he commanded the 8th but have not been sure how long.
>From your data, it looks like it was a brief command.  Can you
clarify this?

*******************************************************************
* John C. Ausland               Tel: +47 22 14 17 68              *
* Land Productions              Fax: +47 22 16 30 92              *
* Sondreveien 4, Entry 2        CIS: 73240,2704                   *
* 0378 Oslo, Norway             Internet: d_ausland_j@kari.uio.no *
*******************************************************************

------------------------------

Date:    Sat, 24 Jul 1993 07:12:55 EST
From:    Larry & Kim Jewell <jewell@MACE.CC.PURDUE.EDU>
Subject: Re: BIO: MARSHALL AND THE 8TH REGIMENT

John, I'll check the library for more information on Marshall.  The book
I'm transcribing is a "one page of data and a portrait" type work.  It's
very nice but limited.

Larry J

------------------------------

Date:    Sat, 24 Jul 1993 09:56:40 -0400
From:    KAPLAN@DUQ3.DUQ.EDU
Subject: Re: hi

Arnaud, my two cents worth in addition to the other sites mentioned, is
Battleship Cove in Falls River, MA.  The battleship USS Massachusetts,
the destroyer USS Joseph Kennedy, and a submarine (name forgotten) are
moored under the bridge carrying Interstate 95 from Providence, RI to
Fall River.  Next to the moored boats is a dinky gift shop, and the official
PT Boat museum.  You can view up close 2 restored PT boats, and see several
pretty good dioramas.  The eating in both cities is good if you want to
try Portuguese food.

                                        Richard Kaplan
                                        kaplan@duq3.duq.edu

------------------------------

Date:    Sat, 24 Jul 1993 07:06:10 PDT
From:    Eric Fenster <efenster@IGC.APC.ORG>
Subject: Moscow trip notes: May-June '93

>From efenster Sat Jul 24 06:24:19 1993
Received: by igc.apc.org (4.1/Revision: 1.100 )
        id AA05365; Sat, 24 Jul 93 06:24:19 PDT
Date: Sat, 24 Jul 93 06:24:19 PDT
From: Eric Fenster <efenster>
Message-Id: <9307241324.AA05365@igc.apc.org>
To: efenster
Subject: Moscow notes: May-June '93
Status: RO

  Aeroflot's flight from Brussels started almost as usual.  If the new
carpeting--attached flat to the floor at least in most places instead of
bunching up to trip the unwary--was a surprise, the baggage piled in front of
the emergency exits but unnoticed by the cabin crew was not.  My first
request to a flight attendant got him to move the baggage... and to jam it
behind the hinges so as to defeat any attempt to open the door. Finally I
moved it myself under seats of the business cabin--to the smiling approval of
all the flight attendants, who were taking advantage of that empty cabin to
flirt before takeoff.
  After more than a year, the meal tray at my favorite seat still tilted at a
dangerous angle and meant another meal eaten with one hand while other would
be used to keep everything from sliding onto the floor.  When lunch was
served, only a flivker showed that the attendant realized he was commiting
the tray to the forces of gravity, but would a report be made?

  The flight ended with another of the Aeroflot pilots' feather landings.

 The trip in May 1993 was 17 months into "shock therapy," and in many ways
turned out to show that everything had changed and nothing had changed.  An
early example: On the second night in Moscow, we went to the Obratsov Puppet
Theater. It was almost exactly a year after he had died, at the age of 91. In
July 1991, Obratsov was honored on his 90th birthday.  A poster montage of
photos tracing his life was hung on a wall in the theater and, next to it, a
framed letter of congratulationg from President Gorbachev.  Both were there
last October; this May the letter was gone.
 I asked a woman attendant why.  Time passed (proshol vremya), she answered,
any display only stays up for a certain time and then its usefulness is
ended.  I looked at her: "It was a political decision, wasn't it?"  "Yes,"
she acknowledged, quietly.
 Gorbachev is rejected today, so history is dealt with by being erased.
Again.

  We visited a publishing house of children's literature, and those in our
group who know printing were impressed by the quality.  The enterpprise is
still state-owned, and the director felt reasonably confident:  After food,
the first thing a Russian family thinks of buying is books for its children,
he said. In the West we imagine Russia to be hungry, but we don't always know
in what way.  It was reassuring.  Book prices are low, partly because the
publisher wants them to be so that the books will be accessible, partly
because margins over 50% kick in excess profits taxes.
  The problem is that speculators buy up the books from the bookstores and
resell them on the street for several times their true price.  Here, as in
other sectors, state retail stores are converted into wholesale distributors,
doing neither the producer nor the consumer any good, but pushing inflation
up.  (The state store employees surely receive payoffs to sell their goods in
bulk. Whether any portion of these bribes find their way back to producers, I
don't know.)
 The publishing house earns real money, hard currency, via a contract with
McDonalds to make apple pie cartons.
  In May the average monthly wage of the 207 workers was 15,000 rubles, about
$19 an an exchange rate which was varying rapidly, with the highest paid
worker at about 33,000 rubles.  When we came back in June, the average salary
had jumped to 28,000 rubles, about $27 at the current exchange rate, and
there had been another 23% of inflation (officially!).

  May 9, Victory Day. After the events on May 1, our host felt obliged to
officially warn us against going to Gorky Park; it was unknown whether
"unapproved" demonstrations would take place there and whether there would be
violence if they were attempted.
  Our host was covering his bases; that I understood.  But he also believed
that trouble was likely, and that I did not understand.  That is, I did not
understand how his assessment of the political opposition could be so far
off.  The sacrifices and vistory in World War 2 (the "Great Patriotic War")
were sacred.  For either the nationalist-patriotic or the communist
oppositions to deliberately disturb the commemoration in Gorky Park by
bringing violence to the midst of aged war veterans and their families would
thoroughly discredit them and their cause.
  If there was to be violence, it would be because the authorities refused to
grant a parade permit for a march from Belorussia Station.  It was ironic
that Yeltsin was now applying the same restrictions on demonstrations which
had been used against his followers in Spring 1991: The freedom to
demonstrate depended upon "permission" from authorities, who could refuse on
flimsy grounds.  The same authorities could decide how many demonstrators
would be allowed, which was to say that they would determine the existence
and the extent of any grievance against their own authority.
  At the last minute, the authorities avoided confrontation by backing down
from their denial and allowing all marches.
  In the Park, my group managed to talk with a number of veterans, but the
most memorable was with a woman who was a doctor and whose campaign medals
showed she had moved from one difficult front to another during the war.  She
married a soldier in 1952, and returned to her home in the Urals which she
hadn't seen for 9 years.  Her husband died in 1954, of his war wounds she
said, before they had children.  She never remarried, and continued to
practice medicine all her life.
 We came upon one of the many typical knots of people gathered around a few
musicians.  One veteran had an artificial leg and walked awkwardly with a
crutch, but every time the music started he'd hand his crutch to somebody to
hold and dance with grace and pleasure.

  Our visit to an agricultural machinery factory was, in itself, almost the
story of today's Russia.  The original building dates from 1902 and was put
up by an American firm.  The plant made mowing machines, 26 per day, and
employed nearly 9,000 people at its peak.
  In May, production was down to 2 per day.  The machine is too expensive for
the farms, too big for private farms, fuel price increases make it too costly
to run--and, anyway, it's almost impossible to get the engines because they
are made in what is now another country.
  When I came back with another group in June, production was 1 per day and
scheduled to stop in July.  Components were already piled up around the
assembly line, which wasn't functioning.
  To survive, the factory was producing a new, small mower, designed to bee
HORSEDRAWN.
  We toured the plant, trying to avoid the puddles, slippery floors and
debris.  Any filmmaker who wanted to depict a worker's hell would find the
foundry a perfect set.  In the press room, five workers were just finishing
lunch next to their 1902 drop press.  It was still working perfectly well,
but to what purpose?  I watched the process.  Four 80-cm metal stakes at a
time were hand-held under the press, a diamond-shaped bar was held over them
and the press bent in a 20-degree angle.
  Another huge building was filled with a line of modern heavy presses, but
there was no work for them to do.  Both times, in May and June, the
production director, who was taking us around, stopped talking to us and
stared at this contemporary albatross: still there each time he looked, still
useless.
  The director impressed us because he seemed to know all his workers.  On
several occasions, he pointed out bent, withered old men.  "That one's 45."
"That one's 42."  Workers could retire at 55 bu, according to the director,
they usually don't live that long.
  The workers were eager to talk--angry and without hope.  Those in the press
room, where the bad conditions mean a premium, claimed in June that they
earned 15,000 rubles/month, about $14.  Later we were told that in June the
average wage was 15,000 and the range was 7,000-60,000 rubles, the low end
for white collar employees.  In June, the "physiological survival" income was
estimated at 13,000 rubles!
  The enterprise is selling off its social property in order to meet the
payroll.  This includes a stadium, a house of culture, a kindergarten and
housing.  Since sport, cultural and pre-school facilities were usually linked
to enterprises under the Soviet system, this means a major loss to the
workers and to their families.
  The factory is privatizing, and it voted to use the "second variant" by
which the workers buy 51% of the shares and become the "owners."  In this
case, that means 66,000 shares at 1,800 rubles.  But 1,800 rubles is a lot
for the wages being earned, and the workers hadn't bought all the shares.
The "solution," according to the editor of the factory newspaper, was that
many shares were bought by a "worker" who had also established four
businesses on plant property.  "He's not at all intelligent." she said.
  What she meant was that he had got himself on the payroll so as to legally
be a worker entitled to buy shares, but that he was really fronting for
racket interests.  The racketeers have colossal sums at their disposal, and
at the current rate of exchange the whole 51% of the shares would cost only
about $240,000 with all the buildings, machinery (some modern), use of the
land, etc.
  According to the editor, not just this relatively small factory but the
major successful ones (eg, automobile with new automated assembly lines) were
being bought up in this way by the mafia in a mockery of "privatization."
Under the privatization law, the new "worker" owners can sell their shares in
just three years.
  With privatization, the agricultural machinery plant's workforce is
expected to drop to about 2,300.

  We visited a dairy farm whose owner, Peter Illyitch (as in Tchaikovsky)
began it as a private venture more than five years ago, as soon as land
leasing became possible.  He had experience in animal husbandry, and needed
it: state farms would only sell their worst cows, and he is still breeding
them back to quality.
  The finances make your head spin. Peter has taken out several loans and
buys equipment as fast as he can to keep ahead of inflation; the grounds are
strewn with machinery that still has no use. The interest rate keeps rising,
but when we were there in May, Peter showed us a tractor which he bought for
600,000 rubles last year on an 8% loan but which was now worth 18 million.
Since his total indebtedness then was 15 million, if he had gone bankrupt he
could have sold the tractor, paid his debts and been 3 million ahead!  By
now, interest on the most recent loan was 80%, but with inflation at 2000% in
the last year, that meant a highly negative interest rate.
  The farm is in a region near Moscow known for its clean air and forests, a
coveted place for a dacha.  And near the farm ostentatious 3-story brick
dachas were under construction. Under a new law, Russian citizens can own
0.15 hectare plots of land, but local authorities decide on how the land is
distributed. Here, the prospective owners convince the authorities by
agreeing to bring gas and telephone lines in exchange for the land
assignments.  And, as the village mayor told us, he preferred to give the
land to the rich.  Put this together with other reports that country houses
near Moscow were selling for $100,000-250,000 (in a country with a $30
average monthly wage, remember), and it is clear that corrupt officials and
racketeers are the beneficiaries.  In fact, despite the continuing severe
housing shortage, there is a virtual building boom of luxury dachas
observable around Moscow.
  "We lack suburbs with individual houses," a young Russian businessman
explained to me.  I reminded him of the traffic jams which now clog Moscow
and talked about Los Angeles.  Imagine Moscow's suburbanization, starting
with a core population of nine million, to say nothing of the destruction of
the surrounding forests and country which have been preserved until now.

  In May we went to St. Petersburg, where robbery of foreigners was practiced
officially and unofficially.  Last year, I remember one museum which tried
charging foreigners triple admission.  This year the rate for foreigners was
70-100 times the price for Russians.  If that wasn't enough, we visited the
Hermitage and St. Isaac's on International Museum Day, when all museums were
free.  That didn't stop both museums from charging admission as usual, and
only when one was inside was a small sign visible announcing the free
admission.
  At a street kiosk, a Russian woman with our group bought a pastry for 50
rubles.  A minute later, her American companion tried to buy one and was told
it was 500 rubles.  When he said he knew the correct price via his friend,
the kiosk owner came out and began beating up our Russian woman.  For
"betrayal," I suppose.
  On arrival back in Moscow, one person each in three of the five train
compartments we occupied discovered he had been robbed. We went to the
railway police to file a complaint.  They were not suprised by the robbery,
because "it happens everyday," but that we bothered to report it.  "I believe
we were gassed," I said.  The police said I was probably right.  "The French
had this problem, but they finally made the effort and caught the gang," I
said.  The French were here to advise us, the police replied.

  We had a cultural program, but few people decided to go to the Bolshoi on
their own and went with a Russian friend to buy tickets at the theater.  The
Russian verified the price, came to tell the group, then hustled them away.
When they were a sufficient distance, he explained that a scalper had
overheard the woman at the ticket office quote the proper price.  While the
group was being informed of it, the scalper warned the woman that if she sold
the tickets at that price, she would be "hurt."  "Why are you doing this to
me?" she pleaded.  "I have a daughter to feed."  It was to keep her out of
danger that the Russian stopped the purchase and took the group away from the
scene.

  In May, we met a woman who, despite many difficulties, had launched a
successful publishing company whose proceeds helped her run a foundation to
support education and culture without external interference.
  In June, we visited the commercial side of the activity, which involved not
only publishing but other branches, including real estate.
  When I asked about the real estate, the reply concerned a major research
and business center south of Moscow's center which had gotten off to a shaky
start because of "bad publicity."
  I was shocked.  "So you're the ones!" I blurted.  And they were.  The story
was that some time after Moscow's mayor decided he had absolute control over
the city's land and buildings, he ceded 700 acres on Lenin Prospect from
October Square to Gagarin Square to an organization which planned a major
"development" program.  We're talking about some of the most valuable urban
real estate in the world, and it was disposed of in this way.
  The French were involved, and the French ambassador came to the
groundbreaking ceremony last year.  Yeltsin was also expected.  A big hole
had already been dug, and when the officials arrived they found the hole
filled by demonstrators who believed they would be losing their apartments
and who had not even been consulted.  Yeltsin got wind of the demonstration
and stayed home.  When the French ambassador realized what was happening, he
scolded the organizers and left the ceremony.
  Last October, I brought a group to give a seminar on business methods. One
person, who was in PR, made contact with a Russian group which was a
potential client.  A Russian friend of mine went with him to translate his
negotiations.  A short way into the conversation, she discovered she was
talking to the group involved in the "development" project, which needed a PR
person to save its image problem.  The irony was that she lived in (and had
been born in) one of the apartments thought to be menaced, so she suddenly
seemed to be helping to negotiate her own homelessness!
  Anyway, there we were in the bowels of this organization.  In response to
my questions, they claimed that nobody would lose housing, and that all the
fears raised about this were just a "communist plot."  Then they said they
had had a survey of the district done which showed that 43% of the area was
"garbage" land!!  (Anybody reading this who knows Moscow will have his jaw
around his knees by now.)

  When tongues wag in Moscow, they claim that absolutely every government
official and every transaction is corrupt. I'd like to think that isn't true,
but I do know that raw materials are a major Russian export, and I do know
that a Russian friend who works for a Western company which buys such raw
materials was told to have his company representatives bring $300,000 in cash
on their next trip and that it would be collected right at the airport in
exchange for the signatures approving the export.

  What one sees of so-called business are street kiosks selling alcohol, soft
drinks, cigarettes, shampoo.  Many products are imported, others are domestic
but put in Western packaging to deceive customers.  All sorts of
"entrepreneurs" are running about starting new businesses, but they're all
involved in import and trade or in tourism and "services."  I almost never
meet anybody who plans to PRODUCE anything.  Those who claim they want to say
it's impossible.  Maybe so, or maybe colossal overnight profits can't be
resisted.
  Also, in a country with abacuses instead of cash registers, no checks or
credit cards and an inappropriate accounting system, it is overwhelmingly
tempting to engage in businesses with all cash transactions and to hide
income from everybody, including the tax authorities.

 Three Americans arrived for a conference on "Socialism Today."  The
organizer sent an 18 yr-old university student to meet them at the airport
and take them around the city.  Well-dressed, well-mannered, but when he took
them to visit the Kremlin churches, he told them the cost for foreigners was
$15 but if they kept out of sight while he bought them tickets he could
probably get them in for the Russian price of $5.  The real price, for
everybody, is 5 cents!  What pushed this young man to cheat foreign guests
who were, to boot, his COMRADES at a conference on socialism?

 Contrast.  In October I dropped in on a secondary school where I knew French
was taught.  A teacher invited me to a literature course where 12 yr-olds
were following a lecture completely in French. The lecture surveyed several
centuries of French and Russian writers, their styles and the influences they
had on each other. The children not only followed everything, it was clear
they had read many of the authors.  Afterwards, the teacher asked me is I was
bored.  It was the most positive thing I've seen in Moscow, I replied, but
how do you explain to these children why their friends are making fortunes on
the street but that they should continue their education?  We tell them it's
temporary," she said, lamely.

 Another contrast, the efficiency with which all the aspects of our visit
were carried out, and the care--whether it was in the friendliness of the
kitchen staff in the tears of the woman guarding our floor when she thought
our late return from a trip might have meant we had an accident.

  Overall, there were changes since last year.  People claimed to be
optimistic, often adding that they had no other option.  And it's true that
high prices have replaced rationing and empty shelves as the barrier to
goods.  My friend in St. Petersburg explained the difference succinctly: Last
year if one were desperate enough to trade the shirt off one's back to
survive, there was still nothing to buy; this year there is. According to
him, being able to postpone ultimate poverty is a tangible increase of
security,

 What struck me most, however, were the things which remained the same:
First, yet again, the acceptance--the seeking even--of a force to play the
"leading role" in society.  Before, it was the (good) Czar or the Party; now,
the entrepreneurs.  This faith that, given a free hand, they will magically
restore the economy is the fad among the intelligentsia, one of whom assured
me that studies proved that only one in ten people were inherently capable of
true business initiative.  Even trade unionists have taken up the slogan that
they must help "create their own exploiters" and then struggle against them.
  Put in this context, the tolerance for the outrageous wealth being
accumulated by a very few becomes understandable and resembles the
concentration of power rationalized under the previous ideology so that the
new system is less a break with the past than the legacy of it.
  Presumably, at some point the "entrepreneurs" will become satiated with
what they have either appropriated or amassed without producing anything, and
they will cease sending it abroad or consuming it ostentatiously and really
invest in restructuring.  It will be the economic equivalent of the
Khrushchevian political liberalization, a Russian version of the famous
American trickle-down theory.
  This attitude is accompanied by a new dose of determinism which condones
all the criminal or negative aspects of change as "inevitable" or "to be
expected" and predicts their eventual disappearance.  I almost expected to
hear that, "you can't make an omelette without breaking an egg," the version
of the-end-justifies-the-means which bathed the sins of the previous
ideology.
  Why Russia will see the abdication of a mafia which is being given a unique
opportunity penetrate ubiquitously when organized crime is estimated to be
America's third largest industry and has a firm grip Japan and other wealthy
countries is not explained.

  The second stable idea is the attitude toward workers as lazy drunkards.
This is neatly linked with the first, of course; after all, that's why the
workers' state needed the Party as a guide.
  I am allergic to scapegoating workers for the failures of a system they
didn't create and, at some periods, would have been criminally liable for
challenging.  In fact, throwing one's labor into a workplace which wasn't
supplied for production for most of every month would have been insanity.
And far better to "steal" cement and construct something with it as a side
job than leave it harden in the rain.  Surviving Soviet absurdities and being
lazy are contradictory terms; it took energy and ingenuity to satisfy one's
needs.
  What people do seem to have engraved in their minds is that an open direct
line between two points can only be an illusion.  Inordinate non-productive
energy is spent fabricating alternatives, and the (il)logic makes corruption
a completely natural part of the landscape.
  The attitude toward workers is paradoxical.  Private ownership is touted as
the savior which will improve people's work by giving them a direct stake in
its outcome.  The same people who blow this horn will condemn the option for
workers to buy their own enterprise on the grounds that if they are the
owners they will not take the hard decisions for the enterprises's good, or
that if left to elect their own management they will choose only directors
who do not demand performance.
  What is also forgotten in the euphoria is that in the capitalist countries
supposedly being emulated most people work for salaries, not because they
have a private property stake in their work.  Yes, there are owners, but I
daresay the average schoolteacher works with as much dedication as any shop
owner, and probably for much less pay.  Our societies would collapse if good
performance required greed and/or private property as the motivator because
we just don't have that many social functions where those are relevant.  Even
for people who are owners by virtue of investment--stocks, for example--their
own incentive to work and the performance of the companies they "own" are
completely unrelated.  Success in modern capitalist economies depends largely
upon how well the riddle of making bureaucratic management perform wisely is
solved.

  An alarm also needs to be sounded about the threat to the human
infrastructure.  Paying educators and scientists sub-starvation wages means
they all have to look for a side "business" and, as often as not, neglect
their primary work just when the whole educational system needs revision and
attention.  A similar pressure is placed on health professionals at a time
when a crisis, aggravated by enviromental degradation may be striking at the
fundamental level of the gene pool itself.
  The dichotomy is between an insane policy to privatize much of education
and health when the large majority of the population must spend most of its
income for food, while an elite can assure its implantation by sending its
children to schools which cost two months' average salary per day!
  Students from former Soviet republics enrolled in Russian universities are
being told they must pay for previously free education and that $3,000-4,000
would be a bargain because it's so much less than American universities
charge.  (As expensive is US higher education is, and as unusual among
industrial countries in charging for it at all, it is still not ten times the
average annual salary per year!)  This policy can not only hurt relations
with CIS countries, it threatens the human capacity in countries very much
part of Russia's economic geography.

  Many people have claimed that socialism has been proved not to work by the
failures of the Soviet Union's version of it.  If present trends continue,
fairness and logic may oblige those same people to assert that capitalism is
also an unviable system.

 June 29 at Sheremetyevo Airport.  The line to go through exit customs wasn't
moving.  The officer was examining exiting Russians with all deliberate
sloth.  In half an hour, two people were cleared.  The next woman had
forgotten to fill out a currency declaration and was sent back to get one and
fill it out in front of the officer while he waited lazily.  Suddenly, there
was a loud noise.  A senior officer spotted what was going on.  At the top of
his lungs he screamed at the officer:  WHY are you holding everybody up? Take
care of the others while she is writing! Our officer woke up and waved us
through.
  After passport control, we were in the international zone.  I looked up at
the railing on the mezzanine level just in case and was surprised to see the
drying clothes still there.  I went upstairs.  There weren't as many, and the
children seemed to be gone,but after about ten months there was still a group
of stranded Somalians living in the airport, sleeping on cardboard.  The UN
is planning to do something, an airport policeman insisted.
 I looked for the local (free) phone which used to be near the coffee shop.
Gone.  But there was another phone, installed by a Western company, and the
cost for a LOCAL call was $2.00 PER MINUTE!  Let anybody who questions
regulation take note.

----

 These notes do not paint a balanced picture of an exciting country
undergoing unprecedented transformation. Nor do they sufficiently celebrate a
people who are loyal friends and who can transform a kitchen table and a cup
of tea a place of privilege and learning.  Instead, I have isolated points
which may help explain the current crisis.

  I also don't want to provide an excuse for self-righteousness.  The
profiteering from East Europe's difficulties is a Western affliction, as
well.  It would be hard, for example, to imagine anything more cynical than
the behavior of the European Bank for Reconstruction & Development in
spending twice as much money on its own luxuries as it distributed to the
East (leading to Jacques Attali's belated resignation last week).  But that,
and the rest of the economic crisis in the West, is another aspect of the
analysis.

  On the way back from Moscow, I attended the annual Economics Colloquium at
NATO.  This year's subject was E. Europe and the CIS.  I ran into a long-time
Russian acquaintance who worked at a Soviet institute which studied the
world's labor movements.  We had chatted a couple of times when he drew close
and said, "You know, Eric, I am surprised to see you here.  NATO is usually
associated with right wing politics."  I looked at him, and  remembered the
past.  Then I remembered that the new darlings of Russia's democratic
intellectuals are Ronald Reagan and Margaret Thatcher, and that the same
company which was grabbing off Moscow's best real estate was also publishing
translations of Ayn Rand.
------------

Eric Fenster
July 1993         71450.1223@compuserve.com  efenster@igc.apc.org

------------------------------

Date:    Sat, 24 Jul 1993 09:14:07 EST
From:    Larry & Kim Jewell <jewell@MACE.CC.PURDUE.EDU>
Subject: STRAT: Prodical Raider?

This ship seems to be a bit lost.  Anyone know the story behind
this incident?

10/17/43 Sun.  German raider sunk:
                Schiff No. 28 (MICHEL), by submarine TARPON
                 (SS-175), off Chichi Jima, Bonin Islands.

(From: UNITED STATES NAVAL CHRONOLOGY, WORLD WAR II)

Larry J

------------------------------

Date:    Sat, 24 Jul 1993 13:05:53 EDT
From:    Thomas Stuart <C078D6S6@UBVM.BITNET>
Subject: USN KOHI, and YAGs in the SW Pacific, 1942-3

Hello,  I am a reference librarian at the Penn Yan Public Library in
Penn Yan, New York.  We have a patron who is researching for a book
he hopes to write about his adventures as a member of the crew of the
USS KOHI, in World War II.

The patron, Robert "Rusty" King, served as an electrician's mate
on the KOHI.  He became re-interested in the story of the KOHI, and the
group of other YAGs which operated from New Zealand, and decided in 1990
to seriously research the subject.  He has been to the National Archives
in D.C., the Library of Congress, and has written to navy officials both
here in the US and in New Zealand.  He has found many individuals to be
very interested and willing to be helpful, but has in fact not uncovered
much information beyond what he already knew.   He is stalled at this
point by inability to find much of any information about the former
commander of the KOHI.  Mr King does have his name, service #, and knows
for example that he retired as a full Commander, USN, in December 1954.
(It is my suggestion that we not "broadcast" the person's name over the
net in this initial inquiry).

So really we are looking for two kinds of help at this point.
1) any suggestions on how to track down his former commanding officer
(who Mr. King would greatly like to contact, if he is still living) and
2) suggestions on leads for sources of information on the KOHI and the
other YAGs and their role in the SW Pacific in 1942-43.

I've extracted the following from some notes made by Mr. King, which he
will be using in a presentation he'll be making at our library in a
couple weeks:

     ================================================================
In late 1942 there were no U.S. Navy small craft in the South West Pacific,
just warships on daily, unending combat duty.  The New Zealand government
made several wooden and steel-hulled smallcraft available to the United States.
These were then used for supply work in and around the battle areas of New
Caledonia, the islands of the New Hebrides, Fiji and elsewhere. These boats
flew the Stars and Stripes, and were now USN craft.
An Ensign assumed command of one of these ships, newly commissioned as the
USS KOHI, YAG 27, in Wellington, NZ ...  Other crew members came aboard
included a survivor of the USS Quincy, CA 39, sunk at Guadalcanal, and
others who formerly served on the carrier WASP, the crusiers SALT LAKE CITY
and ATLANTA, and other warships lost in naval actions. ...
[The USS KOHI] was a 100-ton wooden-hulled sailing coaster with two masted
schooner rigging, four sails, flat bottom and center board, two diesel
engines, 20mm canon, two machine guns and a crew of 12. ...

[Activities of the KOHI included:]
ferrying island natives, Navy Seabees, rice, ammo, aerial torpedoes,
diesel fuel for shore based radar stations, mail, barrels of gasoline and oil,
missionaries, coast watchers and whatever could be carried on an open cargo
deck.  The KOHI's activities included an attempt to "ram an enemy sub
making an island landing" and other actions to "smack the enemy in numerous
ways wherever we could" in a series of "whopper" adventures -- adventures
about which there appears to have been almost nothing written and for
which there is little he has been able to find in the way of an official
record.
======================================================================
Thomas Stuart
Reference Librarian
Penn Yan Public Library
Penn Yan, NY, USA
email: listuart@ubvm.bitnet

for

Robert E. King, ex USN 224-19-12
3109 Bath Road
Penn Yan, NY  14527
telephone: (315) 536-9507

------------------------------

Date:    Sat, 24 Jul 1993 20:35:51 +0100
From:    Bob Smart <bsmart@SMART.COM>
Subject: Re: STRAT: Prodical Raider?

> This ship seems to be a bit lost.  Anyone know the story behind
> this incident?
>
> 10/17/43 Sun.  German raider sunk:
>                 Schiff No. 28 (MICHEL), by submarine TARPON
>                  (SS-175), off Chichi Jima, Bonin Islands.
>
> (From: UNITED STATES NAVAL CHRONOLOGY, WORLD WAR II)
>
> Larry J
 Look in Silent Victory by Clay Blair ( page 513-514 of my paperback edition)
It is in the Index under Michel.

Tarpon under Tom Wogan found large fast unescorted ship at night.  Tarpon
fired 4 torpedoes, got two hits.  Damaged ship turned to ram forcing Tarpon
deep. Tarpon came back to periscope depth, fired two 'up the kilt', both
missed. Ship opened fire with 6" at the periscope.  Tarpon fired another
single torpedo hit in the stern, appeared to stop gunfire.  Tarpon circled
target fired another which sank target. Tarpon was credited with a '10,000 ton
Japanese Naval Auxilery although there was no radio conformation ( no distress
calls or decrypts).  It was not until postwar that analysis showed that it was
the Raider Michel which had come from the Indian Ocean with 'High Priority
cargo' to Japan."She was the first - and one of the few - German ships sunk by
U.S> subamrines in World War II, all in the Pacific."  from Blair.
Later he gives this summary
"In all U.S. submarines sank four German vessels in the Pacific: the two
U-boats, Herb Andrews freighter, and Tom Wogans merchant raider Michel."

Hope this helps

Bob Smart (bsmart@smart.com or bsmart@verdix.com)

------------------------------

End of WWII-L Digest - 23 Jul 1993 to 24 Jul 1993
*************************************************

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There are 3 messages totalling 108 lines in this issue.

Topics of the day:

  1. REF: ADVICE REGARDING LIBRARIES?
  2. WEAP: "Longlance" naming?
  3. Addr: Libraries

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date:    Sun, 25 Jul 1993 12:17:39 +0200
From:    John Ausland <d_ausland_j@KARI.UIO.NO>
Subject: REF: ADVICE REGARDING LIBRARIES?

  Oslo, July 25.  I am preparing to send out flyers to a select group
of military, university, and public libraries.  A Compuserve user has
told me that this could be a waste of time, that most libraries buy
their books from agents.
  I would appreciate some advice on whether I am spinning my wheels.

*******************************************************************
* John C. Ausland               Tel: +47 22 14 17 68              *
* Land Productions              Fax: +47 22 16 30 92              *
* Sondreveien 4, Entry 2        CIS: 73240,2704                   *
* 0378 Oslo, Norway             Internet: d_ausland_j@kari.uio.no *
*******************************************************************

------------------------------

Date:    Sun, 25 Jul 1993 08:43:35 EST
From:    Larry & Kim Jewell <jewell@MACE.CC.PURDUE.EDU>
Subject: WEAP: "Longlance" naming?

Anyone got an answer for the question below?  Post here or respond to
sender, or to milhst-l@ukanvm.cc.ukans.edu.

Larry J

(Subscription info for MILHST-L available on request.)

Forwarded message:
> Date:     Sun, 25 Jul 1993 00:04:27 -0500
> Reply-To: Military History <@VM.CC.PURDUE.EDU:MILHST-L@UKANVM>
> Subject:  MILHST-L Digest - 23 Jul 1993 to 24 Jul 1993
> To: Recipients of MILHST-L digests
>               <MILHST-L@UKANVM.CC.UKANS.EDU>
> There are 2 messages totalling 32 lines in this issue.
>
> Topics of the day:
>
>   2. Imperial Japanese Navy "longlance" Torpedo
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date:    Sat, 24 Jul 1993 15:54:29 EST
> From:    "TCWERNC@VCCSCENT.BITNET" <TCWERNC@VCCSCENT.BITNET>
> Subject: Imperial Japanese Navy "longlance" Torpedo
>
>  Hello to all. U.S. Naval Technical Mission to Japan , 1945-1946 , No.O-01-1 ,
>  NTJ-L-O-01-1 , gives details of the "longlance" , but does not mention it by
>  name . This favorite weapon of the IJN was used in the First Phase of
>  Battle of the Java Sea , 27 February 1942 , by Destroyer Squadrons 2 and 4.
>  The 24-inch torpedoes were oxygen-propelled , and made almost no wake.
>
>  I am interested to learn how , why , and by whom the "longlance" was given
>  its name.
>
>   Thanks,
>
>   Carl Wernke
>   Tidewater Community College
>   Portsmouth,Va  23703
>   To: Multiple recipients of list MILHST-L (MILHST-L@UKANVM.BITNET)
>
> ------------------------------
>
> End of MILHST-L Digest - 23 Jul 1993 to 24 Jul 1993
> ***************************************************
>

------------------------------

Date:    Sun, 25 Jul 1993 16:26:53 EDT
From:    RICHARD KING <RKING@VUNET.VINU.EDU>
Subject: Addr: Libraries

To John Ausland:
I thought I'd reply on the list, in case anyone else is interested.
I say, go ahead and send your flyers to libraries. Speaking for
myself, even though we are inundated with ads from individuals
and corporations (book publishers, etc.) wanting us to buy books,
we actually make a concerted effort to briefly READ through all
such items. Librarians can usually tell in about two seconds if
such an item is worth a second look for purchasing for their
collection. Yes, we user vendors (about three or four vendors at
this time). We buy through vendors that specialize in university
press books, in science and medical books, and then general items.
There is no one vendor that is best. You get better discounts on
specific items, which means more work for the librarian, but,
after all, we are paid to work and part of that work is separating
out all the book purchase order cards to be sent to specific vendors.
We also are very concerned about buying books (or at least reading
literature) from private presses to increase competition between
publishers.
     Since your book deals with World War II history, I wonder
if you could send flyers to "Military History Librarian" or some such
term. Your book sounds like it belongs in WWII collections.
Ideally, every book we purchase has been reviewed and the librarian
has made a purchase decision based on that review, but sometimes
you buy a book regardless if it important for your collection
areas.
*************************************************************

Richard L. King, Reference Librarian, Vincennes (IN) Univ.
RKING@VUNET.VINU.EDU

------------------------------

End of WWII-L Digest - 24 Jul 1993 to 25 Jul 1993
*************************************************

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There are 8 messages totalling 433 lines in this issue.

Topics of the day:

  1. GEN: LIBRARIES
  2. USAAF 26 JUL 43
  3. Addr: gen (2)
  4. REF: ADVICE REGARDING LIBRARIES?
  5. BIO: Matthew Bunker Ridgway, RIP
  6. The Garry Owen
  7. KOHL VERSUS MITTERAND - a German view

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 26 Jul 1993 05:37:50 -0400
From:    JOHN AUSLAND <d_ausland_j@KARI.BITNET>
Subject: GEN: LIBRARIES

FOR RICHARD KING

Thank you for posting your message on the list, so as to give others
a chance to comment.  Yes, I can understand that the problem is to
catch a busy librarian's attention.  My thought is to send the
following: a press release and a flyer, under cover of a short
letter.

My thought is for the letter to say:
  With the 50th anniversary of the events covered by this book
approaching, you may be interested in adding it to your
collection.
  This is what James Fallows, Washington editor for the Atlantic
Monthly, had to say about it:
  "John Ausland is known to many readers for his insightful essays about
international relations. 'Letters Home' shows the same sensibility and grace
of expression, applied to the daily reality of life during war. I found this
a vivid and revealing book.  It is very well written and engrossing."

I have noted your suggestion that I might address this to the "Military
History Librarian," but wonder if most libraries have such a person.

I would appreciate your, as well as others, comments.

On second thought, if agreeable with you, I will fax you my press
release and flyer, so as to give you a chance to comment on how you
think librarians might react.  I have the fax number of the university
as: 812 885-5868, but perhaps you use another number.

Regards, John Ausland

*******************************************************************
* John C. Ausland               Tel: +47 22 14 17 68              *
* Land Productions              Fax: +47 22 16 30 92              *
* Sondreveien 4, Entry 2        CIS: 73240,2704                   *
* 0378 Oslo, Norway             Internet: d_ausland_j@kari.uio.no *
*******************************************************************

------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 26 Jul 1993 07:16:16 -0400
From:    jem3@CC.BELLCORE.COM
Subject: USAAF 26 JUL 43

COMBAT CHRONOLOGY OF THE US ARMY AIR FORCES
MONDAY, 26 JULY 1943
FTP SITES
  1. ftp.rutgers.edu in directory pub/wwii/usaf
  2. byrd.mu.wvnet.edu (129.71.32.152) in pub/history/military/airforce/
     wwii_chronology

AIRCRAFT MENTIONED IN THIS REPORT:
  B-17, Boeing Flying Fortress
  B-24, Consolidated Liberator
  B-25, North American Mitchell
  B-26, Martin Marauder
  B-40, Boeing Flying Fortress
  C-47, Douglas Skytrain
  Fw 190, Focke Wulf (Luftwaffe)
  P-38, Lockheed Lightning
  P-39, Bell Airacobra

AMERICAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  ALASKA (Eleventh Air Force)
    In the Aleutian Islands, 3 bombers and 5 fighters fly 5 armored
reconnaissance missions to Kiska Island. 32 B-24's, 38 P-40's, and 24
P-38's fly 13 attack raids, bombing and scoring hits on numerous Kiska
Island and Little Kiska Island targets, including North Head, Main Camp,
the runway, Gertrude Cove, AA batteries, and on a suspected submarine in
Kiska Island harbor. A submarine is sighted near Rat Island. AA fire
claims 1 P-40 (pilot rescued), and damages 3 others. 1 B-25 and 15 P-38's
fly 2 air cover missions to Kiska Island for the US Navy. Over 1O4 tons
of bombs are dropped on Kiska Island this day, highest one-day bomb load
so far dropped by the Eleventh Air Force.

CENTRAL PACIFIC THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Seventh Air Force)
  The last mission against Wake Island from Midway Island is flown. 8
B-24's bomb targets including oil storage area. 20+ fighters (including
an aircraft identified as a possible Fw 190) intercept the formation. The
B-24's claim 11 of the fighters shot down.

CHINA-BURMA-INDIA THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  CHINA (Fourteenth Air Force)
    5 B-25's, escorted by 12 fighters, bomb Hankow Airfield, China. An
estimated 30-50 fighters intercept the force; the B-25's and fighters
claim 14 airplanes shot down and 17 probably destroyed; 1 P-40 is lost.

EUROPEAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Eighth Air Force)
  VIII Bomber Command Mission Number 77: Two targets in Germany and a
convoy are hit, i.e.:
    1. 119 B-17's and 2 YB-40's are dispatched against rubber factories
at Hannover; 96 hit the target at 1200-1243 hours; they claim 40-9-28
Luftwaffe aircraft; 16 B-17's are lost; casualties are 4 KIA, 22 WIA and
126 MIA.
    2. 49 of 61 B-17's dispatched against Hannover hit a convoy and other
targets of opportunity; they claim 15-1-7 Luftwaffe aircraft; 6 B-17's
are lost; casualties are 1 KIA, 3 WIA and 51 MIA.
    3. 54 of 121 B-17's dispatched against Hannover hit the U-boat yards
at Hamburg at 1159-1200 hours; they claim 5-0-1 Luftwaffe aircraft; 2
B-17's are lost; casualties are 1 KIA, 3 WIA and 20 MIA.
  A total of 3 B-17's are damaged beyond repair and 86 are damaged on
this mission. Mission results are good but costly; 24 aircraft are lost,
mostly to enemy fighters.
  VIII Air Support Command Mission Number 4: 18 B-26B's are dispatched
against the Saint-Omer/Longuenesse Airfield in France; 15 hit the target
at 1112 hours; 4 aircraft are damaged.
  HQ 41st Bombardment Wing (Heavy) arrives at Brampton Grange, England
from the US. This unit will be redesignated 41st Combat Bombardment Wing
(Heavy) on 13 Sep 43.
  HQ 390th Bombardment Group (Heavy) and it's 568th, 569th, 570th and
571st Bombardment Squadrons (Heavy) arrive at Framlingham, England from
the US with B-17's. The group will fly it's first mission on 12 Aug and
remain at this station until Aug 45.

MEDITERRANEAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  EASTERN MEDITERRANEAN (Ninth Air Force)
    In Sicily,  B-25's bomb Milazzo, Paterno, and Adrano; and P-40's
strafe and bomb Catania and shipping at Riposto harbor.

  WESTERN MEDITERRANEAN (Northwest African Air Force)
    In Sicily during the night of 25/26 Jul, Northwest African Tactical
Air Force (NATAF) medium bombers attack Milazzo, Adrano, and Paterno;
throughout the day light bombers hit Regalbuto at intervals, and fighter-
bombers harass shipping, rail, and road movements. Northwest African
Strategic Air Force (NASAF) B-26's bomb the Marina di Paola, Italy
marshalling yard.
    HQ 64th Troop Carrier Group and it's 16th, 17th, 18th and 35th Troop
Carrier Squadrons transfer from Kairouan, Tunisia to El Djem, Tunisia
with C-47's.
    The 7th Troop Carrier Squadron, 62d Troop Carrier Group, transfers
from El Djem, Tunisia to Gourbrine, Tunisia with C-47's.
    The 37th Fighter Squadron, 14th Fighter Group, transfers from El
Bathan, Tunisia to Ste-Marie-du-Zit, Tunisia with P-38's.

SOUTH PACIFIC THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Thirteenth Air Force)
  In the Solomon Islands, B-24's, P-38's, P-40's, and Navy aircraft hit a
bivouac area and the runway at Kahili on Bougainville Island. B-25's,
P-40's, and US Navy fighters over S Kolombangara Island hit the E shore
of Webster Cove and bivouac area and buildings on Simbo Island.

SOUTHWEST PACIFIC THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Fifth Air Force)
  In New Guinea 40+ B-24's and B-17's bomb Salamaua, Malolo Mission,
Komiatum, Komiatum Ridge, and Lae Airfield.
  The 65th Troop Carrier Squadron, Fifth Air Force, arrives at Port
Moresby, New Guinea from the US with C-47's. The squadron flies it's
first mission upon arrival.

SOURCES:
AIR FORCE COMBAT UNITS OF WORLD WAR II, Office of Air Force History,
  Headquarters USAF, 1961, ISBN 0-912799-02-1
COMBAT SQUADRONS OF THE AIR FORCE, WORLD WAR II, Office of Air Force
  History, Headquarters USAF 1982
THE ARMY AIR FORCES IN WORLD WAR II: COMBAT CHRONOLOGY, 1941-1945 by the
  Office of Air Force History, Headquarters USAF, 1973
THE MIGHTY EIGHTH WAR DIARY by Roger A. Freeman, ISBN 1-85409-071-2

Jack McKillop
USAF (Airways and Air Communications Service)
1955-59

------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 26 Jul 1993 08:06:10 EDT
From:    "William B. Thacker" <wbt@CBEMF.ATT.COM>
Subject: Re: Addr: gen

RICHARD KING writes:

> I am submitting the following commentary that was posted
> on the new American Studies list (H-AMSTDY).
> ...it just
> doesn't seem accurate to me.
>     The posting in question concerns concentration camps:
>         "The 'liberation' label is problematic...American troops
>          did not 'liberate' concentration/death camp prisoners
>          who were gay, but in fact committed them to new,
>          Americanized institutions like mental hospitals,
>          new prisons etc. Liberation was on U.S. terms that
>          sometimes echoed Nazi ideology (as in this case)."

Essentially correct.  In 1945 male homosexuality was illegal in the United
States, though obviously not so severely penalized as in Germany.
(Lesbianism was not illegal in Germany, and very few women were imprisoned
because they were lesbians).   Gay men were arrested and convicted under
Paragraph 175 of the German legal code, which until 1942, called for
imprisonment.  (From 1942, the penalty was death.)  In addition,

When American forces liberated the camps, the policy on gay prisoners
(marked with pink triangles in the same fashion that Jews wore Stars of
David (made by overlapping two yellow triangles) appears to have been
inconsistent.  I'm uncertain whether an official policy was ever issued or
if the matter was left to the commander of the liberating forces.

It is a matter of record, though, that in many cases the American ruled
that

------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 26 Jul 1993 08:49:39 EDT
From:    "William B. Thacker" <wbt@CBEMF.ATT.COM>
Subject: Re: Addr: gen

(Apologies for the incomplete response I accidentally sent earlier.
Despite the repetition, I'm making this version complete.  )

RICHARD KING writes:

> I really don't feel qualified to comment myself, but it just
> doesn't seem accurate to me.

>         "The 'liberation' label is problematic...American troops
>          did not 'liberate' concentration/death camp prisoners
>          who were gay, but in fact committed them to new,
>          Americanized institutions like mental hospitals,
>          new prisons etc. Liberation was on U.S. terms that
>          sometimes echoed Nazi ideology (as in this case)."

Male homosexuality was illegal in both Germany and the United States.  In
Germany, it was a violation of Paragraph 175 of the German legal code;
until 1942, that was punishable by imprisonment, but from 1942 onward, by
death.  In the US, each state had somewhat different laws, though, of
course, none specified the death penalty.

(Lesbianism, interestingly, was not illegal in Germany, and it appears that
only a handful of lesbian women were sent to the camps because of their
sexuality.)

In any case, most of the gay men in the death camps had been arrested and
sentenced to prison, then transferred to the death camps.  These men were
marked with a pink triangle, in the same manner that Jews were marked with
the Star of David (made from two overlapping yellow triangles.)   They were
never a large percentage of the camp inmates, in part because few were
arrested (as compared to Jews, Gypsies, and criminals), but also because
they were usually the worst abused and suffered the highest mortality
rates.

When US (and British) forces liberated the prisons, there seems to have
been uncertainty over what to do with the gay prisoners.  Unlike the
anti-Jewish laws and other laws prohibiting Gypsies, Jehova's Witnesses,
etc, Paragraph 175 was not repealed by the occupation authorities.  The
US psychological profession still considered homosexuality a mental
illness.  So by both domestic and occupation standards, male homosexuals
were still guilty of a crime punishable by imprisonment.

I don't know whether an official policy was issued or the matter was left
to the commander of the liberating forces.  But it is documented that many
of these "rescued" gay men were returned to prison to serve out the
remainder of the sentence handed down by Nazi courts.  And in some cases,
the Allied officers who remanded them to prison specified that the time
they had spent in the labor camps was not to be counted toward service of
that sentence.

So while I suspect that many of the gay prisoners were liberated, it is
documented that many were not.  I've no knowledge of these men being sent
to mental hospitals, but that doesn't seem far-fetched.  I also have no
knowledge of how those prisoners in camps liberated by the Soviets fared;
Stalin had outlawed homosexuality, too, and had concentration camps of his
own.

Reference:  Richard Plant, _The Pink Triangle: The Nazi War Against
Homosexuals_

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Bill Thacker             AT&T Network Systems       attmail!att!cbemf!wbt
Quality Engineer            Columbus, Ohio              wbt@cbemf.att.com
          "Giving money and power to government is like giving
         whiskey and car keys to teenage boys." - P.J. O'Rourke

------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 26 Jul 1993 11:31:41 EDT
From:    Michael Cotter <LBCOTTER@ECUVM1.BITNET>
Subject: Re: REF: ADVICE REGARDING LIBRARIES?

John, RE: Buying books through agents.  Many libraries do buy books
though agents, but may select them from advertisements, book reviews, and
other sources that are available to them.  If a library were to have no
other source than a notice from Compuserve or other electronic medium, it
would still judge a book on the merits of the topic and the authoritative
treatment of the subject matter.   It then would be the library's choice
whether to purchase directly from the author or through an agent (or vendor).
Our library buys many of its current books through Yankee Book Peddler, in
Contoocoock (sp?) New Hampshire.

Hope this helps.

Michael Cotter
Documents Librarian
Joyner Library
East Carolina University
Greenville NC 27858
919/757-6533

------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 26 Jul 1993 13:48:58 EST
From:    Larry & Kim Jewell <jewell@MACE.CC.PURDUE.EDU>
Subject: BIO: Matthew Bunker Ridgway, RIP

Matthew Bunker Ridgway was born at Fort Monroe, Virginia, on 3
March 1895

*** graduated from the United States Military Academy, 1917

*** was commissioned a second lieutenant in April, a first
lieutenant in May, and a temporary captain in August 1917

*** was a company commander and adjutant of the 3d Infantry,
1917-1918

*** was instructor in Spanish and athletics executive at West
Point, 1918-1924

*** was promoted to permanent captain, 1919

*** graduated from the Infantry School at Fort Benning and
served with the 15th Infantry in China and the 9th Infantry in
Texas, 1925-1927

*** served on the American Electoral Commission in Nicaragua and
the Bolivia-Paraguay Commission of Inquiry and Conciliation,
1927-1929

*** married Margaret Wilcox, 1930 (divorced 1946)

*** served with the 33d Infantry in the Canal Zone, 1931-1932

*** was technical adviser to the governor general of the
Philippines, 1932-1933

*** was promoted to major, October 1932

*** graduated from the Command and General Staff School at Fort
Leavenworth, 1935, and the Army War College, 1937

*** was assistant chief of staff, G-3, of Sixth Corps Area,
Second Army, and Fourth Army between 1935 and 1939

*** served in the War Plans Division of the General Staff, 1939-
1942

*** was promoted to lieutenant colonel, July 1940, and to
temporary ranks of colonel, December 1941, brigadier general,
January 1942, and major general August 1942

*** commanded the 82d Airborne Division in operations against
Axis forces in Sicily Italy, and France, 1942-1944, and the
XVIII Airborne Corps in European operations, leading to
Germany's surrender, 1944-1945

*** was promoted to temporary lieutenant general, June 1945

*** commanded the Mediterranean Theater of Operations and was
Deputy Supreme Allied Commander there, 1945-1946

*** married Mary Anthony, 1947

*** was representative of the United States to the United
Nations Military Staff Committee and chairman of the Inter-
American Defense Board, 1946-1948

*** was commander in chief, Caribbean Command, 1948-1949

*** was deputy chief of staff for administration, 1949-1950

*** commanded the Eighth Army against Communist forces in Korea,
1950-1951

*** was promoted to general, May 1951

*** was American and Supreme Allied Commander in the Far East,
1951-1952

*** was Supreme Allied Commander in Europe, 1952-1953

*** was chief of staff of the United States Army 16 August 1953-
30 June 1955

*** dealt with postwar demobilization, training of the South
Korean Army, strengthening of the North Atlantic Treaty
Organization, establishment of a NATO line of communications,
potential crises in Indochina and Formosa, and the effects of
budget cuts upon the Army's capability to carry out its mission

*** retired from active service, June 1955

*** resided in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania until death, 26 July
1993.

From: COMMANDING GENERALS AND CHIEFS OF STAFF, 1775-1982,
William Gardner Bell, Center of Military History, United States
Army, Washington, D.C., 1983

Transcribed and edited by:
Larry W. Jewell
jewell@mace.cc.purdue.edu

------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 26 Jul 1993 20:18:26 CDT
From:    Lou Coatney <MSLRC@ECNUXA.BITNET>
Subject: Re: The Garry Owen

Tom?/Roger?

     "Garry Owen" is sung in the "Son of the Morning Star" movie about
Custer, as I remember.

Lou Coatney
Western Illinois University Library

------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 26 Jul 1993 20:31:58 CDT
From:    Lou Coatney <MSLRC@ECNUXA.BITNET>
Subject: Re: KOHL VERSUS MITTERAND - a German view

Mike Hoffman (and other Germans),

     'Good to see you speak up on the net about this topic -- and, I/we
hope -- others as well.

Lou Coatney

------------------------------

End of WWII-L Digest - 25 Jul 1993 to 26 Jul 1993
*************************************************

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There are 6 messages totalling 229 lines in this issue.

Topics of the day:

  1. INFO: Raw overall aircraft logs?
  2. GEN: LIBRARIES
  3. USAAF 27 JUL 43
  4. garyowen
  5. new job listing
  6. Need help finding regiment history

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 27 Jul 1993 00:46:02 CDT
From:    "Robert J. Granvin" <rjg@UMNSTAT.STAT.UMN.EDU>
Subject: INFO: Raw overall aircraft logs?

Particularly interested in the B-25 Mitchell (B-25J specifically, if
ever possible), but I'm curious if anyone has raw total "log data" for
various WWII aircraft?

I'm interested in large numbers indicating usage.  Of most interest
is easily accessible numbers like how many were built total (and how
many of each major model revision), but the more interesting data is
harder to come by: Approximate (in all cases) total number of missions,
miles flown, hours logged on the airframes (in combat missions or just
in general), etc.

I'd love to find data that basically said "x,xxx B-25J Mitchell's were
built which logged over xxx combat missions, xxx hours, covering xxx
miles during combat, dropping xxx tons of ordnance... blah blah blah."

Does anyone have a reference that can provide some specific requests
(beyond the B-25) or can point me to a good resource?

Oodles of Thanks.

--
Robert J. Granvin                                    Southern Minnesota Wing
rjg@stat.umn.edu                                       Confederate Air Force
  You know you've made a gear-up landing when it takes full power to taxi.

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 27 Jul 1993 09:46:02 +0200
From:    John Ausland <d_ausland_j@KARI.UIO.NO>
Subject: GEN: LIBRARIES

  Oslo, July 27.  Thanks to Michael Cotter and others for their advice
regarding libraries.  The net effect of this is to encourage me to
go ahead with mailing flyers to a select group of university, public,
and military libraries.
  On the advice of several Compuserve users, I have also written to
the Publishers Marketing Association in California, which may help
me cast a wider library net.
  Regards, John Ausland

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 27 Jul 1993 07:08:31 -0400
From:    jem3@CC.BELLCORE.COM
Subject: USAAF 27 JUL 43

COMBAT CHRONOLOGY OF THE US ARMY AIR FORCES
TUESDAY, 27 JULY 1943
FTP SITES
  1. ftp.rutgers.edu in directory pub/wwii/usaf
  2. byrd.mu.wvnet.edu (129.71.32.152) in pub/history/military/airforce/
     wwii_chronology

AIRCRAFT MENTIONED IN THIS REPORT:
  B-17, Boeing Flying Fortress
  B-24, Consolidated Liberator
  B-25, North American Mitchell
  B-26, Martin Marauder
  P-38, Lockheed Lightning
  Spitfire, Vickers Supermarine

AMERICAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  ALASKA (Eleventh Air Force)
    In the Aleutian Islands, 12 bombers and 20 fighters take off on 5
attack missions to Kiska Island. Several of the fighters jettison bombs.
The other aircraft hit Main Camp, North Head and Little Kiska Island.
    The 21st Bombardment Squadron (Heavy), 30th Bombardment Group (Heavy)
transfers from Umnak Island to Shemya, Island. The air echelon is operat-
ing from Amchitka Island.

CHINA-BURMA-INDIA THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  CHINA (Fourteenth Air Force)
    10 B-24's attack shipping in the Samah Bay area of Hainan Island,
claiming severe damage to 2 vessels; 25-30 fighters intercept the B-24's.
13 fighters are claimed shot down; no B-24's are lost. 6 B-25's, support-
ed by 14 fighters, attack targets of opportunity on Stonecutter's Island,
in the Hong Kong area after failing to locate a reported freighter in the
area.

EUROPEAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Eighth Air Force)
  VIII Air Support Command Mission Number 5: 18 B-26B's are dispatched
against Tricqueville Airfield, France; 17 hit the target at 1825 hours.

MEDITERRANEAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  EASTERN MEDITERRANEAN (Ninth Air Force)
    P-40's attack tactical targets in battle area in NE Sicily, and
others hit shipping at Catania, Sicily.

  WESTERN MEDITERRANEAN (Northwest African Air Force)
    Northwest African Strategic Air Force (NASAF) B-17's hit the airfield at
Capua and the railroad at Lioni, Italy. B-25's and B-26's bomb the landing
ground at Scalea, Sicily. Northwest African Tactical Air Force (NATAF)
fighters and light bombers continue bombing and strafing of ports, shipping,
bridges, landing grounds, and motor transport in Sicily as the US Seventh
Army reaches Tusa and San Mauro and pushes toward Nicosia.
    The 307th Fighter Squadron, 31st Fighter Group, transfers from
Agrigento, Sicily to Palermo, Sicily with Spitfires.
    The 309th Bombardment Squadron (Light), 86th Bombardment Group
(Light), transfers from Gela, Sicily to Barcelona, Sicily. This squadron
will be redesignated the 525th Fighter-Bomber Squadron on 23 Aug 43.

SOUTH PACIFIC THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Thirteenth Air Force)
  In the Solomon Islands, Brigadier General Ray L Owens becomes Command-
ing General, Thirteenth Air Force. B-17's bomb airfields at Kahili on
Bougainville Island and Ballale Island. 8 P-38's and 70+ US Navy and
Marine Corps aircraft again attack the Munda area on New Georgia Island,
hitting positions on Bibolo Hill and targets at Gurasai, Munda Point, and
Munda Airfield.
  The 371st Bombardment Squadron (Heavy), 307th Bombardment Group (Heavy)
based on Espitu Santo in the Hebrides Islands begins operating with B-24's
from Funafuti Island in the Ellice Islands.

SOUTHWEST PACIFIC THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Fifth Air Force)
  In New Guinea, 35 B-25's and 18 B-24's pound the Salamaua area in one
of the largest single-strike attacks of Southwest Pacific Area (SWPA).
Airfield and supply storage at Salamaua, the town of Kela and nearby
hilltop positions, and defensive positions between the road and beach at
Logui are hit; 5 other B-25's hit barges between Pommern Bay and Finschh-
afen, and the concentration and supply area at Voco Point; a lone B-24 on
armored reconnaissance bombs targets of opportunity on Mundua and Unea
Islands.

SOURCES:
AIR FORCE COMBAT UNITS OF WORLD WAR II, Office of Air Force History,
  Headquarters USAF, 1961, ISBN 0-912799-02-1
COMBAT SQUADRONS OF THE AIR FORCE, WORLD WAR II, Office of Air Force
  History, Headquarters USAF 1982
THE ARMY AIR FORCES IN WORLD WAR II: COMBAT CHRONOLOGY, 1941-1945 by the
  Office of Air Force History, Headquarters USAF, 1973
THE MIGHTY EIGHTH WAR DIARY by Roger A. Freeman, ISBN 1-85409-071-2

Jack McKillop
USAF (Airways and Air Communications Service)
1955-59


----------------------------------------------------------------------
|  Jack McKillop      |  Those who have long enjoyed such privileges |
|  Bellcore           |  as we enjoy forget in time that men have    |
|  Piscataway, NJ     |  died to win them.     FDR                   |
|  USA                |  jem3@cc.bellcore.com                        |
----------------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 27 Jul 1993 09:12:23 -0400
From:    "Harold J. Cohen." <COHEN@ITHACA.BITNET>
Subject: garyowen

                        A version of Garyowen(with lyrics) is available on
an audiocassette by Bobby Horton.The cassette "Homespun Songs of the Union
Army vol. 2" costs $10.00 and can be ordered from: Bobby Horton, 3430
sage Brook Lane, Birmingham, AL 35243.

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 27 Jul 1993 09:12:28 -0500
From:    Kris Zapalac <kzapalac@PAPAYA.WUSTL.EDU>
Subject: new job listing

THE FOLLOWING ANNOUNCEMENT WILL APPEAR IN AN UPCOMING ISSUE OF AHA'S
"PERSPECTIVES."  PLEASE POST TO BULLETIN BOARDS / E-LISTS AS APPROPRIATE:

MEDIEVAL EUROPEAN HISTORY.  Washington University in St. Louis is seeking
to make an appointment in Medieval European History at the rank of
assistant professor (tenure track).  Candidate should have Ph.D. by June
1994.  The Department plans to interview candidates at the AHA annual
meeting in January 1994.  Please send letter of application, c.v. or
placement file, and three letters of recommendation to Professor Richard
Walter, Department of History, Box 1062, Washington University, St. Louis
MO 63130-4899, by December 1.  Women and minority candidates are strongly
urged to apply.  Washington University is an AA/EOE.  Employment
eligibility verification required on hire.

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 27 Jul 1993 18:44:50 -0500
From:    Larry & Kim Jewell <jewell@MACE.CC.PURDUE.EDU>
Subject: Re: Need help finding regiment history

Can anyone help John out here?  Post to the list, send mail to me
or post to soc.veterans. (Email to soc.veterans via
soc-veterans@cs.utexas.edu).

TIA,
Larry J

>I apologize if this is the wrong newsgroup but I need help
>finding information on my father's WW2 military history.
>
>According to his discharge papers he was in the 253rd Infantry
>Regiment serving in Europe. As a kid, either my imagination
>ran wild or I was told he was in the 101st Airborne in the
>Normandy Invasion and also fought in the Battle of the Bulge.
>From what I have read in books, I see no mention of the 253rd
>Infantry Regiment along with the 101st Airborne.
>
>Is it common for GIs and/or Regiments to get moved araoun? Is the
>regiment listed on his discharge papers his assignment at the time
>of discharge only or would it have been throughout his service?
>His papers list the following Campaigns: Central Europe Rhineland,
>G.O. 33, and W.D. 45 - do these mean anything to anybody?
>His basic training was in Fort Dix, New Jersey.
>
>I would greatly appreciate any help on researching the history of
>the 253rd Inf. Reg. or if anybody can tell me how to go about
>tracking down his military records I would be forever grateful.
>Thanks in advance for any help anybody can provide.
>--
>John R. Bonsma
>Bell Communications Research
>jrb1@donuts0.bellcore.com


--
#L.W. Jewell WWII-L Listowner JEWELL@MACE.CC.PURDUE.EDU
#"Sunday's horoscope is note worthy because of its strange, sudden and wholly
#unpredictable and inexplicable occurrences, affecting all phases of life."
#"Your Horoscope" L.A. Evening Herald Express, Sat, 12/06/41  #

------------------------------

End of WWII-L Digest - 26 Jul 1993 to 27 Jul 1993
*************************************************

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There are 7 messages totalling 280 lines in this issue.

Topics of the day:

  1. Need help in finding
  2. USAAF 28 JUL 43
  3. HELP!!!!!
  4. INF: Marshall at Ft. Screven
  5. REF: 2nd World War Aftermath -- Berlin blockade?
  6. Informations Request (2)

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 28 Jul 1993 10:58:45 +0200
From:    John Ausland <d_ausland_j@KARI.UIO.NO>
Subject: Re: Need help in finding

i]Larry, the only reference I find to the 253 Regiment in the material
I have makes it a part of the 63rd Division after our forces crossed
the Rhine.  John might call 202 504-5400.  This is the number of:

Army Office of Military Hist.
1099 14th St. NW
Franklin Court
Washington, DC 20005-3402

If he does not get enough information there, he can visit the National
Archives in Suitland, Maryland.

I do not know how one gets information on an individual.  If anyone else
does, I would be curious to know.  There is a National Personnel Records
Center in St. Louis, but when I wrote them to get some Morning Reports,
they told me they were only helping people who are trying to make claims
against the government.

Regards, John Ausland

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 28 Jul 1993 07:15:09 -0400
From:    jem3@CC.BELLCORE.COM
Subject: USAAF 28 JUL 43

COMBAT CHRONOLOGY OF THE US ARMY AIR FORCES
WEDNESDAY, 28 JULY 1943
FTP SITES
  1. ftp.rutgers.edu in directory pub/wwii/usaf
  2. byrd.mu.wvnet.edu (129.71.32.152) in pub/history/military/airforce/
     wwii_chronology

AIRCRAFT MENTIONED IN THIS REPORT:
  A-36, North American Apache
  B-17, Boeing Flying Fortress
  B-24, Consolidated Liberator
  B-25, North American Mitchell
  B-26, Martin Marauder
  C-47, Douglas Skytrain
  Fw 190, Focke Wulf (Luftwaffe)
  Liberator, Consolidated (RAF)
  P-39, Bell Airacobra
  P-40, Curtiss
  P-47, Republic Thunderbolt

CENTRAL PACIFIC THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Seventh Air Force)
  The 333d Fighter Squadron, 318th Fighter Group, transfers from Hilo,
Hawaii to Bellows Field, Oahu, Territory of Hawaii with P-39's.

CHINA-BURMA-INDIA THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  CHINA (Fourteenth Air Force)
    6 B-25's, with escort of 9 P-40's, bomb Taikoo Docks at Hong Kong.

EUROPEAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Eighth Air Force)

  ANTISUBMARINE WARFARE (AAF Antisubmarine Command)
    In the Bay of Biscay, German submarine, U-404, is sunk by a B-24 of
the 4th Antisubmarine Squadron (Heavy) and a Royal Air Force (RAF) Libera-
tor of No. 224 Squadron, at 45-53N 09-23W.

  STRATEGIC OPERATIONS (Eighth Air Force)
    VIII Bomber Command Mission Number 78: The aviation industry in
Germany is targetted but bad weather hampers the raids. The targets are:
      1. 182 B-17's are dispatched against the Fieseler Works at Kassel,
Germany; 58 hit the target at 1027-1054 hours; they claim 27-15-22
Luftwaffe aircraft; 7 B-17's are lost, 4 are damaged beyond repair and 54
damaged; casualties are 15 WIA and 71 MIA.
      2. 120 B-17's are dispatched to the Fw 190 plant at Oschersleben,
Germany; 37 hit the target; they claim 56-19-41 Luftwaffe aircraft; 15 B-
17's are lost, 1 is damaged beyond repair and 64 damaged; casualties are
11 WIA and 134 MIA.
  This is the deepest US bomber penetration into Germany to date. The
raid achieves good results however, 22 B-17's are lost as fighters score
first effective results with rockets. 105 P-47's, equipped with jettison-
able belly tanks for the first time on a mission, escort the B-17's into
Germany; other P-47's, going more than 30 miles (48 km) deeper into
Germany than they have penetrated before, meet the returning bombers.
They surprise about 60 German fighters and destroy 9 of them; 1 P-47 is
lost.
    VIII Air Support Command Mission Numbers 6 and 7: The primary targets
are in Belgium and France, i.e.:
      1. 18 B-26B's are dispatched against the coke ovens at Zeebrugge,
Belgium; 17 hit the target at 1105 hours; 3 B-26's are damaged.
      2. 18 B-26B's are dispatched against Tricqueville Airfield, France
but the mission is recalled when the accompanying fighters do not join
up.

MEDITERRANEAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  EASTERN MEDITERRANEAN (Ninth Air Force)
    In Sicily, almost 100 P-40's hit shipping at Catania and Santa Teresa
di Riva, fly patrol over the Straits of Messina, and bomb encampments.

  WESTERN MEDITERRANEAN (Northwest African Air Force)
     Northwest African Strategic Air Force (NASAF) fighters sweep over S
Sardinia. In Sicily, Northwest African Tactical Air Force (NATAF) light
bombers hit Regalbuto, Milazzo, and Centuripe; A-36's and P-40's hit
heavy traffic on the Troina-Randazzo road, bridges and roads N and W of
Cesaro, the landing ground at Falcone, and buildings near Randazzo.
     On the ground in Sicily, the US Seventh Army takes Nicosia and
pushes toward Santo Stefano di Camastra. The British Eighth Army takes
Agira. Allied cargo vessels begin arriving at Palermo, and Lieutenant
General Harold R Alexander, 15 Army Group Commanding General, moves his
HQ to Sicily.
    HQ 320th Bombardment Group and it's 443d Bombardment Squadron (Medi-
um) transfer from Massicault, Tunisia to El Bathan, Tunisia with
B-26's.
    The 8th Troop Carrier Squadron, 62d Troop Carrier Group, transfers
from El Djem, Tunisia to Gourbrine, Tunisia with C-47's.
    The 99th Fighter Squadron, XII Air Support Command, transfers from
Fardjouna, Tunisia to Licata, Sicily with P-40's.

SOUTH PACIFIC THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Thirteenth Air Force)
  In the Solomon Islands, B-25's and US Navy aircraft hit gun positions
and other targets at Webster Cove on New Georgia Island.

SOUTHWEST PACIFIC THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Fifth Air Force)
  On New Britain Island in the Bismarck Archipelago, B-25's attack barges
and fuel dump between Cape Raoult and Rein Bay and hit the airfield at
Cape Gloucester and 2 destroyers offshore; single B-24's bomb Unea
Island and unsuccessfully attack shipping in Saint George Channel between
New Ireland and New Britain Islands. In New Guinea, B-24's bomb Manokwari
and Larat and Boela on Ceram Island in the Moluccas Islands. On Timor
Island, B-25's hit the town of Lautem and the airfield at Cape Chater.

SOURCES:
AIR FORCE COMBAT UNITS OF WORLD WAR II, Office of Air Force History,
  Headquarters USAF, 1961, ISBN 0-912799-02-1
COMBAT SQUADRONS OF THE AIR FORCE, WORLD WAR II, Office of Air Force
  History, Headquarters USAF 1982
THE ARMY AIR FORCES IN WORLD WAR II: COMBAT CHRONOLOGY, 1941-1945 by the
  Office of Air Force History, Headquarters USAF, 1973
THE MIGHTY EIGHTH WAR DIARY by Roger A. Freeman, ISBN 1-85409-071-2

Jack McKillop
USAF (Airways and Air Communications Service)
1955-59


----------------------------------------------------------------------
|  Jack McKillop      |  Those who have long enjoyed such privileges |
|  Bellcore           |  as we enjoy forget in time that men have    |
|  Piscataway, NJ     |  died to win them.     FDR                   |
|  USA                |  jem3@cc.bellcore.com                        |
----------------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 28 Jul 1993 09:01:08 -0400
From:    jem3@CC.BELLCORE.COM
Subject: HELP!!!!!

Larry,

Please excuse this post; but I need an answer and the guys on this
net are some of the best!!!!

I remember seeing a book within the last six months about the
Berlin Airlift of Jun 48-Sep 49.  I mentioned it to someone who now
wants it but I cannot find it in the book stores and unfortunately, I
don't remember the author or title.  (Sorta SOL, right?)  Does anyone
have any additional information?

Please e-mail me at the address listed below.  Thanks in advance!

----------------------------------------------------------------------
|  Jack McKillop      |  Those who have long enjoyed such privileges |
|  Bellcore           |  as we enjoy forget in time that men have    |
|  Piscataway, NJ     |  died to win them.     FDR                   |
|  USA                |  jem3@cc.bellcore.com                        |
----------------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 28 Jul 1993 11:04:17 EST
From:    Larry & Kim Jewell <jewell@MACE.CC.PURDUE.EDU>
Subject: INF: Marshall at Ft. Screven

John asked about George Marshall's short stay at Ft. Screven (sp?),
and, according to Forrest Pogue, it was short because Douglas MacArthur
wanted him to take the instructor job.  Marshall was having a lot of fun
with the CCC and didn't want to go, but Dougie Mac made a personal
request and George went quietly.

Interesting things pop up when you have a small army where "everybody knows
everybody" :-).

Further details on request. Sorry I didn't write down the name of the Pogue
book.  I'll get it later and post or mail if requested.

Larry J

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 28 Jul 1993 14:31:04 EDT
From:    Robert E George <regeorge@MAGNUS.ACS.OHIO-STATE.EDU>
Subject: REF: 2nd World War Aftermath -- Berlin blockade?

 The Berlin airlift /                           Tusa, Ann.  1988   2
 The Berlin blockade /                          Tusa, Ann.  1988   3
 Das Krisenmanagement der Vereinigten Staaten   Gerhardt,   1984   4
  The United States and the Berlin Blockade, 19  Shlaim, Av  1983   5
  Die Berliner Krise 1948/49 :  zur imperialist  Keiderling  1982   6
  Kryzys berli?nski, 1948-1949 /                 Mikulska-G  1980   7
 Berlin and Israel 1948  [microform] : foreign  Rosenberg,  1978   1
  Bridge across the sky :  the Berlin blockade   Collier, R  1978   2
  Blockade: Berlin and the cold war.             Morris, Er  1973   4
 Es ging um Deutschlands Einheit.  R?uckschau   Friedensbu  1971   7
  The American occupation of Germany;  politics  Gimbel, Jo  1968   1
  Bridge in the sky                              Donovan, F  1968   2
 Berlin airlift.                                Rodrigo, R  1960   3


Was it any of the above?

     Regards,
     Robert George

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 27 Jul 1993 16:24:09 BRA
From:    "Silvio E. G. Melo" <COV90105@UFRJ.BITNET>
Subject: Informations Request

     Please, if is possible i need informations about the fate of following
ships:

British Cruisers : Adventure, Delhi, Despatch, Durbam, Dautless, Diomede, Danae
British Destroiers : Scimitar, Scout, Saladin, Sardonyx, Shikari, Sabre, Fury,
                     Fame, Douglas, Campbel, Malcolm, Mackay, Stuart, Montrose
British Gumboat : Gnat, Scarab, Farantuba, Term
British Minelayer : Ringdove, Medusa, Malpomene, Minerva

     Grate in advance

     Silvio. E. G. Melo

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 28 Jul 1993 19:01:27 MDT
From:    Steve Alvin <STEPHEN_ALVIN@DSU1.DSU.NODAK.EDU>
Subject: Re: Informations Request

On tue, July 27th, Silvio Melo requested:

>      Please, if is possible i need informations about the fate of following
> ships:
>
> British Cruisers : Adventure, Delhi, Despatch, Durbam, Dautless, Diomede, Danae
> British Destroiers : Scimitar, Scout, Saladin, Sardonyx, Shikari, Sabre, Fury,
>                      Fame, Douglas, Campbel, Malcolm, Mackay, Stuart, Montrose
> British Gumboat : Gnat, Scarab, Farantuba, Term
> British Minelayer : Ringdove, Medusa, Malpomene, Minerva

You might want to get a copy of *Ships of the Royal Navy*, by J. J.
Colledge.  "The complete record of all fighting ships of the Royal
Navy, from 1400 to today, is presented here in alphabetical order.
Each entry includes the ship's tonnage, main armament, builder,
launch data, disposition, and any name change." Maybe a Librarian on
the list can provide the publisher and ISBN number.

I hope this helps.


Steve Alvin
Dickinson State University
STEPHEN_ALVIN@DSU1.DSU.NODAK.EDU
**********************************************************************
*Those who fail to remember history are doomed to repeat it.--Proverb*
*Those who fail to remember history are doomed to repeat my class.-SA*
**********************************************************************

------------------------------

End of WWII-L Digest - 27 Jul 1993 to 28 Jul 1993
*************************************************

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There are 14 messages totalling 583 lines in this issue.

Topics of the day:

  1. Need help finding regiment history (2)
  2. USAAF 29 JUL 43
  3. Nat'l HIstorical Soc. (2)
  4. INF: MARSHALL
  5. REF: BRITISH BOOK ON WWII DOCUMENTS
  6. VET:Ethnic/Minority
  7. Green Books (3)
  8. "Greenbacks" -- (BIBLIO?)
  9. Patton anecdote
 10. Informations Request

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 29 Jul 1993 09:16:45 +0200
From:    Chris Scogings <cscoging@UNPCS1.CS.UNP.AC.ZA>
Subject: Re: Need help finding regiment history

>>According to his discharge papers he was in the 253rd Infantry
>>Regiment serving in Europe. As a kid, either my imagination
>>ran wild or I was told he was in the 101st Airborne in the
>>Normandy Invasion and also fought in the Battle of the Bulge.
>>From what I have read in books, I see no mention of the 253rd
>>Infantry Regiment along with the 101st Airborne.

Has anyone answered this yet?  The 82nd and 101st Airborne regiments,
certainly on D-Day, were consecutive numbers starting with 501, ie: there
was 501, 502, 503, etc up to about 507.  I'm certain that the 253rd INF regt
would have nothing to do with them.

BTW, anyone know why the regiments were consecutive numbers but the two
Airborne divs were 82 and 101 ?  and later on, the 17th Airborne.

Chris
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Chris Scogings                      Voice: (27) 331 955645
Computer Science Dept                 Fax: (27) 331 955599
University of Natal
Pietermaritzburg                   E-Mail:cscoging@unpcs1.cs.unp.ac.za
----------------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 29 Jul 1993 07:32:17 EDT
From:    Lowe Barrett MAJ <hb9388@USMA6.USMA.EDU>
Subject: Re: Need help finding regiment history

Larry and John,

I offer the following info about the 253rd Inf Regt.

Bear

253rd Inf Regt:

253rd Inf, 254th Inf, 255th Inf  assigned to 63rd Inf Div in WW2.

Entered combat in late 1944 on southern part of French front.
Assigned to 7th US Army.  Fought in and around the Colmar Pocket
Jan-Feb 45.  In Feb, crossed the Saar north of Sarreguemines and
a few weeks later breached the Siegfried Line (US term; German term
is the Westwall) just south of Saarbrucken.  Captured Heidelberg
in March.  In April, destroyed the remains of the 17th SS
Panzer-grenadier Division near the Hardthauser Woods and crossed
the NEckar River.  Pursued the retreating German forces through
Wurttemburg and Bavaria.  Ended the war near Landberg at the edge
of the Bavarian Alps.

The 253rd Inf Regt never fought with or was assigned to the
101st Airborne Division.

Info taken from:

1)  Infantry Regiments of the US Army by James Sawicki,
Wyern Publications, Dumfies, Virginia, 1981.

2)  Fighting Divisions by CWO E. J. Kahn and Tech Sgt
H. McElmore, Infantry Journal Press, Washington DC, 1946
(now out of print).



>Can anyone help John out here?  Post to the list, send mail to me
>or post to soc.veterans. (Email to soc.veterans via
>soc-veterans@cs.utexas.edu).
>
>TIA,
>Larry J
>
>>I apologize if this is the wrong newsgroup but I need help
>>finding information on my father's WW2 military history.
>>
>>According to his discharge papers he was in the 253rd Infantry
>>Regiment serving in Europe. As a kid, either my imagination
>>ran wild or I was told he was in the 101st Airborne in the
>>Normandy Invasion and also fought in the Battle of the Bulge.
>>From what I have read in books, I see no mention of the 253rd
>>Infantry Regiment along with the 101st Airborne.
>>
>>Is it common for GIs and/or Regiments to get moved araoun? Is the
>>regiment listed on his discharge papers his assignment at the time
>>of discharge only or would it have been throughout his service?
>>His papers list the following Campaigns: Central Europe Rhineland,
>>G.O. 33, and W.D. 45 - do these mean anything to anybody?
>>His basic training was in Fort Dix, New Jersey.
>>
>>I would greatly appreciate any help on researching the history of
>>the 253rd Inf. Reg. or if anybody can tell me how to go about
>>tracking down his military records I would be forever grateful.
>>Thanks in advance for any help anybody can provide.
>>--
>>John R. Bonsma
>>Bell Communications Research
>>jrb1@donuts0.bellcore.com
>
>
>--
>#L.W. Jewell WWII-L Listowner JEWELL@MACE.CC.PURDUE.EDU
>#"Sunday's horoscope is note worthy because of its strange, sudden and wholly
>#unpredictable and inexplicable occurrences, affecting all phases of life."
>#"Your Horoscope" L.A. Evening Herald Express, Sat, 12/06/41  #
>

Barrett F. Lowe                    RANGERS LEAD THE WAY!
MAJ, IN
Dept of Physics, US Military Academy, West Point, NY 10996

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 29 Jul 1993 07:51:03 -0400
From:    jem3@CC.BELLCORE.COM
Subject: USAAF 29 JUL 43

COMBAT CHRONOLOGY OF THE US ARMY AIR FORCES
THURSDAY, 29 JULY 1943
FTP SITES
  1. ftp.rutgers.edu in directory pub/wwii/usaf
  2. byrd.mu.wvnet.edu (129.71.32.152) in pub/history/military/airforce/
     wwii_chronology

AIRCRAFT MENTIONED IN THIS REPORT:
  B-17, Boeing Flying Fortress
  B-24, Consolidated Liberator
  B-25, North American Mitchell
  B-26, Martin Marauder
  B-40, Boeing Flying Fortress
  Beaufighter, Bristol
  P-40, Curtiss

AMERICAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  ALASKA (Eleventh Air Force)
    In the Aleutian Islands, 1 B-17 scouts Kiska Island and bombs the
Main Camp area.

CHINA-BURMA-INDIA THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  BURMA-INDIA (Tenth Air Force)
    In Burma, 2 flights of B-25's blast the previously bombed Mu River
bridge between Ywataung and Monywa. The bridge is hit heavily with 1 span
left submerged in the river.

  CHINA (Fourteenth Air Force)
    18 B-24's, with fighter escort, bomb shipping and dockyard installa-
tions at Hong Kong. Kowloon and Taikoo Docks and the old Royal Navy yards
are hit. 4 P-40's attack a Japanese force of 23 bombers and 30 fighters
attacking Hengyang, China; 1 Japanese fighter is downed.

EUROPEAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Eighth Air Force)
  VIII Bomber Command Mission Number 79: 2 locations in Germany are the
targets for this mission:
    1. 167 B-17's and a YB-40 are dispatched to the shipyards at Kiel;
91 hit the shipyard at 0901 hours and 48 hit targets of opportunity; they
claim 48-6-33 Luftwaffe aircraft; 6 B-17's are lost, 2 are damaged beyond
repair and 62 are damaged; casualties are 2 KIA, 8 WIA and 61 MIA.
    2. 81 B-17's are dispatched to the Heinkel Works at Warnemunde; 54 hit
the target at 0922-0924 hours; they claim 0-2-0 Luftwaffe aircraft; 4
B-17's are lost and 7 damaged; casualties are 40 MIA.
  VIII Air Support Command Missions 8 and 9: 2 airfields are the target:
    1. 18 B-26B's are dispatched against Schipol Airfield at Amsterdam,
The Netherlands; the mission is aborted due to a navigational error.
    2. 21 B-26B's are dispatched against Ft. Rouge Airfield, France; 19
hit the target at 1828 hours; 8 B-26's are damaged.

MEDITERRANEAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  EASTERN MEDITERRANEAN (Ninth Air Force)
    In Sicily, 200+ P-40's, to date the largest number of fighters
operating in 1 day during the Sicilian campaign, attack Messina Riposto,
shipping at Catania, Santa Teresa di Riva, Taormina, Milazzo, and in the
Straits of Messina.

  WESTERN MEDITERRANEAN (Northwest African Air Force)
    Northwest African Strategic Air Force (NASAF) B-26's hit Aquino Air-
field, Sicily. B-17's bomb Viterbo Airfield, Italy. In Sicily, Northwest
African Tactical Air Force (NATAF) fighters and light bombers hit Regalbuto,
Milazzo, shipping off Messina, and gun positions and motor transport in NE
Sicily.
    On the ground in Sicily, the US Seventh Army almost completes the mopup
of W Sicily, approaches Santo Stefano Quisquina, advances on Mistretta, and
takes 3 islands off Trapani. The British Eighth Army opens an assault during
the night of 29/30 Jul along an axis of Catenanuova-Adrano.
    The detachment of the 414th Night Fighter Squadron, 2d Air Defense
Wing, operating from Protville, Tunisia with Beaufighters returns to it's
base at Rerhaia, Algeria.
    The 415th Night Fighter Squadron, 1st Air Defense Wing, transfers from
Monastir, Tunisia to La Sebala, Tunisia with Beaufighters. The detachment
at Protville, Tunisia also transfers.
    The 441st, 442d and 444th Bombardment Squadrons (Medium), 320th
Bombardment Group (Medium), transfer from Massicault, Tunisia to El
Bathan, Tunisia with B-26's.

SOUTHWEST PACIFIC THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Fifth Air Force)
  In New Guinea, B-17's, B-24's, and B-25's bomb Kela Point and village,
and Salamaua town and peninsula area. On New Britain Island in the Bis-
marck Archipelago, B-25's, B-26's, and a B-24 attack Army HQ, barges, and
villages in the Natamo vicinity, shipping off Cape Gloucester, Borgen Bay,
along the coast from Ring Ring Plantation to Roebuck Point and barges off
Cape Dampier, New Guinea. P-40's strafe targets of opportunity.

SOURCES:
AIR FORCE COMBAT UNITS OF WORLD WAR II, Office of Air Force History,
  Headquarters USAF, 1961, ISBN 0-912799-02-1
COMBAT SQUADRONS OF THE AIR FORCE, WORLD WAR II, Office of Air Force
  History, Headquarters USAF 1982
THE ARMY AIR FORCES IN WORLD WAR II: COMBAT CHRONOLOGY, 1941-1945 by the
  Office of Air Force History, Headquarters USAF, 1973
THE MIGHTY EIGHTH WAR DIARY by Roger A. Freeman, ISBN 1-85409-071-2

Jack McKillop
USAF (Airways and Air Communications Service)
1955-59


----------------------------------------------------------------------
|  Jack McKillop      |  Those who have long enjoyed such privileges |
|  Bellcore           |  as we enjoy forget in time that men have    |
|  Piscataway, NJ     |  died to win them.     FDR                   |
|  USA                |  jem3@cc.bellcore.com                        |
----------------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 29 Jul 1993 08:17:53 EDT
From:    "William B. Thacker" <wbt@CBEMF.ATT.COM>
Subject: Nat'l HIstorical Soc.

I got mail last night from "The National HIstorical Society" out of
Hicksville, NY.  They're hawking a multi-volume set, titled "The UNited
States Army in World War II"

The set consists of a number (I can't tell how many) of volumes, plus three
picture books (400 pages each) plus two softcover atlases with 100 maps.
The first volume is over 600 pages,  for which they want only $20. (and
they take ten bucks off that as an introductory grabber.)  They also throw
in some other junk.

This looks too good to be true.  Twenty bucks for a book is nothing, and
they look to be of good quality.  I'm skeptical, it looks so good. I can
think of a number of ways this could turn sour (there are several thousand
volumes, perhaps, or the later books are $50 each...).  Does anyone know
anything about these folks?  (I'll give them a call, of course, but I
figured I'd check here, too.)

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Bill Thacker             AT&T Network Systems       attmail!att!cbemf!wbt
Quality Engineer            Columbus, Ohio              wbt@cbemf.att.com
          "Giving money and power to government is like giving
         whiskey and car keys to teenage boys." - P.J. O'Rourke

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 29 Jul 1993 10:04:58 -0400
From:    "Mr. Scott Hannon" <hannon@UMBC.EDU>
Subject: Re: Nat'l HIstorical Soc.

Bill Thacker writes:
>I got mail last night from "The National HIstorical Society" out of
>Hicksville, NY.  They're hawking a multi-volume set, titled "The UNited
>States Army in World War II"
...
>The first volume is over 600 pages,  for which they want only $20.
...
>This looks too good to be true.  Twenty bucks for a book is nothing, and
>they look to be of good quality.  I'm skeptical, it looks so good.

These are clones of the famous "green series" published (and still available
from) the US GPO. I too received this offer. Looks fairly good, but I
aready have a number of these books, and I'd rather not have to hassle
with a "book of the month" type of buying arrangement. And as most of
the volumes are still available from the GPO ($17-$40, most maybe $25) its
not all that great a deal.

*I think* all books published by the US GPO are in the public domain, so
anyone can (and as we see, they do) reprint them and sell them.

Most of the books look fairly good...they are mostly by US Army historians
and used primary sources (after action reports, orders, etc. Lots of foot
notes, etc).

Unfortunately the series was never completed (well, not with complete
coverage). The operations of 6th Army Group in S and E France are barely
covered...the operations in Alsace are just plain not covered at all.

The person who asked about the 253rd will thus have trouble, as...you guessed
it...the 253rd was part of 63 ID, a part of US 7th Army, a part of 6th Army
Group...in Alsace! [Remember the French in WW2 discussion? Their 1st Army
was the other unit with 6th Army Group.]

Oh, and the 63 ID and 101 ABD were both involved in the same fight in Alsace
in late Jan 1945. I forget if they were adjacent in the line (along the Moder
river) or not.

Scott.

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 29 Jul 1993 16:54:46 +0200
From:    John Ausland <d_ausland_j@KARI.UIO.NO>
Subject: INF: MARSHALL

  Oslo, July 29.  Larry, You probably have in mind one of the volumes of
Pogue's biography of Marshall, which are fine books.  I have the
one on the post war period and can get the one on the pre-war at
a library here, so don't go to further trouble.
  Regards, John Ausland

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 29 Jul 1993 16:55:05 +0200
From:    John Ausland <d_ausland_j@KARI.UIO.NO>
Subject: REF: BRITISH BOOK ON WWII DOCUMENTS

  Oslo, July 29.  The British have recently published THE SECOND
WORLD WAR: a guide to documents in the Public Record Office, by
John D. Canwell.  It seems to cover all the ministries, including
the Foreign Office, except the defense ministry.
  There is however at the back a list of official histories of
the war.  The one on Europe is VICTORY ON THE WESTERN FRONT,
edited by Major L.F. Ellis.
*******************************************************************
* John C. Ausland               Tel: +47 22 14 17 68              *
* Land Productions              Fax: +47 22 16 30 92              *
* Sondreveien 4, Entry 2        CIS: 73240,2704                   *
* 0378 Oslo, Norway             Internet: d_ausland_j@kari.uio.no *
*******************************************************************

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 29 Jul 1993 09:50:01 -0500
From:    Ellen Pedraza <pedraza@CS.UWP.EDU>
Subject: VET:Ethnic/Minority

Hi!  I represent a group of students training to be elementary school
teachers.

For their class assignment (due in early September) they would like to
contact WWII veterans (or spouses or friends) from the following ethnic
groups:

African-American
Hispanic-American (Mexican, Puerto Rican, Cuban)
German-American
Italian-American
Native-American
Asian-American (Chinese, Japanese, Pacific Islander, Cambodian)

The group needs to talk (email) to individuals from the above groups about
their experiences at home or during military service during WWII.

If any of the WWII-L subscribers (or friends or spouses) meet the above
description and would like to "talk" to the class, please contact me
directly at the email address below.

The class assignment is to incorporate the ethnic experience into a
curriculum for Grades 2-5 about WWII.  They will be using traditional
sources such as films, videos, textbooks, but also want to include
personal interviews.

Also, if any subscribers are aware of ethnic/minority WWII veterans
organizations, I would appreciate hearing from you.

Ellen J. Pedraza        University of Wisconsin-Parkside
pedraza@cs.uwp.edu      (414)595-2077

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 29 Jul 1993 11:53:00 -0400
From:    Kevin Kamphaus <USR5066A@CBOS.UC.EDU>
Subject: Green Books

I have read alot in this group about the "Green Books". What are they, do they
have a ISBN number, would they be available in my public library, and if they
were, what would they be called?

Thanks,
Kevin Kamphaus
usr5066a@cbos.uc.edu
kamphaus@petsys.dnet.ge.com


------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 29 Jul 1993 14:35:14 -0400
From:    "Mr. Scott Hannon" <hannon@UMBC.EDU>
Subject: Re: Green Books

>I have read alot in this group about the "Green Books". What are they,

That is the slang name of "The US Army in World War II" official history,
a multi-volume set [hmmm, maybe 30 volumes?] covering the European,
North African, Italian, Pacific, and Alaska/US theaters and operations
of *the US Army*. Not the US Marines, USAAF, Navy, etc, *just the US
Army*. Besides the military history of the campaigns, other volumes deal
with the special topics and services (quartermaster, chemical warfare,
etc).

The reason they are called the "green series" is that the binding and
covers are green...hey, these are ARMY books after all  :^)
Generally they take up couple meters of shelf space, so a walk thru
the military history section of a library will make them easy to find
if the library has them.

>do they have a ISBN number,

I'd assume so...I don't have a volume handy.
I forget the Dewey...in the "D"s with WW2 history.

> would they be available in my public library,

Public library? Unlikely, unless it is a good big one. They are certainly
not "rare". University librarys are likely to have them too.

>and if they were, what would they be called?

Each volume has its own title...they are part of a series, but each is
a stand-alone work. _Rearming the French_, _Chronology_, _Victory in
Papua_, etc, etc.

As I said, most of the "green series" volumes are still available
from the US GPO. The GPO also offers a fair selection of other good
military history books, and prices are very reasonable (its non-profit;
prices are merely to covering costs). They are available to anyone by
mail order or local GPO bookstore, not just US citizens.

Scott.
Scott Hannon, Thu Jul 29 1993 (hannon@umbc.edu)

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 29 Jul 1993 14:34:12 CDT
From:    Lou Coatney <MSLRC@ECNUXA.BITNET>
Subject: "Greenbacks" -- (BIBLIO?)

The Army "Greenbacks" can also be found in U.S. Documents depository
  collections in many major libraries -- call ahead.

If a library shelf number begins with a letter (like "D") it is part of the
  Library of Congress numbering system.  The Dewey numbers for WWII are in
  the 940s.

The U.S. Army Center for Military History has many other excellent publica-
  tions, including its series on the Russian Front.  Ironically the final/3rd
  volume (by Ziemke) was published first -- maybe because the Soviets were
  more forthcoming about their victories at the time -- and then the second.

We are still waiting on Dr. Charles von Luttischau's "Meisterwerke" -- the
  draft now stands at well over 1,000 pages, and the CMH is balking at
  publishing it.  Dr. vL did the superb maps in the Breakout & Pursuit and
  Ardennes volumes.

I urge WWII-L members to contact anyone they know in DC of influence (and)
  to (otherwise) exhort Brig. Gen. Nelson, the CinC, to get this moving.
  USACMH, 1099 14th St NW, Wash., DC, 20005-3402, 202/504-5400.

Lou Coatney
  Western Illinois University Library (although the opinions expressed above
  are my own, not the Library's)

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 29 Jul 1993 14:46:17 -0400
From:    "Dennis E. Sparks" <SPARKS@CAER.UKY.EDU>
Subject: Patton anecdote

This anecdote about Gen. Patton was extracted from Paul Tibbet's
autobiography, which has been variously titled "The Tibbets Story",
and "Flight of the Enola Gay".  As a 2nd Lt., Tibbets was assigned
to Fort Benning, GA in February 1938.  One of his duties was to
fly the then Lt. Col. Patton over the countryside so that he could
observe his tanks in action.

"One incident that I remember quite well came in 1940, when Patton's
outfit was demonstrating the speed, firepower, and manueverability
of some newly acquired tanks.  Bleachers and loudspeakers were set up
in the demonstration area, and a large number of officers from other
units, in addition to the tank corps students, turned out for the show.

The tanks clattered by in formation, then turned and smashed down a
number of fair-sized trees.  The instructors kept the spectators
informed of what was happening.  Patton himself took the microphone
at one point.  ...

Inspired perhaps by the size of his audience, he suddenly was seized
with the impulse to do something spectacular.  On a nearby hillside
was an abandoned farmhouse in ramshackle condition.  A tank had just
come to a stop in front of the bleachers and its driver, a sergeant,
was pointing out features that made this equipment superior to the
old tanks.

Patton broke into the sergeant's lecture and said, "Now I'll show you
what this tank can do.  See that house over there?  I'm going to
knock it down."

The sergeant started to protest.  "But sir," he said, "I wouldn't do-"

The general waved him aside and said, "Never mind, sergeant, I'm going
to show these people something."

Before the sergeant could remonstrate further, Patton climbed through
the hatch, let himself down into the driver's seat, and went roaring
across the field and up the hill in a cloud of dust.

The old frame house shuddered as Patton's tank smashed into it at full
speed.  Splinters flew in every direction as one side of the structure
collapsed.  But the big tank failed to come out the other side as it
was supposed to.  The spectators watched in puzzeled expectancy, and
a couple of tank corpsmen, including the sergeant, rushed to the house.

A few moments later they emerged, accompanied by Patton.  "Why didn't
someone tell me there was a basement under that house?" asked the
general, who was in good spirits despite his misadventure.  Suddenly
he realized that the sergeant had been trying to tell him just that.
Striding to the microphone, he showed no sign of embarrassment.

"There's a lesson in this," he told his audience of military
personnel.  "Always listen to your sergeant." "



Dennis E. Sparks
SPARKS@CAER.UKY.EDU
Lexington, Kentucky

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 29 Jul 1993 16:07:58 EST
From:    Larry & Kim Jewell <jewell@MACE.CC.PURDUE.EDU>
Subject: Re: Green Books

>
> >I have read alot in this group about the "Green Books". What are they,
>
> That is the slang name of "The US Army in World War II" official history,
> a multi-volume set [hmmm, maybe 30 volumes?] covering the European,

  70+ at last count.

> >do they have a ISBN number,

> I'd assume so...I don't have a volume handy.
> I forget the Dewey...in the "D"s with WW2 history.

  D100's in the GovDoc section of a repository library.  Dewey is 940.92,
if memory serves.

> As I said, most of the "green series" volumes are still available
> from the US GPO. The GPO also offers a fair selection of other good
> military history books, and prices are very reasonable (its non-profit;
> prices are merely to covering costs). They are available to anyone by
> mail order or local GPO bookstore, not just US citizens.

  Ordering information and store locations are available from "byrd".
(byrd.mu.wvnet.edu) as gpo_order.txt and gpo_store.txt.

> Scott.
> Scott Hannon, Thu Jul 29 1993 (hannon@umbc.edu)


Larry J

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 29 Jul 1993 15:07:12 BRA
From:    "Silvio E. G. Melo" <COV90105@UFRJ.BITNET>
Subject: Re: Informations Request

      Steve

      Thank's for your information, but in Brasil the access of some books is
very dificult and more times, impossible.
      I'll look for this book, thank's.

                               Silvio

------------------------------

End of WWII-L Digest - 28 Jul 1993 to 29 Jul 1993
*************************************************

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Status: O

There are 12 messages totalling 606 lines in this issue.

Topics of the day:

  1. USAAF 30 JUL 43
  2. GEN: Stars and Stipes
  3. VET:Ethnic/Minority
  4. Need help finding regiment history
  5. Battalions (2)
  6. GREEN BOOKS
  7. MEDIA: PREPARATIONS FOR 1994
  8. GEN: WHERE TO ARCHIVE PAPERS?
  9. USAAF 28 JUL 43
 10. USAAF 31 JUL-1 AUG 43
 11. The Ploesti, Rumania Raid

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 30 Jul 1993 07:13:11 -0400
From:    jem3@CC.BELLCORE.COM
Subject: USAAF 30 JUL 43

COMBAT CHRONOLOGY OF THE US ARMY AIR FORCES
FRIDAY, 30 JULY 1943
FTP SITES
  1. ftp.rutgers.edu in directory pub/wwii/usaf
  2. byrd.mu.wvnet.edu (129.71.32.152) in pub/history/military/airforce/
     wwii_chronology

AIRCRAFT MENTIONED IN THIS REPORT:
  A-20, Douglas Havoc
  B-17, Boeing Flying Fortress
  B-24, Consolidated Liberator
  B-25, North American Mitchell
  B-26, Martin Marauder
  F4U, Vought Corsair (USN)
  P-38, Lockheed Lightning
  P-40, Curtiss
  P-47, Republic Thunderbolt

CHINA-BURMA-INDIA THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  CHINA (Fourteenth Air Force)
    15 P-40's over the Hengyang, China area make contact with 39 Japanese
fighters and 24 bombers. In the ensuing battle, 3 bombers and 2 fighters
are downed; 2 P-40's are lost.

EUROPEAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Eighth Air Force)
  VIII Bomber Command Mission Number 80: The aviation industry at Kassel,
Germany is targetted for today:
    1. 119 B-17's are dispatched to the Bettenhausen Fieseler Works; 94
hit the target at 0910-0917 hours; they claim 40-7-29 Luftwaffe aircraft;
6 B-17's are lost, 5 are damaged beyond repair and 64 are damaged;
casualties are 11 KIA, 10 WIA and 52 MIA.
    2. 67 B-17's are dispatched to the Waldau Fieseler Works; 40 hit the
target at 0925-0928 hours; they claim 8-6-3 Luftwaffe aircraft; 6 B-17's
are lost and 18 are damaged; casualties are 1 WIA and 45 MIA.
  107 P-47's with auxiliary tanks escort these raids and they surprise the
attacking Luftwaffe fighters over Bocholt, Germany as the enemy is not yet
accustomed to fighter escort penetration beyond the coastal fringe. They
claim 25-4-8 Luftwaffe aircraft; 7 P-47's are lost and 1 is damaged beyond
repair; casualties are 6 MIA.
  VIII Air Support Command Mission Numbers 10A and 10B: 2 airfields are
targetted:
    1. 24 B-26B's are dispatched to the Woensdrecht Airfield, The Nether-
lands; 11 hit the target at 0657 hours; 1 B-26 is lost, 1 is damaged
beyond repair and 5 are damaged; casualties are 7 WIA and 6 MIA.
    2. 24 B-26B's are dispatched to the Courtrai/Wevelghem Airfield,
France but the mission is recalled because the escorting fighters are fog
bound on the ground.
  In the 2 B-26 missions, the B-26 crews claim 6-5-1 Luftwaffe aircraft.

MEDITERRANEAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  EASTERN MEDITERRANEAN (Ninth Air Force)
    In Sicily, 100+ P-40's attack shipping at Milazzo, Messina, and
Riposto, and hit targets in the battle area.

  WESTERN MEDITERRANEAN (Northwest African Air Force)
    In Italy, Northwest African Strategic Air Force (NASAF) B-17's bomb
Grottaglie Airfield and B-25's hit the airfield at Pratica di Mare. In
Sicily, Northwest African Tactical Air Force (NATAF) A-20's bomb Milazzo
and hit gun positions N and E of Centuripe and fighters hit shipping off
Milazzo.
    On the ground in Sicily, the enemy evacuates Santo Stefano Quisquina,
with a rear guard action. The British take Catenanuova and push on to the
NE.

SOUTH PACIFIC THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Thirteenth Air Force)
  In the Solomon Islands, 9 B-24's, with an escort of 16 P-38's and P-40's
and 40+ US Navy F4U's, pound the airfield on Ballale Island.

SOUTHWEST PACIFIC THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Fifth Air Force)
  In New Guinea, B-24's bomb Salamaua and Kela; B-25's hit barges off Huon
Peninsula and villages in the Finschhafen area; and A-20's destroy several
barges at Hanisch Harbor and Langemak Bay. Single B-24's bomb Cape Glouce-
ster on New Britain Island and Unea Island.

SOURCES:
AIR FORCE COMBAT UNITS OF WORLD WAR II, Office of Air Force History,
  Headquarters USAF, 1961, ISBN 0-912799-02-1
COMBAT SQUADRONS OF THE AIR FORCE, WORLD WAR II, Office of Air Force
  History, Headquarters USAF 1982
THE ARMY AIR FORCES IN WORLD WAR II: COMBAT CHRONOLOGY, 1941-1945 by the
  Office of Air Force History, Headquarters USAF, 1973
THE MIGHTY EIGHTH WAR DIARY by Roger A. Freeman, ISBN 1-85409-071-2

Jack McKillop
USAF (Airways and Air Communications Service)
1955-59


----------------------------------------------------------------------
|  Jack McKillop      |  Those who have long enjoyed such privileges |
|  Bellcore           |  as we enjoy forget in time that men have    |
|  Piscataway, NJ     |  died to win them.     FDR                   |
|  USA                |  jem3@cc.bellcore.com                        |
----------------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 30 Jul 1993 13:52:51 +0100
From:    Richard Cummings <CUMMINGSR@ADMINA.RFERL.ORG>
Subject: GEN: Stars and Stipes

For those on the list who might remember the newspaper Stars
and Stripes, here are some passages from a AP report:

By KEVIN COSTELLOE= Associated Press Writer= BERLIN, july 29 (AP)
- The European edition of Stars and Stripes, the U.S. soldiers'
daily newspaper for more than a half-century, said Thursday it is
in serious financial shape but confident of staying in business.

Born in 1942 in London as Nazi bombs rained down on the city, the
lively tabloid - 50 cents a copy - is a staple of military life
in Germany, Britain, Italy and other countries.

As revenues get tighter with troop cutbacks, the GIs' companion
is running into money woes.


--==oo00oo==--
cummingsr@rferl.org
RFE/RL Inc
Munich,Germany

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 30 Jul 1993 06:58:54 EST
From:    Larry & Kim Jewell <jewell@MACE.CC.PURDUE.EDU>
Subject: Re: VET:Ethnic/Minority

Hi, you might want to post your request to

soc-veterans@cs.utexas.edu

which will mail to the veterans news group on Internet.  If you don't
get the news group, be sure to specify such to avoid "lost replies."
Soc.veterans has an estimated world-wide readership of 17,000 so you
will be casting your net much wider with this method.

Write back if you need more information.
(Write directly to me, please, since your mail bounces from this site
to the address shown in your post.)

Larry J

#L.W. Jewell WWII-L Listowner JEWELL@MACE.CC.PURDUE.EDU
#"Sunday's horoscope is note worthy because of its strange, sudden and wholly
#unpredictable and inexplicable occurrences, affecting all phases of life."
#"Your Horoscope" L.A. Evening Herald Express, Sat, 12/06/41  #

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 30 Jul 1993 08:21:03 -0600
From:    RJD <doyle@CHEM.NRL.NAVY.MIL>
Subject: Re: Need help finding regiment history

>>From what I have read in books, I see no mention of the 253rd
>>Infantry Regiment along with the 101st Airborne.

>Has any one answered this yet? The 82nd and 101st Airborne