Subject: WWII-L Digest - 25 Aug 1993 to 26 Aug 1993

From: Automatic digest processor <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 27 Aug 1993 00:00:31 -0400

There are 25 messages totalling 1079 lines in this issue.

Topics of the day:

  1. Gen: U-534 Details of Items Found
  2. U-534 (2)
  3. Internet Survey (4)
  4. USAAF 26 AUG 43
  5. TAC: production/blitzkrieg
  6. War crimes precedents:  Homma and Yamashita (4)
  7. <No subject given>
  8. TAC/STRAT Strategic Bombing (2)
  9. U-boat in Denmark info
 10. TAC/STRAT: WWII Bombing
 11. weap: destroiers
 12. world war II (2)
 13. your mail
 14. WEAP: Amazingly boring Pzkw 38(t) ramblings
 15. Internet Survey <an apology>
 16. POLISH AIR INFO

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 26 Aug 1993 06:55:00 +0100
From:    Richard Cummings <[email-masked]>
Subject: Gen: U-534 Details of Items Found

I didn't keep the post, but someone asked what was found in
U-534.

                       (c) United Press International.
              May be reproduced in hard copy only with credit to
                         United Press International.

Wednesday 25-Aug-93 09:15 AM

Wine, condoms and torpedoes found aboard salvaged U-boat

BONN (UPI) _ Bomb disposal experts found torpedoes, wine and
condoms aboard a salvaged German U-boat but saw no sign of the
fabulous treasures some believe may be aboard, a spokesmen for
the salvage operation said Wednesday.

The spokesman said Danish navy bomb disposal experts found the
torpedoes during an initial probe into parts of the vessel. He
said no one has seen the U-boat's hold yet.

``Two bottles of wine were found in the forward torpedo room. Now
we know it is the right U-boat, as the navigator can remember the
bottles,'' said Jonathan Wardlow, a spokesman for Copenhagen
publisher Karsten Ree, who is funding the $3.6 million salvage
operation.

Speaking by telephone from Anholt Island, halfway between Sweden
and Denmark, Wardlow said 100 bottles of wine were believed to be
aboard. A box of condoms also was found during the search of the
submarine.

``The U-boat was the last to leave the (French port of) Bordeaux.
The crew ransacked the stores before leaving, and when they
opened the box later they found it contained condoms,'' Wardlow
said.

The U-534 was pulled 220 feet (67 m) to the surface of the
Kattegat Sea, 13 miles (20 km) northeast of Anholt Island Monday.
Operations were delayed Tuesday because the subamarine was
weighed down by mud and clay wedged between its inner and outer
hulls.

Henrik Laier, another spokesman for the salvage operation, said
that after the Danish experts probed the inside of the boat
``they found no trace of any treasure. They haven't seen anything
other than the torpedo chambers and bits of equipment such as
shells and ammunition cases.''

He said the German submarine was placed on a submerged barge and
probably will be towed into dry dock Friday after the torpedoes
have been disarmed.

The U-boat was sunk by depth charges fired by a British Royal Air
Force bomber May 5, 1945, four days before Germany's
unconditional surrender. The submarine was sailing from Kiel on
the northern German coast while fleets of other German U-boats
were scuttled in the closing stages of the war.

Although survivors of the sinking have said the U-boat contained
only normal supplies, there has been intense speculation over its
cargo, including claims that gold and treasures stolen by the
[NAZIS], secret weapons plans and even the body of Adolf Hitler's
mistress, Eva Braun, were aboard.

--==oo00oo==--
[email-masked]
RFE/RL Inc
Munich,Germany

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 26 Aug 1993 10:23:17 +0200
From:    Mike Hoffmann <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: U-534

In message <199308260237.AA05834@thoth> you write:
>Network News reported the German sub was only partially searched as of
>the 25th and so far the most important find consisted of 100 bottles
>of German wine!  A coupe of other items also, but must have been even
>less important.  Can't remember what they were.

Less important? Why, there was a whole box of condomes on board!

:-)
Mike

--
Mike Hoffmann - Internet Administrator, Siemens-Nixdorf AG, SNI SU AP 1123
INTERNET: [email-masked]
"A system admin's life is a sorry one.  The only advantage he has over
Emergency Room doctors is that malpractice suits are rare.  On the other
hand, ER doctors never have to deal with patients installing new versions
of their own innards!"  -Michael O'Brien

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 26 Aug 1993 07:00:30 EST
From:    Eden Steven CPT <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Internet Survey

>                              INTERNET SURVEY
>
>                     Adele F. Bane <[email-masked]>
>                 William D. Milheim <[email-masked]>
>              The Pennsylvania State University at Great Valley
>______________________________________________________________________________
__
>This electronic mail survey is being conducted to identify the functions of th
e
>Internet that are most used by the academic community.  You have been chosen a
s
>a member of a selected academic list service (LISTSERV) to participate.
>Results of this survey will form the basis of a journal article to be publishe
d
>later this year.  Please answer all survey questions.
>______________________________________________________________________________
__
>
>INTERNET INSIGHTS:  A Survey
>
>We will begin by asking a few questions about yourself:
>
>        How many years of computer experience do you have?      _10____
>        How long have you used e-mail of any type?              _2____
>        How long have you been an Internet user?                _1____
>
>Three primary functions of the Internet have been identified.  They are
>electronic mail, Telnet or remote log-in, and FTP or file transfer.  An
>estimated 15 million users take advantage of these functions daily.
>This survey explores the use of each of these services.
>
>1.  E-Mail Use:  How often do you make these connections?
>
>           (Insert the appropriate number beside items below:)
>
>        1=Not at all                    4=About 2-3 times a month
>        2=A few times                   5=Once a week
>        3=About once a month            6=More than once a week
>
>                Private Email:                                  _6____
>
>                Discussion group(s):                            _6____
>                        (Specify)
>
>                Usenet (or Netnews)                             _1____
>
>                Electronic journal(s)/newsletters(s):           _1____
>                        (Specify)
>
>
>
>2.  Telnet Use:  How often do you connect to remote databases?
>
>           (Insert appropriate number beside items below.)
>
>        1=Not at all                    4=About 2-3 times a month
>        2=A few times                   5=Once a week
>        3=About once a month            6=More than once a week
>
>                Games/Simulations:              _2____
>                Library Catalogs:               _2____
>        .       Specialized Databases:          _2____
>
>
>2a.  How frequently do you connect these Internet sources:
>
>           (Insert appropriate number beside items below.)
>
>        1=Not at all                    4=About 2-3 times a month
>        2=A few times                   5=Once a week
>        3=About once a month            6=More than once a week
>
>                American Mathematical Society BBS               __1___
>                American Psychological Assn.                    __1___
>                CARL                                            __1___
>                CITADEL                                         __1___
>                Cleveland FreeNet                               __1___
>                Dartmouth Dante                                 __1___
>                Dialog                                          __1___
>                Dow-Jones News Retrieval                        __1___
>                Dranet                                          __1___
>                EDIN                                            __1___
>                EPA                                             __1___
>                ERIC                                            __1___
>                FEDIX/MOLIS                                     __1___
>                GenBank                                         __1___
>                Geographic Name Server                          __1___
>                International Centre for Distance Learning      __1___
>                ISAAC                                           __1___
>                Lexis                                           __1___
>                Market/Business Report                          __1___
>                National Education BBS                          __1___
>                Netfind                                         __1___
>                Nexis                                           __1___
>                Oceanic Information Center                      __1___
>                OCLC                                            __3___
>                PENpages                                        __1___
>                RLIN                                            __1___
>                SpaceLink                                       __1___
>                STIS                                            __1___
>                TC Forum                                        __1___
>                Weather Underground                             __1___
>                Webster Dictionary                              __1___
>
>                Other  (Please specify):
>
>
>3.  FTP Use:  How often do you download files from FTP archive sites?
>
>           (Insert appropriate number beside each item)
>
>        1=Not at all                    4=About 2-3 times a month
>        2=A few times                   5=Once a week
>        3=About once a month            6=More than once a week
>
>                Computers and Academic Freedom                  __1___
>                EASI                                            __1___
>                History                                         __1___
>                LIBSOFT                                         __1___
>                Lyric and Discography                           __1___
>                NASA                                            __1___
>                Online Libraries Directory                      __1___
>                Science Education                               __1___
>                SIMTEL20                                        __1___
>                SUMEX-AIM                                       __1___
>                U.S. Supreme Court Decisions                    __1___
>                Washington Uni. Public Domain Archives          __1___
>
>                Other (Please Specify):
>
>
>4.      Several navigational aids have been developed for the Internet.
>        How often do you use these network guides?
>
>           (Insert appropriate number beside items below.)
>
>        1=Not at all                    4=About 2-3 times a month
>        2=A few times                   5=Once a week
>        3=About once a month            6=More than once a week
>
>                Archie                                          __1___
>                Campus-wide Information Systems                 __1__
>                Gopher                                          __2___
>                WAIS (Wide-area information servers)            __1___
>                WWW (WorldWideWeb)                              __1___
>                Veronica                                        __1___
>                HYTELNET                                        __1___
>                Other (Please specify):
>
>
>Personal experiences can be the most helpful to other users.  Please comment o
n
>the following:
>
>5.      The importance of the Internet to your work?   Helpful but not vital
>
>
>
>6.      Advantages the Internet offers over other resources?
>
>         Always available at my desk, a chance to search widely for research
materials
>
>7.      Barriers to using the Internet?
>
>        Ignorance of computers - Internet is not user friendly
>
>8.      Your most memorable use of the Internet?
>
>
>
>9  These questions will help us interpret the results of this study:
>
>        Title:  ________Assisstant Professor________________________________
>        Affiliation:  __USMA at West Point________________________________
>        Discipline:  ___History________________________________
>        Research Interest(s):__19th Century European
Warfare__________________________________
>        _________________________________________________________
>
>Please return the completed survey to: [email-masked]
>by September 3, 1993.
>
>If you would like a summary of the survey results, please place your
>e-mail address here:  _____________________.
>
>
>            :) Thank you for taking the time to participate :)
>

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 26 Aug 1993 07:15:28 -0400
From:    [email-masked]
Subject: USAAF 26 AUG 43

COMBAT CHRONOLOGY OF THE US ARMY AIR FORCE
THURSDAY, 26 AUGUST 1943
FTP SITES
  1. ftp.rutgers.edu in directory pub/wwii/usaf
  2. byrd.mu.wvnet.edu (129.71.32.152) in pub/history/military/airforce/
     wwii_chronology

AIRCRAFT MENTIONED IN THIS REPORT:
  B-17, Boeing Flying Fortress
  B-24, Consolidated Liberator
  B-25, North American Mitchell
  B-26, Martin Marauder
  P-38, Lockheed Lightning
  P-39, Bell Airacobra
  P-40, Curtiss
  P-47, Republic Thunderbolt
  Zeke, Mitsubishi A6M, Navy Type 0 Carrier Fighter

AMERICAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  ALASKA (Eleventh Air Force): In the Aleutian Islands, the Eleventh Air
Force's striking power shrinks rapidly as the the following squadrons are
ordered to prepare for departure to the Zone of Interior (ZI):
  21st Bombardment Squadron (Heavy), 30th Bombardment Group (Heavy), on
Umnak Island with B-24's,
  36th Bombardment Squadron (Heavy), 28th Composite Group, on Amchitka
Island with B-24's,
  73d Bombardment Squadron (Medium), 28th Composite Group, on Amchitka
Island with B-25's, and
  406th Bombardment Squadron (Medium), 41st Bombardment Group (Medium), at
Elmendorf Field, Anchorage, with B-25's.

CHINA-BURMA-INDIA THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  CHINA (Fourteenth Air Force): 15 B-24's, with an escort of 17 fighters,
bomb Kowloon Docks at Hong Kong; 5 Japanese interceptors are shot down. 5
B-25's, supported by 11 P-40's, bomb Tien Ho Airfield at Canton, China; in
a battle with enemy interceptors 1 P-40 is lost; the B-25's and P-40's
claim 5 Zekes downed.
  In China, the 449th Fighter Squadron is activated at Kunming and is
assigned to the 51st Fighter Group. The squadron forms at Lingling and
begins training with P-38's.

EUROPEAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  STRATEGIC OPERATIONS (Eighth Air Force): VIII Air Support Command Mission
35: 36 B-26's are dispatched to Caen/Carpiquet Airfield, France; all hit
the target at 1846 hours; 1 B-26 is damaged beyond repair when it crashes
on landing.
  HQ 67th Fighter Wing arrives at Walcot Hall, England from the US. The
wing will remain at this station until Oct 45.
  HQ 20th Fighter Group arrives at Kings Cliffe, England from the US. The
group will remain at this station until Oct 45.
  The 359th and 360th Fighter Squadrons, 356th Fighter Group, arrive at
Goxhill, England from the US with P-47's.

MEDITERRANEAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  EASTERN MEDITERRANEAN (Ninth Air Force): The 316th Troop Carrier Group
and it's 36th, 37th, 44th and 45th Troop Carrier Squadrons with C-47's are
transferred to the Twelfth Air Force.
  The 328th, 329th, 330th, and 409th Bombardment Squadrons (Heavy), 93d
Bombardment Group (Heavy), which have been operating from Bengasi, Libya
since Jun 43 with B-24's, return to their base at Hardwick, England.

  WESTERN MEDITERRANEAN (Northwest African Air Force): The Royal Air Force
(RAF) Desert Air Force (DAF) is assigned to the Northwest African Tactical
Air Force (NATAF), along with US units of the Ninth Air Force which have
been an operational part of DAF and Northwest African Tactical Bomber Force
(NATBF).
  In Italy, 80+ Northwest African Strategic Air Force (NASAF) B-17's, with
P-38 escort bomb Capua Airfield; 100+ fighter-escorted medium bombers hit
Grazzanise Airfield and satellite field; P-40's bomb Carloforte on San
Pietro Island and strafe the S part of Sardinia; and NATAF medium and light
bombers bomb targets on the toe of Italy, including the railroad junction
at Locri and gun positions at Reggio di Calabria and Villa San Giovanni.

SOUTH PACIFIC THEATER OF OPERATIONS (Thirteenth Air Force): In the Solomon
Islands, 11 B-25's and 50+ US Navy dive bombers, escorted by fighters,
pound AA positions and barges at Ringa and Webster Coves on New Georgia
Island and at Nusatuva Island; P-40's strafe 2 large motor boats and a
100-foot (30.5 m) steam vessel off Ganongga Island; 15 B-24's bomb Papatura
Ite and supply areas on Papatura Fa Island; 15 B-24's, with fighter escort,
bomb Kahili Airfield on Bougainville Island; and P-39's strafe buildings on
Gizo Island and at Kolulavabae Inlet.

SOURCES:
AIR FORCE COMBAT UNITS OF WORLD WAR II, Office of Air Force History,
  Headquarters USAF, 1961, ISBN 0-912799-02-1
COMBAT SQUADRONS OF THE AIR FORCE, WORLD WAR II, Office of Air Force
  History, Headquarters USAF 1982
THE ARMY AIR FORCES IN WORLD WAR II: COMBAT CHRONOLOGY, 1941-1945 by the
  Office of Air Force History, Headquarters USAF, 1973
THE MIGHTY EIGHTH WAR DIARY by Roger A. Freeman, ISBN 1-85409-071-2

Jack McKillop
USAF (Airways and Air Communications Service)
1955-59

-------------------------------------------------------------------
|  Jack McKillop         |  Those who have long enjoyed such      |
|  Bellcore              |  privileges as we enjoy forget in      |
|  Piscataway, NJ USA    |  time that men have died to win them.  |
|  [email-masked]  |                       FDR              |
-------------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 26 Aug 1993 07:44:59 CDT
From:    "[email-masked]. --Scherrer,
         Tim A." <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: TAC: production/blitzkrieg

I saw something that suprised me in the table of vehicle production.
It showed Pzkw. 38 (t) production into 1944.  I thought that in the '43
time frame the Germans started converting their 38 (t)'s into Marders, a
nd Hetzers.  I saw the production figures for the 38 (t) under the Assau
lt Gun area.  The production that late seems wierd to me.  If they made
these vehicles that late--what were they used for???  These vehicles wer
very obsolete by 1942--why would they continue making them for 2 years,
if not to make chassis for other vehicles like the Hetzer and Marder??

I have a personal interest in the 38 (t) chassis because a guy in my Wor
ld War II reenactment unit, the 11th Panzer, has a real Hetzer.  Believe
me--there is nothing like the feeling of running along side her while
supporting an attack.  The ground shakes, and allied reenactors run, eve
n though the only thing the Hetzer can do is hurt thier pride.

Tim

************************************************************************
*  Tim A. Scherrer          "You'll be fighting WWII for the rest of   *
*  Facilities Supervisor     your life", Ron Scherrer, 1971            *
*  WP:816-785-5253                                                     *
*  HP:816-665-6704                                                     *
*  ID# [email-masked]                             *
************************************************************************

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 26 Aug 1993 09:02:00 EST
From:    Crane Conrad LTC <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: War crimes precedents:  Homma and Yamashita

>A sobering amplification, Conrad.  But are you saying the trials and
>  executions of H and Y for ultimate responsibility -- knowing or not --
>  was a VALID precedent?
>
>Pardon my tossing you a "live one" -- it WAS the Supreme One who put them
>  on/in the dock.
>
>Lou
>

Lou,
     While most coverage of the Homma-Yamashita trials notes that two Associate
Supreme Court Justices called the proceedings "legalized lynchings", the same
accounts normally fail to mention that seven other justices supported the final
verdicts.  Obviously there were many factors of timing and circumstance that
made the trials unique, but the reality for all military commanders is that the
legal precedent is on the books, and could be used again.  If you get a chance
to read the majority opinion of "In re Yamashita", you'll see that there was a
legal basis for the verdict, though the logic does seem harsh or convoluted at
times.  The bottom line is that commanders are responsible to take all possible
reasonable actions to insure that war crimes will not occur in their command.

                                             Con Crane

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 26 Aug 1993 08:31:21 EST
From:    Don Layton <[email-masked]>
Subject: <No subject given>

    A colleague of mine is working on a biography Edwin Hubble.  In
his research he came across a letter which stated that a German WWII
submarine had been captured on Chesapeake Bay during WWII.  On board
were German agents whose task it was to go ashore and kill Hubble.

    This sounded preposterous to my colleague and to me as well.  Has
anyone else heard that story?  Is there any possibility that this
actually happened and has simiply been covered up?  I would
appreciate any responses or reactions to this tale.

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 26 Aug 1993 09:37:23 -0400
From:    "M. Joseph Barone" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: TAC/STRAT Strategic Bombing

 From: Shawn Robert Woodford <[email-masked]>:
> Is Mr. Barone's post a signal for open-season on WWII Strategic Bombing?

Well, actually, I was hoping for rational discourse on the subject
since I really haven't formed my own conclusions on this topic.  :-)
Thanks.
--
Joe Barone
[email-masked]
Oh, man, don't hit me with those negative waves so early in the morning!

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 26 Aug 1993 09:59:45 -0400
From:    "Mr. Scott Hannon" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: TAC/STRAT Strategic Bombing

>Is Mr. Barone's post a signal for open-season on WWII Strategic Bombing?

I hope not...its an escapee from ALT.WAR where I was unwise enough
to voice an unpopular opinion about "best tank of WW2" based in
part on ease/cost of production...whoa the flames from Panther
fans and Sherman haters!  :-)

Scott.

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 26 Aug 1993 09:45:28 CDT
From:    John Hirvela <John=Hirvela%EMC=Srvc%Eng=[email-masked]>
Subject: U-boat in Denmark info

Cross posted w/o permission. cheers, john

To:             Multiple,recipients,of,list,SCUBA-L
                <[email-masked]>
Cc:
Bcc:
From:           Lauri P R{ty <[email-masked]>
Subject:        Re: Uboat in Denmark
Date:           Wednesday, August 25, 1993 15:48:57 CDT
Attach:
Certify:        N
Forwarded by:

  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------

U534 was on a escort mission escorting several XXI class german boats
to Bergen. It was the FLAK (anti-aircraft artillery) boat. It was sunk
as it protected the others, which dived and got away.

U-534 (NOLLAU) WAS ON A STANDARD MISSION WHEN IT WAS SUNK.

I dived the boat 2.8.1993, a day before salvage. To my knowledge no
team has dived it after 1988, when a german sport diver was killed.

praty&rraty
----

PSK KUPLA: WE GO IN, WE DELIVER, WE COME OUT.

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 26 Aug 1993 10:55:00 CDT
From:    Shawn Robert Woodford <[email-masked]>
Subject: TAC/STRAT: WWII Bombing

Whoa dudes, chill!  No dis intended...

Shawn Robert Woodford
[email-masked]

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 26 Aug 1993 12:50:23 BRA
From:    "Silvio E.G. Melo" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: weap: destroiers

      Larry

      I need anyone informations about this ships. All informations is welcome.

Silvio
      P.S.

      I have making my master degree, and only come to university once a week,
and my answers is also only a week.

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 25 Aug 1993 16:33:44 -0400
From:    [email-masked]
Subject: world war II

Greeting from OHIO WESLEYAN! I would like enter a discussion with you
on WWII, however I do not know how to star. Please contact me back and
give some ideas on discussion topics.

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 26 Aug 1993 11:22:37 -0500
From:    "Sidney W. Kitchel" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: your mail

Don Layton writes:
|->
|->     A colleague of mine is working on a biography Edwin Hubble.  In
|-> his research he came across a letter which stated that a German WWII
|-> submarine had been captured on Chesapeake Bay during WWII.  On board
|-> were German agents whose task it was to go ashore and kill Hubble.
|->
|->     This sounded preposterous to my colleague and to me as well.  Has
|-> anyone else heard that story?  Is there any possibility that this
|-> actually happened and has simiply been covered up?  I would
|-> appreciate any responses or reactions to this tale.

        This seems extremely ridiculous. Why would anyone want to kill
Hubble? The older generation of astronomers, trained in the accurate,
19th century observing techniques, thought that Hubble was
partially incompetent and that the over-reliance on photographic
techniques would ruin "true" astronomy. BUT...nobody I know of, Nazi
or not, wanted him dead.
        Also, where's the submarine??? Why should it's capture be
secret now?
                                                        --Sid
--
Sidney W. Kitchel           [email-masked], [email-masked]
Data Parallel Systems, Inc.  ============||  DPSI  ||===============
4617 E. Morningside Drive                             (812) 334-8100
Bloomington, Indiana,  47408  USA               FAX:  (812) 334-8121

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 26 Aug 1993 12:48:21 CDT
From:    Lee Short <[email-masked]>
Subject: War crimes precedents:  Homma and Yamashita

>Lou,
>    While most coverage of the Homma-Yamashita trials notes that two Associate
>Supreme Court Justices called the proceedings "legalized lynchings", the same
>accounts normally fail to mention that seven other justices supported the
>final verdicts.
>Obviously there were many factors of timing and circumstance that made
>the trials unique,

Like the fact that MacArthur *somehow* managed to pick out for trial
the Japanese commander who took the Philippines from him and the one
who defended the Philippines against him?  Even though their war
crimes were tenuous at best, and there were plenty of Japanese who
committed blatant war crimes who were left unprosecuted?

I wouldn't call that "unique", I'd call it "vindictive".

Lee

Lee Short   [email-masked]         This is the sort of English up with which
Software Janitor                 I will not put.
Hughes Training, Inc.              --  W. Churchill
Minneapolis, MN

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 26 Aug 1993 14:44:24 CDT
From:    Brett Person <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: U-534

>
> In message <199308260237.AA05834@thoth> you write:
> >Network News reported the German sub was only partially searched as of
> >the 25th and so far the most important find consisted of 100 bottles
> >of German wine!  A coupe of other items also, but must have been even
> >less important.  Can't remember what they were.
>
> Less important? Why, there was a whole box of condomes on board!
>
> :-)
> Mike
>
> --

Ok, so is there any serious speculation as to why a U Boat would be carrying
a cargo like this?  I mean, the condoms I can understand. but the wine? :-)
Maybe they were planning a party?

--
Brett Person
Guest Account
North Dakota State University
[email-masked] || [email-masked]

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 26 Aug 1993 16:22:40 EST
From:    Larry & Kim Jewell <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: world war II

>
> Greeting from OHIO WESLEYAN! I would like enter a discussion with you
> on WWII, however I do not know how to star. Please contact me back and
> give some ideas on discussion topics.
>
It was a BIG war. What are YOUR interests? I'm a naval hysterian myself :-).

Larry J

#L.W. Jewell WWII-L Listowner [email-masked]
#"Sunday's horoscope is note worthy because of its strange, sudden and wholly
#unpredictable and inexplicable occurrences, affecting all phases of life."
#"Your Horoscope" L.A. Evening Herald Express, Sat, 12/06/41

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 26 Aug 1993 17:35:06 -0400
From:    "Mr. Scott Hannon" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: War crimes precedents:  Homma and Yamashita

>>Obviously there were many factors of timing and circumstance that made
>>the trials unique

>Like the fact that MacArthur *somehow* managed to pick out for trial
>the Japanese commander who took the Philippines from him and the one
>who defended the Philippines against him?

Pick out the two worst/most-famous war crimes comitted by the Japanese
against US subjects. Lets see...
1) the Bataan Death March, and
2) the destruction of Manila (after Warsaw, the most damaged major city of
   WW2) and massacre of civilians by Japanese naval troops.
That "somehow" is plain to me: common sense.

>Even though their war
>crimes were tenuous at best, and there were plenty of Japanese who
>committed blatant war crimes who were left unprosecuted?

Most of the underlings who actually committed the crimes were dead (I
don't think there was a single prisoner taken of the naval troops in
Manila). Pretty much the only folks realistically available to prosecute
soon after the war were the leaders.

Scott.

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 26 Aug 1993 16:46:56 CDT
From:    Lou Coatney <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: War crimes precedents:  Homma and Yamashita

Good post, Scott.  Also, MacArthur had the power and prestige to make sure
  that those he believed had hurt the people he cared about  were not going
  to be let off the hook  like some others were.

Lou Coatney

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 26 Aug 1993 17:00:31 -0400
From:    "M. Joseph Barone" <[email-masked]>
Subject: WEAP: Amazingly boring Pzkw 38(t) ramblings

 From: Tim Scherrer:
> I saw something that surprised me in the table of vehicle production.
> It showed Pzkw. 38 (t) production into 1944.  I thought that in the '43
> time frame the Germans started converting their 38 (t)'s into Marders,
> and Hetzers.

Looking more closely through the Uwe Fiest book where I found the
info, it seems that the chart for Pzkw 38(t) includes chassis built
for self-propelled artillery and anti-aircraft variants.

Before I go any further, I should give a little detail on the book.
The book, "Deutsche Panzer: 1917-1945" is a pictorial of every single
type and ausf of German tank produced in that period (it even has a
listing for the Kw Nb.Fz, which was a real boat, of which only five
were built).  There is no write-up; only captions to the numerous
photos and vehicle specifications and production numbers and some
organizational info.

With that in mind, taking a closer look kind of confuses things!  For
the Pzkw 38(t), the manufacturer, Praga, produced approximately 1500
vehicles from 1937 to 1942.  The Pzjg 38 76.2 PAK 36(r), Marder III,
was also produced by Praga in 1942.  No production values are listed,
but a caption mentions 344 were deployed in April 1942.  There were
418 Pzjg 38 75 PAK 40/3, Marder, vehicles produced in 1942 and 1943
by Praga.  There were 1577 Hetzers, JgPz 38(t), built between 1943
and 1945 by Praga and Skoda.  The chart I sent out yesterday indicated
that 1598 Hetzers were built in 1944 alone!  And this is from the
same book!

The FLAK variation was called the 2cm FLAK 38 L/55 Auf Sf. 38(t).
No nickname is given.  162 were built by Praga in 1943 and 1944.

The Bison, 15cm sIG 33/1 Auf. Sf. 38, Ausf H and M were the SPA
variant.  370 were built in 1942 and 1943 by Praga.  Both the Ausf
H and M had the 15 cm sIG 33/1.  It looks like the H had the gun
mounted forward while the M had it mounted toward the rear.  As a
result, the superstructures differ greatly.  The superstructure of
an M looks similar to a Wespe with a shorter gun.

Totaling these production numbers indicates around 4000 Pzkw 38(t)
chassis were produced between 1937 and 1945.  The chart indicates
that 2978 were built from 1940 to 1944.  Some of the discrepancy
might be accounted for by assuming that the missing 1000 were produced
before 1940 or in 1945.  Adding to the discrepancy, however, is the
unknown number of Marder IIIs that were produced (I assumed 344 which
was the deployment for one particular month).

Anyway, to answer Tim's question, they were still cranking out Pzkw 38(t)
chassis after 1942 for the specialized armored vehicles.

Type                              1940   1941   1942   1943   1944  Total
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Pzkw 38(t) (Czech)                 275    698    195     87    125   1380
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
JgPz 38                              0      0      0      0   1598   1598
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Total                              275    698    195      87  1723   2978
--
Joe Barone
[email-masked]
This, gentlemen, is my counterpart, General Vogel.  When I look at his
face, I see a loser.  I'm sitting in his headquarters; I'm drinking his
wine; hell, I even have one of his broads hanging around here somewhere.

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 26 Aug 1993 18:27:08 -0400
From:    Steven VEST <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Internet Survey

========================== [email-masked]=========================
= Steven Vest: Electronic Reference Librarian: Nova University, Ft. Ldl, FL  =

On Wed, 25 Aug 1993, William Milheim wrote:

>                               INTERNET SURVEY
>
>                      Adele F. Bane <[email-masked]>
>                  William D. Milheim <[email-masked]>
>               The Pennsylvania State University at Great Valley
> ________________________________________________________________________________
> This electronic mail survey is being conducted to identify the functions of the
> Internet that are most used by the academic community.  You have been chosen as
> a member of a selected academic list service (LISTSERV) to participate.
> Results of this survey will form the basis of a journal article to be published
> later this year.  Please answer all survey questions.
> ________________________________________________________________________________
>
> INTERNET INSIGHTS:  A Survey
>
> We will begin by asking a few questions about yourself:
>
>         How many years of computer experience do you have?      _10+____
>         How long have you used e-mail of any type?              _5yrs____
>         How long have you been an Internet user?                _3yrs____
>
> Three primary functions of the Internet have been identified.  They are
> electronic mail, Telnet or remote log-in, and FTP or file transfer.  An
> estimated 15 million users take advantage of these functions daily.
> This survey explores the use of each of these services.
>
> 1.  E-Mail Use:  How often do you make these connections?
>
>            (Insert the appropriate number beside items below:)
>
>         1=Not at all                    4=About 2-3 times a month
>         2=A few times                   5=Once a week
>         3=About once a month            6=More than once a week
>
>                 Private Email:                                  _6____
>
>                 Discussion group(s):                            __6___
>                         (Specify)
>
>                 Usenet (or Netnews)                             _6____
>
>                 Electronic journal(s)/newsletters(s):           _2____
>                         (Specify)
>
>
>
> 2.  Telnet Use:  How often do you connect to remote databases?
>
>            (Insert appropriate number beside items below.)
>
>         1=Not at all                    4=About 2-3 times a month
>         2=A few times                   5=Once a week
>         3=About once a month            6=More than once a week
>
>                 Games/Simulations:              __1___
>                 Library Catalogs:               __4___
>         .       Specialized Databases:          __2___
>
>
> 2a.  How frequently do you connect these Internet sources:
>
>            (Insert appropriate number beside items below.)
>
>         1=Not at all                    4=About 2-3 times a month
>         2=A few times                   5=Once a week
>         3=About once a month            6=More than once a week
>
>                 American Mathematical Society BBS               _1____
>                 American Psychological Assn.                    _1____
>                 CARL                                            _2____
>                 CITADEL                                         _1____
>                 Cleveland FreeNet                               _4____
>                 Dartmouth Dante                                 _1____
>                 Dialog                                          _5____
>                 Dow-Jones News Retrieval                        _1____
>                 Dranet                                          _1____
>                 EDIN                                            _1____
>                 EPA                                             _1____
>                 ERIC                                            _1____
>                 FEDIX/MOLIS                                     _1____
>                 GenBank                                         _1____
>                 Geographic Name Server                          _1____
>                 International Centre for Distance Learning      _1____
>                 ISAAC                                           _1____
>                 Lexis                                           _1____
>                 Market/Business Report                          _1____
>                 National Education BBS                          _1____
>                 Netfind                                         _1____
>                 Nexis                                           _1____
>                 Oceanic Information Center                      _1____
>                 OCLC                                            _1____
>                 PENpages                                        _1____
>                 RLIN                                            _1____
>                 SpaceLink                                       _1____
>                 STIS                                            _1____
>                 TC Forum                                        _1____
>                 Weather Underground                             _1____
>                 Webster Dictionary                              _1____
>
>                 Other  (Please specify):
>
>
> 3.  FTP Use:  How often do you download files from FTP archive sites?
>
>            (Insert appropriate number beside each item)
>
>         1=Not at all                    4=About 2-3 times a month
>         2=A few times                   5=Once a week
>         3=About once a month            6=More than once a week
>
>                 Computers and Academic Freedom                  __1___
>                 EASI                                            __1___
>                 History                                         __1___
>                 LIBSOFT                                         __1___
>                 Lyric and Discography                           __1___
>                 NASA                                            __1___
>                 Online Libraries Directory                      __1___
>                 Science Education                               __1___
>                 SIMTEL20                                        __1___
>                 SUMEX-AIM                                       __1___
>                 U.S. Supreme Court Decisions                    __1___
>                 Washington Uni. Public Domain Archives          __1___
>
>                 Other (Please Specify):
>
>
> 4.      Several navigational aids have been developed for the Internet.
>         How often do you use these network guides?
>
>            (Insert appropriate number beside items below.)
>
>         1=Not at all                    4=About 2-3 times a month
>         2=A few times                   5=Once a week
>         3=About once a month            6=More than once a week
>
>                 Archie                                          _2____
>                 Campus-wide Information Systems                 _2____
>                 Gopher                                          _2____
>                 WAIS (Wide-area information servers)            _2____
>                 WWW (WorldWideWeb)                              _2____
>                 Veronica                                        _4____
>                 HYTELNET                                        _____
>                 Other (Please specify):
>
>
> Personal experiences can be the most helpful to other users.  Please comment on
> the following:
>
> 5.      The importance of the Internet to your work?
              Very>
>
>
> 6.      Advantages the Internet offers over other resources?
              Immediacy>
>
>
> 7.      Barriers to using the Internet?
              Poor editors.  Lack of standardization of command structure.>
>
>
> 8.      Your most memorable use of the Internet?
>
             >
>
> 9  These questions will help us interpret the results of this study:
>
>         Title:  Head, Off Campus Libray Services_________
>         Affiliation:  Nova University____
>         Discipline:  _Academic Library___
>         Research Interest(s):_Too many to list.______
>         _________________________________________________________
>
> Please return the completed survey to: [email-masked]
> by September 3, 1993.
>
> If you would like a summary of the survey results, please place your
> e-mail address here:  _____________________.
>
>
>             :) Thank you for taking the time to participate :)

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 26 Aug 1993 18:42:34 -0400
From:    Steven VEST <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Internet Survey <an apology>

My apologies for posting my first response to the list instead of to the
correct address.  Mea Culpa.

Steven

========================== [email-masked]=========================
= Steven Vest: Electronic Reference Librarian: Nova University, Ft. Ldl, FL  =

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 26 Aug 1993 18:49:32 CDT
From:    Lou Coatney <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Internet Survey

How do I fill out the survey.

Lou Coatney

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 26 Aug 1993 19:48:50 EST
From:    Larry & Kim Jewell <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Internet Survey

Send this to the originator, not the list! Only the fact that it came
from a resonably legit school kept me from sending a lightning bolt.
I really hate junk mail, especially when the sender doesn't have the
courtesy to ask the listowner first.

Larry J

#L.W. Jewell WWII-L Listowner [email-masked]
#"Sunday's horoscope is note worthy because of its strange, sudden and wholly
#unpredictable and inexplicable occurrences, affecting all phases of life."
#"Your Horoscope" L.A. Evening Herald Express, Sat, 12/06/41

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 27 Aug 1993 13:35:38 +1000
From:    Physics1 Student Records <[email-masked]>
Subject: POLISH AIR INFO

While the subject of strategic bombing is topical I would like an answer to the
following.
Which Polish squadrons under British command were used at the bombing of Monte
Cassino ?
Does anyone have a list of Polish casualties from the above bombing ?
   Any answers or a point in the right direction would be appreciated.
   On the general side is there a site or archive I can access to find info
on the Polish Air Force under the British.
                                                 Regards
                                                 John Foster

------------------------------

End of WWII-L Digest - 25 Aug 1993 to 26 Aug 1993
*************************************************