Subject: WWII-L Digest - 25 Apr 1994 to 26 Apr 1994

From: Automatic digest processor <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 27 Apr 1994 00:01:08 -0400

There are 46 messages totalling 1327 lines in this issue.

Topics of the day:

  1. REF: Battleship TX (4)
  2. Date: Mon, 25 Apr 1994 14:52:11 CST
  3. INF: USAAF 26 APR 44
  4. Tirpitz (11)
  5. Nazi Bombers (11)
  6. USS TEXAS
  7. INFO: Military aircraft & vehicles display
  8. Japanese Underground?
  9. Exercise Tiger (3)
 10. Lindbergh (2)
 11. Re[2]: NOST: 50 years ago this week
 12. Battleship TEXAS
 13. Re[2]: Tirpitz (2)
 14. Re[2]: Nazi Bombers
 15. BARBAROSSA
 16. German Helicopters
 17. TRV: Off Beat Weapons... (2)
 18. the "Silent Service"

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 26 Apr 1994 00:14:48 -0600
From:    Josh Talbert <[email-masked]>
Subject: REF: Battleship TX

Hello all.  I am interested in finding out all possible information regarding
the Battleship Texas during WWII.  I have never come accross anything here in my
home state of Texas dealing exclusively, or almost exclusively, with her.  I
would greatly appreciate references regarding this.  I realize that there may
not be any books which specifically deal with only the Texas, but books
regarding her fleet, battle records, etc., would be useful.  BTW, the only
picture of her in battle that I have seen is one taken from her of an oncoming
kamikaze.  The kamikaze was shot down, and no damage was done to her by it.  I
saw this in the Time-Life WWII series.

Thanks in advance,

Josh Talbert
[email-masked]

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 26 Apr 1994 02:08:25 -0500
From:    "WILLIAM L. HUBER - SAA" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Date: Mon, 25 Apr 1994 14:52:11 CST

>
> My mind may be playing tricks on me, but wasn't Lindbergh involved with
> some anti-war activity before the US entered the war?  It may have been
> the "America First Committee" or something like that.  Maybe we
> discussed it before, bt if he was involved in activities like that isn't
> it ironic he got involved and shot down some aircraft later.  What
> status did he fly under?  Was he military or civilian?  How old was he
> at the time? TAS

Hi Tim,

Yes, Lindbergh was very outspoken in opposing the US's entry into
WWII.  He had visited the aircraft factories of Germany in the 1930s
and came away feeling that the German's could not be beaten in the
air.  He was awarded the Nazi Eagle Order 1st Class with Breast Star
which was typically awarded to collaborationist foreign nationals but
Lindbergh got it for his famous flight across the Atlantic supposedly.
He was pretty chummy with the Luftwaffe staff, Goring included.

He had joined the military to fly and ended up hauling mail but after
his transatlantic flight was made Colonel.  After that he was not real
active in the military and began touring the world's aircraft
production centers.  It was here that he met Goring and got
flabergasted by the Luftwaffe.

Once the US got into the war he requested assignment to the active Air
Corps.  I guess he wanted to contribute something to get his good name
back after loosing a lot of popularity by his anti-war stance.

He ended his days exploring remote jungles looking for undiscovered
populations of native peoples and found some in New Guinea, I think.
He was a most interesting person.

Cheers, Bill Huber / [email-masked]

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 26 Apr 1994 07:04:00 EDT
From:    mc killop <[email-masked]>
Subject: INF: USAAF 26 APR 44

COMBAT CHRONOLOGY OF THE US ARMY AIR FORCES
WEDNESDAY, 26 APRIL 1944
FTP SITES
  1. ftp.rutgers.edu in directory pub/wwii/usaf
  2. byrd.mu.wvnet.edu (129.71.32.152) in pub/history/military/airforce/
     wwii_chronology

AIRCRAFT MENTIONED IN THIS REPORT:
  A-20, Douglas Havoc
  B-17, Boeing Flying Fortress
  B-24, Consolidated Liberator
  B-25, North American Mitchell
  B-26, Martin Marauder
  B-29, Boeing Superfortress
  C-47, Douglas Skytrain
  P-38, Lockheed Lightning
  P-39, Bell Airacobra
  P-40, Curtiss
  P-47, Republic Thunderbolt
  P-51, North American Mustang

CHINA-BURMA-INDIA (CBI) THEATER OF OPERATIONS

  BURMA-INDIA (Tenth Air Force): In Burma, 3 B-24s bomb Akyab; 6 P-38s hit
the Tiddim road near Chindwin; 70 fighter-bombers and 3 B-25s pound numerous
targets at Mogaung, Kamaing and several points in the N part of the Mogaung
Valley; in Mandalay and the surrounding area, 9 B-24s bomb railroad yards and
engine sheds, and 9 P-38s hit stores and hangars.

  CHINA (Fourteenth Air Force): In Burma, P-40s on armed reconnaissance from
Lashio to Man Kat cause considerable damage; 2 trucks, a warehouse, a water
tank, and 2 locomotives are destroyed, gun positions and a bridge are strafed
and a Japanese-occupied building is left in flames.

  STRATEGIC OPERATIONS (Twentieth Air Force): Japanese fighters make their
first interception of B-29s as they are flying over the Hump; the brief
confrontation results in no losses on either aide.

EUROPEAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS (ETO)

  STRATEGIC OPERATIONS (Eighth Air Force): Mission 319 Part 1: 589 bombers
and 554 fighters are dispatched to targets in Germany; no claims of enemy
aircraft are made; 5 fighters are lost:
  1. Of 357 B-17s dispatched, 292 hit the industrial area at Brunswick, 47
hit the Hildesheim/Hannover area and 5 hit targets of opportunity; 2 B-17s
are damaged beyond repair and 121 damaged; casualties are 9 KIA and 3 WIA.
  2. The 238 B-24s dispatched to Paderborn fail to bomb because there were
no PFF aircraft in the formation; 18 B-24s were damaged; 1 airman was KIA.
  Escort is provided by 90 P-38s, 311 Eighth and Ninth Air Force P-47s and
153 Eighth and Ninth Air Force P-51s; 1 P-38 and 4 P-51s are lost and 1 P-47
is damaged beyond repair; 1 pilot is KIA and 5 MIA.
  Mission 319 Part 2: 62 B-17s are dispatched to Cologne but are recalled at
mid-English Channel because of weather; some aircraft carry 2,000 lb (907 kg)
glide bombs on external racks. Escort is provided by 43 P-47s and 47 P-51s;
the P-47s claim 2-0-0 Luftwaffe aircraft
  Fighter-bomber missions: 33 P-38s (including Droopsnoot aircraft), plus
escorts, hit Le Mans Airfield, France without loss; 24 P-51s, plus 4 escorts,
bomb Cormeilles-en-Vexin Airfield, France without loss.
  Mission 320: 5 of 5 B-17s drop 800,000 leaflets on Ghent, Antwerp,
Brussels, Liege and Gosselies, Belgium at 2330-2358 hours without loss.
  HQ 34th Bombardment Group (Heavy) arrives at Mendlesham, England from the
US.

  TACTICAL OPERATIONS (Ninth Air Force): The Ninth Air Force Tactical Air
Plan for Operation NEPTUNE (actual operations within Operation OVERLORD; used
for security reasons on OVERLORD planning documents bearing place names and
dates) is published, 10 days after receiving formal Allied Expeditionary Air
Force (AEAF) directive ordering such a plan.
  Around 125 B-26s attack Plattling landing ground, Germany. Fighters fly
750+ sorties against scattered targets in NW Europe.
  Unit moves in England: HQ 50th Troop Carrier Wing from Bottesford to
Exeter; HQ 439th Troop Carrier Group and 91st, 92d, 93d and 94th Troop
Carrier Squadrons from Balderton to Upottery with C-47s; 95th, 96th, 97th and
98th Troop Carrier Squadrons, 440th Troop Carrier Group, from Bottesford to
Exeter with C-47s.

MEDITERRANEAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS (MTO)

  TACTICAL OPERATIONS (Twelfth Air Force): In Italy, bad weather greatly
curtails activity; P-47s attack motor transport and railroad tracks and hit a
gas dump near Trasimeno Lake, a landing ground at Canino and marshalling
yards of Leghorn.

PACIFIC OCEAN AREA (POA, Seventh Air Force): B-24s, having landed at Los
Negros Island after bombing Guam Island on 25 Apr, hit Ponape Island and
return to Kwajalein Atoll. B-25s based on Makin Island hit Jaluit and Wotje
Atolls.

SOUTH PACIFIC AREA (SOPAC, Thirteenth Air Force): On New Britain Island, 24
B-25s bomb the runway and dispersal area at Lakunai; and 35 fighter-bombers
pound the airfield at Tobera. 8 P-40s attack occupied areas along bays of
Tabut and Wariki, Bougainville Island.

SOUTHWEST PACIFIC AREA (SWPA, Fifth Air Force): In New Guinea, 120+ B-25s and
A-20s pound the Wewak area, hitting airfields at Wewak, But, Dagua and Boram,
and supply areas, troops, and several small villages. 13 B-24s bomb Awar
Point, 20 P-39s and P-47s attack bridges and targets of opportunity near
Madang and 8 P-39s attack roads, villages, and supply dump near Bunabun
Harbor; a B-25 on reconnaissance sinks a lugger in the Sepik River; and
Allied ground forces take Hollandia and occupy Alexishafen.

SOURCES:
AIR FORCE COMBAT UNITS OF WORLD WAR II, Office of Air Force History,
  Headquarters USAF, 1961, ISBN 0-912799-02-1
COMBAT SQUADRONS OF THE AIR FORCE, WORLD WAR II, Office of Air Force
  History, Headquarters USAF 1982
THE ARMY AIR FORCES IN WORLD WAR II: COMBAT CHRONOLOGY, 1941-1945 by the
  Office of Air Force History, Headquarters USAF, 1973
THE MIGHTY EIGHTH WAR DIARY by Roger A. Freeman, ISBN 1-85409-071-2

Jack McKillop
USAF (Airways and Air Communications Service)
1955-59

-------------------------------------------------------------------
|  Jack McKillop              |  Those who have long enjoyed such |
|  Bellcore                   |  privileges as we enjoy forget in |
|  Piscataway, NJ USA         |  time that men have died to win   |
|  [email-masked]  |  them.                     FDR    |
-------------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 26 Apr 1994 09:04:08 -0230
From:    OLAF <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: REF: Battleship TX

X-News: leif mail.wwii-l:9502

>From: [email-masked] (Josh Talbert)
>Subject:REF: Battleship TX
>Date: 26 Apr 1994 03:05:37 -0230
>Message-ID:<[email-masked]>

>Hello all.  I am interested in finding out all possible information regarding
>the Battleship Texas during WWII.  I have never come accross anything here in my
>home state of Texas dealing exclusively, or almost exclusively, with her.  I
>would greatly appreciate references regarding this.  I realize that there may
>not be any books which specifically deal with only the Texas, but books
>regarding her fleet, battle records, etc., would be useful.  BTW, the only
>picture of her in battle that I have seen is one taken from her of an oncoming
>kamikaze.  The kamikaze was shot down, and no damage was done to her by it.  I
>saw this in the Time-Life WWII series.
>
>Thanks in advance,
>
>Josh Talbert
>[email-masked]

But there *is* a book devoted exclusively to the _Texas_. Look for a book
by
Hugh I. Power, Jr. entitled simply _Battleship Texas_ and published in 1993
by Texas A&M University Press (ISBN 0-89096-516-1). The book was reviewed
in
the January 1994 issue of _The Northern Mariner_, the journal of the
Canadian Nautical Research Society. I'm sure it has been (or soon will be)
reviewed in other journals as well.

Olaf Janzen
Corner Brook, Newfoundland
[email-masked]

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 26 Apr 1994 07:54:51 -0400
From:    QUACK <[email-masked]>
Subject: Tirpitz

Todays Hartford Courant in their 50 Years Ago Today column on WWII men-
tioned that six British aircraft carries were attacking the Tirpitz in a
Norwegian fjiord.
Whatever became of this ship?

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 26 Apr 1994 07:02:45 GMT-6
From:    Terry Moore <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Nazi Bombers

Hello, Scott!

>      I was watching a show called "Wings of the Luftwaffe" a few weeks ago
>      on the Discovery channel (I think). It mentioned something about a
>      Heinkel He-215(?) which was designed to be a long range bomber. They
>      claimed this bomber made it to within 12 miles(!?) of New York City
>      before it had to turn back. Does anybody have information about this?
>      Were any Nazi bombs ever dropped on the North American continent (not
>      including naval weapon)? If so, where, when, how???

    Wings of the Luftwaffe is a fascinating series. The plane I think
you are referring to is the Me-264 which was designed to bomb New
York City. I have seen pix of it, and have info on it, if you want
it. Please let me know.

    No German bombs were ever dropped on the US from German sources.

    Hope this helps.

    Terry

Terry Moore, Professor of German and French, Amarillo College
P.O. Box 447, Amarillo, Texas 79178, voice 806-371-5077
fax 806-371-5370

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 26 Apr 1994 14:07:09 +0200
From:    Emmanuel Gustin <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Nazi Bombers

On Mon, 25 Apr 1994, Jones, Scott T. wrote:

>      I was watching a show called "Wings of the Luftwaffe" a few weeks ago
>      on the Discovery channel (I think). It mentioned something about a
>      Heinkel He-215(?) which was designed to be a long range bomber. They
>      claimed this bomber made it to within 12 miles(!?) of New York City
>      before it had to turn back. Does anybody have information about this?
>      Were any Nazi bombs ever dropped on the North American continent (not
>      including naval weapon)? If so, where, when, how???

The Junkers Ju 390 flew to within 20km of New York, then turned back. It
was a long-range development of the Ju 290, itself a military development
of the four-engined long-range Ju 90 airliner. There was no Heinkel 215;
the number 215 was allocated to Dornier for their Do 215 twin-engined
bomber.

The only enemy bombs dropped on the North American continent during WWII
were four Japanese 76kg firebombs, dropped by a Yokosuka E14Y 'Glenn'
reconaissance aircraft for submarines.

Emmanuel Gustin

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 26 Apr 1994 07:06:51 GMT-6
From:    Terry Moore <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: REF: Battleship TX

Hello, Josh!

You might consult the excellent history of the U.S. Navy (The
author's name escapes me for the time being.) The book is entitled:
The History of the United States Navy and was published by Ballantine
Books some years ago. It is the only reference I have found that
deals in some detail with the combat history of the Texas. It was
used in the bombardment of Normandy and Cherbourg, as best I can
remember. The actor Robert Montgomery was the gunnery officer at the
time.

Hope this helps.

Terry

----------------------------------------------------------------------

> Hello all.  I am interested in finding out all possible information regarding
> the Battleship Texas during WWII.  I have never come accross anything here in my
> home state of Texas dealing exclusively, or almost exclusively, with her.  I
> would greatly appreciate references regarding this.  I realize that there may
> not be any books which specifically deal with only the Texas, but books
> regarding her fleet, battle records, etc., would be useful.  BTW, the only
> picture of her in battle that I have seen is one taken from her of an oncoming
> kamikaze.  The kamikaze was shot down, and no damage was done to her by it.  I
> saw this in the Time-Life WWII series.
>
> Thanks in advance,
>
> Josh Talbert
> [email-masked]
>

Terry Moore, Professor of German and French, Amarillo College
P.O. Box 447, Amarillo, Texas 79178, voice 806-371-5077
fax 806-371-5370

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 26 Apr 1994 08:38:02 EDT
From:    Ken Koester <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Nazi Bombers

On Tue, 26 Apr 1994 14:07:09 +0200 Emmanuel Gustin said:
>The only enemy bombs dropped on the North American continent during WWII
>were four Japanese 76kg firebombs, dropped by a Yokosuka E14Y 'Glenn'
>reconaissance aircraft for submarines.

?  Didn't a few of the balloon-bombs actually make it across the Pacific to
Oregon?

ken koester
[email-masked]

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 26 Apr 1994 08:35:12 EDT
From:    Alan Wild <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Tirpitz

>From:         QUACK <[email-masked]>
>
>Todays Hartford Courant in their 50 Years Ago Today column on WWII men-
>tioned that six British aircraft carries were attacking the Tirpitz in a
>Norwegian fjiord.
>Whatever became of this ship?

The Tirpitz was a large battleship, sister ship to the Bismark. As I
recall reading, she put up a good fight against something like three
British heavy cruisers who finished her off in the open ocean. All
this after they discovered her hiding place in Norway.

-Al (I hope my memory serves me correctly.)

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Alan Wild, LAN Mgr.  Father of 1.5             Voice:          (401) 792-2611
ACC - Lippitt - URI  American Legion Post 102. FAX:            (401) 792-5479
Kingston, RI  02881                            Bitnet:           AWild@URIACC
                                               Internet: [email-masked]

Murphy's Uncertainty Principle:    You can know something has gone wrong only
                                    when you make an odd number of mistakes.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 26 Apr 1994 15:00:05 +0200
From:    Emmanuel Gustin <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Tirpitz

On Tue, 26 Apr 1994, Alan Wild wrote:

> >Todays Hartford Courant in their 50 Years Ago Today column on WWII men-
> >tioned that six British aircraft carries were attacking the Tirpitz in a
> >Norwegian fjiord.

The Tirpitz was first heavily damaged by small X-class submarines that
entered the fjord and dropped explosives under its keel, but I don't have
the date.  On 3 April 1944, the Tirpitz was damaged by a carrier air
strike. On 22 August in Altenfjord, this was repeated. On 15 September,
Lancaster bombers, temporarely based in the USSR for this attack (The USSR
sent a bill for it) damaged it with 'Tallboy' bombs. (Tallboy was a
streamlined, spin-stabilized 12000lb bomb, that fell at supersonic
speeds.) On 12 November 1944, it was sunk by Lancasters with Tallboy bombs
while in Tromso --- the latter base was within reach of UK-based bombers.

Emmanuel Gustin

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 26 Apr 1994 09:18:00 EDT
From:    mc killop <[email-masked]>
Subject: USS TEXAS

Another source of information on the history of the battleship Texas
is the DICTIONARY OF AMERICAN NAVAL FIGHTING VESSELS published by the
USN a number of years ago.  I believe you will find the "T's" in Volume
6 or 7.  Larry Jewell reported some time ago that these books were being
published again but I do not have any information on them.  Larry, are
you there?

-------------------------------------------------------------------
|  Jack McKillop              |  Those who have long enjoyed such |
|  Bellcore                   |  privileges as we enjoy forget in |
|  Piscataway, NJ USA         |  time that men have died to win   |
|  [email-masked]  |  them.                     FDR    |
-------------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 26 Apr 1994 08:19:04 -0500
From:    "Sue Hattabaugh, Valparaiso University" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: INFO: Military aircraft & vehicles display

Sorry to others on the list--I can't get through any other way.
Tim Scherrer:
I just found out from the chair of the committee  of this display
that this IS the museum you were referring to.  Fred Ropkey is no
longer associated with the museum.  This museum is in Chesterton, Indiana
about 10 miles north of Valparaiso.
Sue

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 26 Apr 1994 08:30:08 -0500
From:    "Robert J. Granvin" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Japanese Underground?

In message World War II Discussion List writes:
> It is well known that in Germany there was an underground movement trying to
> depose Hitler. Was there any underground to speak of in Japan? It would be
> incredible to conclude that all Japanese supported their warlords
> absolutely. So, who were the Japanese dissidents and what happened to them?

Actually, it's not hard to believe that there may not have been an underground
movement in Japan.

The "warlords" were seen as gods by the population -- after all, the emperor
is nothing less.  That alone is pretty good at discouraging the formation of
a resistance movement ... Actually hearing god's voice on the radio and seeing
him in person once in a while could be sobering to some people ... :-)

Also, while the mainland was suffering under blockades and the losses of
huge numbers of people in foreign campaigns, it was considered the ultimate
glory to die for your country.  Unlike Europe, bombs were not raining down
on the population every day (until the very end).

The motivation for a counter-movement in Japan is far less than it would have
been in Europe, making it beliveable that no significant effort was ever
formed.

--
Robert J. Granvin                                             [email-masked]
University of Minnesota, School of Statistics
         "I'm my father?  I'm my mother?  I'm chipped beef on toast?"

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 26 Apr 1994 09:40:15 -0400
From:    QUACK <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Tirpitz

I assume then,that the ship is still on the bottom and no efforts have or
had been made to salvage her.
As an aside, I also have an interest in the Horton flying wings and if mem-
ory serves me correctly isn't one at the Smithsonian's Maryland center?

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 26 Apr 1994 07:17:55 -0800
From:    John Riegsecker <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Exercise Tiger

>>What were the circumstances of RAdm Moon's suicide?

Samuel Eliot Morison mentions it briefly in his series of books.  If I
remember correctly, Morison says that Moon was a perfectionist, and thought
that it was impossible for him to complete his task given the all the
constraints.  I should know better than to trust my memory but I think this
was the invasion of Southern France.

John Riegsecker                                 (206) 756-3566
Dept of Math and Computer Science               [email-masked]
University of Puget Sound

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 26 Apr 1994 07:18:08 -0800
From:    John Riegsecker <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Nazi Bombers

>On Tue, 26 Apr 1994 14:07:09 +0200 Emmanuel Gustin said:
>>The only enemy bombs dropped on the North American continent during WWII
>>were four Japanese 76kg firebombs, dropped by a Yokosuka E14Y 'Glenn'
>>reconaissance aircraft for submarines.
>
>?  Didn't a few of the balloon-bombs actually make it across the Pacific to
>Oregon?
>
>ken koester
>[email-masked]

Yes they did.  The intent was to have them start forest fires.  There is an
interesting story connected with them. I can find the details if there is
interest, or perhaps someone else recalls the story better than I do, but a
small church group (I believe) was hiking in the Oregon woods.  One of the
children found one of the paper ballons and tugged on it.  The bomb on it
exploded killing the adult woman and some children.

Not so very long ago there was a meeting between relatives of those killed
and a Japanese woman who, as a small girl in Japan, had help make the
ballons.  Very touching.

John Riegsecker                                 (206) 756-3566
Dept of Math and Computer Science               [email-masked]
University of Puget Sound

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 26 Apr 1994 16:29:44 +0200
From:    Bengt Nilsson <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Tirpitz

I can't verify this, but I suppose someone else can.
The Tirpitz sank in shallow water. She basically turned upside down and
close to 1000 sailors were killed. Some of them were trapped inside the
ship.

I think she was broken up in the 1950's.

Bengt Nilsson
Link|ping University Library
[email-masked]

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 26 Apr 1994 09:32:53 -0500
From:    Joe Pohlmann <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Tirpitz

        Concerning the discussion of a battleship being sunk by several
British Heavy Cruisers, I believe you are talking about the SCHARNHORST.
This vessel was large enough to be listed as a Battlecruiser, but was
officially referred to as a Pocket Battleship, if I remember right.
        Anyway, on December 26th, 1943, British naval intelligence
intercepted orders to the Scharnhorst to attack two arctic convoys, and
when the attack was launched, found itself facing the Duke of York BB and a
good sized force of cruisers and destroyers.  The Scharnhorst went to the
bottom due to a torpedo attack from the Cruiser Jamaica.
        Of the 1900 crewmen aboard, only 36 survived.
        This had all happened off the coast of Norway, where the Scharnhorst
had been stationed.

Joe Pohlmann
[email-masked]
(513) 467-2106

"The big gun, what's that?"
"It's a weapon, powerful enough to blow up the whole world!"
"Who are we going to use it on?"
"The Russians."

(from the movie 'Real Men')

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 26 Apr 1994 08:26:42 PDT
From:    Sidney Allinson <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Lindbergh

Mr Lindberg was deluded enough to fall under the spell of Nazi Germany.
He became an outspoken advocate of Hitler's policies, via many public
speeches in the US during the late 1930s.
His reserve commission in the USAAF was revoked by President Roosevelt.
In mid-war, Lindberg wangled an appointment as a civilian technical
aircraft advisor in the South Pacific. That is where he shot down those
Japanese aircraft -- still a civilian. Probably an unique achievement.

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 26 Apr 1994 08:30:42 PDT
From:    Sidney Allinson <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Exercise Tiger

Thanks for the follow-up. Whatever the reason, RAdm Moon's suicide seems
to have been a sad business. He was by no means the only officer to crack
under the strain of responsibility.

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 26 Apr 1994 08:38:32 PDT
From:    Sidney Allinson <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Re[2]: NOST: 50 years ago this week

FM bernard Montgomery himself, in turn, was "played" by Lt. Clifton
James, Royal Army Pay Corps.
Someone in Intelligence saw Lt James impersonating then-General Montgomery
in an army stage show. James was then detailed to "be" Monty at various
public appearances, the purpose being disinformation of enemy Intelligence
agents.
James' resemblance to Monty was uncanny. Fooled even British troops and
newsreel cameramen, too. There was only one slight different between the
two; James had lost part of one finger, show off in the First World War.
So he wore a false finger during public appearances.
Another fortunate thing that helped was that James was a professional
actor, so could impersonate Monthy's characteristic speech mannerisms.
After the war, James made a career of appearing on stage doing a reprise
of his wartime role. He wrote a book, too, I WAS MONTY'S DOUBLE.
(PS that "show off" above should read "shot off")

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 26 Apr 1994 11:11:23 EDT
From:    MR SKIP WILDER <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Battleship TEXAS

Josh-
        The USS TEXAS is tied up as a permanent memorial at the San Jacinto
Battleground State Park, about 12 miles east of downtown Houston.  I'll bet
that the gift/museum shop has lots of published material on her war record
in both WWI and WWII.  Sorry, I don't have a telephone number.
        Regards,

 -----------------------------------------------------------
 |    Skip Wilder              |                           |
 |    [email-masked]      |"The road to hell is paved |
 |    FAX (703)528-2103        | with good intentions."    |
 |    McLean, Virginia, U.S.A. |                           |
 -----------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 26 Apr 1994 08:49:23 PDT
From:    Sidney Allinson <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Nazi Bombers

'Think you'll find that those Japanese balloon-bombs sent against
nort-west US in 1945 were not so much "dropped" here as they were
released far out in the Pacific to drift east on prevailing winds.
        The balloon bombs' intent was to set fire to forests in
Washington state and British Columbia. The Japanese launched far
more that four of these devices. However, as they were very fragile,
it seems only a half dozen actually reached the US mainland.
        Sadly, one came down near a family out on a picnic in
Washington. A mother and three kids. They must have been curious enough
to touch the device, as it exploded, killing them all.

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 26 Apr 1994 08:52:41 PDT
From:    Sidney Allinson <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Tirpitz

Sunk by RAF bombs, 12 November, 1944.

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 26 Apr 1994 17:59:29 +0100
From:    "H.G. Henry" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Nazi Bombers

I thought a Japanese submarine also shelled a weather station on
Vancouver Island, British Columbia, Canada?

Hugh Henry, St John's College, Cambridge

On Tue, 26 Apr 1994, Emmanuel Gustin wrote:

> On Mon, 25 Apr 1994, Jones, Scott T. wrote:
>
> >      I was watching a show called "Wings of the Luftwaffe" a few weeks ago
> >      on the Discovery channel (I think). It mentioned something about a
> >      Heinkel He-215(?) which was designed to be a long range bomber. They
> >      claimed this bomber made it to within 12 miles(!?) of New York City
> >      before it had to turn back. Does anybody have information about this?
> >      Were any Nazi bombs ever dropped on the North American continent (not
> >      including naval weapon)? If so, where, when, how???
>
> The Junkers Ju 390 flew to within 20km of New York, then turned back. It
> was a long-range development of the Ju 290, itself a military development
> of the four-engined long-range Ju 90 airliner. There was no Heinkel 215;
> the number 215 was allocated to Dornier for their Do 215 twin-engined
> bomber.
>
> The only enemy bombs dropped on the North American continent during WWII
> were four Japanese 76kg firebombs, dropped by a Yokosuka E14Y 'Glenn'
> reconaissance aircraft for submarines.
>
> Emmanuel Gustin
>

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 26 Apr 1994 13:11:48 -0400
From:    "John E. Kollar" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Lindbergh

I don't know how old he was, but he flew as a civilain
who needed to gather information for Lockheed about the
actual performance of the P-38 in combat, and it's not
combat if you don't get to shoot at someone right :),
he actually did help the performace of the P-38 in that he
found out that the pilots were flying with the settings on
the engine, manifold, etc, on full power all the time, he
showed them how to use less fuel intensive methods to allow
mission radius to increase.
        He was heavily involved in the peaceniks(WWII), and was
reportedly a german sympathizer (probably changed after he heard
fo the death camps), but interesting to notice is that they
sent him to the Pacific and not Europe (P-38s were in both theatres
at the time), maybe they were nervous about him getting second
thoughts...

John E. Kollar

BTW:Keegan cancelled for Wednesday, sorry to get any hopes up about
answered questions, but ends up he made a prior engagement somewhere
and didn't put it in his calender, hey I thinks he's ready to be a
professor (  :)  )
(Please nobody get offended, I'll be a professor too someday)

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 26 Apr 1994 13:18:45 -0400
From:    "John E. Kollar" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Nazi Bombers

Also bombs were dropped on the continental US by the first
intercontinental weapons system, a balloon with a timer put into the
jet stream that was hoped to carry it from Japan to the US, didn't
do too much but cost one farmer his tractor when it fell into a hole
caused by the explosion of one of the bombs underground.

John E. Kollar

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 26 Apr 1994 10:32:55 PDT
From:    Sidney Allinson <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Exercise Tiger

As RAdm Moon was serving in the Mediterranean at time of his suicide,
the TIGER disaster seems a bit remote from him.  Wonder what the
connection was.  ?

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 26 Apr 1994 12:49:53 CDT
From:    jesse carnes <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Nazi Bombers

Actually ...

Some children (it was either 4 or 5 of them) were killed in Oregon during the
war by a balloon bomb from Japan.
I cataloged the book on that and other incidents.
A rather tragic case, but true.

The device did not explode until one of the children found it and moved it
slightly.
A rather tragic case depicted in graphic detail.

Jesse Carnes

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 26 Apr 1994 13:03:15 -0500
From:    Michael D Wallick <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Tirpitz

On Tue, 26 Apr 1994, Emmanuel Gustin wrote:

> On Tue, 26 Apr 1994, Alan Wild wrote:
>
> > >Todays Hartford Courant in their 50 Years Ago Today column on WWII men-
> > >tioned that six British aircraft carries were attacking the Tirpitz in a
> > >Norwegian fjiord.
>
> The Tirpitz was first heavily damaged by small X-class submarines that
> entered the fjord and dropped explosives under its keel, but I don't have
> the date.  On 3 April 1944, the Tirpitz was damaged by a carrier air
> strike. On 22 August in Altenfjord, this was repeated. On 15 September,
> Lancaster bombers, temporarely based in the USSR for this attack (The USSR
> sent a bill for it) damaged it with 'Tallboy' bombs. (Tallboy was a
> streamlined, spin-stabilized 12000lb bomb, that fell at supersonic
> speeds.) On 12 November 1944, it was sunk by Lancasters with Tallboy bombs
> while in Tromso --- the latter base was within reach of UK-based bombers.
>
> Emmanuel Gustin
>
Here are some books about the TIRPITZ:

Gallagher, Thomas Michael.  The X-Craft Raid.  New York: Harcourt Brace
  Jovanovich, 1971.

Kennedy, Ludovic Henry Coverly.  Menace, the Life and Death of the Tirpitz.
  London: Sidgwick & Jackson, 1979.

Woodward, David.  The Tirpitz and the Battle for the North Atlantic.  New
  York: Norton, 1954.

Read more about it.

Michael Wallick

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 26 Apr 1994 11:07:21 PST
From:    "Jones, Scott T." <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re[2]: Tirpitz

     Along the line of the demise of German warships...

     Does anybody know the history of the "Graf Spee"? As I recall, it was
     a "pocket battleship" which was expected to perform miracles of
     warfare but ended up being a tin can target for the Royal Navy. Is it
     true that the "Graf Spee" was the most heavily armed and armored of
     all German ships sans the Bismarck?

     Scott T. Jones                | "Animals are our friends, but
     Dahlgren, VA 22448  USA       |  they won't pick you up at the
     Internet:  [email-masked] |  airport."- Bobcat Goldthwait
_____________________________________________________________________________

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 26 Apr 1994 14:17:05 EDT
From:    "Jonah Triebwasser, Adjunct Instructor,
         Marist Coll" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re[2]: Nazi Bombers

>>
>>?  Didn't a few of the balloon-bombs actually make it across the Pacific to
>>Oregon?
>
>Yes they did.  The intent was to have them start forest fires.  There is an

The fear of forest fires during WWII, especially on the West Coast,
was the reason the forest service had the character of Smokey Bear
created. Smokey is celebrating his 50th birthday this year! Regards-

Jonah Triebwasser
Adjunct Instructor
Marist College
Dyson Building (Adult Education)
Poughkeepsie, New York12601
Tel: (914) 575-3331, ext. 7037
E-Mail: [email-masked]

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 26 Apr 1994 13:18:57 GMT-6
From:    Terry Moore <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Tirpitz

Hello, Alan!

However, don't forget that the Tirpitz was first bombed in its fjord
at Trondheim by the Dambuster Squadron of the RAF, Number 617. That
raid brought about the only recorded court martial of a Knight's
Cross holder in the Wehrmacht. A scapegoat was needed and Heinrich
Ehrler's squadron was blamed for not reacting fast enough to save the
ship.

The Tirpitz was also attacked by underwater craft of the RN. Its hull
was pierced and repaired with concrete, although it was far from
being combat ready. It was felt that the mere presence of this ship
in Norway would tie down substantial units of the British Home Fleet.

Terry

Terry Moore, Professor of German and French, Amarillo College
P.O. Box 447, Amarillo, Texas 79178, voice 806-371-5077
fax 806-371-5370

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 26 Apr 1994 13:19:40 GMT-6
From:    Terry Moore <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Tirpitz

Hello, Bengt!

All you state is correct.

Terry

Terry Moore, Professor of German and French, Amarillo College
P.O. Box 447, Amarillo, Texas 79178, voice 806-371-5077
fax 806-371-5370

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 26 Apr 1994 14:13:08 GMT-6
From:    Terry Moore <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: REF: Battleship TX

Hello, again, Josh!

The name of the author occurred to me, after some thought. The author
of the book "The History of the U.S. Navy" was Stan E. Smith. This
book came out some years ago by Ballantine Books. It is lengthy and
detailed. I would highly recommend it, if you can find a copy.

Hope this helps.

Terry

Terry Moore, Professor of German and French, Amarillo College
P.O. Box 447, Amarillo, Texas 79178, voice 806-371-5077
fax 806-371-5370

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 26 Apr 1994 14:56:31 GMT-6
From:    Terry Moore <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: BARBAROSSA

Hello, Dmitry!

Sorry to have taken so long to get back to you. I will try to answer
you as best I can.

  This information was made public in a documentary based on
information newly released from the Russian archives.

> Facts!? All what I know this is some non-clear rumours which are
> represented in Volkogonov's book (despite of his strong desire to draw
> Stalinin black light-it's new Russian political course- he found nothing).
> I can say only my opinion: in that situation any peace was impossible.

    I don't know about that. The Germans made some basic mistakes in
assuming they were going to be able to get away with the kind of
treatment they eventually meted out to the Russian populace,
particularly in the way the Germans administered the occupied areas.

    If this situation and attitude had not prevailed, the outcome
would have been much different, and peace, of sorts, would have been
possible.

    Perhaps, in the light of reality, a genuine peace would have been
impossible without the Germans substantially altering their policies
and attitudes toward the Russians in general.

 > Why?

> People (I mean Soviet) was ready to war becouse strong propaganda before
> 1939. A lot of people (servicemen) paticipated in Spain civil war (1936-
> 1939). People knew: the war will happen and it will be war with Germans.
> I remember several sentences from well-known song "If tomorrow war will be":

    I don't know that the Russians were ready for war before it
actually  occurred. Perhaps psychologically, but not militarily and
politically.

    Certainly the enemy was easy to imagine, given the political
climate in the Soviet Union during the 1930's. This "enemy" was an
easy whipping stick that Stalin didn't hesitate to use to divert
attention from domestic economic problems, hound his real or imagined
enemies such as Trotsky, and above-all to maintain a wartime
atmosphere within the country so that Stalin could solidify his power
base and find ample and easy justification to enforce his heavy-
handed rule.

 >   If tomorrow war will be
>   If tomorrow marsh will be
>   You must be ready today!
> By the way in this song enemy was named exactly - Germans.
> So, despite of deep Stalin's simpaphy to Germans (this fact is set and
> connected with before revolution Stalins biography) he undestood very
> well who was main Russian (please, note - I said Russian, not Soviet)
> opponent at that time. Becouse Stalin became by Stalin only by reason
> that he defended and implemented RUSSIAN geopolitical interests.
> (may be it was rather intuitively). He
> was leader not the Soviet Union, but renewed RUSSIAN EMPIRE. Read the
> Stalin's works and you understood it.(Bolshevizm was finished with
> Lenin's death.)

    I don't think Bolshevism ever existed. It is dictatorship
regardless of appellation. Besides, Lenin's interpretation of Marx
had to be altered to fit the circumstances, given the condition of
the country at the time of his usurpation of power.

>         As it stands, it was impossible for Stalin to stop struggle
> after his appeal to nation (5 of July 1941) to war up to finish point.

    I don't agree with that. Stalin could do pretty much what he
wanted as the absolute master of Russia. There are too many instances
in his public career where today's truth was tomorrow's lie.

 I know the generation of Stalin's communists (my grangfather and other).
> They were communists by form, but russian nationalists by nature.

    I don't doubt that, but that didn't stop them from obeying the
Party's directives.

    > By the way, it's one of the reason of
Stalin's cleaning in party -
> he killed all Lenin's communists and replaced them by other kind ones.

    Yes, those amenable to his (Stalin's) dictates whose loyalty,
under Stalin, would have been most questionable. It was only a
natural occurrence for Stalin to want to replace his predecessor's
people with his own. The only difference was that Stalin wanted no
one left alive who could even so much as brook any interference with
his plans.

> Lenin built International Union of Communist Republic. Stalin built
> some other - renewed Russian Empire.

    Perhaps, but it was dictatorship regardless of what you call it.

> I am sure: if Stalin would do so he would be replaced by other person
> (may it's strange fo you to hear it). Marshal Zhukov, for example.
> Of course, Stalin was not suicideman.

    I can't imagine Stalin being replaced by anyone, as long as he
was alive, much less Marshal Zhukov. I think there were times when
Stalin felt someone might try, as he might have thought would happen,
after the initial severe reverses the Soviet Union sustained in the
opening phases of Barbarossa. But I don't think anyone seriously
would have offered him a challenge, as long as he was alive.

 >         But I am ready to hear your facts if they exist.

    See above.

> >    I think that would have depended on the situation. There were
> >enough people in the SU who had already had enough of Stalin's brand
> >of rule, and had the Germans been a little more sensitive to these
> >peoples, particularly the Ukraine, the whole house, I think, would
> >have come crashing around Stalin's ears.
>
> It's true. But Germans tried to use this fact very intensively.
> There were several SS division formed from different nations:
> western ukrainains, baltic people, crimean tatars (this small nation
> formed two SS division!). But once again I repeat: Stalin was leader
> of russians, eastern ukrainains (practically russians) and belorussians
> (very close to russians). This three nations took 85-90%.
> I forgot georgians! It was strong suppoter of Russian Empire (please,
> note: it was at that time, but not now).
> Of course, Germans tried to create Russian anticommunist front (Vlasov
> army- French Vishi variant).

    Not a serious thing, I think. By the time, the Germans got Vlasov
ready for combat in the Wehrmacht, his force was simply looked upon
as another source for manpower use on the Eastern Front.

But this army was not able to war
>  effectively, becouse it was formed
> by following way. The russian prisoned servicemen were said:either service
> in Vlasov army or death. What do you opt? So, number of strugglers for idea
> was small enough in ROA.

    Agreed. But, you must not forget that the Germans at the highest
levels did not trust a Russian renegade as Vlasov. It required a
complete reversal of the military situation on the Eastern Front for
the Germans to use a man like Vlasov.

> Other example: the position of russian intellectuals. They didn't like
> Stalin, of course. But they undestood very well: it's necessary to opt
> less from two bad things. Hitler was more dangerous: he planed to clean
> slavic nations in general!

    Perhaps, but I wonder if that was fully comprehended then. I
think this became clearer the longer the Germans remained on Russian
soil, but in the beginning the Germans were thought of as liberators
and welcomed accordingly.

    Your thoughts?

 So, itellegentia stoped his still opposition
> to Stalin regime during war. What do you think: why did Solzhenitstyn
> war for Stalin(not for Vlasov) understanding very well who is Stalin?

    Solzhenitsyn had no choice at the time, as a member of the
Russian Army. And besides, Solzhenitsyn wasn't captured and forced to
make that decision. Nor did he defect.

Also, I think the Russians fought the Great Patriotic War for
themselves and not for Stalin. Stalin just happened to be there at
the time.

    This situation with the intellectuals ceasing its resistance to
Stalin's rule is analagous to that of Chiang Kai- Shek's "peace"
with Mao Tse-Tung after the Japanese attacked Manchuria and became
involved in WWII. Any opposition against each other was put on the
back-burner until the common enemy was dealt with. Afterwards,
accounts could be settled.

    Your thoughts?

    Terry

Terry Moore, Professor of German and French, Amarillo College
P.O. Box 447, Amarillo, Texas 79178, voice 806-371-5077
fax 806-371-5370

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 26 Apr 1994 15:22:20 -0600
From:    Tony Schuler <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: German Helicopters

Thanks Terry,

I would appreciate information on helicopters that flew during the War. Perfor-
mance data and if they were involved in any missions.

I don't want you to dig too deep, so if you don't have the data on a specific
helocopter just say so.

Thanks much,

Tony Schuler

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 26 Apr 1994 15:11:32 PST
From:    "Jones, Scott T." <[email-masked]>
Subject: TRV: Off Beat Weapons...

     This talk about the Japanese balloon bombs got my twisted mind
     thinking of other "unconventional" weapons. I recall the Germans were
     trying to train dogs to run underneath Soviet tanks with bombs on
     their backs. The bombs would detonate by way of a contact trigger
     which, when bent, would produce the necessary spark to go "ka-blooie!"
     The Germans would train them by feeding them underneath a tank with
     the engine running. They hoped that this would get them to associate
     an active tank with Alpo. Well, all was ready for the great debut of
     this new antitank weapon on a battlefield (I do not know WHERE). The
     dogs allowed the bombs to be strapped onto their backs and off they
     ran... underneath the nearest GERMAN tank!

     I have also heard stories of the Japanese being targeted by American
     bats (airborne mammal types) with small incendiary devices. The bats
     were released and, as nature directed, they would find a space
     underneath the eaves of a Japanese building/house, device would ignite
     (as would bat) and the Japanese were demoralized by this "out of
     nowhere" fire. So the theory was, anyway...

     Does anybody know of any other creative weapons or have better details
     on these?

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 26 Apr 1994 18:58:55 -0400
From:    Emery Ford <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Nazi Bombers

--------
>
>The only enemy bombs dropped on the North American continent during WWII
>were four Japanese 76kg firebombs, dropped by a Yokosuka E14Y 'Glenn'
>reconaissance aircraft for submarines.
>
>Emmanuel Gustin
Those bombs were dropped in Oregon, right?

--Emery

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 27 Apr 1994 01:25:45 +0200
From:    Emmanuel Gustin <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Nazi Bombers

On Tue, 26 Apr 1994, Emery Ford wrote:

> >The only enemy bombs dropped on the North American continent during WWII
> >were four Japanese 76kg firebombs, dropped by a Yokosuka E14Y 'Glenn'
> >reconaissance aircraft for submarines.
> >Emmanuel Gustin
> Those bombs were dropped in Oregon, right?

yes.

Emmanuel Gustin

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 26 Apr 1994 19:43:49 -0400
From:    William Newbold Ely III <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Tirpitz

Hi Dr. Moore and WWII buffs!
        Anyone who can help me get more information on Stalag Luft III
in Sagan (now Zagan, Poland)?  What I am interested is the exact location
of the three tunnels, especially Harry and Tom!  I already have been
there, looking for the exact site of the tunnel openings out in the open
just outside the wired fence boundaries of the camp held by Nazis but no
luck yet as no one there could tell me.  So it looks like those who were
interned there may know this.  I only need a map pinpointing those locations!
Thanks, all!
        Stalag Luft III is the name of the camp which Nazis held
prisoners of war (American, British, etc.).  Nazis boasted that it was
escape-proof but they were proven wrong by 76 POWs getting out, although
50 of them were shot by the Gestapo!  I did go there twice.  There is a
memorial museum on the edge or on where the camp was once.  Ironically,
the edges is occupied by the Polish military! I also went to the cemetery
holding the ashes of the 50 murdered POW's.  Across the dirt road from
the cemetery was a larger Soviet cemetery holding many more fallen Soviet
soldiers!
        I'd like to exchange info and views back and forth with those
interested in this topic (Stalag Luft III and its environs: Sagan/Zagan).

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 26 Apr 1994 17:01:03 PDT
From:    Sidney Allinson <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Nazi Bombers

Yes, a Japanese sub did shell the lighthouse at Uclulet, BC. But, the
original post here was discussing bombing (by Jap aircraft).
A sub from Nippon also shelled oil-rigs in Southern California. They
were remarkably un-agressive against the North American mainland
throughout WW2.

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 26 Apr 1994 17:12:16 PDT
From:    Sidney Allinson <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Re[2]: Tirpitz

The German "pocket battleship" GRAF SPEE was scuttled in the mouth
of the River Plate, after losing a gun-battle with three British
cruisers, HMS AJAX, EXETER, and ACHILLES -- 13 December, 1939.
Th German skipper, Captain Lagsdorff, shot himself in a hotel room
in Montevideo, Uraguay, and his crew were intened there for the
rest of the wr.

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 26 Apr 1994 21:07:19 -0500
From:    Jon Stevens <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: TRV: Off Beat Weapons...

On Tue, 26 Apr 1994, Jones, Scott T. wrote:
 I recall the Germans were
>      trying to train dogs to run underneath Soviet tanks with bombs on
>      their backs. The bombs would detonate by way of a contact trigger
>      which, when bent, would produce the necessary spark to go "ka-blooie!"
>      The Germans would train them by feeding them underneath a tank with
>      the engine running. They hoped that this would get them to associate
>      an active tank with Alpo. Well, all was ready for the great debut of
>      this new antitank weapon on a battlefield (I do not know WHERE). The
>      dogs allowed the bombs to be strapped onto their backs and off they
>      ran... underneath the nearest GERMAN tank!

It was the Soviets that trained dogs to do this. See Paul Carrel _Hitler
Moves East_ ,(I don't have it handy but I am fairly certain this info is
in there).  The Germans soon learned to shoot any stray dogs
wandering near their tanks.  It is doubtful that very many German tanks were
destroyed and Carrel even says that some of these dogs would blow Russian
tanks by mistake.

my $.02 worth,
Jonathan Stevens

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 26 Apr 1994 19:56:00 PST
From:    [email-masked]
Subject: the "Silent Service"

        About two months ago I wrote to the list requesting information on the
submarine Flasher.  Through the information ya'll provided I was able to get
my hands on a copy of "War Fish" by George Grider and Lydel Sims.  I wanted to
thank those who responded for the tips.  My great uncle served on the Flasher
under Grider, who was her commander at the end of the war.  Uncle Tom (McCants)
died June of 1992, so I am no longer able to ask him about this.  From what my
Mom tells me he loved to tell stories about his experiences.  Which leads me to
one of my questions.  My grandfather served under Eisenhower as a radio
operator, but that is about all I've been able to get him to tell me.  I was
wondering why it seems to be so hard for many vets to talk about their
experiences.
        I was also wondering if anyone knew of any ftp sites that have more
detailed texts on submarines in WWII, so far I've come up with very little from
either the Atlantic or Pacific theater.  (Ftp sites that have an anonymous login
feature, please.)  Thanks ahead of time.
        Jennifer Hagood
        [email-masked]

------------------------------

End of WWII-L Digest - 25 Apr 1994 to 26 Apr 1994
*************************************************