Subject: WWII-L Digest - 28 Jul 1994 to 29 Jul 1994

From: Automatic digest processor <[email-masked]>
Date: Sat, 30 Jul 1994 00:00:48 -0400

There are 26 messages totalling 793 lines in this issue.

Topics of the day:

  1. GEN: THE WAR IN NORWAY (2)
  2. 50TH: JULY 20 PLOT
  3. INF: USN Chronology 07-29-94
  4. HIST: Ju 390 near NYC in '44 (3)
  5. Staged photographs (3)
  6. INF: 50 Years Ago - 30-JUL-1944
  7. INF: 50 Years Ago FTP Archive
  8. <No subject given>
  9. HUMOR: Top 10 affects (4)
 10. Economic Warfare
 11. MEDIA:Warsaw Uprising
 12. In search of a medic
 13. Did I miss anything while I was out?
 14. Star of Victory (2)
 15. Norway/Enigma
 16. TACT/PROP/OPERATIONS: Doolittle Raid in RVeverse? (2)

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 29 Jul 1994 14:23:55 +0200
From:    JOHN AUSLAND <[email-masked]>
Subject: GEN: THE WAR IN NORWAY

  RON BABUKA says the following:

This of course was one of the failures of the British Intelligence that the
belief that stopping the flow of iron ore from Sweden would slow the German
war effort.  In the first year of the war 40 per cent of Germany's steel
was still being allocated to civilian use and that does not include
construction and exports.  German had immense stockpiles of steel and more
was coming in from Austria, Poland, and Czechoslovakia.

  COMMENT:  I have seen various statements regarding German dependency on
Swedish ore and the delivery route through Narvik.  I do not mean to question
your statements, but could you (or someone else) give me an authoritative quote
on this, along with source.  Ideally, this would cover not only the early phase
of the war but the later years also.

  Regards, John Ausland/Oslo Norway

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 29 Jul 1994 14:28:10 +0200
From:    JOHN AUSLAND <[email-masked]>
Subject: 50TH: JULY 20 PLOT

  Oslo, July 29

  The question of the July 20 plot is also being discussed on the Compuserve
World War II forum.  Here is a recent message, which represents one point of
view.  I would be interested in any comments.

#: 258147 S4/WWII/Commemorative
    28-Jul-94  10:10:24
Sb: #256614-July20 Plot - Hitler
Fm: Milton Goldin 74133,2306
To: Jack Hammond 71260,306 (X)

There is no lack of evidence about what the conspirators wanted from the
Anglo-Americans.  They wanted a return to 1914, including the retention of all
conquests in the East.

In all the discussions of Goerdeler, Stauffenberg and their peers, what is
left out is that their numbers included leading Nazis.  Moreover, that the
chief gripe that they had against Hitler was that he mismanaged the war -- not
that Germany had caused an unspeakable catastrophe.

No wonder that Kohl has had a problem deciding how to celebrate July 20.
Exactly what is there to celebrate?

- Milton

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 29 Jul 1994 01:31:00 PST
From:    "Keller, Theron P." <[email-masked]>
Subject: INF: USN Chronology 07-29-94

UNITED STATES NAVY CHRONOLOGY
from:
//byrd.mu.wvnet.edu/pub/history/military/wwii/naval_chronology/chr4(4,5).txt

1944
07/29 Sat.  United States naval vessel damaged:
             LST 340, by grounding, Marianas Islands area,
              15 d. 10'N., 145 d. 58'E.
            German submarines sunk:
             U-872 and U-2323, by Army aircraft, Bremen, Germany.

Theron P. Keller
Logicon, Inc.
Dahlgren, VA  22448 USA
[email-masked]

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 29 Jul 1994 08:01:22 -0400
From:    Warren Thompson <[email-masked]>
Subject: HIST: Ju 390 near NYC in '44

TO: Ed Kettler (aka "The Eagle") and other interested parties.

Source for my posting anent this event is,

        William Green. WARPLANES OF THE THIRD REICH. [Galahad Books, 1970].
        See p.519.

        Quotation follows:

                In January 1, the Ju 390 V2 [test model #2] was delivered
                to Fernaufklaerungs-Gruppe 5 at Mont de Marson, south of
                Bordeaux, for operational evaluation. The Ju 390 V2 carried
                sufficient fuel for an endurance of 32 hours, and after a few
                short-distance flights, the aircraft flew from Mont de Marson
                to a point some 12 miles from the U.S. coast, north of New
                York, returning successfully to its base.

Hope this helps.

-- Warren Thompson
LEBANON VALLEY COLLEGE
Annville PA 17003

[email-masked]

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 29 Jul 1994 08:05:34 -0400
From:    Ron Babuka <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: GEN: THE WAR IN NORWAY

>  COMMENT:  I have seen various statements regarding German dependency on
>Swedish ore and the delivery route through Narvik.  I do not mean to question
>your statements, but could you (or someone else) give me an authoritative quote
>on this, along with source.  Ideally, this would cover not only the early phase
>of the war but the later years also.
>

John - the source is Len Deightons "Blood, Tears, and Folly : An objective
look at World War II."  Deighton does mention an order from Hitler to
General Dietl on April 13, 1940 instructing him to  "If necessary destroy
ore railway through mountains beyond repair." perhaps showing little
importance placed on the ore.  Deighton also mentions that later in the
war, the low-phosphorus ore became more important as technology improved.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ron Babuka                                         National Warplane Museum
Cornell University                                 Geneseo, New York
CIT - Information Resources
Ithaca, New York 14850
(607) 254-6492

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 29 Jul 1994 09:31:08 -0400
From:    Dan Ford <[email-masked]>
Subject: Staged photographs

And then there was MacArthur's "I Shall Return" photo, splashing ashore
in the Philippines with his corncob jutting--wasn't that also staged, or
re-staged? As I recall, there was no photographer at hand, so he went
back out to the boat or landing craft and did it again.

Now that I've made the obligatory bow towards WWII, here are two items
from personal experience:

In the Mekong Delta in 1964 the ARVN made an amphibious landing upon a
town that was first softened up with napalm from a (if I am not mistaken)
North American AT-6. By the time we all got ashore, there was only one
male in town, and he had a wooden foot. An ARVN officer had him
blindfolded and put a Colt .45 against his temple. I took a picture, as
did Hubert Lecampion, a French photographer. A year later his photo
turned up on an Italian Communist election poster under a heading that
more or less said: "This is how they are dying today in Vietnam." Since I
knew the prisoner hadn't been shot, I got out my pictures and you could
clearly see that there was no clip in the ARVN officer's pistol.

Later, also in the Delta, the ARVN Rangers came into a town which proved
to have a booby-trapped doorway in one of the huts, and a soldier was
mortally wounded. While the medics were treating him, his buddies decided
to burn down the hut. Their matches of course were damp, and so was the
thatch, so John Sharkey, the NBC correspondent, stepped forward and gave
a soldier his Zippo. Then he stepped back out of the cameraman's view and
the hut was duly burnt. I sometimes wonder if that wasn't the first
Zippo Job of the Vietnam War.

My point (there is a point!) is that people are (properly) skeptical of
what they read, but they tend to give photographs more trust than perhaps
they should.

            - Dan      <[email-masked]>

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 29 Jul 1994 07:24:14 -0700
From:    John Davis <[email-masked]>
Subject: INF: 50 Years Ago - 30-JUL-1944

On 30-JUL-1944, the following occurred -

World War II - The Battlefronts
-------------------------------
Western Front - The US 4th and 6th Armoured Divisions (VIII Corps) advance
     towards Avranches and Granville. Units of the 4th reach the outskirts of
     Avranches and capture the bridges over the river See. The VII Corps is
     approaching Villedieu-les-Poetes. The XIX Corps is facing strong German
     counter-attacks near Percy. Further east there are successful British
     attacks near Caument.

Marianas - On Tinian, the 2nd and 4th Marine Divisions push southwards against
     stiff Japanese resistance. The town of Tinian is taken and the Japanese
     are squeezed into a little strip of land at the extreme south end of the
     island. On Guam, the Marines and Infantry have largely cleared the
     southern half of the island.

New Guinea - The Americans land an amphibious Army force on the Vogelkop
     peninsula, near Sansapor on the northwest point of New Guinea. Troops are
     also landed on the off-shore islands of Amsterdam and Middleburg. The
     amphibious force is commanded by RADM W.M. Fechteler. A beachhead about a
     mile and a half wide and half a mile deep is established. In the Aitape
     sector, the Americans regroup in preparation for a counter-attack.

Burma - The Japanese commander in the Myitkyina area orders his troops to
     withdraw and then commits suicide.

Naval Dispatches
----------------
US Minesweepers YMS-304 and YMS-378 sunk by mine, Normandy area.

Foreign Affairs
---------------
Turkish Break With Reich Forseen - Istanbul reports that the Turkish
     government has ordered all Turkish ships in Rumanian and Bulgarian ports
     to return home at once "with or without cargo". This move is being viewed
     as a preparatory move for a break in relations with Germany.

Atocities By Goring Division - Officials in Rome say captured police records
     show toops of the Hermann Goring Division massacred more than 100
     civilians in Stia, Italy on April 11 in reprisal for the shooting of two
     German civilians.

The Homefront
-------------
Swim Record Set - Ann Curtis of San Franciso has set a world record for the
     880-yard free-style swim with a mark of 11:08.6.

Circus Resumes Tour - The Ringling Brothers and Barnum and Bailey Circus,
     whose main tent was destroyed by fire in Hartford, Connecticut on July
     6th has left Sarasoto, Florida to resume its tour in indoor arenas only.

=============================================================================

Sources: "2194 Days of War" by Cesare Salmaggi and Alfredo Pallavisimi, "The
World Almanac Book Of WW II" by Peter Young, "United States Naval Chronology,
World War II" by Naval Historical Division - United States Navy, "Facts On
File Yearbook 1944, Person's Index Of World Events" edited by R.L. Lapica.

----------
John Davis  ([email-masked]/[email-masked])
Cary, N.C.
----------

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 29 Jul 1994 07:48:40 -0700
From:    John Davis <[email-masked]>
Subject: INF: 50 Years Ago FTP Archive

The July 1944 50 Years Ago articles are now available for downloading via
anonymous FTP.

Instructions for downloading 50 YA articles -

The articles are stored by month. To retrieve the articles by FTP, open host
"ftp.netcom.com", enter "anonymous" when prompted for login ID, enter your
Internet mail address when prompted for password. To change to the directory
where the articles are stored enter "cd /pub/jbd". The file name identifies
the month (example - jul1944.txt, contains the July 1944 articles).

----------
John Davis ([email-masked]/[email-masked])
Cary, N.C.
----------

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 29 Jul 1994 10:59:20 -0400
From:    Emery Ford <[email-masked]>
Subject: <No subject given>

50TH: WARSAW UPRISING

Hi everyone,

I thought you might like this.  It comes from the Radio Free / Radio
Europe Daily Report, July 28, 1994:

        WARSAW UPRISING ANNIVERSARY STIRS CONTROVERSY

Preparations for the 50th anniversary of the Warsaw Uprising have
underlined the disparity between Germany's surprisingly warm relations
with Poland and Russia's far less amiable approach.  To transform the
anniversary into a symbol of historical reconciliations, President Lech
Walesa issued invitations to both the German and the Allied heads of
state in August 1993.  The decision to invite the German and Russian
presidents stirred controversy.  A few nationalist groups, including the
Confederation for an Independent Poland, have called for a boycott; they
argue that the presence of "representatives of countries that murdered
Poles offends the victims' memory."  German President Roman Herzog
accepted Walesa's invitation, graciously expressing respect for Poles
who objected to his presence.  "We have waited 40 years for Poland's
return to the community of free nations," Herzog told PAP on 26 July.
Russian President Boris Yeltsin declined the invitation, however.
Russia will be represented by the Yeltsin's chief of staff, Sergei
Filatov.  Although Yeltsin claimed an overcrowded calendar, Interfax
reported on 26 July that the Russian president will spend the first ten
days of August on vacation.  A Polish official called Yeltsin's absence
"a political fact."  Reporting a joke now making the rounds in Warsaw,
Gazeta Wyborcza said that it would be most fitting if Yeltsin were to
observe the anniversary ceremonies from the far side of the Vistula,
just as the Red Army did as the Nazis obliterated the uprising in 1944.
        Louisa Vinton, RFE/RL, Inc.

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 29 Jul 1994 15:59:52 BST
From:    Stephen Baldwin <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Staged photographs

not a WWII photo (sorry) but nevertheless quite a famous bit of "staging"
is from the world's first war documentary filmed by Geoffrey Malins on the
Somme (amongst other places...). It is footage that is often used by the media
here when reporting on the Great War and purports to show men going over the
top during the Battle of the Somme. A number of them are "shot" amid barbed
wire and fall. One of them can be seen turning back to look at the camera.
Also, all the chaps in the film carry next to no equipment. Dramatic yes,
but accurate??? Malins wrote a book about "How I Filmed The Great War"
but doesn't (so I'm told) acknowledge any fakings or suchlike
jiggery pokery.

Steve Baldwin
[email-masked]

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 29 Jul 1994 11:19:26 EDT
From:    Alan Wild <[email-masked]>
Subject: HUMOR: Top 10 affects

Top 10 Cultural/Societal affects from WWII: (fill in the gaps)

10. Industries turns to streamlining for commercial appeal.
    Not only automobiles, but later toasters and refridgerators
    become "streamlined".

 9. "Hitler" moustache falls out (way out) of fashion.

 8. "Rommel", a favorite name for dogs,... especially for G-Sheps.

 7.
 6.
 5.
 4.
 3.
 2.
 1.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Alan Wild, LAN Mgr.  Father of 1.8815          Voice:          (401) 792-2611
ACC - Lippitt - URI  American Legion Post 102. FAX:            (401) 792-5479
Kingston, RI  02881  NRA Life Member           BITNET:           AWild@URIACC
                                               Internet: [email-masked]
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 29 Jul 1994 08:44:32 PST
From:    "Jones, Scott T." <[email-masked]>
Subject: Economic Warfare

     I recently read an article regarding the planned changes for the
     American paper currency. The main reason for this change, according to
     the article, as the recent influx of fake currency through terrorist
     organizations, "the Mob", and others. Apparently Syria, Jordan and
     Iran(?) are the main suppliers of said money.

     Anyway, to relate this to WWII... Did the Germans not have a plan to
     saturate the British economy with faux pound notes? Did they have
     their eyes (Augen) set on doing the same to the North American
     economy? Realizing I am not an economist, how exactly would such an
     operation be pulled off? Would the fake bills be dropped all over a
     city? Introduced gradually through large purchases? Give the fake
     bills to the citizens to pay their taxes?

     Scott

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
     Scott T. Jones VMI '87        | "Stupid is as Stupid does."
     Dahlgren, VA 22448  USA       |            - Forrest Gump
     Internet: [email-masked]  |

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 29 Jul 1994 12:10:05 EDT
From:    Chuck Weckesser <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: MEDIA:Warsaw Uprising

Dear Jeff,

Your message to Terry and I was superb. Your analogy regarding Afghanistan gave
me pause and after thinking about it, I now think that you are right.

For historical accuracy only, wasn't the Russian Civil War over by the time
Poland defeated Trotsky in 1920?

I'd like to make on point regarding Finland. I think that Stalin's decision to
allow Finlad to remain independent was his way of showing the west that he had
no evil intentions of expanding the USSR's borders beyond the Molotov-Ribbentrip
agreement and, of course, the rape and incorporation of the Baltics into the
Soviet Union.

The West would not have tolerated any machinations toward Finalnd. The world
marveled and cheered on the daring Finns, who, on ski's, managed to hold off
several Russian Divisions in 1939. The Finn's were not Nazi's. While it is true
that they were, in theory, a part of the Axis, I believe that it was only to
extent that it was convenient and provided the only conduit to reverse Russian
territorial gains made in 1939.

To the best of my knowledge, the Finn's refused to turn over any Jews, even a
token number, to the Nazi's to be murdered. If I am wrong, would someone please
correct me on this point?

During the Cold War, it was no accident that the West fretted and worried itself
with the "Finlandization" of various countries in which the USSR had gained a
sphere of influence. The Finn's were in a no-win situation. They are a noble
people.

Regards,

Chuck Weckesser

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 29 Jul 1994 09:43:09 -0700
From:    Ed Kettler <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: HIST: Ju 390 near NYC in '44

Thanks, I'll look it up.

Ed

Ed Kettler                                       [email-masked]

On Fri, 29 Jul 1994, Warren Thompson wrote:

> TO: Ed Kettler (aka "The Eagle") and other interested parties.
>
> Source for my posting anent this event is,
>
>         William Green. WARPLANES OF THE THIRD REICH. [Galahad Books, 1970].
>         See p.519.
>
>         Quotation follows:
>
>                 In January 1, the Ju 390 V2 [test model #2] was delivered
>                 to Fernaufklaerungs-Gruppe 5 at Mont de Marson, south of
>                 Bordeaux, for operational evaluation. The Ju 390 V2 carried
>                 sufficient fuel for an endurance of 32 hours, and after a few
>                 short-distance flights, the aircraft flew from Mont de Marson
>                 to a point some 12 miles from the U.S. coast, north of New
>                 York, returning successfully to its base.
>
> Hope this helps.
>
> -- Warren Thompson
> LEBANON VALLEY COLLEGE
> Annville PA 17003
>
> [email-masked]
>

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 29 Jul 1994 09:52:50 -0700
From:    Ed Kettler <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: HUMOR: Top 10 affects

Blitz (blitzkrieg) becomes a household word, unfortunately related to ad
campaigns.

Ed Kettler                                       [email-masked]

On Fri, 29 Jul 1994, Alan Wild wrote:

> Top 10 Cultural/Societal affects from WWII: (fill in the gaps)
>
> 10. Industries turns to streamlining for commercial appeal.
>     Not only automobiles, but later toasters and refridgerators
>     become "streamlined".
>
>  9. "Hitler" moustache falls out (way out) of fashion.
>
>  8. "Rommel", a favorite name for dogs,... especially for G-Sheps.
>
>  7.
>  6.
>  5.
>  4.
>  3.
>  2.
>  1.
>
> -----------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Alan Wild, LAN Mgr.  Father of 1.8815          Voice:          (401) 792-2611
> ACC - Lippitt - URI  American Legion Post 102. FAX:            (401) 792-5479
> Kingston, RI  02881  NRA Life Member           BITNET:           AWild@URIACC
>                                                Internet: [email-masked]
> -----------------------------------------------------------------------------
>

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 29 Jul 1994 12:31:54 EST
From:    "Chris D. Martz" <[email-masked]>
Subject: In search of a medic

Hi Everyone,

I'm new on this listserv, so bear with me if my question is beyond the scope
of what you're used to.  I am in the process of trying to identify and locate
a US Army medic (name unknown) who was present at the invasion of Zamami Shima
on March 26,1945 by the 1st Battalion, 305th Regimental Combat Team, 77th
Infantry Division, 10th Army.  Two of my middle-aged Okinawan friends were
treated by this soldier, and they would like to find him for the 50th
anniversary to either thank him or his family for what he did for them.

I have narrowed down the list of potential candidates to about 230 enlisted
men who served with the 305th Med.  I would like to narrow the list down
further if I could by locating a personnel list for this particular military
operation.  Does anyone know if medical reports might have been kept on
civilian casualties, and where they might be located?  Any other ideas as to
how I might ascertain what personnel were actually there on that first day of
the invasion (medical personnel, that is)?

I would appreciate any leads you might be able to provide.

Thanks,

Chris D. Martz
[email-masked]

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 29 Jul 1994 13:41:00 -0400
From:    Warren Thompson <[email-masked]>
Subject: HIST: Ju 390 near NYC in '44

TO: Ed Kettler and other interested parties. The same info on this aircraft is
also found in the title below:

        J.R. Smith & Antony L. Kay. GERMAN AIRCRAFT OF THE SECOND WORLD WAR
                [Baltimore, The Nautical & Aviation Publ. Co of America,
                1972]. See p.456.

        NOTE: This was part of the Luftwaffe's develpment of an "Amerika-
              Bomber." As well as conventional bombs, it could also carry a/g
              missiles (Fritz X, Hs 293, Hs 294).

-- Warren

[email-masked]

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 29 Jul 1994 13:45:57 EDT
From:    Steven Vest <[email-masked]>
Subject: Did I miss anything while I was out?

      Folks:

           I just wanted to send up a flare to let everyone know that I'm
(finally) situated and plugged in at my new position and I'm back on the
list.   Did I miss any really good stuff?

Best,

    Steven Vest

------------------------------------------------------------------------
STEVEN VEST            *      "IT SEEMS I WOKE UP IN THE BATHTUB, IN AN
PURDY/KRESGE LIBRARY   *       UNDIGNIFIED POSITION.  MY SCEPTER AND MY
WAYNE STATE UNIVERSITY *       HOLY HENCHMEN GONE." --DAVE GORDON
[email-masked] *       --I DREAMED I WAS CARDINAL RICHLIEU--
________________________________________________________________________

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 29 Jul 1994 15:06:52 -0400
From:    Wendy Slader <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Star of Victory

On Wed, 27 Jul 1994, Adron Coldiron wrote:

> Would anyone know anything about the campaign or event for which the
> Ethiopian 1941 Star of Victory (actually in the form of a German cross with a
> crown on top) was issued. Any comments would be appreciated. Adron Coldiron.
>

I was very intrigued by your inquiry because I recognize your description
of the Ethiopian 1941 Star of Victory as one of the items in my father's
collection of memorabilia from the War.  I now have it.  There are many
things contained within his collection with origins I am not familiar
with.  I  too would be interested in some information about this cross.
Thank you.

Wendy Slader

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 29 Jul 1994 15:18:20 -0500
From:    Mike Yaklich <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Star of Victory

This is just a guess, but the British and pro-Selassie Ethiopian guerilla
forces reconquered Ethiopia from the Italians in a campaign essentially
started and finished in 1941...could the "Star of Victory" be from that?

Mike Yaklich
Pitt

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 29 Jul 1994 16:07:23 -0500
From:    Mike Yaklich <[email-masked]>
Subject: Norway/Enigma

Talking about the possibility of the British pre-empting the German invasion
of Norway, and the role Enigma intelligence might have played in this (which
was the proposition that started this line of discussion), I wanted to mention
that in addition to the fact that the British simply didn't have all the
pieces of the Enigma puzzle (especially the rotor settings which were key
to the whole thing) early enough to make a difference (per the Kahn book),
it also took some time to get the intelligence evaluation organization
set up well enough to get utilize the tidbits gained in a timely fashion
(Winterbotham goes into this in "The Ultra Secret").  Given the volume of
intercepts pouring in once the British started deciphering Enigma, this
was no little task-- sometimes intelligence evaluation is just as important
as intelligence gathering.

Also, I recall someone on this topic speaking sarcastically about the British
claiming Narvik as a victory.  Let's not confuse the strategic outcome of the
Norway campaign, obviously an Axis victory, with the tactical aspects of the
fighting for Narvik.  There were essentially three phases to this struggle.
The original German invasion, a force of ten of their newest and biggest
destroyers carrying Gen. Dietl and 2,000 well-trained mountain troops (to
be supported if necessary by landing parties from the ships), arrived on the
first day of the Norway operation.  Norwegian defenses consisted primarily
of two old, turn-of-the-century coastal defense cruisers (about the size of
a small light cruiser but totally obsolete) anchored in the harbor.  After
conferring with the captain of one of the Norwegian ships, the Eidswold,
and demanding the surrender of the port (which the Norwegian captain refused
in no uncertain terms), the Germans blew both of the Norwegian vessels out
of the water with a spread of torpedoes, killing or drowning a couple hundred
Norwegian sailors in the process.  The town was then occupied pretty much
without incident.  This could be called the first battle of Narvik.
The British, however, reacted quickly, sending in their own destroyer
flotilla, backed by a battleship (the Warspite, if I recall correctly).
In two successive naval battles they destroyed the entire German naval
force, costing them ten of their best destroyers and thoroughly isolating
Dietl's small German force.  Although they suffered destroyer losses too,
this second phase was a decided British tactical victory.  The Allies then
proceeded to develop a long, perhaps overly-cautious campaign to retake the
port from the German ground troops.  They established their own sizeable base
in the region (at Tromso, I think), and even brought King Haakon back to
Norwegian soil at that location.  From this base a combined British, French,
and Norwegian ground force prosecuted a slow but sure campaign that, despite
criticisms (probably justified in view of the small size and desperate
situation of Dietl's force) of moving too cautiously, retook Narvik in
early June.  It was only events in a completely different theatre, i.e. the
fall of France, that caused the Allies to withdraw from the area, where
Dietl's troops had retreated to the mountains and were hanging on by their
toenails.  This, too, could be termed an Allied tactical victory, undermined
by a strategic defeat.

Anyone interested in a good blow-by-blow of the Narvik naval campaign can
consult Stephen Roskill's "The War At Sea," which I guess is the official
RN history.  Churchill's six-volume history of the war also sheds some light
on the Allied preparations for a Norway campaign, pre-empted by the German
invasion, although Churchill was of course far from a neutral observer.
One other aspect I find interesting was that the Norwegians claim that they
were ready to vigorously defend their sovereignty against all comers, which
would have meant they would have fought the British (in theory) as hard as
they fought the Germans (and they put up a pretty tough defense in many
places, for example the Oslo fiord)...the British seemed to have believed
this wouldn't be the case in regard to their planned ops there...

One last thought while I'm flaming... regarding the 50th anniversary of
the Stauffenberg plot...seems that it would set a pretty bad precedent to
celebrate the attempted assassination of the head of state of one's own
country, particularly one that could make a claim to having at least assumed
office in a more-or-less legal fashion (without wishing to start a flame war,
an analogy would be those who believe FDR's domestic politics led us all
pretty far down the road to ruin pushing for a celebration of the anniversary
of his death next April 12th)

Thanks for listening

Mike Yaklich
Pitt

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 29 Jul 1994 15:37:09 PDT
From:    Sidney Allinson <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: TACT/PROP/OPERATIONS: Doolittle Raid in RVeverse?

There was a British aircraft configuration, too, that used two
"piggy-back" flying boats.Name escapes me at the moment.

--

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 29 Jul 1994 15:39:01 PDT
From:    Sidney Allinson <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: TACT/PROP/OPERATIONS: Doolittle Raid in RVeverse?

Emanuael..
Thanks, you triggered thename now, in my memory.
You confirm my previous post that there was a British "piggy-back"
flying boat configureation.
By the way, it was the MayO.
Regards -- Sidney.

--

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Date:    Fri, 29 Jul 1994 20:32:50 -0400
From:    David Rising <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Staged photographs

Another of these which comes to mind is the famous film sequence of
Hitler dancing a jig when the Nazis conquered France. In fact, a Canadian
film maker took a short clip of Hitler stamping his foot and ran it over
and over making him 'dance'. Cheers,
David Rising

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Date:    Fri, 29 Jul 1994 19:42:27 -0700
From:    Ed Kettler <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: HUMOR: Top 10 affects

and of course, football ...

Ed Kettler                                       [email-masked]

On Fri, 29 Jul 1994, Ed Kettler wrote:

> Blitz (blitzkrieg) becomes a household word, unfortunately related to ad
> campaigns.
>
> Ed Kettler                                       [email-masked]
>
>
> On Fri, 29 Jul 1994, Alan Wild wrote:
>
> > Top 10 Cultural/Societal affects from WWII: (fill in the gaps)
> >
> > 10. Industries turns to streamlining for commercial appeal.
> >     Not only automobiles, but later toasters and refridgerators
> >     become "streamlined".
> >
> >  9. "Hitler" moustache falls out (way out) of fashion.
> >
> >  8. "Rommel", a favorite name for dogs,... especially for G-Sheps.
> >
> >  7.
> >  6.
> >  5.
> >  4.
> >  3.
> >  2.
> >  1.
> >
> > -----------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > Alan Wild, LAN Mgr.  Father of 1.8815          Voice:          (401) 792-2611
> > ACC - Lippitt - URI  American Legion Post 102. FAX:            (401) 792-5479
> > Kingston, RI  02881  NRA Life Member           BITNET:           AWild@URIACC
> >                                                Internet: [email-masked]
> > -----------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
>

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Date:    Fri, 29 Jul 1994 21:57:31 -0500
From:    GEORGE BAUER <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: HUMOR: Top 10 affects

I'm not sure what an affect of war is...  Do you mean effect???

George Bauer
U.S.A.:  [email-masked]

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End of WWII-L Digest - 28 Jul 1994 to 29 Jul 1994
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