Subject: WWII-L Digest - 24 Jan 1995 to 25 Jan 1995

From: Automatic digest processor <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 26 Jan 1995 00:01:58 -0500

There are 47 messages totalling 1470 lines in this issue.

Topics of the day:

  1. Korea references
  2. RAF operations
  3. WHAT-IF: Pearl Harbor-II (2)
  4. BOOK:Charles Whiting (7)
  5. INF : German System of Occupation
  6. TRIV: Hitler's Henchmen program
  7. WHAT-IF: Pearl Harbor (6)
  8. Eastern Front - study tour
  9. INF: 3rd Army Chronology - 26Jan45
 10. Capt. Beach and other writers. (3)
 11. German POW deaths
 12. INF: 50 Years Ago - 26-JAN-1945
 13. Auschwitz
 14. POWs (3)
 15. Book:Himmler
 16. Farewell BBs
 17. TRIV  Hitler's Henchmen Program
 18. WEAP: Battleships (3)
 19. What IF: Panama Canal?
 20. TRIV Hitler's Henchmen Program
 21. Soviet brutality in '45 Germany
 22. Faulty Torpedoes
 23. [INF] USAAF 26 JAN 45
 24. USN
 25. Lend-Lease to Sov via Pacific
 26. TRV:  Hitler's Henchmen Program
 27. deaths of german pow
 28. Ref: Locations: Lobenhausen, Melsorsen, Kassel, Germany
 29. <No subject given>

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 24 Jan 1995 23:30:54 EST
From:    "Cassady B. Craft" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Korea references

Drew, go to your university library and find Paul, T. V.  _Asymmetrical
Conflicts:  War Initiation by Weaker Powers_.  Cambridge Univ. Press,
1994.  He has a pretty good bibliography of Korean War (and a case study/
chapter on it also).

Good luck with the assignment!

Cassady Craft
e-mail [email-masked]
or
[email-masked]

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 25 Jan 1995 12:04:50 +0100
From:    Henrik Olsen <[email-masked]>
Subject: RAF operations

Hi,

A friend of mine, Michael, is interested in the RAF operations over
Nothern Europe during WWII. He is not subscribing to this list.

If anyone has interest/info, please contact him by e-mail:

[email-masked]

Thanks, :-)

Henrik

[email-masked]

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 25 Jan 1995 06:11:00 -0500
From:    Thoams Wildenberg <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: WHAT-IF: Pearl Harbor-II

On Tue, 24 Jan 1995, Steve New wrote:

> You wrote:
>
> >
> >I'd re-phraze the question:
> >
> >What if Nagumo had conducted a follow up attack to destroy the oil
> farm,
> >harbor facilities, etc.
> >
> >What then??
> >
> >
>
> I suspect that the majority of the Pacific Fleet would have been
> recalled to California waters until the facilities in Pearl could be
> repaired or replaced.
>
> Eventually, the rebuilt Pacific fleet would have been sent out to push
> the Japanese back, but with the new production ships fighting in the
> initial stages.  Picture Coral Sea with 5 or 6 fleet carriers, supported
> by 4 or 5 jeep carriers, New Jersey and Missouri.

Yes, but by then Port Morsby and maybe Australia would have been in Jap
hands. Not to mention Guadalcanal.  The "Great" battle of attrition
somewhere in the vast Pacific would have been interesting to say the least!
Don't you agree?

>
> Of course, the Japanese would have been stronger too, and our Navy would
> be in the attack rather than defense position (a more difficult role to
> succeed in) so I suspect that the war would have extended into 1947
> (barring the development __and delivery__ of a-bombs).
>
> --
>
> Steve L. New
> [email-masked]
> Just an armadillo on the shoulder of the information superhighway.
>

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 25 Jan 1995 15:07:51 GMT
From:    Stephen Baldwin <[email-masked]>
Subject: BOOK:Charles Whiting

Ladies and Gentlemen!
I recently bought from a 2ndhand bookshop a book I once started to
read a few years ago (borrowed from a library), but
never finished, namely "Siegfried - The Nazis' Last Stand" by
Charles Whiting I believe.

I have never heard of said author and just wondered whether any
on the list would care to comment on the author, the book, or both...

steve baldwin
[email-masked]

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 25 Jan 1995 16:19:00 +0100
From:    perrin <[email-masked]>
Subject: INF : German System of Occupation

Hi from Paris, France and sorry for our poor english
We are new to this list and very impressed by the exchanges here.
Does any of you, gentlemen, know where we can find some informations about
the different towns-places where the Oberfeldkommandanturen,
Feldkommandanturen, Kreiskommandanturen and Orstkommandanturen were implanted ?
Furthermore, dos any of you know why there was just one Wehrmacht
Kommandantur in this organization ? This WK was in Calais (Northern France)
in 1942 where was also a _normal_ Kommandantur.
This WK 721 is listed in G. TESSIN's _ Verbaende und Truppen der deutschen
Wehrmacht un Waffen-SS 1939-1945 (e. band).
Thanks for any help-comment.

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 25 Jan 1995 09:24:03 -0600
From:    "William L. Huber - SAA" <[email-masked]>
Subject: TRIV: Hitler's Henchmen program

> On Mon, 23 Jan 1995 21:17:11 -0500 Douglass Green said:
> >I am finishing my first read of Speer's book Inside the Third Reich. I saw
> >a peice to TV last night called 'Hitler's Henchmen' where they referred to
> >the book as self serving. I see some of that, but I also see Speer taking
> >responsibility for his actions/inactions during the war.

As a sidebar, for those who saw Hitler's Henchmen on Discovery last
Sunday, did anybody catch the "glaring error"??  First right answer
gets a star next to his name for the rest of the week!

Cheers, Bill Huber / [email-masked]

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 25 Jan 1995 10:28:53 -0500
From:    Lee Windsor u <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: WHAT-IF: Pearl Harbor

Hello Steve,

I'm curious as to when Costello's book was published and what his sources
are.  The excerpt you included implied that the Japanese were unaware of
Barbarossa until after the start date.  It was always my understanding
that the Germans *were* informing the Japanese of their plans and that the
Russian "Sorge" spy ring in Japan was feeding on this information.

Can someone clarify this for me.

Semper Fi

Lee W.

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 25 Jan 1995 10:35:40 -0500
From:    [email-masked]
Subject: Eastern Front - study tour

HI all,

For the fourth year I am organizing several military tours in Russia. One in
particular may be of interest to WWII list members. This will be a detailed
analysis and "staff ride" to battlefields conducted by professional Russian
military historians. Dates 7 to 29 August. It will include the battlefields
all around St. Petersburg, Pskov, Novgorod, Valdai hills, northwest, west,
and southwest of Moscow, and Belgorod - Kursk region. We will also visit some
of the finest military museums in the world and meet with WWII veterans. The
list of specific battles and units to be studied is too long for this note,
but I will be pleased to send it to anyone interested. Hope to see many of
you on the tour.  Please respond to
john sloan
[email-masked]

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 25 Jan 1995 10:49:36 EST
From:    Alan Wild <[email-masked]>
Subject: INF: 3rd Army Chronology - 26Jan45

January 26, 1945
D-Day +234

-26th Inf Div continues along the ridge between the Clerf and Our Rivers
 capturing Marnach and Munhausen.

-90th Inf Div captures Lieler.

-358th Inf Regiment relieves units of the 6th Armored Div.

-III Corps passes control of 90th Inf Div to VIII Corps following the
 adjustment made on 23Jan45.

-87th Inf Div begins relief of 17th Airborne.

-XIX TAC flew 189 sorties, claimed 219 vehicles, 145 railroad cars, and
 13 armored vehicles.

***Source: _Patton's Third Army, A Chronology_ by Charles Province.
   'Apologies for typos; sometimes I'm in a rush,... or having a beer.

Alan Wild, Sr. Prog/Analyst
ACC - Lippitt - URI
Kingston, RI  02881

American Legion, Post 102
I am the NRA.

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 25 Jan 1995 11:08:35 -0500
From:    [email-masked]
Subject: Capt. Beach and other writers.

Is there a bibliography available which lists books by participants in the
war.  Not the leaders and theoreticians, but those with lower echelon
experience.  Writers like Capt. Beach, Eugene Sledge, and Bill Mauldin (Ie.
Participants who could write well enough to keep a sixteen year-old up late
into morning) I'd appreciate a copy.

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 25 Jan 1995 11:11:04 EST
From:    "SGM Robert S. Rush" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: BOOK:Charles Whiting

Charles Whiting, from my perspective, is an author who thrives on
sensationalism.  There are snippets of good in all, but his
conclusions sometimes border on the simplistic.  I realize this
is a bit hard, but really had my blood pressure raised when I
read Siegfried.  Are there any supporters of Whiting out there?
Are my comments out of line, too harsh?

Rob Rush

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 25 Jan 1995 11:33:03 EST
From:    Roger Coon <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: German POW deaths

Let me start by saying that I have only read the reviews of the books
on both sides of the did-Eisenhower-let-1-million-German-Pows-die
argument which is why I am appealing to those more familiar with them
for information.  The rebuttal book came off sounding as though it
was being claimed that 1 million weren't killed but only a few hundred
thousand (all numbers are from my poor, aging, memory.)  Is there something
like a consensus as to how many if any were allowed to die?  I am aware
of allegations that the Soviets deliberately put ex-concentration camp
prisoners in charge of POW camps on the Eastern front with disastrous
results for the POWs but sorting this out from revisionist, anti-holocaust
sentiments has never been in my particular area of interests.  Now,
this discussion has aroused some interest on my part.  Any information
would be appreciated.
As always, thanks in advance,
Brad Coon

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 25 Jan 1995 12:08:58 EST
From:    John Davis <[email-masked]>
Subject: INF: 50 Years Ago - 26-JAN-1945

On 26-JAN-1945, the following occurred -

World War II - The Battlefronts
-------------------------------
Western Front - Operation Blackcock is successfully concluded in the British
2nd Army sector. A small German bridghead remains at Vlodrop, but no immediate
effort is planned to eliminate it. In the U.S. 1st Army sector, the 7th
Armoured Division clears Meyerode. In the 3rd Army sector, elements of the
26th Division clear Fischbach and Marnach. In the XII Corps area, the 4th
Division is being withdrawn from the line. The 5th Division captures
Hoscheiderdickt and Schlindermanderscheid. The 80th Division expands its
bridgehead across the Clerf and also takes Lellingen and Siebenaler. Elements
of the 94th Division clear Butzdorf and drive toward Sinz. In the 7th Army
sector, the 45th Division is virtually out of contact with the Germans and
activity also subsides on the 103rd and 79th Division fronts. In the French
1st Army sector, the U.S. 3rd Division makes substantial gains, clearing
Houssen, Rosenkranz, Riedwihr and also enter Jebsheim.

Eastern Front - The Soviets drive a salient between East Prussia and Danzig as
the 2nd White Russian Front captures Marienberg and reaches the Gulf of Danzig
northeast of Elbing. In Poland, Soviet forces are encircling Thorn and Posen.
The 1st Ukraine Front seizes Hingenburg in Silesia.

Philippines - General Krueger orders a rapid drive on Manila. On Mindoro,
Camina Drome is ready for use by heavy bombers. Japanese resistance in the
Bulalacoa area comes to an end.

=============================================================================

Sources: "United States Army in World War II, Chronology 1941-1945" compiled
by Mary H. Williams, Office of the Chief of Military History, Department of
the Army, "2194 Days of War" by Cesare Salmaggi and Alfredo Pallavisimi,
"Facts On File Yearbook 1945, Person's Index Of World Events" edited by R.L.
Lapica.

Copyright 1995 by John B Davis, ALL RIGHTS RESERVED.

Previous articles are archived at ftp.webcom.com in directory /pub/jbd/www
and can be accessed via the WWW by URL: http://www.webcom.com/~jbd/ww2.html.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
John Davis                Cary, North Carolina              [email-masked]
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 25 Jan 1995 11:18:16 -0600
From:    Cooper Addison <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: BOOK:Charles Whiting

I've read a couple of books by him, most recently -The Battle of Hurtgen
Forest- and when compared with other accounts of the same actions found
him to in accord with what others wrote.  I do find his style to be
slightly tabloidish and he seems to overstate.

Cooper Addison

On Wed, 25 Jan 1995, Stephen Baldwin wrote:

> Ladies and Gentlemen!
> I recently bought from a 2ndhand bookshop a book I once started to
> read a few years ago (borrowed from a library), but
> never finished, namely "Siegfried - The Nazis' Last Stand" by
> Charles Whiting I believe.
>
> I have never heard of said author and just wondered whether any
> on the list would care to comment on the author, the book, or both...
>
> steve baldwin
> [email-masked]
>

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 25 Jan 1995 13:00:03 -0500
From:    David Rising <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Auschwitz

On Tue, 24 Jan 1995, Metod M. Milac wrote:

> A 55 minute video cassette, produced by the National Center for
> Jewish Film at Brandeis University, entitled "Liberation of
> Auschwitz," covers the period from 27 Jan., 3 pm (official Soviet
> Army time of entering Auschwitz complex) until 28 Feb. 1945 and
> many subsequent developments and facts. This video is based entirely
> on the records of the Soviet Army.

Metod, do you know if the footage used is Soviet footage? I am of the
understanding that a lot of the Soviet Auschwitz liberation footage was
staged at a later date (much like that famous film of their two armies
linking). Just wondering.
David Rising

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 25 Jan 1995 13:17:23 -0400
From:    Mike Yaklich <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: WHAT-IF: Pearl Harbor

        My impression (and the only detailed reading I've done on the subject
is Gordon Prange's "Target Tokyo") is that it worked the other way around,
i.e., that Sorge's main contribution was obtaining the information that the
Japanese were not going to attack Russia, but to move south, and passing this
on to the Soviets (as opposed to picking up from the Japanese that the Germans
were planning to attack the USSR).  However, I do remember reading something in
the above source that Sorge narrowly missed being recalled to the Soviet Union
as part of a purge.  Its been a while since I read the book, I'm not sure if
that was earlier than 1941 as part of the "Yezhovshchina" or military purges,
or whether this was part of Stalin's campaign to suppress the "alarmist rumors"
of an impending German attack (I'm aware that Stalin did order the punishment
of some spies whose reports speculated on preparations for Barbarossa).  If I
can find the time I'll go look it up... (it seems to me that Sorge, as a press
attache at the German embassy in Tokyo, would not have needed his Japanese
sources to find out about Barbarossa.  It is true, though, that he did
sometimes pass tidbits on to the Japanese as a way of building networks through
which he could receive information, so perhaps he helped inform some of his
Japanese sources about the upcoming invasion of the USSR).

        Regards

        Mike Yaklich

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 25 Jan 1995 17:55:00 UTC
From:    "Edward S. Miller" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: WHAT-IF: Pearl Harbor

> What if Nagumo had conducted a follow up attack to destroy the oil farm,
 > harbor facilities, etc.

Terry replies:
  > Thank God he didn't.... it would have presented a serious problem for
  > later  supply of warships...  would have been forced to return to the US
  > for  refuelling... etc.

  The problem would have been temporary.  During the war the USN mastered
the art of quickly erecting oil tanks at newly captured bases which had far
less infrastructure and labor than Pearl.  The Seabees could typically
complete a tank farm and big fuel dock within 3 months of a landng.
  Furthermore, excavation of the the huge 6-million barrel Red Hill
underground oil storage chambers at Pearl Harbor commenced in December 1940
and was well along at the time of the attack.  Although the first oil wasn't
stored there until September 1942, it seems plausible that work would have
been accelerated if necessary.

Ed Miller  [email-masked]

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 25 Jan 1995 13:20:55 -0500
From:    David Rising <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: POWs

On Tue, 24 Jan 1995, Charles Mattocks wrote:

> I've also read accounts of the Soviets brutality to the civilian
population ie > women?  Has anyone else heard this?

Yes. The attack on Berlin is a particularly good example, where the
Soviet armies were given free rein for about a week after the city was
taken to rape and pillage as they pleased.

  I understand that
this was mostly conducted > by units from the far east portion of the
Soviet Union.

Sorry, don't know where they came from, but I suspect that their
ethnicity had little to do with it.

  I also read some where > that the Soviets executed any
Soviet Soldier that surrendered, escaped and the > returned to Soviet
lines?

Some were executed outright by Kommisars (sp?), and many others were thrown
into concentration camps. A neighbor of mine back in Toronto had been a
Soviet soldier captured by the Germans, and he came to Canada rather than
face the consequences in the Soviet Union.

Hope this helps,
David Rising

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 25 Jan 1995 13:25:07 -0500
From:    David Rising <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Book:Himmler

On Tue, 24 Jan 1995, William Lippert wrote:

> Hello all!
>    This semester I am taking a class called Nazi Germany.  The professor
> is Dr. Breitman.  He wrote, "Architect of Genocide" - about Himmler and
> the Final Solution.  Anyone ever read it?  Comments?

It's a fantastic book. I envy you taking the class. Please feel free to
pass on interesting tidbits to the rest of us :-). It's really a pleasure
to take a course with people like Breitman rather than just reading their
books. I had an undergrad course with Michael Marrus (well known
holocaust historian) and his depth of knowledge/understanding was simply
amazing.
David Rising

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 25 Jan 1995 17:54:00 UTC
From:    "Edward S. Miller" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Farewell BBs

Julian E Gomez asked

  > What could possibly ram a BB and sink it, rather than being reduced to
  > scrap itself?

This relply is off the WWII track (forgive me, Joe) but according to the
source the first "modern" battleship sunk was the Italian Re d'Italia at the
Battle of Lissa, July 20, 1866.  The account is amusing. The ship stopped
while transferring the admiral's flag to another vessel.  Seeing the
Austrian ship Ferdinad Max bearing down on her and expecting (get this!) to
be boarded, the crew left the main guns unattended.  The Austrian crew were
sent below and the F. Max struck the Re d'Italia at right angles,
penetrating below the water line six feet through armor and wood.  As it
backed away, the Re d'Italia capsized in a few minutes.

Ed Miller   [email-masked]

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 25 Jan 1995 13:18:23 EST
From:    SKIP WILDER <[email-masked]>
Subject: TRIV  Hitler's Henchmen Program

For Bill Huber -
        Re:  Glaring Error.  Several references to Scheer showed a
photgraph of someone else, ya?
        Regards,
 -----------------------------------------------------------
 |    Skip Wilder              |                           |
 |    [email-masked]      |"The road to hell is paved |
 |    FAX (703)528-2103        | with good intentions."    |
 |    McLean, Virginia, U.S.A. |                           |
 -----------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 25 Jan 1995 17:54:00 UTC
From:    "Edward S. Miller" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: WEAP: Battleships

Jorge Merino notes that the final two Iowa classs BBs, Illinois and
Kentucky, were laid down in December 1944 and January 1945.

The accepted US war plan then in effect projected defeat of Japan within one
year of Germany's surrender, i.e., V-J Day was expected in spring 1946 at
the latest.

It still took 3 years to build a BB.  I wonder who the navy expected they
would fight.

Ed Miller  [email-masked]

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 25 Jan 1995 14:04:47 -0400
From:    Mike Yaklich <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: WHAT-IF: Pearl Harbor

        It seems to me that the scenario of Japan attacking the Soviet Union in
1941, instead of moving south against the US, British, et al, would require a
total disavowal of the basic strategic imperatives which drove the dominant
circles in the Japanese Army and government.  The underlying assumption of the
clique which came to power first within the Army, then in the nation
(culminating in the premiership of Tojo), was that the greatest threats facing
Japan in the post-World War I era were Communism/Socialism internally and a
potentially expansionist Soviet Russia externally.  From (Giichi) Tanaka onward
the solution for both problems was seen in expansion.  To build up a modern
military force capable of opposing the USSR, Japan needed to further its own
industrialization.  To do this without further deteriorating the already (in
most cases) deplorable conditions of the Japanese industrial working class,
thereby helping to precipitate revolutionary activity, or without forcing the
peasants to bear the brunt (as happened in the USSR, and also to a certain
extent in eastern European nations such as Hungary and Romania), access to
cheap raw materials was also a necessity.  Furthermore, Japan needed more room
and more food for its population of 100 million crowded on to four small,
mountainous islands with a total land mass roughly the size of California.  To
grow the Japanese economy in the manner indicated without imposing an undue
burden on large strata of its own citizenry, the best solution (to the
generals) seemed to be the adoption of a policy similar to the colonization
efforts of the western powers.  That is, obtain control of areas that
simultaneously provided cheap food and raw materials, as well as a ready market
for Japanese products, especially finished products of Japanese industry.  That
way the whole country prospers, a kind of trickle-down effect helps even the
lowly worker, and the only loser is/are the foreign countries on the receiving
end of the bargain (hey, they make out too because of the exposure to the
racially superior Japanese culture-- remember, "only our Emporer is divine,"
proof enough right there that the sons of Nippon were a cut above all those
inferior other nationalities-- at least that's how it played in Japan).  It was
this mode of thinking that led the Japanese Army, through the Kwantung Army
stationed in China, to forge and enforce its own foreign policy through the
occupation of Manchuria.  This act in turn reinforced the argument, since
Manchuria, a mineral-rich province larger than Japan itself, was then rapidly
industrialized and integrated into the Japanese economy.  Success bred further
efforts, and the real prize, of course, was control of China (preferably
through economic domination and puppet government rather than actual occupation
of more than a few strategic localities).  Unfortunately for the Japanese, the
attempt to apply the Manchurian model to China proper led to what the Japanese
called a "quicksand war,"-- Vietnam on a dramatically larger geographic scale,
which ate up ever greater quantities of men, material, and money without
producing a decisive result.  This led to a further dilemma, which led directly
to Pearl Harbor etc.  The border clashes with the Soviet Union in 1938-39,
ultimately resulting in a fairly crushing local military defeat, confirmed the
Japanese Army's fear of the Russians (hey, a T-26 or a BT-5 was a killer tank
compared to what the Japanese had in 1939-- they also used air-to-air rockets
for the first time in these incidents, and besides the technological
superiority of some of the new Soviet weapons was the fact that in the end they
were simply able to mass more aircraft and armored vehicles than the Japanese
could match-- exactly what the Japanese Army leadership had always feared).
When the western oil embargo hit Japan in the summer of 1941, and the US
demanded withdrawal from China as the price for its relaxation (there was
considerable confusion over whether this meant withdrawal from Manchuria-- by
now a crucial cog in the Japanese economy-- as well.  The Japanese thought it
did), the Japanese government saw essentially two choices.  Either humiliating
withdrawal and a long period of "gaishin-shotan" (literally, "to lick bile and
sleep on kindling," i.e., a period of hardship and sacrifice) domestically, or
an attempt to proceed despite the embargo.  Since the military was still
predicting that the war in China would require three years to bring to a
successful conclusion, and Japan's oil reserves would run out long before that,
and since furthermore the accession to Allied demands with all the loss of face
that would entail was essentially out of the question, the seizure of the
"Southern Resource Area" (mainly Malaya and Indonesia-- the Phillipines and
Burma were added resource sources but even more important to guard the flanks
of these regions) from its western masters became the preferred alternative.
But we should remember that this was undertaken only as a means of allowing the
continuation of the conquest of China, and that the China venture was only
undertaken to create a strategic counterbalance to the threat of the Soviet
Union.  The entire Japanese strategy for World War 2 can be summed up as
attempting to seize the resources they needed, and then defend a perimeter
around them long enough for these areas to be integrated a la Manchuria.  IMHO,
it might have worked had they not gotten overconfidant and over-reached
themselves on land and sea after phase one of this plan esssentially went as
scheduled (although the shortage of merchant shipping and the abysmal lack of
preparations to defend it from submarine attacks would have remained an
achilles heel, with the heart of the "Resource Area" so far from Japan).
Anyway, my .02, much of which is also outlined in Toland's "Rising Sun," among
other places.  But the thing to remember is that the Japanese leadership feared
the Rooskis more than just about anything else.  I might add that I agree with
the previous posts on this topic that pointed out that the strategic
ramifications of a Japanese invasion of the Siberian littoral probably would
have been minimal UNLESS they forced Stalin to terminate his drawing of
reserves from east to the Moscow front in the winter of '41-'42.

        Regards

        Mike Yaklich

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 25 Jan 1995 15:26:06 -0500
From:    "Mr. Scott Hannon" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: BOOK:Charles Whiting

>Charles Whiting, from my perspective, is an author who thrives on
>sensationalism.  There are snippets of good in all, but his
>conclusions sometimes border on the simplistic.  ...
>
>Rob Rush

I've read his _Operation Nordwind_ book closely, and while I think that
overall it's a fair-to-good "popular" history, it does sometimes wander
into what I'd consider sensationalism. He tends to be meager in his
discussion of the operational level of battle, and spends most of his
time either on small unit actions (usually fairly well presented) , or
squables over strategy and orders far to the rear at Army HQ. In short
he focuses on dramatic conflict at the expense of presenting a full
picture of what'd going on. There is very little in the way of OoBs,
battle maps, analysis of operations, etc. The sensationalistic aspects
appear in his opinions regarding just how serious the US-French clash
over orders regarding the retreat from Alsace were to the stability of
the French gov't (such as it was) and the unity of the alliance both
then and post-war. IMO he goes a little overboard in terms of it's
lasting effects.

Scott.
Scott Hannon, Wed Jan 25 1995 ([email-masked])

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 25 Jan 1995 15:29:03 CST
From:    Robert Hohlt <[email-masked]>
Subject: What IF: Panama Canal?

Robert J. Granvin;

When you wrote today:  "... Part of the long term plan included
the capture or destruction of the Panama Canal -- it takes a
LONG time to send ships around the horn. ..."

Do you have any more information on this?  This is very interesting
to me.

The Japanese at times seemed to work miracles with their seamanship.
How did they plan to attack the Panama Canal?  Aircraft carrier
attack?  Could the Japanese have sailed a force though and shot up
one of the Locks?  Maybe sacrifice a ship by scuttling it in a
narrow channel?

What were the Panama canal defenses at the time?

Hmmmmmm? Please tell me more if you have it.

Robert Hohlt, Jr.

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 25 Jan 1995 15:53:56 -0600
From:    Mark J Weber <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: POWs

There are multiple reports of British soldiers and American airmen, who
had been incarcerated in East Prussia, taking up arms against Red Army
rather than allowing themselves to be 'liberated' by same. Allegedly
these men witnessed Red atrocities against civilians and did not trust
the reds. These men allegedly fought their way to the west in company of
retreating/evacuating Germans.
        Among opther sources, see Polish postwar history of Danzig/Gdansk.

--
Dr. Mark J. Weber                       [email-masked]
Department of Management and Economics  tel (w) 612-641-2431
Hamline University                      fax (w) 612-641-2956
1536 Hewitt Ave.                        tel (h) 612-475-2960
St. Paul, MN 55104                      fax (h) 612-476-8309

On Tue, 24 Jan 1995, Charles Mattocks wrote:

> This is getting off the subject that started this dicussion, but didn't the
> Russians "liberate" some POW camps that held US, British and other western
> allies personnel?  I read or heard alot of them never came back after being
> liberated by the Russians?  Is this true?
>
> I've also read accounts of the Soviets brutality to the civilian population ie
> women?  Has anyone else heard this?  I understand that this was mostly conducted
> by units from the far east portion of the Soviet Union.  I also read some where
> that the Soviets executed any Soviet Soldier that surrendered, escaped and the
> returned to Soviet lines?  Any comments?
>
> Chip Mattocks
> [email-masked]
>

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 25 Jan 1995 17:24:00 -0600
From:    "William L. Huber - SAA" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: TRIV Hitler's Henchmen Program

> For Bill Huber -
>         Re:  Glaring Error.  Several references to Scheer showed a
> photgraph of someone else, ya?
>         Regards,
>  -----------------------------------------------------------
>  |    Skip Wilder              |                           |

WE HAVE A WINNER!!!!  YOU WIN AN ALL EXPENSE PAID HOLIDAY IN EUROPE
brochure ACCOMPANIED BY a photo of  HEATHER LOCKLEAR !!!!

For double bonus points and the really BIG GRAND PRIZE description:

Name that misnamed person.  Operators are standing by....

Disclaimer- this contest is in no way affiliated with the publishers
clearing house sweepstakes and any and all similarities are purely
unintentional.

Congratulations Skip!!!  Bill :-) Huber

PS - It was actually Speer who they said this fellow was but since you
were the only person to respond, you win the preliminary prize
described above.  Bill

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 25 Jan 1995 18:28:09 EST
From:    Henry Sirotin <[email-masked]>
Subject: Soviet brutality in '45 Germany

>From the accounts I have read, the breakdown on behavior was not by
ethnicity, but between frontline assault troops, who were generally
well behaved, and follow up units, both reserves and logistic, who were
not. Ethnicity cut across this line: many supply troops were illiterate
laborers from Central Asia, but many tankers were also from this area,
as their smaller stature better fitted them for duty in low silhouette
AFVs. BTW, Soviet "Far Eastern" troops were, ethnically, predominantly          transplanted Europeans.

Henry Sirotin

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 25 Jan 1995 17:18:48 -0600
From:    Greg Kelley <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: BOOK:Charles Whiting

Hey, I can say something positive about Charles Whiting: he's not as bad
as Ladlislas Farago.......

(talk about damning with faint praise!)

                                          Glad To Be Of Service!

                                          Greg Kelley
                                          St. Paul Public Library
                                          [email-masked]

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 25 Jan 1995 15:46:12 -0800
From:    Steve New <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: WHAT-IF: Pearl Harbor-II

You wrote:

>
>On Tue, 24 Jan 1995, Steve New wrote:
>
>> You wrote:
>>
>> >
>> >I'd re-phraze the question:
>> >
>> >What if Nagumo had conducted a follow up attack to destroy the oil
>> farm,
>> >harbor facilities, etc.
>> >
>> >What then??
>> >
>> >
>>
>> I suspect that the majority of the Pacific Fleet would have been
>> recalled to California waters until the facilities in Pearl could be
>> repaired or replaced.
>>
>> Eventually, the rebuilt Pacific fleet would have been sent out to
push
>> the Japanese back, but with the new production ships fighting in the
>> initial stages.  Picture Coral Sea with 5 or 6 fleet carriers,
supported
>> by 4 or 5 jeep carriers, New Jersey and Missouri.
>
>Yes, but by then Port Morsby and maybe Australia would have been in Jap
>hands. Not to mention Guadalcanal.  The "Great" battle of attrition
>somewhere in the vast Pacific would have been interesting to say the
least!
>Don't you agree?
>
>
>>
>> Of course, the Japanese would have been stronger too, and our Navy
would
>> be in the attack rather than defense position (a more difficult role
to
>> succeed in) so I suspect that the war would have extended into 1947
>> (barring the development __and delivery__ of a-bombs).
>>
>> --
>>
>> Steve L. New
>> [email-masked]
>> Just an armadillo on the shoulder of the information superhighway.
>>
>
>
I expect we would have seen the last two Iowa battleships in service, as
well as all four of the next class, if not more yet.  Guadalcanal in
Japanese hands, easy.  Port Moresby and Australia, I'm not so sure.  The
Aussies were a tough nut to crack.

I don't think that the Japanese Army had the strength to take Australia,
they never even completed the conquest of China even with Chaing and Mao
fighting each other as hard as they fought the Japanese.

--

Steve L. New
[email-masked]
Just an armadillo on the shoulder of the information superhighway.

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 25 Jan 1995 18:15:21 EST
From:    Henry Sirotin <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: WEAP: Battleships

Dear Ed,

With your corporate experience, is this question rhetorical?
Who needs an enemy when you have a funded program?

If I can dig out my copy of Vincent Davis, I'll see what he has to say.

Regards,

Henry Sirotin

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 25 Jan 1995 15:56:39 -0800
From:    Steve New <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: WHAT-IF: Pearl Harbor

You wrote:

>
>Hello Steve,
>
>I'm curious as to when Costello's book was published and what his
sources
>are.  The excerpt you included implied that the Japanese were unaware
of
>Barbarossa until after the start date.  It was always my understanding
>that the Germans *were* informing the Japanese of their plans and that
the
>Russian "Sorge" spy ring in Japan was feeding on this information.
>
>Can someone clarify this for me.
>
>Semper Fi
>
>Lee W.
>
>
Lee,

The book was published in 1981.  He's got a bibliography 12 pages long
(in small print) although he doesn't specifically footnote the section
that I quoted from. My best guess from cruising the bibliography is:
Ike, Nabutaka ed. Japan's Decision for War; Records of the 1941 Policy
Conferences,  (Stanford, 1967)

--

Steve L. New
[email-masked]
Just an armadillo on the shoulder of the information superhighway.

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 25 Jan 1995 17:05:13 -0700
From:    Jim O'Neil <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: POWs

>I've also read accounts of the Soviets brutality to the civilian population ie
>women?  Has anyone else heard this?

Yes, Germans took advantage of Russian women and bouyed by propaganda, the
Soviets returned the favor several times over. The German women would have
fought any Soviet invasion fanatically and killed themselves in
considerable numbers before allowing it to happen again, after WW II. This
from talking with Germans while stationed there-it was repeated by many
disparite groups I talked with.

> I understand that this was mostly conducted
>by units from the far east portion of the Soviet Union.

I don't think it was organized to this level-"you guys are the Rape and
Pillage support for the attack" didn't occur to my knowledge.

>  I also read some where
>that the Soviets executed any Soviet Soldier that surrendered, escaped and the
>returned to Soviet lines?  Any comments?

They "distrusted" such soldiers, but did not always kill them immediatly;
some had useful knowledge. After the war many such were eliminated, since
they were no longer needed. I talked to an ex-Soviet soldier, who on being
overrun by the Germans, found it propitious to join their side... he rose
to Ober-Leutnant in the security forces on the East front, commanding other
soldiers who had swapped sides. He was re-captured by the Russians and was
able to convince them that he had been trying to get himself and his men
back to the Soviet side... Since he also was able to share information and
knowledge of how the Germans did things, he was kept around and consulted
regularly. In the late spring of 1945 he found an opportunity to switch to
the American Band Wagon... his fellows were all rounded up at a later point
(he found out later from??) and have not been seen since. He went to work
for the US Intell folks... I got to talk with him when I was 14 and he
worked with my Dad.

Jim O'Neil      They don't pay me enough to fight fair!

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 25 Jan 1995 17:05:55 -0700
From:    Jim O'Neil <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Capt. Beach and other writers.

>Is there a bibliography available which lists books by participants in the
>war.  Not the leaders and theoreticians, but those with lower echelon
>experience.  Writers like Capt. Beach, Eugene Sledge, and Bill Mauldin (Ie.
>Participants who could write well enough to keep a sixteen year-old up late
>into morning) I'd appreciate a copy.

Add Charles McDonald; COMPANY COMMANDER & TO THE SOUND OF TRUMPETS or
something close to that...There are more too, but that's all I can think of
right now.

Jim O'Neil      They don't pay me enough to fight fair!

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 25 Jan 1995 18:25:52 -0600
From:    Chuck Johnson <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: WHAT-IF: Pearl Harbor

> Jim Benn wrote:
> >I've always wondered WHAT IF Japan had not attacked Pearl Harbor, but
> >the USSR instead.  Wouldn't that have made a big difference in the German
> >attack on Russia?  Also, Germany would not have declared war on the US.
> >Was it not in Japan's strategic interest to double-team Russia with
> Germany?

  Steve L. New wrote:
> It could have been a great help to Germany, but the Japanese weren't all
> that interested in helping Germany, they had their own agenda to pursue.
>
> The following is extracted from chapter 5 of John Costello's The Pacific
> War,
> 1941-1945:
>
>
> The Fuhrer's long planned crusade to rid the world of bolshevism,
> while it achieved spectacular military triumphs during its first
> weeks, was to prove a diplomatic disaster....The attack on Russia
> very nearly ruptured the Tripartite Pact on which Japan was
> depending on Germany's aid in maintaining good relations with
> Stalin so as to preclude any threat from Siberia while the Army
> and Navy concentrated on their southward thrust.  Prime Minister
> Konoye felt betrayed because the Germans clearly trusted their
> Axis partners too little to warn them of Barbarossa...

 [good info from Japanese perspective deleted]

  Chuck Johnson wrote:
  Since we're quoting from books, I thought you might be interested
  in the following paragraph from "Blood, Tears and Folly" by Len
  Deighton.  It give a good slate on the German perspective.

  [After describing the planning for "Barbarossa"]:
  "Inexplicably, Hitler did not confide his intentions to his Japanese
  friends, so while his soldiers were preparing to march upon Russia,
  the Japanese were abandoning their ideas of attacking the Soviet
  Union in favour of the 'strike southwards' into the Pacific.  What if
  the Germans and Japanese had coordinated their attacks upon Stalin's
  vast empire, rich with oil and the raw materials they both wanted?
  It is an interesting academic question, though Hitler was convinced
  that he needed no help to crush Russia.  The OKW planners said it
  would be done in eight weeks, ten at most.  Hitler preferred to
  allow the Japanese to get into a fight with the Americans.  In this
  way, the Japanese would be occupied while he plundered the USSR,
  and the Americans would no longer have resources to spare to help
  the British."

  Later in the same chapter, Deighton gives some of the estimates by
  military "experts" of how long the USSR would hold out.  American
  military experts extimated about 3 months while British "intelligence"
  thought the Russians would last about ten days!

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 25 Jan 1995 20:02:03 -0500
From:    Lee Windsor u <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: BOOK:Charles Whiting

Hello Sar-Major

On Wed, 25 Jan 1995, SGM Robert S. Rush wrote:

> Charles Whiting, from my perspective, is an author who thrives on
> sensationalism.  There are snippets of good in all, but his
> conclusions sometimes border on the simplistic.  I realize this
> is a bit hard, but really had my blood pressure raised when I
> read Siegfried.  Are there any supporters of Whiting out there?
> Are my comments out of line, too harsh?
>
> Rob Rush
>
I would tend to agree that Mr. Whiting tends to write on a very basic
level.  From his material that I have read, I doubt very much that he has
made any significant historical discoveries or revelations.  Although I
confess I do not have one of his books in front of me to check his
credentials and sources.

P.S.  I've noticed that Mr. Barone is something of a fan of Kelly's
Heros.  Well Joe, the only thing I can say about this flagrant Hollywood
promotionalism is:

"Its a piece of junk!  The fuel system leaks all over the place!"

Semper Fi

Lee W.

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 13 Jan 1995 16:26:13 -0600
From:    Terrence Lindell <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Faulty Torpedoes

Doug,

In response to your query on sources dealing with faulty torpedoes.  I have
been fascinated in the recent number of books written by submarine officers.
Perhaps you are already familiar with them but didn't list the names.  I
don't have all of the titles or full names with me, but you might find
these interesting if you have not already run across them:

Paul R. Schratz, _Submarine Commander:  A Story of World War II and
   Korea_.  Lexington:  University Press of Kentucky, 1988; rpt., New York:
   Pocket Books, 1990.

Fluckey, Eugene B.  _Thunder Below!_ [war patrols of USS BARB under
   Fluckey's command.  By that time, to torpedo problems might have been
   resolved and he does not give much detail on his prior service.  I believe
   this was published by the University of Illinois Press two or three years
   ago.

Mendenhall, Corwin [I think that is the name].  Published about 4 years ago.
   I don't have the title with me, but it was something like _Submarine
   Diary_.

Ruhe, [William?].  _War in the Boats_.  Published within the last two years,
   perhaps by the Naval Institute Press.  Ruhe saw service in two or three
   boats between 1942 and 1944 in the Pacific before he took command of
   a training sub on the East Coast.

Kane, Richard.  _Wahoo_.  This was written perhaps 8 or 10 years ago [?] and
   it has been quite a while since I have read it.  I seem to remember that
   it is part memoir and part speculative history on what happened to the
   WAHOO after Kane left it for the TANG (about which he has also written).
   The TANG, as you probably know, was sunk by one of its own torpedoes
   (talk about faulty!).

Sterling, Forrest.  _Wake of the Wahoo_.  One of the few enlisted memoirs of
   the submarine war I have seen.  I read this more than 20 years ago and
   don't recall much about it.  Sterling [I hope I have the name right] was
   a yeoman who had the good fortune to transfer from the WAHOO shortly
   before it left for its last war patrol.

There is also an early memoir entitled _Warfish_.  The name Sam Grider seems
familiar, but I haven't read it.

Of these books, Schratz has harsh words on the torpedo situation.  My favorite
line from his book is one I quote to my WWII class when I talk about the
submarine war:  "I was only one of many frustrated submariners who thought it
a violation of New Mexico scenery to test the A-bomb at Alamagordo when the
naval torpedo station was available." (p. 54 of the paperback version of his
fine book which I recommend highly).  His book is indexed and there are
numerous references to torpedoes.

You might also want to look at John D. Alden's _U.S. Submarine Attacks during
World War II_ (Annapolis:  Naval Institute Press, 1989), a reference book that
lists all known submarine attacks during the war.  It indicates the number of
hits of the torpedoes fired.  It might be a rough guide to the efficacy of
the torpedoes, but complicated by the fact that there were many factors other
than torpedo malfunction that affected success rates early in the war.

Hope this is of some assistance.  On a personal note, Doug, please give my
regards to Jim Marten of the history faculty at Marquette.

Terry Lindell
Department of History
Wartburg College
Waverly, Iowa  50677
[email-masked]

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 25 Jan 1995 20:20:00 EST
From:    mc killop <[email-masked]>
Subject: [INF] USAAF 26 JAN 45

COMBAT CHRONOLOGY OF THE US ARMY AIR FORCES
FRIDAY, 26 JANUARY 1945
FTP SITES
  1. ftp.rutgers.edu in directory pub/wwii/usaf
  2. byrd.mu.wvnet.edu (129.71.32.152) in pub/history/military/airforce/
     wwii_chronology

AIRCRAFT MENTIONED IN THIS REPORT:
  A-20, Douglas Havoc
  B-24, Consolidated Liberator
  B-25, North American Mitchell
  B-26, Martin Marauder
  B-29, Boeing Superfortress
  C-47, Douglas Skytrain
  P-38, Lockheed Lightning
  P-40, Curtiss
  P-51, North American Mustang

NOTE: A number in parenthesis after a target name indicates the number of
bombers attacking.

CHINA-BURMA-INDIA THEATER

  CHINA THEATER (Fourteenth Air Force): In China, 15 P-51s and P-40s hit
Chenghsien Airfield and locomotives, tracks, and motor transport at Nanking
and Sinsiang.

  HQ AAF (Twentieth Air Force): 2 missions are flown during the night of
25/26 Jan.
  Mission 30: In French Indochina, 25 of 26 B-29s mine Saigon, Camranh Bay
and Phan Rang Bay without loss.
  Mission 31: 41 of 50 B-29s mine the 6 approaches to Singapore harbor and
Penang harbor in the Malayan States and the Pakchan River and Koh Si Chang
Channel in Thailand.

  INDIA-BURMA THEATER (Tenth Air Force): In Burma, 8 fighter-bombers support
ground forces in the Namhkam area; 140+ fighter-bombers hit troops, supplies,
guns, railroad targets, and targets of opportunity at Tangtong, Panghai, Man
Pwe, Kyaunghkam, Mong Pa, Na-lang, Hsenwi, Molo, Mong Tat, Humon, Tonghkan,
Pangnim, Konghsa, Namtu, Namhsan, and in the Nampok area. Transports fly 500+
sorties to advanced bases and frontline areas. The detachment of the 493d
Bombardment Squadron (Heavy), 7th Bombardment Group (Heavy), operating from
Luliang, China, transporting gasoline to Suichwan, China with B-24s, returns
to base at Pandaveswar, India.

EUROPEAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS (ETO)

  STRATEGIC OPERATIONS (Eighth Air Force): 31 of 32 P-51s based in Belgium,
fly an uneventful fighter sweeps over the Heilbronn, Aschaffenburg, Giessen,
and Trier, Germany areas.

  TACTICAL OPERATIONS (Ninth Air Force): In Germany, 27 B-26s bomb the
Euskirchen rail bridge to interdict rail traffic SW from Euskirchen, much of
which comes from Cologne and Bonn. The 3 Tactical Air Commands fly armed
reconnaissance, alert flights, and patrols; the XIX Tactical Air Command
supports US Third Army elements from S of Saint-Vith, Belgium to W of
Saarlautern, Germany.

MEDITERRANEAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS (MTO)

  STRATEGIC OPERATIONS (Fifteenth Air Force): Weather prevents bombing
operations. P-38s fly reconnaissance and reconnaissance-escort missions and
escort RAF supply drop over Yugoslavia.

  TACTICAL OPERATIONS (Twelfth Air Force): In Italy during the night of 25/26
Jan, A-20s fly armed reconnaissance of the Po Valley, bombing Po River
crossings, Ghedi Airfield, and general movement throughout the area; both
the 57th Bombardment Wing and the XXII Tactical Air Command cancel all
operations for the day because of bad weather.

PACIFIC OCEAN AREA (POA)

  AAFPOA (Seventh Air Force): 17 Guam Island-based B-24s bomb Iwo Jima Island
airfields; during then night of 26/27 Jan, the airfields are hit by 9 B-24s
on individual harassment missions.

SOUTHWEST PACIFIC AREA [SWPA, Far East Air Force (FEAF)]: On Luzon Island,
B-24s hit coastal guns on Corregidor Island and in Balete Pass; B-25s bomb
the Cabcaben Airfield area and coastal guns on Carabao Island and A-20s
attack Grande Island coastal defenses at the mouth of Subic Bay. On Mindanao
Island, B-25s bomb Likanan and Sasa and P-38s strafe the same targets and
also hit Padada. A-20s and fighter-bombers, along with a few B-24s, continue
armed reconnaissance and miscellaneous attacks against airfields,
communications, vehicles, coastal guns, town areas, and other targets
throughout Luzon and in the C Philippine Islands. HQ 3d Air Commando Group,
the 3d and 4th Fighter Squadrons (Commando) and the 318th Troop Carrier
Squadron (Commando) move from Leyte Island to Mangaldan, Luzon with P-51s and
C-47s. HQ 90th Bombardment Group (Heavy) and the 321st and 400th Bombardment
Squadrons (Heavy) move from Biak Island to San Jose, Mindoro Island with
B-24s. The 69th Troop Carrier Squadron, 433d Troop Carrier Group, moves from
Biak to Tanauan, Leyte with C-47s. The 386th Bombardment Squadron (Light),
312th Bombardment Group (Light), moves from Tanauan, Leyte to San Jose,
Mindoro with A-20s.

SOURCES:
AIR FORCE COMBAT UNITS OF WORLD WAR II, Office of Air Force History,
  Headquarters USAF, 1961, ISBN 0-912799-02-1
COMBAT SQUADRONS OF THE AIR FORCE, WORLD WAR II, Office of Air Force
  History, Headquarters USAF 1982
THE ARMY AIR FORCES IN WORLD WAR II: COMBAT CHRONOLOGY, 1941-1945 by the
  Office of Air Force History, Headquarters USAF, 1973
THE MIGHTY EIGHTH WAR DIARY by Roger A. Freeman, ISBN 1-85409-071-2

Jack McKillop
USAF (Airways and Air Communications Service)
1955-59

-------------------------------------------------------------------
|  Jack McKillop         |  Those who have long enjoyed such      |
|  Bellcore              |  privileges as we enjoy forget in      |
|  Piscataway, NJ USA    |  time that men have died to win them.  |
|  [email-masked]  |                       FDR              |
-------------------------------------------------------------------

26/0118Z JAN

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 25 Jan 1995 20:28:00 EST
From:    mc killop <[email-masked]>
Subject: USN

>From the US Navy News Service

This Week in the Navy:  Jan. 26, 1942 -- The Japanese
submarine I-173 was sunk by USS Gudgeon (SS 211), the first enemy
naval vessel sunk by a U.S. submarine.

-------------------------------------------------------------------
|  Jack McKillop              |  Those who have long enjoyed such |
|  Bellcore                   |  privileges as we enjoy forget in |
|  Piscataway, NJ USA         |  time that men have died to win   |
|  [email-masked]  |  them.                     FDR    |
-------------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 25 Jan 1995 20:28:02 EST
From:    Henry Sirotin <[email-masked]>
Subject: Lend-Lease to Sov via Pacific

To whomever raised the question (sorry, I deleted the original text),

For the reference that 50% of US lend-lease to Russia in WWII went
via the Pacific on Soviet-flagged ships, see Gerhard Weinberg's
WORLD AT ARMS, p.404, citing Herring's AID TO RUSSIA and Mottle's
PERSIAN GULF CORRIDOR (in the Army Green Book series), the two
standard refs on the subject.

Hnery Sirotin

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 25 Jan 1995 18:56:06 EST
From:    SKIP WILDER <[email-masked]>
Subject: TRV:  Hitler's Henchmen Program

For Bill Huber -
        Of course, my Scheer should be Speer; sorry for the typo.

        Regards,
 -----------------------------------------------------------
 |    Skip Wilder              |                           |
 |    [email-masked]      |"The road to hell is paved |
 |    FAX (703)528-2103        | with good intentions."    |
 |    McLean, Virginia, U.S.A. |                           |
 -----------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 25 Jan 1995 17:58:56 -0800
From:    Jim Curry <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: deaths of german pow

Hello,Keith!
"Other Losses" may be interesting but it certainly isn't trustworthy.
Bacque's thesis and supporting arguments were shredded by Stephen Ambrose
and other scholars in "Eisenhower and the German POWs: Facts Against
Falsehood" (Louisiana State University Press,1992).  If you haven't
read this yet,you certainly ought to.
Jim Curry

On Mon, 23 Jan 1995, Keith Johnson wrote:

>      An interesting book to read concerning the deaths of German POW in
> Europe is:
>
>      "Other Losses: the shocking truth behind the mass deaths of disarmed
> German soldiers and civilians under General Eisenhower's command" by
> James Bacque 1991
>
>      German POW interned in the United States were also killed
> intentionally. At a POW camp in Salina, Utah, a guard machine-gunned
> prisoners of war sleeping in their tents, killing eight and wounding others.
>
>      I have never come across a definitive work on the German POW
> experience in the Soviet Union; however, for a history paper in college,
> I researched this subject as best as I could. About 1 1/2 million died
> during their internment and another 2 million are unaccounted for.
>
>      Keith
>

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 25 Jan 1995 21:23:24 EST
From:    Henry Sirotin <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Ref: Locations: Lobenhausen, Melsorsen, Kassel, Germany

Try the COLUMBIA GAZETTEER OF THE WORLD at your local library.
It has most population points down to about 2500 around the world
(as of 1962) and cross-references multiple and former names.

HS

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 25 Jan 1995 21:37:40 EST
From:    Henry Sirotin <[email-masked]>
Subject: <No subject given>

I will be going NOMAIL for several days, perhaps a week.

Henry Sirotin

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 25 Jan 1995 21:35:57 -0600
From:    Cheryl Kaye Bryant <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Capt. Beach and other writers.

On Wed, 25 Jan 1995 [email-masked] wrote:

> Is there a bibliography available which lists books by participants in the
> war.  Not the leaders and theoreticians, but those with lower echelon
> experience.  Writers like Capt. Beach, Eugene Sledge, and Bill Mauldin (Ie.
> Participants who could write well enough to keep a sixteen year-old up late
> into morning) I'd appreciate a copy.
>
I too am interested in books written by those who experienced the events
as they happened, and not just through research.  I, myself, can only get
the stories through research, but there is something added when the
writer was actually involved.

C.K. Bryant

*******************************************************************
"The Riskier the road, the greater the profit."    / C.K. Bryant
        The 62nd Rule of Acquisition               / W.I.U. English
*******************************************************************

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 25 Jan 1995 22:29:13 -0600
From:    Cheryl Kaye Bryant <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: BOOK:Charles Whiting

On Wed, 25 Jan 1995, SGM Robert S. Rush wrote:

> Charles Whiting, from my perspective, is an author who thrives on
> sensationalism.  There are snippets of good in all, but his
> conclusions sometimes border on the simplistic.  I realize this
> is a bit hard, but really had my blood pressure raised when I
> read Siegfried.  Are there any supporters of Whiting out there?
> Are my comments out of line, too harsh?

No Rob, in fact, you may not be harsh enough.  But who am I to judge, I'm
just a Freshman Composition teacher.

C.K. Bryant

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"The Riskier the road, the greater the profit."    / C.K. Bryant
        The 62nd Rule of Acquisition               / W.I.U. English
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Date:    Wed, 25 Jan 1995 20:29:30 -0800
From:    Ed Kettler <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: WEAP: Battleships

You wrote:

>
>Dear Ed,
>
>With your corporate experience, is this question rhetorical?
>Who needs an enemy when you have a funded program?
>
>If I can dig out my copy of Vincent Davis, I'll see what he has to say.
>
>Regards,
>
>Henry Sirotin
>
>
Dear Henry,

Is this addressed to me or someone else?  It does sound rhetorical!<G>

Regards (but slightly confused),

Ed Kettler
[email-masked]

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End of WWII-L Digest - 24 Jan 1995 to 25 Jan 1995
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