Subject: WWII-L Digest - 5 Jan 1995 to 6 Jan 1995

From: Automatic digest processor <[email-masked]>
Date: Sat, 7 Jan 1995 00:03:10 -0500

There are 38 messages totalling 1166 lines in this issue.

Topics of the day:

  1. ? resources
  2. Smithsonian Contact Needed (4)
  3. INF: USN Chronology 01-06-95 (2)
  4. Neutrals
  5. Largest AAF Strike (2)
  6. "Martyred Villages" (4)
  7. 3rd Army Chronology - 7Jan45
  8. TV series the World at War
  9. NOST: Normandy
 10. Movie "Das Boot" (3)
 11. Fwd: Russian Aircraft Museum
 12. MEDIA:MIAs Home at Last
 13. BOOK: World at Arms (was: TV series the World at War)
 14. WEAP:Japanese Planes? (3)
 15. Death of Billy SHAFER, 7th Army (USA), 63rd Division
 16. Battle of the Bulge (2)
 17. Smithsonian Contact Need
 18. INF: 50 Years Ago - 07-JAN-1945 (2)
 19. Promo 'Das Bird'
 20. WWW page announcement (2)
 21. DOC: "The Invasion of Japan", some thoughts.
 22. ARC: History at USD
 23. INF- 2 quick questions

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 5 Jan 1995 13:31:02 -0800
From:    Sidney Allinson <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: ? resources

THE WORLD AT WAR is an accurate ducumentary about events during the Seco

Second World Wa.

There are no "slants imposed by Sir Laurence Olivier".
he is merely the voice-over, an actor hired to speak the words written in
the script.

Sidney Allinson.

--

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 5 Jan 1995 19:47:13 -1000
From:    John DeVirgilio <[email-masked]>
Subject: Smithsonian Contact Needed

Hello Everybody:

Can anybody give a name, E-mail address, phone number, or postal address to
somebody associated with the Enola Gay exhibit to be opened at the Smithsonian
Museum.   Any information would be of great help.

Thanks,

John DeVirgilio

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 6 Jan 1995 04:00:18 PST
From:    "Keller, Theron P." <[email-masked]>
Subject: INF: USN Chronology 01-06-95

UNITED STATES NAVY CHRONOLOGY
from:
//byrd.mu.wvnet.edu/pub/history/military/wwii/naval_chronology/chr4(4,5).txt

1945
01/06 Sat. Aircraft from fast carrier task force (Vice Adm. J. S.
           McCain) commence 1-day attack on Japanese aircraft and
           airfield facilities in Luzon area, P. I.
            United States naval vessels sunk:
             High-speed minesweeper HOVEY (DMS-11), by aircraft
              torpedo, Luzon area, P.I.,
              16 d. 20'N., 120 d. 10'E.
             High-speed minesweeper LONG (DMS-12), by suicide plane,
              Philippine Islands area,
              16 d. 12'N., 120 d. 11'E.
            United States naval vessels damaged:
             Battleships NEW MEXICO (BB-40) and CALIFORNIA (BB-44),by
              suicide planes, Luzon area, P. I.,
              16 d. 20'N., 120 d. 10'E.
             Heavy cruiser LOUISVILLE (CA-28), by suicide plane,
              Luzon area, P. I.,
              16 d. 37'N., 120 d. 17'E.
             Heavy cruiser MINNEAPOLIS (CA-36), by suicide plane,
              Luzon area, P. I.,
              16 d. 10'N., 120 d. 10'E.
             Light cruiser COLUMBIA (CL-56), by suicide plane,
              Luzon area, P. I.,
              16 d. 20'N., 120 d. 10'E.
             Destroyer NEWCOMB (DD-586), by suicide plane and
              accidentally by United States naval gunfire,
              Luzon area, P. I.,
              16 d. 20'N., 120 d. 10'.E
             Destroyer RICHARD P. LEARY (DD-664), by suicide plane,
              Luzon area, P. I.,
              16 d. 20'N., 120 d. 10'E.
             Destroyers ALLEN M. SUMNER (DD-691) and WALKE (DD-723),
              by suicide plane, Luzon area, P. I.,
              16 d. 40'N., 120 d. 10'E.
             Destroyer O'BRIEN (DD-725), by suicide plane, Luzon
              area, P. I.,
              16 d. 23'N., 120 d. 14'E.
             Destroyer LOWRY (DD-770), accidentally by United States
              naval  gunfire, Luzon area, P. I.,
              16 d. 40'N., 120 d. 10'E.
             High-speed minesweeper SOUTHARD (DMS-10), by suicide
              plane, Luzon area, P. I.,
              16'11 d. N., 126 d. 16'E.
             High-speed transport BROOKS (APD-10), by suicide plane,
              Luzon area, P. I.,
              16 d. 20'N., 120 d. 10'E.

Information compiled by U.S. Navy Historians.  For more information,
contact the Naval Historical Center at (202) 433-3940.
Archived by: "Larry W. Jewell" <[email-masked]>
Posted by:
Theron P. Keller
Logicon, Inc.
Dahlgren, VA  22448 USA
[email-masked]

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 6 Jan 1995 06:56:50 EST
From:    "Steve L. New" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Neutrals

     >While we are on the subject of neutrals and occupieds, does anyone
     >have source info on the respective air forces of the smaller nations
     >during the war? I read once about either the Swiss or the Swedes
     >shooting down German aircraft with ME-109s they had purchased from
     >the Germans.  Also I read with interest the "Honved" postings and
     >would welcome further info.

     >Paul Gregor

     >Kent State

        The Swiss were quite active in protecting their airspace.  If an
     intercepted aircraft refused to surrender, they would attempt to shoot
     it down.

        They received BF-109s from Germany both by purchase, and through a
     deal where they destroyed a captured German night fighter (and it's
     secret radar) and released it's crew for more BF-109s.

        The Swedes did not fly the BF-109.

    Steve L. New
    [email-masked]
    Just an armadillo on the shoulder of the information superhighway.

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 6 Jan 1995 06:33:10 -0600
From:    "Roddy R. Rupert" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Largest AAF Strike

On Mon, 2 Jan 1995, Eric Pass wrote:

> The question was raised about how this might compare in the
> sense of largest number of sorties (daily( of all time).
>
> Perhaps someone could contrast this this with say, the number of
> sorties flown the first night of desert Storm?  This would provide
> a basis for comparison.  Anyone have the numbers handy?
>
> Eric ([email-masked])
>

Page 163 of "Conduct of the Persian Gulf War - Final Report to Congress",
prepared by the Defense Department, shows a graph of the total number of
Coalition aircraft sorties during each day of the war. It is difficult to
precisely read due to the scale of the chart, but here goes:

        Jan. 16 - 2,400 sorties (first day of air war)
        Feb. 25 - 3,200 sorties (highest daily total on the chart)

These numbers should be accurate to within +- 50 sorties.

---------------------------
Rod Rupert
Springfield, MO

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 6 Jan 1995 08:23:14 +0001
From:    Ira H Krakow <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Smithsonian Contact Needed

John,
>
> Can anybody give a name, E-mail address, phone number, or postal address to
> somebody associated with the Enola Gay exhibit to be opened at the Smithsonian
> Museum.   Any information would be of great help.
>
  Contact Don Gourley at

[email-masked]

  Don is the Internet administrator for the Smithsonian.  He should be
able to get you in contact with the right people associated with the
Enola Gay exhibit.

Ira Krakow
[email-masked]

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 6 Jan 1995 08:25:17 +0001
From:    Ira H Krakow <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: "Martyred Villages"

Sidney,

> Your request for a list of villages destroyed by the Germans would
> require a very thick book, indeed.
>

  Is there such a book?

Ira Krakow
[email-masked]

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 6 Jan 1995 09:08:06 EST
From:    Alan Wild <[email-masked]>
Subject: 3rd Army Chronology - 7Jan45

January 7,1945
D-Day +215

-VII Corps sector fighting was heavier North and West of Bastogne. No change
 along the 101st Airborne front, 17th Airborme advances 2 miles.

-XIX TAC grounded due to poor weather.

-3rd Army policy established regarding Allied nationals who'd collaborated
 or served with the Germans. They were to be treated as POWs.

-Rear echelon of the 3rd Army moves to Esch.

-Civil Affairs Section issues intelligence reports identifying widespread
 looting by German troops in the Ardennes offensive.

*** Source: _Patton's Third Army_ by Charles Province
    Typos are mine. 'Apologies.

Alan Wild, Sr. Prog/Analyst
ACC - Lippitt - URI
Kingston, RI  02881

I am the NRA.

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 6 Jan 1995 08:35:32 -0600
From:    Drew Halevy <[email-masked]>
Subject: TV series the World at War

I recently bought the book that goes along with the World at War, and I
was not to happy with it as a source on the war. I have now started
reading A World at Arms, and I like it so far. Has anyone else read this
book?-Drew

Drew Philip Halevy      |
Grad Student            | The main thing is to make history,
Department of History   | not to write it.
University of Arkansas  | Otto von Bismark
[email-masked]   |

On Thu, 5 Jan 1995, Sidney Allinson wrote:

> THE WORLD AT WAR is an accurate ducumentary about events during the Seco
> Second World Wa.
> There are no "slants imposed by Sir Laurence Olivier".
> he is merely the voice-over, an actor hired to speak the words written in
> the script.

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 6 Jan 1995 09:42:27 -0500
From:    Ron Babuka <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: INF: USN Chronology 01-06-95

>UNITED STATES NAVY CHRONOLOGY

>1945
>01/06 Sat. Aircraft from fast carrier task force (Vice Adm. J. S.
>           McCain) commence 1-day attack on Japanese aircraft and
>           airfield facilities in Luzon area, P. I.

>            United States naval vessels damaged:

>             Destroyers ALLEN M. SUMNER (DD-691) and WALKE (DD-723),
>              by suicide plane, Luzon area, P. I.,
>              16 d. 40'N., 120 d. 10'E.

This morning I called up my father to wish him a happy 70th birthday.
After  some small talk I asked him if he recalled what happened 50 years
ago today, and he said that he remebered this as clear as it was just
yesterday.  My father was a Fire Control technician on the Allen M. Sumner
(DD-692 not 691) and had been in the middle of a running firefight with
suicide planes for over two hours.  These aircraft were attempting to
complete a two fold mission, the first being penetration of the outer
screen of destroyers in hopes of crashing into the carriers of the Task
Force and the second being destroying the screen of picket duty destroyers
themselves.  On this day his battle station was in the main battery
director, having just finished his normal two week rotation on the port
quad 40mm director. He was switching from one aircraft that was in too
close for the main battery 5"-38 guns to engage another Japanese aircraft
several thousand yards out that was attempting destroy his ship.  Even
though the main battery guns were not able to down the aircraft heading
right at his ship, he had to concentrate on the next target and hope that
the inner defense of 40mm and 20mm cannons (and luck) would finish the job.
 In a matter of seconds from switching over to the new target, the main
battery gunnery officer called out over the intercom that they had hit
their target.  My father slewed the main battery director (and the guns)
back over to the port side in hopes of picking up their original target
both visually and via radar when the ship heeled hard over to port.  The
sea arround the ship literally rose out of the water as the original target
began to strafe his ship. The sounds of cannon shells and machine guns
riveting holes in his ship seemed to slow down everything into movie-like
frames.  He had a split second to look up through a viewing hatch in front
of him to see an older model Zero fighter with a bomb attached underneath
fly about 10 feet over his head.  A loud screaching noise followed as the
Zero tore through the first smoke stack and then dove into a torpedo mount
midway of the ship.  My father remebered fondly today that his best friend
was a torpedoman on that mount that never lived to see his next birthday.
The ships entire damage control team was instantly killed by the concussion
of the explosion some 40 feet down ship.  The crew was able to initiate
quick and prompt damage control action and limp back to a naval base for
some patches and temporary repairs.  During the initial repairs, the ships
crew also had discovered that the 500 lb bomb attached underneath the
aircraft had lodged deep in the bowls of the ship and had been kind enough
to remain unexploded.  Had that bomb exploded, the ship surely would have
broken in two.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ron Babuka
Cornell University
CIT - Information Resources
Ithaca, New York 14850
(607) 254-6492

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 6 Jan 1995 08:55:45 -0600
From:    "William L. Huber - SAA" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: "Martyred Villages"

> Your request for a list of villages destroyed by the Germans would
> require a very thick book, indeed.
>
> For every well-known incidence -- Lidice, say -- there are a hundred
> now-ignored such sad places.

Sidney has pretty much summed it up perfectly.  Max Hastings in his
book _Das Reich_ relates the feelings of the SS when they first saw
the reports in the Allied press about their Ourador "operation".  The
article showed the outrage of the Western Allies over the slaughter of
French civilians.  The SS were amazed that it got such attention
because it was insignificant in comparison to what the division had
done in Russia.

Cheers, Bill Huber / [email-masked]

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 6 Jan 1995 16:06:31 CET
From:    "COL Donnell, Doug" <[email-masked]>
Subject: NOST: Normandy

Hello to everyone on the list and Happy New Year.  I've been lurking in
the shadows for a while and too busy to make any meaningful contributions
to the list, but, as always, have enjoyed the reading.

I wanted to pass along a few comments regarding a trip I made to Normandy
a few months back.  The French did a marvelous job of sprucing up the
area for the 50th anniversary -- lots of new signs, repaved roads, parking
lots, etc.  Also, the area seems a lot more "tourist friendly" than it was
years ago (my last visit was about 15 years ago) -- by that I mean
availbility of rooms, new museums, exhibits, etc -- the people have always
been friendly.

If anyone is planning a trip, I have quite a bit of info on opening times
of museums, places to see, and so on that I would be glad to share.  Just
e-mail direct.

                                Doug Donnell
                                Ruppertsweiler, Germany

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 6 Jan 1995 15:49:36 CET
From:    "COL Donnell, Doug" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Movie "Das Boot"

Das Boot - both original with subtitles and dubbed versions are available
for $19.95 ea from Critics' Choice Video 1-800-367-7765.

                          Doug Donnell
                          Ruppertsweiler, Germany

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 6 Jan 1995 08:01:21 -0500
From:    James E Irwin <[email-masked]>
Subject: Fwd: Russian Aircraft Museum

Maybe someone here can help this man?

John Sloan perhaps?

Jim

Received: from uga.cc.uga.edu by dpsc.dla.mil (5.61++/1.34)
Reply-To: The Aircraft Discussion List <[email-masked]>
Sender: The Aircraft Discussion List <[email-masked]>
From: NORMAN Brent <[email-masked]>
To: Multiple recipients of list AIRCRAFT
              <[email-masked]>

Has anyone out there seen a good book about the Soviet Aircraft Museum at
Monino? I saw one book, but it was in Japanese. The photographs were very
good. Lots of interesting aircraft there, as well as some of the early
prototypes and record setting planes. I would like to scrape up enough money
and plan a trip to there. I am still trying to visit the American Plane
Storage (DM Airbase).

Brent Norman
[email-masked]

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
 James E. Irwin (Jim)                  Internet address:
 Defense Personnel Support Center        [email-masked]
 2800 S. 20th Street                   215-737-3678
 Philadelphia PA  19101-8419           Autovon 444-3678

                     "Never in the field of human conflict
                     was so much owed by so many to so few."
                               Winston S. Churchill
----------------------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 6 Jan 1995 11:40:05 EST
From:    Mike Fetters <[email-masked]>
Subject: Smithsonian Contact Needed

Hello John, I'm in the museum's Office of Public Affairs. I should be
able to answer most questions related to the upcoming exhibition "The
Last Act: The Atomic Bomb and the End of World War II." The exhibition
is scheduled to open in late May 1995. Note to everyone on the group: I
come in friendship and in the interest of positive information exchange
and constructive dialogue. I know some of you have expressed strong
feelings about this exhibition over the past months, and that's the
primary reason I've decided to join the group. I hope I can provide
background information that will help each of you make informed
decisions about the upcoming exhibition. I also look forward to
providing you with updates about the exhibition's opening. For instance,
will the museum go to a free, timed pass system for admission (as we did
with the "Star Trek" exhibition)? At the same time, I hope I can provide
information about the other museum services available to you all.
Thanks.....Mike Fetters

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 6 Jan 1995 09:36:48 -0500
From:    James E Irwin <[email-masked]>
Subject: MEDIA:MIAs Home at Last

>From the DoD Newswire 6 January 1995

:WWII FLIERS FINALLY BURIED

   ARLINGTON, Va.  -- For 50 years Don Weiss was mostly a
mystery to his only daughter: a smiling pilot in an Army photograph,
one in a long list of names of young American men who never came
home from war.
   On Wednesday, Sue Ann Reisdorph watched as Lt. Col. Don L. Weiss
and three of his crewmen came home.
   Mrs. Reisdorph, who was six months old when her father's B-26
bomber was shot down over France in World War II, held a folded flag
as Army gunners saluted a single casket at Arlington Memorial
Cemetery.
   The casket held the remains of Weiss, copilot Axel "Pete"
Slustrop, bombardier David Meserow and navigator George H. Hazlett
Jr.
   "The best part of it for me was we were able to complete things,
to give closure in such a dignified way," Mrs. Reisdorph said after
the simple burial service under cold, clear skies.
   She traveled from her home in Spring Hill, Fla., for the service,
joining more than 40 relatives of the four fliers. Others traveled
from New York, Maine, Iowa, Massachusetts, Oregon and Illinois.
   "It's another chapter, the last chapter," Mrs. Reisdorph said.
   The crewmen were members of the 386th Bombardier Group based in
England. Weiss, of Denison, Iowa, was 29 when the twin-propeller
plane was shot down on June 22, 1944 over Caen, France. Slustrop, of
Portland, Ore., and Meserow, of Oak Park, Ill., were 22. Hazlett, of
Belmont, Mass., was 24.
   The body of a fifth crewman was found shortly after the crash.
Remains of three others on the plane were never found.
   Several years ago, Mrs. Reisdorph began looking for answers,
eventually travelling to see her father's name inscribed on a
memorial in Normandy, France, and contacting some of his wartime
friends.
   In 1986, bone fragments and bits of ammunition turned up in a
pasture near Caen. Army experts found bits of leather flight
jackets, several shoes, the dial of an altimeter, and a ripped name
tag.
   In November, the Pentagon told family members that Weiss,
Meserow, Hazlett and Slustrop were no longer among the 79,000
Americans missing from World War II.
   "It was quite an amazing phone call," said Meserow's son, David
Sauer.
   Like Mrs. Reisdorph, Sauer was a few months old in 1944 and never
met his father. Sauer's name was changed when his mother remarried.
   "It was important for me, and for my mother," said Sauer, of
Mobile, Ala. "She only had telegrams, not a visit from the Army to
tell her for sure that he was dead. When someone is missing, you
never are certain what happened."
   The crew would be old men now, like many of those who stood in
bright, cold sunshine Wednesday to bury them.
   Warwick Clark smoothed his gray hair in the chill wind and
saluted after six horses drew the caisson toward the hillside
gravesite.
   Earlier, the retired Air Force officer thumbed through
memorabilia of the 386th Bombardier Group during a brief memorial
service. Clark said his bunk was close to Slustrop's at the bomber
group's home base in England.
   "I had loaned him a pair of my pants, and I think he was wearing
them that day," Clark said. "I have always wondered about what
happened to that crew."

========

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
 James E. Irwin (Jim)                  Internet address:
 Defense Personnel Support Center        [email-masked]
 2800 S. 20th Street                   215-737-3678
 Philadelphia PA  19101-8419           Autovon 444-3678

                     "Never in the field of human conflict
                     was so much owed by so many to so few."
                               Winston S. Churchill
----------------------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 6 Jan 1995 09:21:33 U
From:    Henry Herz <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Largest AAF Strike

        Reply to:   RE>>Largest AAF Strike

Page 163 of "Conduct of the Persian Gulf War - Final Report to Congress",
prepared by the Defense Department, shows a graph of the total number of
Coalition aircraft sorties during each day of the war. It is difficult to
precisely read due to the scale of the chart, but here goes:

        Jan. 16 - 2,400 sorties (first day of air war)
        Feb. 25 - 3,200 sorties (highest daily total on the chart)

These numbers should be accurate to within +- 50 sorties.
---------
One must be careful with these numbers because sorties can be a misleading
measure of combat power.  Firstly, these probably include sorties by aircraft
of all types (tanker, transport, electronic warfare and other support
aircraft -- I don't know if it includes helos, though).  Secondly, sorties
are sometimes counted strangely.  For example, if a transport aircraft flies
from base A to base B to base C and back to base A, I believe this is counted
as four sorties, not one.  Just a helpful caveat.

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 6 Jan 1995 12:27:44 EST
From:    "H. Emery Ford" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: BOOK: World at Arms (was: TV series the World at War)

On Fri, 06 Jan 95, Drew Halevy wrote:

>I recently bought the book that goes along with the World at War, and I
>was not to happy with it as a source on the war. I have now started
>reading A World at Arms, and I like it so far. Has anyone else read this
>book?-Drew

I really enjoyed this book.  The perpective Weinberg gives on the roles of
the nations outside of the major combatants is very refreshing. The
things I found most enlightening were:

1.  The portrayal of the relationship between Germany and Japan with
respect to the Soviet Union.

2.  The struggle of the British Empire to maintain its colonial empire
in Europe and Asia.

Emery

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 6 Jan 1995 12:55:05 -0400
From:    Mike Yaklich <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: WEAP:Japanese Planes?

        For Thomas Wildenberg:

        The D4Y was a carrier-based dive bomber.
        The first letter in Japanese naval aircraft designations indicated
type:
        A= carrier-based fighter
        B= carrier-based level/torpedo bomber
        C= carrier-based reconnaisance
        D= carrier-based dive bomber
        E= reconnaisance floatplane
        F= observer floatplane
        G= land-based heavy bomber
        H= flying boat
        K= trainer
        J= land-based fighter
        L= transport
        M= experimental aircraft
        N= floatplane fighter
        P= land-based light bomber
        Q= anti-submarine aircraft

As far as I know these were the only types actually built, although there was
an "R" (land-based reconnaisance) and an "S" (?) designation reserved.  The
second letter in the Japanese designation system indicated manufacturer by
first letter of name (eg, in "D4Y" Y=Yokosuka, in the A6M "Zero" M=Mitsubishi).
The only wierd one in there was that the Kyushu naval arsenal, formerly the
Watanabe factory, retained manufacturer designation "W". (eg, "Q1W").  Note
that letters easily mistaken for western numerals, like "I" and "O", were
omitted from the scheme.  Also note that these type prefixes were sometimes
added to the end of the designation for aircraft modified from original type.
For instance, the floatplane "Zero" became the A6M2-N, the final end indicating
floatplane fighter version (the numbers were of course different models, and
the second number different variants of a particular model).  Also the "Shiden"
fighter developed from the "Kyofu" floatplane fighter got the designation
N1K1-J, since the new variant was a land-based fighter, etc.

Japanese army aircraft all had the prefix "ki" followed by a number, regardless
of type ("ki" being short for "hikoki" or "airplane").

One last trivia bit on the D4Y, although it was a dive-bomber the first two to
see action (at least that I know of, all this is from memory) were employed as
carrier-based reconnaisance aircraft during the battle of Midway (June '42).

Regards

Mike Yaklich

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 6 Jan 1995 12:26:43 CST
From:    "SCHERRER, TIM" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Movie "Das Boot"

Congrats on your promotion to COL----this is the first I've noted it
being an O-6!  TAS

************************************************************************
*  Tim A. Scherrer          "You'll be fighting WWII for the rest of   *
*  Facilities Supervisor     your life", Ron Scherrer, 1971            *
*  WP:816-785-5253                                                     *
*  HP:816-665-6704                                                     *
*  ID# [email-masked]                             *
************************************************************************

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 6 Jan 1995 11:31:09 -0800
From:    Jack Taylor <[email-masked]>
Subject: Death of Billy SHAFER, 7th Army (USA), 63rd Division

I am new to the WWII-L mailing list and this is my first query.  I hope it is
appropriate.  I am a genealogist and am writing a book on my family
history.  My cousin was supposedly killed at the Battle of Bulge. I am
trying to find out the circumstances under which he was killed.  I have
very little information to go on other than the following:

Name: Billy Curtis SHAFER  Born: 2 August 1925 in Momence, Kankakee
Co., Illinois  Enlisted: 4 Sep 1944  Rank: Private   Attached 7th Army, 63rd
Division  His mother recieved a telegram that he had been Killed In Action
on 12 April 1945.

I have the original telegram and a picture of him in uniform.  Supposedly
he was killed in Germany.  He is buried in the National Cemetery in
Springfield, Illinois.  His mother and father died many years ago and his
sister is not aware of the circumstances of his death.  I am interested in
any information I can get on him or his unit.  It is quite possible that
someone who knew him or was in his unit is still alive.  How would one
go about gathering information on him?  Any comments or suggestions
would be appreciated.

I can be reached by E-mail at:  [email-masked]

or snail-mail: Jack Taylor  10388 Krista Court   Cupertino, California
95014

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 6 Jan 1995 13:57:52 -0600
From:    "Tim J. Watts" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Battle of the Bulge

I confess up front that I know little about the Battle of the Bulge, but
I had always thought that the Allies won because improved weather allowed
air support.  But I have noticed in the last two weeks in the USAAF
chronology and the 3rd Army Chronology that the weather really wasn't that
much better.  I guess what I have come to realize is that close-air support
may have helped, but it was still the guys on the ground that went toe-to-
toe with the Germans that won the battle.  Thanks, guys, for clearing up
that myth in my foggy brain.

Tim J. Watts
Valparaiso University

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 6 Jan 1995 11:31:14 U
From:    Henry Herz <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Smithsonian Contact Need

        Reply to:   RE>Smithsonian Contact Needed

Can anybody give a name, E-mail address, phone number, or postal address to
somebody associated with the Enola Gay exhibit to be opened at the
Smithsonian
Museum.   Any information would be of great help.

Thanks,

John DeVirgilio

John-

The Smithsonian Office of Printing & Photographic Services can be reached at
the following email: [email-masked].  They have an FTP server with WW II
aircraft (and other) photos.  Enjoy.

-Henry

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 6 Jan 1995 15:35:28 -0500
From:    "Steven Pudlo, Dept. Computer Svcs." <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Smithsonian Contact Needed

To Mike Fetters, Smithsonian Museum;

I'm glad you have elected to become a part of the list, and that the
SI is toning down it's PC exhibit.

I had a really tough time deciding to renew my SI and NASM memberships,
and it was contributors like those form this list that tipped the scales,
not all those cutsey articles.

I would really much like to see the SI reclaim it's rightful place as the
authorative source for research and information without political slant.

Please reassure me that there IH hope.

Thanx                                                           Steve

-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Steven E. Pudlo  - [email-masked] |"Life may be a drag...
STC Programmer/Analyst - (203) 885-2343  |    But it sure beats the
Three Rivers Community-Technical College |       only known alternative"
574 New London Turnpike                  |                     (S.E.P.)
Norwich, CT. U.S.A. 06360                |No one gets out of it alive..
-----------------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 6 Jan 1995 13:59:27 -0800
From:    John Davis <[email-masked]>
Subject: INF: 50 Years Ago - 07-JAN-1945

On 07-JAN-1945, the following occurred -

World War II - The Battlefronts
-------------------------------
Western Front - In the British 2nd Army sector, the 53rd Division captures
Grimbiermont. In the U.S. 1st Army sector, co-ordinated attacks by the 2nd
Armoured and 84th Infantry Divisions toward the Laroche-Salmchateau road
make good progress. Dochamps and Marcouray are captured and only rear
guards remain in the Consy area. The 3rd Armoured Division takes Regne,
Verleumont, Sart and Grant Sart. The 82nd Airborne Division captures
Goronne, Farniers, Mont and Rochelinval. In the 3rd Army sector, the 87th
Division continues its attack on Tillet and is also engaged in the Bonnerue
area. The 17th Airborne Division takes Rechrival, Millomont and Flamierge
and reach the outskirts of Flamizoulle. The 6th Armoured Division remains
under strong pressure in the Neffe-Wardin area east of Bastogne. The 35th
Division makes a limited attack toward the Lutrebois-Lutremange road,
halting just short of it.

In the 7th Army sector, the 45th Division, on the left flank of the Bitche
salient, reaches heights overlooking Althorn and overcomes final resistance
within Wingen. In the Gambsheim bridghead area, efforts of the 79th
Division to clear Drusenheim are unsuccessful. The 3rd Algerian Division
takes over the attack toward Gamsheim from Kilstett.

Eastern Front - In Hungary, the Germans continue efforts to relieve the
Budapest garrison, which is being methodically destroyed and capture
Esztergon, northwest of the city.

Philippines - Underwater demolition teams begin the search for underwater
obstacles in Lingayen Gulf as the preinvasion aerial and naval bombardment
of Luzon continues. On Mindoro, Japanese planes are for the first time
consipicuously absent from the San Jose area.

=============================================================================

Sources: "United States Army in World War II, Chronology 1941-1945" compiled
by Mary H. Williams, Office of the Chief of Military History, Department of
the Army, "2194 Days of War" by Cesare Salmaggi and Alfredo Pallavisimi,
"Facts On File Yearbook 1945, Person's Index Of World Events" edited by R.L.
Lapica.

Copyright 1995 by John B Davis, ALL RIGHTS RESERVED.

Previous articles are archived at ftp.webcom.com in directory /pub/jbd/www
and can be accessed via the WWW by URL: http://www.webcom.com/~jbd/ww2.html.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
John Davis                Cary, North Carolina                 [email-masked]
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 6 Jan 1995 23:29:19 +0100
From:    Emmanuel Gustin <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: WEAP:Japanese Planes?

On Fri, 6 Jan 1995, Mike Yaklich wrote:

> As far as I know these were the only types actually built, although there was
> an "R" (land-based reconnaisance) and an "S" (?) designation reserved.

There was a Yokosuka R2Y Keiun land-based reconaissance aircraft, but it
flew only once before it was destroyed. The S was for nightfighters;
there was an Aichi S1A, and it was also often used as suffix (J1N1-S,
D4Y2-S). Not in your list is "P" for bombers, as in Yokosuka P1Y Ginga.

> Japanese army aircraft all had the prefix "ki" followed by a number, regardless
> of type ("ki" being short for "hikoki" or "airplane").

I thought "Ki" was for "Kitai", airframe. But I'am not very educated in
Japanese :-).

Emmanuel Gustin

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 6 Jan 1995 23:38:21 +0100
From:    Emmanuel Gustin <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: WEAP:Japanese Planes?

Some more detail on the Yokosuka D4Y 'Suisei':

  The Yokusaka team studied the imported Heinkel He 118 dive-bomber
  prototype before developing the D4Y. Japan had bought a license for the
  production of this aicraft, but that was abandoned after the prototype
  was lost. Yokosuka developed an streamlined, fast dive bomber inspired
  by the He 118. It was first flown in November 1940. The wing of the
  D4Y was somewhere between the mid-wing and low-wing position, to make
  room for an internal bomb-bay. Performance was high, but in dives the
  D4Y suffered from wing flutter.

  The first production version was the  D4Y1-C reconaissance aircraft.
  Two were embarked on Soryu when this carrier was sunk in the battle
  of Midway. Production of the D4Y1 dive bomber began in March 1943.
  About 170 (140 D4Y1s and 30 D4Y1-Cs) participated in the Battle of
  the Phillippine Sea; almost all were lost. The D4Y1 and D4Y2 lacked
  protection for the crew and engine; the Atsuta engine, a copy of
  the Daimler-Benz DB601, was unreliable. There was also a night-fighter
  version, the D4Y2-S. A few dozen were  built, with angled 20mm cannon.

  The D4Y3 was powered by a more powerful, less vulnerable and more
  reliable Mitsubishi Kinsei 62 radial. This version operated almost only
  from land bases. 556 were built. The D4Y4 was a suicide attack version of
  the D4Y3, carrying 800kg of explosives; about 300 were built. On 15
  August 1945, a D4Y4 flew the last suicide mission of the war. The
  armoured D4Y45 version was under development when the war ended.
  Total production was 2038.

  A D4Y2 is now in a museum next the Yasukuni temple in Tokyo. This is the
  only complete surviving example.

Type        D4Y1          D4Y2          D4Y3          D4Y4
            ----------------------------------------------------
Role        dive-bomber   dive-bomber   dive-bomber   suicide
Crew        2             2             2             1
Engine      Aichi         Aichi         Mitsubishi    Mitsubishi
            Atsuta 21     Atsuta 32     Kinsei 62     Kinsei 62
            1200hp        1400hp        1560hp        1560hp

Wing Span   11.49m        11.49m        11.50m        11.50m
Length      10.22m        10.22m        10.22m        10.22m
Height       3.67m         3.74m         3.74m         3.74m
Wing Area   23.6m2        23.6m2        23.6m2        23.6m2
Empty W.    2565kg        2565kg        2501kg
Normal W.   3650kg        3835kg        3754kg
Max. W.     4361kg        4353kg        4657kg        4733kg
Max. Speed  298kn         313kn         310kn
     at:    4750m         5250m         6050m
Cruise Sp.  230kn         230kn         180kn
     at:    3000m         2000m         3000m
Climb       600m/min      820m/min      820m/min      820m/min
Ceiling     9900m         10700m        10500m
Range:
  Normal     850nm         790nm          890nm
  Max.:     2100nm        1945nm         1560nm
Bomb load:
  Normal    310kg         310kg         310kg         800kg
  Max       560kg         560kg         560kg
Guns:
  All versions had two forward-firing 7.7mm on the engine cowling.
  Flexible rear-firing 7.92mm or 13mm gun. Angled fixed 20mm
  gun in nightfighter version.

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 6 Jan 1995 17:54:12 EST
From:    Henry Sirotin <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: "Martyred Villages"

Dear Ira,

One section of the walls of the Holocaust Museum in Washington are
inscribed with the names of Jewish communities annihilated by the
Nazis, so there is some sort of list, somewhere; probably at Yad
Vashem. I've never seen a book. as such, but you might try the
YIVO Research Institute in NYC. Give them time, though- they are
moving and may not yet be unpacked.

Henry Sirotin

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 6 Jan 1995 17:42:26 EST
From:    Alan Wild <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Battle of the Bulge

"Tim J. Watts" <[email-masked]> said:
>
>I had always thought that the Allies won because improved weather allowed
>air support...

Hi Tim, there were the highest casualty figures I've yet seen for the
western front during the Ardennes offensive. That speaks to me of glutony
on the part of the General staff playing it consevatively, throwing their
weight into it. (aspersions aside) The price was paid in infantry lives.
The discussions concerning defense in that sector were settled by accessing
a delaying action back to the Meuse, at a bargained cost.

Alan Wild, Sr. Prog/Analyst
ACC - Lippitt - URI
Kingston, RI  02881

I am the NRA.

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 6 Jan 1995 17:58:51 EST
From:    Alan Wild <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Promo 'Das Bird'

>From:         "SCHERRER, TIM" <[email-masked]>
>
>Congrats on your promotion to COL----this is the first I've noted it
>being an O-6!  TAS

Doug's destined for the "stars". -Al  " God speed."

Alan Wild, Sr. Prog/Analyst
ACC - Lippitt - URI
Kingston, RI  02881

I am the NRA.

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 6 Jan 1995 18:02:28 EST
From:    Bill Lippert <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: "Martyred Villages"

On Fri, 6 Jan 1995 17:54:12 EST Henry Sirotin said:
>Dear Ira,
>
>One section of the walls of the Holocaust Museum in Washington are
>inscribed with the names of Jewish communities annihilated by the
>Nazis, so there is some sort of list, somewhere; probably at Yad
>Vashem. I've never seen a book. as such, but you might try the
>YIVO Research Institute in NYC. Give them time, though- they are
>moving and may not yet be unpacked.
>
>Henry Sirotin

   I more or less remember the wall that those communities were written
on.  First, weren't there a lot of names on there - over a hundred?
And second, did it refer to the elimination of the Jewish community in
those towns (i.e. the Jews were liquidated but everyone else remained)
or the complete annihilation of those communities (buildings and all).
If the former is the case, I would not place them in the same category
as Lidice or other such towns destroyed for reprisals.  This is not
to detract or emphasize one from the other, only that they are different
insofar as the motives to destroy them were very different.

William Lippert
The American University

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 6 Jan 1995 18:06:25 EST
From:    Alan Wild <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: INF: 50 Years Ago - 07-JAN-1945

>Philippines - Underwater demolition teams begin the search for underwater
>obstacles in Lingayen Gulf as the preinvasion aerial and naval bombardment
>of Luzon continues.

What types of personal equipment were there for detection? What other types
were used? That stretch of ocean looks small on a map, but... -Al

Alan Wild, Sr. Prog/Analyst
ACC - Lippitt - URI
Kingston, RI  02881

I am the NRA.

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 6 Jan 1995 19:45:27 EST
From:    "H. Emery Ford" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: WWW page announcement

On Fri, 06 Jan 95, Emmanual Gustin wrote:

>Announcement for these who didn't get the earlier one:
>
>There is a WWW page up at
>
>         http://www.vestnett.no/vulcan/index.html
>
>devoted to military history. At the moment most files at this
>site are related to military aviation: lists of "all" military
>aircraft, a list of acronyms and codenames, a description of
>designation systems, a very incomplete overview of aircraft
>markings, and other items.

I just checked out this page and it looks promising.  However, not being
as famililiar as I should be about WWII aviation, I can't seem to find
the P-38 (the Lightning, right?) under US aircraft.  Is that possibly
one of the things still being worked on?

Emery

------------------------------

Date:    Sat, 7 Jan 1995 02:45:13 +0100
From:    Emmanuel Gustin <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: WWW page announcement

On Fri, 6 Jan 1995, H. Emery Ford wrote:

> I just checked out this page and it looks promising.  However, not being
> as famililiar as I should be about WWII aviation, I can't seem to find
> the P-38 (the Lightning, right?) under US aircraft.  Is that possibly
> one of the things still being worked on?

You're right about the P-38, thanks for checking. I used a program to
convert the ASCII original to HTML for the WWW page, but it failed at P-38
because the indentation in the original is wrong. You can find the P-38
entry included with the one for the Hughes P-37. I'll correct it...

Emmanuel Gustin

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 6 Jan 1995 17:30:59 -0800
From:    Sidney Allinson <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Movie "Das Boot"

The same producer/director who brought us DAS BOOT recently released his
epic, STALINGRAD.

I watched it on a videotape last night. Marvellous show.

Sidney Allinson.

--

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 6 Jan 1995 21:00:56 EST
From:    "Larry W. Jewell" <[email-masked]>
Subject: DOC: "The Invasion of Japan", some thoughts.

I've just finished John Ray Skates' "The Invasion of Japan: Alternative
to the Bomb."

Short Answer: If you want to read about the planning for OLYMPIC and
CORONET (the planned invasions of Kyushsu and the Kanto plain) then this
book is a good overview, or at least a starting place for further research.
Skates' conclusions, however, are sometimes so weak as to be invisible.

Long Answer: Skates' has done a lot of work on this book, almost enough
to make it worth reading.  A great deal of detail regarding who was to
do what and with what is to be found here.  Of interest to some will be
the description of the point-system devised to muster-out the troops with
the most combat time (and men with children had a *huge* advantage in
the point totals).

What irritated me was Skates' almost sublime ability to take a set of
facts, look closely at half and ignore the other half.  For example, two
sets of casualty figures are examined (I use the term loosely), one being
Truman's post-war statements that using the bomb saved one-half million
to one million U.S. lives.  The other figure is MacArthur's estimation
of casualties based on the invasions of Iwo Jima and Okinawa (32,500-50,000).
Without a fully functional crystal ball I will venture no total of my
own, but I will suggest that those who do want to hazard a guess should
look at the Ketsu-Go plan to defend the home islands of Japan.  Skates
tell us that the invasion beaches on Kyushu were consistently to a terrain
to favor the defender and OLYMPIC would have made Okinawa look like the
Allies were trying to capture Sydney.

Another serious void in a balanced view of the invasion is a look at
the range of casualities to be expected by the defenders.  I suspect that
this is due to the fact that >90% of the defenders would have died.

Bottom line: For me, I'm glad I didn't *pay* for this book. (It was a
gift.) However, it does have some good pointers to other research material.
(I was disturbed but one thing, however, which I may have to elaborate on
after more reseach.)

Larry J

[email-masked]; Co-Mod.: BYRD.MU.WVNET.EDU (Historical docs)
"Sunday's horoscope is note worthy because of its strange, sudden and wholly
unpredictable and inexplicable occurrences, affecting all phases of life."
Your Horoscope" L.A. Evening Herald Express, Sat, 12/06/41

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 6 Jan 1995 18:16:19 -0800
From:    Steve Schoenherr <[email-masked]>
Subject: ARC: History at USD

The Department of History at the University of San Diego now has a Web Home Page
up and running with a variety of information, syllabi, bibliographies,
samples of
multimedia projects on local history.  The URL is:
http://192.215.84.38/History/HISTHOME.htm

One of the multimedia projects is on the Ryan FR-1 Fireball jet fighter
produced for the Navy in 1945. You will see at this Web site a 1946
description, photo and drawing of this plane.  Graduate student A.J. Lutz
has been researching this aircraft and is collecting all possible
information, including archival photos, film, technical information, and
personal histories for a multimedia master's thesis. Anyone with
suggestions for sources should contact his faculty advisor, Dr. Steven
Schoenherr <[email-masked]>. A.J. will be happy to share the results of his
research with those who provide any assistance.

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 6 Jan 1995 23:06:42 -0500
From:    Thomas Pike <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: INF- 2 quick questions

For #2: Archival Reserach International (202) 338-4249

------------------------------

End of WWII-L Digest - 5 Jan 1995 to 6 Jan 1995
***********************************************