Subject: WWII-L Digest - 20 Mar 1995 to 21 Mar 1995

From: Automatic digest processor <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 22 Mar 1995 00:02:42 -0500

There are 40 messages totalling 1739 lines in this issue.

Topics of the day:

  1. INF: USN Chronology 03-21-95
  2. [INF] USAAF 21 MAR 45
  3. USS Franklin
  4. Doenitz and agg war
  5. Balloon?!!
  6. Offending Someome...
  7. NOST:Nuernberg pt 4
  8. NOST: Nuernberg pt 3
  9. NOST: Nuerenberg Pt 5
 10. NOST: Nuernberg pt 5
 11. NOST: Nuernberg pt 6 (2)
 12. Enterprise Green
 13. Blutfahn
 14. James Howard (4)
 15. SAIPAN CONTROVERSY
 16. General - WWII Ghost Stories (2)
 17. HUMOR - WWII Ghost Stories (2)
 18. Hitler's Uniform On Display (5)
 19. INF: 50 Years Ago - 22-MAR-1945
 20. WANT: Artist/Cartoonist
 21. Japanese Balloons
 22. [INF] USAAF 22 MAR 45
 23. More on Bong
 24. Grenada Army Airfield, MS.
 25. <No subject given>
 26. JAMES HOWARD
 27. HITLER'S UNIFORM O
 28. Mountbatten Pink
 29. Wahoo War Reports
 30. your mail

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 21 Mar 1995 04:00:14 PST
From:    "Keller, Theron P." <[email-masked]>
Subject: INF: USN Chronology 03-21-95

UNITED STATES NAVY CHRONOLOGY
from:
//byrd.mu.wvnet.edu/pub/history/military/wwii/naval_chronology/chr4(4,5).txt

1945
03/21 Wed. Japanese aircraft make first known operational use of
           piloted bombs in unsuccessful attack against Admiral
           Mitscher's fast carrier task force.
            Japanese naval vessel sunk:
             Submarine chaser NO. 33 and cable layer TATEISHI,
              by Army aircraft, South China Sea,
              11 d. 50'N., 109 d. 18'E.

Information compiled by U.S. Navy Historians.  For more information,
contact the Naval Historical Center at (202) 433-3940.
Archived by: "Larry W. Jewell" <[email-masked]>
Posted by:
Theron P. Keller
Logicon, Inc.
Dahlgren, VA  22448 USA
[email-masked]

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 21 Mar 1995 08:04:00 EST
From:    mc killop <[email-masked]>
Subject: [INF] USAAF 21 MAR 45

COMBAT CHRONOLOGY OF THE US ARMY AIR FORCES
WEDNESDAY, 21 MARCH 1945
FTP SITES
  1. ftp.rutgers.edu in directory pub/wwii/usaf
  2. byrd.mu.wvnet.edu (129.71.32.152) in pub/history/military/airforce/
     wwii_chronology

AIRCRAFT MENTIONED IN THIS REPORT:
  A-20, Douglas Havoc
  A-26, Douglas Invader
  B-17, Boeing Flying Fortress
  B-24, Consolidated Liberator
  B-25, North American Mitchell
  B-26, Martin Marauder
  F-5, Lockheed Lightning
  P-38, Lockheed Lightning
  P-47, Republic Thunderbolt
  P-51, North American Mustang
  P-63, Bell Kingcobra
  Spitfire, Vickers Supermarine

NOTE: A number in parenthesis after a target name indicates the number of
bombers attacking.

  ZONE OF INTERIOR (Fourth Air Force): A P-63 from Walla Walla AAFld,
Washington, intercepts a Japanese balloon near Redmond, Washington, and,
after a chase that includes 2 refueling stops, shoots it down near Reno,
Nevada.

CHINA-BURMA-INDIA THEATER

  CHINA THEATER (Fourteenth Air Force): 4 P-51s damage several locomotives
and boxcars at Vinh Airfield, French Indochina and along the railroad to the
N. 6 B-24s claim 1 vessel damaged in S China Sea.

  INDIA-BURMA THEATER (Tenth Air Force): In Burma, 30 P-47s support Chinese
ground forces in the Hsipaw area; 34 P-38s sweep roads S of the bomb line; 13
B-25s and 18 P-47s attack troop concentrations and vehicles at several points
behind the Japanese lines; 526 air supply sorties are flown to the forward
areas; in ground action in the area of the British Fourteenth Army's 33
Corps, organized resistance ceases in Mandalay and Allied forces completely
take over that city.

EUROPEAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS (ETO)

  STRATEGIC OPERATIONS (Eighth Air Force): 5 missions are flown.
  Mission 901: Preparatory air operations for the forthcoming (23 Mar)
crossing of the lower Rhine River by Allied ground forces begin. 1,408
bombers and 806 fighters, in conjunction with Ninth Air Force and RAF
aircraft, attack jet fighter bases; with one exception, all attacks are
visual; they claim 58-3-49 Luftwaffe aircraft; 7 B-17s and 9 P-51s are lost:
  1. 107 of 152 B-17s hit the secondary target, the tank factory at Plauen;
targets of opportunity are Reichenbach (34) and other (1); they claim 3-3-3
aircraft; 5 B-17s are lost and 48 damaged. The escort is 273 of 314 P-51s;
they claim 9-0-0 aircraft in the air and 3-0-0 on the ground; 3 P-51s are
lost (pilots MIA) and 1 damaged beyond repair.
  2. 129 of 151 B-17s attack Hardorf Airfield; 14 others hit Vorden Airfield,
a target of opportunity; 1 B-17 is lost, 1 damaged beyond repair and 71
damaged. Escorting are 94 of 98 P-51s; they claim 0-0-2 aircraft in the air.
  3. 214 B-17s are sent to attack the airfields at Zwischenahn (57), Marx
(77) and Wittmundhafen (74); casualties for 1., 2. and 3. above are 7 WIA and
56 MIA. 108 of 109 P-51s escort and claim 2-0-8 aircraft on the ground; 1
P-51 is lost (pilot MIA).
  4. 518 B-24s are dispatched to hit airfields at Ahlhorn (61), Hesepe (165),
Achmer (180) and Mulheim Airfield at Essen (90); 21 B-24s are damaged.
Escorting are 95 of 99 P-51s; they claim 35-0-30 aircraft on the ground; 3
P-51s are lost (pilots MIA).
  5. 373 B-17s are sent to hit airfields at Hopsten (159 using Gee-H) and
Rheine (180); targets of opportunity are the airfields at Hesepe (13) and
Achmer (12); 1 B-17 is lost and 49 damaged; 1 airman is KIA, 3 WIA and 9
MIA. 97 of 102 P-51s escort; they claim 6-0-0 aircraft on the ground.
  6. 36 P-51s fly a sweep over Giebelstadt Airfield and claim 0-0-6 aircraft
on the ground.
  7. 13 P-51s escort 9 F-5s, 1 P-38 and 1 Spitfire on photo reconnaissance
missions over Germany.
  8. 35 P-51s fly a scouting mission.
  Mission 902: In a DISNEY operation, 3 B-17s attack the E-boat pens at
Ijmuiden, the Netherlands with rocket bombs; 6 P-51s escort.
  Mission 903: 1 B-17 bombs Oberursel in a Micro-H Mk II radar test; 4 P-51s
escort.
  Mission 904: During the afternoon, 90 of 92 B-24s attack Mulheim Airfield
at Essen; 60 are damaged and 1 airman is WIA.
  Mission 905: 8 of 9 B-24s drop leaflets in the Netherlands and Germany
during the night.

  TACTICAL OPERATIONS (Ninth Air Force): In Germany, 580+ A-20s, A-26s, and
B-26s strike 6 communications centers and a marshalling yard E of the Rhine
River, along with several casual targets, in the interdiction campaign to
obstruct enemy movement; fighters fly patrols and armed reconnaissance,
attack railroads and bridges, support the US VII Corps as its units reach the
Sieg River near Siegburg, cooperate with the XII Corps as more of its
elements reach the Rhine River at various points between Boppard and Worms,
and support the XX Corps as additional units reach the Rhine between Worms
and Mannheim.

MEDITERRANEAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS (MTO)

  STRATEGIC OPERATIONS (Fifteenth Air Force): 660+ B-24s and B-17s, with
fighter escorts, bomb the Neuburg an der Donau Airfield, Germany, marshalling
yards at Villach (2 yards), Klagenfurt, Graz and Bruck and der Mur, Austria,
and Pragersko, Yugoslavia, 3 oil refineries and a goods depot at Vienna,
Austria, and 4 scattered targets of opportunity; supply and reconnaissance
missions with escort are flown.

  TACTICAL OPERATIONS (Twelfth Air Force): A-20s continue to attack
communications in the Po Valley especially the Po River crossings during the
night of 20/21 Mar; during the day fighter-bombers concentrate on railroad
targets (lines, trains, bridges, and viaducts) and dumps in the Po Valley and
areas N of the battleline in the N Apennines; medium bombers bomb a railroad
fill at Salorno, bridges at Casarsa della Delizia and Pizzighettone,
marshalling yards at Vipiteno and Brennero, and bridge approaches at Campo.
The 86th and 87th Fighter Squadrons, 79th Fighter Group, move from Fano to
Cesenatico, Italy with P-47s.

PACIFIC OCEAN AREA (POA)

  AAFPOA
    Seventh Air Force: On Chichi Jima Island, 13 B-24s, based on Guam Island,
hit Susaki Airfield, which is hit again during the night of 21/22 Mar by 5
more, flying separate strikes.
    VII Fighter Command: 16 P-51s from Iwo Jima Island strafe and bomb
barracks and radio and radar installations on Chichi Jima.

SOUTHWEST PACIFIC AREA [SWPA, Far East Air Force (FEAF)]: On Luzon Island,
B-25s, A-20s, and fighters continue large-scale support missions, hitting a
variety of targets including Japanese defenses at Lipa and Tarlac and the
town of Naga and Camiling. In the C Philippine Islands B-24s hit targets near
Cebu City while A-20s pound other towns on Cebu Island. B-24s bomb Samah
Airfield on Hainan Island. B-25s on a shipping sweep attack and set afire a
freighter SE of Nanao Island, China. HQ 42d Bombardment Group (Medium) and
the 390th Bombardment Squadron (Medium) move from Morotai Island to Puerto
Princesa, Palawan Island with B-25s; the 67th Fighter Squadron, 347th Fighter
Group, ceases operating from Morotai with P-38s and returns to base at Puerto
Princesa, Palawan.

SOURCES:
AIR FORCE COMBAT UNITS OF WORLD WAR II, Office of Air Force History,
  Headquarters USAF, 1961, ISBN 0-912799-02-1
COMBAT SQUADRONS OF THE AIR FORCE, WORLD WAR II, Office of Air Force
  History, Headquarters USAF 1982
THE ARMY AIR FORCES IN WORLD WAR II: COMBAT CHRONOLOGY, 1941-1945 by the
  Office of Air Force History, Headquarters USAF, 1973
THE MIGHTY EIGHTH WAR DIARY by Roger A. Freeman, ISBN 1-85409-071-2

Jack McKillop
USAF (Airways and Air Communications Service)
1955-59

-------------------------------------------------------------------
|  Jack McKillop         |  Those who have long enjoyed such      |
|  Bellcore              |  privileges as we enjoy forget in      |
|  Piscataway, NJ USA    |  time that men have died to win them.  |
|  [email-masked]  |                       FDR              |
-------------------------------------------------------------------

21/1303Z MAR

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 21 Mar 1995 08:28:00 EST
From:    mc killop <[email-masked]>
Subject: USS Franklin

 >The devastating damage suffered by the Franklin reminds me of the Saturday a
 >week before 1 April, L-Day on Okinawa. The invasion force was forming up in
 >Ulithi Lagoon, and I was standing at the railing of the ship I was on together
 >with a couple of friends who were Marine communicators. It was a drizzly,
 >cloudy day, and all of a sudden, out of the fog appeared a large carrier
 >escorted by a cruiser close aboard. As they came nearer, we could see that the
 >carrier had suffered heavy damage and we could make out her hull number, and
 >that of the cruiser. They were, of course, the Franklin and the Santa Fe. The
 >next day, Sunday, dawned clear and bright, about off our portside, about half a
 >mile away, was the Franklin, her flight deck curving up like a roller coaster,
 >and you could see through the hangar decks the blackened bulkhead, and,
 >perhaps, if memory serves, some slight smoke still. As you know, she was
 >repaired enough to enable her to make hew own way to the Brooklyn Navy Yard,
 >with repair crews still working on her, although she would never fight again.
 >When it reached Brooklyn, so I recall, they were still recovering bodies from
 >the twisted innards of the ship. She and her men deserve all the honor we can
 >give them. Ben Frank

Another fact that we Irish-Americans are proud of is that the first
chaplain since the Civil War won the Medal of Honor for deeds
performed on the USS Franklin.  He was a Jesuit priest and Navy
chaplain named O'Callaghan and as I remember the story, the hangar
deck was on fire and full of ordnance.  On three different
occasions, he rounded up volunteers and led them to the hangar deck
and led them in throwing the ordnance over the side.  This act is
credited with saving the ship.

I believe a destroyer or DE was named in his honor.

If anyone has access to information about this act of heroism, I
would appreciate hearing it.

-------------------------------------------------------------------
|  Jack McKillop              |  Those who have long enjoyed such |
|  Bellcore                   |  privileges as we enjoy forget in |
|  Piscataway, NJ USA         |  time that men have died to win   |
|  [email-masked]  |  them.                     FDR    |
-------------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 21 Mar 1995 07:55:10 GMT-6
From:    "Robert T. Moore" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Doenitz and agg war

Hello, William!

Thanks for the note, and hope all is well.

>    You mentioned in one of your posts Doenitz's aggressive use of submarines
> in the Battle of the Atlantic.  This did indeed get him in some hot water.
> He was held responsible for the sinking of unarmed merchants without warning
> or chance for the crew to abandon ship.  However, Nimitz and many other
> American naval men came to his defence, saying that the US had pursued a
> similar policy in the Pacific.

    Yes, and their depositions may have had some affect, but I do not
feel that Admiral Doenitz should have been tried, as he wasn't and
didn't do any more or less than any of the other combattants. That
was my point.

    Thanks again for the note, and please stay in touch.

    All the best.

    Terry

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 21 Mar 1995 08:57:13 EST
From:    "Dennis E. Sparks" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Balloon?!!

Excerpted from Jack McKillop's excellent daily postings:

>Subj:  [INF] USAAF 21 MAR 45
>
>  ZONE OF INTERIOR (Fourth Air Force): A P-63 from Walla Walla AAFld,
>Washington, intercepts a Japanese balloon near Redmond, Washington, and,
>after a chase that includes 2 refueling stops, shoots it down near Reno,
>Nevada.

How damn fast was this balloon anyway?  ;-)

(Somewhat) more seriously, I just took a quick look at an atlas.  From
Walla Walla (near the Washington/Oregon border), going SSW to Reno (near
the California/Nevada border, looks to be around 450 miles.  And this
took two refueling stops?  The balloon must have been at a very high
altitude, so that the P-63 had to expend an inordinate amount of time
and fuel trying to reach it.

I'm assuming that this was one of the balloons carrying an incendiary
bomb.  Did the bomb detonate when it hit the ground?  Also, how did
the AAF spot the balloon in the first place?  Would something as small
as a bomb casing and/or as diaphanous as a balloon show up on radar?
Wouldn't the balloons have been very difficult to detect visually,
particularly if they were at extreme altitudes?  Was there some sort
of standing airborne patrol, or was this a chance encounter while the
P-63 was on a different mission?

Jack, could you please tell me where you read this account?  I'd be
interested in reading more about it.

Dennis E. Sparks
[email-masked]
Lexington, Kentucky

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 21 Mar 1995 06:43:10 -0800
From:    Larry Godek <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Offending Someome...

You wrote:

>
>According to current news reports, the V-E Day parade in Moscow will
>be largely demilitarized, while the "Official" V-end of the war or
>something else that shall remain unexplained Day will be armed to
>the teeth.
>
>HS
>
>

and guess who will be with the russians?  OUR fearless "leader"?
Everyone should find a VE or VJ day T shirt and wear it.

LG

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 21 Mar 1995 09:08:18 CET
From:    "COL Donnell, Doug" <[email-masked]>
Subject: NOST:Nuernberg pt 4

Continuing quotes from William Shirer-

Sept 6

Hitler sprang his Arbeitsdienst, his Labour Service Corps, on the public
for the first time today and it turned out to be a highly trained, semi-
military group of fanatical Nazi youths.  Standing there in the early
morning sunlight which sparkled on their shiny spades, fifty thousand
of them, with the first thousand bared above the waist, suddenly made
the German spectators go mad with joy when, without warning, they broke
into a perfect goose step. . .They [the labor service boys] formed an
immense Sprechchor -- a chanting chorus -- and with one voice intoned such
words as these "We want one Leader! Nothing for us! Everything for Germany!
Heil Hitler!"

Sept 7

Another great pagent tonight.  Two hundred thousand party officials packed
in the Zeppelin Wiese with their twenty-one thousand flags unfurled in
the searchlights like a forest of weird trees.  "We arstrong and will get
stronger," Hitler shouted at them through the microphone, his words
echoing across the hushed field from the loudspeakers.  . .
Later they recovered enough -- fifteen thousand of them -- to stage a
torchlight parade through Nuremberg's ancient streets, Hitler taking the
salute infront of the station across from our hotel.

Sept 8

Today the army had its day, fighting a very realistic sham battle in the
Zeppelin Meadow.  it is difficult to exaggerate the frenzy of the three
hundred thousand German spectators when they saw their soldiers go into
action, heard the thunder of the guns, and smelt the powder.  I feel
that all those Americans and English (among others) who thought that
German militarism was merely a product of the Hohenzollerns -- from
Frederick the Great to Kaiser Wilhelm II -- made a mistake.  It is rather
something deeply ingrained in all Germans.  They acted today like children
playing with tin soldiers.  The Reichwehr "fought" today only with the
"defensive" weapons allowed them by Versailles, but everybody knows
they've got the rest -- tanks, heavy artillery, and probably airplanes.

Later -

After seven days of almost ceaseless goose-stepping, speech-making, and pageantry, the party rally come to and end tonight.  You have to go through one of
these to understand Hitler's hold on the people, to feel the dynamic in the
movement he's unleashed and the sheer, disciplined strength the Germans posses.  And now -- as Hitler told the correspondents yesterday in explaining his
technique -- the half-million men who've been here during the week will go
back to their towns and villages and preach the new gospel with new
fanaticism.

To be continued. . .

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 21 Mar 1995 08:50:08 CET
From:    "COL Donnell, Doug" <[email-masked]>
Subject: NOST: Nuernberg pt 3

My apologies for the typos and sometimes poor syntax yesterday.  I was about
to doze off as I was typing.  No such excuses today.

Continuing. . .

An area adjacent to the Luitpoldhain called the Zeppelinwiese (Zepplelin-meadow,so named as it had previously been used as a landing zone for Zeppelins) was
also developed into a large parade ground.

The area was used in the early 30s, but was greatly enlarged with many permanentstructures for the 1936 party congress.  The capacity was increased to hold
400,000 people.  A road seventy two feet wide was built in front of the
reviewing stand.  The reviewing stand itself was 80 feet high and 1300 feet
long, built out of brick with stone facing.  Backing this were 170 stone
pillars.

Stone grandstands twenty feet high enclosed the field on the other three sides.
Thirty four stone towers were placed at even intervals around the perimeter,
each capped with six flagpoles.

For the 1936 rally, Speer installed 130 searchlights positioned around the
stadium, pointing straight up.  The light reached 20,000 feet and could be
seen as far away as Frankfurt (over 100 miles to the Northwest).

There were, of course, many pictures taken of the rallies.  Those that show
three huge vertically oriented Nazi flags behind the reviewing stand were
taken at the Luitpoldhain.  Those showing an enclosed field with the
reviewing stand flanked by rows of columns were taken at the Zeppelinwiese.

To get a feel for the excitement of the Nuernberg rallies I'll borrow some
quotes from William Shirer's "Berlin Diary".  Writing about the 1934
rally:

5 Sept -  I'm beginning to comprehend, I think, some of the reasons for
Hitler's astounding success.  Borrowing a chapter from the Roman church, he
is restoring pagentry and colour and mysticism to the drab lives of
twentieth-century Germans.  This morning's opening meeting in the Luitpold
Hall on the outskirts of Nuremberg was more than a gorgeous show; it also
had something of the mysticism and religious fervour of an Easter or
Christmas Mass in a great Gothic cathedral.  The hall was a sea of
brightly coloured flags.  Even Hitler's arrival was made dramatic.  The
band stopped playing.  There was a hush over the thirty thousand people
packed in the hall.  The the band struck up the 'Badenweiler March' a
very catchy tune, and used only, I'm told, when Hitler makes his big
entries.  Hitler appeared in the back of the auditorium, and followed by
his aides, goering, Goebbels, Hess, Himmler, and the others, he strode
down the long centre aisle while thirty thousand hands were raised in
salute.  An immense symphony orchestra played Beethoven's 'Egmont'
overture.  Great Klieg lights played on the stage, where Hitler sat
surrounded by a hundred party officials and officers of the army and
navy. Behind them the "blood flag" the one carried down the streets of
Munich in theill-fated putsch.  Behind this, four or five hundred S.A.
standards.  When the music was over, Rudolf Hess, Hitler's closest confidant,
rose and slowly read the names of the Nazi "martyrs" -- brown-shirts who
had been killed in the struggle for power -- a roll call of the dead, and
the thirty thousand seemed very moved.

In such an atmosphere no wonder, then, that every word dropped by Hitler
seemed like an inspired Word from on high. Man's -- or at least the
German's -- critical faculty is swept away at such moments, and
every lie pronounced is accepted as high truth itself.

More in a few minutes. . .

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 21 Mar 1995 09:34:14 CET
From:    "COL Donnell, Doug" <[email-masked]>
Subject: NOST: Nuerenberg Pt 5

The new Congresshalle

Another project envisioned for the rally grounds was the "New Congress Halle".
The cornerstone for this enormous auditorium was laid during the 1935 rally.
Quoting from After the Battle no 2:

The nw Congress Hall was to be 670 feet wide, 870 feet ling, and 150 feet
high.  It was to be 1.3 times the length and 1.7 times the width of the Roman
Colosseum.  The cost of construction was estimated at approximately 25
million pounds.  The hall was to provide seats for 40,000 people and standing
room for 8,000.  The walls were to be decorated with 1,000 flags.  The roof
was to be supported by eighty-eight columns, each of them fifty-one feet
high; the whole project would cover 160,000 square feet. An extensive network
of railway tracks was laid around the whole site to facilitate the transportation of building materials, and an estimated 150 freight wagons were used daily
for shipment.  The Congresshalle was Hitler's favourite project and work on
it continued until the winter of 1942-43.  When work stopped, the building
was approximately half completed.  The roof, the second story, the interior
constuction, and the stage remained unfinished.

End of quote.

The Marzfield, named after Mars, god of war, was another enormous project --
but this one was never begun.  It was to have been a parade ground measuring
3400 ft by 2300 ft.  Stands were to be built around the field to hold 160,000
spectators.  Twenty four towers each 130 ft high would rise from behind the
stands.  A large processional avenue (this WAS built) ran from the Marzfeld
area.  It was a little over a mile long and 264 feet wide.  The avenue was
lined with stone steps for spectators.  Work continued on the processional
avenue until 1943.

Next ....  The area today

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 21 Mar 1995 10:38:39 CET
From:    "COL Donnell, Doug" <[email-masked]>
Subject: NOST: Nuernberg pt 5

The area today

Much of what was built by the Nazis still remains today and is easily accessed
by anyone interested.

All of the stonework has been removed from the Luitpoldhain and it has been
turned into a park.  It still, however, retains the shape of a parade ground
and it doesn't take a lot of imagination to recreate what was, in your mind.
The Ehrenmal (war memorial) at the end of the Luitpoldhain still exists and
it's easy, armed with a picture or two from the past, to find the exact
spot Hitler stood during ceremonies there.

Perhaps the most fascinating extant structure is the Zeppelinwiese.  The
entire stadium still stands and, again, is easy to access (you can park
right in front of it).  The grounds themselves are now used as sports
fields and are fenced off from the general public.  The towers still stand,
each with the base of the flagpoles that were so evident in all the photos.
The reviewing stand also remains.  You can stand on the tribune, or speakers
platform, just as Hitler did in the 30s.  The large swastika on top of
the reviewing stand was blown off by the Allies after the war (opening
sequence of the movie "Judgement at Nuerenberg".  In 1967 the columns
were removed from the main platform.

The processional avenue also remains, although the tiers alongside are
overgrown.

Some of the area now serves as the city's fairgrounds -- something along the
line of the Oktoberfest grounds in Munich -- with beer tents, rides, etc.
(Though obviously not operating at this time of year).

The New Congress Hall remains, as well (it would take a nuclear explosion
to get rid of it).  It wasn't apparent to me if any further work had been
done on it.  At least part of it is used by the Nurnberg Symphony
Orchestra.

A few towers were built as part of the Marzfeld project, but were blown up
in 1960.

The city of Nuernberg, although it was about 90 per cent destroyed during the
war, has been rebuilt to look much as it did before the war.  Great pains
were taken to rebuild the city using the same designs and even the same
stonework, thus the appearance of Nuernberg belies the extent of the WWII
destruction.  It also provides a fascinating opportunity to compare old
photos with todays scenes and easily determine where the old pictures
were taken.

I'd like to close (yes, finally) with a personal observation.  No book, picture,
or description can truly convey the enormous size of the rally area.  In
seeing it today, one can only imagine what it must have been like, back in

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 21 Mar 1995 10:47:27 CET
From:    "COL Donnell, Doug" <[email-masked]>
Subject: NOST: Nuernberg pt 6

Bear with me. . .the system logged me out and I dern near lost part 5.
Picking up again. . .

the 30s during the party congresses.  I walked away with perhaps a better
understanding of the grip that the Nazis had on the German population.
Walking around the grounds I couldn't help but be awed by the massive
size of the project and, again, could only imagine the fervor that accompanied
the pomp and cermony of the rallies.

Thanks for bearing with me through this.

                           Doug

Doug Donnell
[email-masked]

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 21 Mar 1995 10:57:16 -0500
From:    QUACK <[email-masked]>
Subject: Enterprise Green

Didn't Tom Clancy write a book on this entitled Emerald Necklace or such?
Pure fiction of course.

Ron Musco

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 21 Mar 1995 12:05:40 -0500
From:    Max Calderwood <[email-masked]>
Subject: Blutfahn

Col. Donnell,

Thanks for the really interesting tour of the sites of Nurenburg.

I have a question for the list brought up by this:

What happened to the Nazi "Blood Flag" or Blutfahn (sp?).  Was it destroyed or
captured during the war?  Is it sitting in some Russian Archive or some
colletors basement?

Does anybody know what happened to this most sinister Nazi "relic"?

Max C.

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 21 Mar 1995 12:24:00 EST
From:    mc killop <[email-masked]>
Subject: James Howard

The Associated Press is reporting that retired USAF Brigadier
General James H. Howard has died at Belleair Bluffs, Florida.  He
was 81.

In 1944, Howard was a P-51 pilot with the Ninth Air Force when he
single-handedly attacked 30 Luftwaffe aircraft that were attacking
AAF bombers.  He shot down four aircraft and damaged others before
returning to base in England.  He was awarded the Medal of Honor
for this mission, the only fighter pilot in the European Theater to
win the award.  I believe he had fought in China with the AVG
(????) and his aircraft bore a Chinese expression which for the
life of me I cannot remember.

In 1945, Howard became commander of Pinellas AAFld (now St
Petersburg-Clearwater International Airport).

Requiescat in pace.

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 21 Mar 1995 12:22:59 -0400
From:    Mike Yaklich <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: SAIPAN CONTROVERSY

        Ben, I was wondering if I could also get a copy of that Smith vs Smith
controversy paper snail-mailed to me.  I'd be happy to defray any expenses
involved.  Your comments on Nimitz intrigued me, I always had a pretty
favorable impression of him as a commander.  Also, I'm dumping those Japan
posts into a textfile and reorganizing them a bit (also eliminating obvious and
embarrassing factual errors, typos, etc), I should be able to send them to you
shortly.

        Thanks in advance

        Mike Yaklich

PS My snailmail address is;

        Mike Yaklich
        229 Bettis Rd
        West Mifflin,  PA  15122

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 21 Mar 1995 10:06:00 PST
From:    "Wsiaki, Bill" <[email-masked]>
Subject: General - WWII Ghost Stories

I am curious if anyone has read or heard any WWII-L stories related to the
supernatural or unexplained?

Bill Wsiaki
St. Paul's College Library
[email-masked]

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 21 Mar 1995 12:59:13 -600
From:    Lowell Rick Cox <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: NOST: Nuernberg pt 6

>Bear with me. . .the system logged me out and I dern near lost part 5.
>Picking up again. . .
>
>the 30s during the party congresses.  I walked away with perhaps a better
>understanding of the grip that the Nazis had on the German population.
>Walking around the grounds I couldn't help but be awed by the massive
>size of the project and, again, could only imagine the fervor that accompanied
>the pomp and cermony of the rallies.
>
>Thanks for bearing with me through this.
>
>                           Doug
>
I have seen the Zeppelinwiese in a very different mode from what Doug has
described.  While I was stationed in Amberg in 1979 I heard of a big rock
concert to be held in Nuremburg (english spelling, sorry can't do umlauts),
luckily my unit wasn't scheduled to be in the field or on the border at that
time so I got tickets.

Imagine my surprise when I walked into the concert site and saw things that
I'd only seen before in pictures and film clips of the Nazi party rallies.
I can
attest to the fact that the accoustics are pretty good there.  Those bands
put out alot of noise and it sounded really good.

The highlight band was the Who.  They came on just after it got dark and
they put on the first Laser light show that I'd ever seen.  The main Lasers
were on the same location that the old Nazi eagle had been on.

All in all a really good show, but it gave me chills every time I thought of an
earlier series of events held in that location.  Good but weird.

Just my $0.02

Rick Cox    [email-masked]
Ameritech National Customer Service Center
Hoffman Estates, Illinois.

Modification of an old Cav saying; If you ain't Cav, you got over!

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 21 Mar 1995 14:38:37 EST
From:    Alan Wild <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: HUMOR - WWII Ghost Stories

There's always the 5 torpedo bombers that went down in,...

The Bermuda Triangle.

I had read that their maps were tampered with and read that the area of
ocean in question was the Cheryl Tiegs triangle, so they, ahem,... went down.

-Al

Alan Wild, Sr. Prog/Analyst
ACC - Lippitt - URI
Kingston, RI  02881

American Legion, Post 102
I am the NRA.

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 21 Mar 1995 16:04:38 EST
From:    "Dennis E. Sparks" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: James Howard

>From Jack McKillop:

>The Associated Press is reporting that retired USAF Brigadier
>General James H. Howard has died at Belleair Bluffs, Florida.  He
>was 81.
>
>In 1944, Howard was a P-51 pilot with the Ninth Air Force when he
>single-handedly attacked 30 Luftwaffe aircraft that were attacking
>AAF bombers.  He shot down four aircraft and damaged others before
>returning to base in England.  He was awarded the Medal of Honor
>for this mission, the only fighter pilot in the European Theater to
>win the award.  I believe he had fought in China with the AVG
>(????) and his aircraft bore a Chinese expression which for the
>life of me I cannot remember.
>
>In 1945, Howard became commander of Pinellas AAFld (now St
>Petersburg-Clearwater International Airport).
>
>Requiescat in pace.

His P-51B was named "Ding Hao", which is supposed to be the Chinese
equivalent of "Okay".  354th FG(?)

Dennis E. Sparks
[email-masked]
Lexington, Kentucky

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 21 Mar 1995 15:24:20 GMT-6
From:    "Robert T. Moore" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: General - WWII Ghost Stories

Hello, Bill!

> I am curious if anyone has read or heard any WWII-L stories related to the
> supernatural or unexplained?

    Yes, there was some discussion about this topic some months back.
You might consult the archives.

    All the best.

    Terry

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 21 Mar 1995 16:33:07 EST
From:    Chuck Weckesser <[email-masked]>
Subject: Hitler's Uniform On Display

The role of museum's in protecting history, both good and bad is something few
of us would argue with. But are there boundaries? Are some "exhibits" so
outrageous that the sensibilities of the masses should be taken into account in
deciding whether an object should be displayed?

I for one am shocked that Hitler's party uniform (although interesting the New
York Times had a photograph of the uniform sans Hitler's Iron Cross) is on
display.

I think his uniform should be taken to Auschwitz, hung up on a nail where
millions of Jews hung their tattered cloths and burned. All personal effects of
Hitler should be taken by the state and similarly burned in public.

It's just too much for me to even think that some would be interested--and God
help those who are more than interested but downright titilated--in seeing
Hitler's "uniform." It even makes me ill to hear his "uniform" refered to as
such.

Another idea--and my pee shy bladder would quickly recover--would be allow the
decendents of as many Jews as possible to simple form a line and URINATE on this
so called "antiquity."

This exhbit has crossed the line of good taste. It should be stopped.

Just one (angry) opinion.

Chuck Weckesser

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 21 Mar 1995 15:56:02 -0600
From:    "Robert J. Granvin" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Hitler's Uniform On Display

> The role of museum's in protecting history, both good and bad is something few
> of us would argue with. But are there boundaries? Are some "exhibits" so
> outrageous that the sensibilities of the masses should be taken into account in
> deciding whether an object should be displayed?
>
> I for one am shocked that Hitler's party uniform (although interesting the New
> York Times had a photograph of the uniform sans Hitler's Iron Cross) is on
> display.
>
> I think his uniform should be taken to Auschwitz, hung up on a nail where
> millions of Jews hung their tattered cloths and burned. All personal effects of
> Hitler should be taken by the state and similarly burned in public.
>
> It's just too much for me to even think that some would be interested--and God
> help those who are more than interested but downright titilated--in seeing
> Hitler's "uniform." It even makes me ill to hear his "uniform" refered to as
> such.
>
> Another idea--and my pee shy bladder would quickly recover--would be allow the
> decendents of as many Jews as possible to simple form a line and URINATE on this
> so called "antiquity."
>
> This exhbit has crossed the line of good taste. It should be stopped.
>
> Just one (angry) opinion.
>
> Chuck Weckesser

All displays, especially museum displays, have certain functions in their
very existence... One is to teach, one is to preserve and another is to
preserve the memory and history of an artifact or what it represents.

The best way to do that is to evoke some manner of emotion, though most
displays try to do so in a positive and emotionally neutral way.

I do not object to any of Hitler's personal items being on display.  If it
evokes emotion, good.  If it evokes anger, perhaps even better.

In today's world, where history is under constant attack by all who seek to
rewrite it or -- at least -- reconsider it, everything that helps assure
the preservation of the memory and facts of what truly happened is a very
important thing.  To destroy artifacts that represent something one may
consider totally, wholly and irreversably evil will do nothing but destroy
a symbol or artifact that directly brings you to that time.

Once you start, where do you stop?  If everything that is offensive or
too difficult to handle is destroyed and not made available for viewing,
then almost all evidence of history would eventually be eradicated.

There are far worse things that can be displayed and what one person finds
extremely difficult or even impossible to bear differs greatly from that of
another person.  My family, parents, sister and all sorts of relatives,
lived under German occupation for many years.  When my mother attended the
first airshow I worked at, we had a Ju-52 on display.  She found it very
difficult to walk near that airplane and refused to go inside.  But when it
flew, and she looked _up_ to see that cross flying overhead, she nearly
lost all composure.  It was too almost too much for her.  However, the
display of other Nazi artifacts didn't phase her a bit.

By the definitions set forth here, should that Ju-52 have been sent to the
smelters because of all the negatives that it represented -- or should it
be preserved and made available so others may feel some of those same pangs
in the future and _remember_ why it's so important to not lose these
lessons?

Regardless of my personal feelings on the artifact, I say display it...
remember... and pass on the feelings of why we can't forget.

--
\\ Robert J. Granvin                                 User Services Specialist
// School of Statistics - University of Minnesota            [email-masked]

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 21 Mar 1995 15:26:39 -0800
From:    Steve New <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: James Howard

You wrote:

>
>The Associated Press is reporting that retired USAF Brigadier
>General James H. Howard has died at Belleair Bluffs, Florida.  He
>was 81.
>
>In 1944, Howard was a P-51 pilot with the Ninth Air Force when he
>single-handedly attacked 30 Luftwaffe aircraft that were attacking
>AAF bombers.  He shot down four aircraft and damaged others before
>returning to base in England.  He was awarded the Medal of Honor
>for this mission, the only fighter pilot in the European Theater to
>win the award.  I believe he had fought in China with the AVG
>(????) and his aircraft bore a Chinese expression which for the
>life of me I cannot remember.
>
>In 1945, Howard became commander of Pinellas AAFld (now St
>Petersburg-Clearwater International Airport).
>
>Requiescat in pace.
>
>
The aircraft  (a p51B) was named "Ding Hao!" which translates loosly as
"Number One!".

--

Steve L. New
[email-masked]
Just an armadillo on the shoulder of the information superhighway.

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 21 Mar 1995 17:48:49 -0600
From:    "William L. Huber - SAA" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Hitler's Uniform On Display

> > I for one am shocked that Hitler's party uniform is on
> > display. (paraphrased due to this stupid mail editor, sorry)

Where is this display located?  As a collector of 3rd Reich era
uniforms, this one is one not to miss.

> > It's just too much for me to even think that some would be interested--and God
> > help those who are more than interested but downright titilated--in seeing
> > Hitler's "uniform."

I have to admit I am more than casually interested in seeing this
uniform.  I understand that the 3rd Reich evokes tremendous emotional
energy from people who were victimized by it and others who are
sensitive to them.  I can think of few moments in human history where
a more reprehensible government ruled than during the 3rd Reich but
eradicating all evidence of its existence is not the lesson we need to
learn from this period of history.

I have collected these items for the past 20 years and have used my
collection as examples during countless lectures at schools and
libraries here and in Europe.  When you are talking to a class of ten
year olds about WW2 its as foreign to them as their text book is.  Its
just words and black and white photos.  When you can pass around a
German helmet and the kids can feel its weight and smell its musty
age, *then* history enters the realm of reality.  The only thing
better is to have a person who was there - a vet, a Holocaust
survivor, someone who speaks from experience.  All I can do is offer
my research and my collection so I do.  Its all I have to offer but I
do it because above all, this must never be allowed to happen again.
When all traces of it are gone as Chuck suggests then with what do we
counter those who would deny that the Holocaust occurred?

The revisionist/denial platform is based on refuting the mountains of
evidence that scholars have compiled  for 50 years.  If we do away
with all of that then its their word against ours.  I spend a lot of
time and energy informing young people of the horrors of that period
because it is the new generation that is susceptible to being duped by
the half truths and outright prevarications of neo-nazi and other hate
groups, especially if there is nobody to counter those arguments with
hard facts and a firm background in the subject.  I feel like I'm
preaching to the choir because you members of this list are marching
to the same drum beat.  We fight ignorance, plain and simple.  Its
been said that those who do not learn from history are doomed to
repeat it.

     I wonder how many people would come to the Kelly base library to
see my Holocaust memorial display if all it consisted of was printed
white cards that describe items that were destroyed because of what
they were?  Interestingly, the reason that collectors have to pay the
outrageous prices SS items are bringing is because it was the SS
themselves that made sure that no trace of their crimes remain to
haunt them.  The SS burned more SS uniforms than any other group.  I
know Chuck would not want to further the interests of the SS but
unwittingly that is precisely what he is urging.

> > Just one (angry) opinion.
> >
> > Chuck Weckesser

I have gone on enough.  I didn't get Chuck's original post so maybe I
am missing something.  If the uniform is being displayed at a neo-nazi
rally then I'm right there with you, Chuck, but if its simply a
historical display that puts the items in their historical perspective
then I am all for the display.

Cheers, Bill Huber / [email-masked]

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 21 Mar 1995 18:55:47 EST
From:    Henry Sirotin <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: HUMOR - WWII Ghost Stories

Charles Berlitz' THE PHILADELPHIA EXPERIMENT

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 21 Mar 1995 19:14:39 EST
From:    John Davis <[email-masked]>
Subject: INF: 50 Years Ago - 22-MAR-1945

On 22-MAR-1945, the following occurred -

World War II - The Battlefronts
-------------------------------
Western Front - In the U.S. 1st Army sector, the III Corps begins attacks
across the Wied. The V Corps liberates the area between the Rhine and the
Wied. In the 3rd Army sector, the XII Corps finishes capturing the west
bank of the Rhine and prepares to cross the river. The 10th Armoured
Division takes Landau. The 7th Army continues to advance towards the Rhine.
The 103rd Division reaches Klingenmunster. The 14th Armoured Division
completes the capture of Steinfeld.

Eastern Front - Troops of the 3rd White Russian Front continue the
reduction of the German pocket in East Prussia. The 2nd White Russian Front
is making slow progress against fortifications about Danzig and Gdynia.

Philippines - In the XI Corps area, the 43rd Division takes Mt. Balidbiran
and mops up on Mt. Tanauan.

Iwo Jima - The 5th Marine Division continues the tortuous advance northwest
toward the sea.

=============================================================================

Sources: "United States Army in World War II, Chronology 1941-1945" compiled
by Mary H. Williams, Office of the Chief of Military History, Department of
the Army, "2194 Days of War" by Cesare Salmaggi and Alfredo Pallavisimi,
"Facts On File Yearbook 1945, Person's Index Of World Events" edited by R.L.
Lapica.

Copyright 1995 by John B Davis, ALL RIGHTS RESERVED.

Previous articles are archived at ftp.webcom.com in directory /pub/jbd/www
and can be accessed via the WWW by URL: http://www.webcom.com/~jbd/ww2.html.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
John Davis                           |                      [email-masked]
Cary, North Carolina                 |            http://www.webcom.com/~jbd/
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 21 Mar 1995 18:17:04 -0600
From:    "Robert J. Granvin" <[email-masked]>
Subject: WANT: Artist/Cartoonist

This isn't EXACTLY related to WWII, so I'll rely on people to send back
via email.

In any case, are there any artists or cartoonists (or cariacturists) on
this list?  We've got some simple (?) artwork we'd like to do from time to
time for our displays (WWII related :-) including one T-shirt design, if an
event happened this weekend (50-50 chance).

Of course, we're looking for donated work, but we'd give you credit.  :-)

Just curious... :-)

--
Robert J. Granvin
Southern Minnesota Wing Confederate Air Force

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 21 Mar 1995 19:20:50 EST
From:    Paul Gregor <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Hitler's Uniform On Display

I read the interesting post with regard to Hitlers uniform. A few years
back, the popular magazine Archaeology did an article concerning a recently
rediscovered bunker used by the Liebstandarte Adolf Hitler near the
chancellery.  The bunker was adorned with frescoes, one of which portrayed
SS troopers shielding a German family;.  The article went on to discuss the
preservation issues facing archaeologists in Germany.  Should the remains
of an unpleasant past be destroyed? From my point of view this plays into
the hands of those that would deny the holocaust.  A public display is an
issue for debate, but I can't see destroying the uniform.

A few years ago Maplethorpe put a crucifix in a bottle of urine and labelled
the image Piss Christ. It was protected under free speech as artwork, valuable
in and of itself regardless of who it offended. I like to sit back and see who
the fors and againsts are in censorship issues, it provides insight.

                                           Just my thoughts

                                             Paul Gregor

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 21 Mar 1995 20:05:00 EST
From:    mc killop <[email-masked]>
Subject: Japanese Balloons

Yesterday, Dennis Sparks asked about the Japanese balloons that were
launched against the U.S.  Dennis, I checked and found the following in
Volume VI of THE ARMY AIR FORCES IN WORLD WAR II edited by Craven and Cate,
Office of Air Force History, 1983.

Chapter 3 -- Air Defense Of The United States

Postscript:  The Japanese Balloons

Although the Japanese had failed to exploit their Pearl Harbor success by
follow-up attacks on the American mainland, they did contrive before
hostilities ended to send against the United States the first
intercontinental missiles to be employed in warfare.  The search for such a
weapon seems to have been triggered by the hope of retaliation for the
Doolittle raid on Tokyo in April I942.  After two years of experimentation,
the Japanese had developed a bomb-carrying free balloon which depended upon
prevailing winds across the Pacific to reach its target in North America.
Beginning in November I944, the Japanese launched no less than 9,000 of the
new weapons.  Large-scale manufacture of the balloons had begun in July 1944;
by the following February monthly output had reached 5,578 units; altogether,
about i6,ooo balloons were made.

There were two types: a few pilot balloons, equipped to send a radio signal,
were made of rubberized silk on the mistaken notion that this bag was a
superior container of hydrogen; a second type, designed to carry bombs or
incendiaries, had an envelope made by cementing together five layers of very
thin paper.  The resulting sphere, 33 feet (10 m) in diameter, could lift a
load of about 300 pounds (136 kg).  Ingenious devices were used to sustain
the flight of the balloon and to release the bombs.  An automatic control
device allowed hydrogen to escape as the balloon began to rise above 35,000
feet (10,668 m), and whenever it dipped below 30,000 feet (9,144 m) another
mechanism, using aneroids and a battery, activated fuzes to release sandbag
ballast.  When all the sandbags had been dropped, the bombs were released
and a demolition device destroyed the remaining gear--or so the theory ran.
The balloons, which could attain speeds as high as 200 miles per hour (322
km/h), required from three to five days to complete the crossing.

The revenge campaign began with the launching of the first balloon on 1
November 1944.  On 4 November an American vessel off southern California
salvaged the envelope of one balloon, and on 11 December the first discovery
on the mainland was made at Kalispell, Montana.  The balloons landed over
a wide area, from the Aleutians to Mexico, and from California east to
Michigan.  Military authorities confirmed about 150 recoveries.  At first it
was thought that the salvaged fragments came from weather balloons blown off
course, but by January 1945 enough bomb fragments had been identified to
convince the Army that it was dealing with a serious weapon.  As late as
March 1945, however, the War Department was still uncertain as to which of
the following might prove to be the primary purpose of the balloons:
bacteriological or chemical warfare; incendiary and antipersonnel bombing;
terrorization to produce diversion of American forces; transportation of
espionage agents; or novel purposes not yet apparent.

The very uncertainty about enemy intentions stimulated defense measures
against the new weapon.  As 1945 opened, the U.S. Army's Western Defense
Command and the U.S. Navy's Western Sea Frontier were made jointly
responsible for defense against the balloons.  A conference of interested
agencies quickly found that the stripping of west coast air defenses had left
only a skeleton structure: the sharp reduction in radars had left gaps in the
warning screen, and even AA strength was very limited.  Before reactivating
defenses, it was necessary to determine whether aircraft could destroy the
balloons.  Repeated attempts by Fourth Air Force units to track balloons
produced only two successful interceptions: a P-38 pilot from Santa Rosa Army
Air Field, California brought down one, and a P-63 pilot from Walla Walla
AAFld, Washington trailed his target from Redmond, Oregon, to Reno, Nevada,
before forcing it to earth.  Bad weather, inaccurate sightings, and the high
altitude at which the balloons traveled, all contributed to the poor record
of interceptions.  To determine if radar tracking would help, the Fourth Air
Force set up an elaborate project, but by the time the equipment for the test
was emplaced late in April 1945, the balloons had stopped coming.  Meantime,
a rigid news blackout had deprived the Japanese of all knowledge of the
results of the attack.  This secrecy produced the only fatalities of the
balloon campaign when, on 5 May 1945, six members of a picnic group were
killed by a bomb they discovered in a wooded area near Bly, Oregon.

It was fortunate that the balloons stopped coming before the tinder-dry days
of summer could provide a test of the incendiary bombs' ability to start
extensive forest fires.  If the Japanese had been able to sustain their best
launching rate of 100 balloons per day, and if they had armed the missiles
with clusters of small incendiaries, there might well have been serious
consequences in the western states.  As it was, the enemy got scant return
for his effort.

-------------------------------------------------------------------
|  Jack McKillop              |  Those who have long enjoyed such |
|  Bellcore                   |  privileges as we enjoy forget in |
|  Piscataway, NJ USA         |  time that men have died to win   |
|  [email-masked]  |  them.                     FDR    |
-------------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 21 Mar 1995 20:16:00 EST
From:    mc killop <[email-masked]>
Subject: [INF] USAAF 22 MAR 45

COMBAT CHRONOLOGY OF THE US ARMY AIR FORCES
THURSDAY, 22 MARCH 1945
FTP SITES
  1. ftp.rutgers.edu in directory pub/wwii/usaf
  2. byrd.mu.wvnet.edu (129.71.32.152) in pub/history/military/airforce/
     wwii_chronology

AIRCRAFT MENTIONED IN THIS REPORT:
  A-20, Douglas Havoc
  A-26, Douglas Invader
  B-17, Boeing Flying Fortress
  B-24, Consolidated Liberator
  B-25, North American Mitchell
  B-26, Martin Marauder
  B-29, Boeing Superfortress
  UC-64, Noorduyn Norseman
  F-5, Lockheed Lightning
  F-6, North American Mustang
  L-1, Stinson Vigilant
  L-4, Piper Cub (Grasshopper)
  L-5, Stinson Sentinel
  P-47, Republic Thunderbolt
  P-51, North American Mustang

NOTE: A number in parenthesis after a target name indicates the number of
bombers attacking.

CHINA-BURMA-INDIA THEATER

  CHINA THEATER (Fourteenth Air Force): In China, 24 fighter-bombers and a
single B-25 attack railroad traffic and railroad yards in and around
Shihkiachwang, at Chukiatsi, and from Sinsiang to Chenghsien.

  HQ AAF (Twentieth Air Force): Mission 45: 76 of 78 B-29s, operating in 2
waves, blast storage dumps at Rangoon, Burma without loss.

  INDIA-BURMA THEATER (Tenth Air Force): In Burma, 16 fighter-bombers support
Chinese ground forces near Hsipaw; 12 B-25s and 41 fighter-bombers hit
numerous targets along and immediately behind the enemy lines; troops,
supplies, and communications are attacked and 2 bridges are knocked out; 547
air supply sorties are flown to forward areas; the 71st Liaison Squadron,
Tenth Air Force [attached to 1st Liaison Group (Provisional)], moves from
Katha to Myitkyina with L-1s, L-4s, L-5s and UC-64s.

EUROPEAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS (ETO)

  STRATEGIC OPERATIONS (Eighth Air Force): 2 missions are flown.
  Mission 906: Air attacks in preparation for the lower Rhine River crossing
by Allied ground forces continue; 1,331 bombers and 662 fighters attack
barracks and military encampments in the Ruhr and airfields in Germany
visually; they claim 27-1-12 Luftwaffe aircraft; 1 B-17 and 3 P-51s are lost:
  1. 99 of 114 B-17s hit Ahlhorn Airfield; 13 others hit the marshalling yard
at Oldenburg, a target of opportunity; 1 B-17 is lost; 9 airmen are MIA.
Escorting are 95 of 99 P-51s.
  2. 457 B-17s are sent to hit military camps at Bottrop (36), Dorsten (74),
Barningholten (111), Westerholt (116), Feldhausen N (74) and S (39); 3 B-17s
are damaged beyond repair and 111 damaged; 2 airmen are KIA and 8 WIA. The
escort is 95 of 99 P-51s.
  3. 297 B-17s are sent to hit military camps at Hinsbeck (67), Geresheim
(73), Ratingen (75) and Mulheim (74); 114 B-17s are damaged and 3 airmen are
WIA. 48 P-51s escort; they claim 0-0-1 aircraft on the ground.
  4. 342 B-24s are dispatched to hit airfields at Kitzingen (168),
Giebelstadt (75) and Schwab Hall (82); 8 others hit Wurzburg, the secondary
target; 1 B-24 is damaged beyond repair and 1 damaged; 8 airmen are KIA. The
escort is 138 of 153 P-51s; they claim 3-0-1 aircraft in the air and 13-0-7
on the ground.
  5. 109 of 113 B-17s hit the Rhein Main Airfield at Frankfurt; 31 B-17s are
damaged. Escorting are 56 P-51s.
  6. 6 B-17s fly a screening mission.
  7. 19 of 22 P-51s escort 19 of 22 F-5s on photo reconnaissance missions
over Germany; they claim 11-1-3 aircraft in the air.
  8. 2 B-17s and 31 of 32 P-51s fly a scouting mission.
  9. 150 of 153 P-51s escort Fifteenth AF bombers from Italy.
  Mission 907: 9 of 10 B-24s drop leaflets in the Netherlands and Germany.

  TACTICAL OPERATIONS (Ninth Air Force): In Germany, nearly 800 A-20s, A-26s,
and B-26s bomb 9 communications centers and a marshalling yard E of the Rhine
River (plus 7 towns, flak positions, and a target of opportunity) as part of
the interdiction program to impede the movement of supplies and troops;
fighters escort the bombers, attack railroads and other assigned targets, fly
patrols and armed reconnaissance, support the US 1st and 9th Infantry
Divisions SE of Honnef and along the Wied River, cooperate with the XII Corps
as it begins crossing the Rhine River in the Mainz-Oppenheim areas and with
the XX Corps which begins an attack on Ludwigshafen. HQ 69th Tactical
Reconnaissance Group and the 10th Tactical Reconnaissance Squadron arrive at
Nancy, France from the US with F-6s; HQ 474th Fighter Group moves from
Florennes, Belgium to Strassfeld, Germany; the 31st Tactical Reconnaissance
Squadron, Ninth AF [attached to 9th Tactical Reconnaissance Group
(Provisional)], arrives at Maastricht, the Netherlands from the US with F-6s;
the 72d Liaison Squadron, Ninth Air Force (attached to Sixth Army Group),
moves from Buhl to Sarreguemines, France with L-5s.

MEDITERRANEAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS (MTO)

  STRATEGIC OPERATIONS (Fifteenth Air Force): 680+ B-17s and B-24s (with
Eighth and Fifteenth AF fighter escort) hit the Ruhland, Germany and Kralupy
and Vltava, Czechoslovakia oil refineries (some bombers on the Ruhland raid
bomb the Lauta aluminum works to the N), a railroad communications and
ordnance depot, a marshalling yard, and 2 oil refineries at Vienna, Austria,
marshalling yards at Graz, Wels, Zeltweg and Klagenfurt, Austria, and
Neratovice, Czechoslovakia, and scattered targets of opportunity;
reconnaissance and reconnaissance escort missions are also flown.

  TACTICAL OPERATIONS (Twelfth Air Force): In Italy during the night of 21/22
Mar, A-20s and A-26s continue intruder raids concentrating on Po River
crossings in the E Po Valley; during the day P-47s blast rail lines, trains
and other communications targets, especially in the E Po Valley and areas to
the N. In Austria, B-25s destroy a bridge at Brixlegg, severely damage the
Steinach bridge, and hit bridge approaches at Muhlberg and the town of Matrei
am Brenner. Weather prevents successful attacks on 2 targets in N Italy.

PACIFIC OCEAN AREA (POA)

  AAFPOA
    Seventh Air Force: On Chichi Jima Island, 13 B-24s from Guam Island bomb
Susaki Airfield. 20 B-24s from Angaur Island bomb Cebu Island.  During the
night of 22/23 Mar, 4 B-24s from Guam Island make individual raids on Susaki
Airfield.
    VII Fighter Command: 16 Iwo-based P-51s bomb and strafe a weather station
 fuel storage, and radar installations on Chichi Jima.

SOUTHWEST PACIFIC AREA [SWPA, Far East Air Force (FEAF)]: On Cebu Island,
B-24s and A-20s (along with US Marine Corps aircraft) hit Cebu City, defenses
at several locations on Cebu, and targets on Inampulugan Island nearby. On
Luzon Island, B-24s, B-25s, A-20s, and fighters continue to hit numerous
objectives, chiefly Balete Pass, Tangadon, San Fernando, and the Batangas
areas. On Formosa, other B-24s hit Tainan and Okayama Airfields, destroying
several hangars, planes, and gun positions. The 64th Bombardment Squadron
(Heavy), 43d Bombardment Group (Heavy), moves from Tacloban, Leyte Island to
Clark Field, Luzon with B-24s; the 69th and 100th Bombardment Squadrons
(Medium), 42d Bombardment Group (Medium), cease operating from Morotai Island
with B-25s and move to base at Puerto Princesa, Palawan Island; the 75th
Bombardment Squadron (Medium), 42d Bombardment Group (Medium), moves from
Sansapor, New Guinea to Puerto Princesa, Palawan with B-25s; and the 868th
Bombardment Squadron (Heavy), Thirteenth AF, moves from Noemfoor Island, New
Guinea to Morotai Island with B-24s (the squadron uses airborne radar for
low-level attacks at night and for pathfinder operations).

SOURCES:
AIR FORCE COMBAT UNITS OF WORLD WAR II, Office of Air Force History,
  Headquarters USAF, 1961, ISBN 0-912799-02-1
COMBAT SQUADRONS OF THE AIR FORCE, WORLD WAR II, Office of Air Force
  History, Headquarters USAF 1982
THE ARMY AIR FORCES IN WORLD WAR II: COMBAT CHRONOLOGY, 1941-1945 by the
  Office of Air Force History, Headquarters USAF, 1973
THE MIGHTY EIGHTH WAR DIARY by Roger A. Freeman, ISBN 1-85409-071-2

Jack McKillop
USAF (Airways and Air Communications Service)
1955-59

-------------------------------------------------------------------
|  Jack McKillop         |  Those who have long enjoyed such      |
|  Bellcore              |  privileges as we enjoy forget in      |
|  Piscataway, NJ USA    |  time that men have died to win them.  |
|  [email-masked]  |                       FDR              |
-------------------------------------------------------------------

22/0115Z MAR

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 21 Mar 1995 20:15:40 EST
From:    William Lippert <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Hitler's Uniform On Display

On Tue, 21 Mar 1995 19:20:50 EST Paul Gregor said:
>I read the interesting post with regard to Hitlers uniform. A few years
>back, the popular magazine Archaeology did an article concerning a recently
>rediscovered bunker used by the Liebstandarte Adolf Hitler near the
>chancellery.  The bunker was adorned with frescoes, one of which portrayed
>SS troopers shielding a German family;.  The article went on to discuss the
>preservation issues facing archaeologists in Germany.  Should the remains
>of an unpleasant past be destroyed? From my point of view this plays into
>the hands of those that would deny the holocaust.  A public display is an
>issue for debate, but I can't see destroying the uniform.
>
>                                           Just my thoughts
>
>                                             Paul Gregor

   I read about that Liebenstandarte bunker thing in the Washington Post.
Unfortunately, in that case at least, I believe making it into a public
relic had considerable problems, which you can find with the preservation
of many historical places and items.  These include costs for maintenance,
personnel, pamphlets and advertising, parking, handicap access, etc.  You
get the general idea.  So in this case, we just can't say, "it must be
preserved!"  There is the realistic aspect to consider.

William Lippert
The American University

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 21 Mar 1995 20:37:00 EST
From:    mc killop <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: James Howard

 >>From Jack McKillop:
 >
 >>The Associated Press is reporting that retired USAF Brigadier
 >>General James H. Howard has died at Belleair Bluffs, Florida.  He
 >>was 81.
 >>
 >>In 1944, Howard was a P-51 pilot with the Ninth Air Force when he
 >>single-handedly attacked 30 Luftwaffe aircraft that were attacking
 >>AAF bombers.  He shot down four aircraft and damaged others before
 >>returning to base in England.  He was awarded the Medal of Honor
 >>for this mission, the only fighter pilot in the European Theater to
 >>win the award.  I believe he had fought in China with the AVG
 >>(????) and his aircraft bore a Chinese expression which for the
 >>life of me I cannot remember.
 >>
 >>In 1945, Howard became commander of Pinellas AAFld (now St
 >>Petersburg-Clearwater International Airport).
 >>
 >>Requiescat in pace.
 >
 >His P-51B was named "Ding Hao", which is supposed to be the Chinese
 >equivalent of "Okay".  354th FG(?)
 >
 >Dennis E. Sparks
 >[email-masked]
 >Lexington, Kentucky

Dennis gets a cigar (if that is still PC!).  The mission for which
Howard won the Medal of Honor took place on 11 Jan 44.  Howard was
Commanding Officer of the 356th Fighter Squadron, 354th Fighter
Group, Ninth Air Force at Boxted, England.   On that date, the
356th, equipped with P-51Bs, escorted Eighth Air Force B-17s to hit
the aircraft factories at Oschersleben and Halberstadt.  Howard, a
former AVG pilot with 6.5 Japanese victories, shot down an Me 110
but lost contact with the rest of the group in the process.  He
found himself escorting a B-17 wing by himself; the wing was under
attack by Luftwaffe aircraft.  Howard, who was 6 foot 2 inches
(187cm) tall, was flying his P-51B named DING HAO.  He spent the
next 30 minutes chasing 30 some Luftwaffe fighters.  After two
encoutners, 2 of his 4 machine guns jammed.  During his next
attack, the third machine gun jammed.  With only one gun working,
Howard "stooged" up to the enemy aircraft suddenly and then backed
away as they broke.  He had two further encounters before he
terminated the action and returned to Boxted.  He was credited with
shooting down 4 aircraft and probably destroying or damaging 3
others.  Lieutenant Colonel Allison C Brooks, the B-17 wing leader,
said, "It was a case of one lone American against what seemed to be
the entire Luftwaffe."  Other B17 crew members called him "the
one-man Air Force."

Howard was a double ace with 12.3 aircraft credited during the war.

-------------------------------------------------------------------
|  Jack McKillop              |  Those who have long enjoyed such |
|  Bellcore                   |  privileges as we enjoy forget in |
|  Piscataway, NJ USA         |  time that men have died to win   |
|  [email-masked]  |  them.                     FDR    |
-------------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 21 Mar 1995 21:04:07 -0500
From:    chris garcia <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: More on Bong

On Wed, 15 Mar 1995, Robert T. Moore wrote:

> Hello, Chris!
>
> Thanks for the post.
>
>  If he'd had a wingman it didn't do
> > him any good.
>
>     Perhaps in that situation, but attacking a bomber formation is
> not the same thing as a dogfight with opposing fighters, where mutual
> protection is essential, and a good wingman will always stick with
> his leader.
>
>     Thanks for allowing my comment. Please let me hear yours.
>
I haven't been on this list for so many days I kindof forgot what I
wrote.  Steinhoff's book "Messerschmitt's Over Sicily", is interesting
because of two themes he shows in his experience.  He had cometo Sicly
from the eastern front, after the defeat at Stalingrad.  His faith in the
Luftwaffe leadership, except for Galland, had been badly eroded by the
mismanagement of thinsg there.  Galland had been leading fighters against
the US 8th Air Force for quitea while and had cometo show them how to
shoot down bombers.  That's what they were having so much trouble with.
It was during this time that Goering issued the order that they would
choose amoung themselves from every fighter group a man to be court
marshalled for cowardice as a result of their failureto shoot down
bombers.  Although this never cameto pass, the fact that he had given
them such an order destroyed morale amoung the fighters, and eventually
widened the rift between Galland and Goering, which eventually resulted
in a shouting match at an officers meeting where Galland stood up and,
shouting his outrage at Goering's mistreatment of the Jagdwaffe, tore off
his Knight's Cross in front of everyone and threw it at Goering.
     Reading the book it is interesting to realise that everything in
this worldf of air combat hadto be learned literaly "on the fly".  They
didn't know how to shoot down heavy bombers.  When they got the Me262's
they didn't know how to fight in a jet.  They had to figure out new
things as they went along.

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 21 Mar 1995 21:15:00 EST
From:    mc killop <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Grenada Army Airfield, MS.

 >Hello all.
 >
 > I am seeking information on the Grenada Army Air Field,
 >Grenada, Mississippi and it's associated rifle range as
 >part of a DERP-FUDS study designed to determine whether
 >the site needs to be remediated due to it's use during the
 >period July 1942 through March 1945.
 >
 > I am interested in the following units stationed at the
 >GAAF:
 >    443d Base Headquarters and Air Base Squadron.
 >    63d Troop Carrier Group.
 >
 > Also would anyone happen to know what the acronym
 >HITTC stands for? I suppose the TCC is for Troop Carrier
 >Command (Paratrooper chauffeurs and glider tug pilots) but the
 >HI portion has me stumped.  Additionally, would anyone happen
 >to know which sidearms (if any) were typically carried by C-47
 >and C-60 aircrew as well as some idea of how much training
 >they actually accomplished with their sidearms (if any).
 >
 >Any and all responses are welcome.
 >
 > Mike LaForge

Mike,

Here is what I got.

The I Troop Carrier Command was activated as the Air Transport Command on
30 Apr 42 and was redesignated on 4 Jul 42.  This command was responsible
for training troop carrier wings and groups for airborne operations.  On
20 May 42, command headquarters were located in a cantonment adjacent to
Stout Field, the municipal airport at Indianapolis, Indiana.  In addition
to Stout Field, the I TCC sponsored the building of 8 new airfields, two of
which it gave up without having occuupied the, and the improviement of 3
pre-Pearl Harbor bases.  The I TCC transferred Blythe AAFld, California and
Ardmore AAFld, Oklahoma to the Second and Third Air Forces without
occupying them.  It gave Florence AAFld, South Carolina to the Third Air
Force in Mar 43.  The three old fields regularly used by the command were
Bowman Field, Louisville, Kentucky; Lawson Field, Ft Benning, Georgia; and
Pope Field, Ft Bragg, North Carolina.  New fields constructed were
Bergstrom Field, Austin, Texas; Laurinburg-Maxton AAB, Maxton, North
Carolina; Alliance AAFld, Nebraska; Sedalia AABld, Knobnoster, Missouri;
and Grenada AAFld, Mississippi.

The 63d Troop Carrier Group had been activated on 1 Dec 40 at Wright
Field, Dayton, Ohio as the 63d Transport Group.  The 9th Transport Squadron
was activated at Patterson Field, Dayton, Ohio, at the same time and was the
only squadron assigned to the group for the next six months.  The 9th was
equipped with C-33s, C-34s and C-39s throught 1941.  On 17 Feb 41, HQ 63d
TCG moved to Patterson Field and on 10 May 41, the 3d Transport Squadron
at Duncan Field, San Antonio, Texas, equipped with C-33s and C-39s, was
also assigned to the group.  The group HQ moved to Brookley Field, Mobile,
Alabama on 9 Sep 41 followed by the 9th TS on 18 Sep and they began
transporting supplies, material and personnnel to the Caribbean area. The
63d was assigned to the Air Transport Command in Apr 42 and the 63d and 9th
moved to Camp Williams, Wisconsin on 24 May 42 followed by the 3d on 29
May.  By this time, they were flying C-47s and C-53s and continued to fly
these aircraft until 1944.  Two additional squadrons were assigned in Jun
42 to bring the group up to full strenth; the 6th Transport Squadron at
Camp Williams was assigned sometime in Jun and the 52d Troop Carrier
Squadron was activated at Camp Williams on 15 Jun.  On 4 Jul 44, these units
were redesignated Troop Carrier Group/Squadrons and the Air Transport Command
became the I Troop Carrier Command.

The 63d continued training and moved to Dodd Field, Texas on 18 Sep 42
where the 60th Troop Carrier Squadron was activated on 26 Oct 42.  The 60th
was activated to replace the 6th Troop Carrier Squadron which transferred
to New Guinea in the Fall of 1942 and was reassigned to the 374th Troop
Carrier Group in Nov.

Training continued at Victorville, California from 18 Nov 42 and then
Lawson Field, Georgia on 7 May 43.  The group and four squadrons moved to
Grenada AAFld, Mississippi on 3 Jun 43 and began training replacement
crews in Jul 43.  On 17 Jan 44, the 9th Troop Carrier Squadron departed
Grenada for Hawaii and was reassigned to the Seventh Air Force on 3 Feb
44. Two days later, on 19 Jan 44, the 63d and the 3d, 52d and 60th
squadrons moved from Grenada to Sedalis AAFld, Missouri where all three
units were disbanded on 14 Apr 44.

-------------------------------------------------------------------
|  Jack McKillop              |  Those who have long enjoyed such |
|  Bellcore                   |  privileges as we enjoy forget in |
|  Piscataway, NJ USA         |  time that men have died to win   |
|  [email-masked]  |  them.                     FDR    |
-------------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 21 Mar 1995 09:54:08 -0600
From:    Kelvin Brent Luther <[email-masked]>
Subject: <No subject given>

        I've got questions on three subjects for anyone out there who can
enlighten me on them.

1.  Has anyone heard of the Bachstelze and it's usage.  Apparently it was
a rarely used kite like apparatus with a platform towed behind a U-boat.
An observer would be up on the platform looking for targets!  From what
little I have read it was used only in the South Atlantic.

2.  I have come across mention of a British naval installation known as
Base T or Port T in the Southern Maldives.  Apparently it was so top
secret and well hidden the Japanese never learned of it's existance.
With all the havoc they reaped in the Indian Ocean I am curious if there
was a special reason for the security apart from the obvious advantage of
simply having a safe port.  Any history of its use would interest me.

3.  I have read a short account of the USS Antares, a repair ship that
spotted a Japanese midget submarine trying to follow it into Pearl
through the anti-sub nets on the morning of Dec. 07.  It was apparently
sunk at 6:45 AM by the USS Ward.  As  the first bombs dropped at 7:55
does  anyone know if the account is accurate.  Can you then explain the
sinking as the US was not yet at war.  I would think that a sub
attempting to enter Pearl would itself been seen as a hostile act and
perhaps this was reason enough.  If this is the case was there a delay in
reporting the incident?  I do not want to prompt Pearl Harbor
conspiracy theories and do not subscribe to them but if
this is a true account it would be interesting to know what happened.

Thanks in advance for any help anyone out there can give me.
Kelvin Luther

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 21 Mar 1995 22:57:53 -0500
From:    Ben Frank <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: JAMES HOWARD

Sorry, Steve, but when I was in China, "Ding Hao" meant "very good," and "Ding
Ding Hao" meant "very, very good." Ben Frank

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 21 Mar 1995 22:57:57 -0500
From:    Ben Frank <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: HITLER'S UNIFORM O

Sorry, but it wasn't Maplethorpe who photographed the cross in a test tube of
urine, but another "noteworthy" artist, whose name escapes me at this moment,
and probably just as well. I probably should have written "artist," with
quotes, as well. Ben Frank

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 21 Mar 1995 22:57:02 -0500
From:    Jodi Berls <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Mountbatten Pink

Doug Donnell wrote:

> Hey, maybe the movie "Operation Petticoat" wasn't all wrong :-)

Arrgh. Yeah, it was, on many levels. :-)

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 21 Mar 1995 22:57:47 -0500
From:    Jodi Berls <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Wahoo War Reports

Thomas Wildenberg wrote:

>For those of you interested in same the War Patrol for Wahoo (First >-Sixth
Patrols Aug 42/Aug 43) can be found in fiche # 1146-1148, >microfilm series
M1752.

Thanks very much.

Jodi Berls
[email-masked]

------------------------------

Date:    Tue, 21 Mar 1995 23:06:55 -0500
From:    Chuck McCormick <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: your mail

On Tue, 21 Mar 1995, Kelvin Brent Luther wrote:

> 3.  I have read a short account of the USS Antares, a repair ship that
> spotted a Japanese midget submarine trying to follow it into Pearl
> through the anti-sub nets on the morning of Dec. 07.  It was apparently
> sunk at 6:45 AM by the USS Ward.  As  the first bombs dropped at 7:55
> does  anyone know if the account is accurate.  Can you then explain the
> sinking as the US was not yet at war.  I would think that a sub
> attempting to enter Pearl would itself been seen as a hostile act and
> perhaps this was reason enough.  If this is the case was there a delay in
> reporting the incident?  I do not want to prompt Pearl Harbor
> conspiracy theories and do not subscribe to them but if
> this is a true account it would be interesting to know what happened.

It is generally considered a bad idea to try to enter a US Navy Port,
unauthorized, at night, in a submerged submarine.  If you were to try such a
stunt today you might find your boat depth-charged, or worse.  Whether
there is a war declared or not is immaterial.

The Ward did report the attack on the midget sub to the Base Officer
on duty and I believe the report was passed on, perhaps even to Adm.
Kimmel.  The problem was that everyone had 'war jitters' and reports of
enemy subs occured frequently.  I think other USN ships had depth-charged
what they though were unidentified subs in the Hawaiian Islands previous
to December 7th.  Also, just because one midget sub tried to sneak into
the harbor in the middle of the night does not mean that a suprise air
attack is going to happen within hours!

By the way, the Ward was crewed by Naval Reservists from St. Paul,
Minnesota.  The former crewmen of the Ward formed a club called the
'first shot club' after the war and I think that the 5" gun that fired
the first US shots in WWII sits someplace near the State Capitol Building
in ST. Paul.

The best source on events leading up to and including Pearl Harbor is "At
Dawn We Slept" by Gordon Prange.

Chuck
[email-masked]

------------------------------

End of WWII-L Digest - 20 Mar 1995 to 21 Mar 1995
*************************************************