Mendele: Yiddish literature and language ______________________________________________________ Contents of Vol. 07.170 March 14, 1998 1) kurve (Hugh Denman) 2) Leo Rosten's _The Joys of Yiddish_ (Al Grand) 3) Sarah B. Smith (Ben Steinberg) 4) Mirele Efros (Nina Warnke) 5) interes in yidish tsvishn ba'aley tshuva (Miki Safadi) 6) Same sound, different meaning (Morrie Feller) 7) translating Yiddish phrases (Hershl Hartman) 8) Adar (David Herskovic) 9) expressions (Sarah Faerman) 1)---------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 11 Mar 1998 03:02:16 +0100 From: Hugh Denman Subject: kurve Meyer-Leyb Wolf raises some interesting points [07.167:8] concerning the etymology of 'kurve' [a question to which, I might mention in parentheses, my nuts-and-sledgehammer trope was never applied]. The H/A suggestion was intended as a suggestion. As I said, it is just what I have been inclined to assume in the past without thinking about the question too much. However, I still believe that a 'proto-Slavic' origin is unlikely. If the derivation were Slav, Preobrazhensky would not have to posit a tentative Old High German source that he himself regards as dubious. Furthermore, were the word to be found in Slav languages not themselves in contact with Yiddish, this would be inconclusive, since a word once borrowed can easily be passed on, particularly in the case of racy, slang terms. (The only Bulgarian dictionary I have to hand does not list the word, but that is not conclusive either, of course). Again, if 'kurve' were indeed pronounced [kurve] throughout Yiddishland, this would tell us nothing, since it is not at all uncommon for words to be borrowed from a language and returned at a later date or at another place. On the other hand if [kirve] and [kerve] are attested anywhere this would go a long way to substantiate my hypothesis. Did the Atlas questionnaire include such indelicate topics or can some Mendelyaner with personal experience of Galitsyaner low-life please enlighten us? Hugh Denman 2)---------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 11 Mar 1998 09:22:07 EST From: Savoyid Subject: Leo Rosten's _The Joys of Yiddish_ I wish to respond to the startling revelation in Peter Gutmann's posting on Leo Rosten (Vol 07.167 ) that _The Joys of Yiddish_ "is used it as a source for information and, most of all, for quotes in academic papers on Yiddishkeyt." If this be true then _s'iz az okh un vey_ to the academics who visited _Joys_ for anything other than to lament. But why don't we hear from the Yiddish scholars themselves? Are you out there listening Dr.Mordkhe Schaechter, Dr. Sheva Zucker, Zelig Bach, Sholem Berger, Eli Wiesel, Dr.Shikl Fishman, Dr. Benyomen Hrushovski, Yosl and Chana Mlotek, Miriam Hoffman, Dr. David Fishman, Dr. David Roskies, Avrom Sutzkever, Motkhe Shtrigler, Yankev Goldstein, Dr. Esther Himelshteyn and Leybl Botvinik? How often have you or any of your colleagues or students dipped into Rosten as a source of information? Al Grand 3)---------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 11 Mar 1998 10:04:58 -0500 (EST) From: Ben Steinberg Subject: Sarah B. Smith I am looking for information about the Yiddish writer Sarah B. Smith, beyond what is available in the Leksikon fun der nayer Yidisher literatur and Reisen's Leksikon. Briefly, she was born in Hungary in 1888, and came to the U.S. at the age of 15. She wrote for the Forverts, Morgn-Zshurnal, Tog, and others, and reported on courts and crime in NYC. She also wrote in English, including a play called Piper Paid and another play which was made into the film My Sister Tisa. I have not been able to find any information on her outside of the Leksikon article, except for a few reviews; can anyone add anything to this? Please reply to the list and to brsteinb@ajhs.org. Many thanks. Ben Steinberg 4)---------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 11 Mar 1998 10:33:35 -0500 (EST) From: Nina Warnke Subject: Mirele Efros Steven Cassedy asked about the "shtekn" in Gordin's Mirele Efros. Gordin's script refers to Mirele's cane several times in the last act. I don't recall the film version but in all photographs that I have seen of the play's performances Mirele is shown as an old woman with a cane. It is, in fact, probably the most pervasive image of Mirele. Nina Warnke 5)---------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 11 Mar 1998 09:44:12 -0800 From: michaela safadi Subject: interes in yidish tsvishn ba'aley tshuva Tsi veyst emetser vegn interes in lernen yidish tsvishn di ba'aley tshuva arum der velt? Vu ken men gefinen tsitatn vegn azelkhe forshungen? Does anyone know about interest in learning Yiddish among ba'aley tshuva around the world? Where can one find citations about such research? Miki Safadi 6)---------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 11 Mar 1998 11:23:19 -1000 From: feller@indirect.com (Morris Feller) Subject: Same sound, different meaning I know there is a special term to designate two words which sound alike but have different meanings. And there probably are words in different languages which sound the same but have a separate meaning in each language. This is probably true of Yiddish and other languages. However, to find a complete sentence in one language having meaning in another language is probably much rarer. I recall hearing many years ago such an example of a sentence which when pronounced had a definite meaning, within limits, both in Yiddish and in Spanish. Thus in Yiddish: Ah ki est un a meser, A cow eats without a knife. Spanish: Aqui esta una mesa. Here is a table. I wonder is anyone knows of other examples similar to the above which have Yiddish as one of the sentences. Morrie Feller Phoenix 7)---------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 11 Mar 1998 14:46:52 EST From: Hershl Subject: translating Yiddish phrases I have forwarded Parshandoso's queries (07.164) to my favorite expert and we can expect a reply almost momentarily unless, of course, his computer is down until after Friday, the 13th, since he happens to live in a walled city. In the meantime, I would caution all Mendelyaner, Mendelistn and abiver es hot got in hartsn un a khush far humor NOT to send e-mail to my favorite expert, lest the electronic powers-that-be take urgent umbrage. (And is that last word derived from Middle High or Middle Low Aramaic? I must remember to ask vayzusu.) Hershl Hartman, stamalets, CA 8)---------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 11 Mar 1998 19:30:33 +0000 From: David Herskovic Subject: Adar My father tells me that in der haym fleygt men zogn 'shvat tonye brat; uder tonye bruder'.(Or something like that.) It means Shvat in not a friend and Adar is not a brother, a reference to the cold months. David Herskovic 9)---------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 12 Mar 1998 11:49:34 -0500 From: Sarah_Faerman@tvo.org (Sarah Faerman) Subject: expressions My mother came from a shtetl Pavoloch near Kiev. She used many colourful expressions. Here are two that I have not heard elsewhere: 1. "Odem a mentsch un katchke rik zich" (This I understood as poking fun at someone who was trying to act big or grand). 2. "Shoyn chasene gemacht" (indicating something that got used up very fast) Sound familiar to anyone? Sarah Faerman ______________________________________________________ End of Mendele Vol. 07.170 Address for the postings to Mendele: mendele@lists.yale.edu Address for the list commands: listproc@lists.yale.edu Mendele on the Web: http://www2.trincoll.edu/~mendele http://sunsite.unc.edu/yiddish/mendele.html