Mendele: Yiddish literature and language ______________________________________________________ Contents of Vol. 08.061 September 20, 1998 A gut yor! 1) Shnipishok & Butshatsh (Mikhl Herzog) 2) Sholem Asch's son (Sylvia Schildt) 3) Yiddish as a Foreign Language in Israel (Lucas Bruyn) 4) Symposium for Yiddish Studies in Germany (Marion Aptroot) 5) feygl (Stan Nadel) 6) Back to Feygl (Mikhl Herzog) 7) leshone toyve (Feygl Infeld Glezer) 8) Oxymoron af yiddish (Itsik Shteyn) 9) tsu libe fraynt (gershn un nechame vainer) 1)---------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 13 Sep 1998 23:18:38 -0400 (EDT) From: "Mikhl Herzog" Subject: Shnipishok & Butshatsh These ar real places. Offhand, I don't know where the former is, but the latter is a well-known location in Galicia (Southern Poland). I think that both Dov Sadan and Agnon were from Butshatsh. There are a number of other real locations that figure in Yiddish expressions designating far away, presumably mythical place: "in Loyvitsh" (in Poland), "in Trok" (in Lithuania), "in di Bonifratn" (mental hospitals run by a monastic order in various Polish towns), "in Boyberik" (a locatable town under a similar sounding name in the Ukraine), "in Yehupets" ("pseudonym" for Kiev)--both of the latter made famous by Sholem Aleichem, "in Hotseplots" (in or near Czechoslovakia, as I recall). An unspecified location, "hinter di harey-khoyshekh" is, of course, not to be found on any real map. Altogether, an interesting subject for study--the geographic distribution of various place-names that assumed a mythical character. Mikhl Herzog 2)---------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 15:19:13 -0400 (EDT) From: Pcreativa@charm.net (Sylvia Schildt) Subject: Sholem Asch's son There's an Asch book in translation called "This I Believe". Moe Asch was more than a folk song collector - he was the founder of Folkways records, with its repertoire of thousands of titles. These records are now part of the Smithsonian Folkways division. Smithsonian may have Moe Asch materieal as well. Sylvia Schildt 3)---------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 16:30:43 -0400 (EDT) From: troia Subject: Yiddish as a Foreign Language in Israel. 'Foreign Language' and 'Second Language' teaching are terms used in a specific context. To give an example, English is a 'Second Language' in India and taught as such. English is the language that speakers of different local languages have in common there. In France English is a foreign language. If English is taught in England or America to non-native speakers it is called English as a second language. The differences are not always as clear. In Holland English is a foreign language, on the edge of being a second language - for instance since some university courses are taught in English. If Yiddish is taught to Israelis who use the language in their daily life, within a Yiddish speaking community, we would call it Yiddish as a second language teaching; if it is taught to Israelis who don't know any Yiddish, but study it in order to read literature or to communicate with their grandmother, it would be called Yiddish as a foreign language. Both approaches require a different teaching programme, using different teaching materials and techniques. No reason for Sylvia Schildt to get so exited about the word 'foreign', which is appropriate because she seems to want to include even the Falashas in her teaching programme. I would like to remind her that she has not answered any questions relating to the issue of Yiddish in Israel yet (where did the money go ???) and that her clarion call seems rather monotonous. Lucas Bruyn. 4)---------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 17 Sep 1998 07:07:29 -0400 (EDT) From: aptroot@phil-fak.uni-duesseldorf.de (Marion Aptroot) Subject: Symposium for Yiddish Studies in Germany The program of the First Annual Symposium for Yiddish Studies in Germany (7-8 October 1998) is available on the internet: http://www.phil-fak.uni-duesseldorf.de/jiddisch/ Those who do not have internet access can obtain the program via e-mail: jiddisch@phil-fak.uni-duesseldorf.de Marion Aptroot, Duesseldorf 5)---------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 17 Sep 1998 12:48:25 -0500 From: Stan Nadel ) Subject: feygl Wouldn't this in turn suggest that "feygle," as the Yiddish slang translation for the disparaging term "fairy," is derived from a German word for violet rather than the more obvious little bird? That seems unlikely on its face. Besides, my grandfather used the same word, Feygl, for both the little bird who told him things (when asked where he had heard something), and for his sister's name. I'm forced to conclude, that if the name Faygl ever had any origins in a German dialect word for Violet, that meaning had been lost by the time my great-grandparents named my great-aunt Feygl--and that native speakers of Yiddish in late 19th century Vilna Gubernia (at least) clearly understood it to mean bird. When it comes to languages, I'll rely on native speakers over logical deductions as to what is likely or unlikely every time. Stan Nadel 6)---------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 18 Sep 1998 00:47:32 -0400 (EDT) From: "Mikhl Herzog" Subject: Back to Feygl To Meyer Wolf, et al: My apologies. I may have "misspoken" in citing German _Voeglein_ as the variant of _Veilchen_ 'violet' from which the Yiddish name Feygl is derived. I believe that I discovered that entry in a German dialect dictionary (in Germany). However, the only relevant variant of _Veilchen_ 'violet' thatl I can confirm with materials at hand is _Veigelein_ (a perfect cognate). See, for example, Wildhagen, s.v. Veigelein: 'wallflower' Veilchen 'violet'. Kluge, s.v. Veilchen: .... Auf obd. -lein is das in Mundarten und Volksliedern lebendige Veigelein gebildet, das auf mhd _violin_ zurueckgeht. In other words, it remains that the Yiddish name _Feygl_ concerns violets, not birds. As to Meyer question "What reason is there to prefer the flower source to the bird source?": If he were the father of girls (unlike me, he's not), he could answer the question himself. I can understand naming a little girl "Bird" or "Birdy", but "BIRDS"? A nekhtiker tog! (Yes, I know that a back-formation from the diminutive Feygele is also a possibility, but I'll stick to my guns.) A gut un gezunt yor aykh alemen!! Mikhl Herzog 7)---------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 17 Sep 1998 21:40:10 -0400 (EDT) From: yiddish1@juno.com (Feigl I Glaser) Subject: leshone toyve leshone toyve tikoseyvu -- ale, ale vu ir zayt! leshone toyve tikoseyvu -- say fun noent, say fun vayt! kh'vintsch aykh ale, mendelyaner, un mendelyanerkes yung un alt -- a gezunt un freylekh yor, un sholem oyf der gantser velt! un kumen vet avelt fun sholem ven mentshn veln dos farshteyn, az andere felker, gloybns, rasn hobn rekhtn, vertn, prakht un kheyn. ayer, feygl infeld glezer 8)---------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 18 Sep 1998 10:51:54 -0400 (EDT) From: shteyn@juno.com (Isak Shteyn) Subject: Oxymoron af yiddish In mendele 08.058 hat sikh emetser nokhgefregt af dem bestn peyrush fun oxymoron af yiddish. oyb definirn dem bagrif, volt ikh gezogt az oxymoron iz an ojsdruk basirt af a stire, dehajne"gut in dr'erd" af'n ort fun shlekht, "a gut ojg" af'n ort fun a bejz ojg, "a khelemer khokhem"af'n ort fun a tipesh, sikh "trejstn mit khalushes"vos mejnt nisht geshtorbn-kholile-nor gekhalesht, "melekh evyon", un andere. ikh vinsh ale mendelianer a gut, gesund jor, Itsik Shteyn 9)---------------------------------------------------- Date: Sat, 19 Sep 1998 14:02:54 -0400 (EDT) From: Nechama & Gershon Winer Subject: tsu libe fraynt Aich leebe fraint Foon nechtn, morgn oon foon haint Meer too-en aich gedenkn Oon tzuzamn benkn Der Reboine Shel Oilm zol oondz shenkn ZUM NAI-EM YOR TaSHsNaT Oif ale perzenleeche laidn -- a refoo-e Dee bameeungn far Yidish zoln hobn a p'oole Tzu dee tzores een Yisro-el zol koomn dee y'shoo-e Meet der gantzer velt, meer zoln shoin derlebn dee g'oole Tfeeledeeke voonchn foon Yeroosholaim saame vainer gershn oon nechame ______________________________________________________ End of Mendele Vol. 08.061 Address for the postings to Mendele: mendele@lists.yale.edu Address for the list commands: listproc@lists.yale.edu Mendele on the Web: http://www2.trincoll.edu/~mendele http://sunsite.unc.edu/yiddish/mendele.html