Mendele: Yiddish literature and language ______________________________________________________ Contents of Vol. 08.132 March 15, 1999 1) klal yidish (Feygl Infeld Glezer) 2) book of Yiddish proverbs (Paul Sireci) 3) Yiddish Arthur Conan Doyle (Clifford S. Goldfarb) 4) G. Winer's discussion of Grade (Gitl Dubrovsky) 5) Shneour's Noah Pandre (Marjorie Schonhaut Hirshan) 6) a ditty from Minsker Gubernye (Stanley (Zalman) Matoren) 7) poor judgment, or worse! (Itsik Goldenberg) [Moderator's note] 8) ferd's fus (Chane Honig) 9) Song Lyrics (Lorin Sklamberg) 1)---------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 10 Feb 1999 16:27:21 -0500 (EST) From: Feigl I Glaser Subject: KLALL YIDISH ODER STAM GEHAKT A TSHAYNIK Es zaynen letstns geven a por notitsn fun Mendelyaner, vos hakn a tshaynik un dreyen a spodik in kegnershaft fun klal-yiddish. Vel ikh nit stam farlirn keyn verter un shures zey ibertsutsaygn. Ikh hob gornit kegn di vos hobn zikh keyn mol nit oysgelernt shraybn un leyenen a gutn yidish. Vos ken men nebekh hobn tsu zey, az zeyere eygene lerer zaynen geven bagrenetst un geblibn farshtekt in der metode fun "komets alef = o; komets beis - bo, komets daled = do", ua"v. Ober nemen zikh di khutspe fun lernen mit undz YIDISH-VETERANEN -- Yidish-Toyre, un tsu redn mit bitul un gayve vegn undsere libe lerer un lererkes, lingvistn un lingvistkes, un khosheve organizatsyes - Yivo, Tsish un andere kultur-organizatsyes? Darf men, muz men zey derlangen in kolner arayn. Oyb zey viln efenen di mayler vegn Yidish-loshn, zoln zey araynkukn frier in bikher-katalogn, veln zey zikh dervisn az es vern keseyder gedrukt Yidishe verter-bikher -- in Isroel, in tsofn-Amerike, in dorem-Amerike, un iber gor der velt. Ikh aleyn hob in shtub arum 8-10 Yidish-Englishe verterbikher un oykh punkt azoy fil englishe verterbikher (fun England - Oxford un Collins; fun di Fareinikte Shtatn - Webster's, The American Heritage, u"a. Un az es geyen aroys mer englishe verterbikher vi Yidishe, iz vos? "Kolumbus hot andekt Amerike"! Zey Hobn far undz antplekt, az es zaynen faran merer English-reder, English-lernendike, mer aroysgeber un fondn deroyf vi bay unds. Vos bavayzn zey dermit? Vi ikh hob shoyn frier ongevizn, ken yeder redn vi er vil un vi er ken, ober an inteligenter mentsh prubirt lekhol-hapokhes tsu shraybn in klal Yiddish, vos iz ongenumen gevorn fun der Yidisher kultur-velt in 1929 un nokh a rey konferents fun Yivo mit Tsisho arayngebrakht enderungen in 1934, 1936. Yo, in itstikn moment zaynen mir tsu shvakh tsu makhn groyse enderungen, un say di vos zaynen nit roy deroyf, say afile undsere gelernte zoln aroyftsvingen oyf undz zeyere dyalektn (litvishn, besaraber, amerikaner oder perzenlekhn) un zeyere gedanken. Halt ikh take az di letste haores tsum Yidishn oysleyg, aroysgegebn fun Yivo-Tsisho in 1936 zoln ongenumen vern fun ale, un nit yeder zol zikh makhn shabes far zikh. Biz letstn zaynen nokh geven azelkhe vos hobn geshribn mit shtume alefn un heyen, vu m'darf nit, (azoy vi mayne eltern un mayn zeyde), un yeder redaktor hot zikh gehaltn farn grestn Yidish-spetsyalist un fartaytsher fun Yidishn vort. Ober letsns zaynen forgekumen enderungen. Dovid Kats hot ibergearbet Aleksander Harkavis verterbukh; baarben Dzhin Dzhofen hot aroysgegebn a por bikhlekh in a nishkoshedikn Yidish tsu lernen mit dervaksene un yugntlekhe, di Lubavitsher hobn aroysgegebn a kinder-lernbikhl in a nishkoshedikn Yidish un a tsol ayngeshparte zhurnal un tsaytung-redaktorn bobn zikh untergevorfn (mer veyniker) dem klal-Yidish oysleyg. Hof ikh az di andere, vos haltn nisht fun progres, veln nokhton zeyer bayshpil. A sakh yeshives un religyeze organizatsyes vendn shoyn naye psikhologishe metodn un derfar arayngekrogn a gresere tsol naye "shrekevdike" .Ven mir veln vern genug groys un shtark, veln mir rufn Yidishe Shprakh-un-Kultur Konferentsn, vos veln diskutirn vegn araynbrengen enderungen. Farshteyt zikh, az di tekhnologye vakst un naye verter kumen tsu, un keyner hot nit kegn dem arayntsunemen tsugob-terminologye. Ober m'darf tsugebn, az dos "reynikn" dos loshn fun "Daytshe elementn" dergeyt oft tsu absurdn. English un Hebreish zaynen itst gresere gefarn far Yidish vi Daytsh, ober mir zorgn zikh nor kholile nit tsu nutsn a vort funem modernem Daytsh, beis mir derloybn zikh tsu nutsn a mase Hebreishe "kheyder-oysdrukn" (vos nor a kleyne tsol Yidish reder zaynen mit zey bakant) un Slavishe verter, vos nor di bisl asimilatorn hobn arayngevorfn. Es dermont zikh mir vi mayn bruder Ele hot fun zey khoyzik gemakh: Kkh'bet ihn panno Rozalyo, borgn zo me di vizhimatshko mit de balyo. De vizhimatshko shtayt in keyle, de balyo hot a feyle; kh'vel nisht borgn, kh'vel nisht pozhitshen - de madam vet kimo vet zo kzhitshen. Ikh hob nisht kegn dem az MEKHABER ODER SHRAYBER iz beser tsu nitsn vi FARFASER (ikh halt az farfaser iz nor khal tsu shafn lider oder poemes), az s'iz a bisl shener tsu zogn BINIEN vi GEBAYDE, ikh bin ober nit maskim az di veyniker pasike verter darf men in gantsn aroysvarfn fun der shprakh un az s'iz beser tsu zogn BAYM NIT-ZAYN vi IN DER OPVEZNHAYT, az s'iz beser tsu zogn PIRKUS vi FINANTS, az s'iz beser tsu shraybn FINEF vi FINF, un azoy vayter. Tayere khaveyrim un khavertes, Mendelyaner un Mendelyanerkes, zayt geshtarkt, redt Yidish, leyent Yidish, lernt zikh un andere shraybt un leyenen Yidish , filt zikh fray tsu redn, ober lernt zikh oys shraybn in a gutn klall-Yidish. Beste grusn, Feygl Infeld Glezer 2)---------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 9 Feb 1999 23:39:09 -0500 (EST) From: SpazzSmurf@aol.com Subject: book of Yiddish proverbs The other day i was in Barnes and Noble in the Judaica section and found a fantastic book. It's called Yiddishe Chochma and, as the title suggests, it contains wonderful Yiddish proverbs and expressions that my grandmother used to say. I don't believe that an author took credit for compiling it, but the illustrator was named. There were beautiful Chagall- like paintings scattered within. I highly recommend this book as a family treasure. Paul Sireci 3)---------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 10 Feb 1999 23:42:08 -0500 (EST) From: "Clifford S. Goldfarb" Subject: Yiddish Arthur Conan Doyle Isaac Bashevis Singer said that as a young boy he had been given Yiddish books by Dostoevsky and Arthur Conan Doyle. He said they wrote so beautifully in Yiddish that it motivated him to become a Yiddish writer. I am trying to locate and get originals or copies of all of the works of Arthur Conan Doyle that have been translated into Yiddish (including, but not limited to the Sherlock Holmes stories, of which I already have a number). I have searched most North American and Western European sources. If anybody has any knowledge of such works, or would like to have a list of what I have found so far, please contact me off list. Clifford S. Goldfarb Toronto, Ontario 4)---------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 11 Feb 1999 11:14:45 -0500 (EST) From: GDubrovsky@aol.com Subject: G. Winer's discussion of Grade In Gershon Winer's discussion of Grade's "My Quarrel with Hersh Rasseyner [Vol 08.129], I must add a side light. While I was working on my translation of Kentucky, I had the good fortune to visit with I. J.Schwartz and to talk about his relationship with his contemporaries. At the end, he suffered from extreme loneliness. I asked if he ever saw Chaim Grade, one of the few of his contemporaries then alive. He looked very sad, and said he had had a big argument with Grade years before and never spoke to him since. The subject of the argument was Grade's abandonment of his poetic gifts. Schwartz respected Grade's talents as a poet. According to Schwartz, Grade was only writing poetry when he first came to America, but was not able to earn anything with his poetry. The Forward promised to publish stories if he had them, but they had no need for more poets. Grade then began writing stories (according to Schwartz's testimony). Schwartz reported that he told him, "Go ahead. Write stories because that is what you can sell." To me, he compared Grade to a mercenary. Winer's discussion of the Hirsh Resseyner story prompted this memory. I wonder if it is another layer in the story. I haven't read it in years, but shall do so promptly. At any rate, I thank Gershon Winer for a provacative entry in Mendele On Line. Shalom, Gitl Dubrovsky 5)---------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 11 Feb 1999 11:04:10 -0500 (EST) From: SHirshan@aol.com Subject: Shneour's Noah Pandre Although the term Pandre is not originally a Yiddish one, no lesser a Yiddish writer than Zalman Shneour (whom some have rated artistically with Sholem Asch and I.J. Singer) starts his riveting novel, _Song of the Dnieper_ with the following opening lines to flesh out his forceful, main character, Noah Pandre: _It is hard to say now whether Pandre was a real family name, or a nickname, or a hint at his non-Jewish appearance. His generation has died out-the generation of butchers who reeked with the smell of raw meat and brute strength._ Whatever its origin or exact translation, the term pandre appears to have had meaning and enjoyed usage in Yiddish. Marjorie Schonhaut Hirshan 6)---------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 11 Feb 1999 14:57:29 -0500 (EST) From: matoren Subject: a ditty from Minsker Gubernye Also for scholarly purposes, I add to Hershl Bershady's uncle's [Vol 08.129] ditty, one my mother repeated to me about fifty years ago. Although offensive today, one need only consider the highly-pogromized area of Minsker Gubernye from which she came. Vakhlakhlakis Yidn brokhes Goyim kadokhes. Nem a holts. Makh a tsaylem. Farshtek in tokhes. Stanley (Zalman) Matoren 7)---------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 11 Feb 1999 19:38:57 -0500 (EST) From: robert goldenberg Subject: poor judgment, or worse! I am sure that I am not the only reader of Mendele who was shocked, if not outraged, to see the totally inappropriate ditty in Mendele 08.129(9). To foist it upon us "for scholarly purposes" is simply a hypocritical ruse. I am surprised that our moderator did not catch this before releasing it. I feel that an apology is called for, for this regrettable lapse in judgment. Even were there no Christian subscribers to Mendele, I would be embarrassed to see this sort of thing. If such a "poem" denigrating a Jewish religious symbol were to appear in the media, it would justifiably be branded as anti-semitic. Shame! A kharpe un a shande! Itsik Goldenberg [Moderator's note: I am sorry that Itsik Goldenberg was offended by a posting to Mendele. However I think that there are legitimate scholarly purposes in collecting and studying folklore, even if it does not comply with our current ethical and other standards. Jokes in general are "often terribly insulting to members of ethnic, racial, sexual, religious, and other groups" (A.A.Berger, "The Genius of the Jewish Joke", Jason Aronson, 1998). This particular kind, obscene and blasphemeous, or "anti-behavioral" according to B.A.Uspensky ("Ot mifa k literature", Rossiskii Universitet, 1993) is well known in many cultures (see e.g. M.M.Bakhtin, "Rabelais and his world", MIT Press, 1968). Fortunately, many examples of the irreverent Yiddish folklore were recorded by I.Bernstein, N.Stutchkoff and others without any censoring. Whether Mendele as media is appropriate for such postings is a different issue that may be discussed. -Iosif Vaisman] 8)---------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 12 Feb 1999 10:35:54 -0500 (EST) From: Alice Honig Subject: ferd's fus Dear Mendele, i want to add my mother's use of relationship terms to the response of E.Palevsky [Vol 08.129]. My mom, born in Yashenovke nearly 99 years ago (she just died a day ago at 98) used to remark sarcastically that two people were related "vi a ferd's fus poskevis aynikl" (a horse's hoofs grandbabe... or something as vaguely irrelevant as this relationship would be!). Chane Honig 9)---------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 17 Feb 1999 13:05:45 -0500 (EST) From: LorinSklam@aol.com Subject: Song Lyrics Greetings! I'm looking for additional lyrics, published, recorded or otherwise, for a song I found on an lp set called "The Generations of Israel" (CBS Legacy 32 B5 0012, ca. 1968). It is performed there by Naomi Levy. Perhaps it is only a fragment of a longer recording. Here's what I have so far: Oygn kukn vayt avek, Vayt in mitn yam. Zeglen vayse piramidn, Vayt in mitn yam. Tsu zey geyn, tsu zey shteyn, Vayt in mitn yam. Beyze vintn eybik veyen, Vayt in mitn yam. Opgeshvimen iz der tog, Vayt in mitn yam. Regn likhtik in der himl, Vayt in mitn yam. Keyner kumt nit shpet bay nakht, Vayt in mitn yam. Sha, shvimt aroys mayn laykhte shifl, Vayt in mitn yam. Thanks in advance for your help! Sincerely, Lorin Sklamberg ______________________________________________________ End of Mendele Vol. 08.132 Address for the postings to Mendele: mendele@lists.yale.edu Address for the list commands: listproc@lists.yale.edu Mendele on the Web: http://www2.trincoll.edu/~mendele http://metalab.unc.edu/yiddish/mendele.html