Mendele: Yiddish literature and language ______________________________________________________ Contents of Vol. 1 no. 181 February 21, 1992 1) Faribl (Raphael Finkel) 2) Kishkot (David Neal Miller) 3) Klafte (Dovid Braun) 4) Bund (Dovid Braun) 5) Klafte (David Hirsch) 1)---------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 20 Feb 1992 15:50:25 EST From: Raphael Finkel Subject: clarification My question about faribl was 'can it be used in a sentence that does not contain a negative'. For example, in English, you can't say "*I wouldn't rather be in San Fransisco"; the verb "rather" does not exist in the negative. In Yiddish, you can't say "*ikh tor geyn"; the verb "tor" does not exist in the positive. So my question was, can you say "er hot gehat a groys faribl" or anything like that. Raphael Finkel 2)---------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 20 Feb 92 16:49:50 EST From: David Neal Miller Subject: kishkot [DNM, ed. by EP:] >>Why "mezuza" and "mezuzot" in L.P.'s posting to _Mendele_ >>1:172? >>Is it not bowing to Hebraist hegemonism to privilege >>transcription from modern Hebrew?... >>Vaynraykh has "mezuzah" >>(pp. 203, 553); I prefer "mezuze" (i.e. the standard >>romanization), italicized. [EP, unedited:] >might i point out that, when the early speakers of yiddish >borrowed the term into yiddish in the first place, they >were 'bowing to hebraist hegemonism', as you put it? in >addition, it's not an item of *yiddish* culture, like >yortsayt lamps and gefilte fish, but of *jewish* culture >and is known to jews whether from columbus, lvov, istanbul, >or aleppo... i assume that is why weinreich wrote it the >way he did. >ellen prince Ellen Prince misconstrues my argument, perhaps because it was formulated too telegraphically. My problem was not with Weinreich's use of "mezuzah" (plural presumably "mezuzahs") but with Prager's use of "mezuzot"; indeed, I cited Weinreich approvingly. "Mezuzahs," in the context of English running text, is, I'd assert, the unmarked form: it reflects (I suspect) the unselfconscious pronunciation of ideologically uncommitted speakers of American English. If I prefer (italicized) "mezuzes," it is because I wear my Yiddishist commitment on my sleeve (pen? word processor?). Accordingly, I've no problem with a Hebraist who writes "mezuzot," as long as he/she does so as an act of ideological assertion. What *is* hegemonist is the assumption that transcription of modern Israeli ("Sephardic") Hebrew is more acceptable/more correct in the context of English running text. Hegemonism lies precisely in making the institutional appear to be natural. This is not meant to be a major issue, but something of a wink at (or stab at the kishk[a]ot of) Yude-Leyb: the colleague who writes so convincingly about ludic Yiddish might want to be cautious about priviliging transcription from modern Israeli Hebrew in a forum such as _Mendele_. David Neal Miller Internet: miller.3@osu.edu Bitnet: miller.3@ohstmail 3)---------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 20 Feb 92 17:03:45 EST From: David Braun Subject: klafte kh'hob geshribn mayn komentar vegn aroysred fun _klafte_ eyder ikh hob geleyent WERMANs entfer az kof-lamed-veys-tof-alef iz der oysleyg in targem-loshn. mistame iz der opshtam fun vort take fun targem-loshn. shkoyekh. Dovid Braun 4)---------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 20 Feb 92 17:15:25 EST From: David Braun Subject: Bund?! Just read Werman on yidishkayt. A point of information: there are no Bund schools. The Tsisho (tsentrale yidishe shul-organizatsye) schools were the Bund schools before the khurbm. (Sorry, the Yiddish school in Melbourne is bundistish.) The Bund is often used as a "synonym" for non-Haredic Yiddish-centered yidishkayt. I've noticed this especially in Israel -- it was assumed that since I, a young man who speaks Yiddish but doesn't have bord-un-peyes, speak Yiddish, I must have stg to do with the Bund or come from a Bundist family. nisht do's iz emes un nisht do's iz emes. Besides the young Bundist organization in Australia (skif = sotsyalistishe kinder-farband) I don't think there is any activity of the Bund for younger people who weren't involved since before the war. Dovid Braun 5)---------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 20 Feb 92 18:16 PST From: David Hirsch Subject: RE: Mendele Vol 1.180 I just opened my Jastrow Aramaic dictionary and see that "klavta" is there as "bitch". While officially Kalbta, the note says that the word is traditonally pronounced "klavta". Is it really more complicated than this David Hirsch ______________________________________________________ End of Mendele Vol 1.181