Mendele: Yiddish literature and language ______________________________________________________ Contents of Vol. 4.005 May 23, 1994 1) Fonye ganef (Louis Fridhandler) 2) Fonye ganef (Moyshe Taube) 3) Fonye ganef (Rick Gildemeister) 4) Raysn (Howie Aronson) 5) Preglen (Leigh Lisker) 6) Zishe (Jeremy Stern) 7) Subject pro-drop in yiddish (Ellen Prince) 1)---------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri May 20 14:49:39 1994 From: 74064.1661@CompuServe.COM Subject: Fonye ganef In Mendele 4.003 Aren Portnoy asks about the origin of fonye and fonye ganef as terms for the tsar. I believe it was an opprobrious term for any Russian who was automatically considered a hater of Jews. Ganef --> thief is obvious. Fonye is not. A polyglot friend of mine, a Jewish psychiatrist who was born and trained in Hungary, survived service in a Rumanian labor battalion in World War II by the skin of his teeth (with the indirect help of Raoul Wallenberg and a rare, compassionate German soldier) was quick to suggest the origin of fonye. I pass on this purely anecdotal offering. Ivan is a typical Russian name. From that is derived the nickname Vanya. Vanya in Yiddish became Fonye, a general term for a Russian. To that was often added ganef to indicate contempt. Any other suggestions? Louis Fridhandler. 2)---------------------------------------------------- Date: Sat May 21 11:48:53 1994 From: taube@HUM.HUJI.AC.IL Subject: fonye My teacher Moyshe Altbauer, who's turning ninety (90!) this year and is still going strong suggested once that fonye derives from the Russian theme afon- 'Athenian' i.e. 'Greek'., i.e. 'Russian' (cf. Yovn, literally 'Greek' for 'Russian'). Moyshe Taube 3)---------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri May 20 15:57:33 1994 From: EEGLC%CUNYVM.bitnet@YaleVM.YCC.Yale.Edu Subject: Fonye (ganev) Fonye is/was the general word used by Yiddish-speaking Jews to refer to Russians (non-Jews). The origin of the reference to the Tsar as "Fonye Ganef" is very upsetting. It wasn't that long ago that the tsar had boys of eight years stolen and forced to serve in the Russian armed forces 25 years. This was, among other things, an attempt at Russification. Families throughout the Pale of Settlement lived in perpetual insecurity. On a lighter note, Ize Kremer, the great Yiddish singer from Bessarabia, has a song where she throws every epithet she can at some miserable jerk, "Your yikhes is that they took you in priut" That last word is the word, if I'm right, for the custom of taking the children from their families. Anyway, hence Fonye Ganef, I think. Khaim Vaytsman's associates were all excited because Lenin wanted the two of them to "talk",since there was common ground doing *something* about the state of affairs of tsarist Russia. After the meeting, they asked Vaytsman how it went. He answered, "Fe! Fe! Fonyak!" (I don't know where I read that). Rick Gildemeister 4)---------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri May 20 21:58:53 1994 From: hia5@midway.uchicago.edu Subject: Raysn In re: etymology of "Raysn." Aren Portnoy's question about the origin of "Fonye" = Russian reminded me of a question that has long intrigued me: the origin of the term "Raysn" for Belorussia. The word looks to me suspiciously non-Slavic and appears to have (?) some connection with the same root as in "Russia, Ruthenia, Rus." Do any Mendelniks have insight into the origin of this term? Thanks Howie Aronson 5)---------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri May 20 18:22:09 1994 From: llisker@babel.ling.upenn.edu Subject: preglen Mikhl Herzog. Of course a "mitteldeutch" bregeln doesn't rule out a Slavic source. I remember asking Uriel Weinreich about gepregelt many years ago, I think it was before his dictionary appeared. He said he had no idea of its origin, and I'm sure he knew a good deal about Slavic. On braten etc and self-inflicted hair loss: my wife has long been convinced that dictionaries are produced by males with no knowledge of cookery and the arts there practiced, and thus produce sloppy glosses in that semantic area. Leigh Lisker 6)---------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon May 23 08:30:54 1994 From: jstern@phoenix.Princeton.EDU Subject: Origin of Zishe I am posting this for someone else on the Internet. Does anyone know the etymology of the Yiddish name, "Zishe"? Is it related to "Zisl"? Jeremy Stern 7)---------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon May 23 08:50:49 1994 Subject: subject pro-drop in yiddish does anyone know of any mention by the yiddishists of missing subjects in yiddish sentences, e.g. bist gerekht, herst a mayse? a dank. ellen prince ______________________________________________________ End of Mendele Vol. 4.005 A Table of Contents is now available via anonymous ftp, along with weekly updates. Anonymous ftp archives available on: ftp.mendele.trincoll.edu in the directory pub/mendele/files Archives available via gopher on: gopher.cic.net Mendele has 2 rules: 1. Provide a meaningful Subject: line. 2. Sign your article. To subscribe, send SUB MENDELE FIRSTNAME LASTNAME to: LISTSERV@YALEVM.YCC.YALE.EDU Send submissions/responses to: mendele@yalevm.ycc.yale.edu Other business: nmiller@starbase.trincoll.edu