Yiddish Mailing List, Issue #36 April 21, 1991 205 lines =============================== Highland Park, Forverts, ... (Nicholas Eshelman) Should we have a more 'literary' mailing list? (Noyakh Miller & David Sherman) Suggestions for books for a 13-year-old to learn Yiddish? (Yankl Falk) [Nu, ver kon shikn epes farn nekstn numer...? - DS] ------------------------ Digest-Message: 36/1 Date: Thu, 18 Apr 1991 08:52:49 -0400 From: Nicholas Eshelman Subject: Re: mail.yiddish issue #34 Nathalie shraybt az zi voynt itst in Highland Park. Dos iz mir interesant vayl do hob ikh a sakh tsayt fargebrengt. Ikh hob mayn "library degree" (MLS) fun Rutgers bakumen (Rutgers gefint zikh in New Brunswick, vos grenst zikh mit High land Park) un mayn bruder arbet do. Nathalie, tsi kenstu di Homestead Tap? Do zaynen di beste cheeseburgers in New Jersey. Tsi zaynen do fil yidish reders in Highland Park? Do hob ikh mayn "Oytser fun der yidisher sprakh" gekoyft. Oyf tshikaves, an ander nitslekhe aynkukbukh iz "Anglish-Yinglish" fun Gene Bluestein (Athens, GA: University of Georgia Press, 1989) Es iz klal nit keyn visenshaftlekh verk, ober es iz alts epes interesant. Der briv vegn dem vorverts iz geven oykh a tshidaver. Tsi leyent ir di Englishe oyfgabe funem Forverts? Ikh abonir bayde (Yidish un English). Di Englishe iz take zeyer gut, ober ikh hob moyre az "The Forward" vet shlingen "Dem Forverts." Dos heyst: me vet hobn nor eyn tsaytung IN GANTSN oyf English mit etlekhe zaytlekh oyf Yidish. Nu, vays ikh vos. Vi maynt ir? Zayt gezunt, Nicholas ------------------------ Digest-Message: 36/2 Subject: Re: what is to be done? Date: Thu, 18 Apr 91 14:08:17 EST From: David Sherman In-Reply-To: ; from "vax1.trincoll.edu!NMILLER" at Apr 18, 91 3:13 pm [ I'm reproducing both Noyakh Miller's message, indented, and my replies interspersed, in this and the next message. Comments from others on the list are welcome. -DS ] > > Dear Dave: > > I'm writing this primarily to you. If you see fit to include it > in the next number of mail.yiddish, fine. > > For some time I've felt that, while mail.yiddish is always fun to > read, it isn't exactly an intellectual feast. I had hoped for one. > While it's true that the death of Yiddish, which I myself foresaw > with great clarity some 45 years ago, has not come to pass and the > evil decree has been (temporarily?) averted, it remains true that > the situation is precarious. Precarious because even if a language > is preserved through native speakers (Borough Park, Jerusalem) it is > impoverished unless the study of its literature occupies an equally > important place. > > By the study of Yiddish literature I mean the real thing: the kind of > criticism now available from people like Ruth Wisse, Irving Howe, the > Harshavs, etc. And others of similar seriousness whom a serious mail > list might attract. > > What I've said about literature holds true as well for linguistic studies. > Here too we've been lucky. I would like to see a mail list in which such > studies can be discussed. > > I therefore propose the establishment of a separate list devoted to > Yiddish scholarhip primarily in the areas of literature and linguistics but > not limited to them. The history of other lists persuades me that these > topics can not be discussed in the same place as the topics that typically > show up in mail.yiddish. I'm willing to take on such a list. But I'm reluc- > tant to proceed until we have discussed the matter. As the founder of mail. > yiddish you're not only a pioneer but you also have what we would call a > khazuke, a normative claim. So let us discuss. > > Norman > > > > I'll put it into the mailing list for comment. My feeling is that there's no need for a separate mailing list -- if people would like to increase the quality/scholarship level of the existing list, I'd very much like to see that. I'm not sure that the history of other lists is any indication; there's no problem with volume at the moment, and I think anyone on mail.yiddish now would qant to be on both lists. Certainly, if there's significant volume I'm happy to have you take on such a list, but if there's no volume, what's the point? If you would like to start contributing higher quality articles, and perhaps prod one or two of the other more literate participants to reply, we can get something going. I'll even contribute myself, to the extent I can (my literary knowledge isn't great, but I'm very interested in the linguistic side). The normal reason for splitting up a list and starting a new one is that there's volume of discussion on list #1 that is making it hard to keep track of everything, and that part of this discussion isn't of interest to all participants of list #1. I don't see that applying here -- but if you can get the volume up, I'd love it to be te case. If you like, we can agree (or decree) that issue #x (37, say) will be one for literary discussion. Consider that to be the putative first issue of your mailing list, but to keep it simpler, I'll handle mailing it out. Start writing. Comments? ------------------------ Digest-Message: 36/3 Subject: Re: what is to be done? To: utai!vax1.trincoll.edu!NMILLER Date: Thu, 18 Apr 91 19:40:02 EST From: David Sherman In-Reply-To: ; from "vax1.trincoll.edu!NMILLER" at Apr 18, 91 5:33 pm [ Continuation from the message above - DS ] > > One cause of list-splitting is as you say heavy traffic. Another, > Dave, is when the intellectual level of a list makes it next to > impossible to attract enough serious people to attain critical > mass. Therefore, while I have no personal objection to writing > criticism (by the way, I'm no critic, and I'm not at all sure that > I would want to see my writing on the proposed list) for mail.yiddish, > no amount of such writing would be of any help. I see what you mean. > There _is_ very little traffic now. But I have reason to believe > that a demand exists that would never be satisfied with mail.yiddish. > I've forwarded issues of it to many friends, some of them accomplished > Yiddishists, not one of whom has joined. _I've_ stayed on because of > my love for Yiddish but it hasn't always been easy. > > Moreover, I think that some good people can be attracted. Some are > friends, others friends of friends. There are a surprising number of > older academics who know a thing or two. But they will not write (and > this is the naked truth) for a list that also prints Yiddish-American > ditties. Lo ze haderech. Nisht azoy provet men a seder. Fair enough. If you think you know enough people who might actually participate, that's great. > > The upshot is this: I am going to look further into establishing a > private list (by invitation only). As far as I can see, it will not cut > into your list since most of them will never hear of it. At the end of > a year we'll know. Oh, I'm not worried about "competition". The more the better. I would certainly like to be on your list, and I'll certainly mention it on mail.yiddish for those who are interested, as long as you don't object. May I reproduce our discussion above in mail.yiddish for comment from the others? [ Noyakh subsequently indicated that would be fine, provided it doesn't offend anyone. It shouldn't. Those who would like to partcipate in (and, especially, contribute to) a mailing list that focuses on literary critique and linguistic analysis of Yiddish, please contact nmiller@vax1.trincoll.edu and cc me. - DS] ------------------------ Date: Wed, 17 Apr 91 10:32:01 PDT From: torsqnt!sequent!cs.MENTOR.COM!jfalk (Jack Falk) Ikh darf fregn: mayn eltster zun Simkhe iz mit zeks khadoshim tsurik bar-mitzve gevorn, un itst vil er g-tzedank lernen mame-loshn. Mir lernen tsuzamen mit "Yidishe Kinder Alef", funem Arbeter Ring. Es zeyt oys tsu zayn a guter lern-bikhl, un er hot fun dem hanoe gehat. Tsi kent ir andere bikher oder lern-materialn vos zaynen laytish far a ben-draytsn? A dank funem tatn un zun... [ Vus zugt ir, teyere leyeners? Meine kinder zenen nokh ale tsi klein -- ikh veis nisht vus tsu zugn vegn bikher far a dreitsn-yur-alt kind. Khutz Weinreich's "College Yiddish"... - DS ] ------------------------ SOF FUN NUMER 36 ------------------------ David (Daniel Moishe) Sherman, Toronto Moderator, mail.yiddish dave@lsuc.on.ca attcan!lsuc!dave@uunet.uu.net uunet!attcan!lsuc!dave {AT&T sites}!att!lsuc!dave