Subject: Re: NETCOM CANCELED !!! HERE'S WHY ...

From: [email-masked]
Date: Fri, 6 Oct 1995 05:34:37 GMT

Sometime around Thu, 05 Oct 1995 21:41:49 GMT, [email-masked]
(Powaqqatsi) wrote in rec.drugs.misc:

>I canceled my Netcom account today.  People have been talking about
>the mysteriously disappearing posts by everyone with Netcom access, so
>I thought I'd do a little investigating just to see how bad it was.
>
>Last night, I loaded up the headers at midnight, and then came back to
>read those headers at 6 AM the same day (6 hours later).  In some of
>the groups, as many as 1000 brand new posts from the night before were
>gone and in others just a few were missing.  This is not the first
>time this has happened, but I didn't document it before like I did
>last night.  It has been happening regularly for at least the last 2
>weeks.

Let me guess.  Every time you go in and read messages, *poof*!!  Suddenly,
next time you go to read them, THEY'VE BEEN CENSORED!!!!  (Isn't it amazing
how this works?  All because YOU read the posts, they were deleted!  Netcom
waited, watching the logs, until YOU accessed them, and then erased ONLY
the ones you read!).

Learn to use that piece-of-shit software you paid for.  ALL newsreaders
assume that once you've read a post, you won't want to have to wade past
all the ones you've just read, to get to the ones you haven't read.

Toggle your newsreader to show you ALL posts, including the previously-read
ones, and then take your sorry butt over to news.newusers.questions and get
a clue.  Get two, you need them.

Gawd.  And then you go SCREAMING that everyone's posts are being DELETED.
Ohmigawd!!  Noooooo!

BTW, the Netcruisers (that's you, dip) are on a completely different news
system than the shell and other netcom account holders. You are a wholly
and completely separate service.   Netcruisers aren't the ONLY part of
netcom, you know.  The news spools aren't identical; sometimes we have
articles you don't, and vice versa.  See also anything on Cnews,
unbatching, and so on.

Now go, and study the FAQs, and read (that's READ, dammit, not spew forth
violently) netcom.netcruiser.*, and news.newusers.*.  

I do hope you realize that this will be a problem for you on ALL ISPs,
since it's a simple function  of your newsreader and has *nothing* to do
with "posts disappearing!!!"

BTW, do you think you whined to enough newsgroups?

---

From: [email-masked] (Joel Rubin)
Date: 6 Oct 1995 08:57:00 GMT

In article <[email-masked]>, [email-masked] 
says...
>
>[email-masked] wrote:
>
>You haven't been watching very closely
>
>We already know that the time limit to d/l an article is 2 days max.
>After that, the file is gone.
>
>Outright delete was done last night oct 5th pacific time somewhere
>between 10pm and 6am.  Around this time the server went down in my
>area.
>
>Need for Speed and Spear of Destiny were almost finished showing up in
>full.
>
>Next morning....GONE
>
>No screw up on my end. I even wipe my agent free and got a fresh d/l
>GONE!
>
>OPNE MOUTH, INSERT FOOT!
>
I know around 7 A.M. PDT on 5 October the news server was incredibly 
slow. Like 5 minutes to retrieve 100 headers and 30 seconds to retrieve 
a short article.

---

From: [email-masked] (Powaqqatsi)
Date: Fri, 06 Oct 1995 09:15:23 GMT

>waited, watching the logs, until YOU accessed them, and then erased ONLY
No Idiot, the headers have been ERASED FROM  THE SERVER.  READ THIS
AGAIN.  Do you have an idea how internet messages are sent?  I thnk
not.

>all the ones you've just read, to get to the ones you haven't read.

READ THE ABOVE AGAIN.  The headers I read in at midnight were now "not
available" when I tried to read the bodies to them a 6am.

>a clue.  Get two, you need them.
I did MORE than that.  I even set back my message pointers to 5000
previous posts and then read the ALL back in. The ones from the night
before were GONE FROM THE SERVER.  Can't you read?

>articles you don't, and vice versa.  See also anything on Cnews,
I DON'T USE NETCRUISER.  I already KNOW it is a piece of crap.  You're
not telling me something I don't know.

>violently) netcom.netcruiser.*, and news.newusers.*.  
REREAD THIS POST, CAREFULLY THIS TIME.

>with "posts disappearing!!!"
Then why do some servers have ALL their posts intact for up to 2 weeks
ago?

>BTW, do you think you whined to enough newsgroups? 
This is my first time at whining about it.  And I think I whined REAL
good.   :)  (applause, applause, applause...)

---

From: [email-masked] (Ebok)
Date: 6 Oct 1995 02:12:35 -0700

Check the other major providers.  I am sure you will find the same kind of
manipulation of posts. BIG BROTHER IS HERE AND WELL.

PS:  AND GROWING BIGGER!!!!

---

From: [email-masked] ([email-masked])
Date: Sat, 07 Oct 1995 00:37:53 GMT

>BTW, do you think you whined to enough newsgroups? 

I hear ya champ!!!  You are one of very few people who KNOW HOW to use
their NETCOM account.  Everyone gets their little NET"LOOSER"
software and then wonder why it sucks!!!  These people should  set up
a winsock TCP/IP  shell dialup and use some real client software!!!

---

From: [email-masked] (Bullwinkle Moose)
Date: Fri, 06 Oct 1995 22:31:18 GMT

>a winsock TCP/IP  shell dialup and use some real client software!!!

	Jeez I din't know there was any other way to use this group... I mean
WHY OH WHY would some one use the CRUMMY software that came with the
account. Netcom doesn't sell software-last time I looked they were in
the biz to sell connect time. GET A LIFE and GET SUM SOFTWARE THAT
WORKS FOR YOU NOT FOR THEM, DUMMY. 
	I tried the 'cracked' version of Agent .99... Liked it so well that I
(shh don''t tell!) paid for it (gasp)
	anyway it has been my experience that most isp errors are operator
errors not provider errors... AND that 'deleted' files usually will
show up in a couple of days... as a matter of fact one of the files
this dork (in the origional thread) said was deleted... was here all
along. In his headlong rush to be an expert he forgot about common
sense and patience.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
^                                      ^
^    /notes from a one legged duck/    ^                             ^
^                                      ^
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

---

From: [email-masked]
Date: Fri, 06 Oct 1995 07:38:49 GMT

Next morning....GONE

OPNE MOUTH, INSERT FOOT!

---

From: tinker
Date: Fri, 06 Oct 1995 01:33:51 GMT

>So I called Netcom today and talked with one of their supervisors in
>technical support.  After a run-around like you wouldn't believe, they
>ASSURED me that all posts and headers are kept on the system for at
>LEAST 5 days. (Then how come she only found 400 posts in alt.herbs
>when I had her check? :)  When pressed as to why the ones from last
>night are now gone, there was dead silence on the phone.  I told them
>others have reported their posts disappearing too, and that people
>reported this to Netcom, and Netcom's reply to them was "We have
>limited disk space to save so many posts."  Yet when I asked them
>about this, they "claimed" that they never heard of that reason.  So I
>told them, if it was -- I can't imagine a company as large as yours
>holding out for the price of yet one more gig-drive to invest.

>To make the run-around shorter and less painful for you than what I
>got.... THEY HAVE NO PLANS TO  CHANGE THIER POLICY in this regard.
>So... my friends.... if you have a Netcom account .... expect posts to
>be gone the very next day that you call to get replies to your topics.
>You can save yourself some headaches, like I did, and just cancel your
>account if this is a consideration for you.  But I don't believe that
>Netcom should be playing censor police, no matter HOW they go about
>it, or how many excuses they come up with.  Nobody yet has gotten a
>straight answer from them on why this is happening (not even the
>supervisor I talked to could get a straight answer from her
>higher-ups, so she claimed).  When a company practices deceit to their
>customers, I feel it is time to find a new company.  So today, I am
>pulling out my list of 53 servers in my area and am going to go down
>it one by one to make sure this does not happen to me again.

>Feel free to copy and paste this post to other newsgroups if you feel
>it is important enough.  I recorded my conversations with Netcom
>today, so I KNOW I am speaking the truth in what I have to say about
>my transactions with them.  If they say otherwise ... consider all the
>other wild stories they've been telling others all this month.  You
>won't get the truth out of them, I tried.  Now they won't get my money
>either.

I thought I noticed something going wrong with the posts last night
too. I have netcom. I did notice one thing. In the erotic areas some
of the posts were deleted, but only some of them. The ones that seemed
to be questionable, legal? Were the only ones that were pulled. Also
most of the posts in this category were gone as soon as they went up.
I had no idea that netcom would be responsible though. Well, I hear
that there are some places you can get on for the same money and not
be limited to 40 hours of prime time acess. Is this true? Are there
other  places to call in the LA Cal. area that are cheaper with
unlimited time? I use netcruiser, so would like one that will have a
good piece of software that i can use IRC and a decent browser. I use
free agent for this area. Also, when i am in the irc area and want to
trade warez I could use something that will allow me to use DCC
command. Netcruser won't do that. Can anyone please help?

---

From: [email-masked] (Mr. Foo)
Date: Sat, 07 Oct 1995 03:45:02 GMT

>BTW, do you think you whined to enough newsgroups? 
Why don't you crawl back into your old crusty SHELL account and stay
there.  He is correct about NETCOM losing posts.  I uploaded 12 posts
to ABIW the same night he mentioned.  ONE made it through.  You shell
account jerks think your shit don't stink, but your so caught  up in
your own little SHELL you don't even see what's happening to the net.

Mr. Foo

---

From: [email-masked] (Mr. Foo)
Date: Sat, 07 Oct 1995 03:52:23 GMT

>a winsock TCP/IP  shell dialup and use some real client software!!!
Ah...DUH!  Gee, I'm using a NetLooser account and I don't even have
NetLooser installed on my system...ahhh Duuh...I wonder how that
happened?   I still agree with Powaqqatsi, NETCOM is censoring the
Alt.* newsgroups and providing crappy service.   I've found a local
provider that will give me UNLIMITED access to a DIRECT SLIP/PPP
connection, PLUS a SHELL account for $25 a month, plus they keep all
the usenet group messages for 4 days.  Guess I'll be right behind
Powaqqatsi at the end of this month.....

Mr. Foo

---

From: [email-masked] (Powaqqatsi)
Date: Sat, 07 Oct 1995 04:38:16 GMT

On Sat, 07 Oct 1995 03:52:23 GMT, [email-masked] (Mr. Foo)

>Powaqqatsi at the end of this month.....
Hey Foo, I found one like that too, and another that has over 60,000
newsgroups and keeps then on their system for a whole 7 days for $17.
(But timed access on that one 100hrs/mo..)  I was starting to get
angry with these guys saying I use Netcruiser, which I don't, but then
it dawned on me... these guys probabably work for Netcom.

Actually, I should thank netcom for doing this, I didn't realize there
were even cheaper and better access providers out there unless I was
forced to look.  Many don't advertise.  Was on the phone for 8 hours
today (voice) researching.  All the good deals I found are local
access providers so what I found won't help others.  But guys?  Start
checking your areas.  You'd be surprised with what is available.

---

From: [email-masked] (Powaqqatsi)
Date: Sat, 07 Oct 1995 04:28:01 GMT

On Fri, 06 Oct 1995 22:31:18 GMT, [email-masked] (Bullwinkle Moose)

>along. In his headlong rush to be an expert he forgot about common
Let's see if I can clear this up.  I don't USE NETCRUISER.  I set back
my message pointers by as much as 5000 posts.  And reloaded the
headers.  Now, not only were the bodies to the missing posts not
available anymore, but the headers were wiped too, yet 4 hours before,
there were over 1000 posts DATED FROM THE NIGHT BEFORE that were gone.
As they are today, and the day before and as I suspect they will be in
the morning..  Hell, even posts like this one will be gone within a
day.  I know, I've posted this REexplanation about 5 times now, and I
don't think any got out, they are listed in my outbox as successfully
delivered, but a refresh of the newgroups shows they don't exist in
netland.  So is the way with netcom's access to the newsgroups.  After
a careful study of message threads on less risky newsgroups, I went
back and found today that I had to repost 3 other messages of mine
that never showed up on other people's servers (yet show successful
deliveries).  Could be I was posting them at the time when Netcom is
doing their nightly deletion of the previous day's posts (3-6am) and
they got lost in the shuffle.

I use Dial-Up, I use Agent, I use NetScape, I use Chameleon, ..... I
think I have a pretty good idea to what I am doing.   I knew on the
first time I ran Netcruiser that it was a piece of shit.  Seeing as
how I am not the only one documenting missing threads, headers, and
posts frrom previous nights -- I doubt Netcom has gotten everyone
convinced it is "user error".  They can make fools of some of the
people all of the time, and I suspect it will be those that keep their
netcom accounts.  Just please, whatever you do, please don't whine
about how you were made a fool of too in the next month.  I don't care
to hear it -- OR ask me help you find you a decent server.

---

From: [email-masked] (Robert Haviland)
Date: Sat, 07 Oct 1995 06:46:32 GMT

>OPNE MOUTH, INSERT FOOT!

Hey, did you kow that Netcom had a power surge in San Diego?  As far
as I know, no one could log on until last night.  Maybe Netcom just
lost their data.  So I might be naive.

I'm probably just a new sucker with Netcom.  But with alot of the
other online services admitting to censoring, I've just signed on.  I
figure they can't be any worse.

Does anyone know of the "perfect" provider in Nashville?

Robert Haviland

And the left handers shall inherit the Earth.

;-)

---

From: [email-masked] (Bullwinkle Moose)
Date: Sat, 07 Oct 1995 05:14:30 GMT

On Sat, 07 Oct 1995 04:28:01 GMT, [email-masked] (Powaqqatsi)

>to hear it -- OR ask me help you find you a decent server.

	Clearly you have missed the point... 

	You have mistaken this group for someone that cares...
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
^                                      ^
^    /notes from a one legged duck/    ^                             ^
^                                      ^
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

---

From: [email-masked] (Powaqqatsi)
Date: Sat, 07 Oct 1995 10:30:46 GMT

On Sat, 07 Oct 1995 10:43:38 GMT, [email-masked] wrote:

>[email-masked] ([email-masked]) wrote:
>
>
>
>You certainly hit the nail on the head with that one!!  I have no
>complaints about my Netcom service and have not experienced the
>problems these guys keep writing about... I think I'm getting my
>moneys worth with Netcom! I've looked at the local service providers,
>and they ALL SUCK!!
>
>
>
>
              ^^^^^^^^^^employees of netcom^^^^^^^^^

---

From: [email-masked] (Powaqqatsi)
Date: Sat, 07 Oct 1995 11:11:34 GMT

On Sat, 07 Oct 1995 10:43:35 GMT, [email-masked] wrote:

>[email-masked] (Joel Rubin) wrote:
>
>>
>That was probably because of the extra load hurricane Opal put on the
>system... We were solid down for two days here...
>
>
>
Well, let's see.... SO far Netcom has tried to convince everyone it
was "user error" by all the people that subscribe to their services,
whether it be for the lack in the software they put out, the
information they tell people on how to set up the software or
whatever.  Then they say it is user error because users cannot get all
the posts with THEIR crappy software.  Then they tell others that the
reason the posts are missing is because it is a new policy to cut back
on storage space at their facility for the newsgroups (I guess they
can't afford another gig-harddrive) and that is the reason the posts
are being spooled off so often.  Another time they said it was because
there was so much traffic in the alt.binaries that the system couldn't
keep up.  (What's the matter?  Is your server software just as crappy
as the stuff you send to your customers?)  Then, I get a letter in
mail telling me the reason that the bodies to the posts don't show up
is because there is not enough room on the 3.5" disk that they send
out.  (THAT was a doozie, read all about it, I posted a copy of it ...
if you can find it now .. it probably got deleted already in this
newgroup),
AND
NOW
They are blaming it on Hurricane Opal.  What's next?  The little green
men from mars stole all the bits everyone is sending out?  Yeah,
that's it.  Must be.  Couldn't be NETCOM having or creating all these
problems. Could it.  NO WAY!  (phew.... I can't believe, now that I
wrote a summation of the reasons that have been posted for the last 2
months (by others) why I kept deceiving myself into thinking netcom
was a good access provider.  Well, hit me on the head with a brick, it
finally sank in.)

Face it, Employees of Netcom, the more you try to save the face of
Netcom by coming up with even MORE excuses... you keep looking worse
and worse.  You've come to the end of your excuses. How much more
obvious can you get?

My apologies to those newsgroups that are fed up with this thread from
the very first byte about it.  But with the way Netcom is lately, I
wanted a copy of this thread in at least one newsgroup somewhere.
Tonight will be my last night of bothering your time, your deletion
button or key, or whatever.  I'm a fan of Nader's Raiders, what can I
say? :)  The people need to know.  Even if it matters not to you
personally because you don't use the Netcom make and model number.
(As Marvin the robot read on the mountain -- the ONLY known message
actually from god -- "We apologize for the inconvenience.")  <----
should be Netcom's motto.  I'm out of this thread, and out of netcom.
Too much NETCOM-BULL too little too late.

---

From: [email-masked]
Date: Sat, 07 Oct 1995 10:43:28 GMT

>BTW, do you think you whined to enough newsgroups? 

You are totally right, I used to think Netcom was screwing up, but I
just didn't know how to use Agent... I have no probs with Netcom at
all, and enjoy fantastic service!  All I had to do was take a closer
look at my newsreader settings and all my problems went away...

---

From: [email-masked]
Date: Sat, 07 Oct 1995 10:43:35 GMT

---

From: [email-masked]
Date: Sat, 07 Oct 1995 10:43:38 GMT

---

From: [email-masked] (BEAVIS)
Date: Sun, 08 Oct 1995 09:04:14 GMT

>system... We were solid down for two days here...
Who gives a flying fuck about NETCOM..what a waiste of my time.  fuck
netcom....who cares.

---

From: [email-masked] (AfterBurner)
Date: Sat, 07 Oct 1995 12:22:30 GMT

I coulda swore I heard [email-masked] (Powaqqatsi) spew

>              ^^^^^^^^^^employees of netcom^^^^^^^^^

Not here.  I have been using my ix account for about 6 months
now, with no problems.  However, they have said several times,
that over the last few weeks, they have been keeping the
alt.binaries heirarchy on a limited space restraint.  With
everyone going back to school for the fall, the UseNet traffic
easily doubles.  I have sent a note to support stating that the
valuable newsgroups in the alt.binaries heirarchy are important
to me, and if they continue with this restraint, I would look
around.  I rcvd a prompt message back stating that it was a
temporary thing, as they were upgrading the news servers.  

Also, if you check the MOTD, you'll see that the service went
down the other day, which may have caused it.

------
To get my attention, post:
ATTN:  >>Afterburner<<
Then watch that post for a followup.  

"...I was feelin' some feelin's you wouldn't believe.."
                                    - Nine Inch Nails
"AAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRRRGGGGGGGHHHHH"
                                    - Rage Against the Machine

Stop by warez-games for trade..

---

From: [email-masked] (Thomas Craig)
Date: Sun, 08 Oct 1995 03:56:46 GMT

>a winsock TCP/IP  shell dialup and use some real client software!!!

Uh, I think you need some lessons.  A "winsock TCP/IP" and a "shell"
dialup are two completely different things.

---

From: [email-masked] (Thomas Craig)
Date: Sun, 08 Oct 1995 04:02:41 GMT

>	You have mistaken this group for someone that cares...

Clearly you have missed the point in that, like a total idiot, you
commented over 100 lines of text into a post that contained a single,
idiotic, childish taunt.  Perhaps you better go to that remedial class
on Netiquette, kid.

---

From: [email-masked] (Thomas Craig)
Date: Sun, 08 Oct 1995 04:22:03 GMT

>temporary thing, as they were upgrading the news servers.  

This thread is getting old.  As far as Netcom saying they are
restraining the a.b hierarchy to save space, it seems pretty
unbelievable.  During the school season, Usenet generates about
200-300 Mb of posts daily.  So a 3 Gb drive should be able to hold a
minimum of 10 days worth of traffic.  Since a 3 Gb drive costs less
than the monthly cost of a leased line for a T-1 PoP, of which Netcom
has *many*, any explanations involving the cost of storage are
garbage.  Netcom has, at last look, over 200,000 subscribers. Hmm, at
$20 per month, that's $4 mil monthly gross income.  The price of some
3 Gb drives wouldn't make a dent in it.

So, it seems to reason that Netcom either:

1) Is very interested in the dividends it's stockholders get and
couldn't care less about its users.

2) Has no idea what "planning for the future" means and is constantly
upgrading its hardware behind the growth curve.

3) Is randomly or selectively deleting posts for unknown and possibly
nefarious reasons (like the dreaded and infamous "missing part 23 of
54" trick in the warez binaries).

Who knows?  Who cares?  If you think Netcom is stiffing you, go to
another provider (preferably a local ISP).  If you think Netcom is
doing the best it can, stick with it.

You Pays Your Money and You Takes Your Chances

---

From: [email-masked]
Date: Sun, 08 Oct 1995 17:41:04 GMT

>Who gives a flying fuck about NETCOM..what a waiste of my time.  fuck

Maybe the people on Netcom care?  Grow up loser boy.

.

---

From: [email-masked] (Robert Haviland)
Date: Sun, 08 Oct 1995 17:08:26 GMT

[email-masked] (<gOT WArEz>) wrote:

>Before a couple of days ago, I didn't have a problem with my
>Netcruiser account, and always thought that people who complained
>about it didn't know how to use their software right.  The Netlooser
>software does suck, so I only use Free Agent.  Yesterday, Netcom must
>have deleted something because posts posted on Thursday were
>mysteriously gone on Friday.  I never used to care, but this time I'm
>pissed off.  You can be sure I'm switching to another provider.

>Oh, and by the way, to all you morons that think we just don't know
>how to use our news readers.  Well, I don't have Netcruiser installed,
>and I know hot to use Agent inside out.  So don't give me that shit.

If you didn't have trouble before the surge, you did read that a few
times, you might not have problems after everything straightens back
out.  You did know that Netcom was down?  

I did let an article sit in a binaries group and one in another
hierachry that were dated 10-3.  The one in the binaries group is gone
while the other was okay.  So, they are just not saving the files from
this group.  Contact support and see what they say.  

No, I don't work for Netcom.

Robert Haviland

;-)

---

From: [email-masked] (Tao0805001)
Date: 8 Oct 1995 14:41:10 -0400

Apparently I think AOL is trying to censor this thread too, since of the
27posts in this thread I am only able to read the last 10 or so, and the
rest is "expired or canceled". AOL banned alt.binaries.warez hierachies,
FYI. Prodigy is doing the same thing like Netcom, as I see they are
deleting all binaries in warez groups except the last part(usually part
4), meaning that over 2/3 of the posts are deleted. Online services are
getting sucker and sucker everyday.....

---

From: [email-masked] (Joachim Van Brandt)
Date: Sun, 08 Oct 1995 22:02:16 GMT

>look at my newsreader settings and all my problems went away...

Okay, tell me what I have to do with Free Agent then to make it work.
Hmmm?
If you do that and it works, Ill tell everyone youre right. but right
now, I cant find what the problem is.
Okay?
Now well see the truth.

---

From: [email-masked] (Thomas Craig)
Date: Mon, 09 Oct 1995 00:24:17 GMT

>getting sucker and sucker everyday.....

So people can just post warez in groups like "za.test" and the like.
The great thing about the net, if I may quote, is that "It interprets
censorship as damage, and routes around it".

---

From: [email-masked] (Keith Blair)
Date: Mon, 9 Oct 1995 14:31:44 GMT

[email-masked] (Thomas Craig) wrote:

>This thread is getting old.

Yes, it is. So why are you continuing it?

>As far as Netcom saying they are restraining the a.b hierarchy to
>save space, it seems pretty unbelievable.  During the school season,
>Usenet generates about 200-300 Mb of posts daily.

You really have no clue do you? The erotica binary groups take up more
than that alone. Considering Netcom now has well over 14,000 groups,
with at least %50-%75 of them having activity, that's a lot of space.
Also considering that the erotica binary groups number over 20, each
with probably hundreds of megs a week, that also adds up. Quit spewing
forth knowledge that you think you have when you don't.

>couldn't care less about its users.

Or, maybe they don't care about supporting a newsgroup with illegal
activity in it? Go ahead, call up tech support and tell them that
you're pissed off because you're too stupid to get your new warez
d00d.

>upgrading its hardware behind the growth curve.

This is pretty true.

>54" trick in the warez binaries).

Oh yea. The company that's too cheap to buy a new hard drive is really
going to pay someone to sit around watching newsgroups and deleting
posts. Oh yea, that's really going to happen.

>doing the best it can, stick with it.

While I've had my Netcom account, I've tried 5 other providers. Once
you do that, you realize that Netcom isn't as bad as you think it is.
It's also quite funny to see that only people with Netcruiser (Note
correct spelling - and I don't even use it) accounts are complaining.
All of us "Shell users who don't think our shit stinks" don't seem to
have any problem. And as for the comment made that shell users don't
know what's happening on the net.. Netcruiser = AOL. 'Nuff said.

---

From: [email-masked] (Keith Blair)
Date: Mon, 9 Oct 1995 14:31:49 GMT

>Maybe the people on Netcom care?  Grow up loser boy.

Actually he's right. If you're having problems on Netcom, post it to a
Netcom news group where it might do some good. This is a binary group.
Read again - B-I-N-A-R-Y. That means non-text. 

YOU grow up panty-waste.

---

From: [email-masked] (Thomas Craig)
Date: Mon, 09 Oct 1995 15:20:23 GMT

>forth knowledge that you think you have when you don't.

Well, having managed a news spool with over 10k groups, the
200-300Mb/day number is about correct.  The alt. hierarchy takes about
half of that, the biggest being the alt.binaries groups.  The
comp.binaries are next biggest.  Why does a self-proclaimed "shell
user" like yourself think he knows for sure what is happening on the
news spool?

>posts. Oh yea, that's really going to happen.

All of these are hypothetical.  I claim no inside knowledge of what
Netcom is doing.  These are just possible reasons.  As far a randomly
deleting posts, I could write a nice little shell script, or even a
patch for the news software, that could kill random binary posts to
the warez newsgroups unmonitored.  Its been done in the past (mainly
by college sys admins).

>know what's happening on the net.. Netcruiser = AOL. 'Nuff said.

The issue is not what method you use to access Netcom, either
Netcruiser, your own TCP/IP apps, or a shell account, but what is
happening on Netcom's own servers, which I hope you realize, couldn't
care less what method of access you use.

I'm tired of people with 5 months experience as an end-user on the net
spouting "facts" as if they were sys admins with 20 years experience.
Just realize that you don't know everything about the internet,
especially about what is going on at the other end of your phone line.

---

From: [email-masked] (Evan Platt)
Date: Sat, 07 Oct 1995 23:00:47 GMT

>waited, watching the logs, until YOU accessed them, and then erased ONLY

Hey dipwad?? He said he would go in and retrieve headers. See
"retrieving headers." Then wait 6 hours, and retrieve the article. See
"retrieving article."

---

From: [email-masked] (Evan Platt)
Date: Sat, 07 Oct 1995 23:07:54 GMT

>	You have mistaken this group for someone that cares...

Hey netcom looser...
Did you have to quote the ENTIRE DAMN THREAD to just say that???

---

From: [email-masked] (Keith Blair)
Date: Tue, 10 Oct 1995 15:41:55 GMT

>user" like yourself think he knows for sure what is happening on the

Excuse me if I forgot to bow to your greatness sir. After all, you
have run a news server right? Wow. Golly. I think I went wee wee in my
pants. Guess I better get back to my mommie's Prodigy account and look
for more /<rAd WaReZ d00d for my awesome 286/12.

Sigh.

Signed,
Someone who's been on the net longer than 5 months thankyouverylittle.

---

From: [email-masked] (CB Leek)
Date: Tue, 10 Oct 1995 22:45:44 GMT

>YOU grow up panty-waste.

Hate to tell you, but I'm seeing these postings all over, including
this one -- and I DON'T read ANY of the alt.binaries.

--
*** Conserve Energy: Laughter is easier than Anger!
*** [email-masked], Goose Bay, Labrador

---

From: [email-masked] (Thomas Craig)
Date: Wed, 11 Oct 1995 00:45:19 GMT

>Someone who's been on the net longer than 5 months thankyouverylittle.

If you've been on the net longer than five months, why don't you act
it?  You refute my statement, saying I don't have a clue.  When I
explain the source of my information - actual experience - you do a
kiddie flame with no content.

Send me some information that proves me wrong about the volume of
usenet and I'll gladly apologize.  Until then, sit back and listen
without making up figures and claiming that they are facts.

---

From: [email-masked]
Date: Sun, 08 Oct 95 13:30:15 -0700

i can't stand it anymore!!! i hate this SHIT!!! why are you posting this "i
don't give a damn" stuff about net-com in FOLKLORE:HERBS?????????
 
i hate it!! STOP IT!!

--==~^~remember..only god can make a tree~^~==--