1995.07.24 / Dieter Britz /  Blabblio update 24-Jul-95
     
Originally-From: britz@kemi.aau.dk (Dieter Britz)
Newsgroups: sci.physics.fusion
Subject: Blabblio update 24-Jul-95
Date: Mon, 24 Jul 1995 14:36:15 GMT
Organization: Sci.physics.fusion/Mail Gateway

Starry droogs,

Two more, er, cold fusion papers plus two peripherals that I think are more
interesting. The two CNF papers are not really, but both refer to CNF and
are clearly motivated by it. Alekseev et al actually did a self targeting
job, but talk about skewed tritium/neutron ratios in these metals. Hm, they
don't say whether they actually measured neutrons. The Indian corrosion lot
applied their craft to Pd's behaviour, and it's corrosion lore, with such
phrases as open circuit potential (which normally gives you a hint about
corrosion rate), galvanic current etc. Well, why not?

The possible role of Li in CNF has been much discussed, and Yamazaki et al
try to see whether Li can indeed be codeposited with hydrogen and enter the
Pd bulk. There is now a fair amount of evidence that it can, and these people
find rather high levels, despite  the low overpotentials applied to the Pd.
Looking at the Li % vs depth, and visually doing what the authors did, i.e.
fitting a Cottrell diffusion profile to the curve (taking surface leakage into
account), I'd say that their 7% figure is even a bit low, it looks more than
about 10% right at the surface, before leakage. On the other hand (taking out
the old envelope with a clean back), using their fitted diffusion coefficient
range for Li in Pd (10^-22...10^-20 m^2/s), and the supposed leakage depth
(about 30 nm), this leakage would require between 10^3 and 10^5 seconds; so
this is unlikely. I guess it's more likely to be an artifact of the SIMS
technique they used to measure Li penetration. Interesting, just the same.
The Mengoli et al paper looks at the alloy of Pd with Rh, with interesting
results. You get higher loading, and they distinguish between total loading
and Pd loading, i.e. the D/Pd ratio after imagining the Rh away. It's a way
to maximise that figure, and might even make sense, I don't know. Both these
papers will be cited by CNF workers, but are not in themselves CNF papers,
not even mentioning that context.

I will probably be off the air for a month or so, going to a place where I
may not have Internet access. So have lots of fun with physics farces,
plasmoids, gravity theory, Plutonium, the Swartz/Schultz cockfight and all
the other things that make this group worth avoiding.

Journal Papers: Current count = 996
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
#
Alekseev VA, Vasil'ev VI, Romodanov VA, Ryshkov YuF, Rylov SV, Savin VI,
Skuratnik YaB, Strunnikov VM; Tech. Phys. Lett. 21 (1995) 231.
Originally in Pis'ma Zh. Tekh. Fiz. 21 (1995) 64.
"Tritium production in the interaction of dense streams of deuterium
plama with metal surfaces".
** Self targeting ion beam, Ti, V, Fe, Zr, Nb, tritium, res+, no FPH/Jones
** refs
The authors regard this as a cold fusion paper but it is in fact about a
plasma discharge experiment, in a 30 mbar atmosphere of D2 between two
stainless steel electrodes, about 12 kV passed across them. Along part of the
axis, cylinders of various metals are placed, so that the plasma pinch pushes
onto the cylinder surface. The authors state that the resulting fusion favours
the tritium branch over the neutron one, and they analyse for tritium after
many discharges, both in the gas and the metal (but do not report any neutron
measurements). Group-IV metals were more effective than the others in
producing tritium, and the metals contained more tritium than the gas. The
authors find that tritium production correlates with hydrogen solubility in
the metal.  Dec-94/Mar-95
#......................................................................Jul-95
Mukherjee D, Wordsworth A; Tool & Alloy Steels, 1994, 323.
"Stress relieving of palladium foils, controls its electro-catalytic
properties".
** Experimental, Pd foil, open circuit potentials, corrosion rates,
** pretreatment, res0, no FPH/Jones refs.
A pair of corrosion workers try to throw some light on cold fusion, by looking
at open circuit potentials of Pd foils in a 3% NaCl electrolyte, as well as
its corrosion rate in conc. nitric acid, as a function of various
pretreatments such as "normalising" at 700 C, annealing at 680 C, quenching in
water at 30 C and at 19 C. Some of the foils were loaded with hydrogen, using
a 5% HCl solution and a Zn sacrificial anode. The hydrogen was then driven out
of the Pd again by heating at 200 C, resting for 5 min and then heating at 400
C. Results show that stress relieving treatment activates the Pd surface,
leading to a higher "galvanic current" where the counter electrode was mild
steel. More active Pd also corroded faster.
#......................................................................Jul-95

Peripherals: Current count = 98
^^^^^^^^^^^
#
Mengoli G, Fabrizio M, Manduchi C, Milli E, Zannoni G;
J. Electroanal. Chem. 390 (1995) 135.
"Absorption-desorption of deuterium at Pd95%-Rh5% alloy. I: environment and
temperature effects".
Using both metal/D2 gas and electrolysis systems, the team investigates the
deuterium uptake of the title alloy, at some temperatures. Gas loading was at
900 mbar, going from 900 C down to 20 C while measuring pressure to determine
deuterium loading. For electrolysis, various ionic strengths of LiOD were used
and loading measured by anodic extraction. Higher loadings than for pure Pd,
up to 0.89 (D/Me) or 0.94 (D/Pd) for the gas phase, and 0.92 (D/Me) or 0.97
(D/Pd) for electrolysis were achieved. Absorption is achieved only below about
50 C. With electrolysis, high alkalinity favoured loading.
#..................................................................... Jul-95 
Yamazaki O, Yoshitake H, Kamiya N, Ota K-i;
J. Electroanal. Chem. 390 (1995) 127.
"Hydrogen absorption and Li inclusion in a Pd cathode in LiOH solution".
This paper examines the interesting question of whether Li is inserted along
with hydrogen upon electrolysis of LiOH at a Pd cathode. Even with
underpotential deposition (UPD), this is not considered possible, but others
claim to have observed Li insertion. The present team, too, finds insertion,
up to about 7%at (and possibly higher), using SIMS. Assuming plain linear
diffusion, the diffusion coefficient of Li in Pd is determined as lying
between 10^-18 and 10^-16 cm^2/s, compared with about 10^-7 cm^2/s for protons
or deuterons. At electrolysis times up to 500 h, Li was found to a depth of
200 nm, with a maximum at about 30 nm (there may have been some surface loss
upon removal of the cathode from the solution). Some of the results indicate
an effect on hydrogen absorption by the included Li.
#..................................................................... Jul-95



How to retrieve the archived biblio files:
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
1. By ftp from vm1.nodak.edu; log in as anonymous, giving your email
   address as password. Then cd to fusion. There are many files here, so
   do not use dir; if you are after the biblio files only, try
   dir fusion.cnf-*
   and then get or mget what you want.
2. Send an email to listserv@vm1.nodak.edu, blank subject and the message
   get fusion.<whatever you want>. To find out what there is, send
   index fusion
   This gets you an email with the directory of all files there, with which
   you can also match Fusion Digest numbers with file names, before getting
   those files. The index, or files you ask for, will be emailed to you.

---  Dieter Britz   alias britz@kemi.aau.dk

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------------------------------
1995.07.24 /  jedrothwell@de /  Inattentive Barry Marriman
     
Originally-From: jedrothwell@delphi.com
Newsgroups: sci.physics.fusion
Subject: Inattentive Barry Marriman
Date: Mon, 24 Jul 95 12:00:08 -0500
Organization: Delphi (info@delphi.com email, 800-695-4005 voice)

Barry Merriman <barry@starfire.ucsd.edu> continues to make up facts as he goes
along. This improvisation is innovative, creative, and fun, but it ain't
science. I pointed out to him that in my essay "Highlights of ICCF5" I said
that the Potapov device needs to be verified. He responded:
 
     "Well then thats good. I'm sorry I didn't read your full essay, but its
     not readily available to me. I was going by the content of what you
     posted here. I suppose Infinite Energy, or wherever it appeared, would
     frown on you posting it here in its entirety, anyway."
 
I posted the entire essay here. There was a long discussion of it here,
primarily centered around the Cravens / CETI results. I posted various
references to it, and offered, on several occasions, to send out new copies. I
posted it in sci.energy, in CompuServe's SCIENCE forum library, and in John
Logajan's home page. Several people asked for updated copies and I presume
they put it in various newsgroups and home pages.
 
Look Barry, you choose not to read what I write. That's fine. No problem! I am
delighted to have you as a non-reader. I encourage you to put me on your
auto-delete list. You have also decided you will not bother to read original
sources -- papers, conference proceedings, patents and so on. That is a-okay
too. Peachy keen. You have no idea what Los Alamos is doing in CF; you haven't
a clue what Mitsubishi is up to; and you are probably not even aware of the
results from Japan's National Laboratory for High Energy Physics (KEK). That
stuff was described in my paper, but you have decided to wallow in ignorance
and pretend there is no data, no papers, and no science of cold fusion. Well,
okay, but let me suggest to you that you make yourself look like a fool every
time you pontificate on the subject. Since you know nothing about it, and you
are too lazy to find out anything, I suggest you shut up and save yourself
some embarrassment. You are not kidding anyone, we can see that you make up
facts as you go along.
 
Other "skeptics" seem to thrive on making fools of themselves. Richard Blue
goes out of his way to post his crackpot ideas about magically changing
specific heat and other absurdities. I think he gets a kick out of showing
everyone how ignorant he is, but I don't suppose you do. It seems sort of
kinky to me. You make up facts, but he makes up physics from scratch. I am
sure he does not believe a word of it, any more than Morrison believes in his
magic "cigarette lighter."
 
- Jed
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1995.07.24 / Richard Schultz /  Re: Inattentive Jed Rothwell
     
Originally-From: schultz@garnet.berkeley.edu (Richard Schultz)
Newsgroups: sci.physics.fusion
Subject: Re: Inattentive Jed Rothwell
Date: 24 Jul 1995 16:15:07 GMT
Organization: Philosophers of the Dangerous Maybe

It's deja vu all over again. . .
In article <5jFDZmY.jedrothwell@delphi.com>,  <jedrothwell@delphi.com> wrote:

>Look Barry, you choose not to read what I write. That's fine. No problem! I am
>delighted to have you as a non-reader. I encourage you to put me on your
>auto-delete list. You have also decided you will not bother to read original
>sources -- papers, conference proceedings, patents and so on. That is a-okay
>too. Peachy keen. 
>. . .but you have decided to wallow in ignorance
>and pretend there is no data, no papers, and no science of cold fusion. Well,
>okay, but let me suggest to you that you make yourself look like a fool every
>time you pontificate on the subject. Since you know nothing about it, and you
>are too lazy to find out anything, I suggest you shut up and save yourself
>some embarrassment. 

Replace "Barry" with "Jed" and "science of cold fusion" with "evidence that
the news media took the Wright Brothers seriously in 1903" and it would
word just as well.  You might consider the substance of which your house
is constructed before throwing heavy silicaceous objects about.  
--
					Richard Schultz
             "an optimist is a guy
              that has never had
              much experience"
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1995.07.24 / Cole Keirsey /  Re: Plasmoids
     
Originally-From: cole@advtech.uswest.com (Cole Keirsey)
Newsgroups: sci.physics.fusion
Subject: Re: Plasmoids
Date: 24 Jul 1995 16:47:52 GMT
Organization: U S WEST Advanced Technologies

The opening sentence of the article on plasmoids reads:

"Fundamental anomalous phenomena are the contradictions of the
postulates of the premises of people's theories, and the environment."

I think this sort of "science writing" deserves special recognition.
After reading this opening sentence, the reader knows just what to
expect from the rest of the article.  Other contributors to
sci.physics.fusion could profit from the example.

ck


-- 
______________________________________________________________________
C. C. Keirsey                 | "You can take the wisdom of this world 
cole@maverick.uswest.com      |  And give it to the ones who think it
                              |      all ends here." -- Bruce Cockburn 
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1995.07.24 /  lolita /  ?)$@>H%8@2``2)$
     
Originally-From: lolita@david.edu (lolita)
Newsgroups: sci.physics.fusion
Subject: ?)$@>H%8@2``2)$
Date: Mon, 24 Jul 1995 17:57:22 GMT

Cancelling unapproved article in moderated group.
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1995.07.24 /  lolita /  ?)$@>H%8@2``2)$
     
Originally-From: lolita@david.edu (lolita)
Newsgroups: sci.physics.fusion
Subject: ?)$@>H%8@2``2)$
Date: Mon, 24 Jul 1995 18:02:07 GMT

Cancelling unapproved article in moderated group.
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1995.07.24 /  lolita /  ?)$@>H%8@2``2)$
     
Originally-From: lolita@david.edu (lolita)
Newsgroups: sci.physics.fusion
Subject: ?)$@>H%8@2``2)$
Date: Mon, 24 Jul 1995 18:02:47 GMT

Cancelling unapproved article in moderated group.
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1995.07.24 / Richard Schultz /  What is hemoglobin doing here?
     
Originally-From: schultz@garnet.berkeley.edu (Richard Schultz)
Newsgroups: sci.physics.fusion
Subject: What is hemoglobin doing here?
Date: 24 Jul 1995 11:13:58 GMT
Organization: University of California, Berkeley

In article <DC36GB.Lxr@world.std.com>,
mitchell swartz <mica@world.std.com> wrote:

>  Au contraire.  The "R" and "T" refer to "relaxed" and "taut" and
>are a great simplification dealing with tertiary structure.
>  Apparently, Mr. Schultz could not answer.

(1) "R" and "T" refer to "relaxed" and "tense," not "relaxed" and "taut".

(2) In the usual parlance, "R" and "T" refer to quaternary, not tertiary,
structure (although there is a tertiary structure associated with each
of the quaternary structures, and one can consider the effects on the 
kinetics of intermediates that have a "t" tertiary structure but an
"R" quarternary structure -- indeed, it is commonly accepted that the
changes in quaternary structure are driven at least in part by tertiary
relaxation).

(3) Note that, true to form, Swartz left out the previous evidence of
both his own incompetence (in which he referred to the states as "T" and
"D") and that I had answered his original question.

This is (I promise) the last post on hemoglobin that I will send here.
--
					Richard Schultz

"I seem to smell a peculiar and a fishlike smell."

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1995.07.24 / Richard Schultz /  Mitchell Swartz, vocabulary genius
     
Originally-From: schultz@garnet.berkeley.edu (Richard Schultz)
Newsgroups: sci.physics.fusion
Subject: Mitchell Swartz, vocabulary genius
Date: 24 Jul 1995 11:30:28 GMT
Organization: Philosophers of the Dangerous Maybe

In article <DC36nM.1LE@world.std.com>,
mitchell swartz <mica@world.std.com> wrote:

>>>How many of the CF applicants to the symposium
>>>did Mr. Schultz actually speak with?  And who?

>>None.  Nor have I spoken to anyone involved in the programming.

>  No wonder Mr. Schultz has been so willing to impugn.

Swartz seems to love his new-found vocabulary word "impugn."  What he
doesn't seem to be aware of is that the only person whom I am "impugning"
is him, because of his continuous stream of lies and omissions on this
and many other issues.  I have explained numerous times, in detail, the
process of reasoning that led me to conclude that the so-called "censorship"
of cold fusion at the ACS meeting was a product of Swartz's rather 
fevered imagination.  I even explained to Swartz several times how programming
is actually done, what happens when more papers are submitted than there
is time for in a given session, and why it is not possible to just add more
papers.  Swartz never made any substantive reply to any of that (which, I
am sure, comes as no surprise to anyone).  I asked him if he had any 
experience with programming of any science conferences -- a question that
he has so far refused to answer.  Despite his doubts that I would answer
his question (who is impugning whom here, I wonder), I did.  Unlike
Swartz, who will not answer any question when that answer will force him
to admit what everyone else knows already.
--
					Richard Schultz

"You don't even have a clue as to which clue you're missing." -- Miss Manners
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1995.07.24 / Ieromnimon F /  Re: The Golden Anniversary of Trinity (Atomic Age)
     
Originally-From: ierof@brave4.essex.ac.uk (Ieromnimon F)
Newsgroups: sci.physics.fusion
Subject: Re: The Golden Anniversary of Trinity (Atomic Age)
Date: 24 Jul 1995 11:27:46 GMT
Organization: University of Essex, Colchester, UK

In article <xzDAIMV.jedrothwell@delphi.com> jedrothwell@delphi.com writes:
>Wayne Price <SUCOR@I-link.net> writes:
> 
>     "Celebrating the 50th anniversary of the Atomic Age. . . . J. Robert
>     Oppenheimer is standing before the bellowing mushroom cloud at 008
>     seconds after detonation.  Oppenheimer after observing the results of
>     his creation quoted an ancient Hindu text, "Now I am become death, the
>     destroyer of worlds". . . . Check out this Fractal Design color art work
>     at: .alt.binaries.pictures.misc . . .Comments welcomed!
> 
>You want comments? Okay, you asked for it. As a Japanese - American, I find
>this posting sick, disgusting, and outrageous. Look, no reasonable person
>disputes that in war it is sometimes necessary to use inhuman methods. War is
>hell. Many (but by no means all) Japanese people acknowledge that it is a good
>thing the bomb brought the war to a quick end. But good grief! It is nothing
>to "celebrate"!!!
> 
>Why not "celebrate" the battle of Cold Harbor or the Siege of Verdun? You can
>post a nice fractal picture of General Grant observing the results of his
>orders, thinking: "Jesus Christ, I just massacred 13,000 of my own men for
>nothing." If you are going to have a fractal picture of Oppenheimer, I suggest
>you juxtapose it with photographs of the children dying in agony, with the
>skin torn off the bodies and flies crawling over their faces. I think that
							       ^^^^^^^^^^^^
>Oppenheimer himself would be appalled at the idea of "celebrating" or
 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>romanticizing the bomb in this fashion. It is like celebrating the use of
 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

As indeed he was. The verse that Oppenheimer cited was a (elaborate perhaps, but
then he was an educated man) result of the realization of the consequences of
his work.
  I don't think that many scientists were happy after Hiroshima & Nagasaki. The
best that Feynman offers in his memoirs is excuses about the necessities of the
war effort, when he cares to talk about the moral aspect of his and his
colleagues (sp?) work. He did say he felt morose and hopeless for some time
after the end of the Manhattan project.

>poison gas in World War I. Any decent human being will morn such cruel,
>shameful, hideous events, not celebrate them. It is good to recall this
>history, because it teaches us the folly of war, and makes us hope that we
>will never again be forced to use such inhuman weapons.
> 
>- Jed

Frank
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1995.07.23 / Roger Ivie /  MIT cold fusion patent?
     
Originally-From: ivie@cc.usu.edu (Roger Ivie)
Newsgroups: sci.physics.fusion
Subject: MIT cold fusion patent?
Date: 23 Jul 95 21:48:22 MDT
Organization: Utah State University

In Saturday's Deseret News (out of Salt Lake City) there's a front-page
story claiming MIT has patented a "cold-fusionlike device". The inventers
claim that it "releases the latent heat" of hydrogen through something
called "anharmonic vibrations". While they say it is possible that fusion
might occur, it would not be significant and is not the source of energy
tapped by the device.

I was wondering if anyone knows anything more about the device; in particular,
the phrase "anharmonic vibration" makes no sense to me.
-- 
----------------+------------------------------------------------------
Roger Ivie      | "Did you know the AIDS spore can live in sweaters?"
ivie@cc.usu.edu |          -- Overheard at Hansen Planetarium
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1995.07.24 / mitchell swartz /  What is hemoglobin doing here?
     
Originally-From: mica@world.std.com (mitchell swartz)
Newsgroups: sci.physics.fusion
Subject: What is hemoglobin doing here?
Subject: What is hemoglobin doing here?
Date: Mon, 24 Jul 1995 12:42:53 GMT
Organization: The World Public Access UNIX, Brookline, MA

  In Message-ID: <3uvv9m$gsf@agate.berkeley.edu>
Subject: What is hemoglobin doing here?
schultz@garnet.berkeley.edu (Richard Schultz) demonstrates
how little he knows.

Mr Schultz wrote:
  >  Au contraire.  The "R" and "T" refer to "relaxed" and "taut" and
  >are a great simplification dealing with tertiary structure.
  >  Apparently, Mr. Schultz could not answer.
=rpes "(1) "R" and "T" refer to "relaxed" and "tense," not "relaxed" and "taut"
=rpes (2) In the usual parlance, "R" and "T" refer to quaternary, not tertiary,
=rpes structure (although there is a tertiary structure associated with each
=rpes of the quaternary structures, and one can consider the effects on the 
=rpes kinetics of intermediates that have a "t" tertiary structure but an
=rpes "R" quarternary structure -- indeed, it is commonly accepted that the
=rpes changes in quaternary structure are driven at least in part by tertiary
=rpes  relaxation).

  Unlikely.
   The quaternary structure refers to the aggregation, that
is, polymerization.   Oxygenated hemoglobin is a dimer.
Hemoglobin is a tetramer in the deoxygenated (purple) state.

The oxygen cause a change in the tertiary structure and upon
oxygenation (orange color) the material becomes a dimer
which is a new quaternary state.

  (Hb)4  +   4O2  ------->    changes in tertiary then
                           quart. structure  -------->  2    (HbO2)2

   Mr. Schultz got this wrong, true to his form.

    Perhaps he would care to comment
why even this is an approximation?
   Or how the electronic state is involved?

   More likely he cant answer, and
since he got this wrong, true to his form,
and since he knows nothing about
cold fusion, Mr. Schultz's  "peculiar and a fishlike smell" to
which he refers and personally caries about,
is now explained in toto.

   Mitchell Swartz

   ===========================
"I think you're thinking of Wyoming, where the men are men, 
the women are men, and the sheep are scared."
  [Richard Schultz, Princeton and Berkeley, 22 Jun 1995]


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1995.07.24 / mitchell swartz /  Autoradiographs of the electrode
     
Originally-From: mica@world.std.com (mitchell swartz)
Newsgroups: sci.physics.fusion
Subject: Autoradiographs of the electrode
Subject: Re: Autoradiographs of the electrode
Date: Mon, 24 Jul 1995 12:44:38 GMT
Organization: The World Public Access UNIX, Brookline, MA

  In Message-ID: <9507231556.AA12169@pilot07.cl.msu.edu>
Subject: Re: Autoradiographs of the electrode
blue@pilot.msu.edu (Richard A Blue) continues his 
thoughts.    

   Dick now agrees that an autoradiograph
may provide a crude picture of the distribution of activity from an
electrode. 

    His other ideas are good.

    He continues, "is the level of activity detected by electronic 
      --means consistent with the time require to develop an 
     --  autogradiographic  image?"
     --   "I have the feeling that there is a significant conflict 
     --  between the results of various CF experiments on this point. "

  Perhaps Dick will elaborate and clarify as to whether
this putative conflict was discovered by his during his
reading of the literature, or was this his "feeling".

   After announcing this "feeling", Dick continues 
his flawed theory that cold fusion does not exist.
Dick says, sounding authoritative,
      --     "It is one of those areas in which
      --   no two laboratories have ever gotten the same result."

  Do tell Dick.  Please share the data, or is this another
"feeling"?

   Also, Dick,
Quaerie:  Is there significant conflict between the results in
hot fusion labs at present?

  Best wishes.
    Mitchell Swartz



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1995.07.24 / mitchell swartz /  [0;1;5;32;42mRichard Schultz contiues his fantasies[0m
     
Originally-From: mica@world.std.com (mitchell swartz)
Newsgroups: sci.physics.fusion
Subject: [0;1;5;32;42mRichard Schultz contiues his fantasies[0m
Date: Mon, 24 Jul 1995 12:49:38 GMT
Organization: The World Public Access UNIX, Brookline, MA

  In Message-ID: <3v008k$h17@agate.berkeley.edu>
schultz@garnet.berkeley.edu (Richard Schultz) continues
his copious misstatements and
ad hominems in his sick attempt to impugn.

  He has admitted that he knew nothing about the
ACS symposium which relegated the entire CF
submissions to a garage and poster sessions.  As
Schultz has finally admitted after wasting weeks
of everyone's time:

    >>>How many of the CF applicants to the symposium
    >>>did Mr. Schultz actually speak with?  And who?
    >>None.  Nor have I spoken to anyone involved in the programming.

  No wonder Mr. Schultz has been so willing to impugn.
Mr.  Schultz has a continuous stream of lies and interference
so unique to him.
Many people have told him  numerous times to grow up, but
the most he can do is e-mail his fantasies worldwide as his
constant harassing over the nets causes normal 
contributors to avoid nets.  too bad he has been unable to
be either appropriate or adult, but then even his sigs
are a fractal look at his mind.

   ===========================
"I think you're thinking of Wyoming, where the men are men, 
the women are men, and the sheep are scared."
  [Richard Schultz, Princeton and Berkeley, 22 Jun 1995]
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------------------------------
1995.07.24 / Dieter Britz /  Re: Citations (how not to provide them)
     
Originally-From: Dieter Britz <britz@kemi.aau.dk>
Newsgroups: sci.physics.fusion
Subject: Re: Citations (how not to provide them)
Date: Mon, 24 Jul 1995 14:53:00 +0200
Organization: DAIMI, Computer Science Dept. at Aarhus University

On Thu, 20 Jul 1995, mitchell swartz wrote:

[.....................]
> 15 die are thrown into a circle the concentration is
> 15 die (or dice, excuse me) in a circle.
[.....................]

OK, Mitch, you get a point for even knowing that the word "die" exists;
most people have forgotten. But to straighten you out, "die" is singular,
"dice" is plural. Thus, "15 die" is an overcorrection.

Might I suggest that you two (Schultz & Swartz) take this long and (to us)
pointless squabble off the air? You are getting about as tedious as all
those cross-posters. Thank you in anticipation.


-- Dieter Britz  alias  britz@kemi.aau.dk


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1995.07.24 / mitchell swartz /  Citations (how not to provide them)
     
Originally-From: mica@world.std.com (mitchell swartz)
Newsgroups: sci.physics.fusion
Subject: Citations (how not to provide them)
Subject: Re: Citations (how not to provide them) wrote:
Date: Mon, 24 Jul 1995 13:58:42 GMT
Organization: The World Public Access UNIX, Brookline, MA

  In  <Pine.OSF.3.91.950724083032.11347B-...@kemi.aau.dk>
 Dieter Britz <britz@kemi.aau.dk>Newsgroups: sci.physics.fusion
Subject: Re: Citations (how not to provide them) wrote:

    [.....................]
    > 15 die are thrown into a circle the concentration is
    > 15 die (or dice, excuse me) in a circle.
     [.....................]
 -   "OK, Mitch, you get a point for even knowing that the word "die" exists;
 -   most people have forgotten. But to straighten you out, "die" is singular,
 -   "dice" is plural. Thus, "15 die" is an overcorrection."

  Thanks.  Is that a bevy or gaggle of dice? or what?

  Best wishes.
    Mitchell

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1995.07.23 / Barry Merriman /  Re: Silly nonsense from Robert Heeter
     
Originally-From: barry@starfire.ucsd.edu (Barry Merriman)
Newsgroups: sci.physics.fusion
Subject: Re: Silly nonsense from Robert Heeter
Date: 23 Jul 1995 22:02:55 GMT
Organization: UCSD SOE

In article <5BCBoJi.jedrothwell@delphi.com> jedrothwell@delphi.com writes:
> Barry Merriman <barry@starfire.ucsd.edu> writes:
>  
> >I find it interesting that you don't offer up as equally likely
> >that the device simply doesn't work, and experimental error is
> >the source of the conflicting results. I guess that would just be
>  
> B.S. The next paragraph in the essay dealt with that likelihood. I described
> my efforts to verify the thing, and the necessity of verification.
>  

Well then thats good. I'm sorry I didn't read your full
essay, but its not readily available to me. I was going by the
content of what you posted here. I suppose Infinite Energy,
or wherever it appeared, would frown on you posting it here
in its entirety, anyway.


--
Barry Merriman
UCSD Fusion Energy Research Center
UCLA Dept. of Math
bmerriman@fusion.ucsd.edu (Internet; NeXTMail is welcome)


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1995.07.24 / Dave Davies /  Re: What's up with P&F ?
     
Originally-From: Dave Davies <dave.davies@anu.edu.au>
Newsgroups: sci.physics.fusion
Subject: Re: What's up with P&F ?
Date: 24 Jul 1995 05:14:19 GMT
Organization: Speaking for MYSELF

barry@starfire.ucsd.edu (Barry Merriman) wrote:
>
>Does anyone know what is going on with Pon's and F.? Last
>rumor we heard---from an evil skeptical source---was that 
>they were in essence abandoning their cold fusion work.
>
Yes, source-cred. = zilch.

>Given that their public presentation history consists
>of a big press conference, an initial provocative but 
>sketchy paper, and then a long slow series of retractions
>of nuclear signatures (gamma's, neutrons, He4), its hard

Well, they did that once. Not much of a statistic really. 

>to see how much longer they can go without issuing some
>sort of detailed status report.
>
As long as their masters damn well like. Can you give me one good
reason why a commercial organisation should boast about success until
they had a commercial device ready to roll? I can give you good reasons
why they do not.

>Particulalrly amusing is their effective non-presence at last years
>CF conference, which was held on their home turf. Though I 
>recall F. said something along the lines of ``no news is good news''
>(an odd slogan for a scientist).

Last year or ICCF5? I gather thtey were both there but unless you want
to join the tea-leaf reading club that some sceptics, like DM, have
you can say little other than they are not in a marketing phase.
>
>In any event, does anyone happen to have an inside knowledge 
>of whats going on? In my book, the current body of CF lives or dies 
>by the work of P&F: they've been at longer (10 years now!) and
>with more funding (must be approaching $10,000,000, including the 
>$5M from Utah) than anybody else, and are also the most competent 
>elechtro-chemists involved.If their experiments are a bust,
>I doubt there is anything to the various spinoff approaches, regardless of
>whether they seem more robust.
>
Again, tea-leaves and guesswork. I agree with Jed here that F&P do not seem
to be the leading edge here but might be stuck in a rut. This often happens
with the first into a field. Everyone else learns from their mistakes. To those
who believe that they are getting heat robustness is the name of the game.

I have said before that comments such as yours reveal a lot about how remote 
many academics are from the commercial world. No wonder that the word
'academic'
has taken on the meaning of 'pointless' or 'irrelevant'. It makes life a lot 
harder for those academics who do communicate effectively and do understand 
things outside their immediate speciality.


dave

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------------------------------
1995.07.24 / Paul Koloc /  Re: NO GR POSTINGS - Says Heeter - What Gall!
     
Originally-From: pmk@prometheus.UUCP (Paul M. Koloc)
Newsgroups: sci.physics.fusion
Subject: Re: NO GR POSTINGS - Says Heeter - What Gall!
Date: Mon, 24 Jul 1995 05:07:31 GMT
Organization: Prometheus II, Ltd.

In article <3ursht$p90@soenews.ucsd.edu> barry@starfire.ucsd.edu (Barry Merriman) writes:
>In article <-2007951553350001@ip-salem2-23.teleport.com>  
><singtech@teleport.com> (Charles Cagle) writes:

>> Back off Heeter, GR *is* related to fusion along with SR, particularly so
>> if it is a local event which is globally mediated.

>Is it? If so, why don't you spell out more precisely what important
>role GR plays in any fusion reaction?

Likely several, but perhaps I assume too much.  First it still seems
feasible to me that the form of grav/EM equations suggest some kind of 
possible unifying feature or super set. This being said, there could 
be a connection between grav and magnetic fields, for example, which 
doesn't show up except in large massive bodies with certain other 
dynamic features.  

>Certainly the local fusion reaction itself involves only the strong
>and EM forces.

>About the closest I could imagine is that the sun is a gravitationally
>contained fusion reactor, but even that has nothing to do with GR
>and little of interest to do with gravity.

Now, I've always suspected since I came up with this PLASMAK(tm) 
concept  (Are they still simmering at Garching??) and Spheromak 
topology, that such objects could be generated within the Sun's outer 
body.  These would be sufficiently deep so that it would take a while 
for them to migrate (driven by bouyancy) to the surface, where they 
decay into remnants, we see as sunspots.   

One fusion connection is that when formed, the cavitation and physical 
inertial separation of plasmas and fields, could easily generate the 
compression heating necessary to produce a burn.  Of course the burn 
extinguishes, likely within relatively short period of time due to 
expanstion cooling, which takes place as these objects come to 
pressure equilibrium with thier immediate environment.  Of course, 
that cooling continues until arrival at the surface where the core
Kernel or highly magnetized ring is very cool by comparison to
the surrounding plasma.  But, I realise you probably had a momentary 
lapse of speculative memory.   
                                :-)    

So Barry, what is the starting depth, making assumptions about 
vertical drift velocity, variable size due to expansion, Bremsstrahlung 
net inout rad rates, and the init burn temperature versus the adiabatic 
expansion cooled final "black sun-spot" temperature???   
Still looking for that computational prowess.  

>--
>Barry Merriman
>UCSD Fusion Energy Research Center
>UCLA Dept. of Math
>bmerriman@fusion.ucsd.edu (Internet; NeXTMail is welcome)
+-------------------------------------------------------------------------+
| Paul M. Koloc, Bx 1037 Prometheus II Ltd, College Park MD 20741-1037    |
| mimsy!promethe!pmk; pmk%prometheus@mimsy.umd.edu   FAX (301) 434-6737   |
| VOICE (301) 445-1075   *****  Commercial FUSION in the Nineties *****   |
+-------------------------------------------------------------------------+

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------------------------------
1995.07.24 / Alan M /  Re: The dodo replies
     
Originally-From: "Alan M. Dunsmuir" <Alan@moonrake.demon.co.uk>
Newsgroups: sci.physics.fusion
Subject: Re: The dodo replies
Date: Mon, 24 Jul 1995 06:58:53
Organization: Home

In article: <B9Dh50U.jedrothwell@delphi.com>  jedrothwell@delphi.com writes:

> No, that is because you are a contemptible, patronizing, nitpicking jerk who
> knows nothing about history, technology or business. You spout on about
> irrelevant aspects of theoretical physics, because you think that theory can
> overrule facts.

Oh! How I love the free and unfettered exchange of academic information,
views and insights which the Information Superhighway brings us!

To think that, without the 'Net, none of us might ever have heard of Jed,
that vibrant multi-millionaire entrepreneur, whom we can all aspire to
emulate!

-- 
Alan M. Dunsmuir [@ his wits end]     (Can't even quote poetry right)

         I am his Highness' dog at Kew
         Pray tell me sir, whose dog are you?
			      [Alexander Pope]

PGP Public Key available on request.


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------------------------------
1995.07.23 /  lolita /  ?)$@>H%8@2``2)$
     
Originally-From: lolita@david.edu (lolita)
Newsgroups: sci.physics.fusion
Subject: ?)$@>H%8@2``2)$
Date: Sun, 23 Jul 1995 22:13:3 GMT
Organization: david



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                                              <= Crusader =>
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------------------------------
1995.07.23 /  lolita /  ?)$@>H%8@2``2)$
     
Originally-From: lolita@david.edu (lolita)
Newsgroups: sci.physics.fusion
Subject: ?)$@>H%8@2``2)$
Date: Sun, 23 Jul 1995 22:13:3 GMT
Organization: david


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------------------------------
1995.07.23 /  lolita /  ?)$@>H%8@2``2)$
     
Originally-From: lolita@david.edu (lolita)
Newsgroups: sci.physics.fusion
Subject: ?)$@>H%8@2``2)$
Date: Sun, 23 Jul 1995 22:13:3 GMT
Organization: david


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