From RUSTEX-L@UBVM.cc.buffalo.edu Thu Apr 9 18:34:41 1992 Received: from ubvm.cc.buffalo.edu for jkl by oscsunb.osc.edu (5.65c/pl1+KVa/920330.1102) id AA07714; Thu, 9 Apr 1992 18:34:26 -0400 Received: from UBVM.BITNET by UBVM.cc.buffalo.edu (IBM VM SMTP V2R2) with BSMTP id 8615; Thu, 09 Apr 92 18:36:28 EDT Received: by UBVM (Mailer R2.08 PTF008) id 6785; Thu, 09 Apr 92 18:31:25 EDT Received: from UBVM.BITNET by UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU (LISTSERV release 1.7b) with NJE id 6181 for RUSTEX-L@UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU; Thu, 9 Apr 1992 18:29:10 -0400 Received: from UBVM by UBVM.BITNET (Mailer R2.08 PTF008) with BSMTP id 6578; Thu, 09 Apr 92 18:28:22 EDT Received: from netmail.microsoft.com by UBVM.cc.buffalo.edu (IBM VM SMTP V2R2) with TCP; Thu, 09 Apr 92 18:28:17 EDT Received: from microsoft.UUCP by netmail.microsoft.com with UUCP (5.65/25-eef) id AA02473; Thu, 9 Apr 92 14:13:35 -0700 X-Msmail-Message-Id: 45F2AB36 X-Msmail-Conversation-Id: 45F2AB36 X-Msmail-Wiseremark: One Planet, One People, One Platform: Macintosh Message-Id: <9204092113.AA02473@netmail.microsoft.com> Newsgroups: bit.listserv.rustex-l Date: Thu, 9 Apr 1992 15:13:16 PDT Sender: Russian TeX and Cyrillic text processing list From: Christopher Rimple Subject: RE: Cyrillic font conversions on a Mac??? [LONG] X-To: rustex-l@ubvm.cc.buffalo.edu X-Cc: rustex-l@ubvm.cc.buffalo.edu To: Jan Labanowski Status: R |Hello. I am looking for conversion programs to translate some |Cyrillic fonts |into other Cyrillic fonts. In particular, I am using the Casady & Greene |"Glasnost" package of fonts which have a "Soviet"-style |keyboard map. However, |I was told that the most popular ASCII conversion table in the CIS is KOI-8. |A message with KOI-8 text inside looks like gibberish to me. I |have a Mac and |a friend of mine has a Fontographer utility which can be used to re-map the |characters. However, I am very reluctant to "reinvent the wheel" and have |more interest in history than in programming. Can anyone help, please. Most Cyrillic fonts use the IBM standard keyboard mapping and ASCII values below 128 for their characters. KOI-7 and -8, on the other hand, are methods of transliteration (converting Cyrillic characters into English phonems, represented with Roman characters). After converting Cyrillic to KOI, it no longer matches the ASCII values for most Cyrillic fonts, so you can't just select the text and change the font to Cyrillic. What you need is a transliteration utility which will convert your Cyrillic ASCII codes to KOI codes and back again. Funny coincidence, but I was noting the lack of such a utility last night, so I started writing one for Windows; it only transliterates to KOI (not back) right now, but I hope to have it done in a few weeks (both English and Russian versions) and I'll make it available to anyone when it's finished. However, KOI is mostly a waste of time, since you can send Cyrillic ASCII via email and the receiver only needs to select the text and change the font to Cyrillic for it to appear correctly; this technique is computer-independent, provided both people have a Cyrillic font that maps to the IBM standard (Soviet) keyboard. I've attached some information I put together for people here at Microsoft; ignore the references to server locations and you should find it informative. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- 8) What's transliteration? Transliteration is the process of translating one language into another, using the characters and phonems of the second language. This is very common for email sent in Russian, since Cyrillic characters cannot be sent through email (see #9 below). For example, an email message may be entirely in Russian, but will be written using Roman characters, like "kak dela?" (which is Russian for "how have you been doing?"). There are many methods for transliterating Russian to English, but two of the most common are KOI-7 and the Library of Congress codes. KOI-7 provides a one-to-one-character relationship which is popular among heavy computer users, while the Library of Congress method is considered more easily read in email. Both are shown below: Russian KOI-7 Library of Congress --------- ----- -------------------- ah a A a A beh b B b B veh w W v V geh g G g G deh d D d D yeh e E e E (ye,je,ie) yo $ # e E (yo,jo,io) zhe v V zh ZH z z Z z Z i i I i I (ee) i kratkoe j J j J ka k K k K el l L l L em m M m M en n N n N o o O o O peh p P p P er r R r R es s S s S teh t T t T u u U u U (oo) ef f F f F kha h H x X tse c C ts TS che ~ ^ ch CH sha { [ sh SH shcha } ] shch SHCH hard sign " " yeri y Y y Y soft sign x X ' reverse e | \ e E yu ` @ ju JU (yu,iu) yah q Q ja JA (ya,ia) 9) How can I send a message or file in Cyrillic through email? Email is sent between sites using a protocol called UUCP, which does not support standard 8-bit characters. Therefore, files containing formatting and character properties (bold, italic - composed in Word for Windows or other word processors) cannot be sent through email. There are three solutions to this problem: transliteration, text-only file transfer, and UUencoding. Transliteration (see #8 above) is very common, while text-only file transfer and UUencoding are rare. There are limitations with each method that you should consider before making your decision, but text-only file transfer seems to be the most efficient if it is available to you. Transliteration is easily accomplished, but requires that you convert all your Cyrillic text into English phonems; of course, all formatting and character properties will be lost. To transliterate a message or file, convert all the Cyrillic characters as specified in #8 above. Text-only file transfer allows you to send Cyrillic text, but requires that the recipient have a word processor which supports Cyrillic fonts. To convert Cyrillic to text-only, open the file with your word processor and save it in text-only format; note that all formatting and character properties will be lost. Append or paste the text-only file into your email message and send it. The recipient will need to copy the text to their word processor or save the email message as a file they can open, then change the font to Cyrillic. For example, you could compose a message to a friend using a Cyrillic font in Word for Windows, save the message as a text-only file, open it with Windows' Notepad, and paste it into an email message. The recipient would then save the message as a file, open it with Word for Windows, select the text, and change the font to Cyrillic. This method works best if both you and the recipient are using the same font, since a few Cyrillic fonts don't use standard Soviet keyboard mapping. UUencoding allows you to send a file as-is, but requires that the recipient have a decoder utility and a word processor which can read the file; all formatting and character properties will be retained. UUencoding a file is easy if you use WinMail or MS Mail. Both of these applications allow you to attach a file to your email, and that file is automatically UUencoded. When your email is received, the recipient will use a UUdecode utility to decode the file. If you receive a file which has been UUencoded, it will appear as an attachment to the email which you may extract out to a file and open with a word processor. If you're not using WinMail or MS Mail, or you need to UUencode a file without using those applications, you can get utilities from \\toolsvr\contrib!culture.cis\uucode. There is a README.TXT file that describes all the files and sub-directories. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- 1) How can I use Cyrillic fonts in a Dos application? Most popular word processors support Cyrillic fonts, inherently or through a language module. Diplomat Software makes the Russian Diplomat, a software package for typing and printing Cyrillic characters from most Dos applications, including Word, Word Perfect, Ventura Publisher and others. They can be reached at: Diplomat Software 3700 Campus Drive #202 Newport Beach, CA 92660 USA Tel: (714) 474-6968 Fax: (714) 250-8117 2) How can I use Cyrillic fonts in a Windows application? A set of TrueType Cyrillic fonts can be found in \\toolsvr \contrib!culture.cis\fonts\truetype. There is a README.TXT file that describes all the files and sub-directories. Note that if you are using Windows 3.0 or 3.0a, you must also be running Adobe Type Manager (ATM) to use these fonts. Cassady & Greene and Adobe Systems make Cyrillic fonts for Windows; either package should be available through most mail- order or local software stores. 3) How can I use Cyrillic fonts in a Macintosh application? Cassady & Greene and Adobe Systems make Cyrillic fonts; either package should be available through most mail-order or local software stores. Bersearch Information Services makes a sans-serif Cyrillic font called RussianH which matches the height, weight, and style of Helvetica. It includes several keyboard layouts, including IBM standard and phonetic. They can be reached at: Bersearch Information Services 26160 Edelweiss Circle Evergreen, CO 80439 USA Tel: (800) 851-0289, (303) 674-8875 Fax: (303) 674-2860 Email: Bersearch@MCIMail.com glps Products makes the Bilingual Solution, a software package for typing and printing Cyrillic from Macintosh applications. There are also extension packages for word counts and alphabetic list sorting (in Cyrillic). They can be reached at: glps Products P.O. Box 3454 Chapel Hill, NC 27515-3454 USA Tel: (800) 869-9567 4) Are there other sources for Cyrillic utilities? The Russian Works is a mail-order company specializing in Cyrillic products. They sell Cassady & Greene fonts, all of glps Products' packages, and many other products for Dos, Windows, and Macintosh. They can be reached at: The Russian Works P.O. Box 2455 Chapel Hill, NC 27515-2455 USA Tel: (800) 869-9567 5) How can I keep up on the latest Cyrillic utilities? glps Products publishes Computing In Russian, a bi-monthly newsletter of Cyrillic product information, Dos/Windows/Macintosh application tips, and other information of interest. It is sub- titled the "computing newsletter for Russian-language professionals". Subscriptions are $15.00 US for one year and are available from the address given above for glps Products. 6) How do I know where a Cyrillic character is on the keyboard? There are two common keyboard layouts for Cyrillic fonts: IBM and phonetic. Usually, Cyrillic fonts use the IBM standard, which is based on IBM typewriters sold in the CIS. Any Dos application which supports Cyrillic fonts should include a keyboard layout display. Under Windows 3.1 you can use the Character Map utility, and on the Macintosh you can use the Key Caps desk accessory. Unfortunately, there is no similar utility under Windows 3.0 and 3.0a. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From RUSTEX-L@UBVM.cc.buffalo.edu Fri Apr 10 16:48:51 1992 Received: from ubvm.cc.buffalo.edu for jkl by oscsunb.osc.edu (5.65c/pl1+KVa/920330.1102) id AA28004; Fri, 10 Apr 1992 16:48:35 -0400 Received: from UBVM.BITNET by UBVM.cc.buffalo.edu (IBM VM SMTP V2R2) with BSMTP id 3658; Fri, 10 Apr 92 16:49:08 EDT Received: by UBVM (Mailer R2.08 PTF008) id 2337; Fri, 10 Apr 92 16:44:06 EDT Received: from UBVM.BITNET by UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU (LISTSERV release 1.7b) with NJE id 9840 for RUSTEX-L@UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU; Fri, 10 Apr 1992 16:43:00 -0400 Received: from UBVM by UBVM.BITNET (Mailer R2.08 PTF008) with BSMTP id 2056; Fri, 10 Apr 92 16:41:23 EDT Received: from elroy.Jpl.Nasa.Gov by UBVM.cc.buffalo.edu (IBM VM SMTP V2R2) with TCP; Fri, 10 Apr 92 16:41:19 EDT Received: from avatar.com by elroy.Jpl.Nasa.Gov (4.1/SMI-4.1+DXR) id AA05396; Fri, 10 Apr 92 13:40:25 PDT Received: from getunx.info.com by avatar.com id aa10056; Fri, 10 Apr 92 11:54:29 PDT Received: by getunx.info.com id AA00888 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for rustex-l@ubvm.cc.buffalo.edu); Thu, 9 Apr 1992 22:16:14 -0800 Message-Id: <199204100616.AA00888@getunx.info.com> Newsgroups: bit.listserv.rustex-l Date: Thu, 9 Apr 1992 22:16:14 -0800 Sender: Russian TeX and Cyrillic text processing list From: "Glenn E. Thobe" Subject: Re: Cyrillic font conversions on a Mac??? [LONG] X-To: rustex-l@ubvm.cc.buffalo.edu To: Jan Labanowski Status: R Felix Kreisel asks: >Hello. I am looking for conversion programs to translate some Cyrillic fonts >into other Cyrillic fonts. In particular, I am using the Casady & Greene >"Glasnost" package of fonts which have a "Soviet"-style keyboard map. However, >I was told that the most popular ASCII conversion table in the CIS is KOI-8. Christopher Rimple answers: >Most Cyrillic fonts use the IBM standard keyboard mapping and ASCII >values below 128 for their characters. The keyboard map is a red herring. Only the internal encoding of the fonts involved in the conversion is relevant to answering the question. Apparently Mr. Rimple advocates using an internal character encoding determined by the desired Russian keyboard layout and the default American English-to-ASCII keyboard mapping. It doesn't take long to see the shortcomings of this approach. For one thing not all keyboards are alike, neither American English ones (which not everyone in the world uses anyway) nor Russian ones. For another, the code you get won't match anybody's standard so you won't be able to exchange texts in it or use many Cyrillic text processing tools. >However, KOI is mostly a waste of time, since you can send Cyrillic >ASCII via email and the receiver only needs to select the text and >change the font to Cyrillic for it to appear correctly; this technique >is computer-independent, provided both people have a Cyrillic font that >maps to the IBM standard (Soviet) keyboard. What Mr. Rimple is saying is that if everyone used HIS "standard" they wouldn't have any need of ANYONE ELSE's standards. The fact is that KOI-8 is the defacto standard for e-mail in Russia (I didn't say I liked it), and that when KOI-8 passes into the mostly 7-bit Western e-mail system the 8-th bit is (usually) stripped leaving the Russian text in KOI-7. For internal use, use whatever character set you like (I like ISO 8859-5), so long as you are willing to transliterate incoming and outgoing (by whatever medium) texts into appropriate standards. > 8) What's transliteration? > > Transliteration is the process of translating one language into > another, using the characters and phonems [sic] of the second language. Wow, and I thought it took major artificial intelligence to get a machine to translate from one language to another! :-) In general, codes are quite arbitrary. KOI-7 and KOI-8 (cousins) are based loosely on ASCII and the perceived sound values of the Roman letters in English, German, etc., which makes it possible (though not comfortable) to read Russian in KOI-7 on an ASCII display. Since neither Russian nor English uses a phonemic orthography, the reference to phonemes in incorrect. > 9) How can I send a message or file in Cyrillic through email? If you are mailing to the .su domain, the wisest thing is to convert your Cyrillic text file to KOI-7 and send it. Other schemes such as uuencoding should be considered only after prior negotiation and agreement with the recipient. Mail which you receive from .su will usually arrive in KOI-7 (though it probably began life in KOI-8). For mixed language text, short KOI may be used in which all Cyrillic is in lower case KOI-7 and all Roman is in upper case ASCII. Of course, with short KOI any case information will be lost. Uuencoding (or other reversible 8-7 bit encoding) may be agreed upon when it is necessary or desirable to preserve the full eight-bit information. In this case it is a good idea to agree on the character set encoding as well, which may be ISO 8859-5, KOI-8, AV, etc. If you are receiving, it is well to have a few transliteration tools handy so as to be prepared for any of the common 8-bit character sets. As Mr. Rimple points out, many word processor formats contain numerous 8-bit special codes and must be uuencoded (or similar) to be transmitted successfully. However, unless your recipient agrees to such a format (e.g. you're both Word Perfect enthusiasts), it is usually advisable to convert the file to a plain text representation and follow the above advice. > 1) How can I use Cyrillic fonts in a Dos application? For character-based text viewing and editing (as opposed to WYSIWYG "word processors" which support various font attributes), I recommend a switchable keyboard driver and screen font (code page). Then use your favorite 8-bit clean text editor. Readers of this group should be familiar with Dimitri Vulis' free keyboard driver and code page. Since I don't use word processors, I won't contest others' advice on those. > 2) How can I use Cyrillic fonts in a Windows application? Ditto. > 3) How can I use Cyrillic fonts in a Macintosh application? The same principles apply for the Mac (which I don't use). I was intrigued by a posting to comp.fonts which told how one can obtain all the tools needed to completely NATIONALIZE and LOCALIZE the Mac OS. Basically, you join APDA (Apple Developers' Assoc.), which is no big deal really. I hope someone will follow up on this and report back to the group. >Newsgroups: comp.fonts >Subject: Re: Czech Fonts??? >From: kanala@sc2a.unige.ch >Date: 20 Feb 92 19:35:15 +0200 >Organization: University of Geneva, Switzerland > >[quote omitted] > >Czech, Slovak, Hungarian, and even Russian systems (yes, entirely localized ! ) >can be found on the latest Develo Disk. You can get one if you register as >an Apple developer, or subscribe to "d e v e l o p" magazine (APDA) or buy >from APDA only the latest issue incl. the CD (I guess about $20). You can >also use Localizer included on this CD to add just the KCHR, INTL and itl. >resources to your US system. >Happy localizing, >Roman Kanala, COMIN, University of Geneva, Switzerland, kanala@sc2a.unige.ch > 6) How do I know where a Cyrillic character is on the keyboard? I personally recommend learning to touch type the standard Russian keyboard. This approach requires a little extra effort to learn. The reward for your labors is that you can think in Russian orgthography while you are composing (works wonders for your spelling). Learning the Russian keyboard is much facilitated by the use of "typing tutor" programs. (I have written a portable typing tutor. Write if interested. There is a typing tutor for DOS in the Rustex-L archive.) Consulting a chart while hunting and pecking is painfully slow and not at all conducive to learning. BTW, to partially answer the original question, programs to transliterate between 8-bit Cyrillic (e.g. ISO 8859-5, KOI-8, AV) and 1-1 7-bit codes (KOI-7) are generally easy to write as they require only a simple table lookup. However, there are some interesting twists when you try to mix ASCII and KOI-7. Programs for 1-many transliterations are easy in the Cyrillic->ASCII direction, but complex in the reverse direction. If the code is carefully selected to avoid ambiguity, and if the code is known and strictly adhered to, the reverse transliteration can be accomplished with good results, i.e. minimal post-editing by a human. If the Felix will write to me, I may be able to give more specific help on how to do the transliteration he asked about. Obviously, what I need to know is the internal encoding of his character set. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- -Glenn Thobe From owner-seelangs@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU Tue Feb 15 01:30:36 1994 Received: from phem3 for owner-seelangs@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU by infomeister.osc.edu (8.6.4/930601.1506) id BAA01891; Tue, 15 Feb 1994 01:30:35 -0500 Received: from PSUVM.PSU.EDU (MAILER@PSUVM) by phem3.acs.ohio-state.edu (PMDF V4.2-13 #3557) id <01H8WAO16NM896VONT@phem3.acs.ohio-state.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 1994 01:30:27 EST Received: from PSUVM.PSU.EDU (NJE origin LISTSERV@PSUVM) by PSUVM.PSU.EDU (LMail V1.1d/1.7f) with BSMTP id 8873; Tue, 15 Feb 1994 01:29:41 -0500 Date: Tue, 15 Feb 1994 01:27:55 -0500 From: "L. Jake Jacobson" Subject: Font materials available to Slavists Sender: "SEELangs: Slavic & E. European Languages & literatures list" To: Multiple recipients of list SEELANGS Reply-to: "SEELangs: Slavic & E. European Languages & literatures list" Message-id: <01H8WAO16NMA96VONT@phem3.acs.ohio-state.edu> Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Comments: To: List SEELANGS Status: R Greetings! The following items of interest for Macintosh-using Slavists are available via anonymous ftp from ftp.pitt.edu: 1) A pair of Cyrillic fonts in Type One format. -- One of them is called Constantin. Constantin contains all of the characters necessary for writing in all of the modern Slavic languages that use Cyrillic, as well a few of the most common symbols and diacritics used for transcribing Russian dialects and a selection of archaic characters and diacritics used in medieval Slavic manuscripts. Constantin comes in Plain, Italic and Bold versions. -- The other font is called (of course) Methodius. Methodius is a supplement to Constantin; it contains more goodies for transcribing medieval manuscripts, such as a full selection of superscript letters and a few ornament marks. Neither font corresponds to any of the "standards" for Cyrillic encoding, but then again, how many of the standard fonts have even two nasal vowels, much less the five variants found in Constantin and Methodius? These fonts are also freely distributable. An alpha version of Constantin "leaked out" two years ago -- anyone who actually kept it around should probably get the new version, which is cleaned up extensively. If someone would care to try this font in TrueType for Windows, send me private mail. These fonts can be found at ftp.pitt.edu in the directory dept/slavic/download/slavistfonts.sea.hqx 2) Two keyboard resources for the Macintosh I was rather frustrated using Apple's Cyrillic fonts due to the keyboard resource which accompanies them. Rather than learn the Russian keyboard layout, I hacked up a new keyboard resource which allows one to use a "transliterated" or "homophonic" or "student" layout while typing Russian with Apple's fonts. While I was at it, I also hacked a similar keyboard resource for fonts in the _al'ternativa_ encoding. The Read Me doc included (in MS Word format) explains the layout used. These keyboards can be found at ftp.pitt.edu in the directory dept/slavic/download/slavkchr.sea.hqx ----- It's my feeling that 98% of the people reading this would be better off using a standard Cyrillic font (although I am somewhat frustrated by the lack of accented vowels in Apple's fonts, which makes them unsuitable for producing materials for beginning Russian students). However, since there might be a few other people out there tired of drawing in archaic letters by hand when they cite manuscripts, I have made my fonts available for anyone who wants them. L. Jake Jacobson lcjst2+@pitt.edu Slavic Department University of Pittsburgh From owner-rustex-l@UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU Wed Feb 2 14:33:49 1994 Received: from UBVM.cc.buffalo.edu for owner-rustex-l@UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU by infomeister.osc.edu (8.6.4/930601.1506) id OAA07508; Wed, 2 Feb 1994 14:33:46 -0500 Received: from UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU by UBVM.cc.buffalo.edu (IBM VM SMTP V2R2) with BSMTP id 5009; Wed, 02 Feb 94 14:33:22 EST Received: from UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU (NJE origin LISTSERV@UBVM) by UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU (LMail V1.2a/1.8a) with BSMTP id 0414; Wed, 2 Feb 1994 14:33:21 -0500 Received: from UBVM.BITNET by UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU (LISTSERV release 1.8a) with NJE id 9409 for RUSTEX-L@UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU; Wed, 2 Feb 1994 14:32:45 -0500 Received: from UBVM (NJE origin SMTP@UBVM) by UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU (LMail V1.2a/1.8a) with BSMTP id 0144; Wed, 2 Feb 1994 14:31:44 -0500 Received: from gatekeeper.imagen.com by UBVM.cc.buffalo.edu (IBM VM SMTP V2R2) with TCP; Wed, 02 Feb 94 14:31:38 EST Received: from imagen.sclara.qms.com (imagen.imagen.com) by gatekeeper.imagen.com (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA05161; Wed, 2 Feb 94 11:31:44 PST Received: from monkey.sclara.qms.com by imagen.sclara.qms.com (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA27254; Wed, 2 Feb 94 11:31:43 PST Received: by monkey.sclara.qms.com (4.1/client-1.5) id AA02758; Wed, 2 Feb 94 11:31:42 PST Message-ID: <9402021931.AA02758@monkey.sclara.qms.com> Newsgroups: bit.listserv.rustex-l Date: Wed, 2 Feb 1994 11:31:42 PST Reply-To: Russian TeX and Cyrillic text processing list Sender: Russian TeX and Cyrillic text processing list From: "Dmitriy N. Vasilev" Subject: Re: WP to Cyrillic X-To: fridberg@PFC.MIT.EDU, RUSTEX-L@UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU To: Jan Labanowski In-Reply-To: Mail from 'Mikhail Fridberg ' dated: Wed, 2 Feb 1994 08:06:23 -0500 Status: R [WP 5.1 DOS and Alternative Encoding] >There is practically no difference between CP-866 and KOI-8AV and they are >mostly non-russian letters. There's no such thing commonly known as "KOI-8AV"; There are at least 5 more or less standard Russian encodings: 1. Alternative Variant, AV - several flavours, which differ in the 0xF0-0xFF range; one of the flavours is IBM Code Page 866. De-facto standard on PC. 2. KOI-8, AKA "old" KOI-8, GOST 19768-74, RFC1489 - de-facto UNIX/Internet standard; several flavours again, mostly around disagreement of "Yo" and "Hard Sign" letter positions; 3. OV, ISO 8859-5, ECMA 113, GOST 19768-87, seems to be the "most standard" and, hence, the least used in the real world. 4. "Windows Standard Cyrillic", Microsoft Code Page 1251, endorsed by Adobe, is now on the rise in the Windows world. 5. "Macintosh Standard Cyrillic" is also endorsed by Adobe. How to output a file in any of the above encodings from WP 5.1 DOS ================================================================== Pick up a unused code page number, e.g. 8669, 8999 or alike. Create a WP file in the WP system directory with the name WP.WCP (WordPerfect Code Page); this file is of the following format (I did it some time ago, so correct me if I'm wrong): , e.g. for AV it would be 128 10,0 129 10,2 130 10,4 ...etc... You can redirect only DOS codes 0-31 and 128-255. Anyone knows of those ready-made files for the encodings mentioned available on the Net? Dm. -- Dm. Vasilev | "Free cheese can be found only in a mouse trap" dmitriy@sclara.qms.com | : QMS may not agree -----------------------' = koi-8 = From owner-rustex-l@UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU Fri Jan 7 09:36:20 1994 Received: from UBVM.cc.buffalo.edu for owner-rustex-l@UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU by infomeister.osc.edu (8.6.4/930601.1506) id JAA21292; Fri, 7 Jan 1994 09:36:17 -0500 Received: from UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU by UBVM.cc.buffalo.edu (IBM VM SMTP V2R2) with BSMTP id 1048; Fri, 07 Jan 94 09:35:44 EST Received: from UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU (NJE origin LISTSERV@UBVM) by UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU (LMail V1.2a/1.8a) with BSMTP id 6601; Fri, 7 Jan 1994 09:35:44 -0500 Received: from UBVM.BITNET by UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU (LISTSERV release 1.8a) with NJE id 4295 for RUSTEX-L@UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU; Fri, 7 Jan 1994 09:35:10 -0500 Received: from UBVM (NJE origin SMTP@UBVM) by UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU (LMail V1.2a/1.8a) with BSMTP id 6284; Fri, 7 Jan 1994 09:33:07 -0500 Received: from uu5.psi.com by UBVM.cc.buffalo.edu (IBM VM SMTP V2R2) with TCP; Fri, 07 Jan 94 09:32:53 EST Received: from fourd.com by uu5.psi.com (5.65b/4.0.071791-PSI/PSINet) via UUCP; id AA17016 for ; Fri, 7 Jan 94 09:21:31 -0500 Message-ID: <9401071421.AA17016@uu5.psi.com> Newsgroups: bit.listserv.rustex-l Date: Fri, 7 Jan 1994 07:00:38 -0000 Reply-To: Daniel_Chirkov@fourd.com Sender: Russian TeX and Cyrillic text processing list From: "Daniel A. Chirkov" Organization: 4th Dimension BBS Subject: INFO: Russian on the Mac. X-To: RUSTEX-L@UBVM.cc.buffalo.edu To: Jan Labanowski Status: RO ***INFO: RUSSIAN ON THE MAC*** Version: 1.3 Last Updated: 1/6/94 Created: 1/4/94 Notes: Previous version posted on RUSTEX-L was without linefeeds. Sorry about that! -[ Contents ]------------------------ (0) Introduction (1) Apple Standard Cyrillic 1.1 Where to ftp 1.2 Installation in US System 7 1.3 Installation in US System 6 * 1.4 Cyrillic font sources * 1.5 Keyboards and keyboard lables 1.6 Technical Info (2) Other formats 2.1 KOI 2.2 Converting * (3) Apple Russia * 3.1 Apple Dealers * 3.2 APDA products in Russia (4) About this document ------------------------------------- * = new or updated (0): INTRODUCTION A long time ago people wanted to type Cyrillic on the mac. It was difficult to find fonts, companies charged a hundred dollars for a Russian "Times" font. Now the Mac has WorldScript and it's much easier to work with other languages. Unfortunatly, Apple has been slow and still has only released the Chinese and Japanese language kits. - But you can FTP International System software from ftp.apple.com. Including the Russian system. If you would like to install 7.0.1R, just FTP all of the files (see sec 1.1) and install. You will have a Russian Finder, dialog boxes, and other stuff that comes with Apple's system software. If you prefer to use the US System and just want the fonts, you should read section 1.2 or 1.4, depending on what version you are using. Unlike the older fonts, Apple Standard Cyrillic (WorldScript) does not map Cyrillic letters in place of English, and this allows you to type both English and Russian with the same font. It also allows you to have various keyboard layouts while using the same fonts. For example you can have both the Russian "typewriter" layout (included with the Russian System) and the transliterated American style keyboard (A on the QWERTY keyboard will produce an A in Russian) in the keyboard menu - still using the same fonts. Currently, most font companies are shipping fonts in this standard, and it seems soon there will be less confusion if everyone uses Apple's standard. (1): APPLE STANDARD CYRILLIC 1.1 Where to ftp ftp.apple.com cd dts/mac/sys.soft.intl/russian.7.0.1 total 8239 -rw-r-xr-x 1 mjohnson archivis 1431790 Jan 18 1993 disk-tools.hqx -rw-r-xr-x 1 mjohnson archivis 875459 Jan 18 1993 fonts-1.hqx -rw-r-xr-x 1 mjohnson archivis 890256 Jan 18 1993 fonts-2.hqx -rw-r-xr-x 1 mjohnson archivis 1397799 Jan 18 1993 install-1.hqx -rw-r-xr-x 1 mjohnson archivis 1175545 Jan 18 1993 install-2.hqx -rw-r-xr-x 1 mjohnson archivis 1023797 Jan 18 1993 printing.hqx -rw-r-xr-x 1 mjohnson archivis 612905 Jan 18 1993 rs-system-7-tune-up-1-1-1.hqx -rw-r-xr-x 1 mjohnson archivis 6673 Jan 18 1993 software-license.txt -rw-r-xr-x 1 mjohnson archivis 941630 Jan 18 1993 tidbits.hqx 1.2 Installation in US System 7 a. FTP the Install1 and Fonts1 disks from ftp.apple.com. (see above) b. Installing the Russian Script: In the Finder, open up the Install 1 disk (you need the "disk image" software, if you don't know how to get that let me know, and it's covered in the Mac FAQs I think). Look for the System file. Copy the Russian system file to your HD. Click on the copy on your HD, choose "Duplicate". Double click on the "Copy of System" file. It will open up and you will see fonts as well something titled "Roman" and "Russian" if you don't see "Russian" you will see a file with the same icon (worldscript) but it will be called some giberish, that is it, the giberish is "Russian" in Russian, but since you don't have the font's installed yet you can't read it. This is the Keylayout and Script file (Worldscript). Drag this file out of the "Copy of System" onto the desktop. Trash the "Copy of System" from your HD. Open up *YOUR* system folder on your HD. Drag the "Russian" Script file onto your System file icon. There! You have installed the Russian Script. Restart. c. Installing Fonts: Drag all the fonts from the Fonts 1 disk you FTP'd into your system folder, or use Suitcase II. These are the TrueType fonts. If you need Postscript fonts, they are on the Install 2 disk, so you should FTP that too if you want. For more font installation instructions refer to you guru, FAQ, or manual. d. Restart. Look for an icon that looks like a flag or a diamond on the top right hand corner of your screen. If you see something like that, your all set. That is the Keyboard menu you use to switch keyboards. Use baloon help on it to learn how it works. If you don't see them menu, check if you have installed everything correctly, check if there is a "Russian" Script file in your System file. Check to see if you have the fonts installed. IF IT STILL DOES NOT SHOW UP, you *may* need to do some hacking with ResEdit. If you have System 6, see the next section. *If you still don't have the Keyboards menu showing.* Open the System file with ResEdit. Open itlc resource with id 0 The sixth item in the list of controls should be a radio button with the label "Always show keybd. icon." If the radio button is set to 0 the menu is off. If 1, it is on. It is necessary to restart the mac after changing the state of the button. 1.3 Installation in System 6 If you have system 6: For System 6, you need to use ResEdit. a. Get by FTP the Install 1and Fonts 1 disks from the right directory at ftp.apple.com. b. Installing the Russian Script: In the Finder, open up the Install 1 disk (you need the "disk image" software, if you don't know how to get that let me know, and it's covered in the Mac FAQs I think). Look for the System file. Copy the Russian system file to your HD. Open up ResEdit. Copy the following resources from the Russian System file into the System file on your HD. Type ID # itl0 19456 > itl1 19456 > itl2 19456 > copy these to your System file itl4 19456 > itlb 7 > Also, create a SICN resource in your system file with the ID of 19456 and draw a Russian flag or another symbol (this will show up in the menu). Open itlc resource with id 0. (In your System file) The sixth item in the list of controls should be a radio button with the label "Always show keybd. icon. If the radio button is set to 0 the keyboard menu is off. If 1, it is on. Restart. c. Installing Fonts: Copy all the fonts from the Fonts 1 disk you FTP'd into your System file with Font/DA Mover, or use Suitcase II. These are the TrueType fonts, you will need the TrueType INIT for System 6, available at the usual places. If you need Postscript fonts, they are on the Install 2 disk, so you should FTP that too if you want. For more font installation instructions refer to you guru, FAQ, or manual. d. After you do this, you should see a icon of the current script (a diamond for English/Roman) in the upper right hand corner of the menu bar. Click here to change from Russian to English (you must be using a proper font). 1.4 Cyrillic font sources You may get bored of the APCCourier, Bastion, and Latinskij fonts. There are several other fonts available as freeware, but most are old and where not made for WorldScript. Adobe has Times Ten-Cyrillic and Minion-Cyrillic fonts that are compatible. You can also contact: (incomplete) listing of Cyrillic font vendors... Adobe Systems Inc. Cyrillic and other fonts. Tel. (800) 445 8787 AZZET Sells Postscript fonts as well as Russian Pagemaker. 103064 Moscow-64 a/ya 374 Tel: (095) 227 8626, 297 4329 Fax: 227 8626 Casady & Green, Inc. Cyrillic and other fonts. Tel. (800) 359 4920 Fax. 408 624 7868 ParaGraph Sells Postscript fonts. 103051 Moscow Petrovskii blvr. 23 Tel:(095) 200 2566, (095) 925 4907 Fax. (095) 928 2768 1.5 Russian Keyboards and Keyboard Lables Currently Apple(US) does not sell Russian keyboards (hardware) but but it will if it ever releases a Russian Language Kit, like the Chinese and Japanese kits released last year. Hooleon Corporation makes some great Cyrillic key labels. They are clear plastic with the Cyrillic letters in red. You just stick them on your existing keyboard and the English letters still show through. We have used about 20 sets of them here and they have proven to be very durable. Some have been in use for more than three years and have not fallen off or worn out. We recently sold some old computers and needed to remove some of the key labels that had been in place for several years. They came off without too much trouble and did not leave a residue on the keyboard. You can reach Hooleon at (800) 937-1337 or (602) 634-7515. The last ones we purchased were $16.95 but I think there was a volume discount. >Info on keyboard lables contributed by Doug Smith. 1.6 Technical Info If you are a want more technical info about WorldScript as well as the tables to the fonts and character layout sheets, contact APDA or your computer bookstore to get a copy of Guide to Macintosh Software Localization 330 pages published by Addison-Wesley 1992 by Apple Computer. (2): OTHER FORMATS 2.1 KOI KOI-7 and KOI-8 are formats that are used in Russian email and Relcom newsgroups. There are fonts available so you can read the newsgroups. However, for standards sake, you should use the MacTranslit program to convert to Apple's Standard Cyrillic. 2.2 Converting >Info from a message written by the author of the MacTranslit program There is a utility for Mac that can handle different mappings and convert among them. It works on text files only though. It called MacTranslit and available on SUmex-Aim archives in directory info-mac/text as mactranslit_1_2.hqx. It is $25 shareware. The Version in archives can convert from/to Apple Standard Cyrillic, KOI-8AV and old Glasnost unilingual font from Cassady & Greene. Full version include 15 conversions, including KOI-7, KOI-8OV (the one used on Relcom), CP866, Cyrillic for Windows, free fonts like Petersburg, and many others. You'd need System 7 for it to run though, but it's very fast, like 1Mb in 15 sec on Mac Plus. (3): APPLE RUSSIA 3.1 Apple Dealers Apple has begun to sell Macintoshes in Russia. Possibly you could buy keyboards from Russian dealers. >Info taken from advertizement in a daily newspaper. Macintosh LC II is sold with "WorldWrite(tm)" software with a 3 million word Russian spell checker. Phone numbers of authorized Apple Computer dealers: "Intermikro" Tel. 267 3210, 261-3049 AD MacCentre Tel. 955 2720, 955 2779 Big Mac Tel. 235 1667, 235 5120 3.2 APDA Products in Russia APDA products can be purchased through: for Russia, Belarus, Armenia, Georgia, Latvia, Lithuania Arkady Moreynis RUI 2 Vysheslavtsev per.,17 103055 Moscow Russia AppleLink: rui.devsales Tel. 095 284-2850 FAX: 095 284 5746 (last time I tried to send email to rui.devsales@applelink.apple.com it did not work, I sent a message to APDA asking what was going on. I got this message: Thank you for your inquiry. Please try Applelink address is "RUI.PM". Please let them know you have had trouble using "RUI.DEVSALES". They can help you with your questions.) for Ukraine CDV Ltd., Apple Computer IMC, Artyoma Str., %2-D 254053 Kiev -53 Ukraine Applelink: UA.PM Tel. (7044) 211 94 02 FAX: (7044) 211 37 21 (4): ABOUT THIS DOCUMENT I'm not responsible for your computer or font problems resulting from the use or misuse of the information presented in this file. Although every effort has been made to provide you with correct information, the author(s) are not responsible for the accuracy of this document. My Email address is Daniel_Chirkov@fourd.com. Please send any corrections, questions, suggestions, or Russian fonts. I plan to update this file as required. Please do not email me to obtain updates of this file. ***END OF FILE*********************************************************************** System: fourd.com Phone: 617-494-0565 Cute quote: Being a computer means never having to say you're sorry ******************************************************************** From owner-rustex-l@UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU Tue Jan 4 05:04:33 1994 Received: from UBVM.cc.buffalo.edu for owner-rustex-l@UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU by infomeister.osc.edu (8.6.4/930601.1506) id FAA12813; Tue, 4 Jan 1994 05:04:30 -0500 Received: from UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU by UBVM.cc.buffalo.edu (IBM VM SMTP V2R2) with BSMTP id 8698; Tue, 04 Jan 94 05:03:53 EST Received: from UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU (NJE origin LISTSERV@UBVM) by UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU (LMail V1.2a/1.8a) with BSMTP id 8029; Tue, 4 Jan 1994 05:03:53 -0500 Received: from UBVM.BITNET by UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU (LISTSERV release 1.8a) with NJE id 1277 for RUSTEX-L@UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU; Tue, 4 Jan 1994 05:03:27 -0500 Received: from UBVM (NJE origin SMTP@UBVM) by UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU (LMail V1.2a/1.8a) with BSMTP id 7917; Tue, 4 Jan 1994 05:03:23 -0500 Received: from uu5.psi.com by UBVM.cc.buffalo.edu (IBM VM SMTP V2R2) with TCP; Tue, 04 Jan 94 05:03:08 EST Received: from fourd.com by uu5.psi.com (5.65b/4.0.071791-PSI/PSINet) via UUCP; id AA12267 for ; Tue, 4 Jan 94 05:00:43 -0500 Message-ID: <9401041000.AA12267@uu5.psi.com> Newsgroups: bit.listserv.rustex-l Date: Tue, 4 Jan 1994 04:33:06 -0000 Reply-To: Daniel_Chirkov@fourd.com Sender: Russian TeX and Cyrillic text processing list From: "Daniel A. Chirkov" Organization: 4th Dimension BBS Subject: INFO: Apple Cyrillic Fonts on the Mac/KOI8,7 X-To: George.Diab@fourd.com, Fred.Ryan@fourd.com, Richard.and.Joanna.Robin@fourd.com, pfolk@superdec.uni.uiuc.edu, pesetsk@MIT.EDU, ajt@wam.umd.edu, wesc@glas.apc.org, RUSTEX-L@UBVM.cc.buffalo.edu To: Jan Labanowski Status: RO ***INFO: Installing Cyrillic on the Mac*** Version: 1.0 Last Updated: 1/4/94 Created: 1/4/94 This text file contains information on installing Apple's Cyrillic fonts on the Mac, and information about KOI7 and KOI8 formats used in Relcom newsgroups and Russian email. - Contents - (1) Apple Cyrillic Fonts 1.1 Where to look 1.2 Installation (System 7) 1.3 Installation (System 6) 1.4 Hacking 1.5 Compatible fonts 1.6 Russian Keyboard 1.7 Technical Info (2) KOI7/8 & Converting Formats (3) About this document ***INFO: Installing Cyrillic on the Mac*** Version: 1.0 Last Updated: 1/4/94 Created: 1/4/94 - Contents - (1) Apple Cyrillic Fonts 1.1 Where to look 1.2 Installation (System 7) 1.3 Installation (System 6) 1.4 Hacking 1.5 Compatible fonts 1.6 Russian Keyboard 1.7 Technical Info (2) KOI7/8 & Converting Formats (3) About this document (1): APPLE CYRILLIC FONTS 1.1 Where to look ftp.apple.com cd dts/mac/sys.soft.intl/russian.7.0.1 total 8239 -rw-r-xr-x 1 mjohnson archivis 1431790 Jan 18 1993 disk-tools.hqx -rw-r-xr-x 1 mjohnson archivis 875459 Jan 18 1993 fonts-1.hqx -rw-r-xr-x 1 mjohnson archivis 890256 Jan 18 1993 fonts-2.hqx -rw-r-xr-x 1 mjohnson archivis 1397799 Jan 18 1993 install-1.hqx -rw-r-xr-x 1 mjohnson archivis 1175545 Jan 18 1993 install-2.hqx -rw-r-xr-x 1 mjohnson archivis 1023797 Jan 18 1993 printing.hqx -rw-r-xr-x 1 mjohnson archivis 612905 Jan 18 1993 rs-system-7-tune-up-1-1-1.hqx -rw-r-xr-x 1 mjohnson archivis ! 6673 Jan 18 1993 software-licens e.txt -rw-r-xr-x 1 mjohnson archivis 941630 Jan 18 1993 tidbits.hqx 1.2 Installation (System 7) a. Get by FTP the Install 1and Fonts 1 disks from the right directory at ftp.apple.com. b. Installing the Russian Script: In the Finder, open up the Install 1 disk (you need the "disk image" software, if you don't know how to get that let me know, and it's covered in the Mac FAQs I think). Look for the System file. Copy the Russian system file to your HD. Click on the copy on your HD, choose "Duplicate". Double click on the "Copy of System" file. It will open up and you will see fonts as well something titled "Roman" and "Russian" if you don't see "Russian" you will see a file with the same icon (worldscript) but it will be called some giberish, that is it, the giberish is "Russian" in Russian, but since you don't have the font's installed yet you can't read it. This is the Keylayout and Script file (Worldscript). Drag this file out of the "Copy of System" onto the deskt! op. Trash the "Copy of System" fro m your HD. Open up *YOUR* system folder on your HD. Drag the "Russian" Script file onto your System file icon. There! You have installed the Russian Script. Restart. c. Installing Fonts: Drag all the fonts from the Fonts 1 disk you FTP'd into your system folder, or use Suitcase II. These are the TrueType fonts. If you need Postscript fonts, they are on the Install 2 disk, so you should FTP that too if you want. For more font installation instructions refer to you guru, FAQ, or manual. 4. Restart. Look for an icon that looks like a flag or a diamond on the top right hand corner of your screen. If you see something like that, your all set. That is the Keyboard menu you use to switch keyboards. Use baloon help on it to learn how it works. If you don't see them menu, check if you have installed everything correctly, check if there is a "Russian" Script file in your System file. Check to see if you have the fonts installed. IF IT STILL DOES NOT SHOW UP, you *may* need to do som! e hacking with ResEdit, see the Ha cking section. If you have System 6, see the next sections. *If you still don't have the Keyboards menu showing. a. Open the System file with ResEdit. b. Open itlc resource with id 0 c. The sixth item in the list of controls should be a radio button with the label "Always show keybd. icon. d. If the radio button is set to 0 the menu is off. If 1, it is on. e. It may be necessary to restart the mac after changing the state of the button. 1.3 Installation (System 6) If you have system 6: For System 6, you need to use ResEdit. a. Get by FTP the Install 1and Fonts 1 disks from the right directory at ftp.apple.com. b. Installing the Russian Script: In the Finder, open up the Install 1 disk (you need the "disk image" software, if you don't know how to get that let me know, and it's covered in the Mac FAQs I think). Look for the System file. Copy the Russian system file to your HD. Open up ResEdit. Copy the following resources from the Russian System file into the System f! ile on your HD. RESOURCE ID # itl0 19456 itl1 19456 itl2 19456 itl4 19456 itlb 7 Also, create a SICN resource in your system file with the ID of 19456 and draw a Russian flag or another symbol (this will show up in the menu). Open itlc resource with id 0. (In your System file) The sixth item in the list of controls should be a radio button with the label "Always show keybd. icon. If the radio button is set to 0 the keyboard menu is off. If 1, it is on. Restart. c. Installing Fonts: Copy all the fonts from the Fonts 1 disk you FTP'd into your System file with Font/DA Mover, or use Suitcase II. These are the TrueType fonts, you will need the TrueType INIT for System 6, available at the usual places. If you need Postscript fonts, they are on the Install 2 disk, so you should FTP that too if you want. For more font installation instructions refer to you guru, FAQ, or manual. d. After you do this, you should see a icon of the current scr! ipt (a diamond for English/Roman) in the upper right hand corner of the menu bar. Click here to change from Russian to English (you must be using a proper font). 1.4 Compatible Fonts You may get bored of the APCCourier, Bastion, and Latinskij fonts. There are several other fonts available as freeware, but most are old and where not made for WorldScript. Adobe has Times Ten-Cyrillic and Minion-Cyrillic fonts that are compatible. You can also contact: ParaGraph Sells fonts for PC and Mac. 103051 Moscow Petrovskii blvr. 23 Tel: (095) 200 2566, (095) 925 4907 Fax: (095) 928 2768 AZZET Azzet sells Postscript fonts as well as Russian Pagemaker. 103064 Moscow-64 a/ya 374 Tel: (095) 227 8626, 297 4329 Fax: 227 8626 I can't tell you more, I have never contacted the above companies, just seen their ads. 1.5 Russian Keyboards Currently Apple does not sell Russian keyboards (hardware) because but it will if it ever releases a Russian Language Kit, like the Chinese and Japanese kits releases last year. I'm i! n the process of trying to find ou t if the Apple dealer in Moscow can sell me a Russian keyboard. Right now, you can buy a good expensive thin marker and write the Russian letters on your keyboard. 1.6 Technical Info If you are a want more technical info about WorldScript as well as the tables to the fonts and character layout sheets, contact APDA or your computer bookstore to get a copy of Guide to Macintosh Software Localization 330 pages published by Addison-Wesley 1992 by Apple Computer. (2): KOI7/8 & CONVERTING FORMATS KOI7 and KOI8 are formats that are used in Russian email and Relcom newsgroups. (The following info stolen from a message written by the author of the MacTranslit program:) There is a utility for Mac that can handle different mappings and convert among them. It works on text files only though. It called MacTranslit and available on SUmex-Aim archives in directory info-mac/text as mactranslit_1_2.hqx. It is $25 shareware. Version in archives can convert from/to Apple Standard Cyr! illic, KOI-8AV and old Glasnost un ilingual font from Cassady & Greene. Full version include 15 conversions, including KOI-7, KOI-8OV (the one used on Relcom), CP866, Cyrillic for Windows, free fonts like Petersburg, and many others. You'd need System 7 for it to run though, but it's very fast, like 1Mb in 15 sec on Mac +. (3): ABOUT THIS DOCUMENT I'm not responsible for your computer or font problems resulting from the use or misuse of the information presented in this file. My Email address is Daniel_Chirkov@fourd.com. Please send me any corrections, complaints, suggestions, or Russian fonts. I plan to update this file as required. ***END OF FILE*********************************************************************** System: fourd.com Phone: 617-494-0565 Cute quote: Being a computer means never having to say you're sorry ******************************************************************** From owner-rustex-l@UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU Sun Dec 26 17:13:05 1993 Received: from UBVM.cc.buffalo.edu for owner-rustex-l@UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU by infomeister.osc.edu (8.6.4/930601.1506) id RAA13937; Sun, 26 Dec 1993 17:13:03 -0500 Received: from UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU by UBVM.cc.buffalo.edu (IBM VM SMTP V2R2) with BSMTP id 4214; Sun, 26 Dec 93 17:13:13 EST Received: from UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU (NJE origin LISTSERV@UBVM) by UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU (LMail V1.2a/1.8a) with BSMTP id 7403; Sun, 26 Dec 1993 17:13:13 -0500 Received: from UBVM.BITNET by UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU (LISTSERV release 1.8a) with NJE id 4721 for RUSTEX-L@UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU; Sun, 26 Dec 1993 17:12:53 -0500 Received: from UBVM (NJE origin SMTP@UBVM) by UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU (LMail V1.2a/1.8a) with BSMTP id 7299; Sun, 26 Dec 1993 17:12:38 -0500 Received: from uu5.psi.com by UBVM.cc.buffalo.edu (IBM VM SMTP V2R2) with TCP; Sun, 26 Dec 93 17:12:33 EST Received: from fourd.com by uu5.psi.com (5.65b/4.0.071791-PSI/PSINet) via UUCP; id AA26078 for ; Sun, 26 Dec 93 17:06:39 -0500 Message-ID: <9312262206.AA26078@uu5.psi.com> Newsgroups: bit.listserv.rustex-l Date: Sun, 26 Dec 1993 16:59:42 -0000 Reply-To: Daniel_Chirkov@fourd.com Sender: Russian TeX and Cyrillic text processing list From: "Daniel A. Chirkov" Organization: 4th Dimension BBS Subject: Russian Email (Re(2): Cyrillic fonts for relcom) X-To: Peter.Folk@fourd.com, pesetsk@MIT.EDU, RUSTEX-L@UBVM.cc.buffalo.edu To: Jan Labanowski Status: RO << I do not know abouth the KOI-7 mapping, but I wrote a program that converts fonts in text files (my Petersburg looks good on the screen, but my Cyrillic looks much better printing) so that my friends in St. Petersburg and I could correspond electronically in russian, but it requires that you know both alphabets, you lose all the formating, and you have to put slashes around the text to be converted. If you have a better/easier way of doing this, I would be very appreciative of any help. I can send you the program (Source is in C, or I can compile it), and I would be interested in your solutions. >> Because Apple has made a standard for Cyrillic on the mac, I think it would be best to use it. Apple's Cyrillic fonts are available from ftp.apple.com, as is the Russian system software. If you want to use it, you just need to extract the keyboard resources and fonts from it and place it into your System 7.x. (It's also possible to use them with 6.0 with Keyboard switcher or something like that cdev). The Fonts disks include Postscript as well as TrueType and Bitmapp Cyrillic fonts. Also Adobe uses the same layout scheme as Apple in it's Minion fonts (btw New York Times Russian uses Minion Cyrillic from Adobe). Here's where to look: FTP ftp.apple.com cd dts/mac/sys.soft.intl/russian.7.0.1 total 8239 -rw-r-xr-x 1 mjohnson archivis 1431790 Jan 18 1993 disk-tools.hqx -rw-r-xr-x 1 mjohnson archivis 875459 Jan 18 1993 fonts-1.hqx -rw-r-xr-x 1 mjohnson archivis 890256 Jan 18 1993 fonts-2.hqx -rw-r-xr-x 1 mjohnson archivis 1397799 Jan 18 1993 install-1.hqx -rw-r-xr-x 1 mjohnson archivis 1175545 Jan 18 1993 install-2.hqx -rw-r-xr-x 1 mjohnson archivis 1023797 Jan 18 1993 printing.hqx -rw-r-xr-x 1 mjohnson archivis 612905 Jan 18 1993 rs-system-7-tune-up-1-1-1.hqx -rw-r-xr-x 1 mjohnson archivis 6673 Jan 18 1993 software-license.txt -rw-r-xr-x 1 mjohnson archivis 941630 Jan 18 1993 tidbits.hqx I don't know about other Cyrillic fonts on the Mac... there are just *TOO MANY* of them made and all with different layouts. Happening to be a low-end programmer that I am, I quickly wrote a basic program convert from KOI7 to Apple's Cyrillic (text files), but it's horribly slow because of basic. To view KOI7 I also made KOI7 fonts so I could read email before converting them to Mac format. If anyone wants a copy, send me mail. -Dan ******************************************************************** System: fourd.com Phone: 617-494-0565 Cute quote: Being a computer means never having to say you're sorry ******************************************************************** From owner-seelangs@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU Wed Nov 10 22:37:05 1993 Received: from phem3 for owner-seelangs@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU by infomeister.osc.edu (8.6.1/930601.1506) id WAA02253; Wed, 10 Nov 1993 22:37:04 -0500 Received: from PSUVM.PSU.EDU (MAILER@PSUVM) by phem3.acs.ohio-state.edu (PMDF V4.2-13 #3557) id <01H560MPR1F48XCDDK@phem3.acs.ohio-state.edu>; Wed, 10 Nov 1993 22:36:55 EST Received: from PSUVM.PSU.EDU (NJE origin LISTSERV@PSUVM) by PSUVM.PSU.EDU (LMail V1.1d/1.7f) with BSMTP id 1065; Wed, 10 Nov 1993 22:36:54 -0500 Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1993 21:49:38 -0500 From: Lester C Jacobson Subject: Details: Apple's Fonts Sender: "SEELangs: Slavic & E. European Languages & literatures list" To: Multiple recipients of list SEELANGS Reply-to: "SEELangs: Slavic & E. European Languages & literatures list" Message-id: <01H560MPR1F68XCDDK@phem3.acs.ohio-state.edu> Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Comments: To: SEELANGS@cunyvm.cuny.edu Status: RO Greetings! Since my posting to this group last month about Apples's official East European fonts, I've been getting a steady trickle of personal queries about how to get them, so I thought that it might be worthwhile to post more details here. While Apple does not provide any official support for most "localized" system software outside the country of its use, it does make such systems available on its ftp site. Connect to ftp.apple.com -- log on as anonymous and give your username@address as the password. To get to the EE software, go through the directories dts/mac/sys.soft.intl and from there you can get into one of the directories that you need: russian.7.0.1 OR czech.7.0.1 OR polish.7.0.1. Inside of each directory, you will be able to download the files for the system software -- each of them will have a .hqx suffix. For example, in the russian.7.0.1 directory, you can get the files disk-tools.hqx, fonts-1.hqx, fonts-2.hqx, and so on. While still at ftp.apple.com, you will need to get a utility to use the files you have downloaded. Go to to the directory dts/util and download the files diskcopy-4-2.hqx and diskcopy-4-2-readme.txt. After you de-binhex your system files, you must decompress them (they are all self-expanding archives, so no problem there), after which they will turn into files with the suffix .image. These files are for use with the DiskCopy utility; start DiskCopy, load one of the .image files into it, and then insert a disk -- DiskCopy will make the disk you need (just like the system disks that came with your Mac, only with Russian/Czech/Polish software). The ReadMe has more info on using DiskCopy. If you want to use the TT Cyrillic fonts, open up the system FILE (!) on the Russian Disk Tools disk and drop the script and keyboard into your own System 7.x file. After you restart your machine, you will notice that a keyboard menu appears in your Finder menu -- you can switch keyboards via this menu or by pressing Command-Spacebar. You can now drop the TT Cyrillic fonts into your system and access the Cyrillic characters in them by using the Russian keyboard. If I remember correctly, the Cyrillic fonts are on the fonts-2.hqx disk image, but don't quote me on that. Your Cyrillic fonts will have bizarre names with a non-Russian system active -- don't worry about that. Note that the Polish and Czech systems use the same fonts, such as Times CE or Helvetica CE, so don't bother getting the font disks from both systems. WARNING: Do NOT, repeat do NOT, try dropping Polish or Czech scripts and keyboards into your system folder. Two Latin-based scripts seem to be currently incompatible with one another (which I found out the hard way). The upshot of this is if you want to use Times CE, for example, you will probably have to memorize some rather inconvenient key positions (e.g., you press Shift-Option-r to get scaron, but Shift-Option-9 to get Scaron), but you will get used to this fairly quickly. Note that you could also use the Cyrillic TT fonts without installing the keyboard and script, but it would require a lot of mental juggling to memorize all the the key positions. All of this is faily easy using System 7.x. If you run System 6.0.7 or 6.0.8, you can use TrueType fonts by dropping the TrueType INIT into your system (it's in one of the packages in dts/mac/sys.soft/imaging, but I forget which one), restarting, and then using Font/DA Mover version 4.1 (In the same directory as the TT INIT, get the file font-da-mover-4-1.hqx.) to install the fonts into your system. It is possible to install alternate keyboards into System 6.0.7 using ResEdit, but it's best to find someone who knows what s/he is doing to help you out on this. Finally, if you're really the curious type, you could use all of these system disks to do a complete re-install and run your Mac using one of the Slavic systems, but I'd recommend against it, as some of your applications might not like the change. If you've always wondered how to say "Erase disk" in Czech, it would be better to just start up from the Czech Disk Tools disk and play around for a while :-). DISCLAIMER: All of this has worked for me and a couple of other people I know, but I, like Apple, cannot be held responsible for any problems you may run into. BACK UP YOUR SYSTEM FILE before you start this process. I hope this helps, L. Jake Jacobson lcjst2+@pitt.edu Slavic Department University of Pittsburgh From owner-rustex-l@UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU Wed Sep 15 16:51:40 1993 Received: from ubvm.cc.buffalo.edu for owner-rustex-l@UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU by oscsunb.osc.edu (5.65c+KVa/930601.1506) id AA10225; Wed, 15 Sep 1993 16:51:34 -0400 Received: from UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU by UBVM.cc.buffalo.edu (IBM VM SMTP V2R2) with BSMTP id 4202; Wed, 15 Sep 93 16:51:47 EDT Received: from UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU (NJE origin LISTSERV@UBVM) by UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU (LMail V1.1d/1.7f) with BSMTP id 1887; Wed, 15 Sep 1993 16:51:46 -0400 Received: from UBVM.BITNET by UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU (LISTSERV release 1.7f) with NJE id 1332 for RUSTEX-L@UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU; Wed, 15 Sep 1993 16:51:15 -0400 Return-Path: <@UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU:valery@CS.UMB.EDU> Received: from UBVM (NJE origin SMTP@UBVM) by UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU (LMail V1.1d/1.7f) with BSMTP id 1629; Wed, 15 Sep 1993 16:49:46 -0400 Received: from eris.cs.umb.edu by UBVM.cc.buffalo.edu (IBM VM SMTP V2R2) with TCP; Wed, 15 Sep 93 16:49:43 EDT Received: by eris.cs.umb.edu id AA25806 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for rustex-l@ubvm.cc.buffalo.edu); Wed, 15 Sep 1993 16:49:10 -0400 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL17] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1216 Message-Id: <199309152049.AA25806@eris.cs.umb.edu> Newsgroups: bit.listserv.rustex-l Date: Wed, 15 Sep 1993 16:49:09 -0400 Sender: Russian TeX and Cyrillic text processing list From: Valery C Subject: Cyrillic TT-font X-To: rustex-l@ubvm.cc.buffalo.edu To: Jan Labanowski Status: RO Hi ..., I am using Microsoft Word for Windows with Crillic fonts that I purchased about a year ago from a company in Boston called Taurus Consulting. They have TrueType and PostScript Cyrillic fonts for Windows and Macintosh and the quality is great. The basic set of is about $80 which includes up to 8 fonts as far as I remember. I got a package of 26 fonts (all they had at that time) for $199. Since then I heard they got more fonts but I haven't seen those. I am using phonetic keyboard layout but they also support Russian standard and you could get a bilingual keyboard (or stickons) for free if order the whole library. I was also looking for a Russian spellchecker for Windows but it was not available at that time, though they said they were working on it. I was not very happy with the service - the response was slow and they also don't take credit cards. I lost the flyer that they sent to me so I have only their phone number - (617) 639-2397. From owner-rustex-l@UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU Fri Sep 10 12:57:08 1993 Received: from ubvm.cc.buffalo.edu for owner-rustex-l@UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU by oscsunb.osc.edu (5.65c+KVa/930601.1506) id AA22071; Fri, 10 Sep 1993 12:56:58 -0400 Received: from UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU by UBVM.cc.buffalo.edu (IBM VM SMTP V2R2) with BSMTP id 2408; Fri, 10 Sep 93 12:57:09 EDT Received: from UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU (NJE origin LISTSERV@UBVM) by UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU (LMail V1.1d/1.7f) with BSMTP id 3258; Fri, 10 Sep 1993 12:57:09 -0400 Received: from UBVM.BITNET by UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU (LISTSERV release 1.7f) with NJE id 4492 for RUSTEX-L@UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU; Fri, 10 Sep 1993 12:56:41 -0400 Return-Path: <@UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU:71064.2533@COMPUSERVE.COM> Received: from UBVM (NJE origin SMTP@UBVM) by UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU (LMail V1.1d/1.7f) with BSMTP id 2968; Fri, 10 Sep 1993 12:55:29 -0400 Received: from ihe.compuserve.com by UBVM.cc.buffalo.edu (IBM VM SMTP V2R2) with TCP; Fri, 10 Sep 93 12:55:24 EDT Received: by ihe.compuserve.com (5.67/5.930129sam) id AA04702; Fri, 10 Sep 93 12:54:51 -0400 Message-Id: <930910164354_71064.2533_CHJ25-5@CompuServe.COM> Newsgroups: bit.listserv.rustex-l Date: Fri, 10 Sep 1993 12:43:54 EDT Sender: Russian TeX and Cyrillic text processing list From: Eric S Johnson <71064.2533@compuserve.com> Subject: IBM WP --> Mac X-To: KREISEL@YSKRA.PFC.MIT.EDU, RUSTEX-L@UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU To: Jan Labanowski Status: RO Felix, > Hello, I have a floppy sent by a friend from Moscow with a large file > written using the WordPerfect Russian Module Code Page 866. I am using a > Mac with the AppleStd fonts from Casady & Greene. How can I convert that > text into my own format? Thanks for any help, Felix Not easily. 1) Find a friend with WP5.1/Russian to write that out to Russian ASCII (I'll do it if you send a diskette)--the resulting file will be in Briabin's AV encoding (KOI-8)--WP must be started with "WP /CP=899" for this to happen; 2) use Exceller Cyrillic Support's "Cyrillic Central" to convert the encoding of the Russian to CP 1251 (ditto, or write yr own IBM conversion); 3) install the Windows version of the Mac fonts onto your Mac (they came with your C&G fonts--at least in an order I saw last week--i.e. your C&G fonts came with two sets of Mac PS fonts, 1 with the AplStd character set and 1 with the Windows CP 1251 encoding); 4) use a Mac with a SuperDrive to read the IBM file produced by (2) above; 5) read the resulting file into a Mac word processor, block the entire file, and set the font to the C&G Russian font using the Windows character set. An alternative, so you can read the Russian but not edit it: 1) Find a friend with WP5.1/Russian to write that out to ASCII (I'll do it if you send a diskette); 2) use Exceller's "Central" to convert that to KOI-7, which essentially takes the Cyrillic characters and converts it to Roman characters, 1-to-1, so you get something looking like oB]ESTWO S OGRANI^ENNOJ OTWETSTWENNOSTX@ ukrkom-hERSON (hERSON) --but you'll be able to read it (ditto); 3) e-mail or SuperDrive the English-language file to your Mac (ditto). Best, Eric From INFO-RUSS-request@smarty.ece.jhu.edu Tue Feb 2 23:16:29 1993 Received: from smarty.ece.jhu.edu for INFO-RUSS-request@smarty.ece.jhu.edu by oscsunb.osc.edu (5.65c+KVa/921206.2314) id AA21138; Tue, 2 Feb 1993 23:16:21 -0500 Received: by smarty.ece.jhu.edu (5.61/1.18jrs) id AA16813; Tue, 2 Feb 93 20:04:44 -0500 Errors-To: INFO-RUSS-request@smarty.ece.jhu.edu Sender: INFO-RUSS-request@smarty.ece.jhu.edu Precedence: bulk Received: from mail-relay-1.mv.us.adobe.com by smarty.ece.jhu.edu (5.61/1.18jrs) id AA16808; Tue, 2 Feb 93 20:04:41 -0500 Received: by mail-relay-1.mv.us.adobe.com; id AA11688; Tue, 2 Feb 93 17:04:38 -0800 Received: by ideal.mv.us.adobe.com (4.0/SMI-4.1) id AA00962; Tue, 2 Feb 93 17:04:33 PST Date: Tue, 2 Feb 93 17:04:33 PST From: shor@mv.us.adobe.com (Ilya Shor) Message-Id: <9302030104.AA00962@ideal.mv.us.adobe.com> To: info-russ@smarty.ece.jhu.edu Subject: INFO-RUSS: High quality Cyrillic typefaces Status: RO ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Adobe Releases First Macintosh Cyrillic Typeface Package Opening of Eastern Europe Increases Business and Academic Demand for Cyrillic Type Mountain View, Calif. (February 1, 1993) (NASDAQ:ADBE)- Adobe Systems Incorporated today announced the Macintosh(r) version of the Minion(tm) Cyrillic typeface package, for use in Russian and other Slavic languages. Also available from Adobe since September 1992 is a version of the Minion Cyrillic typeface that supports Microsoft(r) Windows(tm) applications and WordPerfect(r) DOS on IBM(r) and compatible personal computers. The Minion Cyrillic typeface family includes six styles: Regular, Italic, Semibold, Semibold Italic, Bold and Bold Italic. In addition to font software, the package includes Adobe's award-winning Adobe Type Manager(tm) (ATM(tm)) software and keyboard support for Russian, Transliterated Russian, Ukrainian, Belorussian, Serbian, Macedonian and Bulgarian. The Windows version of the product provides keyboard support in the form of a utility named Keyboard Layout Manager(tm), jointly developed by Adobe and ParaGraph International, a Russian/American business venture with headquarters in Moscow and in Boulder, Colorado. "We have worked closely with Apple to ensure that our Cyrillic fonts are compatible with Apple's WorldScript(tm) technology, which is a part of System 7.1," said Burwell Davis, product manager for Adobe's Type Marketing Group. "We are excited about the possibilities that WorldScript opens up for Macintosh users in a variety of countries. With the combination of the Macintosh and Windows version of our product, we believe we are now offering the highest-quality Cyrillic type available for personal computers. Minion Cyrillic was designed by Robert Slimbach and joins the collection of Adobe Original designs as a complement to the Latin version. The Adobe Originals collection now includes 16 families and continues to represent the best-selling typefaces from the Adobe Type Library. The Adobe Originals are developed by a group of full-time type designers with specialized skills in both design and in using the tools needed to develop electronic type. Price and Availability The suggested retail price of Adobe's Minion Cyrillic package is $275. A special educational price of $159 is available for qualified teachers and students. The new release is expected to be available from Adobe Authorized Resellers in the first quarter of 1993. For information, customers may contact Adobe at 1-800-833-6687. Adobe Systems Incorporated, founded in 1982, is headquartered in Mountain View, California. Adobe develops, markets and supports computer software products and technologies that enable users to create, display, print and communicate electronic documents. The company licenses its technology to major computer and publishing suppliers, and markets a line of type and application software products. Revenue for fiscal 1992 exceeded $265 million. ________________ Adobe, Adobe Type Manager, ATM, Keyboard Layout Manager and Minion are trademarks of Adobe Systems Incorporated which may be registered in certain jurisdictions. Windows is a trademark and Microsoft is a registered trademark of Microsoft Corporation. IBM is a registered trademark of International Business Machines Corporation. Apple and Macintosh are registered trademarks and WorldScript is a trademark of Apple Computer, Inc. WordPerfect is a registered trademark of WordPerfect Corporation. For more information contact: LaVon Peck Adobe Systems Incorporated 415 962-2730 ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- From INFO-RUSS-request@smarty.ece.jhu.edu Sat Dec 12 00:49:27 1992 Received: from smarty.ece.jhu.edu for jkl by oscsunb.osc.edu (5.65c+KVa/920330.1102) id AA29116; Sat, 12 Dec 1992 00:49:22 -0500 Received: by smarty.ece.jhu.edu (5.61/1.18jrs) id AA25183; Fri, 11 Dec 92 18:39:58 -0500 Errors-To: INFO-RUSS-request@smarty.ece.jhu.edu Sender: INFO-RUSS-request@smarty.ece.jhu.edu Precedence: bulk Received: from cuccfa.ccc.columbia.edu by smarty.ece.jhu.edu (5.61/1.18jrs) id AA25178; Fri, 11 Dec 92 18:39:54 -0500 Date: Fri, 11 Dec 1992 18:40:06 -0500 (EST) From: SELECTOR@CUCCFA.CCC.COLUMBIA.EDU Message-Id: <921211184006.2cb0@CUCCFA.CCC.COLUMBIA.EDU> Subject: INFO-RUSS: About Russian Fonts 12/11/92 To: info-russ@smarty.ece.jhu.edu X-Vmsmail-To: SMTP%" info-russ@smarty.ece.jhu.edu" Status: R |||| TO: INFO-RUSS NET/smtp%" info-russ@smarty.ece.jhu.edu" |||| FROM: Lev Selector/selector@cuccfa.ccc.columbia.edu |||| RE: About Russian Fonts 12/11/92 Dear friends: Recently I was asked by many people about True-Type Russian Fonts for Windows 3.1 and for Macintosh. I see also repeated questions about Russian True-Type fonts on computer nets. May be it is worth posting a brief information to avoid these questions and discussions on this net. I posted question on RUSTEX-L mailing list and received a lot of answers. Here is a short digest. I received permission from IR coordinator to post this message. In case you have any comments - please don't post them on IR net. You should better send them to me: I'll summarize. Disclaimer: This is only a very-very short summary. I did not tested all the sources myself. I also did not listed all software sources available. ----------- cut here ----------- Cyrillic Libraries are available from Casady & Greene 22734 Portola Drive, Salinas, CA 93908-1119. Tel.: 1-800-359-4920 or (408) 484-9228 Fax.: (408)484-9218 Their ads list many fonts including True-Type fonts. They have fonts with the same encoding for IBM and Macintosh. Thus you can easily transfer files between 2 most popular computer systems. The fonts have a good number of styles to choose from (7 families), good quality, and compatible key layouts (!). Ask for Mike Wright at the Casady & Greene. -------------------------------- You can order the fonts (including that of Casady & Greene and from other manufactures), order translating programs (from/to alternativnaya kodirovka and all other "standards") and other "Russian <--> English software (and get more infor) through at 800-869-9567 or 919-968-6780. Ask for David Moffat. He is very knowledgable and helpful. Ask to mail you their catalog. -------------------------------- Exceller Software Corp. at 1-800-426-0444 or 607-257-5634 also have Russian True-Type fonts and many useful programs for both IBM and Mac, though translation between IBM and Mac may not be so easy because encodings are different. -------------------------------- Some other vendors offer True-Type fonts for IBM clone at lower prices. You can also find fonts for free. But making a decision to use (or not) a particular font do not forget to clarify several points: - does it work with Windows 3.1? - type(s) of encoding (there are several standards)? - keyboard layouts? - how to translate to/from other encodings and platforms? - can it work with a PostScript printer? -------------------------------- keep eye on mailing list RUSTEX-L and on Usenet Newsgroup comp.fonts for more information. RusTeX-L aim is to facilitate the work on the Russian language version of the TeX typesetting system, but related technical topics are often discussed on the list: other Russian text processing systems, thesauri, spell checkers, Russian keyboard layout, and e-mail to Soviet sites. This list is limited to technical topics only. A collection of RusTeX-related software (METAFONT sources for Cyrillic fonts, Russian hyphenation patterns, et al) and mailing list archives are kept on UBVM.cc.buffalo.edu RUSTEX-L@UBVM.cc.buffalo.edu. LISTSERV@UBVM.cc.buffalo.edu. To subscribe to RusTex-L, send Email message without Subject to the following address: LISTSERV@UBVM.cc.buffalo.edu The body of the message should contain only 1 string: SUB RUSTEX-L your full name where "your full name" is your REAL name, and NOT your network userID ). For example: SUB List-L John X. Doe ----------- cut here ----------- Good luck - Lev