Subject: Linux-Misc Digest #756
From: Digestifier <[email-masked]>
To: [email-masked]
Date: Wed, 14 Sep 94 08:13:09 EDT

Linux-Misc Digest #756, Volume #2                Wed, 14 Sep 94 08:13:09 EDT

Contents:
  Re: best PCMCIA ethernet? (Harald T. Alvestrand)
  Re: Copyright and licensing - a plea to software authors (Jeff Kesselman)
  Re: Is 2 MB enough for an ISDN router (Alan Cox)
  Re: What about a votr on comp.os.linux.doom (Eugene Tyurin)
  Re: Yggdrasil FTP site (Jeff Kesselman)
  Re: Alpha processor (Jim Paradis)
  Re: The snatchability factor (was Re: WABI vs (Eric Silver)
  Re: Linux is a GNU system and the DWARF support (Orc)
  *** PLEASE READ THIS BEFORE POSTING *** (misc-2.07) (Ian Jackson)
  Re: Why more than one partition? (Dan Pop)

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: [email-masked] (Harald T. Alvestrand)
Crossposted-To: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.networking
Subject: Re: best PCMCIA ethernet?
Date: 14 Sep 1994 07:52:45 GMT

For running Linux on Ethernet, I use:

- Kernel 1.1.48 (it worked with 1.1.45 too)
- "modules", "NEW" version (date June 26, I think)
- David Hinds' PCMCIA drivers, version 2.1.3 (current is 2.2.3, I think)
  from cb-iris.stanford.edu:/pub/pcmcia
- D-Link DE-650 for the Ethernet (this has been supported the longest,
  but the 3Com is supposed to be supported too)
- Megahertz XJ1144 for the modem

Works like a charm!
-- 
                   Harald Tveit Alvestrand
                [email-masked]
      G=Harald;I=T;S=Alvestrand;O=uninett;P=uninett;C=no
                      +47 73 59 70 94
My son's name is Torbjørn. The letter between "j" and "r" is o with a slash.

------------------------------

From: [email-masked] (Jeff Kesselman)
Subject: Re: Copyright and licensing - a plea to software authors
Date: Wed, 14 Sep 1994 03:29:23 GMT

In article <[email-masked]> [email-masked] (Peter Jones) writes:
>Jim Goddard ([email-masked]) wrote:
>[snip snip]
>> Have to disagree with you on these two Ian.  If the code does not
>[snip snip snip]
>> Jim
>
>This, I think, must be a difference between the US and UK Copyright
>law.  My understanding is that Ian is correct for the UK: copyright is
>implicit on any work.  Of course, I stand to be corrected.  And European
>copyright law is a whole other kettle of fish...
>
>-- Peter

NO! Copyright is also implicit in the United States.  Someone is just 
mis-informed (dangerously so...)

------------------------------

Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.help
From: [email-masked] (Alan Cox)
Subject: Re: Is 2 MB enough for an ISDN router
Date: Tue, 13 Sep 1994 10:06:07 GMT

In article <[email-masked]> [email-masked] (Mihail S. Iotov) writes:
>Has anyone tried running linux with 2 MB to use it as a router only ?
>I imagine for ISDN traffic even 386SX16 will be enough, but question is
>about the memory. I have no 2MB PC at hand to check.

2Mb is plenty. If you want to use something as a router only why not just
run PCroute on an old 286 ?

Alan

-- 
  ..-----------,,----------------------------,,----------------------------,,
 // Alan Cox  //  [email-masked]   //  GW4PTS@GB7SWN.#45.GBR.EU  //
 ``----------'`----------------------------'`----------------------------''

------------------------------

From: [email-masked] (Eugene Tyurin)
Subject: Re: What about a votr on comp.os.linux.doom
Date: 13 Sep 1994 00:53:22 GMT
Reply-To: [email-masked] (Eugene Tyurin)

Exactly. Doomers --> alt.games.doom, but first FTP to
infant2.sphs.indiana.edu, /pub/doom.
-- 
  Eugene Tyurin ( ITP, Stony Brook Univ. )
  E-mail: [email-masked] ( MIME mail is welcome! )
     WWW: http://www.physics.sunysb.edu:80/~gene/plan.html

------------------------------

Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.help
From: [email-masked] (Jeff Kesselman)
Subject: Re: Yggdrasil FTP site
Date: Tue, 13 Sep 1994 03:57:02 GMT

In article <[email-masked]> [email-masked] writes:
>
>Is there a problem with the ftp site at Yggdrasil, I keep getting an unknown 
>host from ftp.yggdrasil.com?

Interesting, so do I.  Thats the site they list in their Fall94 release 
docs.  Maybe their name server has forgotten them (that used to happen to 
us at work on occasion.)

------------------------------

From: [email-masked] (Jim Paradis)
Subject: Re: Alpha processor
Date: 12 Sep 1994 23:53:34 -0400

[email-masked] wrote:
: I saw that someone posted some info about a prot of linux to the alpha
: processor.  I could not find that info and was wondering if someone could 
: tell me where to find it or summarize it for me.

Oh heck... it's not THAT long, and it hasn't shown up on c.o.l.a yet,
so here it is:

                      Linux/AXP Progress Report
                          September 9, 1994

                             Jim Paradis
                     Alpha Migration Tools Group
                    Digital Equipment Corporation

                  Introduction - What Is Linux/AXP?

The Linux FAQ (Frequently-Asked-Questions) list describes Linux as
follows:

     Linux is a Unix clone for 386/486-based PCs, written from scratch
     by Linus Torvalds, with assistance from a loosely-knit team of
     hackers across the Net.  It aims towards POSIX compliance.

     It has all the features you would expect in a modern
     fully-fledged Unix, including true multitasking, virtual memory,
     shared libraries, demand loading, shared copy-on-write
     executables, proper memory management and TCP/IP networking.

     It uses the hardware features of the 386 processor family (TSS
     segments et al) to implement these features.

     It is distributed under the GNU General Public License

Although the distributed Linux kernel depends heavily on the x86
processor architecture, it is feasible to port it to other
architectures.  Indeed, ports are currently in progress to the Alpha
AXP, 680x0, PowerPC, MIPS, and possibly other architectures.  Linux/AXP
is my port of the Linux operating system to the Digital Alpha AXP
architecture.

                        Overview of Linux/AXP

Linux/AXP is a port of Linux to the Digital Alpha AXP RISC
microprocessor.  It is based on the Linux V1.0 kernel.  Linux V1.0 was
current when I started the project.  To limit the number of variables,
I decided to stick with a single version while developing the
AXP-specific pieces.  Although the Linux V1.0 kernel provides more than
enough functionality for our current needs, we might investigate
subsequently leapfrogging to the most-current stable kernel when
Linux/AXP is stable.

Linux/AXP is a 32-bit operating system.  Except for those cases where
the kernel must interface with the Alpha AXP hardware, no kernel data
type is wider than 32 bits.  As far as C programmers are concerned, so
pointers and longs are 32 bits.  The decision to remain with 32-bit
data types was based on our group's experience with migrating legacy
software to a 64-bit environment.  By not changing the size of any data
types, those parts of Linux that are unaffected by the port (such as
the file system code) should continue to work without modification.
Changing the data type size would require significant code review to
ensure that all data types are used correctly.  Note that 64-bit
quantities are still available for computation through the use of "long
long" and "long double" C data types.  Thus, the only limitation of a
32-bit operating system is the unavailability of 64-bit pointers.  On
PC-class machines, with at most a few tens of megabytes of physical
memory, this should not be a significant restriction for the forseeable
future.

Linux/AXP is primarily targetted at PC-class Alpha AXP platforms that
support ISA, EISA, VLB, and PCI devices.  Support for other devices and
platforms is possible in the future.  Contributions of drivers for
other platforms are always welcome.

                        Current Project Status

I am currently cross-developing the Linux kernel port on a DEC 3000
model 500 AXP that is running DEC OSF/1.  I have also built and tested
all of my development tools on a 486 box running Linux, and everything
seems to work there too.  Naturally, I prefer the Alpha AXP box 8-).

The cross-development environment consists of gcc 2.5.8 with
configuration options for "alpha-linux", as well as gas, gdb, ld, and
GNU binutils.  I modified gdb has been modified so as to allow
source-level debugging of Linux when running on the ISP software
simulator.

ISP is an Alpha AXP CPU software simulator that runs on Ultrix, DEC
OSF/1, Linux, OpenVMS, and Windows NT AXP.  Only the DEC OSF/1 and
Linux versions support remote debugging via gdb.

The development environment also includes a set of utilities for
viewing and manipulating ext2 file systems from user mode.  These are
necessary when creating a bootable file system image for Linux/AXP.

The Linux kernel currently boots, goes through all initializations,
and runs the first user task.  At present, that first user task is a
hand-crafted "hello, world" program in place of /etc/init.  A more
significant program is not available, due to the unavailability of
libc.

Porting libc has been taking place in parallel with kernel development
and porting user and system utilities is taking place now.

Linux/AXP currently boots from a 1.44Mb ext2 floppy or floppy image.
Linux/AXP does not yet have disk drivers.  The bootstrap code reads
the floppy image into a RAM disk area, and the kernel uses the RAM
disk as its root file system.  The bootstrapper takes the RAM disk
size from the file system; the size of the RAM disk is limited only by
available system memory.

                          Future directions

Currently I'm getting a core set of utilities (sh, ls, grep, cat) up
and running, and packaging up a "developer's kit" for those who would
like to contribute to the project.  The developer's kit will consist
of:

      -  Sources for the Linux/AXP kernel

      -  Sources for all cross-development tools (gcc, etc)

      -  Sources for the ISP AXP CPU simulator

      -  Porting notes, build instructions, etc.

The developer's kit will definitely work on DEC OSF/1 systems and
Intel Linux systems.  It will probably run on other UNIX systems as
well, but I cannot guarantee that.

The version of Linux in the developer's kit will probably have only
console-callback device drivers.  Console-callbacks are the Alpha AXP
equivalents of BIOS calls on an Intel system.  They are quite slow
because they run synchronously with interrupts disabled.  As on an
Intel system, using console-callback or BIOS drivers will get you up
and creaking, but an important item on the agenda will be to write
real device drivers that take full advantage of the system and the
Alpha AXP CPU.

The supplied console-callback drivers will only support local disk
and console character I/O.  No networking, graphics, or windowing
support will be available.  Distributed utilities will be minimal and
the kernel itself will be extremely fragile.

The developer's kit will be distributed via anonymous ftp, with the
location to be announced.  If you would like to contribute to the
Linux/AXP project, please send email to [email-masked].  I
will maintain a list of who is working on what, to reduce duplication
of effort.

Please note that in order to do useful work in the device-driver
space, you MUST have access to an ISA or EISA-based Alpha AXP system
(such as the DEC 2000 AXP).  Unfortunately, we are not in a position
to lend out development systems at this time, except to Linus of
course 8-).

Questions/comments/requests please to [email-masked].

-- 
Jim Paradis ([email-masked])

      The purpose of time is to keep everything from happening at once.  
                               It's not working.

-- 
Jim Paradis ([email-masked])

      The purpose of time is to keep everything from happening at once.  
                               It's not working.

------------------------------

From: [email-masked] (Eric Silver)
Crossposted-To: comp.sys.hp,comp.sys.hp.apps,comp.sys.sun.apps,comp.windows.x,comp.windows.x.apps,comp.unix.unixware
Subject: Re: The snatchability factor (was Re: WABI vs
Date: 13 Sep 1994 04:19:46 GMT

J.J. Paijmans ([email-masked]) wrote:
: In article <[email-masked]> [email-masked] (Martin Sohnius) writes:
: ...
: >
: >Over lunch today, I mentioned this thread to the guy who is in charge of
: >software piracy issues for Novell-Wordperfect in Europe.  His reaction was
: >"forward the thread to me".  (See above, re legal insurance.)
: >
: >BTW, I understand that WP 6 for UnixWare is in beta.
: >
: >--
: >                        +--------------------------------------------+
: >Martin Sohnius          | "It doesn't matter whether the cat is      |

: Martin not only accused me implicitly of software-piracy (see this
: thread a few weeks ago), he now threatens to set his legal bloodhounds
: on this thread.  Obviously it is his right to do so but it effectively
: portraits the horror that established firms feel when confronted with
: new developments.

: And it is so bloody stupid... Linux offers a new way to boost
: WP-sales, which is a BIG seller, and all they can do is wave with
: lawyers and insert fingers in dykes, because it might threaten that
: Unixware of theirs, that is a SMALL seller and likely will remain so.

: Guess in which department Martin (or should I say: Mister Sohnius)
: is working...

: Paai.

I don't think you'll find much sympathy here pal. 

: -- 
: Copyright Hans Paijmans 1994. Niets hierboven mag geheel of

Wow! Copyright! Have you got yor nerve!

: gedeeltelijk worden geciteerd buiten de nieuwsgroep(en) waar het
: oorspronkelijk is geplaatst.  Nothing of the above may be cited
: outside the newsgroups in which the message originally was posted.

Eric Silver

------------------------------

From: [email-masked] (Orc)
Subject: Re: Linux is a GNU system and the DWARF support
Date: Tue, 13 Sep 1994 03:04:47 GMT

In article <[email-masked]>,
Matt Welsh <[email-masked]> wrote:
>In article <[email-masked]> [email-masked] (Orc) writes:
>>In article <[email-masked]>,

>>   No reason.  But since my first interpretation of RMS's idea is
>>that the FSF will take credit for work they've not done, it seems
>>like it's not the most politic way to ask for recognition.
>
>The FSF is not taking credit for anything that they have not
>done.

   True.  note that I said "first interpretation": when you said

> RMS's idea (which I have heard first-hand) is that Linux systems
> should be considered GNU systems with Linux as the kernel.

   the very first thing that popped into my head, even armed with
the knowledge that RMS likes to make Pronouncements, was that FSF
was trying to take credit for Linux.  And I *like* the FSF, and
support the work they're doing.

>Or did
>believe that it was the Linux development team which wrote gcc,
>libc, and the dozens of other software tools which your Linux
>system depends upon to run?

   Now I'd have to disagree with this.  Aside from gcc and libc, I
can get stuff from multiple sources, not just the FSF.  I have at
least as much Berkeley code on my linux box as I do FSF code --
if I was to convert over to FreeBSD, the only substantive change
would be the kernel, and that's certainly not a "GNU system with
BSD as the kernel"

   The GNU stuff is good, with very few bugs and gotchas, and the
development of Linux would be quite different without having gcc
around.  And the [L]GPL is a nice idea, which I approve of, and
would be happy to use if it wasn't for this recent exchange of
messages.  But using <x> tools doesn't make what you wrote also an
<x> tool.

                ____
  david parsons \bi/ [email-masked]
                 \/

------------------------------

From: [email-masked] (Ian Jackson)
Subject: *** PLEASE READ THIS BEFORE POSTING *** (misc-2.07)
Date: 14 Sep 1994 04:03:16 -0600

Please do not post questions to comp.os.linux.misc - read on for details of
which groups you should read and post to.

Please do not crosspost anything between different groups of the comp.os.linux
hierarchy.  See Matt Welsh's introduction to the hierarchy, posted weekly.

If you have a question about Linux you should get and read the Linux Frequently
Asked Questions with Answers list from sunsite.unc.edu, in /pub/Linux/docs, or
from another Linux FTP site.  It is also posted periodically to c.o.l.announce.

In particular, read the question `You still haven't answered my question!'
The FAQ will refer you to the Linux HOWTOs (more detailed descriptions of
particular topics) found in the HOWTO directory in the same place.

Then you should consider posting to comp.os.linux.help - not
comp.os.linux.misc.

Note that X Windows related questions should go to comp.windows.x.i386unix, and
that non-Linux-specific Unix questions should go to comp.unix.questions.
Please read the FAQs for these groups before posting - look on rtfm.mit.edu in
/pub/usenet/news.answers/Intel-Unix-X-faq and .../unix-faq.

Only if you have a posting that is not more appropriate for one of the other
Linux groups - ie it is not a question, not about the future development of
Linux, not an announcement or bug report and not about system administration -
should you post to comp.os.linux.misc.

Comments on this posting are welcomed - please email me !
--
Ian Jackson  <[email-masked]>  (urgent email: [email-masked])
2 Lexington Close, Cambridge, CB4 3LS, England;  phone: +44 223 64238

------------------------------

From: [email-masked] (Dan Pop)
Subject: Re: Why more than one partition?
Date: Tue, 13 Sep 1994 17:07:31 GMT

In <[email-masked]> [email-masked] (Sean Gilley) writes:

>As I'm just about to install a couple of 300M disks, I've got a question
>about partitioning.
>
>My current system contains two IDE drives, one 100M and the other 60M.
>I plan to keep the 60M for DOS, and use the 100M for my Linux root
>partition.  I'll probably transfer /usr to one of the new drives, as
>space on that drive is tight.
>
>So I install these 300M drives.  I know I've been told that drives with
>more than one partition run faster than drives with a single partition.
>I got a guess or two, but can someone give me a definitive answer as to
>why this is true, if it is true?

I don't think this is true.
>
>And other than that, is there a reason to partition the drives into
>multiple partitions?

Mostly for administrative reasons. It makes sense to have /tmp on a
partition of its own, so that a "bad" user or process won't cripple
your system when it fills the root partition and it makes sense to
have /usr/local on its own partition, as well as /home so that you
can upgrade your system without having to save and restore these
parts of your system.

The main drawback of this approach is that you have to statically allocate
the space on your disk between the different partitions, and changing
the allocation later is a major pain.

Also, having a swap partition on each disk is a good idea, because this
should increase the swapping performance.

Dan
--
Dan Pop 
CERN, CN Division
Email: [email-masked]
Mail:  CERN - PPE, Bat. 31 R-004, CH-1211 Geneve 23, Switzerland

------------------------------

** FOR YOUR REFERENCE **

The service address, to which questions about the list itself and requests
to be added to or deleted from it should be directed, is:

    Internet: [email-masked]

You can send mail to the entire list (and comp.os.linux.misc) via:

    Internet: [email-masked]

Linux may be obtained via one of these FTP sites:
    nic.funet.fi				pub/OS/Linux
    tsx-11.mit.edu				pub/linux
    sunsite.unc.edu				pub/Linux

End of Linux-Misc Digest
******************************