Subject: Linux-Misc Digest #763
From: Digestifier <[email-masked]>
To: [email-masked]
Date: Thu, 15 Sep 94 14:13:37 EDT

Linux-Misc Digest #763, Volume #2                Thu, 15 Sep 94 14:13:37 EDT

Contents:
  Re: Linux is a GNU system and the DWARF support (Michael I Bushnell)
  Re: Linux is a GNU system and the DWARF support (Marcus Daniels)
  Re: [Q] Unix driver for Mattel Powergloves ? (Jeff Kesselman)
  Re: Copyright and licensing - a plea to software authors (Jeff Kesselman)
  Re: Looking for small emacs-like editor source ([email-masked])
  Re: doom speedups (Peter Mutsaers)
  Re: Q: Reading from a ext2fs partition from DOS? ([email-masked])
  Re: Is there a SLIP FAQ or HOWTO anywhere ? (Dennis Heltzel)
  Re: VHDL for Linux...? (Matthew Donadio)
  Re: alt.games.doom.linux (was Re: What about a votr on comp.os.linux.doom) (H. Peter Anvin)
  Re: posting HOWTOs to c.o.l.announce (David Barr)
  Re: OS/2 fan wants to try Linux.. What do I need ?? (J.J. Paijmans)
  Re: Linux on Thinkpad 755C: no dice!! (J.H.M.Dassen)
  OPENLOOK/XView ....Font Problems (RYAN  Colin Patrick)
  Re: OS/2 fan wants to try Linux.. What do I need ?? (H. Peter Anvin)
  Re: Horrific bug in DOOM! (H. Peter Anvin)
  Re: HYDRA - serial bidirectional transfer for Linux? (Louis Lagendijk)
  __IO_stderr_ undefined linking libX11 (Michel Anders)

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: [email-masked] (Michael I Bushnell)
Crossposted-To: gnu.misc.discuss
Subject: Re: Linux is a GNU system and the DWARF support
Date: 15 Sep 1994 15:24:55 GMT

In article <[email-masked]> [email-masked] (Alan Cox) writes:

   eg   -       Can BSD code be incorporated and redistributed as part
                   of a GPL program: Specifically does the BSD license
                   requirement for credits in the documentation etc count
                   as an 'additional restriction' on distribution as the GPL
                   requires there are none. If it does (as my legal info says)
                   then you can't mix BSD with GPL and distribute the result.
                   If it doesn't can I therefore sell software GPL'd but with
                   a documentation requirement of must come with this expensive
                   booklet I've written ?

In the United States, the anwser is that there is apparently no
problem, because the BSD credit requirement is not thought to be
legally enforceable by most attorneys.  However, this is possibly not
the case in other countries (notably, the UK).

It *is* an additional restriction (if legally binding) and it does
pose a problem.  Given the good will of Berkeley, while it's a problem
that needs to be addressed (and rms is looking into various ways of
doing so); nobody is going to get sued on either side.

People might think that the GPL should make a special exception for
this.  (I did at first.)  But actually, the Berkeley requirement (if
enforceable) really is inimical to the GPL.  Imagine the situation
after twenty--or a hundred--people have added their own credit
requirements.  It would become essentially impossible to advertise GNU
software at all.

           -    How do inline functions in include files related to the GPL

GPL: If the inline functions are big/complex enough to make the result
a derived work, then the GPL applies as a whole to the resulting work.
The meanings of "big" and "complex" are undecided by the law at this
point.

LGPL: The same thing applies, except that the LGPL (*not* the GPL)
excludes from worry functions less than ten lines long, whether or not
they cause derivative status.

           -    What about structures from include files

Again, this depends on what the courts say is a "derived work".  It
seems likely that use of data structure layouts does not constitute
derivation, at the very least, if you compile without symbols.

With the LGPL, there is a special exemption for data structure layouts.

           -    When is a dynamic link a dynamic link 

The FSF's legal documents never use this term, so it's definition
doesn't matter.

           -    Interface issues. If I build a system that can use an LGPL
                   shared library I don't have to give a damn about the LGPL -
                   It hasn't got any gnu code in it and if people choose to
                   plug the two together its up to them.

If you distribute .o files (but not fully linked executables) which
only include data structure layouts and short (< 10 lines) functions
from header files, then you are on safe ground, with an LGPL'd
library.

        -mib

--
+1 617 623 3248 (H)         |           En arche en ho logos, 
+1 617 253 8568 (W)        -+-            kai ho logos en pros ton theon,
1105 Broadway               |             kai theos en ho logos.
Somerville, MA 02144        |           Kai ho logos sarx egeneto,
[email-masked]          |             kai eskenosen en hemin.

------------------------------

From: [email-masked] (Marcus Daniels)
Crossposted-To: gnu.misc.discuss
Subject: Re: Linux is a GNU system and the DWARF support
Date: 15 Sep 1994 13:30:15 GMT
Reply-To: [email-masked]

In-reply-to: [email-masked]'s message of Thu, 15 Sep 1994 11:52:11 GMT

>>>>> "Alan" == Alan Cox <[email-masked]> writes:
In article <[email-masked]> [email-masked] (Alan Cox) writes:

[]
Alan>   - How do inline functions in include files related to the GPL

Alan>   - What about structures from include files

Alan>   - When is a dynamic link a dynamic link
[]
Alan> A GPL v3 seems needed for at least one of these issues.

Indeed, it may be necessary to address these issues in a broad way.
However, it becomes easy to paint yourself into a corner by specifying legal
interpretations for each and every techinical convention.  It is easy
to see why the FSF has avoided this level of detail.

The examples you cite are specific to the C/object-module
world.  These terms don't apply so well to reflective development environments.

Developers should be able to tune the L/GPL to their personal intent, making
minor exceptions just as the FSF does.  I think the way to do this is with
explicit agreements with users.

------------------------------

From: [email-masked] (Jeff Kesselman)
Subject: Re: [Q] Unix driver for Mattel Powergloves ?
Date: Wed, 14 Sep 1994 18:35:48 GMT

In article <[email-masked]> [email-masked] (Christophe Person) writes:
> Sorry I posted in a wrong group, but some may be interested.       
> [ln -s flames /dev/null]
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>Does anybody know where I could find source code for a Unix station
>(whatever, I will translate) to handle Mattel Powergloves (better   
>for a parallel port but serial is ok). 

For UNIX, I can't help you, however there is Ms_DOS source code around 
pretty freely.  For that, you can get a copy of The Virtual REality 
Cosntruction Kit, by Gradecki (they guy who puts out PCVR journal.)

------------------------------

From: [email-masked] (Jeff Kesselman)
Subject: Re: Copyright and licensing - a plea to software authors
Date: Wed, 14 Sep 1994 18:38:28 GMT

In article <[email-masked]> [email-masked] (Anselm Lingnau) writes:
>In article <[email-masked]>, Jeff Kesselman
><[email-masked]> wrote:
>
>> NO! Copyright is also implicit in the United States.  Someone is just 
>> mis-informed (dangerously so...)
>
>The idea of implicit copyright was codified by the so-called Berne
>Convention, which the United States ratified fairly recently, years
>after just about everybody else. So you used to have to put a copyright
>notice on your stuff in the US a couple of years back, but not today.
>

Thanks for the note on the Berne Convention. I won't even begin to try to 
dispute your obviously superior knowledge of international Copyright.

Implicit copyright in the US, however, has been a reality since at least 
the mid 80's.  It came in with the last revision of the US Copyright code.

Jeff Kesselman

------------------------------

From: [email-masked]
Subject: Re: Looking for small emacs-like editor source
Date: Thu, 15 Sep 1994 15:16:46 GMT

In article <[email-masked]> ramos@brixton (Jesus Ramos) writes:

>I'm looking for sources to a small emacs-like editor(something like micro-emacs)
>or jove. Essentiall, I'm looking for something small and friendlier than vi.
>I want to bould this for my sun at work. I have jove at home(linux), but it's
>binaries only :(

>If you can point me as to where I can find any of these(or something similar),
>I would very very grateful.

I recommend JED.  It's available for just about every platform under the 
sun, including Solaris machines, from

  amy.tch.harvard.edu:/pub/jed

I've yet to find an editor that comes close.

Stuart

------------------------------

From: [email-masked] (Peter Mutsaers)
Subject: Re: doom speedups
Date: Thu, 15 Sep 1994 09:00:03 GMT

>> On Wed, 14 Sep 1994 00:15:15 GMT, [email-masked] (Andrew
>> R. Tefft) said:

  ART> I never played any doom except on Linux the last few days, but
  ART> when I got the newer version (with fixed pixel doubling) it was
  ART> very much slower. I eventually figured out why.

  ART> I had followed the suggestion in the readme (which is only really
  ART> hinted at): I don't have a sound card so I blew away sndserver.

But once you've heard the sounds that DOOM produces, you don't want to
play it anymore without sound. DOOM is the best reason to buy a sound
card...
--
Peter Mutsaers                  |  AT Computing bv,  P.O. Box 1428,
[email-masked]                    |  6501 BK  Nijmegen, The Netherlands
tel. work: +31 (0)80 527248     |
tel. home: +31 (0)3405 71093    |  "... En..., doet ie het al?"

------------------------------

From: [email-masked]
Subject: Re: Q: Reading from a ext2fs partition from DOS?
Date: Thu, 15 Sep 1994 15:35:01 GMT

In article <[email-masked]> [email-masked] (Steve DuChene) writes:

>Won Hong ([email-masked]) wrote:

>: Just wondering if there is a DOS program you can use to be able to
>: read the Linux ext2fs partitions, guess it would be something like
>: the mscdex thing to read iso9660 format.  It would just be nice to
>: be able to access things on all my drives in either operating system.

>        Everytime I see this come up I wonder what someone is thinking
>        when they say they want to do this? DOS does not have any means
>        of restricting access to the filesystem (oh, like /etc/passwd!)
>        to prevent someone with a DOS program like this from accessing my
>        system files as root! I really don't think this is a real swift
>        idea here.

Simple.  My machine at home runs Linux.  My machine in the office runs DOS.  
The Linux box isn't networked, while the DOS box is.  Which means I end up 
carrying piles and piles of floppies around whenever I need something at 
home off the Internet.  Being able to use ext2 on those floppies (or a 
UMSDOS driver for DOS) would simplify things a LOT.

Stuart

------------------------------

From: [email-masked] (Dennis Heltzel)
Subject: Re: Is there a SLIP FAQ or HOWTO anywhere ?
Date: 15 Sep 1994 13:07:30 -0000

Bill Hiley ([email-masked]) wrote:
: There seem to be a few questions in this group about setting up SLIP/PPP
: etc.
: I want to set up a SLIP server and am not sure where to start.
: Is there a FAW or HOWTO anywhere ? I can't seem to find one

Look for the NET2 FAQ. It covers SLIP pretty extensively. I've read it 
and plan to implement it "real soon now". I know it's at sunsite.unc.edu, 
probably at a lot of other places as well.

Dennis

------------------------------

From: [email-masked] (Matthew Donadio)
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.development,comp.lsi.cad,comp.lang.vhdl
Subject: Re: VHDL for Linux...?
Date: 14 Sep 1994 01:55:22 GMT

ADA ([email-masked]) wrote:
: I have been playing (or trying to play) with both magic and ocean.  I
: was wondering if there are any free VHDL simulators available or being
: worked on for Linux.  If so, what about synthesis tools?

Are there _any_ free VHDL tools?  All of the ones I have used haven't
been..

: While I'm on the subject, and I know this isn't the proper group but I
: know there are a lot of hardware weenies out there like me, is there
: an emacs major mode for VHDL floating around?

I think had one at one time or another, but I can't seem to find it.

--
Beaker aka Matt Donadio   | Life is short,     ---   __ o    __~o    __ o
[email-masked] |    ride like    ----    _`\<,   _`\<,   _`\<,
--- Penn State Cycling ---|      the wind.    ---  ( )/( ) ( )/( ) ( )/( )
====================================URL: http://mxd120.rh.psu.edu/~donadio

------------------------------

Crossposted-To: alt.config
From: [email-masked] (H. Peter Anvin)
Subject: Re: alt.games.doom.linux (was Re: What about a votr on comp.os.linux.doom)
Reply-To: [email-masked] (H. Peter Anvin)
Date: Wed, 14 Sep 1994 20:37:43 GMT

NOTE: FOLLOWUPS SET TO alt.config

Since the Linux version of iD Software's game DOOM! was recently
released, the comp.os.linux.misc and comp.os.linux.help groups have
been inundated with questions about Linux DOOM!.  On the other hand,
people seem hesitant to take Linux-specific questions to
alt.games.doom, probably since most people reading that group are
unfamiliar with Linux, and since the S/N ratio in that group is rather
low.

Hence this is a formal proposal to create alt.games.doom.linux.  As by
Altnet guidelines, this is presented for discussion in alt.config
ONLY.

        /hpa

Followup to:  <[email-masked]>
By author:    [email-masked] (Hans Peter Verne)
In newsgroup: comp.os.linux.misc
>
>    : Lets control the flood and get it out of the road before it starts!
> 
>    You have my vote.  Or maybe they should start using alt.games.doom.
> 
> The problem is that  alt.games.doom is  very crowded and noisy, with tons of
> post about satanism, what is your favorite level or weapon and such...
> The questions that are more specific to the linux port tends to drown 
> in there. 
> 
> Also, linux-wizards that could be helpful might not read a.g.d. , and
> DOOM-wizards might not read c.o.l.[mh]   :-)    As it is, I cross-post...
> 
> I would rather suggest a  alt.games.doom.linux  group, doom-questions have
> nothing to do in the comp-hierarchy....
> 
-- 
INTERNET: [email-masked]             --- Allah'u'abha ---
IBM MAIL: I0050052 at IBMMAIL     HAM RADIO:   N9ITP or SM4TKN
FIDONET:  1:115/511 or 1:115/512  STORMNET:    181:294/1 or 181:294/101
Linux: a free UNIX clone for the 386.  Get yours today from tsx-11.mit.edu!

------------------------------

From: [email-masked] (David Barr)
Subject: Re: posting HOWTOs to c.o.l.announce
Date: 15 Sep 1994 11:42:27 -0400

In article <[email-masked]>,
Matt Welsh <[email-masked]> wrote:
>No, this is done on purpose. The reason? I am at odds with the
>news.answers moderation team over their approval mechanism. They

I don't really feel that all the HOWTO's et al are appropriate
for news.answers.  Once comp.os.linux.answers is created, that
should be used exclusively.  Sites like me expire *.answers for
a month or more, so it is effectively the same thing as crossposting
to news.answers.

--Dave

------------------------------

From: [email-masked] (J.J. Paijmans)
Subject: Re: OS/2 fan wants to try Linux.. What do I need ??
Date: 15 Sep 1994 09:15:35 GMT

In article <[email-masked]> [email-masked] (todd) writes:
>I recently added Linux to my OS/2 machine and am quite
>happy, so I feel somewhat qualified to answer this post:
>
>Jim Chisholm ([email-masked]) wrote:
>: Hi folks..
>: I'm a long time advocate of OS/2 and I am curious about Linux..
>
>: 1)will it run on a386DX40 8M ?
>
>Yes, but slowly.

I don't agree at all. I had Linux on a 386DX40 with 8 meg & normal
video and when I upgraded to 486-66 with 16 meg & VESA I was even a
bit disappointed that the FEEL of using Linux - under X Windows - did
not change very much. Of course programs that took a long time on the
386 were *much* faster on the 486, but starting utilities, compiling
*short* programs & stuff like that, really went smooth already on
the 386.

So unles you want to bend your machine under heavy work, the 386/40
with 8 meg should be more than sufficient.

Paai.

-- 
Copyright Hans Paijmans 1994. Niets hierboven mag geheel of
gedeeltelijk worden geciteerd buiten de nieuwsgroep(en) waar het
oorspronkelijk is geplaatst.  Nothing of the above may be cited
outside the newsgroups in which the message originally was posted.

------------------------------

From: [email-masked] (J.H.M.Dassen)
Subject: Re: Linux on Thinkpad 755C: no dice!!
Date: 15 Sep 1994 09:21:32 GMT

In article <[email-masked]>,
Edward Vale <[email-masked]> wrote:
>I'm trying to load Linux (Slackware 1.1.2) on my friend's Thinkpad 755C
>without much success.  The boot disk goes OK but when it tries to read
>the root disk I get all kinds of floppy I/O errors.  
>Could it be because this thing has a 2.88 Mb floppy drive???  (I have ZERO 
>documentation on the 755C).
>
>Anyone had some success with the 755C, or have any ideas on who I can
>get around the problem???

If you have access to WWW, you could look at 
http://peipa.essex.ac.uk/html/linux-thinkpad.html
you'll find a lot of info on Linux on a Thinkpad 750;
it also tells you that there is a Slackware 2.0 compatible bootdisk at 
ftp://peipa.essex.ac.uk/pub/tp750/tp-bare.gz

Hope this helped,
Ray
-- 
UNFAIR  Term applied to advantages enjoyed by other people which we tried 
to cheat them out of and didn't manage. See also DISHONESTY, SNEAKY, 
UNDERHAND and JUST LUCKY I GUESS.     
- The Hipcrime Vocab by Chad C. Mulligan  

------------------------------

Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.admin
From: [email-masked] (RYAN  Colin Patrick)
Subject: OPENLOOK/XView ....Font Problems
Date: Thu, 15 Sep 1994 14:34:06 GMT

Help. I have installed the latest Slackware distributions (from sunsite) of
XFree and XView. Everything is OK for XFree but my OPENLOOK ie Xview can't
find the proper fonts. It is looking for -b$h-lucidia........ fonts. I've
checked the fonts.alias files and have noticed that these fonts are already
aliased in the 75dpi directory. But still, all XView applications, including
olvwm (grrrrr) crash because they can't find there fonts. I've done mkfontsdir a
nd xset fp rehash and all that stuff but to no avail.

I noticed that the xview and olvwm .rc files use a shell variable called
$OPENWINHOME. And all menu and font etc references are loaded in relation to
this. I've looked and looked, but can't find where is var. is set.

Is it a Xresource ?
Where can I set this ?
Whats up with the fonts ?

Any help will be greatly appreciated.

Colin Ryan: [email-masked]

~
~

-- 
==========================================================================
===============================================================================
===============================================================================
Colin P. Ryan

------------------------------

From: [email-masked] (H. Peter Anvin)
Subject: Re: OS/2 fan wants to try Linux.. What do I need ??
Reply-To: [email-masked] (H. Peter Anvin)
Date: Wed, 14 Sep 1994 01:42:17 GMT

Followup to:  <[email-masked]>
By author:    [email-masked] (todd)
In newsgroup: comp.os.linux.misc
>
> I recently added Linux to my OS/2 machine and am quite
> happy, so I feel somewhat qualified to answer this post:
> 
> Jim Chisholm ([email-masked]) wrote:
> : Hi folks..
> : I'm a long time advocate of OS/2 and I am curious about Linux..
> 
> : 1)will it run on a386DX40 8M ?
> 
> Yes, but slowly.
> 

But not anywhere near as slowly as OS/2.

        /hpa

-- 
INTERNET: [email-masked]             --- Allah'u'abha ---
IBM MAIL: I0050052 at IBMMAIL     HAM RADIO:   N9ITP or SM4TKN
FIDONET:  1:115/511 or 1:115/512  STORMNET:    181:294/1 or 181:294/101
#include <stdquote.h>

------------------------------

From: [email-masked] (H. Peter Anvin)
Subject: Re: Horrific bug in DOOM!
Reply-To: [email-masked] (H. Peter Anvin)
Date: Wed, 14 Sep 1994 01:46:26 GMT

Followup to:  <[email-masked]>
By author:    [email-masked] (Kevin Lentin)
In newsgroup: comp.os.linux.misc
> 
> > The original name for the glorified boot loader now known as MS-DOS
> > was QDOS, which stood for Quick and Dirty Operating System.  Note that
> > the letter Q has since been dropped.
> 
> Huh? I know QDOS as a separate product. Sort of in the lvein of 4DOS. Is
> this a coincidence?

Probably.

        /hpa
-- 
INTERNET: [email-masked]             --- Allah'u'abha ---
IBM MAIL: I0050052 at IBMMAIL     HAM RADIO:   N9ITP or SM4TKN
FIDONET:  1:115/511 or 1:115/512  STORMNET:    181:294/1 or 181:294/101
ld error:  wallet.c:  _money not found

------------------------------

From: [email-masked] (Louis Lagendijk)
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.admin
Subject: Re: HYDRA - serial bidirectional transfer for Linux?
Date: 15 Sep 1994 10:43:43 GMT

In article <[email-masked]>,
Holger Muenx <[email-masked]> wrote:
>
>Guten Tag!
>
>   Did anybody consider porting HYDRA, a serial bidirectional file transfer
>program to Linux?
>
>   HYDRA is a file transfer protocol available for MS-DOS and Amiga machines
>which allows sending and receiving files from/to serial connections at the
>same time. On a 19200 connection it is said to manage >2200cps for sending
>or receiving - resulting in >4400cps considering the bidirectional transfer.
>
>   The good thing is that the source code of this program is available.
>At least the documentation says so. Unfortunately, I did not find the source
>code on the net.
>
I don't think the code is available on the net. It is however 
available in fidonet. I once requested the code from the BBS of
one of the authors. 

>   So: Is any port for Linux available? If not where can I get the source
>code so that I can have a try on it myself?
>
Porting should not be too hard. I have been working on a port
of Binkley 2.59 that has hydra as one of it's file transfer modes.
There it works, although I have not had too much chance to test it
yet.

cheers, Louis

------------------------------

From: [email-masked] (Michel Anders)
Subject: __IO_stderr_ undefined linking libX11
Date: Thu, 15 Sep 1994 14:57:03 GMT

when compiling and linking a program that uses X11 functions, the linker
reports that some modules in the X11 lib reference symbol __IO_stderr_
The question is simple: what is it, and were is it defined?
(My 'solution' of defining a global FILE * __IO_stderr_ = stderr ; works,
but is a wild guess: if no actual reference to __IO_stderr_ is ever made
while the program is running I wouldn't know if my guess was wrong)

anyone?

Michel.

* This is no X11 question: i never get that linker error on our sun

------------------------------

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End of Linux-Misc Digest
******************************