From CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu Tue Oct 22 23:35:32 1991
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Sender: Chinese Computing Network <CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu>
From: grad3008%WRITER.YORKU.CA@uga.cc.uga.edu
Subject:      CRN communication
Comments: To: ccnet-l@uga.cc.uga.edu
To: Multiple recipients of list CCNET-L <CCNET-L@UGA>
Status: RO

As reported in the People's Daily on 15 Oct. 1991, China's E-mail networks
has begun to work and can be reached through the German networks (DFN).
Anyone knows how to reach China's networks (CRN)/

From CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu Wed Oct 23 00:26:34 1991
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Sender: Chinese Computing Network <CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu>
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To: Multiple recipients of list CCNET-L <CCNET-L@UGA>
Status: RO

<grad3008@WRITER.YORKU.CA>, you asked:

> As reported in the People's Daily on 15 Oct. 1991, China's E-mail networks
> has begun to work and can be reached through the German networks (DFN).
> Anyone knows how to reach China's networks (CRN)/

As your request, I re-post this message that originally posted to CCNET-L,
INFONETS in Sept. this year.

******************************************************************************
Date: Tue, 10 Sep 1991 18:35:00 +1000
From: "Huang, Chih-Hsien" <7911013@TWNCTU02.BITNET>
Subject: E-mail access to M'land China

For those concerning connection to mainland CHINA,

As an editor of campus magazine with a special report on network connection
to mainland China, I tried very hard to find out any possibly way for sending
e-mails to there.  I got help from kind netters, from whois database,
knowing that CANET(Chinese Academic Network) users actually have e-mail access
with Internetter.  So I contacted Mr. Qian, the administative contact of
CANET via e-mail and personal letter.  Finally, I got response after Mr. Qian
got my personal letter.  (Now, people in Taiwan can mail letters to mainland
China indirectly, via Hong Kong.)

Mr. Qian gave me some introduction of CANET, and eventually mentioned the
main problem is lack of funds, so people on CANET have to pay fees for
both receiving and sending e-mail abroad.  In this case, after you reading
this message, PLEASE DON'T TRY TO SEND E-MAILS TO MR. QIAN ASKING ABOUT
FURTHER DETAIL, SINCE I CAN NOT MAKE SURE MR. QIAN ALSO HAVE TO PAY FEE
FOR HIS E-MAIL OR NOT.  I am afraid the mail flood will cause another big
problem to him.  Thank you.

Regards,

=== Original message from Mr. Qian ============================================
From:   cn%"QIAN@ica.beijing.canet.cn" 20-AUG-1991 19:18:57.92
To:     7911013@twnctu02.bitnet
CC:
Subj:   reply

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Date: Tue, 20 Aug 91 15:06 CHINA TIME +100
From: QIAN@ica.beijing.canet.cn
Subject: reply
To: 7911013@twnctu02.bitnet
Message-id: <29780B1EE25F00002B@ICA.BEIJING.CANET.CN>
X-Organization: ICA BEIJING CHINA
X-Envelope-to: 7911013@twnctu02.bitnet
X-VMS-To: IN%"7911013@twnctu02.bitnet",QIAN

Mr.Huang,Thank you for your letter of Aug.5.Some time ago I received an email
from you,and I'm sorry Ihave been unable to answer it sooner.Thank you for your
paying great attention for CANET project.
Hherewith I'm encluding the briefly introduction of CANET.
-------------------------------------------------------------------
      CANET , co--initated by ICA ( Beijing  Instutute  for  Computer
  Applications ) and the University  Karlsruhe ( Germany ) , began in
  1986. Its purpose is to integrate chinese academic communities with
  the worldwide computer netowrk, and to promote information exchange
  and technical cooperation with the rest of the world . The  initial
  service provided by CANET is the international E-mail delivery.
      The first connection with CSNET was actually set up in Sep.1987.
  The central machine located in ICA , Siemens 7,760/ BS2000 running
  PMDF/BS2000 software,was successfully connected  with the  E-mail
  systems all over the world by means of the relay machinein  Univer-
  sity of Karlsruhe.
      Since then ,  CANET  has  been operational and has provided the
  worldwide E-mail service for some academic communities within China.
      In 1990 Oct. ,  the  top  level  domain ---" CN " for China was
  registered with DDN SRI--NIC by ICA . This is a very important step
  for the development of CANET.
      CANET is a store and forward electronic mail network .
      Recently,the central machine in CANET is a Micro VAXII--cluster
  system under VMS 4.7 running PMDF 3.1/VMS,which acts as an interna-
  tional gateway linking the main domain server located at Uni. Karl-
  sruhe by x.25 through the CHINAPAC (Chinese Packed Switching Network).
      For remote sites, CANET is accessible for any academic communi-
  ty of China through the CHINAPAC ( national x.25 PDN )  or the dial
  up telephone links, at 1200 bps and 2400 bps or 4800 bps (depending
  on the cost factor ). End--user's PC  or workstations can access to
  local node machine by terminal emulation . CANET  adopts  RFC--822
  formats.
     CHINAPAC , the first national PDN in China , was operational in
  the end of 1989 , it is authorized  by the goverment and run by the
  Ministry  of Posts and Telecommications of China.This network is
  based on x.25 . At persent , it is still on the first stage and has
  3 node-machines ( Package Switching Node ) and 8 package multiplexers
  which are  located  at 11 major cities in China. It has international
  link through the satellites.
     All amchines of CANET implement  Internet  DNS ( domain naming
  system ) syntax.
     The top level domain --- " CN " for China has been  operational
  since Jan.1991 . Currently, the international mail delivery usually
  takes half a day . At present , 16 sites have been connected within
  CANET. It is true , many institutions and universities have estab-
  lished their private local network in the compus, most of them are
  interested in joning CANET.But, there are the financial boundaries--
  ---lack of the funds. If the funding is available, CANET will be
  growing rapidly.
---------------------------------------------------------------------
  Frankly speaking,the CANET has not been a part of the Internet yet,
because it does't implement the TCP/IP protocol suite to link with the
Internet via the leased line directly.that is why CANET is unable to do
FTP and R-Login recently.Also,this is the reason that CANET's user has
to pay the international communication fees not only for sending mail
but also for receiving mail.
  I hope these will be of some help to you.
Best wishes!
Qian,tian-bai

===============================================================================


---------------------------------------------------------------------------
                                   ::   :: .        :;       ,,,,,;.,,,,:.
Huang, Chih-Hsien, E.E.83        ''::'''::'''  ,,,,,;;,,,,;, ::.:., ', ,:
                                   ;:...:;          ::       ::.,.:  ,':,
Email:                         ,,,,,,,,,,,,,;,      ::   .   ::.:...'   ':'
 7911013@TWNCTU02.BITNET         :........;;,   '''''''''''   :.......::,
 7911013%VS3540@TWNCTU01.BITNET  ::   :   ::     :. :.        ::......::
                                 ::''':'''::    :::  ;, ';.   ::......::
National Chiao Tung Univ.        ;:...:...:;   :'::   ' : :;  ::......::
Hsin-chu, Taiwan, R.O.C.        ..;''   '';,  '' ':::::::'   ..;''   '';,

From sol.ctr.columbia.edu!caen!sdd.hp.com!cs.utexas.edu!solo.csci.unt.edu!iex!neptune!john Wed Mar 20 16:55:28 EST 1991
Article: 26897 of soc.culture.china
Xref: sol.ctr.columbia.edu soc.culture.china:26897 soc.culture.taiwan:10451 soc.culture.hongkong:9704
Path: sol.ctr.columbia.edu!caen!sdd.hp.com!cs.utexas.edu!solo.csci.unt.edu!iex!neptune!john
From: john@neptune.iex.com (John Ho)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china,soc.culture.taiwan,soc.culture.hongkong
Subject: Re: Internet SITES in China, Taiwan, or Hong Kong
Message-ID: <john.669482178@neptune>
Date: 20 Mar 91 15:16:18 GMT
References: <1991Mar7.194228.28299@prism.poly.edu> <12165@pasteur.Berkeley.EDU>
Sender: news@iex.uucp (USENET news)
Organization: IEX Corporation
Lines: 33
Status: RO

c60a-ej@amazon.Berkeley.EDU (Won Namgoong) writes:


>	I am looking for internet sites in China, Taiwan and Hong Kong.
>If you have any internet IP addresses for these locations, please email me.

>Thanks!

I posted this before but I saw a couple more postings asking the
same questions, so I decided to post again.

 
 City Polytechnic of HK                  user@cphkvx.bitnet
                                         user@cphkvx.cphk.hk
 
 Chinese University of HK                user@cucsc.bitnet
                                         user@cucsc.cuhk.hk

 HK Baptist College                      user@bc750.bitnet
                                         user@bc750.hkbc.hk
 
 HK Polytechnic                          user@hkpcc.bitnet
                                         user@hkpcc.hkp.hk
 
 HK University of Science & Technology   user@usthk.bitnet
                                         user@usthk.hkust.hk
 
 University of HK, Computer Center       user@hkucc.bitnet
                                         user@hkucc.hku.hk
 University of HK, CS Dept.              user@csd.hku.hk
 University of HK, EE Dept.              user@hkueee.hku.hk

 John Ho


From CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu Mon Nov 11 22:37:49 1991
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Date:         Tue, 12 Nov 1991 05:56:21 +0800
Reply-To: "Jymmi C. Tseng" <u431573%IMUX200.MGT.NCU.EDU.TW@uga.cc.uga.edu>
Sender: Chinese Computing Network <CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu>
From: "Jymmi C. Tseng" <u431573%IMUX200.MGT.NCU.EDU.TW@uga.cc.uga.edu>
Subject:      Re:  Taiwan nodes
Comments: To: DANNY%LEVA.ICF.LEEDS.AC.UK@VTVM2.CC.VT.EDU
To: Multiple recipients of list CCNET-L <CCNET-L@UGA>
Status: RO

Danny Cox writes:

        A colleague of mine wishes to send some files over to Taiwan.  Can
        any kind soul remind me of the various Taiwanese Bitnet nodes, and
        tell me whether Taiwan is connected to Internet yet, and if so,
        what the various addresses available are.

        Danny%leva.icf.leeds.ac.uk@nsfnet-relay.ac.uk (Internet)
        Danny%leva.icf.leeds.ac.uk@cunyvm.cuny.edu    (EARN/Bitnet)

The optimistic date we have now for an internet connection is
December this year. I waited a while before posting this because
I know my list is outdated, there seems to be 19 BITNET nodes in
Taiwan while mine lists only 16. Best luck to your friend!

Link Node_Name Connect_via  Organization_Name           Protocol_Uses Date_Updat
   ed
1079 TWNAS886 TWNMOE10  Academic Sinica                  ,TW JNET  90/04/24
2590 TWNCTUCS TWNMOE10  Nat'l Chiao-Tung Univ            ,TW JNET  90/05/29
0087 TWNCTU01 TWNMOE10  National Chiao-Tung Univ         ,TW JNET  90/04/24
3285 TWNCU865 TWNMOE10  National Central University - Com,TW JNET  90/05/29
3250 TWNIAMS  TWNMOE10  Academia Sinica Inst of Atomic & ,TW JNET  90/04/27
3334 TWNIII1  TWNMOE10  Institute for Information Industr,TW RSCS  90/07/19
2652 TWNITRI1 TWNCTU01  Industrial Tech Res Ins          ,TW JNET  90/04/24
1906 TWNMOE10 JPNSUT00  Ministry of Ed Taiwan            ,TW RSCS  90/04/24
2378 TWNMOE20 TWNMOE10  Ministry of Ed Taiwan            ,TW RSCS  90/04/24
2739 TWNNTIT  TWNMOE10  Nat'l Taiwan Inst of Tech        ,TW RSCSV 90/04/24
2053 TWNSCU10 TWNMOE10  Soochow Univ                     ,TW RSCS  90/04/24
2203 TWNSRRC1 TWNMOE10                                   ,TW JNET  90/04/24
3054 TWNTKU10 TWNMOE10  TAMKANG UNIVERSITY--INFORMATION C,TW RSCS
2945 TWNTTIT  TWNMOE10  Tatung Inst of Tech              ,TW RSCS  90/04/24
2735 TWNTUCC1 TWNMOE10  Nat'l Taiwan Univ                ,TW JNET  90/04/24
2726 TWNTUCC2 TWNMOE10  Nat'l Taiwan Univ                ,TW NJEF  90/04/24

Jymmi C. Tseng
Department of Information Management
National Central University
BITNET: u431573@TWNCU865.BITNET         TANET: u431573@imux200.mgt.ncu.edu.tw

From CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu Wed Nov 13 11:37:58 1991
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Date:         Wed, 13 Nov 1991 06:41:12 -0500
Reply-To: terryk%MICROSOFT.COM@uga.cc.uga.edu
Sender: Chinese Computing Network <CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu>
From: terryk%MICROSOFT.COM@uga.cc.uga.edu
Subject:      NOVELL support double byte character sets
Comments: To: ingate!utai!watmath!uga.cc.uga.edu!ccnet-l@uunet.UU.NET
To: Multiple recipients of list CCNET-L <CCNET-L@UGA>
Status: RO

Poster Note:

The purpose of this posting is to let people aware of the current
industry trend toward DBCS.

Terenec Kwan

-=-

NOVELL affirms support for Double Byte Character Sets; gives
Asian customers NetWare in local languages

--(BUSINESS WIRE)--

Overview:    As    the    demand   for   NetWare   increases
internationally,  NOVELL  is  committed to supporting Double
Byte Character Sets (DBCS) in future releases of the NetWare
operating  system.   With DBCS support, NetWare customers in
Asian countries will see NetWare in their local language.

``NetWare's  support for DBCS is consistent with the growing
international  acceptance  of  NetWare,'' said John Edwards,
director of NetWare Products Marketing.  ``We intend to make
NetWare  available  in  native languages to customers in all
countries.''

DBCS  support  involves  enabling  the  operating system and
components/services   to   support   these   languages   and
translating  (localizing)  all  user-visible  parts,  (i.e.,
menus, messages, dates, time, alerts, and documentation), in
their native language.

Need for DBCS: Asian countries such as Japan, Korea, Taiwan,
and  China  require  DBCS  to support the characters used in
their writing systems.

Current DBCS Support: NOVELL recently announced NetWare J, a
Japanese version of NetWare which supports DBCS.

CONTACT: NOVELL Inc.  Michael Adams, 801/429-5809

13:54 ET

BW142  NOV 12,1991 10:54 P :TICKER: NOVL :SUBJECT: SOFT NPRD
ASIA  UT  Copyright  (c)  1991  Business  Wire  Received via
NewsEDGE from Desktop Data, Inc.: 11/12/91 11:09

-=-

From ghuang@risky.ecs.umass.edu Sun Nov 24 23:32:50 1991
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Date: Sun, 24 Nov 91 23:32:04 -0500
From: ghuang@risky.ecs.umass.edu (Guyang Huang)
Message-Id: <9111250432.AA07841@risky.ecs.umass.edu>
To: aeicnet@wam.umd.edu
Subject: E-mail Network Establishment in China--input needed
Cc: rzhu@watmath.waterloo.edu, xuan@hpnmdla.sr.hp.com, yjj@ctr.columbia.edu
Status: RO

Hi AEIC fellows,

I got a call from Mr. Xiaohua Xuan (address seen Cc:) this afternoon about
some questions relating e-mail networking to/in China (remember my early
forwarding of his inquiry?:-) ). Based on what I understand of the status
quo --- I know I could very well be wrong ---- I suggested that the link
b/w US/CA to China has been existed and the main obstacle for the establishment
of such a network is more of technical and financial than that of political,
provided the authority/exports are convinced of the merit from such a network
for the industrial, commercial, research and educational (unfortunately I guess
the education is still the last priority for the authority:-( ) value.

Mr. Xuan is quite enthusiastic and dynamic on gethering help/resources together
for building such a gigantic project:-). He said he knew some scientific
group successfully built up e-mail linkage to Africa. So the next obvious
Question (at least seems to me) is:

What kind of network, and to what extend, is achievable and pragmatic for the
resource/help we could possibly have?

I do know the complication it is and our lack of knowledge. I do admit it
somewhat beyond our aeic netters scope --- I do wish I am wrong here:-) ---
if not capability. But anyway I think it will be at least very inspiring,
incentive and informative to have such a discuss, especially for those
people on computer divisions. And the outcome of the discussion might be
helpful to Mr. Xuan's great goal.

Really, I got all excited by Xiaohua's call. I remember few days ago saw a
post on a net saying that computer network and communism can't be co-exist
:-) ---- Ooops, excuse me for getting political. We should be academical.:-)

Guyang
UMass Amherst

From yawei@silver.ucs.indiana.edu Mon Nov 25 00:02:54 1991
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	(5.65c+/10jsm) id AA23217; Sun, 24 Nov 1991 23:58:43 -0500
Date: Sun, 24 Nov 1991 23:58:43 -0500
From: Bo Xiong <yawei@silver.ucs.indiana.edu>
To: aeicnet@wam.umd.edu, ghuang@risky.ecs.umass.edu
Subject: Re:  E-mail Network Establishment in China--input needed
Cc: rzhu@watmath.waterloo.edu, xuan@hpnmdla.sr.hp.com, yjj@ctr.columbia.edu
Status: RO

Well, people on the network, especially on SCC :-), have been discussing
this question for several years, as far as I know, there are following 
operable network links between China and outside world, but please be 
warned that non of them is free link as DXZ in Hawaii (Hey! :-) pointed
out early today.

1) The link between Beijing and Germany, it was a 1200 bps modem link via
   international phone line but recently was upgraded (connected via Shanghai)
   according to People, but still via telephone company.

   This link has existed for at least five years (?) and most of communication
   going in/out Beijing are thru the link.
  
2) The link between Beijing Univ. and Hong Kong Univ., (then connected
   to other sites in beijing/China), it's been operating since two years
   ago.

3) The link between Qinghua Univ. and Uinv. of British Columbia, Canada,
   it's established in 1989 using X.25 protocol.

Since there have been too many info discussions on the network, I really
do not bother to keep/collect those info, because there is NO
significant change in terms of free-of-charge connection TO CHINA,
though there are big changes on the network INSIDE China.

A guy on SCC (Scott Horne :-) claimed that he had communication with
someone in Beijing via a link in Japan, but NO ONE but himself can
use it so far :-)  :-)  It's likely a "lie"  :-)  (Just read some
news a few weeks ago that some Japanese companies petitioned to JP
gov't to sponsor the e-link to China)

I have the gateway/path names for all of the three links and some true
e-addresses in China (Actually I belive CND-tech group has the most info
in this regard among ordinary CSS overseas :-)

But the problem is, there is NO gov't subsidized link in China (unlike
in the western countries, each internet pays about $3,000 a month to
join the Public Data Network run by gov't or some telephone like AT&T
to get a 24 hour 56K bps constant connection).  Those links to China 
are charged on international phone call basis, i.e., the receiver pays
for each bite they receive, yes, the RECEPIENT pays, not the sender,
so, according someone's experience, if you send three-line message, the
recipient in Beijing pays RM 3-5, because mailer head and handshaking
time is charged too.

Okay, that's a rough picture about what I know.  I have been exhausted
in some other network acitivities (CND and SCC :-)  :-)  If you have
any question, you can send it to      cnd-tech@bronze.ucs.indiana.edu
some bright heads may be able to answer if they have time.

Cheers!

Bo Xiong
On CND working account

From yawei@silver.ucs.indiana.edu Mon Nov 25 00:10:01 1991
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Date: Mon, 25 Nov 1991 00:05:34 -0500
From: Bo Xiong <yawei@silver.ucs.indiana.edu>
To: aeicnet@wam.umd.edu, ghuang@risky.ecs.umass.edu
Subject: Re:  E-mail Network Establishment in China--input needed
Cc: rzhu@watmath.waterloo.edu, xuan@hpnmdla.sr.hp.com, yjj@ctr.columbia.edu
Status: RO

OK, I forgot to mention some more e-links to Chian, besides the e-mail
links (public links) I talked about in my last message, there are many
PRIVATE e-mail links to China, like AT&T, World Bank and HP Co. and
etc., but those are all private company links based on phone line too,
only authorized employees of the company have the access to it.

Bo Xiong

From CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu Mon Dec  9 01:54:54 1991
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Date:         Mon, 9 Dec 1991 14:56:13 CST
Reply-To: u7911013%CC.NCTU.EDU.TW@uga.cc.uga.edu
Sender: Chinese Computing Network <CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu>
From: u7911013%CC.NCTU.EDU.TW@uga.cc.uga.edu
Subject:      TANET(Taiwan Adecamic NETwork) <-> U.S. Internet established
Comments: To: ccnet-l@UGA.BITNET, info-nets@UGA.BITNET,
              soc-culture-taiwan@ucbvax.berkeley.edu
To: Multiple recipients of list CCNET-L <CCNET-L@UGA>
Status: RO

It may interest some of you.

TANET(Taiwan Adecamic NETwork) <-> U.S. Internet has been established
and open to all TANET users.  E-mail, Remote Login, FTP are all available,
and at least, two anonymous FTP sites has been set up; if you are
interested, please try "moers2.edu.tw(140.111.2.22)" or "jenny.nctu.edu.tw
(140.113.250.246)".  By the way, TANET topology is available at 140.111.2.22
for anonymous FTP (/pub/tanet-info/tanet.map).

Best Regards,

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
                                   ::   :: .        :;       ,,,,,;.,,,,:.
Huang, Chih-Hsien, E.E.83        ''::'''::'''  ,,,,,;;,,,,;, ::.:., ', ,:
                                   ;:...:;          ::       ::.,.:  ,':,
E-mail:                        ,,,,,,,,,,,,,;,      ::   .   ::.:...'   ':'
 7911013@TWNCTU02.BITNET         :........;;,   '''''''''''   :.......::,
 u7911013@cc.nctu.edu.tw         ::   :   ::     :. :.        ::......::
                                 ::''':'''::    :::  ;, ';.   ::......::
National Chiao Tung Univ.        ;:...:...:;   :'::   ' : :;  ::......::
Hsinchu, Taiwan, R.O.C.         ..;''   '';,  '' ':::::::'   ..;''   '';,

From @cuvmb.cc.columbia.edu,@TWNMOE10.EDU.TW:TSENGLM@ncuee.ncu.edu.tw Sat Nov 23 00:36:30 1991
Received: from cuvmb.cc.columbia.edu by sirius.ctr.columbia.edu (5.61/5.10) with SMTP id AA10060; Sat, 23 Nov 91 00:36:18 -0500
Received: from CUVMB.COLUMBIA.EDU by CUVMB.COLUMBIA.EDU (IBM VM SMTP R1.2.1) with BSMTP id 7361; Sat, 23 Nov 91 00:35:18 EST
Received: from TWNMOE10.edu.tw by CUVMB.COLUMBIA.EDU (Mailer R2.07) with BSMTP
 id 6292; Sat, 23 Nov 91 00:35:16 EST
X-Delivery-Notice:  SMTP MAIL FROM does not correspond to sender.
Received: from TWNMOE10 (SMTP) by TWNMOE10.edu.tw (Mailer R2.07) with BSMTP id
 1637; Sat, 23 Nov 91 13:35:48 EST
Received: from ncuee.ncu.edu.tw by TWNMOE10.EDU.TW (IBM VM SMTP V2R1) with TCP;
   Sat, 23 Nov 91 13:35:47 EST
Date: Sat, 23 Nov 1991 13:32 CST
From: TSENGLM%ncuee.ncu.edu.tw@cuvmb.cc.columbia.edu
Subject: Re: Chinese SMTP e-mail PD software ?
To: yjj%ctr.columbia.edu@TWNMOE10.EDU.TW
Message-Id: <2184044F00003666@NCUEE.NCU.EDU.TW>
X-Vms-To: IN%"yjj%ctr.columbia.edu@TWNMOE10.EDU.TW"
Status: RO

Dear Mr. Yuan Jiang:
     Thanks your reply. The mail system can support chinese message directly
will let many people happy. There are so many different chinese code in
communication, except encoding/decoding 8 bits code to ASCII, a representation
of different code and conversion must be included.
     I will keep this interest in CC-NET and hope I can do some contributions.

Thanks

Li-Ming Tseng,

From CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu Tue Dec 10 11:25:56 1991
Received: from uga.cc.uga.edu by sirius.ctr.columbia.edu (5.61/5.10) with SMTP id AA03138; Tue, 10 Dec 91 11:25:40 -0500
Received: from UGA.CC.UGA.EDU by uga.cc.uga.edu (IBM VM SMTP R1.2.2MX) with BSMTP id 0363; Tue, 10 Dec 91 11:24:39 EST
Received: from UGA.BITNET by UGA.CC.UGA.EDU (Mailer R2.07) with BSMTP id 3548;
 Tue, 10 Dec 91 11:24:38 EST
Date:         Tue, 10 Dec 1991 16:03:00 GMT
Reply-To: Wind In His Hair <DANNY%LEVA.ICF.LEEDS.AC.UK%VTVM2.CC.VT.EDU@uga.cc.uga.edu>
Sender: Chinese Computing Network <CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu>
From: Wind In His Hair <DANNY%LEVA.ICF.LEEDS.AC.UK%VTVM2.CC.VT.EDU@uga.cc.uga.edu>
Subject:      Taiwan
Comments: To: CCNET-L%UGA.BITNET@VM1.NODAK.EDU
To: Multiple recipients of list CCNET-L <CCNET-L@UGA>
Status: RO

Dear all,

   Thanks again for the Taiwan email help.  Has anyone much experience in
sending large files via Bitnet ?  Can anyone tell me what the limits are
and whether there is any restriction in sending commercial information this
way ?

   The files I'm hoping to send are around a limit of 12MB in size.  Does
anyone have information regarding WHEN Taiwan will arrive on Internet ?  I've
tried to find out from here more directly but not managed so far.  Can I
assume FTP access will be available ?

   Finally, does anyone know how much it costs to establish a site on Bitnet
and also how much on Internet ?


Thankyou very much in advance,

Danny

._________________________________________________.
| Danny Cox                                       |
| +++++++++                                       |
|                                                 |
| Internet :                                      +----------------------------.
|   DANNY%LEVA.ICF.LEEDS.AC.UK@NSFNET-RELAY.AC.UK | 171 Woodhouse Lane         |
| Arpa :                                          |    Leeds                   |
|   DANNY@UK.AC.LEEDS.ICF.LEVA                    |    LS2 3AR                 |
| Bitnet :                                        |    UK                      |
|   DANNY%LEVA.ICF.LEEDS.AC.UK@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU    |    0532 334452             |
#_________________________________________________+    (010-532) 334452        |
                                                  #____________________________#

From CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu Tue Jan  7 16:17:02 1992
Received: from uga.cc.uga.edu by sirius.ctr.columbia.edu (5.61/5.10) with SMTP id AA29967; Tue, 7 Jan 92 16:16:53 -0500
Received: from UGA.CC.UGA.EDU by uga.cc.uga.edu (IBM VM SMTP R1.2.2MX) with BSMTP id 2271; Tue, 07 Jan 92 11:26:52 EST
Received: from UGA.BITNET by UGA.CC.UGA.EDU (Mailer R2.07) with BSMTP id 8084;
 Tue, 07 Jan 92 11:26:50 EST
Date:         Tue, 7 Jan 1992 17:12:14 GMT
Reply-To: Reto BANNWART <K210513%CZHRZU1A.BITNET@uga.cc.uga.edu>
Sender: Chinese Computing Network <CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu>
From: Reto BANNWART <K210513%CZHRZU1A.BITNET@uga.cc.uga.edu>
Subject:      Access to Taiwan
To: Multiple recipients of list CCNET-L <CCNET-L@UGA>
Status: RO

Help!

I tried to subscribe the TWUNIV-L at TWNMOE10 on Taiwan.
But I got only the message

"Your node is outside this LISTSERV's service area.
 Your subscription request has been denied."

back. Any suggestions, what to do? Or are there any other channels to
Taiwan?

Thanks a lot in advance

TAKE IT EASY BUT TAKE IT              RETO
Reto C. Bannwart  K210513@czhrzu1a  (Zurich University/Switzerland)

From CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu Wed Jan  8 05:25:02 1992
Received: from uga.cc.uga.edu by sirius.ctr.columbia.edu (5.61/5.10) with SMTP id AA04722; Wed, 8 Jan 92 05:24:49 -0500
Received: from UGA.CC.UGA.EDU by uga.cc.uga.edu (IBM VM SMTP R1.2.2MX) with BSMTP id 8635; Wed, 08 Jan 92 05:03:06 EST
Received: from UGA.BITNET by UGA.CC.UGA.EDU (Mailer R2.07) with BSMTP id 2520;
 Wed, 08 Jan 92 05:03:05 EST
Date:         Wed, 8 Jan 1992 18:09:17 CST
Reply-To: u7911013%CC.NCTU.EDU.TW@uga.cc.uga.edu
Sender: Chinese Computing Network <CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu>
From: u7911013%CC.NCTU.EDU.TW@uga.cc.uga.edu
Subject:      RE: Access to Taiwan
Comments: To: ccnet-l@uga.uga.edu
To: Multiple recipients of list CCNET-L <CCNET-L@UGA>
Status: RO

>
> I tried to subscribe the TWUNIV-L at TWNMOE10 on Taiwan.
> But I got only the message
>
> "Your node is outside this LISTSERV's service area.
>  Your subscription request has been denied."
>

You have no choice.  TWUNIV-L at TWNMOE10 does not serve
people in Europe.

Several months ago, a friend of mine in Germany also complain
about the same peoblem.  At that time, I wrote an e-mail to
the list owner; however, he didn't give me any reply.

Regards,

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
                                   ::   :: .        :;       ,,,,,;.,,,,:.
Huang, Chih-Hsien, E.E.83        ''::'''::'''  ,,,,,;;,,,,;, ::.:., ', ,:
                                   ;:...:;          ::       ::.,.:  ,':,
E-mail:                        ,,,,,,,,,,,,,;,      ::   .   ::.:...'   ':'
 7911013@TWNCTU02.BITNET         :........;;,   '''''''''''   :.......::,
 u7911013@cc.nctu.edu.tw         ::   :   ::     :. :.        ::......::
                                 ::''':'''::    :::  ;, ';.   ::......::
National Chiao Tung Univ.        ;:...:...:;   :'::   ' : :;  ::......::
Hsinchu, Taiwan, R.O.C.         ..;''   '';,  '' ':::::::'   ..;''   '';,

From CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu Wed Jan  8 08:58:41 1992
Received: from uga.cc.uga.edu by sirius.ctr.columbia.edu (5.61/5.10) with SMTP id AA05627; Wed, 8 Jan 92 08:58:32 -0500
Received: from UGA.CC.UGA.EDU by uga.cc.uga.edu (IBM VM SMTP R1.2.2MX) with BSMTP id 9510; Wed, 08 Jan 92 08:35:19 EST
Received: from UGA.BITNET by UGA.CC.UGA.EDU (Mailer R2.07) with BSMTP id 7552;
 Wed, 08 Jan 92 08:35:18 EST
Date:         Wed, 8 Jan 1992 21:33:00 CST
Reply-To: T341727%TWNCU865.BITNET@uga.cc.uga.edu
Sender: Chinese Computing Network <CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu>
From: T341727%TWNCU865.BITNET@uga.cc.uga.edu
Subject:      Re: Access to Taiwan
To: Multiple recipients of list CCNET-L <CCNET-L@UGA>
Status: RO

>> I tried to subscribe the TWUNIV-L at TWNMOE10 on Taiwan.
>> But I got only the message
>>
>> "Your node is outside this LISTSERV's service area.
>>  Your subscription request has been denied."
>>
>
>You have no choice.  TWUNIV-L at TWNMOE10 does not serve
>people in Europe.
>
>Several months ago, a friend of mine in Germany also complain
>about the same peoblem.  At that time, I wrote an e-mail to
>the list owner; however, he didn't give me any reply.
>
>Regards,
>
>----------------------------------------------------------------------------
>                                   ::   :: .        :;       ,,,,,;.,,,,:.
>Huang, Chih-Hsien, E.E.83        ''::'''::'''  ,,,,,;;,,,,;, ::.:., ', ,:
>                                   ;:...:;          ::       ::.,.:  ,':,
>E-mail:                        ,,,,,,,,,,,,,;,      ::   .   ::.:...'   ':'
> 7911013@TWNCTU02.BITNET         :........;;,   '''''''''''   :.......::,
> u7911013@cc.nctu.edu.tw         ::   :   ::     :. :.        ::......::
>                                 ::''':'''::    :::  ;, ';.   ::......::
>National Chiao Tung Univ.        ;:...:...:;   :'::   ' : :;  ::......::
>Hsinchu, Taiwan, R.O.C.         ..;''   '';,  '' ':::::::'   ..;''   '';,
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Today, the world is small and all related. The network manager is Associate
Director Wen-Shen Chen of TWNMOE10.
     I will forward these two mail to him, at least, there must be some
reason. It may be the wrong setting in initial installation.
     Welcome to join Taiwan 's listservice in NETWORK.

Li-Ming Tseng,  t341727@twncu865.bitnet

From CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu Thu Jan  9 15:53:55 1992
Received: from uga.cc.uga.edu by sirius.ctr.columbia.edu (5.61/5.10) with SMTP id AA24629; Thu, 9 Jan 92 15:53:17 -0500
Received: from UGA.CC.UGA.EDU by uga.cc.uga.edu (IBM VM SMTP R1.2.2MX) with BSMTP id 7176; Thu, 09 Jan 92 15:51:57 EST
Received: from UGA.BITNET by UGA.CC.UGA.EDU (Mailer R2.07) with BSMTP id 3624;
 Thu, 09 Jan 92 15:51:56 EST
Date:         Thu, 9 Jan 1992 14:50:37 CST
Reply-To: Maoee Tsen <tsen%CHEMSUN.CHEM.UMN.EDU@uga.cc.uga.edu>
Sender: Chinese Computing Network <CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu>
From: Maoee Tsen <tsen%CHEMSUN.CHEM.UMN.EDU@uga.cc.uga.edu>
Subject:      TWUNIV-L not served for US area?
Comments: To: ccnet-l@uga.cc.uga.edu
To: Multiple recipients of list CCNET-L <CCNET-L@UGA>
Status: RO

	Greetings, netters,
	a whiles ago, some netters posted that TWUNIV-L is not
	serving Europe area, does it serve for US area?
	anyone get a luck at USA?

> From LISTSERV@TWNMOE10.BITNET Thu Jan  9 14:44:01 1992
> Date: Fri, 10 Jan 1992 04:44:20 -0500
> From: Revised List Processor <LISTSERV@TWNMOE10.BITNET>
> Subject: Output of your job "tsen"
> To: Maoee Tsen <tsen@chemsun>
> Message-Id: <B9E54827833F003258@vx.acs.umn.edu>
> X-Envelope-To: tsen@CHEMSUN.CHEM.UMN.EDU
>
> > SUB TWUNIV-L Maoee Tsen
> Your node is outside this LISTSERV's service area. Your subscription request
> has been denied.
>
>

From CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu Sun Jan 12 23:34:47 1992
Received: from uga.cc.uga.edu by sirius.ctr.columbia.edu (5.61/5.10) with SMTP id AA00995; Sun, 12 Jan 92 23:34:33 -0500
Received: from UGA.CC.UGA.EDU by uga.cc.uga.edu (IBM VM SMTP R1.2.2MX) with BSMTP id 2997; Sun, 12 Jan 92 23:33:35 EST
Received: from UGA.BITNET by UGA.CC.UGA.EDU (Mailer R2.07) with BSMTP id 4090;
 Sun, 12 Jan 92 23:33:34 EST
Date:         Sun, 12 Jan 1992 22:35:11 -0600
Reply-To: wangsh%MHD1.MOORHEAD.MSUS.EDU@uga.cc.uga.edu
Sender: Chinese Computing Network <CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu>
From: wangsh%MHD1.MOORHEAD.MSUS.EDU@uga.cc.uga.edu
Subject:      SUBscribe TWUNIV-L
Comments: To: ccnet-l@uga.cc.uga.edu
To: Multiple recipients of list CCNET-L <CCNET-L@UGA>
Status: RO

     Some netters have problem subscribing TWUNIV-L, here is the reply
from TWNMOE10:

  > Because the traffic of bitnet between TWNMOE10 and JPNSUT00 is vary
  > large before. So listserv at twnmoe10 only serve taiwan area.
  > But we have removed the limit of service area now. So everyone can
  > subscribe TWUNIV-L now.

-Eric Wang
wangsh@mhd1.moorhead.msus.edu

From CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu Wed Jan 15 04:49:55 1992
Received: from uga.cc.uga.edu by sirius.ctr.columbia.edu (5.61/5.10) with SMTP id AA17346; Wed, 15 Jan 92 04:49:38 -0500
Received: from UGA.CC.UGA.EDU by uga.cc.uga.edu (IBM VM SMTP R1.2.2MX) with BSMTP id 0734; Wed, 15 Jan 92 04:48:45 EST
Received: from UGA.BITNET by UGA.CC.UGA.EDU (Mailer R2.07) with BSMTP id 9982;
 Wed, 15 Jan 92 04:48:43 EST
Date:         Wed, 15 Jan 1992 10:39:51 MEZ
Reply-To: Hartmut Bohn <bohn%UTRURT.UUCP@uga.cc.uga.edu>
Sender: Chinese Computing Network <CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu>
From: Hartmut Bohn <bohn%UTRURT.UUCP@uga.cc.uga.edu>
Subject:      Re: ccnet.faq.1.0.4
To: Multiple recipients of list CCNET-L <CCNET-L@UGA>
In-Reply-To:  <9201140148.AA07428@rutgers.edu>; from "Tony Lim" at Jan 14,
              92 12:08 pm
Status: RO

> 7)  Are there any other China/Chinese related interest groups?  How can I
>     subscribe it?


Some of the information in my list of November 14th 1991 was incorrect
and some information has been missing. Guan Weihe of CND was so kind
to correct the errors and supply some of the missing information.
So, here is an update:


CHINA RELATED MAILING LISTS  as of November 19th 1991
=====================================================

CCMAN-L
-------
Purpose:      An electronic magazine published weekly in
	      the Chinese language. Viewing software is provided
	      for a wide variety of terminals.
Location:     USA (University of Georgia)
Moderated:    Yes, published by CND
Subscription: "SUB CCMAN-L <Your Full Name>" to server
Addresses:    1. List:          CCMAN-L@UGA.BITNET
			    or: CCMAN-L@UGA.CC.UGA.EDU
	      2. Server:        LISTSERV@UGA.BITNET
			    or: LISTSERV@UGA.CC.UGA.EDU
	      3. Organised by:  CND
	      4. Moderator:     CND-CM@BRONZE.UCS.INDIANA.EDU

CCNET (Chinese Computing Network)
---------------------------------
Purpose:      The Chinese Computing Network is a computer network
	      forum on technologies relating to the use of
	      Chinese on computers.
Location:     USA (New York)
Moderated:    No
Subscription: "SUB CCNET-L <Your full name>" to server
Addresses:    1. List:          CCNET-L@UGA.BITNET
			   or:  CCNET-L@UGA.UGA.EDU
	      2. Server:        LISTSERV@UGA.BITNET
			   or:  LISTSERV@UGA.UGA.EDU
	      3. Organised by:  INR@UGA.BITNET (Weihe Guan)

CHINA
-----
Purpose:      Discussions on topics related to
	      Chinese Studies
Location:     USA (Princeton University)
Moderated:    Yes
Subscription: 1. "SUB CHINA <Your full name>" to server
	      2. The moderator sends the list guidelines
	      3. send acknowledgement to moderator
Addresses:    1. List:           CHINA@PUCC.PRINCETON.EDU
	      2. Server:         LISTSERV@PUCC.PRINCETON.EDU
	      3. Organised by:   q4356@PUCC.PRINCETON.EDU *
	      4. Moderator:      q4356@PUCC.PRINCETON.EDU
		 * Tom Nimick and David C. Wright

CHINA-NT (China Net)
--------------------
Purpose:      For IFCSS (Independent Federation of Chinese
	      Students and Scholars)
Location:     USA (University of Georgia)
Moderated:    Currently no
Subscription: "SUB CHINA-NT <Your Full Name>" to server
Addresses:    1. List:          CHINA-NT@UGA.BITNET
	      2. Server:        LISTSERV@UGA.BITNET
	      3. Organised by:  China-Net Management Comittee (CNMC)
	      4. Moderator:     net-cord@lab.ultra.nyu.edu (CNMC)

CHINANET
--------
Purpose:      Networking in China
Location:     USA (Texas A&M University)
Moderated:    No
Subscription: "SUB CHINANET <Your Full Name>" to server
Addresses:    1. List:          CHINANET@TAMVM1.BITNET
	      2. Server:        LISTSERV@TAMVM1.BITNET
	      3. Organised by:  X040BK@TAMVM1.BITNET (Butch Kemper)

CHPOEM
------
Purpose:      Exchange and discuss your favourite Chinese poems
	      - classical or modern.
Location:     USA (State University of New York at Buffalo)
Moderated:    No
Subscription: "SUB CHPOEM-L <Your full name>" to server
Addresses:    List:      CHPOEM-L@UBVM.BITNET
	      Server:    LISTSERV@UBVM.BITNET
	      Listowner: xiaofei@acsu.buffalo.edu  (Wang Xiaofei)

CND Canada
----------
Purpose:      Relay CND-Global for Canadian Readers, and
	      local news for and about Chinese in Canada
Location:     Canada (University of Victoria)
Moderated:    Yes
Subscription: "SUB CNC-L <Your Full Name>" to server
Addresses:    1. List:          CNC-L@UVVM.BITNET
	      2. Server:        LISTSERV@UVVM.BITNET
	      3. Organised by:  CND
	      4. Moderator:     CND-CANADA@BRONZE.UCS.INDIANA.EDU

CND-EP
------
Purpose:      China News Digest - European/Pacific Branch
Location:     USA (Indiana University)
Moderated:    Yes
Subscription: "SUB CND-EP <Your Full Name>" to server
Addresses:    1. List:          CND-EP@IUBVM.BITNET
	      2. Server:        LISTSERV@IUBVM.BITNET
	      3. Organised by:  CND
	      4. Moderator:     CND-EP@BRONZE.UCS.INDIANA.EDU

CND-Global (China News Digest - Global)
----------------------------------------
Purpose:      Provides daily news digest about what is
	      happening in China.
Location:     USA (Arizona State University)
Moderated:    Yes
Subscription: "SUB CHINA-NN <Your Full Name>" to server
Addresses:    1. List:          CHINA-NN@ASUACAD.BITNET
	      2. Server:        LISTSERV@ASUACAD.BITNET
	      3. Organised by:  CND
	      4. Moderator:     CND-EDITOR@BRONZE.UCS.INDIANA.EDU

CND-US (China News Digest - US)
-------------------------------
Purpose:      News and information for and about Chinese
	      students and scholars in the US
Location:     USA (Kent State University)
Moderated:    Yes
Subscription: "SUB CHINA-ND <Your Full Name>" to server
Addresses:    1. List:          CHINA-ND@KENTVM.BITNET
	      2. Server:        LISTSERV@KENTVM.BITNET
	      3. Organised by:  CND
	      4. Moderator:     CND-US@BRONZE.UCS.INDIANA.EDU

EMEDCH-L
--------
Purpose:      Discussions on Early Medieval China
Location:     USA (University of Southern California)
Moderated:    No
Subscription: "SUB EMEDCH-L <Your Full Name>" to server
Addresses:    1. List:          EMEDCH-L@USCVM.BITNET
	      2. Server:        LISTSERV@USCVM.BITNET
	      3. Organised by:  Ken Klein

TWUNIV-L
--------
Purpose:      Chinese Scholars and Students Discussion List.
	      Discussion on scholarly topics. No politics!
Location:     Taiwan (Ministry of Education)
Moderated:    No
Subscription: "SUB TWUNIV-L <Your Full Name>" to server
Addresses:    1. List:          TWUNIV-L@TWNMOE10.BITNET
	      2. Server:        LISTSERV@TWNMOE10.BITNET
	      3. Owner:         NCUS002@TWNMOE10.BITNET

ZHONGWEN
--------
Purpose:      Information and discussions on "Chinese Computing"
	      with special attention to Europe.
	      Also maintains a ftp archive for Chinese related
	      software.
Location:     Sweden (Royal Institute of Technology)
Moderated:    No
Subscription: E-mail to server (in natural language :-)
Addresses:    1. List:          zhongwen@NADA.KTH.SE
	      2. Server:        zhongwen-request@nada.kth.se
	      3. Organised by:  mrfung@NADA.KTH.SE (Lars E. Frederiksson)
				paf@NADA.KTH.SE (Patrik Faltstrom)
	      4. FTP archive:   ftp.kth.se <130.237.72.201>
				directory: CJK

NIHONGO (Japanese Language Discussion List)
-------------------------------------------
Purpose:      Discussions on all aspects of the Japanese
	      language
Location:     USA (MIT)
Moderated:    no
Subscription: "SUB NIHONGO <Your Full Name>" to server
Addresses:    1. List:          NIHONGO@MITVMA.MIT.EDU
	      2. Server:        LISTSERV@MITVMA.MIT.EDU
	      3. Organised by:  STRAZ-SUPPORT@CS.MEDIA-LAB.MEDIA.MIT.EDU
				(Steve Strassman)

_________________________________________________________
Thanks to Weihe Guan who corrected errors and supplied
missing information about the CND lists!
_________________________________________________ H. Bohn

--
Hartmut Bohn       ,'|_____,    /   ---,  |  Computerlinguistik / Sinologie
Klemensstr. 13    /| |  |  |  -/--- __/_  |        Universitaet Trier
5500 Trier Ruwer   |  / | \    \ /   |    |               Email:
Germany            |   \|      /\   \/    o          bohn@utrurt.uucp

      [Email: also try bohn%utrurt@unido.informatik.uni-dortmund.de]

From CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu Wed Jan 15 18:34:00 1992
Received: from uga.cc.uga.edu by sirius.ctr.columbia.edu (5.61/5.10) with SMTP id AA23288; Wed, 15 Jan 92 18:33:20 -0500
Received: from UGA.CC.UGA.EDU by uga.cc.uga.edu (IBM VM SMTP R1.2.2MX) with BSMTP id 5503; Wed, 15 Jan 92 18:32:06 EST
Received: from UGA.BITNET by UGA.CC.UGA.EDU (Mailer R2.07) with BSMTP id 6825;
 Wed, 15 Jan 92 18:32:04 EST
Date:         Wed, 15 Jan 1992 18:31:44 -0500
Reply-To: Boon Kang <BOONKANG%BCSC02.BITNET@uga.cc.uga.edu>
Sender: Chinese Computing Network <CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu>
From: Boon Kang <BOONKANG%BCSC02.BITNET@uga.cc.uga.edu>
Subject:      Re: ccnet.faq.1.0.4
To: Multiple recipients of list CCNET-L <CCNET-L@UGA>
Status: RO

 *** Reply to note of 01/15/92 01:49

  How about SCC-L as posted by Huang, Chih-Hsien recently ?
  (it is not included in your list).

 Regards,                          VM/PROFS: BOONKANG
 Boon Kang, IMS Support, HTS
 4000 Seymour Pl, W169BLUE         Phone:    604 389-3991
 Victoria, B.C. V8X 4S8            Fax:      604 389-3916

From CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu Thu Jan 16 09:10:38 1992
Received: from uga.cc.uga.edu by sirius.ctr.columbia.edu (5.61/5.10) with SMTP id AA28433; Thu, 16 Jan 92 09:10:23 -0500
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Received: from UGA.BITNET by UGA.CC.UGA.EDU (Mailer R2.07) with BSMTP id 9865;
 Thu, 16 Jan 92 08:48:22 EST
Date:         Thu, 16 Jan 1992 13:42:16 MEZ
Reply-To: Hartmut Bohn <bohn%UTRURT.UUCP@uga.cc.uga.edu>
Sender: Chinese Computing Network <CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu>
From: Hartmut Bohn <bohn%UTRURT.UUCP@uga.cc.uga.edu>
Subject:      Re: ccnet.faq - SCC-L list
To: Multiple recipients of list CCNET-L <CCNET-L@UGA>
In-Reply-To:  <9201160217.AA23347@rutgers.edu>; from "Boon Kang" at Jan 15,
              92 6:31 pm
Status: RO

*
*  *** Reply to note of 01/15/92 01:49
*
*   How about SCC-L as posted by Huang, Chih-Hsien recently ?
*   (it is not included in your list).
*
*  Regards,                          VM/PROFS: BOONKANG
*  Boon Kang, IMS Support, HTS
*  4000 Seymour Pl, W169BLUE         Phone:    604 389-3991
*  Victoria, B.C. V8X 4S8            Fax:      604 389-3916


I originally had the SCC-L list included in my China/Chinese mailing
lists collection, but after trying several times to subscribe with no
result I dropped it. If anybody has more information about this list
or any other China/Chinese related mailing lists not included in my
list, please let me know!

Hartmut

--
Hartmut Bohn       ,'|_____,    /   ---,  |  Computerlinguistik / Sinologie
Klemensstr. 13    /| |  |  |  -/--- __/_  |        Universitaet Trier
5500 Trier Ruwer   |  / | \    \ /   |    |               Email:
Germany            |   \|      /\   \/    o          bohn@utrurt.uucp

      [Email: also try bohn%utrurt@unido.informatik.uni-dortmund.de]

From CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu Thu Jan 16 17:08:07 1992
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Date:         Thu, 16 Jan 1992 16:52:01 EST
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Sender: Chinese Computing Network <CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu>
Comments:     <Parser> E: Mail origin cannot be determined.
Comments:     <Parser> E: Original tag was -> FROM: Simon Yeh <csf!syeh>
From: Undetermined origin c/o Postmaster <POSTMASTER@uga.cc.uga.edu>
Subject:      Re: ccnet.faq - SCC-L list
Comments: To: CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu
To: Multiple recipients of list CCNET-L <CCNET-L@UGA>
Status: RO

Hartmut wrote,
>*
>*   How about SCC-L as posted by Huang, Chih-Hsien recently ?
>*   (it is not included in your list).
>*
>*  Regards,                          VM/PROFS: BOONKANG
>*  Boon Kang, IMS Support, HTS
>*  4000 Seymour Pl, W169BLUE         Phone:    604 389-3991
>*  Victoria, B.C. V8X 4S8            Fax:      604 389-3916
>
>
>I originally had the SCC-L list included in my China/Chinese mailing
>lists collection, but after trying several times to subscribe with no
>result I dropped it. If anybody has more information about this list
>or any other China/Chinese related mailing lists not included in my
>list, please let me know!

SCC-L has already ceased to exist since April 13, 1991. So is the
[ex-]SCT redistribution list. Once in a while, you hear (that is,
read) distant voice in searching for these ancient, ghostly mailing
lists from the fringes of the Usenet Galaxy. But none of these cries
have ever been decently answered, those intense political [sic]
infighting makes the majority of SCC/SCT dwellers/bystanders uninspired
and alienated. Redistribute them? Who cares?


--- Simon                                  inet: csf!syeh@bcr.cc.bellcore.com
                                                 (or syeh@caip.rutgers.edu)
      .&______~*@*~______&.       m        uucp: ...!bellcore!bcr!csf!syeh
    "w/%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%\w"    mmm***
      `Y""Y""Y"""""Y""Y""Y'      mm*****   "One day our civilization,
   p-p_|__|__|_____|__|__|_q-q   mm**Y**    sublimation or vanity,
_-[EEEEM==M==MM===MM==M==MEEEE]-_.|..|....  will be over."  -- Zhang Ailing

From CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu Sun Feb  2 22:45:43 1992
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Date:         Mon, 3 Feb 1992 11:37:10 +0800
Reply-To: Huang Chih-Hsien <u7911013@DEBBIE.CC.NCTU.EDU.TW>
Sender: Chinese Computing Network <CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu>
From: Huang Chih-Hsien <u7911013@DEBBIE.CC.NCTU.EDU.TW>
Subject:      a new Taiwan-local-news source from Taiwan - need your support
Comments: To: ccnet-l@uga.cc.uga.edu, infonets@uga.cc.uga.edu,
              soc-culture-china@ucbvax.berkeley.edu,
              soc-culture-hongkong@ucbvax.berkeley.edu,
              soc-culture-taiwan@ucbvax.berkeley.edu
To: Multiple recipients of list CCNET-L <CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu>
Status: RO

Dear netters:

(For cross-posting, I apologize first.)

As Taiwan netters occupied 80% capacity of Asia BITNET link (including
Japan, Korea, Taiwan), some people complained that Taiwan netters could
not offer anything but knew how to make use of resources which were
offered by someone else.

Actually, before, the 9.6K BITNET lease line was the only connection;
however, now we can and would like to offer something since another 64K
Internet lease line is established recently.  In fact, NCTU Library
is very much interested in my project on providing a Taiwan-local-news
source, an instant accurate service for those who are concerned about
things taking place in Taiwan, as a reader of Taiwan-local daily
newspapers.

Therefore, in order to get further support and implement the project,
I guess I should make sure of one thing: "how many people would like
to be a reader?"  Will you be a reader?  If YES is your answer, I hope
you could kindly drop me a note.  Thanks a lot.

Happy Chinese New Year,

#---------------------------------------------------------------------#
| Huang, Chih-Hsien            ::   :: .       :;      ,,,,,;.,,,,:.  |
| E.E.83 (Sophomore)         ''::'''::''' ,,,,,;;,,,,;,::.:., ', ,:   |
|                              ;:...:;         ::      ::.,.:  ,':,   |
| E-mail:                  ,,,,,,,,,,,,,;,     ::   .  ::.:...'   ':' |
|                            :........;;,  '''''''''''  :.......::,   |
| u7911013@cc.nctu.edu.tw    ::   :   ::    :. :.       ::......::    |
|                            ::''':'''::   :::  ;, ';.  ::......::    |
| National Chiao Tung Univ.  ;:...:...:;  :'::   ' : :; ::......::    |
| Hsinchu, Taiwan, R.O.C.   ..;''   '';, '' ':::::::'  ..;''   '';,   |
#---------------------------------------------------------------------#

From CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu Sun Feb  9 00:22:45 1992
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Date:         Sun, 9 Feb 1992 00:07:35 EST
Reply-To: yih@BRL.MIL
Sender: Chinese Computing Network <CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu>
Comments:     Resent-From: yih@BRL.MIL
Comments:     Originally-From: Randall Atkinson <atkinson@itd.nrl.navy.mil>
From: yih@BRL.MIL
Subject:      Use of Mnemonic in EUnet and NorduNet
Comments: To: ccnet-l@uga.cc.uga.edu
Comments: cc: net-char@sra.co.jp
To: Multiple recipients of list CCNET-L <CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu>
Status: RO

  I have consulted technical sources within EUnet about precisely who
has installed Keld's software and what it does.  The information was
enlightening to say the least.

  His software is being installed because it provides an 8-bit clean
SMTP implementation.  That is their only interest in it -- as a
mechanism to transport ISO-8859-X cleanly between their backbone
sites.  (EUnet has mostly a hub and spoke topology within each country
and one backbone hub site per country.)  The EUnet folks I talked to
were all very firmly of the mind that 8-bit SMTP was essential and that
their users all felt it was essential.

  There apparently is agreement by most of the hub site administrators
to implement Keld's software ("patches to sendmail/SMTP" to quote one
note) soon but many have not yet done so.  The patches have reportedly
been made available to Paul Pomes of UIUC for inclusion in the version
of sendmail that he maintains.

  There were no statements in support of using Mnemonic for anything.
All of the comments were about Keld's wonderful 8-bit clean SMTP mods.

  On another note, I heard from someone in the Nordunet Engineering
Task Force (NETF) who indicated that Mnemonic was originally put in a
draft of their mail document mainly because Keld had claimed that
other organisations were in favor of using it and had committed to it.
When a NETF member investigated, that person was unable to
substantiate the claims made and I'm told that Mnemonic has now been
removed from the NETF document.  I have not heard this from anyone who
is an NETF officer but I do consider the source reliable for my own
part.

  I infer that the IAB and IESG have not heard formally from either
EUnet or Nordunet in support of Mnemonic since none of the Chairs of
these working groups have reported same to any of the lists.  There
were formal requests for support of ISO-8859-1 and 8-bit SMTP that
reportedly were received some time back.

  My fax number is +1 (202) 404-7942; please mark faxes to my
attention as it is a shared fax machine.  My snail mail address is
below.  If anyone has an official document from either EUnet or
NorduNet that is recent and on official stationary that documents
these official endorsements of Mnemonic, feel free to fax them to me.
Rest assured that I will telephone and fax back to the persons
responsible in those organisations for confirmation of the current
facts before reporting on any such faxed documents to any of these
lists.  If I don't receive anything, I will assume that the claims
that support for Mnemonic is officially requested of the IETF aren't
correct at the present time.

Ran
atkinson@itd.nrl.navy.mil

Randall Atkinson
Mail Code 5544
Naval Research Laboratory
Washington, DC 20375-5000 USA

From CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu Sun Feb  9 00:24:52 1992
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Date:         Sun, 9 Feb 1992 00:07:37 EST
Reply-To: yih@BRL.MIL
Sender: Chinese Computing Network <CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu>
Comments:     Resent-From: yih@BRL.MIL
Comments:     Originally-From: Keld J|rn Simonsen <keld@dkuug.dk>
From: yih@BRL.MIL
Subject:      Re:  Use of Mnemonic in EUnet and NorduNet
Comments: To: ccnet-l@uga.cc.uga.edu
Comments: cc: eunet@eu.net, net-char@sra.co.jp, netf-mhs@nic.nordu.net,
              rare-char@dkuug.dk
To: Multiple recipients of list CCNET-L <CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu>
Status: RO

OK, here are exerts of the most recent EUnet bb meeting where
we talked about Mnemonics. This is exerts taken from the EUnet minutes
repository at mcsun.eu.net .

			EUnet Backbone Managers
			Minutes of Copenhagen Meeting
			16th, 17th and 18th March 1991

Attendance: (29 people)

...
5.0 Voting Points and Decisions
....
5.10	All backbones are strongly encouraged to install the
	DKnet Sendmail patches on character set handling very
	soon (if possible) when available for the most recent
	version of sendmail. Keld is strongly encouraged to get
	the patches included in the official release and write
	documentation on its use. Motion passed, 2 abstentions.
....

			Appendix A
	Report from the character sets in mail WG at the Copenhagen BB mmeeting
			Keld Simonsen

Character set issues are a growing concern in EUnet, with a lot of vendors
providing 8-bit support. Keld Simonsen has made an implementation for
sendmail+IDA 5.61, 5.64 and 5.65 covering many character sets and
characters.

The initial implementation was done in February 1990, and at Breukelen - 2
April  1990 it was decided that all Eunet backbones should run these patches
to  sendmail (if possible).

An article about this appeared in the EUUG newsletter winter 1990/91. The
patches are currently installed at the backbones DK, FR and GR. FI plans to
install the patches quite soon.

Recently there have been extensive discussion within IETF on the subject,
with an IETF meeting in St. Louis, USA 1991-03-11/15 with discussion on the
subject, and Nordunet has also discussed the subject. Nordunet has decided
to take another approach to at least the MTA - MTA communications (an
approach incorporating ideas that was also included in the DKnet scheme).
Unfortunately there seems to be no implementation of this scheme yet, and
the initial implementation would likely not include support for more than
LATIN1, which is insufficient for EUnet purposes. Nordunet will further
discuss the issues of character sets in mail 1991-03-20/22. Keld has
written a draft RFC on parts of the current DKnet scheme.

RARE is also discussing the issue, but is at this point rather late in the
issue.

The EUnet plenary proposed to have the patches included in the de facto
sendmail distribution from U. of Illinois.

Marius, Martijn, Petri, Hans Petter and Keld participated in the WG. The WG
discussed the DKnet solution and was very concerned about IBM  Codepages on
the lines, this should be avoided whenever possible. Only  standard
character sets should allowed. The WG had no conclusion to whether  to
restrict this to only 10646 (the new big standard character set) and  ASCII,
or to also allow 8859 character sets. It was agreed that when 8-bit  was use
on the line, it should be negotiated.

Iceland has the opinion that all users should be enforced to run the same
character set, both in mail and internally on all machines. Others said
that they would have great difficulties in enforcing such a policy. The
DKnet implementation supports both ways of doing things, leaving it to a
policy decision of each backbone how to do it.

The WG asked for more documentation on the actual implementation and how to
use it for configuration.

The WG decided to strongly encourage all backbones to install the DKnet
patches very soon.

FI and NO had problems with this as they are both EUnet and NORDUnet
backbones, and would like to see what NORDUnet decides. As the patches
seems to be quite inexpensive in performance penalties, they do not really
cause any harm and people were confident in just installing them.

Later comment: Keld intends to make a mail list on the subject.

Multi character set support in sendmail

The patches makes support for more character sets than ASCII available in
sendmail. About 90 7- and 8-bit character sets are supported, including the
ISO 8859 character sets, PC codepages, and Mac character set. Actually
almost all of the so-called ECMA collection of character sets is covered,
plus quite some vendor defined character sets.

The patches can be used to support local equipment with character sets other
than ASCII, and then in the transmission out of the machine, the message is
converted to ASCII, so full interoperability and  transparency is
guaranteed. It should be noted that sending out 8-bit characters on the line
in SMTP is a violation of current RFC standards and it will create quite
unintelligible messages on many systems.

The conversion to ASCII is done into a mnemonic representation so a
recipient without special software is able to read the message. This
conversion is fully reversible without information loss, so if the receiver
has sufficient software and hardware, the message can be displayed in the
right way.

A conversion program 'conv' usable as a filter, e.g. together with a pager
in a mailer, is also available, providing for easy rudimentary support when
the hardware is available for the recipient.

When mutual agreement has been achieved between two communicating systems,
these patches can also be used to transmit 8-bit character sets. This is
useful for instance between UUCP sites, or with sites that just send 8-bit
mail out over SMTP.

Installation of character set support patches to sendmail

The patches have been used for sendmail 5.61, 5.64 and 5.65. They will most
likely also work on later sendmail versions.

IDA patches are required.

The sendmail patches requires prior installation of the character set
conversion package. This currently consist of two shar files: ch.shar01 and
ch.shar02. Create a source directory for these and unshar, make and make
install the shar files. Default installation is in /usr/lib/char, /usr/lib
and /usr/include, so you need sufficient privileges for these catalogues.
The 'conv' program is not installed anywhere, but could be copied to
/usr/local/bin or similar places for public access.

Then apply the sendmail patches to the source of sendmail, and remake and
reinstall sendmail.

Configuration

In the ida/cf/Sendmail.mc file you should define the local mailer to use the
internal character set of your machine. If this is e.g. ISO 8859-1 (LATIN1)
it could be done by:

Mlocal,	P=/bin/mail, F=DFMSlmnrs,	A=mail -d $u, C=LATIN1, X=29

Valid character set names, and what encoding they cover, is specified in the
character set conversion package in the file CHARSETS. The character set is
specified with the "C=" option on the Mailer specification. Case is not
significant.

Another parameter is the compose character, which is used to specify
out-of-band characters. This can be "&" or a control character, for instance
ASCII decimal 29, which has the advantage of being invisible in 'more' and
'page' pagers (but not in 'less'). The compose character is given by the
option "X=" and then the decimal ASCII (or other character set) value.

If you have special arrangements for instance with UUCP or SMTP sites
hooking up to you, you should provide mailers for these in the Sendmail.mc
file, like:

MUUCP, P=/usr/bin/uux, F=CDFMUVSpu, S=19, R=19, A=uux - -z -r $h!rmail ($u
 ),C=ASCII,X=29
MUUCP-L1, P=/usr/bin/uux, F=CDFMUSpu, S=19/0, R=19/0, A=uux - -z -r $h!rmail
 ($u),C=latin1,
X=29
MUUCP-850, P=/usr/bin/uux, F=CDFMUSpu, S=19/0, R=19/0, A=uux - -z -r $h!rmail
 ($u),C=CP850,
X=29

MTCP,   P=[IPC], F=CDFMXhnmpu, E=\r\n, A=IPC $h,C=ASCII,X=29
MTCP-L1, P=[IPC], F=CDFMXhnmpu, E=\r\n, A=IPC $h,C=LATIN1,X=29
MTCP-850, P=[IPC], F=CDFMXhnmpu, E=\r\n, A=IPC $h,C=CP850,X=29

Then in the /usr/lib/mail/mailertable for the separate sites declare the
appropriate mailer for the site.

Modifications to IDA sendmail consists of:

1. New mailer definitions: C for character set, and X for escape char in
decimal. Appropriate changes to headers.c and sendmail.h .

2. in collect.c the appropriate mailer for the incoming mail is found and if
the header "X-Charset" or "X-Char-Esc" is found, these are used instead. The
header is untouched. The body is converted from the found charset to Ascii,
which is the internal char set of sendmail.

3. in deliver.c  the receiving mailer is determined and the  corresponding
charset is found. This is written with two new headers, or if they exist,
the old headers are revised. Then the body of the message is converted from
Ascii to  the receiving character set.

4. A new routine findhead() has been added in headers.c to be able to  get
and modify a header.

5. The routine sfgets() in util.c has been changed to allow 8-bit data.

Keld.Simonsen@dkuug.dk 1991-03-24

From CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu Tue Feb 11 13:36:40 1992
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Date:         Wed, 12 Feb 1992 02:27:52 +0800
Reply-To: Huang Chih-Hsien <u7911013@DEBBIE.CC.NCTU.EDU.TW>
Sender: Chinese Computing Network <CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu>
From: Huang Chih-Hsien <u7911013@DEBBIE.CC.NCTU.EDU.TW>
Subject:      Survey Report of Computer Network from Taiwan
Comments: To: ccnet-l@uga.cc.uga.edu
To: Multiple recipients of list CCNET-L <CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu>
Status: RO

 =====================================
 >                                   < --------------------------------
 >  S   U   R   V   E   Y            < | THANK YOU for your responses |
 >                                   < |------------------------------|
 >            R   E   P   O   R   T  < |            I n t e r n e t : |
 >                                   < |      u7911013@cc.nctu.edu.tw |
 >  of Computer Network from Taiwan  < |                B i t n e t : |
 >                                   < |             7911013@TWNCTU02 |
 ===================================== -------------------------------|
   ------------------------------------------|       Huang, Chih-Hsien|
   |   ::   :: .       :;      ,,,,,;.,,,,:. |         EE83, sophomore|
   | ''::'''::''' ,,,,,;;,,,,;,::.:., ', ,:  |            the Dept. of|
   |   ;:...:;         ::      ::.,.:  ,':,  | Electronics Engineering|
   |,,,,,,,,,,,,;,     ::   .  ::.:...'   ':'|                National|
   | :........;;,  '''''''''''  :.......::,  |        Chiao Tung Univ.|
   | ::   :   ::    :. :.       ::......::   |      1001 Ta Hsueh Road|
   | ::''':'''::   :::  ;, ';.  ::......::   | Hsinchu, Taiwan, R.O.C.|
   | ;:...:...:;  :'::   ' : :; ::......::   |------------------------|
   |..;''   '';, '' ':::::::'  ..;''   '';,  |           February 1992|
   --------------------------------------------------------------------




 1. Abstract/Introduction

    This report is  results of  a computer  network  survey which  was
    designed to get further knowledge  on computer network development
    all over  the world  as well as  to be  well-informed of  people's
    interests in Taiwan.   311 replies,  4.5M bytes returned,  flooded
    my mailbox  within a month.   The first  one is  from  Mr. Michael
    Sargent,  Australia <sarge@cs.uq.oz.au>.   I very much  appreciate
    your responses.


 2. Respondent's Background

    2.1 Country

        [Comment]:  a. Survey returned from 38 countries,  totally 311
                       records.
                    b. Statistics    here    are    based    on   your
                       working/studying places,  instead of  where you
                       are from.

        2.1.1 Africa           ->   1 records ( 0.32%)

              # Egypt......... -    1 records ( 0.32%)

        2.1.2 Asia/Pacific     ->  32 records (10.29%)

              # Australia..... -    2 records ( 0.64%)
              # Fiji.......... -    1 records ( 0.32%)
              # Hong Kong..... -    5 records ( 1.61%)
              # India......... -    1 records ( 0.32%)
              # Israel........ -   10 records ( 3.22%)
              # Japan......... -    5 records ( 1.61%)
              # Korea......... -    1 records ( 0.32%)
              # New Zealand... -    4 records ( 1.29%)
              # Singapore..... -    1 records ( 0.32%)
              # Taiwan........ -    2 records ( 0.64%)

        2.1.3 America          -> 167 records (53.70%)

              # Argentina..... -    2 records ( 0.64%)
              # Brazil........ -   30 records ( 9.65%)
              # Canada........ -   29 records ( 9.32%)
              # Chile......... -    1 records ( 0.32%)
              # Colombia...... -    1 records ( 0.32%)
              # Mexico........ -    3 records ( 0.96%)
              # U.S.A......... -  101 records (32.48%)

        2.1.4 Europe           -> 111 records (35.69%)

              # Austria....... -    9 records ( 2.89%)
              # Belgium....... -    6 records ( 1.93%)
              # Czechoslovakia -    1 records ( 0.32%)
              # Denmark....... -    9 records ( 2.89%)
              # Finland....... -   12 records ( 3.86%)
              # France........ -   11 records ( 3.54%)
              # Germany....... -    6 records ( 1.93%)
              # Holland....... -    3 records ( 0.96%)
              # Iceland....... -    1 records ( 0.32%)
              # Ireland....... -    6 records ( 1.93%)
              # Italy......... -    4 records ( 1.29%)
              # Norway........ -   11 records ( 3.54%)
              # Poland........ -    1 records ( 0.32%)
              # Portugal...... -    1 records ( 0.32%)
              # Sbvenia....... -    1 records ( 0.32%)
              # Spain......... -    5 records ( 1.61%)
              # Sweden........ -   13 records ( 4.18%)
              # Switzerland... -    5 records ( 1.61%)
              # U.K........... -    5 records ( 1.61%)
              # Yugoslavia.... -    1 records ( 0.32%)

    2.2 Occupation

        # High School Student............. -   1 records ( 0.32%)
        # Undergraduate student........... -  23 records ( 7.40%)
        # Graduate student................ -  57 records (18.33%)
        # School teacher.................. -   3 records ( 0.96%)
        # University faculty.............. -  83 records (26.69%)
        # Programmer...................... -  29 records ( 9.32%)
        # Engineer........................ -  28 records ( 9.00%)
        # Research institute staff........ -  38 records (12.22%)
        # High-ranking staff(governmental) -   4 records ( 1.29%)
        # Employee(governmental).......... -  14 records ( 4.50%)
        # High-ranking staff(commercial).. -   3 records ( 0.96%)
        # Employee(commercial)............ -   6 records ( 1.93%)
        # Others.......................... -  22 records ( 7.07%)
        # N/A............................. -   1 records ( 0.32%)

    2.3 Special Career

        # BITNET node administrator......... -  18 records ( 5.79%)
        # Internet host system manager...... -  46 records (14.79%)
        # Other network hosts'
          SYSOP/administrator/system manager -  26 records ( 8.36%)
        # Forums/Lists/Newsgroup
          Owner/Mediator/Redistributor...... -  26 records ( 8.36%)
        # Others............................ -  38 records (12.22%)
        # None or N/A....................... - 184 records (59.16%)

    2.4 Level of Education

        # High school -  28 records ( 9.00%)
        # Bachelor... -  84 records (27.01%)
        # Master..... - 102 records (32.80%)
        # Ph.D....... -  82 records (26.37%)
        # Others..... -   7 records ( 2.25%)
        # N/A........ -   7 records ( 2.25%)

    2.5 First Major

        [Comment]:  3 responents have two first majors.

        # Electronics/Electrical Engineering -  31 records ( 9.97%)
        # Mathematics....................... -  29 records ( 9.32%)
        # Computer Science/
          Information Engineering........... -  96 records (30.87%)
        # Physics........................... -  24 records ( 7.72%)
        # Other Engineerings................ -  25 records ( 8.04%)
        # Other Sciences.................... -  36 records (11.58%)
        # Management........................ -   9 records ( 2.89%)
        # Other Business related ........... -   5 records ( 1.61%)
        # Arts/Humanities................... -  37 records (11.90%)
        # Some courses on network........... -   1 records ( 0.32%)
        # No courses on network............. -   8 records ( 2.57%)
        # N/A............................... -  13 records ( 4.18%)

    2.6 Age

        # 19-22 -  26 records ( 8.36%)
        # 23-30 - 106 records (34.08%)
        # 30-40 -  98 records (31.51%)
        # 40-50 -  67 records (21.54%)
        # 50+   -  10 records ( 3.22%)
        # N/A   -   4 records ( 1.29%)

    2.7 Gender

        # Male   - 276 records (88.75%)
        # Female -  27 records ( 8.68%)
        # N/A    -   8 records ( 2.57%)


 3. Survey Results

    3.1 Question -> You are on......

        # Applelink.. -  14 records ( 4.50%)
        # BITNET/EARN - 164 records (52.73%)
        # CompuServe. -  13 records ( 4.18%)
        # FidoNet.... -  10 records ( 3.22%)
        # Internet... - 232 records (74.60%)
        # SPAN....... -   8 records ( 2.57%)
        # THEnet..... -   3 records ( 0.96%)
        # UUCP....... -  46 records (14.79%)
        # Others..... -  23 records ( 7.40%)
        # N/A........ -   1 records ( 0.32%)

    3.2 Question -> So you can have access to......

        # E-mail Service..... - 311 records (100.00%)
        # Interactive Message - 182 records ( 58.52%)
        # Remote Login....... - 215 records ( 69.13%)
        # Anonymous FTP...... - 231 records ( 74.28%)
        # File SEND/RECEIVE.. - 198 records ( 63.67%)
        # Remote Job Transfer -  76 records ( 24.44%)
        # Others............. -  27 records (  8.68%)

    3.3 Question -> If you were a  system manager  of a new  computer,
                    and the computer  was scheduled to be on  ONLY ONE
                    of the network links showed in Question 01,  which
                    ONE would you choose??

        # Applelink.. -   6 records ( 1.93%)
        # BITNET/EARN -  38 records (12.22%)
        # CompuServe. -   2 records ( 0.64%)
        # FidoNet.... -   1 records ( 0.32%)
        # Internet... - 234 records (75.24%)
        # SPAN....... -   0 records ( 0.00%)
        # THEnet..... -   0 records ( 0.00%)
        # UUCP....... -   4 records ( 1.29%)
        # Others..... -   6 records ( 1.93%)
        # N/A........ -  20 records ( 6.43%)

    3.4 Question -> To you,  which  kind of  network  service is  most
                    important??

        # E-mail Service..... - 269 records (86.50%)
        # Interactive Message -  12 records ( 3.86%)
        # Remote Login....... -  29 records ( 9.32%)
        # Anonymous FTP...... -  56 records (18.01%)
        # File SEND/RECEIVE.. -  26 records ( 8.36%)
        # Remote Job Transfer -   1 records ( 0.32%)
        # Others............. -   7 records ( 2.25%)
        # N/A................ -   3 records ( 0.96%)

    3.5 Question -> What do you think about Internet??

        [Comment]:  For INTERNET Users ONLY

        # Stupendous.  I don't know
          how to live without it............... -  87 records (27.97%)
        # Nice.  Benefit me very much.......... - 118 records (37.94%)
        # Necessary.  Sometimes, it is useful.. -  26 records ( 8.36%)
        # So so.  At least,
          I am not disgusted by it............. -   0 records ( 0.00%)
        # Useless. I don't think it do any good -   0 records ( 0.00%)
        # N/A.................................. -  80 records (25.72%)

    3.6 Question -> What do you think about BITNET??

        [Comment]:  For BITNET Users ONLY

        # Stupendous.  I don't know
          how to live without it............... -  23 records ( 7.40%)
        # Nice.  Benefit me very much.......... -  80 records (25.72%)
        # Necessary.  Sometimes, it is useful.. -  42 records (13.50%)
        # So so.  At least,
          I am not disgusted by it............. -  18 records ( 5.79%)
        # Useless. I don't think it do any good -   3 records ( 0.96%)
        # N/A.................................. - 145 records (46.62%)

    3.7 Question -> Compare with BITNET and INTERNET, you think......

        [Comment]:  For those both on INTERNET & BITNET

        # Internet is
          much more useful than BITNET........ -  51 records (16.40%)
        # Internet is more useful than BITNET. -  42 records (13.50%)
        # BITNET is
          much more useful than Internet...... -   3 records ( 0.96%)
        # BITNET is more useful then Internet. -   3 records ( 0.96%)
        # BITNET and Internet
          both are VERY USEFUL................ -  63 records (20.26%)
        # BITNET and Internet both are USELESS -   0 records ( 0.00%)
        # N/A................................. - 149 records (47.91%)


    3.8 Question -> Continue last question, you want to be......

        [Comment]:  For those both on INTERNET & BITNET

        # on Internet only.............. -  29 records ( 9.32%)
        # on BITNET only................ -   4 records ( 1.29%)
        # both on Internet and BITNET... - 131 records (42.12%)
        # on neither Internet nor BITNET -   0 records ( 0.00%)
        # N/A........................... - 147 records (47.27%)

    3.9 Question -> Do you know Taiwan have been on BITNET since June,
                    1987??

        [Comment]:  For non-Taiwanese users

        # Yes.  I even know
          there are 19 nodes in Taiwan now.. -  16 records ( 5.14%)
        # Yes.  I learned it on net......... -  79 records (25.40%)
        # Maybe.  I heard of
          some rumors but couldn't make sure -  30 records ( 9.65%)
        # No.  I have no idea............... - 174 records (55.95%)
        # N/A............................... -  12 records ( 3.86%)

    3.10 Question -> Do you know  Taiwan will have access to  Internet
                     soon??

         [Comment]:  For non-Taiwanese users

         # Yes.  My friend
           in Taiwan told me the fact........ -   3 records ( 0.96%)
         # Yes.  I learned it on net......... -  45 records (14.47%)
         # Maybe.  I heard of
           some rumors but couldn't make sure -  10 records ( 3.22%)
         # No.  Welcome/Congratulations...... - 235 records (75.56%)
         # No.  I don't care................. -   9 records ( 2.89%)
         # N/A............................... -   9 records ( 2.89%)

    3.11 Question -> Are you  concerned about  things taking place  in
                     Taiwan??

         [Comment]:  For non-Taiwanese users

         # Yes.  I am very much concerned
           about all things in Taiwan..... -  37 records (11.90%)
         # Yes.  However, I am concerned
           about economy and industry more -  11 records ( 3.54%)
         # Sometimes.  I am concerned
           things all over the world...... - 190 records (61.09%)
         # A little.  Just curious........ -  55 records (17.68%)
         # No.  I don't care at all....... -  12 records ( 3.86%)
         # N/A............................ -   6 records ( 1.93%)

    3.12 Question -> The network I had access first was......

         # Applelink.. -   5 records ( 1.61%)
         # BITNET/EARN - 143 records (45.98%)
         # CompuServe. -  10 records ( 3.22%)
         # FidoNet.... -   4 records ( 1.29%)
         # Internet... -  82 records (26.37%)
         # SPAN....... -   2 records ( 0.64%)
         # THEnet..... -   0 records ( 0.00%)
         # UUCP....... -  34 records (10.93%)
         # Others..... -  29 records ( 9.32%)
         # N/A........ -   2 records ( 0.64%)

    3.13 Question -> Continue last question, at that time, you were..

         # not more than 12 -   3 records ( 0.96%)
         # 13-15........... -   3 records ( 0.96%)
         # 16-18........... -  15 records ( 4.82%)
         # 19-22........... -  66 records (21.22%)
         # 23-30........... -  99 records (31.83%)
         # 30-40........... -  76 records (24.44%)
         # 40-50........... -  34 records (10.93%)
         # 50+............. -   9 records ( 2.89%)
         # N/A............. -   6 records ( 1.93%)

    3.14 Question -> You have been on net for......

         # Within a year -   6 records ( 1.93%)
         # 1-3 years.... -  22 records ( 7.07%)
         # 4-5 years.... - 114 records (36.66%)
         # 6-8 years.... -  71 records (22.83%)
         # 9-12 years... -  59 records (18.97%)
         # over 12 years -  25 records ( 8.04%)
         # N/A.......... -  13 records ( 4.18%)


 4. Memo

    a. Many people asked me  where I got their addresses.  As a matter
       of fact, I REVIEWed them from BITNET/EARN  LISTSERVs.  If it is
       a breach of etiquette, please accept my apology.

    b. Special    thanks    go    to    Mr.   Kevin   Lowey,    Canada
       <LOWEY@admin1.usask.ca>  sharing your  opinions on  Bitnet  and
       Internet with us.

    c. To  Mr.   Antonio-Paulo  Ubieto,  Spain  <hismod@cc.unizar.es>:
       You asked me  things about  how to send  surveys  respectively.
       Well,  I just  wrote a simple  UNIX script  sending a  copy out
       every minute.

    d. I AM TRYING TO OFFER 'TAIWAN-NEWS' DIRECTLY TO NETTERS  WHO ARE
       INTERESTED IN.  If you have any suggestion, please let me know.

From CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu Tue Feb 11 16:17:06 1992
Received: from ugav2.cc.uga.edu by sirius.ctr.columbia.edu (5.67/5.10) with SMTP id AA19223; Tue, 11 Feb 92 16:17:04 -0500
Received: from UGA.CC.UGA.EDU by uga.cc.uga.edu (IBM VM SMTP V2R2)
   with BSMTP id 4623; Tue, 11 Feb 92 16:16:26 EST
Received: from UGA.BITNET by UGA.CC.UGA.EDU (Mailer R2.07) with BSMTP id 5147;
 Tue, 11 Feb 92 16:16:22 EST
Date:         Tue, 11 Feb 1992 15:13:00 CDT
Reply-To: PECO1805%SLU.BITNET@uga.cc.uga.edu
Sender: Chinese Computing Network <CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu>
From: PECO1805%SLU.BITNET@uga.cc.uga.edu
Subject:      Address in Macao
To: Multiple recipients of list CCNET-L <CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu>
Status: RO

Hi
I got an address of my friend in Macao(close HongKong). It is something like
*****%UEALAB%UMACMV@HKCNT. But I try many time and many form(like *****@UEALAB.
UMACMV.HKCNT), and can't reach it. Can anyone help me?
Thanks
Jian Liu

From GXU@Kentvm.Kent.edu Thu Feb 27 22:47:05 1992
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 Thu, 27 Feb 92 22:45:02 EST
Resent-Date:  Thu, 27 Feb 92 22:41:55 EST
Resent-From: "Xu, Gang" <GXU@Kentvm.Kent.edu>
Resent-To: yjj@ctr.columbia.edu, guan@athena.cs.uga.edu,
        weixin%guinness@sdsu.edu, ghuang@risky.ecs.umass.edu
X-Delivery-Notice:  SMTP MAIL FROM does not correspond to sender.
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 5823; Thu, 27 Feb 92 07:23:43 EST
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 TCP; Thu, 27 Feb 92 07:23:39 EST
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 darmstadt.gmd.de (4.1/GMDDA-MS2.0)
	id AA18780; Thu, 27 Feb 92 13:25:16 +0100
X400-Received: by /PRMD=gmd/ADMD=dbp/C=de/;
	Relayed; 27 Feb 92 13:25:13+0100
X400-Received: by /PRMD=crn/ADMD=_/C=cn/;
	Relayed; 27 Feb 92 20:17:18+0800
Date: 27 Feb 92 20:17:18+0800
From: Mo Weiguo <weiguo.mo%cnl.fudan.crn.cn@Kentvm.Kent.edu>
To: <GXU@kentvm.kent.edu>
Message-Id: <31*weiguo.mo@cnl.fudan.crn.cn>
Status: RO

Hi, CCnet service fellows:

I am going to put him into ccnet-l, the first subscriber of ccnet-l from
mainland China. I will send him a mail. If you have any questions to ask
him, you can let me know, or correspond with his directly.

                                                             Gang

cc: cnd-cord
----------------------------Original message----------------------------
Dear Mr.Xu Gang,
     reat thanks for your quick reponse and detailed guidance. I will
connect Mr.huang soon.
     Because "Information is Life", I am very glad to join "Chinese
Computing" and hope to get to know as more friends abroad as possible.
     Although fee is always a problem, I hope to keep e-mail contact
with you and other fiends. I am also very pleased that I could afford
any help to you and other friends abroad only winthin my ability.

From GXU@Kentvm.Kent.edu Fri Feb 28 01:06:14 1992
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 Fri, 28 Feb 92 01:04:18 EST
Resent-Date:  Fri, 28 Feb 92 01:03:45 EST
Resent-From: "Xu, Gang" <GXU@Kentvm.Kent.edu>
Resent-To: cnd-cord@bronze.ucs.indiana.edu, yjj@ctr.columbia.edu,
        guan@athena.cs.uga.edu, weixin%guinness@sdsu.edu,
        ghuang@risky.ecs.umass.edu
Date:         Fri, 28 Feb 92 00:42:05 EST
From: "Xu, Gang" <GXU@Kentvm.Kent.edu>
To: Mo Weiguo <weiguo.mo@cnl.fudan.crn.cn>
In-Reply-To:  Your message of 27 Feb 92 20:17:18+0800
Status: RO

My reply to the Fudan guy. FYI.
                                              Gang
----------------------------Original message----------------------------
Dear Mr. Mo:

     I am a little bit confused, I replied mail to a Prof. Wang, and then got
a mail from you. Were you the same person using different accounts?

     I have added you to the mailing list of CCNET-L(list for Chinese Computing
). If you feel that the e-mail traffic is too much for you to bear the cost
of receiving the mail, let me know and I can take you off the list. Do you have
to pay for each bytes received from USA? If so, how much you have to pay?

     Welcome to join the e-mail world! You will find many interesting
things and know a lot of more friends through it.

     If you have time, could you tell me something about e-mail network inside
China? How widely it is being used? Can you connect to other schools in the
country? Do you have to pay for using it? What do you know about the structure
and the management of the network inside China? Are there any mailing lists on
various topics for the professional people to exchange information and ideas?
Well, many of my friends are very interested in communicating with
people inside China by e-mail. The information may be very valuable to the
people here.

    Hope that we can keep in touch.

    Best Regards.


                                                           Gang

From ymj1@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu Mon Mar  2 09:37:57 1992
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	id AA15813; Mon, 2 Mar 92 09:37:49 EST
Date: Mon, 2 Mar 92 09:37:49 EST
From: Yuan M Jiang <ymj1@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu>
Message-Id: <9203021437.AA15813@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu>
To: yjj@ctr.columbia.edu
Subject: Net to China
Status: RO

>From @RICEVM1.RICE.EDU:CHINANET@TAMVM1.BITNET Fri Feb 28 13:42:41 1992
Return-Path: <@RICEVM1.RICE.EDU:CHINANET@TAMVM1.BITNET>
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	id AA07345; Fri, 28 Feb 92 13:42:36 EST
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   with BSMTP id 6892; Fri, 28 Feb 92 12:42:00 CST
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 BSMTP id 7678; Fri, 28 Feb 92 12:41:59 CST
Date:         Fri, 28 Feb 1992 13:28:04 -0500
Reply-To: be549%cleveland.Freenet.Edu@RICEVM1.RICE.EDU
Sender: "CHINANET: Networking In China" <CHINANET%TAMVM1.BITNET@RICEVM1.RICE.EDU>
From: Robin Coose <be549%CLEVELAND.FREENET.EDU@RICEVM1.RICE.EDU>
Subject:      Re:  peacenet links in China
X-To:         CHINANET%TAMVM1.BITNET@RICEVM1.RICE.EDU
To: Multiple recipients of list CHINANET <CHINANET@TAMVM1.BITNET>
Status: R

As a Chinese student from Shanghai, I know there are 2 nodes
currently working in China.  One is in the ICA(Institute of Comp-
uter Application, maybe), Beijing.  It's called CANET: Chinese
Academic Network.  I think it's connected to the internet through
a gateway in Germany;
Another one is in Shanghai, whici connects several univeristies
to the Bitnet via a gateway in France.
That's all I think workking so far.  I really doubt where can
those middle-school(high school ?) get funds to install and main-
tain the network?
Any questions, comments, discussion are welcome to be either
posted on the Chinanet or sent to me via email.
                                         Neil Wang


From ghuang@risky.ecs.umass.edu Thu Mar  5 10:42:47 1992
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Received: by risky.ecs.umass.edu (5.57/Ultrix3.0-C)
	id AA11338; Thu, 5 Mar 92 10:38:50 -0500
Date: Thu, 5 Mar 92 10:38:50 -0500
From: ghuang@risky.ecs.umass.edu (Guyang Huang)
Message-Id: <9203051538.AA11338@risky.ecs.umass.edu>
To: xuan@hpnmdla.sr.hp.com
Subject: Re:  E-mail Network Establishment in China--input needed
Cc: yjj@ctr.columbia.edu
Status: RO

Here is a mail from Fudan, Shanghai

>From: **** **<****.**@cnl.fudan.crn.cn>
<Subject: Re: Hello from Fudan Univ.
Status: R

Hi, aeic-netters:
    I'm very glad talk with you. And I want to know eagerly what service the
email network can provide. Just now I have attend some of the interest-group
such as the unix-wizard and had got news from China's digest, but because of
the reason you know well, I don't want anything concerned to politics and sex
to be sent in.
    I am in Computer Network lab, Computer Science Dept., FDU. And my major is
computer network, I am now the postmaster and sys-manager here. So I think I am
very luck to have the opportunity to use the email(in fact, my master thesis is
about e-mail).
    I know you all interested to the emails in China, now I introduce it below,
you can tell it to anyone interested in it.
    The first organization joined to the world network is Beijing Chemistry
College(?), so they named C=cn(Chemical network), but maybe they haven't email
system. Then accord to project 8711, CAEIT(Electric Scienct Institute), NCI(
Northern Computer Institute),Fudan Univ. and Jiao Tong Univ. built China
Research Network(so PRMD=crn), now there are some other institute and university
are to connect into this network. If you want to connect with them, you can 
send email to there postmaster,for example, in fudan it is postmaster@cnl.fudan.
crn.cn.  There address are:
        cc.caeit.crn.cn      (CAEIT)
	eci.crn.cn	(Eastern Computer Institute)
	nci.crn.cn	(Northern Computer Institute)
	sci.crn.cn	(Sorthern Computer Institute)
	scl.crn.cn	(Institute No. 54, in Shijiazhuang)
	ee.sjtu.crn.cn	(Jiao Tong Univ.)

    Now the emails in FDU is only used be several teachers in CNL, except the
previous president Madam Xie Xide. Her PC/XT can access her emailbox here
by modem and telephone line.

/****

From ghuang@risky.ecs.umass.edu Thu Mar  5 10:42:47 1992
Received: from risky.ecs.umass.edu by sirius.ctr.columbia.edu (5.67/5.10) with SMTP id AA24895; Thu, 5 Mar 92 10:42:26 -0500
Received: by risky.ecs.umass.edu (5.57/Ultrix3.0-C)
	id AA11338; Thu, 5 Mar 92 10:38:50 -0500
Date: Thu, 5 Mar 92 10:38:50 -0500
From: ghuang@risky.ecs.umass.edu (Guyang Huang)
Message-Id: <9203051538.AA11338@risky.ecs.umass.edu>
To: xuan@hpnmdla.sr.hp.com
Subject: Re:  E-mail Network Establishment in China--input needed
Cc: yjj@ctr.columbia.edu
Status: RO

Here is a mail from Fudan, Shanghai

>From: **** **<****.**@cnl.fudan.crn.cn>
<Subject: Re: Hello from Fudan Univ.
Status: R

Hi, aeic-netters:
    I'm very glad talk with you. And I want to know eagerly what service the
email network can provide. Just now I have attend some of the interest-group
such as the unix-wizard and had got news from China's digest, but because of
the reason you know well, I don't want anything concerned to politics and sex
to be sent in.
    I am in Computer Network lab, Computer Science Dept., FDU. And my major is
computer network, I am now the postmaster and sys-manager here. So I think I am
very luck to have the opportunity to use the email(in fact, my master thesis is
about e-mail).
    I know you all interested to the emails in China, now I introduce it below,
you can tell it to anyone interested in it.
    The first organization joined to the world network is Beijing Chemistry
College(?), so they named C=cn(Chemical network), but maybe they haven't email
system. Then accord to project 8711, CAEIT(Electric Scienct Institute), NCI(
Northern Computer Institute),Fudan Univ. and Jiao Tong Univ. built China
Research Network(so PRMD=crn), now there are some other institute and university
are to connect into this network. If you want to connect with them, you can 
send email to there postmaster,for example, in fudan it is postmaster@cnl.fudan.
crn.cn.  There address are:
        cc.caeit.crn.cn      (CAEIT)
	eci.crn.cn	(Eastern Computer Institute)
	nci.crn.cn	(Northern Computer Institute)
	sci.crn.cn	(Sorthern Computer Institute)
	scl.crn.cn	(Institute No. 54, in Shijiazhuang)
	ee.sjtu.crn.cn	(Jiao Tong Univ.)

    Now the emails in FDU is only used be several teachers in CNL, except the
previous president Madam Xie Xide. Her PC/XT can access her emailbox here
by modem and telephone line.

/****

From @cuvmb.cc.columbia.edu:CHINANET@TAMVM1.BITNET Sun Apr 12 10:25:14 1992
Return-Path: <@cuvmb.cc.columbia.edu:CHINANET@TAMVM1.BITNET>
Received: from cuvmb.cc.columbia.edu by cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (5.59/FCB)
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Reply-To: "CHINANET: Networking In China" <CHINANET%TAMVM1.BITNET@cuvmb.cc.columbia.edu>
Sender: "CHINANET: Networking In China" <CHINANET%TAMVM1.BITNET@cuvmb.cc.columbia.edu>
From: Robert Pan <io11043%MAINE.MAINE.EDU@cuvmb.cc.columbia.edu>
Subject:      Re: e-mail in HK
To: Multiple recipients of list CHINANET <CHINANET@TAMVM1.BITNET>
Status: RO

The Chinese University of Hongkong site is hp9000.csc.cuhk.hk,
at least there's an anonymous ftp site you can finger.

Robert


From CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu Fri Apr 24 17:33:51 1992
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Date:         Fri, 24 Apr 1992 18:36:51 BST
Reply-To: "Ross Paterson" <rap@DOC.IMPERIAL.AC.UK>
Sender: Chinese Computing Network <CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu>
From: "Ross Paterson" <rap@DOC.IMPERIAL.AC.UK>
Subject:      Re: SERVICE ANNOUNCE from Taiwan - tw.* newsgroups redistribution
Comments: To: CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu
To: Multiple recipients of list CCNET-L <CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu>
Status: RO

> I am curious.  What language do they use in the tw.* newsgroup.
> I suspect it's English.

It is.

If you have Internet access, you can get your newsreader to talk to their
news server (debbie.cc.nctu.edu.tw).  The manual for your newsreader
should explain how.

> What is the status with Japanese email system, the closest one to
> Chinese?  As I know there are many Kanji usenet groups.  The articles
> are coded into ASCII.

Since JIS codes Kanji as pairs of ASCII characters, it's just a matter
of escape sequences, rather than setting the eighth bit.  You just
have to make sure all the software on the path to you leaves the escape
characters alone.  The same would work for GB; BIG-5 would be a little
more complicated.
--
Ross Paterson <rap@doc.ic.ac.uk>
Department of Computing, Imperial College, London SW7

From CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu Fri Apr 24 20:42:40 1992
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Date:         Fri, 24 Apr 1992 16:19:35 -0500
Reply-To: D-P Deng <deng@AX61.BNL.GOV>
Sender: Chinese Computing Network <CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu>
From: D-P Deng <deng@AX61.BNL.GOV>
Subject:      Re: SERVICE ANNOUNCE from Taiwan - tw.* newsgroups redistribution
Comments: To: CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu
To: Multiple recipients of list CCNET-L <CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu>
In-Reply-To:  (Your message of Fri,
              24 Apr 92 11:05:53 EDT.) <9204241651.AA25777@ax61.bnl.gov>
Status: RO

>>>>> In article <9204241651.AA25777@ax61.bnl.gov>
>>>>> "Yuan" == Yuan Jiang <yjj@CTR.COLUMBIA.EDU> writes:
...
  Yuan> What is the status with Japanese email system, the closest one to
  Yuan> Chinese?  As I know there are many Kanji usenet groups.  The articles
  Yuan> are coded into ASCII.  You read them with some special software
  Yuan> (a special version of RN?).

  Yuan> Has any one given a thought on how to develop Chinese email system?

I use emacs to read mail and news. I used to combine a Chinese viewing
program to a key. So when I had messages coded in Chinese (mostly in GB), I
simply pressed that key command, the messages were piped into the viewing
program and displayed. I think the viewing program used was xhzview, since I
don't have easy access to X-terminals I've stopped reading Chinese messages
in this way.

dp

From @TWNMOE10.EDU.TW:u7911013@cc.nctu.edu.tw Sun Apr 26 07:07:33 1992
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From: u7911013@cc.nctu.edu.tw (Huang Chih-Hsien (TWNR Mediator))
Message-Id: <9204261116.AA09266@cc.nctu.edu.tw>
Subject: Re:  SERVICE ANNOUNCE from Taiwan - tw.* newsgroups redistribution
To: yjj@ctr.columbia.edu (Yuan Jiang)
Date: Sun, 26 Apr 92 19:16:14 WST
Cc: ccnet-l@uga.cc.uga.edu
In-Reply-To: <9204241505.AA01179@atlas.ctr.columbia.edu>; from "Yuan Jiang" at Apr 24, 92 11:05 am
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]
Status: RO


> You read them with some special software
> (a special version of RN?).

First, we read news via "rn", and then found "nn" will be a better one.
After weeks, someone got "nnotes" which is more friendly than "nn".
But we were not satisfied, now we use "tin", Feb. 1992 version.

> Has any one given a thought on how to develop Chinese email system?

I don't think developing a Chinese email system will be a difficult
thing, but it is not the main point.  The more important thing is
to unify the Chinese code.  Big-5 is the most popular one, but it 
is not suitable for the 7-bit world-wide e-mail system under STMP
protocol.  

Years ago, some organizations did try very hard to do such a thing, but
all failed.  I think, the main reason is that world-wide computer 
network is not popular in Taiwan.  To most people, they do not have
the chances to having access, so why should they change?  They still
prefer Big-5.  And another big reason is that ETen do not support 
this policy.  You know, ETen has a 90% of totally Chinese systems 
users, according to a survey.  In the other words, we can say 90%
users will not support this policy.

Now, it seems the only way is to make a law and force a change.  Well,
to a democratic country, I think it is the worst method, but if needed,
I will support, since it is very important thing to the future, but 
most people do not know.

-- 
    ::   :: .       :;      ,,,,,;.,,,,:.   H u a n g ,  C h i h - H s i e n
  ''::'''::''' ,,,,,;;,,,,;,::.:., ', ,:   
    ;:...:;         ::      ::.,.:  ,':,    Dept. of Electronics Engineering
,,,,,,,,,,,,,;,     ::   .  ::.:...'   ':'    National Chiao Tung University
  :........;;,  '''''''''''  :.......::,                  1001 Ta Hsueh Road
  ::   :   ::    :. :.       ::......::                 Hsinchu, Taiwan, ROC
  ::''':'''::   :::  ;, ';.  ::......::    
  ;:...:...:;  :'::   ' : :; ::......::    Internet: u7911013@cc.nctu.edu.tw
 ..;''   '';, '' ':::::::'  ..;''   '';,   BITNET  :        7911013@TWNCTU02

From S02337%FLC@VAXF.Colorado.EDU Sun Apr 26 18:26:19 1992
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Date: 27 Apr 1992 16:24:16 -0600 (MDT)
From: S02337%FLC@VAXF.Colorado.EDU
Subject: China email much on my mind -
To: yjj@ctr.columbia.edu
Message-Id: <01GJCJR1PC8I0000CO@VAXF.COLORADO.EDU>
X-Envelope-To: yjj@CTR.COLUMBIA.EDU
X-Vms-To: VAXF::IN%"yjj@CTR.COLUMBIA.EDU"
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT
Status: RO

Hi Yuan,

There is a public wireless data network in HK right now.  But thinking
about the future is exciting.  Will share ideas?

Mitch s02337@flc.colorado.edu
:)

From CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu Fri May 22 02:49:09 1992
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Date:         Fri, 22 May 1992 14:35:19 -0800
Reply-To: Shann Wei-Chang <shann@DONGPO.MATH.NCU.EDU.TW>
Sender: Chinese Computing Network <CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu>
From: Shann Wei-Chang <shann@DONGPO.MATH.NCU.EDU.TW>
Subject:      rtin in cxterm
Comments: To: CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu
To: Multiple recipients of list CCNET-L <CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu>
Status: RO

Hi,

I think many are using "rtin" or "tin" to read and post news.  If I
run rtin in a cxterm, I got the error message:

>  rtin: signal handler caught signal SIGSEGV (11).

It's a pity because we can pose Chinese characters in net news.  There
are news groups in Taiwan that many articles are written in Big5 codes.
Does anybody know how to solve it.  Or is there another news reader that
can be run in cxterm?

-Shann

From @CUVMB.CC.COLUMBIA.EDU:CHINANET@TAMVM1.BITNET Tue Jun 30 12:24:51 1992
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Reply-To: "CHINANET: Networking In China" <CHINANET%TAMVM1.BITNET@CUVMB.CC.COLUMBIA.EDU>
Sender: "CHINANET: Networking In China" <CHINANET%TAMVM1.BITNET@CUVMB.CC.COLUMBIA.EDU>
From: Pengcheng.Zhao%RUBA.RZ.RUHR-UNI-BOCHUM.DE@CUVMB.CC.COLUMBIA.EDU
Subject:      Reply to Re: your mail
X-To:         CHINANET%TAMVM1.BITNET@VM1.FernUni-Hagen.DE
To: Multiple recipients of list CHINANET <CHINANET@TAMVM1.BITNET>
Status: RO

>
>I wonder where can I get some information on  networking in main land China?
> For examples, how many mainframes are hooked up to the internet? Where are
 they
> located? Does the govenment strictly control the computer usage? ...
>
>Randal
>CHAOR@gbms01.uwgb.edu
>
----------------------------------
I know that Beijing is connected to the Internet, at least one kann send email
to Beijing. The address to which one can send email is:
           SOMEONE@ICA.BEIJING.CANET.CN
where someone is to be replaced by a name of somebody or by a organisition.
The mail goes perhaps through Karlsruhr in Germany to Beijing.
That's all I know.

-------------------
P. Zhao       email-addr.: P151520@ruba.rz.ruhr-uni-bochum.dbp.de


From @CUVMB.CC.COLUMBIA.EDU:CHINANET@TAMVM1.BITNET Wed Jul  1 11:23:46 1992
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Date:         Wed, 1 Jul 1992 08:10:54 MST
Reply-To: "CHINANET: Networking In China" <CHINANET%TAMVM1.BITNET@CUVMB.CC.COLUMBIA.EDU>
Sender: "CHINANET: Networking In China" <CHINANET%TAMVM1.BITNET@CUVMB.CC.COLUMBIA.EDU>
From: Qiang Alex ZHAO <azhao%CS.ARIZONA.EDU@CUVMB.CC.COLUMBIA.EDU>
Subject:      Re: your mail
X-To:         CHINANET%TAMVM1.bitnet@ARIZVM1.ccit.arizona.edu
To: Multiple recipients of list CHINANET <CHINANET@TAMVM1.BITNET>
In-Reply-To:  <199207011203.AA26888@optima.cs.arizona.edu>; from "Center for
              Chinese Studies Library" at Jun 29, 92 2:11 pm
Status: RO

> Hi,
> 	I would be very interested in finding out avbout e-mail in China.
> Can you send me some info, too?
> 	Many thanks,
>
> 	John Sweeney
> 	ccsl@library.berkeley.edu

OK. Here's some information that I know (some of them actually came
from this list itself)...


		Networking to China
		===================

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
1) UseNET Newsgroup: fcs.info-nets
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: 9 Apr 92 09:00:32 GMT
From: kuang@rdsparc2.CSELT.STET.IT (Kuang Jiaxing)

There are two E-mail network effective in China, CRN and CANET.

CANET	Chinese Academic Network (CN-DOM)
    Try asking Qian@ica.beijing.canet.cn for details.

CRN	China Research Network
   CRN is a X.400 based network, as far I know, there are a few
   universities and institutes connected to CRN, they are NCI
   (NorthChina Computing Institute), Fudan University, Shanghai
   Jiaotong University, SCI (30th Institute), SCL (54th Institute), ECI
   (32th institute), more universities and institutes are connecting to
   CRN, for details contact postmaster@cnlab.nci.crn.cn or
   xiaofan.zhao@cnlab.nci.crn.cn

Good luck
Kuang

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
2) WHOIS Database at NIC of DDN
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
CANET Chinese Academic Network (CN-DOM)
   c/o ICA
   P.O. Box 2418-26
   Che-Dao-Gou Street
   Beijing
   PEOPLE'S REPUBLIC OF CHINA

   Domain Name: CN

   Administrative Contact:
      Qian, Tian Bai  (TBQ)  QIAN@ICA.BEIJING.CANET.CN
      +86 841-3654
   Technical Contact, Zone Contact:
      Rotert, Michael  (MR78)  Rotert@IRA.UKA.DE
      +49 721 608 4221

   Record last updated on 05-Mar-91.

   Domain servers in listed order:

   IRAUN1.IRA.UKA.DE		129.13.10.90
   NS.EU.NET			192.16.202.11
   NS.UU.NET			137.39.1.3

   Top Level domain for the People's Republic of China

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
3) From: "Herman J. Woltring" <UGDIST@nici.kun.nl>
-------------------------------------------------------------------------

As an editor of campus magazine with a special report on network
connection to mainland China, I tried very hard to find out any
possibly way for sending e-mails to there.  I got help from kind
netters, from whois database, knowing that CANET(Chinese Academic
Network) users actually have e-mail access with Internetter.  So I
contacted Mr. Qian, the administative contact of CANET via e-mail and
personal letter.  Finally, I got response after Mr. Qian got my
personal letter.  (Now, people in Taiwan can mail letters to mainland
China indirectly, via Hong Kong.)

Mr. Qian gave me some introduction of CANET, and eventually mentioned
the main problem is lack of funds, so people on CANET have to pay fees
for both receiving and sending e-mail abroad.  In this case, after you
reading this message, PLEASE DON'T TRY TO SEND E-MAILS TO MR. QIAN
ASKING ABOUT FURTHER DETAIL, SINCE I CAN NOT MAKE SURE MR. QIAN ALSO
HAVE TO PAY FEE FOR HIS E-MAIL OR NOT.  I am afraid the mail flood will
cause another big problem to him.  Thank you.

=== Original message from Mr. Qian

From:   cn%"QIAN@ica.beijing.canet.cn" 20-AUG-1991 19:18:57.92 To:
7911013@twnctu02.bitnet CC:  Subj:   reply

Received: From DEARN(MAILER) by TWNCTU02 with Jnet id 6317
	  for 7911013@TWNCTU02; Tue, 20 Aug 91 19:18 U
Received: from DEARN by DEARN (Mailer R2.08) with BSMTP id 1915; Tue,
20 Aug 91
 09:37:08 CET Received: from ira.uka.de by vm.gmd.de (IBM VM SMTP
R1.2.2MX) with TCP; Tue, 20
 Aug 91 09:36:51 CET Received: from ica.beijing.canet.cn by
iraun1.ira.uka.de id aa10842;
	  20 Aug 91 9:32 MET DST
Date: Tue, 20 Aug 91 15:06 CHINA TIME +100 From:
QIAN@ica.beijing.canet.cn Subject: reply To: 7911013@twnctu02.bitnet
Message-id: <29780B1EE25F00002B@ICA.BEIJING.CANET.CN> X-Organization:
ICA BEIJING CHINA X-Envelope-to: 7911013@twnctu02.bitnet X-VMS-To:
IN%"7911013@twnctu02.bitnet",QIAN

Mr.Huang, Thank you for your letter of Aug.5. Some time ago I received
an email from you, and I'm sorry I have been unable to answer it
sooner. Thank you for your paying great attention to the CANET
project.  Herewith I'm encluding the brief introduction to CANET.
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .

      CANET , co-initiated by ICA ( Beijing  Instutute  for  Computer
  Applications ) and the University of Karlsruhe ( Germany ) began in
  1986. Its purpose is to integrate chinese academic communities with
  the worldwide computer network, and to promote information exchange
  and technical cooperation with the rest of the world.  The  initial
  service provided by CANET is international E-mail delivery.
      The first connection with CSNET was actually set up in Sep.1987.
  The central machine  located in ICA , Siemens 7,760/ BS2000 running
  PMDF/BS2000 software, was successfully  connected  with the  E-mail
  systems all over the world by means of a relay machine at the  Uni-
  versity of Karlsruhe.
      Since then ,  CANET  has  been operational and has provided the
  worldwide E-mail service for some academic communities within China.
      In 1990 Oct. ,  the  top  level  domain ---" CN " for China was
  registered with DDN SRI--NIC by ICA . This is a very important step
  for the development of CANET.
      CANET is a store and forward electronic mail network .
      Recently,the central machine in CANET is a Micro VAXII--cluster
  system under VMS 4.7 running PMDF 3.1/VMS,which acts as an interna-
  tional gateway linking the main domain server located at Uni. Karl-
  sruhe by x.25 through the CHINAPAC (Chinese Packed Switching
  Network).
      For remote sites, CANET is accessible for any academic communi-
  ty of China through the CHINAPAC ( national x.25 PDN )  or the dial
  up telephone links, at 1200 bps and 2400 bps or 4800 bps (depending
  on the cost factor ). End--user's PC  or workstations can access to
  local node machine by terminal emulation . CANET  adopts  RFC--822
  formats.
     CHINAPAC ,  the first national PDN in China , was operational in
  the end of 1989 , it is authorized  by the goverment and run by the
  Ministry  of Posts and Telecommications of China.   This network is
  based on x.25. At persent, it is still on the first stage and has 3
  node-machines ( Package Switching Node ) and 8 package multiplexers
  which are located at 11 major cities in China. It has international
  link through the satellites.
     All amchines of   CANET implement  Internet  DNS ( domain naming
  system ) syntax.
     The top level domain ---  " CN " for China has been  operational
  since Jan.1991 . Currently, the international mail delivery usually
  takes half a day . At present , 16 sites have been connected within
  CANET.  It is true , many institutions and universities have estab-
  lished their private local network in the compus,  most of them are
  interested in joning CANET.But, there are the financial boundaries-
  ---lack of the funds.   If the funding is available,  CANET will be
  growing rapidly.
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .

Frankly speaking,the CANET has not been a part of the Internet yet,
because it does't implement the TCP/IP protocol suite to link with the
Internet via the leased line directly.that is why CANET is unable to do
FTP and R-Login recently.Also,this is the reason that CANET's user has
to pay the international communication fees not only for sending mail
but also for receiving mail.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
4) From GEAND@educ.umass.edu Thu Apr  9 18:23:22 1992
-------------------------------------------------------------------------

This will get you started.  Yes, it is EXTREMELY costly and for that
reason I will NOT tell people E-mail addresses in China.  The archives
of this list should contain some of the traffic this posting caused.

......................................................................
China network observations from October, 1991, visit        1/12/92

The Institute of Computer Applications (ICA) at 10 Che Dao Gou,
Haidian District, Beijing, was created to provide data processing
and computer services to small and medium organizations that could
not afford their own computer installations.  The ICA office is
extremely difficult to find; it is "hidden" at the rear of a complex
whose main mission appears to be quasi-military, and whose neighbors
"don't know anything about it."  ICA is under the Ministry of
Machinery and Electronics Industry.

Contact was established by E-Mail to SYSTEM@ICA.Beijing.Canet.CN
Qian Tian Bai, Vice-Chief Engineer, P.O.Box 2418-26, Beijing, China
100081, phone 841-3654, is the contact person.

Chinanet is very small, and VERY EXPENSIVE.  Costs are 8000 Yuan
to join, 2000 Yuan per month maintenance, and 10 Yuan per KILObyte
of information sent OR RECEIVED.  For comparison, the average
Professor's salary in PRC is 150 Yuan per month.  This explains
why some Internet information Qian Tian Bai wanted is being sent
by regular mail rather than E-Mail.  Those of us who view Internet
as a big, free resource need to realize that casual communications
elsewhere, and especially to China, may NOT be welcome by the
recipient because of the cost.

FAX is much more prevalent than E-mail throughout Asia, partly because
the character set in Japan, China, Hong Kong, Korea, Taiwan, Singapore,
etc. is not amenable to western style keyboarding, nor is the use of
English (Roman characters) that widespread.  As a side note, a major
data base research problem in Beijing is how to produce a telephone
directory!  To get a home telephone number, even if I knew the full
name and address and could pronounce it correctly in Chinese, I had
to go through the place where the person worked;  most work places
have an agreed upon Pinyin or English name that CAN be sorted on,
listed, and retrieved electronically.

Chinanet nodes exist in Beijing, Harbin, Shanghai, and Hangzhou, with
dial-up connections other places.  Most users are businesses or
Chinese Academy of Sciences;  practically none are Universities.
University computing centers (Computer Science Departments) seem to
be in some sort of communication with each other using something
called CNPAC, which is entirely graphic due to the nature of the
natural character set of China.  This might explain why gateway(s)
to Chinanet or Internet don't seem to exist.

Chinanet's connections to the outside world are via a 2400 bps link
(sattelite) to University of Karlsruhe, using PMDF protocol.  Call-ins
are done twice a day for exchange of international mail.  ICA hardware
includes VAX 8700, Siemens 7760, and MVAXII cluster.

The University of International Business and Economics in Beijing has
a massive computer-based communication facility, installed for the
Asian Games last year, and maintained (but not used) in support of
Beijing's bid for the Olympics.  Connections go throughout China, Asia,
and much of the rest of the world.  My guess is that this machine could
host an extensive and inexpensive E-mail network with practically no
additional capital investment!  I said this to everyone who would
listen in other agencies I visited;  perhaps that may have some effect.
Unfortunately, I visited ICA before I visited UIBE and could not get
ICA's reaction to the idea.

Without knowing it when travel plans were made, a major conference
on telecommunications was to be held in Beijing about Nov. 1.  ICA
suggested they could get me in if I were in Beijing at the time, but
I had already accepted a "Soviet" Academy of Science invitation for
November.  I have not been able to find out what transpired at that
conference, although I have been promised a copy of the proceedings.
Perhaps someone who was there could enlighten me (and any others on
the network) about serious interest in moving China forward with
global networking.

As an interesting aside, one of the major U.S. planners of the Nov.
conference also created a large share of international use of
Chinanet in the previous month, and was pointed out to me as someone
insensitive to what their costs were.  My personal reaction was that
action was needed to drive down costs (or get them subsidized) because
what I saw represented to me exactly the kinds of interchanges the
networks were designed to facilitate.

Addtitions, corrections, interpretations, and comments welcome.

     G. Ernest Anderson               GEAND@EDUC.UMass.EDU
     University of Massachusetts

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
5) List CHINANET: Networking in China
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: kuang@rdsparc2.CSELT.STET.IT (Kuang Jiaxing)

Some sites in China have registered IP network number, unfortunately,
due to finance, they have not connected to InterNet directly.

The two major E-Mail network in China are CANET and CRN.

  CANET was setup about 1987 and registered in 1990, it is a subscriber
  e-mail network about 10 Yuan per kilobyte plus phone fee, user loging
  via PSDN or other, it seems there are no subdomain users, as far I
  know there are lots of Universities and Institutes have account on
  CANET.  It cost a huge amount of money to CANET users :-) 10 Yuan per
  kilobyte whatever incoming or outgoing email.

  CRN is a OSI multi-protocol experiment network, e-mail system of CRN
  is based X.400(84 version), it has some universities and institues
  connected via China CNPAC(X.25), each site pay its X.25 fee (quite
  expensive) for outgoing mail, it is mere experiment network, due to
  political and financial reason, it seems impossible to become a real
  research network, ...  For CRN sites, they pay their X.25 fee, usual
  they pay their outgoing emails, Darmstadt.gmd.de acts as InterNet
  <--> X.400 gateway for CRN, it pays most emails to China, and its
  administrator protest high charge, the policy may be changed in
  future.  X.25 is a quite expensive service, it charge you per segment
  you send/receive and per minute you use, Usual each site pays about
  2000 yuan per month if no high volume data transfer.

Some Universities are planning to build Campus network, Tsinghua
University, ZheJian University, Fudan University, ..., I am sorry I
don't know details except Fudan.

I heard that China PTT is planing to build China E-Mail network, and
Shanghai PTT is just beginning to provide such service, it sounds to be
the official e-mail network in future, but I don't know more about it.

For details about CANET, contact Qian@ica.beijing.canet.cn, who is
Administrative Contact of CANET.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
6) First Hand Material: From <xiaofan.zhao@cnlab.nci.crn.cn>
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
>From xiaofan.zhao@cnlab.nci.crn.cn Sun Apr 12 17:19:05 1992
Received: from optima.cs.arizona.edu by caslon.cs.arizona.edu; Sun, 12 Apr 92
 17:19:03 -0700
Received: from ixgate.gmd.de by optima.cs.arizona.edu (4.1/15)
	id AA28511; Sun, 12 Apr 92 17:18:59 MST
Received: by ixgate.gmd.de id AA13488; Mon, 13 Apr 92 02:12:05 +0200
Date: 13 Apr 92  8:11 +0800
From: Xiaofan ZHAO <xiaofan.zhao@cnlab.nci.crn.cn>
To: Qiang Alex ZHAO <azhao@cs.arizona.edu>
In-Reply-To: <9204100052.AA03920(a)acacia.cs.arizona.>
Message-Id: <788:xiaofan.zhao@cnlab.nci.crn.cn>
Subject: Reply: Hello from Arizona (USA)
Return-Receipt-To: Xiaofan ZHAO <xiaofan.zhao@cnlab.nci.crn.cn>
Status: OR

Dear Alex,

Following is some information about CRN for your reference.

Regards,
Xiaofan Zhao, NCI, Beijing, China

==========================

The Chinese Research Network (CRN), founded in 1987, aims at

	* Providing electronic communication means, based on
	  the PSDN and any available communication networks,
	  to the Chineses scientsts, engineers, professors and
	  other reaserchers to facilitate them in exchanging information
	  and coordinating cooperation with their partners in China
	  and abroad.

	* Supporting and coordinating the development and promotion
	  of OSI conformable applications ammong Chinese scientific
	  and research community.

	* Organizing the cooperation among CRN members and their
	  foreign partners.

Eight members of CRN have been interconnected at present, including research
institutes, universities and academic organizations in Beijing, Shanghai,
Chengdu and Shijiazhuang. More institutions will join CRN in the future.

MHS (email), VT (PAD), FTAM, X.11 have been installed at the member
institutions on VAX/VMS, VAX/ULTRIX, SUN/UNIX and APOLLO/UNIX.
CRN has established more than ten direct MHS connections with the member
countries of European Research Networks (RARE), including Germany, Norway
and Switchland, and could exchange e-mails with almost all the research
networks, eg Internet, in the world via RARE gateways.

Chinese MHS (CMHS), dased on DFN-EAN and enhanced by CRN, with
Chenese character and encryption capability has been also installed
at some CRN's member institutions on VAX/VMS and SUN/UNIX systems.

The CRN Board consists of the representatives from her member
organizations, which is responsible for
	* Developing CRN's plans and rules
	* Helping academic and research institutions to join CRN
	* Maintaining the services provided by CRN
	* Helping CRN's members to solve technical problems
	* Organizig and coordinating the development projects
	* Contacting and coopreating, on behalf of CRN, with the peers
	  in China and abroad

Help desk addresses are:
  Beijing:
    CRN's Help Desk                          <helpdesk@cnlab.nci.crn.cn>
    North China Institute of Computer Tech.  <postmaster@cnlab.nci.crn.cn>
    China Academy of Electr. & Info. Tech.   <postmaster@cc.caeit.crn.cn>
    Computer System Engineering Institute    <postmaster@dep9.cse.crn.cn>
  Shanghai:
    Fudan University                         <postmaster@cnl.fudan.crn.cn>
    Shanghai JiaoTong University             <postmaster@ee.sjtu.crn.cn>
  Shijiazhuang:
    Shijiazhuang Communication Lab           <postmaster@tcl.scl.crn.cn>
  Chengdu:
    Southwest Communication Institute        <postmaster@tulip.sci.crn.cn>

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
= Qiang Alex Zhao		| azhao@cs.arizona.edu
				| Dept of Computer Science
				| Univ of Arizona, Tucson


From sol.ctr.columbia.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!pacific.mps.ohio-state.edu!linac!att!cbnewse!danj1 Tue Jul  7 16:42:19 EDT 1992
Article: 61457 of soc.culture.china
Xref: sol.ctr.columbia.edu soc.culture.taiwan:27235 alt.chinese.text:92 soc.culture.china:61457 soc.culture.hongkong:23796 soc.culture.asean:11370
Newsgroups: soc.culture.taiwan,alt.chinese.text,soc.culture.china,soc.culture.hongkong,soc.culture.asean
Path: sol.ctr.columbia.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!pacific.mps.ohio-state.edu!linac!att!cbnewse!danj1
From: Dan_Jacobson@ATT.COM
Subject: Taiwan netnews, FTP sites, Chinese character software
Organization: AT&T-BL, Naperville IL, USA
Date: Mon, 6 Jul 1992 18:07:30 GMT
Message-ID: <1992Jul6Mo132054a.Dan_Jacobson@ATT.COM>
In-Reply-To: joe@astro.as.utexas.edu's message of 3 Jul 92 00:14:34 GMT
References: <75130@ut-emx.uucp>
Sender: danj1@cbnewse.cb.att.com (Dan Jacobson)
Lines: 166
Status: O

>>>>> Regarding Chinese Newsreader; joe@astro.as.utexas.edu (Joe Wang) adds:

Joe> I know someone who regularly logs into his account in Taiwan to read
Joe> news in Hanzi.  He says that he doesn't know much about the software
Joe> that is used, just that it works.

Joe> Anyone know what software he is talking about, and whether it is free
Joe> redistributable?  Also, since Taiwan is on the InterNet, are there any
Joe> FTP sites which may are useful for Chinese language processing.  (The
Joe> person I know mentioned something about the Ministry of Education having
Joe> an anonymous ftp site.)

The Taiwan Ministry of Education's (Jiao4Yu4Bu4) anonymous FTP file
server in Taipei is moers2.edu.tw.  Most of the information there is
in Big5 code. 	(I think it is very wise of the Ministry of Education
to establish this file server and to encourage Taiwan/worldwide growth
of computer networks.)  Poke around the ahkcus.org anonymous FTP site
for the software to use to read the Big5-encoded Chinese characters.
Perhaps the easiest (Unix) way to read Chinese netnews is under
cxterm, distributed with X Windows, but I don't know.

To get a load of help files [some also oriented to telling you how to
read the Mainland China GuoBiao Chinese character set]
Send the line: GET CMHELP PACKAGE
To  : LISTSERV@UGA.BITNET   or:  listserv@uga.cc.uga.edu (internet)

P.S.: many sites don't get alt.chinese.text, so please keep at least
e.g., soc.culture.taiwan in your Newsgroups: header.

P.P.S.: you can also get internal Taiwan groups by e-mail:

|From: u7911013@cc.nctu.edu.tw (Huang Chih-Hsien TWNR Mediator)
|Newsgroups: soc.culture.taiwan
|Subject: SERVICE ANNOUNCE - tw.* Newsgroups Redistribution(TWNR)
|Message-ID: <9204270451.AA15335@cc.nctu.edu.tw>
|Date: 27 Apr 92 04:43:49 GMT
|
|----------------------------------------------------------------------
|
|  ########## ##   #   ##       #     ##           #######
| #    #   #   #  ##  #        ##    #             #     #
|     #        # # # #        #  #  #             #######
|    #         ##  ## .*     #    ## EWSGROUPS   #   #   EDISTRIBUTION
|   #          #   #       ##     #            ##     ## 
|
| FROM:  HUANG, CHIH-HSIEN      at      NATIONAL CHIAO TUNG UNIVERSITY
|----------------------------------------------------------------------
|
|
| 1. Introduction -  What is tw.* Newsgroups Redistribution(TWNR)?
|  
|    Taiwan established its  Internet connection to US at the end of
|    1991.  After that, news systems are  keeping growing around the
|    island.  Some regional  "newsgroups" circulate locally with the 
|    leading group name, "tw".  However,  they may interest a lot of
|    people all over the world, and provide a good place for talking
|    about Taiwan's affairs.  Therefore, I would like to  offer this 
|    re-distribution service.  Hope more and  more people exchanging 
|    information, sharing knowledge/resources with us.
|
|    "tw.*" is a redistribution service for the following newgroups:
|
|    * tw                  - the leading newsgroup of Taiwan
|    * tw.tanet            - TANet discussion
|    * tw.tanet.general    - TANet general information
|    * tw.tanet.tech_news  - TANet tech news
|    * tw.seminar          - seminar announce
|    * tw.conference       - conference announce
|    * tw.announce         - general announce
|    * tw.wanted           - information wanted
|    * tw.lib-automation   - library automation discussion
|    * tw.talk             - free talk on any topic
|    * tw.info-sharing     - sharing information to each other
|    * tw.cad              - CAD discussion
|    * tw.cam              - CAM discussion
|    * tw.misc             - miscellaneous posting
|
|    A program written by myself has been installed on my own account,
|    u7911013@cc.nctu.edu.tw.  This  program  will  check my  mailbox 
|    every minute  and automatically reply  to your  request, i  your 
|    command is valid.
|
|
| 2. Commands
|
|    All commands are accessible via e-mail and should appear in your
|    SUBJECT line, *not* the mail body.  Your request should be send 
|    to: 
|   
|    u7911013@cc.nctu.edu.tw
|    -----------------------
|
|    2.1 Help - /HELP
|       
|        Sending a "/HELP" or "/help" command in your mail SUBJECT, 
|        this help file will be automatically returned to you.
|
|        *example*
|
|        /HELP
|
|    2.2 To be a subscriber - /SUB, /sub
|
|        "/SUB" and  "/sub" commands are available for this purpose.  
|        All articles posted on tw.* newsgroups will be forwarded to
|        the subscribers.
|
|        Here is the command format:
|
|        /SUB your_first_name your_last_name 
|        /sub your_last_name, your_first_name
|
|        *example*
|
|        /SUB Huang, Chih-Hsien
|       
|    2.3 Unsubscribe - /UNSUB, /unsub
|
|        You can ask for removing from this list at any time.  The 
|        command is  "/UNSUB" or  "/unsub".  Note that the service 
|        program only can recognize your e-mail address, so please 
|        unsubscribe from where you subscribe to this list.
|
|        *example*
|
|        /UNSUB
|
|    2.4 Post articles - /POST
|
|        Article posting are  available to subscribers.  Please e-mail
|        your article with "/POST which_newsgroup_you_want_to_post" in
|        the  SUBJECT and  "Article_Subject: your_article_subject"  in
|        the  FIRST  line  of the  MAIL  BODY.  Currently,  posting is 
|        mediated by  myself.  Your article  will be  also sent to the 
|        subscribers.
|
|        By the way, multi-group posting is also accepted.  Please add
|        all the  newsgroups  you want  to post  in the  subject line, 
|        separated with a comma.
|
|        *example*
|
|        /POST tw.announce,tw.misc,tw.talk
|
|        [in the first line of your MAIL BODY]
|      
|        Article_Subject: Service announce: tw.* newsgroups redistribution
|
|
| 3. Comments/Suggestions:
|
|    Please send your comments/suggestions directly to me.
|
|---
|    ::   :: .       :;      ,,,,,;.,,,,:.   H u a n g ,  C h i h - H s i e n
|  ''::'''::''' ,,,,,;;,,,,;,::.:., ', ,:   
|    ;:...:;         ::      ::.,.:  ,':,    Dept. of Electronics Engineering
|,,,,,,,,,,,,,;,     ::   .  ::.:...'   ':'    National Chiao Tung University
|  :........;;,  '''''''''''  :.......::,                  1001 Ta Hsueh Road
|  ::   :   ::    :. :.       ::......::                 Hsinchu, Taiwan, ROC
|  ::''':'''::   :::  ;, ';.  ::......::    
|  ;:...:...:;  :'::   ' : :; ::......::    Internet: u7911013@cc.nctu.edu.tw
| ..;''   '';, '' ':::::::'  ..;''   '';,   BITNET  :        7911013@TWNCTU02
|
|
.


From sol.ctr.columbia.edu!usc!cs.utexas.edu!qt.cs.utexas.edu!yale.edu!jvnc.net!darwin.sura.net!convex!seas.smu.edu!vivaldi!netkeeper!nec-gw!nec-tyo!wnoc-tyo-news!sh.wide!wnoc-kyo!kuis!kuee!rotary!lu Sat Jul 11 14:30:26 EDT 1992
Article: 61886 of soc.culture.china
Path: sol.ctr.columbia.edu!usc!cs.utexas.edu!qt.cs.utexas.edu!yale.edu!jvnc.net!darwin.sura.net!convex!seas.smu.edu!vivaldi!netkeeper!nec-gw!nec-tyo!wnoc-tyo-news!sh.wide!wnoc-kyo!kuis!kuee!rotary!lu
From: lu@rotary.kuee.kyoto-u.ac.jp (Lu)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: Re: New directory at the anonymous ftp site lunix.met.kth.se(130.237.16.204)
Message-ID: <6883@kuee.kuee.kyoto-u.ac.jp>
Date: 11 Jul 92 04:01:40 GMT
References: <1992Jul3.211728.28463@kth.se>
Sender: news@kuee.kuee.kyoto-u.ac.jp
Reply-To: lu@rotary.kuee.kyoto-u.ac.jp (Lu)
Organization: Electrical Engineering Dept. Kyoto Univ.
Lines: 25
Status: O


	I had read a magazine published in Japan which mentioned a
message about VAN of China (mainland).Name is CHINAPAC(CNPAC).
It is managed by Beijing telphone and telgram bureau.

	CNPAC had 9 nodes:
		Shanghai,Guangzhou,Tiejin,Shenyang,Xian,
		Chengdu,Wuhan,shengzheng
		
	Accroding that magazine,you can type 
		ATDP86-1-301-4443
	to connect with CNPAC.(	7bit,even parity,1200bps.)
		
	Address of CNPAC:
			11, West Changan Street, Beijing,
			Tel:86-1-601-0757
			FAX:86-1-601-0717.

	I did not check whether it be true or not. if anyone know more
	about this topic,please discussion in this newsgroup.

 lu@rotary.kuee.kyoto-u.ac.jp  
 LU GUANG PING    
 Elec. Eng. Dept. Kyoto Univ. JAPAN 606.
 Tel:075-753-5286(Lab)


From CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu Fri Apr 24 09:07:14 1992
Received: from ugav2.cc.uga.edu by sirius.ctr.columbia.edu (5.67/5.10) with SMTP id AA27508; Fri, 24 Apr 92 09:07:00 -0400
Received: from UGA.CC.UGA.EDU by uga.cc.uga.edu (IBM VM SMTP V2R2)
   with BSMTP id 5702; Fri, 24 Apr 92 08:55:30 EDT
Received: from UGA.BITNET by UGA.CC.UGA.EDU (Mailer R2.07) with BSMTP id 0123;
 Fri, 24 Apr 92 08:55:27 EDT
Date:         Fri, 24 Apr 1992 21:02:13 WST
Reply-To: Huang <u7911013@CC.NCTU.EDU.TW>
Sender: Chinese Computing Network <CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu>
From: Huang <u7911013@CC.NCTU.EDU.TW>
Subject:      SERVICE ANNOUNCE from Taiwan - tw.* newsgroups redistribution
Comments: To: ccnet-l@uga.uga.edu
To: Multiple recipients of list CCNET-L <CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu>
Status: RO

----------------------------------------------------------------------

  ########## ##   #   ##       #     ##           #######
 #    #   #   #  ##  #        ##    #             #     #
     #        # # # #        #  #  #             #######
    #         ##  ## .*     #    ## EWSGROUPS   #   #   EDISTRIBUTION
   #          #   #       ##     #            ##     ##

 FROM:  HUANG, CHIH-HSIEN      at      NATIONAL CHIAO TUNG UNIVERSITY
----------------------------------------------------------------------


 1. Introduction -  What is tw.* Newsgroups Redistribution(TWNR)?

    Taiwan established its  Internet connection to US at the end of
    1991.  After that, news systems are  keeping growing around the
    island.  Some regional  "newsgroups" circulate locally with the
    leading group name, "tw".  However,  they may interest a lot of
    people all over the world, and provide a good place for talking
    about Taiwan's affairs.  Therefore, I would like to  offer this
    re-distribution service.  Hope more and  more people exchanging
    information, sharing knowledge/resources with us.

    "tw.*" is a redistribution service for the following newgroups:

    * tw                  - the leading newsgroup of Taiwan
    * tw.tanet            - TANet discussion
    * tw.tanet.general    - TANet general information
    * tw.tanet.tech_news  - TANet tech news
    * tw.seminar          - seminar announce
    * tw.conference       - conference announce
    * tw.announce         - general announce
    * tw.wanted           - information wanted
    * tw.lib-automation   - library automation discussion
    * tw.talk             - free talk on any topic
    * tw.info-sharing     - sharing information to each other
    * tw.cad              - CAD discussion
    * tw.cam              - CAM discussion
    * tw.misc             - miscellaneous posting

    A program written by myself has been installed on my own account,
    u7911013@cc.nctu.edu.tw.  This  program  will  check my  mailbox
    every minute  and automatically reply  to your  request, i  your
    command is valid.


 2. Commands

    All commands are accessible via e-mail and should appear in your
    SUBJECT line, *not* the mail body.  Your request should be send
    to:

    u7911013@cc.nctu.edu.tw
    -----------------------

    2.1 Help - /HELP

        Sending a "/HELP" or "/help" command in your mail SUBJECT,
        this help file will be automatically returned to you.

        *example*

        /HELP

    2.2 To be a subscriber - /SUB, /sub

        "/SUB" and  "/sub" commands are available for this purpose.
        All articles posted on tw.* newsgroups will be forwarded to
        the subscribers.

        Here is the command format:

        /SUB your_first_name your_last_name
        /sub your_last_name, your_first_name

        *example*

        /SUB Huang, Chih-Hsien

    2.3 Unsubscribe - /UNSUB, /unsub

        You can ask for removing from this list at any time.  The
        command is  "/UNSUB" or  "/unsub".  Note that the service
        program only can recognize your e-mail address, so please
        unsubscribe from where you subscribe to this list.

        *example*

        /UNSUB

    2.4 Post articles - /POST

        Article posting are  available to subscribers.  Please e-mail
        your article with "/POST which_newsgroup_you_want_to_post" in
        the  SUBJECT and  "Article_Subject: your_article_subject"  in
        the  FIRST  line  of the  MAIL  BODY.  Currently,  posting is
        mediated by  myself.  Your article  will be  also sent to the
        subscribers.

        By the way, multi-group posting is also accepted.  Please add
        all the  newsgroups  you want  to post  in the  subject line,
        separated with a comma.

        *example*

        /POST tw.announce,tw.misc,tw.talk

        [in the first line of your MAIL BODY]

        Article_Subject: Service announce: tw.* newsgroups redistribution


 3. Comments/Suggestions:

    Please send your comments/suggestions directly to me.

---
    ::   :: .       :;      ,,,,,;.,,,,:.   H u a n g ,  C h i h - H s i e n
  ''::'''::''' ,,,,,;;,,,,;,::.:., ', ,:
    ;:...:;         ::      ::.,.:  ,':,    Dept. of Electronics Engineering
,,,,,,,,,,,,,;,     ::   .  ::.:...'   ':'    National Chiao Tung University
  :........;;,  '''''''''''  :.......::,                  1001 Ta Hsueh Road
  ::   :   ::    :. :.       ::......::                 Hsinchu, Taiwan, ROC
  ::''':'''::   :::  ;, ';.  ::......::
  ;:...:...:;  :'::   ' : :; ::......::    Internet: u7911013@cc.nctu.edu.tw
 ..;''   '';, '' ':::::::'  ..;''   '';,   BITNET  :        7911013@TWNCTU02

From @ricevm1.rice.edu:CHINANET@TAMVM1.BITNET Fri Jul 17 13:04:02 1992
Return-Path: <@ricevm1.rice.edu:CHINANET@TAMVM1.BITNET>
Received: from ricevm1.rice.edu by cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (5.59/FCB)
	id AA13136; Fri, 17 Jul 92 13:03:54 EDT
Message-Id: <9207171703.AA13136@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu>
Received: from RICEVM1.RICE.EDU by ricevm1.rice.edu (IBM VM SMTP V2R2)
   with BSMTP id 2575; Fri, 17 Jul 92 12:04:07 CDT
Received: from RICEVM1.BITNET by RICEVM1.RICE.EDU (Mailer R2.08 R208004) with
 BSMTP id 6986; Fri, 17 Jul 92 12:04:05 CDT
Date:         Fri, 17 Jul 1992 12:02:00 CDT
Reply-To: "CHINANET: Networking In China" <CHINANET%TAMVM1.BITNET@ricevm1.rice.edu>
Sender: "CHINANET: Networking In China" <CHINANET%TAMVM1.BITNET@ricevm1.rice.edu>
From: Bin Wang <NUS40%TTACS.BITNET@ricevm1.rice.edu>
Subject:      New Report on Networking in PRC
To: Multiple recipients of list CHINANET <CHINANET%TAMVM1.BITNET@ricevm1.rice.edu>
Status: RO

Hi, Everybody,

There is a new report about the network in PRC coming out. It can surely give
us a better understanding on this topic.

Enjoy !

Bin Wang (USTC869)



-------------------------------CUT HERE-------------------------------------

  [Dr. David Kahaner is a numerical analyst on sabbatical to the
   Office of Naval Research-Asia (ONR Asia) in Tokyo from NIST.  The
   following is the professional opinion of David Kahaner and in no
   way has the blessing of the US Government or any agency of it.  All
   information is dated and of limited life time.  This disclaimer should
   be noted on ANY attribution.]

  [Copies of previous reports written by Kahaner can be obtained using
   anonymous FTP from host cs.arizona.edu, directory japan/kahaner.reports.]

To: Distribution
From:
 David K. Kahaner
 US Office of Naval Research Asia
 (From outside US):  23-17, 7-chome, Roppongi, Minato-ku, Tokyo 106 Japan
 (From within  US):  Unit 45002, APO AP 96337-0007
  Tel: +81 3 3401-8924, Fax: +81 3 3403-9670
  Email: kahaner@cs.titech.ac.jp
Re: Networking in PRC China (Kuo)
15 July 1992
This file is named "china.net"

ABSTRACT. A description of networking activities in PRC (China).
(F.F.Kuo, SRI)

My report on the Internetworking conference [inet.92, 26 June 1992] was
read by

        Dr. Franklin F. Kuo
        Executive Director, Asian Programs
        SRI International
        333 Ravenswood Avenue
        Menlo Park, CA 94025
         Tel: (415) 859-4116; Fax: (415) 859-6171
         Email: KUO@NISC.SRI.COM

Dr Kuo was particularly interested in the sections on China, as he has
recently completed a visit to look at the networking situation there,
and has prepared the report below detailing his trip. It provides
material supplemental to that in my report and should be of value to
those interested in the developments of international networking.

*********************************************************************


NETWORKING IN THE PEOPLE'S REPUBLIC OF CHINA (PRC)

by Franklin F. Kuo, SRI International

At the invitation of the China Institute of Communications, the Citizen
Ambassador Program of People to People International arranged a visit
for a delegation of professionals in telecommunications and networking
technology to the People's Republic of China. I was the leader of the
delegation, whose purpose was to exchange information and solidify
contacts with Chinese professionals within the computer and
communications industry.  The exchange focussed on topics dealing with
China's telecommunications infrastructure, especially on subjects
relating to current research and applications in computer networks. This
group, known as the Networking Technology Delegation, consisted of 24
members, with 18 professionals, and 6 accompanying spouses. Of the 24
there were 17 people from the US, 5 from Japan (2 US citizens residing
in Tokyo) one from Germany, and one from Hong Kong, so it was truly an
international group. Six members of the delegation were native Chinese
speakers, which made it very convenient in our travels.

The itinerary for our trip was as follows:

May 11-15, 1992 Beijing

May 15-19, Xi'an

May 19-22, Shanghai

May 22-24, Hong Kong

Our professional visits concentrated on telecommunications and on
computer networking. We visited a number of the major research
institutes and universities in Beijing, Xi'an and Shanghai. In all three
cities there was a lot of interest in computer networking, especially in
the Internet, and how to connect to it. Another question that frequently
came up was the future of OSI vs that of TCP/IP. There are a lot of
local area networks in operation in China, connecting many PC-clones,
mostly Chinese produced, to some older-generation mainframes such as
Honeywells. What we did not see were operational wide-area networks,
with the exception of a metropolitan demonstration network in Beijing.

Current Wide Area Networks

At present, the major wide area network (WAN) in China is the China
National Public Data Network, CNPAC, which is currently being developed
and implemented. CNPAC, an X-25 packet switched network is designed to
carry data at speeds varying between 1.2 and 9.6 Kbps. The hub is in
Beijing, where the network management center is located, with packet
switches sited in the major cities of Shanghai and Guangzhou, and PS
concentrators found in other major cities. The packet switches,
concentrators, and PADs (packet assembly/disassembly devices) are all
manufactured in China. At the Beijing hub, there is an international
access line to CNPAC. Since we did not see a CNPAC demonstration, it is
not clear how much of it is operational and how much is still under
development.

There are other private data networks in use in China in applications in
the railway system, banking system, civil aeronautics, etc.

In China, there is an X.25 link to the Internet using a store and
forward system via the CNPAC international access line in Beijing
connecting to the University of Karlsruhe, Germany.  To the outside
world, this link is being called "the China Academic Network (CANET)".
In addition to CNPAC connectivity, there is dial-up access to CANET from
inside China. David Kahaner of ONR Tokyo reports that he frequently
communicates with Chinese scientists via CANET. However, many of the
Chinese networking specialists we talked to have never heard of the name
"CANET", so we suspect that CANET means more to the outside world than
in China.

The major problem confronting the development of WANs in China is the
poor telecommunications infrastructure. Since the penetration of basic
plain old telephone service (POTS) is less than 1% among Chinese
businesses and households, and since local and long distance telephone
switching and transmission facilities are inadequate and antiquated, it
is difficult to build a modern computer network upon the current
telecommunications infrastructure.  It will take decades to bring the
basic telecommuncations system up to modern standards, so Chinese
networking will take a long time to come up to western norms also.

Metropolitan and Campus Networks

In Beijing, we witnessed a very impressive metropolitan networking
project called NCFC (National Computing and Networking Facility of
China). NCFC is a demonstration network in Beijing linking the two major
universities, Tsinghua and Beijing Universities to a number of research
institutes of the Chinese Academy of Sciences (CAS). Each of the
pariticipating institutions have campus networks like the TUnet of
Tsinghua University.  These campus networks are connected by NCFC as a
two level system. Currently NCFC has a 10Mbps backbone connecting the
three campus networks, which will increase to 100Mbps in the next phase
of the project. Communication protocols will be ISO/OSI, but TCP/IP is
the first phase protocol. The top level of NCFC consists of the backbone
and the network control center.  The second level is composed of campus
networks at the two universities and CAS. NCFC is the largest and most
ambitious networking project we saw in China. It is partially funded by
the World Bank and the State Planning Commission, and is in limited
operation now, with full operation expected by 1994. We visited two of
the three groups who are participating in the development of NCFC. The
first was the Computer Network Center (CNC) of the Chinese Academy of
Sciences, with its own campus network, the CASnet.  The CNC seems to
have the major responsibility for the development of NCFC, and is
staffed by 40 professionals. The second group, in Tsinghua University,
is described next.

The Tsinghua University Network (TUnet)

The most impressive university networking group we visited was at
Tsinghua University, the premier technical university in China. Under
the direction of Professor Hu Daoyuan, the Tsinghua University network,
TUnet is being developed under a well laid-out strategy based upon the
following goals:

1. It will be a universal, comprehensive campus network; its usage will
include instruction, research, administration, library, and
communications services.

2. It will be a multimedia integrated services network; messages
transmitted in the network will include not only data, but voice and
video as well.

3. It will operate under accepted international standards for
interfacing devices to the network. Emerging standards are important in
the fast changing technology of networking. Initially TUnet will operate
under TCP/IP, but migration strategies have been adopted to migrate to
ISO/OSI.

4. It will be a heterogeneous network using a variety of advanced
networking technologies (LAN, PABX, PS, ISDN and FDDI, etc) to
interconnect multivendor computing facilities.

5. It will be developed in phases, with the first phase (1987 to 1991)
concentrating on interconnection of facilties, and the second phase
(1992 to 1995) emphasizing network services.

In TUnet there are three major networking facilities:

a. A circuit switched network based upon an integrated services PABX,

b. A packet switching network based upon X.25 switches and PADs,

c. Ethernet LANs interconnected through a 100 Mbps FDDI optical fiber
backbone.

A key function of TUnet is electronic mail. Tsinghua University's
message handling system (MHS) functions includes mail, telegraph,
teletext, fax, videotex, voice, images, etc. The MHS is based upon the
EAN system developed by the University of British Columbia conforming to
the CCITT X.400 recommendation series of 1984. Tsinghua's work on its
e-mail system includes migration, Chinese localization, menu adaptation
and the implementation of remote user agents.

The work at Tsinghua on TUnet and NCFC underlines one of the basic
constraints that Chinese networking technologists must live with. Unless
you have foreign (hard) currencies to purchase networking equipment,
you've got to design and build everything from scratch, including
hardware and software. So TUnet represents in many ways a bootstrap
operation. The people in TUnet are all very well trained and dedicated.
It is unfortunate that they could not make use of technology that is
readily available in the Western world.

Local Area Networks (LANs)

In China today there are many LANs in use. Two common LAN products
widely available throughout China are Ethernets from 3COM, and Netware,
a LAN operating system developed by the Novell company. These products
are available in China because of joint venture arrangements that the
cited companies have made with Chinese counterparts. Most of the LAN
products are manufactured in China under license from US companies such
as 3COM and Novell.  At the Shanghai Jiao Tong University, Professor
Yang Chuan-hou, the Director of the Computer Network Research Laboratory
presented to us some work which dealt with an architectural design of a
gateway interconncting LANs to an X.25 packet switched network.  The
work again was developmental in nature, in that both hardware and
software designs were implemented in the laboratory.

Work like that of Professor Yang and his colleagues illustrate the
practical nature of the networking development going on in China today.
I visited China in 1984, when I was a World Bank consultant to Shanghai
Jiao Tong University.  In the intervening years, there has been an
explosive growth in both computing and networking technology in China,
which will only accelerate with the further penetration of the Internet
into China. Since the Internet is capable of bringing network
specialists and users throughout the world into a larger cooperating
community, I believe that China's networking community will soon become
full partners in this world-wide community.

------------------------------END OF REPORT------------------------------


From CHINA-NT@uga.cc.uga.edu Sun Jul 19 18:20:04 1992
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 Sun, 19 Jul 92 18:16:28 EDT
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Reply-To: AEIC <aeic@WAM.UMD.EDU>
Sender: "China-Net (The Coordination Network for IFCSS)"              <CHINA-NT@uga.cc.uga.edu>
From: AEIC <aeic@WAM.UMD.EDU>
Subject:     Computer Networking in China (AEIC News Release 1032)
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To: Multiple recipients of list CHINA-NT <CHINA-NT@uga.cc.uga.edu>
Status: RO

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
3. Computer Networking in China..........................................167
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From:   David K. Kahaner via Bin Wang <NUS40@TTACS.BitNet>
By:     Franklin F. Kuo, SRI International
Source: CHINANET

At the invitation of the China Institute of Communications, the Citizen
Ambassador Program of People to People International arranged a visit
for a delegation of professionals in telecommunications and networking
technology to the People's Republic of China.The exchange focussed on
topics dealing with China's telecommunications infrastructure, especially
on subjects relating to current research and applications in computer
networks. This group, known as the Networking Technology Delegation,
consisted of 24 members, with 18 professionals, and 6 accompanying spouses.
Of the 24 there were 17 people from the US, 5 from Japan (2 US citizens
residing in Tokyo) one from Germany, and one from Hong Kong, so it was truly
an international group. Six members of the delegation were native Chinese
speakers, which made it very convenient in our travels.

Our professional visits concentrated on telecommunications and on
computer networking. We visited a number of the major research
institutes and universities in Beijing, Xi'an and Shanghai. In all three
cities there was a lot of interest in computer networking, especially in
the Internet, and how to connect to it. Another question that frequently
came up was the future of OSI vs that of TCP/IP. There are a lot of
local area networks in operation in China, connecting many PC-clones,
mostly Chinese produced, to some older-generation mainframes such as
Honeywells. What we did not see were operational wide-area networks,
with the exception of a metropolitan demonstration network in Beijing.

Current Wide Area Networks
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
At present, the major wide area network (WAN) in China is the China
National Public Data Network, CNPAC, which is currently being developed
and implemented. CNPAC, an X-25 packet switched network is designed to
carry data at speeds varying between 1.2 and 9.6 Kbps. The hub is in
Beijing, where the network management center is located, with packet
switches sited in the major cities of Shanghai and Guangzhou, and PS
concentrators found in other major cities. The packet switches,
concentrators, and PADs (packet assembly/disassembly devices) are all
manufactured in China. At the Beijing hub, there is an international
access line to CNPAC. Since we did not see a CNPAC demonstration, it is
not clear how much of it is operational and how much is still under
development.

In China, there is an X.25 link to the Internet using a store and
forward system via the CNPAC international access line in Beijing
connecting to the University of Karlsruhe, Germany.  To the outside
world, this link is being called "the China Academic Network (CANET)".
In addition to CNPAC connectivity, there is dial-up access to CANET from
inside China. David Kahaner of ONR Tokyo reports that he frequently
communicates with Chinese scientists via CANET. However, many of the
Chinese networking specialists we talked to have never heard of the name
"CANET", so we suspect that CANET means more to the outside world than
in China.

The major problem confronting the development of WANs in China is the
poor telecommunications infrastructure. Since the penetration of basic
plain old telephone service (POTS) is less than 1% among Chinese
businesses and households, and since local and long distance telephone
switching and transmission facilities are inadequate and antiquated, it
is difficult to build a modern computer network upon the current
telecommunications infrastructure.  It will take decades to bring the
basic telecommuncations system up to modern standards, so Chinese
networking will take a long time to come up to western norms also.

Metropolitan and Campus Networks
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
In Beijing, we witnessed a very impressive metropolitan networking
project called NCFC (National Computing and Networking Facility of
China). NCFC is a demonstration network in Beijing linking the two major
universities, Tsinghua and Beijing Universities to a number of research
institutes of the Chinese Academy of Sciences (CAS). Each of the
pariticipating institutions have campus networks like the TUnet of
Tsinghua University.  These campus networks are connected by NCFC as a
two level system. Currently NCFC has a 10Mbps backbone connecting the
three campus networks, which will increase to 100Mbps in the next phase
of the project. Communication protocols will be ISO/OSI, but TCP/IP is
the first phase protocol. The top level of NCFC consists of the backbone
and the network control center.  The second level is composed of campus
networks at the two universities and CAS. NCFC is the largest and most
ambitious networking project we saw in China. It is partially funded by
the World Bank and the State Planning Commission, and is in limited
operation now, with full operation expected by 1994. We visited two of
the three groups who are participating in the development of NCFC. The
first was the Computer Network Center (CNC) of the Chinese Academy of
Sciences, with its own campus network, the CASnet.  The CNC seems to
have the major responsibility for the development of NCFC, and is
staffed by 40 professionals. The second group, in Tsinghua University,
is described next.

The Tsinghua University Network (TUnet)
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
The most impressive university networking group we visited was at
Tsinghua University, the premier technical university in China. Under
the direction of Professor Hu Daoyuan, the Tsinghua University network,
TUnet is being developed under a well laid-out strategy based upon the
following goals:

1. It will be a universal, comprehensive campus network; its usage will
include instruction, research, administration, library, and
communications services.

2. It will be a multimedia integrated services network; messages
transmitted in the network will include not only data, but voice and
video as well.

3. It will operate under accepted international standards for
interfacing devices to the network. Emerging standards are important in
the fast changing technology of networking. Initially TUnet will operate
under TCP/IP, but migration strategies have been adopted to migrate to
ISO/OSI.

4. It will be a heterogeneous network using a variety of advanced
networking technologies (LAN, PABX, PS, ISDN and FDDI, etc) to
interconnect multivendor computing facilities.

5. It will be developed in phases, with the first phase (1987 to 1991)
concentrating on interconnection of facilties, and the second phase
(1992 to 1995) emphasizing network services.

In TUnet there are three major networking facilities:

a. A circuit switched network based upon an integrated services PABX,

b. A packet switching network based upon X.25 switches and PADs,

c. Ethernet LANs interconnected through a 100 Mbps FDDI optical fiber
backbone.

A key function of TUnet is electronic mail. Tsinghua University's
message handling system (MHS) functions includes mail, telegraph,
teletext, fax, videotex, voice, images, etc. The MHS is based upon the
EAN system developed by the University of British Columbia conforming to
the CCITT X.400 recommendation series of 1984. Tsinghua's work on its
e-mail system includes migration, Chinese localization, menu adaptation
and the implementation of remote user agents.

The work at Tsinghua on TUnet and NCFC underlines one of the basic
constraints that Chinese networking technologists must live with. Unless
you have foreign (hard) currencies to purchase networking equipment,
you've got to design and build everything from scratch, including
hardware and software. So TUnet represents in many ways a bootstrap
operation. The people in TUnet are all very well trained and dedicated.
It is unfortunate that they could not make use of technology that is
readily available in the Western world.

Local Area Networks (LANs)
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
In China today there are many LANs in use. Two common LAN products
widely available throughout China are Ethernets from 3COM, and Netware,
a LAN operating system developed by the Novell company. These products
are available in China because of joint venture arrangements that the
cited companies have made with Chinese counterparts. Most of the LAN
products are manufactured in China under license from US companies such
as 3COM and Novell.  At the Shanghai Jiao Tong University, Professor
Yang Chuan-hou, the Director of the Computer Network Research Laboratory
presented to us some work which dealt with an architectural design of a
gateway interconncting LANs to an X.25 packet switched network.  The
work again was developmental in nature, in that both hardware and
software designs were implemented in the laboratory.

Work like that of Professor Yang and his colleagues illustrate the
practical nature of the networking development going on in China today.
I visited China in 1984, when I was a World Bank consultant to Shanghai
Jiao Tong University.  In the intervening years, there has been an
explosive growth in both computing and networking technology in China,
which will only accelerate with the further penetration of the Internet
into China. Since the Internet is capable of bringing network
specialists and users throughout the world into a larger cooperating
community, I believe that China's networking community will soon become
full partners in this world-wide community.

From @RICEVM1.RICE.EDU:CHINANET@TAMVM1.BITNET Wed Jan 15 07:46:28 1992
Return-Path: <@RICEVM1.RICE.EDU:CHINANET@TAMVM1.BITNET>
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	id AA26042; Wed, 15 Jan 92 07:46:22 EST
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Date:         Wed, 15 Jan 1992 07:43:20 EST
Reply-To: "CHINANET: Networking In China" <CHINANET%TAMVM1.BITNET@RICEVM1.RICE.EDU>
Sender: "CHINANET: Networking In China" <CHINANET%TAMVM1.BITNET@RICEVM1.RICE.EDU>
From: Steve Goldstein--Ph 202-357-9717 <sgoldste%CISE.CISE.NSF.GOV@RICEVM1.RICE.EDU>
Subject:      Re: Send mail to China
X-To:         "CHINANET: Networking In China"
              <CHINANET%TAMVM1.BITNET@RICEVM1.RICE.EDU>
To: Multiple recipients of list CHINANET <CHINANET@TAMVM1.BITNET>
In-Reply-To:  Your message of "Tue,
              14 Jan 92 22:26:00 EST." <9201150329.AA22068@cise.cise.nsf.gov>
Status: RO

>>Frank Ng recently asked how he might send e-mail to China.  A good
question.  If anyone has an answer, would they post it to the list?
I'm sure many on the list would like to know.<<


T.B. Qian
(Qian Tian Bai)
Excutive Director of CANET

 e-mail: Qian@ica.beijing.canet.cn

P.O.Box 2418-26
Beijing,100081
P.R.China
FAX         (+1) 8414913
--------------------------

C. Chiung Li
ICA
P.O. Box 2418/26
Beijing
China
li.c.c.%beijing@ira.uka.de
Phone: 890581/631
Telex: 22558 Nisti CN
--------
Y. Fung Wang
ICA Institute Peking
P.O. Box 2418
Beijing
China
wang%beijing@ira.uka.de
Phone: 8316864
Telex: 22558 Nisti CN

Be aware that they have to pay dearly for their messages received.  So,
please do not send unnecessary traffic.

--SG

From @ricevm1.rice.edu:CHINANET@TAMVM1.BITNET Fri Jul 17 13:04:02 1992
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Date:         Fri, 17 Jul 1992 12:02:00 CDT
Reply-To: "CHINANET: Networking In China" <CHINANET%TAMVM1.BITNET@ricevm1.rice.edu>
Sender: "CHINANET: Networking In China" <CHINANET%TAMVM1.BITNET@ricevm1.rice.edu>
From: Bin Wang <NUS40%TTACS.BITNET@ricevm1.rice.edu>
Subject:      New Report on Networking in PRC
To: Multiple recipients of list CHINANET <CHINANET%TAMVM1.BITNET@ricevm1.rice.edu>
Status: RO

Hi, Everybody,

There is a new report about the network in PRC coming out. It can surely give
us a better understanding on this topic.

Enjoy !

Bin Wang (USTC869)



-------------------------------CUT HERE-------------------------------------

  [Dr. David Kahaner is a numerical analyst on sabbatical to the
   Office of Naval Research-Asia (ONR Asia) in Tokyo from NIST.  The
   following is the professional opinion of David Kahaner and in no
   way has the blessing of the US Government or any agency of it.  All
   information is dated and of limited life time.  This disclaimer should
   be noted on ANY attribution.]

  [Copies of previous reports written by Kahaner can be obtained using
   anonymous FTP from host cs.arizona.edu, directory japan/kahaner.reports.]

To: Distribution
From:
 David K. Kahaner
 US Office of Naval Research Asia
 (From outside US):  23-17, 7-chome, Roppongi, Minato-ku, Tokyo 106 Japan
 (From within  US):  Unit 45002, APO AP 96337-0007
  Tel: +81 3 3401-8924, Fax: +81 3 3403-9670
  Email: kahaner@cs.titech.ac.jp
Re: Networking in PRC China (Kuo)
15 July 1992
This file is named "china.net"

ABSTRACT. A description of networking activities in PRC (China).
(F.F.Kuo, SRI)

My report on the Internetworking conference [inet.92, 26 June 1992] was
read by

        Dr. Franklin F. Kuo
        Executive Director, Asian Programs
        SRI International
        333 Ravenswood Avenue
        Menlo Park, CA 94025
         Tel: (415) 859-4116; Fax: (415) 859-6171
         Email: KUO@NISC.SRI.COM

Dr Kuo was particularly interested in the sections on China, as he has
recently completed a visit to look at the networking situation there,
and has prepared the report below detailing his trip. It provides
material supplemental to that in my report and should be of value to
those interested in the developments of international networking.

*********************************************************************


NETWORKING IN THE PEOPLE'S REPUBLIC OF CHINA (PRC)

by Franklin F. Kuo, SRI International

At the invitation of the China Institute of Communications, the Citizen
Ambassador Program of People to People International arranged a visit
for a delegation of professionals in telecommunications and networking
technology to the People's Republic of China. I was the leader of the
delegation, whose purpose was to exchange information and solidify
contacts with Chinese professionals within the computer and
communications industry.  The exchange focussed on topics dealing with
China's telecommunications infrastructure, especially on subjects
relating to current research and applications in computer networks. This
group, known as the Networking Technology Delegation, consisted of 24
members, with 18 professionals, and 6 accompanying spouses. Of the 24
there were 17 people from the US, 5 from Japan (2 US citizens residing
in Tokyo) one from Germany, and one from Hong Kong, so it was truly an
international group. Six members of the delegation were native Chinese
speakers, which made it very convenient in our travels.

The itinerary for our trip was as follows:

May 11-15, 1992 Beijing

May 15-19, Xi'an

May 19-22, Shanghai

May 22-24, Hong Kong

Our professional visits concentrated on telecommunications and on
computer networking. We visited a number of the major research
institutes and universities in Beijing, Xi'an and Shanghai. In all three
cities there was a lot of interest in computer networking, especially in
the Internet, and how to connect to it. Another question that frequently
came up was the future of OSI vs that of TCP/IP. There are a lot of
local area networks in operation in China, connecting many PC-clones,
mostly Chinese produced, to some older-generation mainframes such as
Honeywells. What we did not see were operational wide-area networks,
with the exception of a metropolitan demonstration network in Beijing.

Current Wide Area Networks

At present, the major wide area network (WAN) in China is the China
National Public Data Network, CNPAC, which is currently being developed
and implemented. CNPAC, an X-25 packet switched network is designed to
carry data at speeds varying between 1.2 and 9.6 Kbps. The hub is in
Beijing, where the network management center is located, with packet
switches sited in the major cities of Shanghai and Guangzhou, and PS
concentrators found in other major cities. The packet switches,
concentrators, and PADs (packet assembly/disassembly devices) are all
manufactured in China. At the Beijing hub, there is an international
access line to CNPAC. Since we did not see a CNPAC demonstration, it is
not clear how much of it is operational and how much is still under
development.

There are other private data networks in use in China in applications in
the railway system, banking system, civil aeronautics, etc.

In China, there is an X.25 link to the Internet using a store and
forward system via the CNPAC international access line in Beijing
connecting to the University of Karlsruhe, Germany.  To the outside
world, this link is being called "the China Academic Network (CANET)".
In addition to CNPAC connectivity, there is dial-up access to CANET from
inside China. David Kahaner of ONR Tokyo reports that he frequently
communicates with Chinese scientists via CANET. However, many of the
Chinese networking specialists we talked to have never heard of the name
"CANET", so we suspect that CANET means more to the outside world than
in China.

The major problem confronting the development of WANs in China is the
poor telecommunications infrastructure. Since the penetration of basic
plain old telephone service (POTS) is less than 1% among Chinese
businesses and households, and since local and long distance telephone
switching and transmission facilities are inadequate and antiquated, it
is difficult to build a modern computer network upon the current
telecommunications infrastructure.  It will take decades to bring the
basic telecommuncations system up to modern standards, so Chinese
networking will take a long time to come up to western norms also.

Metropolitan and Campus Networks

In Beijing, we witnessed a very impressive metropolitan networking
project called NCFC (National Computing and Networking Facility of
China). NCFC is a demonstration network in Beijing linking the two major
universities, Tsinghua and Beijing Universities to a number of research
institutes of the Chinese Academy of Sciences (CAS). Each of the
pariticipating institutions have campus networks like the TUnet of
Tsinghua University.  These campus networks are connected by NCFC as a
two level system. Currently NCFC has a 10Mbps backbone connecting the
three campus networks, which will increase to 100Mbps in the next phase
of the project. Communication protocols will be ISO/OSI, but TCP/IP is
the first phase protocol. The top level of NCFC consists of the backbone
and the network control center.  The second level is composed of campus
networks at the two universities and CAS. NCFC is the largest and most
ambitious networking project we saw in China. It is partially funded by
the World Bank and the State Planning Commission, and is in limited
operation now, with full operation expected by 1994. We visited two of
the three groups who are participating in the development of NCFC. The
first was the Computer Network Center (CNC) of the Chinese Academy of
Sciences, with its own campus network, the CASnet.  The CNC seems to
have the major responsibility for the development of NCFC, and is
staffed by 40 professionals. The second group, in Tsinghua University,
is described next.

The Tsinghua University Network (TUnet)

The most impressive university networking group we visited was at
Tsinghua University, the premier technical university in China. Under
the direction of Professor Hu Daoyuan, the Tsinghua University network,
TUnet is being developed under a well laid-out strategy based upon the
following goals:

1. It will be a universal, comprehensive campus network; its usage will
include instruction, research, administration, library, and
communications services.

2. It will be a multimedia integrated services network; messages
transmitted in the network will include not only data, but voice and
video as well.

3. It will operate under accepted international standards for
interfacing devices to the network. Emerging standards are important in
the fast changing technology of networking. Initially TUnet will operate
under TCP/IP, but migration strategies have been adopted to migrate to
ISO/OSI.

4. It will be a heterogeneous network using a variety of advanced
networking technologies (LAN, PABX, PS, ISDN and FDDI, etc) to
interconnect multivendor computing facilities.

5. It will be developed in phases, with the first phase (1987 to 1991)
concentrating on interconnection of facilties, and the second phase
(1992 to 1995) emphasizing network services.

In TUnet there are three major networking facilities:

a. A circuit switched network based upon an integrated services PABX,

b. A packet switching network based upon X.25 switches and PADs,

c. Ethernet LANs interconnected through a 100 Mbps FDDI optical fiber
backbone.

A key function of TUnet is electronic mail. Tsinghua University's
message handling system (MHS) functions includes mail, telegraph,
teletext, fax, videotex, voice, images, etc. The MHS is based upon the
EAN system developed by the University of British Columbia conforming to
the CCITT X.400 recommendation series of 1984. Tsinghua's work on its
e-mail system includes migration, Chinese localization, menu adaptation
and the implementation of remote user agents.

The work at Tsinghua on TUnet and NCFC underlines one of the basic
constraints that Chinese networking technologists must live with. Unless
you have foreign (hard) currencies to purchase networking equipment,
you've got to design and build everything from scratch, including
hardware and software. So TUnet represents in many ways a bootstrap
operation. The people in TUnet are all very well trained and dedicated.
It is unfortunate that they could not make use of technology that is
readily available in the Western world.

Local Area Networks (LANs)

In China today there are many LANs in use. Two common LAN products
widely available throughout China are Ethernets from 3COM, and Netware,
a LAN operating system developed by the Novell company. These products
are available in China because of joint venture arrangements that the
cited companies have made with Chinese counterparts. Most of the LAN
products are manufactured in China under license from US companies such
as 3COM and Novell.  At the Shanghai Jiao Tong University, Professor
Yang Chuan-hou, the Director of the Computer Network Research Laboratory
presented to us some work which dealt with an architectural design of a
gateway interconncting LANs to an X.25 packet switched network.  The
work again was developmental in nature, in that both hardware and
software designs were implemented in the laboratory.

Work like that of Professor Yang and his colleagues illustrate the
practical nature of the networking development going on in China today.
I visited China in 1984, when I was a World Bank consultant to Shanghai
Jiao Tong University.  In the intervening years, there has been an
explosive growth in both computing and networking technology in China,
which will only accelerate with the further penetration of the Internet
into China. Since the Internet is capable of bringing network
specialists and users throughout the world into a larger cooperating
community, I believe that China's networking community will soon become
full partners in this world-wide community.

------------------------------END OF REPORT------------------------------

From CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu Thu Jul 23 21:16:57 1992
Received: from uga.cc.uga.edu by sirius.ctr.columbia.edu (5.67/5.10) with SMTP id AA08778; Thu, 23 Jul 92 21:16:50 -0400
Received: from UGA.CC.UGA.EDU by uga.cc.uga.edu (IBM VM SMTP V2R2)
   with BSMTP id 7423; Thu, 23 Jul 92 21:14:55 EDT
Received: from UGA.BITNET by UGA.CC.UGA.EDU (Mailer R2.07) with BSMTP id 8802;
 Thu, 23 Jul 92 21:14:53 EDT
Date:         Thu, 23 Jul 1992 18:37:45 CDT
Reply-To: yuan <T900238%NIUCS.BITNET@uga.cc.uga.edu>
Sender: Chinese Computing Network <CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu>
From: yuan <T900238%NIUCS.BITNET@uga.cc.uga.edu>
Subject:      /post question on NCSA Telnet
Comments: To: Avron Boretz <xhgy@crux1.cit.cornell.edu>,
              u7911013@cc.nctu.edu.tw, ccnet-l@uga.BITNET
To: Multiple recipients of list CCNET-L <CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu>
In-Reply-To:  Your message of Thu, 23 Jul 92 18:12:35 -0400
Status: RO

On Thu, 23 Jul 92 18:12:35 -0400 you said:
>Yes, if you do find a solution, please let me know.  I'm not familiar with
>what you call the "Chinese version of NCSA telnet."  Can you drop me a line
>with some information on that?  Incidentally, I haven't tried any of this on
>a Mac or Unix machine, only a PC (I don't know if there are any Big-5 programs
>for Mac or Unix...).
>Avron
    There are several ways to login to another host. You can go through
  Unix host and VM/CMS host or whatever. For the LAN users, they can
  login to another host too, and they need not to bother logining to
  local host then out. Instead, they can telnet directly to anywhere
  in Internet. NCSA developed ftp and telnet for this. Note that, this
  is not all the case, and it depends on inplementation in each LAN.
    You can try ftp twnmoers2.edu.tw, under /chinese-pub, to find for your
  MAC version, if I don't forget. The exact file name will be something
  like TEL23**.ZIP. After you got it, use "pkunzip -d tel23**" to uncompress.
  If you don't have this utility for Mac, you can get it too on the directory
  around, again, I am not exactly sure. I hope somebody can give me the right
  infomation if I am wrong. Thanks..       --yuan

From CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu Fri Jul 24 05:03:55 1992
Received: from uga.cc.uga.edu by sirius.ctr.columbia.edu (5.67/5.10) with SMTP id AA12023; Fri, 24 Jul 92 05:03:46 -0400
Received: from UGA.CC.UGA.EDU by uga.cc.uga.edu (IBM VM SMTP V2R2)
   with BSMTP id 8737; Fri, 24 Jul 92 05:02:12 EDT
Received: from UGA.BITNET by UGA.CC.UGA.EDU (Mailer R2.07) with BSMTP id 8936;
 Fri, 24 Jul 92 05:02:11 EDT
Date:         Fri, 24 Jul 1992 03:28:18 CDT
Reply-To: yuan <T900238%NIUCS.BITNET@uga.cc.uga.edu>
Sender: Chinese Computing Network <CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu>
From: yuan <T900238%NIUCS.BITNET@uga.cc.uga.edu>
Subject:      /post ===Internet Tools======
Comments: To: u7911013@cc.nctu.edu.tw, ccnet-l@uga.BITNET,
              JYE@TWNAS886.BITNET, wyk238@csd4.csd.uwm.edu,
              t900239@niucs.BITNET, JASMIN@TWNMOE10.EDU.TW,
              T90KMC8@niucs.BITNET
To: Multiple recipients of list CCNET-L <CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu>
Status: RO

     If you are trying to find some instruction regarding how to be
  in Internet society. You may use the following as reference. Basically,
  This is regarding how I use them. Therefore, you need not to take them
  too seriously. If anything good you find, just pick them up and use it as
  your own experiences. But if something wrong(should be a lot) with my
  experiences, pls give your responses and corrections to me and other
  friends too.
    I have put them up to twnmoers2.edu.tw(140.111.2.22) only, so if anyone
  give me idea where I can upload. Then everyone can download them here
  in the U.S.
    You are allowed to print them out and make a phisical copy and,
  share them with any or your friends. I think these articles are all
  describe in details with examples supported. So, these may be good materials
  to reference especially for those new netusers.
    One more thing: Note that, these are all writen in  """"Chinese"""".


             === INTERNET TOOLS ====
                                           by --yuan

    Chap0        1. Briefly introductions to Internet
                 2. The first step on computer communication

    Chap1  ###   1. Regarding Eletronic Mail
           ###   2. Mailer--VM/CMS
           ###   3. Mailer--Unix
                 4. Fidonet <--> Internet

    Chap2  ###   1. Intruction to FTP with example using Unix
           ###   2. Unix's ftp command
           ###   3. example using VM/CMS
                 4  Applications:
                       .  .
                       .  . still writing
                       .  .
    Chap3  ###   1. Regarding Remote access with ex. using VM/CMS
                 2. Applications:
           ###      a. Regarding Archie with ex. using Unix
                    b. Library system on Internet
                       with ex. ???????
                    c. Regarding Gopher
                    d. Internet-based BBS vs PC-based BBS
                 .    .
                 .    .

    chap4   ###  1. Remote on-line interactive message with ex.
            ###       Tell & Send in VM/CMS & VAX/VMS through BITNET
            ###       Unix's talk through Internet
                 2. About Listserv...
                 3. NCSA's FTP & TELNET for LAN users
                 4. Regarding TANet
                   . .
                   . .

    Appen     dix 1. Total file lists of twnmoers2.edu.tw
                  2. Some important libraries with address listed


           ===  THOSE AVAILABLE TOPICS ARE MARKED BY '#' MARKS. ====


-rw-r--r--  1 t900238      1696 Jul 24 01:00 Index.big5
-rw-r--r--  1 t900238      1923 Jul 24 01:03 chap1_1_Email.big5
-rw-r--r--  1 t900238     32015 Jul 24 00:58 chap1_2_Email_VMCMS.big5
-rw-r--r--  1 t900238     18542 Jul 24 00:52 chap1_3_Email_Unix.big5
-rw-r--r--  1 t900238      9220 Jul 24 00:52 chap2_1_ftp_Unix.big5
-rw-r--r--  1 t900238      3753 Jul 24 00:56 chap2_2_ftp_Unix_cmd.big5
-rw-r--r--  1 t900238      8513 Jul 24 00:53 chap2_3_FTP_VMCMS.big5
-rw-r--r--  1 t900238      7633 Jul 24 01:01 chap3_1_TELNET.big5
-rw-r--r--  1 t900238     18417 Jul 24 00:55 chap3_2a_Archie.big5
-rw-r--r--  1 t900238     16451 Jul 24 01:02 chap4_1_On_Line_MSG.big5
-rw-r--r--  1 t900238       826 Jul 24 01:56 readme_1st.english

From CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu Tue Sep 24 20:52:40 1991
Received: from uga.cc.uga.edu by sirius.ctr.columbia.edu (5.61/5.10) with SMTP id AA14705; Tue, 24 Sep 91 20:52:22 -0400
Received: from UGA.CC.UGA.EDU by uga.cc.uga.edu (IBM VM SMTP R1.2.2MX) with BSMTP id 6500; Tue, 24 Sep 91 20:52:04 EDT
Received: from UGA.BITNET by UGA.CC.UGA.EDU (Mailer R2.07) with BSMTP id 3557;
 Tue, 24 Sep 91 20:52:02 EDT
Date:         Wed, 25 Sep 1991 03:07:00 CST
Reply-To: "JYMMI C. TSENG" <U431573%TWNCU865.BITNET@uga.cc.uga.edu>
Sender: Chinese Computing Network <CCNET-L%UGA.BITNET@uga.cc.uga.edu>
From: "JYMMI C. TSENG" <U431573%TWNCU865.BITNET@uga.cc.uga.edu>
Subject:      Taiwan Domain Name
To: Multiple recipients of list CCNET-L <CCNET-L@UGA>
Status: RO

Dear Tom,

        You ask about the network situation in Taiwan;

There are about 12 BITNET nodes in Taiwan, with the root node
TWNMOE10 (Ministry of Education) connecting to JPNSUT00.
The BITNET line appears to be a direct leased line and
it's load is heavy, so the Ministry of Education is getting
a direct link to the U.S. Internet this September or October.

The major universities have already been preparing for this
hookup with a national academic network based on the
Internet protocols, we call this network TANET
(Taiwan Academic NETwork).

The registered domain name for Taiwan is tw.
The Taiwan ministry of Education is responsible for administration
of subdomains under the edu.tw. category.
Our University (National Central University)
is assigned the domainname ncu.edu.tw.

For starters, you might try the address guest@sun1.ncu.edu.tw,
but I 'm afraid as of this writting, the physical link
for the Internet link to U.S. is not yet active. Maybe
the Ministry of Education TWNMOE10 mailer is smart enough
to recognize where you are attempting to send to, maybe it is not.

Hope this helps!

Jymmi C. Tseng
NCU/IM

From sol.ctr.columbia.edu!caen!sdd.hp.com!samsung!munnari.oz.au!metro!cluster!liu Mon Feb  9 19:50:34 EST 1987
Article: 18796 of soc.culture.china
Path: sol.ctr.columbia.edu!caen!sdd.hp.com!samsung!munnari.oz.au!metro!cluster!liu
From: liu@cs.su.oz (Liu Yusheng)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: Re: Help: eMail to China?
Message-ID: <1222@cluster.cs.su.oz.au>
Date: 28 Sep 90 00:47:08 GMT
References: <26354@cs.yale.edu> <4d0cb146.12c9a@digital.sps.mot.com>
Sender: news@cluster.cs.su.oz.au
Reply-To: liu@cluster.cs.su.oz (Liu Yusheng)
Organization: Basser Dept of Computer Science, University of Sydney, Australia
Lines: 48
Status: RO


China does have connections to the worldwide network. At least the
Institute of Computer Applications in Beijing had a link to West
Germany in 1988. I used the following addresses to send a greeting
E-Mail to Beijing from Sydney University in the early 1988, and I
received a reply.

rzli%beijing@ira.uka.de
MAIL%beijing@ira.uka.de


The following are the E-Mail addresses to Institute of Computer
Applications (Beijing) which I got in December 1988.

China
wang%beijing@ira.uka.de                   Yun Feng Wang
postmaster%beijing@ira.uka.de             Chuquan Yang


The following are the people who act as the network coordinators
for CANET (China Academic NET).

CHINA
 
Shao-Hong Li
Institute of Computer Applications
c/o Prof Wang, ICA
P.O. Box 2418
Beijing, China
relay.cs.net
Phone:  890581 636
Telex:  22558 NISTI CN

Tian-Bai Qian
Institute of Computer Applications
c/o Prof Wang, ICA
P.O. Box 2418
Beijing, China
Phone:  8313219
Telex:  22558 NISTI CN

Chu-Quan Yang
Academy of Machinery Equipment R&D
c/o Prof Wang, ICA
P.O. Box 2418
Beijing, China
Phone:  8313227
Telex:  22558 NISTI CN


From sol.ctr.columbia.edu!lll-winken!sun-barr!ames!uhccux!wiliki!xli Mon Feb  9 20:13:37 EST 1987
Article: 18805 of soc.culture.china
Path: sol.ctr.columbia.edu!lll-winken!sun-barr!ames!uhccux!wiliki!xli
From: xli@wiliki.eng.hawaii.edu (Xun Li)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: Email to China
Message-ID: <9568@uhccux.uhcc.Hawaii.Edu>
Date: 27 Sep 90 03:16:30 GMT
Sender: news@uhccux.uhcc.Hawaii.Edu
Reply-To: xli@wiliki.UUCP (Xun Li)
Organization: University of Hawaii, College of Engineering
Lines: 43
Status: RO


    I happen to have a friend in Beijing, from whom I learned something about
computer network and email systems in China. Let me share those with you
guys out there.

    According to my friend, there are only a few local area networks(LAN)
in China, for example, most of the computers of the Academia Sinica in
Zhong(1) Guan(1) Cun(1) area in Beijing are connected by a local
ethernet, and it is thus called "Zhong Guan Cun Wang". There are basically
two routes that connect this network in Beijing to the US, one is through
Japan and another is through HongKong, and the later one is the path used
most of the time.

    When one message is sent from this "Zhong Guan Cun Wang" to the US,
it goes through two major gateways, one is in the Hong Kong University,
namely, hkucnt.hku.hk, anthother is located in New York with the network
name of CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU. Typically it takes some 20 hours for a message
from Beijing to reach my computer here.

   Although there are email links to China and they have been there for
years, yet they are not efficient and reliable ones. My friends kept 
complaining that he didn't get my reply messages and I simply just hadn't
received them. Furthermore, the capacity on the link is so small that
any message larger than 10K bytes has a risk of being cancelled at the
Hong Kong gateway, and people at Hong Kong just send a short message to
Beijing that one message for somebody is too large and got cancelled.
Besides, all the service the network in Beijing provides is email, other
network capabilities such as FTP, RLOGIN and TELNET are not available,
partly because that the network is not technically good enough to provide
interactive services.

    Despite all those inconvenience of this link to Beijing, one thing is
certain, it is FREE. My friend never mentioned that there is any charge
on the email service, nor did he always send me short messages or ask me
to send him short ones.

    If any SCCer has more questions regarding this network matter, I will
be happy to answer them or direct them to my friend.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Xun Li 				EE Dept., University of Hawaii
xli@wiliki.eng.hawaii.edu	2540 Dole st. #483, Honolulu, HI96822 
-----------------------------------------------------------------------


From sol.ctr.columbia.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!swrinde!ucsd!ucbvax!VAXA.BANGOR.AC.UK!ABP004 Fri Nov  2 21:51:49 EST 1990
Article: 20644 of soc.culture.china
Path: sol.ctr.columbia.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!swrinde!ucsd!ucbvax!VAXA.BANGOR.AC.UK!ABP004
From: ABP004@VAXA.BANGOR.AC.UK
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: Email to China and HK
Message-ID: <9011011930.AA17905@lilac.berkeley.edu>
Date: 31 Oct 90 17:14:00 GMT
Sender: daemon@ucbvax.BERKELEY.EDU
Lines: 52
Status: RO

Source: Tim Clark, University of Warwick, UK

_______________
|CANET - CHINA|
---------------

A network gatewayed via the University of Kalsrhue  in  West
Germany and thence to Beijing. In general you should be able
to reach a user in China using the address:

     user%beijing%ira.uka.de%net.cs.relay@uk.ac.nsfnet-relay

or perhaps:

     user%beijing%de.uka.ira@uk.ac.earn-relay

There are more than 30 member institutions of CANET. several
institutions use a personal computer and a modem to login on
an account at the host Beijing to read and post  mail.  That
is why the site is not identified in the address.

The following points have been made:

     Please don't send tons of  information  to  China.  The
     link is slow and both ends pay dearly for each byte.

     Please avoid sending political statements.  This  could
     do more harm than use.

The postmaster at Beijing is called `mail' not `postmaster'.

CANET is not related  to  the  CHINANET-BITNET  project  (of
which I have no information apart from this sentence).

____________________
|HARNET - HONG KONG|
--------------------

This is the Hong Kong part of  the  UUCP  network.  However,
only  the  gateway machine, hkucs, is in the UUCP site maps.
Therefore to reach other machines on this network such as:

     cpccvx, hkucc, hkueee, encvax,  hkpv07,  cucsc,  bc750,
     hkpv03, hkpv06, hkpv08, cucsd, cuele, bc785a, bc785b

route the call via hkucs.uucp. I.e.:

     person%site%hkucs.uucp@uk.ac.ukc

or

     person%site%hkucs.uucp%net.uu.uunet@uk.ac.nsfnet-relay


From sol.ctr.columbia.edu!samsung!usc!elroy.jpl.nasa.gov!jarthur!ucivax!gateway Sun Mar 10 00:14:58 EST 1991
Article: 26256 of soc.culture.china
Path: sol.ctr.columbia.edu!samsung!usc!elroy.jpl.nasa.gov!jarthur!ucivax!gateway
From: yeh@netix.COM (Shannon Yeh)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: network in China
Message-ID: <9103090106.AA02738@netix.com>
Date: 9 Mar 91 01:18:33 GMT
Lines: 80
Status: RO


I was asked by some gentlemen to draw a brief picture for China's
current network apllication status.  I am not in that position, in deed,
to do such a job.  Anyhow, today is Friday, time does allow
me to draft some words here. I wish it being helpful.

1. Background

In early 80s, Beijing tried to help Wang's company to open its market in
China. That man did not go back to China to show some friendship until his
late days.  So, most of the early networks (local) are WANGNet, no more.

In middle 80s, China bought many LAN equipments from 3Com directly or
indirectly (Regan had some strange trade policy with China then. As I
can recall, 3Com's server equipment was not allowed to export to China).

Unfortunately, Novell's products did not have a good market sharing in
China.

Until 1989, most of the networks (more than 95%) in China are LANs.

2. Which area has more networks in China?

2.1  DoD
2.2  Iron and Steel companies such as Beijing Capital I&S Company, etc.
2.2  Electricity & Power Administration Bureaus such as the E&P Administration
     Bureau of North Eastern China, etc.
2.3  Oil industries such as Ministry of Petroleum

3. Why no networks on Chinese campuses?

No money.  Once they get soem cash, they usually like to use that cash to
send some visting "scholars" to foreign countries.  As a kind of convention,
many campuses in China love to get equipments through donation channels,
such as donation from the World Bank, UN Education section, some rich men
in HongKong, etc.

I also personally believe, if they allow students to talk with each other
through network mail, more events shall happen in TAM square. :-)

3. In contrast to other Asian countries, where does China stand in terms
   of network applications?

China's network is not much inferrior to Japan.  ( countries like China and
Soviet Union usually like to put most of their cash into defense)

4. what is the bottleneck for China's network business?

They do not have a AT&T like PDN (Public Data Network).  They even do not
have a capacity trunk to carry telephone messages, let alone electronic
mail messages. (For civilian use, not for non-civilian use).

5. how could we (Chinese in US) contribute?

We need to help China to develop new transmission media, which is financially
affordable, and can provide relative communication reliability, maybe something
like radio and sattelite.  It is impossible for China to setup its cross-
country cable based network.

6. they did not much follow TCP/IP, why?

They usually like to send directors or ministers or other bureacrats to
visit outside world.  Those guys know nothing about network, but some
ABC things.  Since OSI is an international standard, and TCP/IP is a
U.S. standard, and "International >> U.S.", they trust OSI a lot.

7. Some short term troble for exchange mail in Chinese

Currently SMTP mail in Internet supoorts 7-bit (ASCII) only.  Chinese
characters is a kind of video-mode stuff (8-bit).  So, send messages
in Chinese between here and China might be a trouble for the timebeing.

But, it will be fixed one way or ther orther soon.


I wish you could add some information to make this draft more detailed.


shannon
-------


From sol.ctr.columbia.edu!bronze!xiong@bsu-cs.bsu.edu Sun Mar 10 01:07:16 EST 1991
Article: 26297 of soc.culture.china
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Path: sol.ctr.columbia.edu!bronze!xiong@bsu-cs.bsu.edu
From: xiong@bsu-cs.bsu.edu (Bo Xiong)
Subject: E-Link between PRC and Canada (Re: Network in China)
Message-ID: <1991Mar9.080704.16573@bronze.ucs.indiana.edu>
Sender: <xiong@bsu-cs.bsu.edu>
Organization: Indiana University
Date: Sat, 9 Mar 91 03:05:49 -0500
Lines: 120
Status: RO

There have been many significant discussions on the network in China,
however, it seems to me that no one has mentioned the "network/link" 
between PRC and Canada.  I am posting three messages on this subject I 
received last July, since my friend (who is working on Ph.D. in networking 
in a Canadian school) requested me not to releasae details, I deleted 
his/her name and the name of the gateway host to those Chinese sites.

BTW, I myself and a few of my friends have been successfully sending/
receiving e-mail to/from PRC (take days long sometimes :-) via the link 
between Hong Kong Univ. and Beijing Univ. and between a German Univ. and 
PRC Ministry of Machinery and etc. which have been mentioned many times 
on SCC.
                                                      Bo Xiong
------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Message No.1
------------
>From ****@****.*****.ca Wed Jul 25 13:19:52 1990
Subject: for your info --- do not spread

Hi Bo,

I know that book, and you probably can find it in many libraries.

    J. S. Quarterman, ``The Matrix'',  Digital Press, 1990.

I read part of it in early 1989. The book summarizes all the current 
networks in the world. It even contains the China-net --- the early 
email discussion group among oversea Chinese students --- pre-SCC. 

However, I think some information on that book are old or out of date,
especially those information about China. Recently, people at ***** CS 
dept are able to receive email from Tsinghua directly, and from Beijing 
Univ through HK univ. A large local area network project has been set 
up among Tsinghua, Beida, Sino Academy of science in Zhong Guan villege 
area, and Northern China computing research institute. The email address 
format, taking from the message recently received from Tsinghua is 
<userid@cnlab.cc.tsinghua.ncfc.cn>. I expect other institutes will adopt 
the same naming convention sooner or later, although the source address 
of the messages from Beida are quite odd (no machine can recognize them!). 
I tried to send confirmation message back to the above address, and it 
went through.

Since Tsinghua - ***** link has not been commercialized, it is really still
in the stage of negotiating (accounting, routing table update management
...), the system manager discourage people use it for the moment. Also 
since the routing table in other sites' have not been updated, their 
machines would not know how to route messages to CNnet. In case you want 
to send to China using Tsinghua - ***** link, you will have to explicitly 
route your message through ***** (the same trick used in early stage of
CND to deliver mail to some Canadian and European sites if you still 
remember :-) as the following:

	<userid%cnlab.cc.tsinghua.ncfc.cn@*****.********.ca>

On the other hand, I tend to let fewer people know this link for the 
following reasons:

1) Our fellow Chinese tend to do things in "bulk" (Yi\ Wo- feng-) beside
taking advantage of cheap things. If too many people use it now, traffic 
will be very high and it will put too much pressure on making the link 
commercial, since only ***** and Tsinghua will pay the money for the 
international traffic between Canada and China (e.g., XX only needs to 
pay XX - ***** traffic for a mesasge from XX to Tsinghua). I prefer delay 
the announcement until its commercial negotiation finishes.

2) networking info is a sensitive thing to Chinese security. If people start
to pour in political related message into that link, China may be alerted and
close the link or restrict the use of network. The best thing is to let it
go and take it easy. So that the current hardline regime does not realize 
what network means to them until it grows too big to control. Remember what 
role that thousands Fax machines over China played after June 4th 1989. After 
more international links set up, it will be impossible for chinese security 
to monitor all the network traffic.
(I played an very active key role in helping Tsinghua in importing the EAN 
X400 message system software from Canada [high tech export requires export 
permit from Canadian government] and setting up the Tsinghua - ***** link).

This is just for your information.  you may forward this message to CND 
people with or without my name.

--- **** ****

Footnote: I say Quarterman's book is old because in his book, all the nodes
in China are "remote nodes" of Germen network since they are named like that. 
The current CNnet has its own independent naming structure which is consistent 
with the internationally adopted domain name convention and which will be 
recognizable by other machines just like CAnet address in Canada, without 
going to German network.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------

Message No.2 
------------
>From ****@****.*****.ca Wed Jul 25 13:22:36 1990
Subject: for your info --- do not spread

BTW, Tsinghua calls to ***** everyday now. I checked the message trasmission
time, it only take 1 minutes.

The Tsinghua - ***** link is a high speed X.25 link. They are working on 
getting a leased line from telephone company.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Message No.3
------------
>From ****@****.*****.ca Wed Jul 25 14:18:25 1990
Subject: for your info --- do not spread


The link between China and Germany mentioned in your message 
is a link between a machine in Beijing Institute of tech (belongs
to Chinese national machinary committee) and univ of University.
It is a different link.

I also over heard that Fuda U in Shanghai has a link to somewhere 
in US. does any of you have any clue in this?
----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Posted by Bo Xiong in Chicago



From sol.ctr.columbia.edu!caen!sdd.hp.com!elroy.jpl.nasa.gov!usc!orion.oac.uci.edu!ucivax!gateway Sat Mar  9 22:20:02 EST 1991
Article: 26127 of soc.culture.china
Path: sol.ctr.columbia.edu!caen!sdd.hp.com!elroy.jpl.nasa.gov!usc!orion.oac.uci.edu!ucivax!gateway
From: yeh@netix.COM (Shannon Yeh)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Subject: CRN--China Research Network (RE: network to china)
Message-ID: <9103072004.AA00333@netix.com>
Date: 7 Mar 91 20:12:21 GMT
Lines: 165
Status: RO


An experimental network, CRN (China Research Network), in China is supposedly
to be functioning this month.  If you have friends there, you might be able
to reach them through Internet.  Basically, the long-haul network in China is
in its childhood, and as of the expenses of bandwidth, they do not have a
public available newgroup for criticizing CCP, yet. :-).  The birth of CRN
means CCP bureacrats did listen to outsiders' voice.  Let's hope CCP can play
some role in the network community.

Because some scientists in Beijing are kind of "a little girl who has
never seen big boy", they just simplly follow the OSI protocol suite (a
"international standard" actually used in Europe). They did not well follow
the TCP/IP protocols used in Internet (ARPANet).

CRN's top domain is CN (China).

Some of the well known sites are attached.

shannon
-------

------------------------------cut here--------------------------------
.........
            Configuration of CRN (China Research Network)
            =============================================
                      Effective Date : 1989.10.24

+-------------------+   +---------------------+   +--------------------+
| Shijiazhuang      |   | Beijing             |   | Shanghai           |
|   *               |   |                     |   |                    |
|   +-----------+   |   |   +-------------+   |   |   +------------+   |
|   | C=cn;     |   |   |   | C=cn;       |   |   |   | C=cn;      |   |
|   | ADMD= ;   |   |   |   | ADMD= ;     |   |   |   | ADMD= ;    |   |
|   | PRMD=crn; |   |   |   | PRMD=crn;   |   |   |   | PRMD=crn;  |   |
|   | O=scl;    |   |   |   | O=caeit;    |   |   |   | O=fudan;   |   |
|   | OU=tcl;   |   |   |   | OU=cc;      |   |   |   | OU=cs;     |   |
|   | MTA-Name: |   |   |   | MTA-Name:   |   |   |   | MTA-Name:  |   |
|   |   scl.crn |   |   |   |   caeit.crn |   |   |   |  fudan.crn |   |
|   +-----+-----+   |   |   +------+------+   |   |   +-----+------+   |
|         |         |   |          |          |   |         |          |
+-------- | --------+   |          |          |   |         |          |
          |             |          |          |   |         |          |
          +--------------------+   |   +--------------------+          |
                        |      |   |   |      |   |                    |
                        |   +--+---+---+--+   |   |   +------------+   |
                        |   | C=cn;       |   |   |   | C=cn;      |   |
                        |   | ADMD= ;     |   |   |   | ADMD= ;    |   |
                        |   | PRMD=crn;   |   |   |   | PRMD=crn;  |   |
         Other WEP's <=====>+ O=nci;      +-----------+ O=sjtu;    |   |
                        |   | OU=cnlab;   |   |   |   | OU=ee;     |   |
                        |   | MTA-Name:   |   |   |   | MTA-Name:  |   |
                        |   |  wep.crn.cn |   |   |   |   sjtu.crn |   |
                        |   +--+---+---+--+   |   |   +------------+   |
                        |      |   |   |      |   |                    |
                        +----- | - | - | -----+   |                    |
                               |   |   |          |                    |
          +--------------------+   |   +---------------------+         |
          |                        |              |          |         |
+-------- | --------+   +--------- | ---------+   |          |         |
| Chengdu |         |   | Nanjing  |          |   |          |         |
|   *     |         |   |   *      |          |   |   *      |         |
|   +-----+-----+   |   |   +------+------+   |   |   +------+-----+   |
|   | C=cn;     |   |   |   | C=cn;       |   |   |   | C=cn       |   |
|   | ADMD= ;   |   |   |   | ADMD= ;     |   |   |   | ADMD= ;    |   |
|   | PRMD=crn; |   |   |   | PRMD=crn;   |   |   |   | PRMD=crn;  |   |
|   | O=sci;    |   |   |   | O=seu;      |   |   |   | O=eci;     |   |
|   | OU=osi;   |   |   |   | OU=cs;      |   |   |   | OU=cnlab;  |   |
|   | MTA-Name: |   |   |   | MTA-Name:   |   |   |   | MTA-name:  |   |
|   |   sci.crn |   |   |   |   seu.crn   |   |   |   |   eci.crn  |   |
|   +-----------+   |   |   +-------------+   |   |   +------------+   |
|                   |   |                     |   |                    |
+-------------------+   +---------------------+   +--------------------+

NOTE: (1) This naming and addressing scheme will be put into operation
          in March 1991.
      (2) MTAs "wep.crn.cn", "caeit.crn", "fudan.crn" and "sjtu.crn"
          have been operational, but with different addresses and MTA-Names.
      (3) MTAs with "*" will be operational in 1991.
      (4) Other connections between MTA's are possible but out of CRN's
          responsibility.
      (5) In March 1991, MTA "caeit.crn" will become the WEP of CRN with the
          MTA-Name "wep.crn.cn" and MTA at NCI will be renamed to "nci.crn".

******************

#H DOC=WEP/CRN.CN; RES=Xiaofan ZHAO; DAT=90.05.24

#W MTA=wep.crn.cn; SAA; EAN;
#+ NET=INTLX25; CLDX121=46022010010910; CUDF=ean1;
#C Xiaofan ZHAO
#E C=cn; ADMD=crn ; PRMD=nci-ins; O=beijing; OU=cnlab; G=xf; S=zhao
#T +86 1 201 7661 Ext. 646
#F +86 1 201 8902
#P NCI, P.O. Box 619, Beijing 100083, China
#S COM=mVAX; OPS=VMS-4.7; MHS=DFN-EAN-V2.2
#X C=cn
#D cn
#R Well-known Entry Point (WEP) for China Research Network (CRN)
#+ German WEP "xps.gmd.dbp" could relay mails to CRN at present.

*******************

#H DOC=ORG/CRN.CN; RES=Xiaofan ZHAO; DAT=90.11.22

#O North China Institute of Computing Technology (NCI)
#C Xiaofan ZHAO
#E C=cn; ADMD=crn; PRMD=nci-ins; O=beijing; OU=cnlab; G=xf; S=zhao
#T +86 1 201 7661 Ext. 646
#F +86 1 201 8902
#P NCI, P.O. Box 619, Beijing 100083, China
#S COM=mVAX; OPS=VMS-4.7; MHS=DFN-EAN-V2.2

#O China Academy of Electronics and Information Technology (CAEIT)
#C Yiqun ZHOU
#E C=cn; ADMD=crn; PRMD=caeit-aca; O=cc; OU=mhs; G=yq; S=zhou
#T +86 1 821 2233 Ext. 3337
#P CAEIT, P.O. Box 64, Beijing 100036, China
#S COM=mVAX; OPS=VMS-4.7; MHS=DFN-EAN-V2.2

#O Fudan University (FUDAN)
#C Jiaxing KUANG
#E C=cn; ADMD=crn; PRMD=fudan-uni; O=fudan-uni; OU=cnlab; S=kuang
#T +86 21 5484906 Ext. 2827
#F +86 21 5488839
#P Department of Computer Science, Fudan University, Shanghai 200433, China
#S COM=SUN/3-470; OPS=SUNOS4.0.3; MHS=DFN-EAN-V2.1

#O Shanghai Jiaotong University (SJTU)
#C Jie CHEN
#E C=cn; ADMD=crn; PRMD=sjtu; O=sjtu; OU=ee; S=chen
#T +86 21 2525456 Ext. 27
#F +86 21 4330892
#P Department of Electronic Engineering, Shanghai Jiaotong University,
#+ Shanghai 200052, China
#S COM=Apollo; OPS=Domain/IX-SR-10.2; MHS=DFN-EAN-V2.1

#O Shijiazhuang Communication Laboratory (SCL)
#C Wanquan MA
#E C=cn; ADMD= ; PRMD=crn; O=scl; OU=tcl; G=wanquan; S=ma
#T +86 331 33330 Ext. 4064
#P SCL, P. O. Box 174, Shijiazhuang 050081, China
#S COM=SUN/4-60; OS=SUNOS4.1; MHS=DFN-EAN-V2.1

#O East China Institute of Computer Technology (ECI)
#C Shengchao LU
#E C=cn; ADMD= ; PRMD=crn; O=eci; OU=cnlab; G=shengchao; S=lu
#T +86 21 9530784 Ext. 350
#F +86 21 9530731
#P ECI, P. O. Box 8209, Shanghai 201800, China

#O South East University (SEU)
#C Guoxing WU
#E C=cn; ADMD= ; PRMD=crn; O=seu; OU=cs; G=guoxing; S=wu
#T +86
#F +86
#P Department of Computer Science, South East University, Nanjing 200018, China
#S COM=SUN3/160; OPS=SUNOS3.5; MHS=DFN-EAN-V2.1

#O Sichuan Communication Institute (SCI)
#C ??? ???
#E C=cn; ADMD= ; PRMD=crn; O=sci; OU=osi; G=???; S=???
#T ???
#F ???
#P SCI, P. O. Box 810, Chengdu 610041, China
#S COM=VAX780; OPS=VMS4.7; MHS=DFN-EAN-V2.1


From @cuvmb.cc.columbia.edu:CHINA-NN@ASUACAD.BITNET Thu Jul 25 00:32:00 1991
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Date:         Wed, 24 Jul 91 23:23:35 -0500
Reply-To: CND-EDITOR%BRONZE.UCS.INDIANA.EDU@cuvmb.cc.columbia.edu
Sender: "China News Digest (Global News)" <CHINA-NN%ASUACAD.BITNET@cuvmb.cc.columbia.edu>
From: cnd-editor%bronze.ucs.indiana.edu@cuvmb.cc.columbia.edu
Subject:      CND-Global, July 25
To: Multiple recipients of list CHINA-NN <CHINA-NN@ASUACAD>
Status: RO

                C h i n a  N e w s  D i g e s t

                        (News Global)

                    Thursday,  July 25, 1991

----------------------------------------------------------------------
5. China Opens First Open, Cooperative Computer Network.............28
----------------------------------------------------------------------
From: "HUIJIE CHEN" <chenh@ucs.indiana.edu>
Source: PRNewswire

  DAYTON, Ohio --  NCR (NYSE: NCR) computers are being used by China's
leading technical university to implement the country's first Open,
Cooperative Computing network which links computers from six vendors
into a resource and information-sharing, open systems network.

  Using client/server principles of NCR's Open, Cooperative Computing
Architecture (OCCA), two NCR TOWER 32/600 multi-user computers are at
the center of Qinghua University's UNIX-based network.  It is the first
known implementation of Open, Cooperative Computing in China.

  The TOWERs use the TCP/IP protocol to link large multi-vendor
computers as well as personal computers together.  The TOWER systems
act as both clients of the large computers and servers for the PCs in
the network.

  Multiple concurrent sessions are supported by NCRNet software, which
provides a consistent user interface across all platforms and
applications, with a separate screen window for each session.

  In addition to supporting the cooperative computing network at
Qinghua, the NCR TOWERs are used for UNIX and C programming language
courses. The university has an NCR TOWER demonstration center and also
provides software training courses on the TOWERs for NCR customers in
China.

  NCR Corporation, headquartered in Dayton, Ohio, develops
manufactures, markets, supports and services enterprise-wide
information systems for worldwide markets.

From CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu Tue Sep 10 06:59:51 1991
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 Tue, 10 Sep 91 06:59:16 EDT
Date:         Tue, 10 Sep 1991 18:35:00 +1000
Reply-To: "Huang, Chih-Hsien" <7911013%TWNCTU02.BITNET@uga.cc.uga.edu>
Sender: Chinese Computing Network <CCNET-L%UGA.BITNET@uga.cc.uga.edu>
From: "Huang, Chih-Hsien" <7911013%TWNCTU02.BITNET@uga.cc.uga.edu>
Subject:      E-mail access to M'land China
Comments: To: ccnet-l@UGA.BITNET, infonets@UGA.BITNET,
              soc-culture-china@ucbvax.berkeley.edu,
              soc-culture-taiwan@ucbvax.berkeley.edu
To: Multiple recipients of list CCNET-L <CCNET-L@UGA>
Status: RO

For those concerning connection to mainland CHINA,

As an editor of campus magazine with a special report on network connection
to mainland China, I tried very hard to find out any possibly way for sending
e-mails to there.  I got help from kind netters, from whois database,
knowing that CANET(Chinese Academic Network) users actually have e-mail access
with Internetter.  So I contacted Mr. Qian, the administative contact of
CANET via e-mail and personal letter.  Finally, I got response after Mr. Qian
got my personal letter.  (Now, people in Taiwan can mail letters to mainland
China indirectly, via Hong Kong.)

Mr. Qian gave me some introduction of CANET, and eventually mentioned the
main problem is lack of funds, so people on CANET have to pay fees for
both receiving and sending e-mail abroad.  In this case, after you reading
this message, PLEASE DON'T TRY TO SEND E-MAILS TO MR. QIAN ASKING ABOUT
FURTHER DETAIL, SINCE I CAN NOT MAKE SURE MR. QIAN ALSO HAVE TO PAY FEE
FOR HIS E-MAIL OR NOT.  I am afraid the mail flood will cause another big
problem to him.  Thank you.

Regards,


=== Original message from Mr. Qian ============================================

From:   cn%"QIAN@ica.beijing.canet.cn" 20-AUG-1991 19:18:57.92
To:     7911013@twnctu02.bitnet
CC:
Subj:   reply

Received: From DEARN(MAILER) by TWNCTU02 with Jnet id 6317
          for 7911013@TWNCTU02; Tue, 20 Aug 91 19:18 U
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 09:37:08 CET
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          20 Aug 91 9:32 MET DST
Date: Tue, 20 Aug 91 15:06 CHINA TIME +100
From: QIAN@ica.beijing.canet.cn
Subject: reply
To: 7911013@twnctu02.bitnet
Message-id: <29780B1EE25F00002B@ICA.BEIJING.CANET.CN>
X-Organization: ICA BEIJING CHINA
X-Envelope-to: 7911013@twnctu02.bitnet
X-VMS-To: IN%"7911013@twnctu02.bitnet",QIAN

Mr.Huang,Thank you for your letter of Aug.5.Some time ago I received an email
from you,and I'm sorry Ihave been unable to answer it sooner.Thank you for your
paying great attention for CANET project.
Hherewith I'm encluding the briefly introduction of CANET.
-------------------------------------------------------------------
      CANET , co--initated by ICA ( Beijing  Instutute  for  Computer
  Applications ) and the University  Karlsruhe ( Germany ) , began in
  1986. Its purpose is to integrate chinese academic communities with
  the worldwide computer netowrk, and to promote information exchange
  and technical cooperation with the rest of the world . The  initial
  service provided by CANET is the international E-mail delivery.
      The first connection with CSNET was actually set up in Sep.1987.
  The central machine located in ICA , Siemens 7,760/ BS2000 running
  PMDF/BS2000 software,was successfully connected  with the  E-mail
  systems all over the world by means of the relay machinein  Univer-
  sity of Karlsruhe.
      Since then ,  CANET  has  been operational and has provided the
  worldwide E-mail service for some academic communities within China.
      In 1990 Oct. ,  the  top  level  domain ---" CN " for China was
  registered with DDN SRI--NIC by ICA . This is a very important step
  for the development of CANET.
      CANET is a store and forward electronic mail network .
      Recently,the central machine in CANET is a Micro VAXII--cluster
  system under VMS 4.7 running PMDF 3.1/VMS,which acts as an interna-
  tional gateway linking the main domain server located at Uni. Karl-
  sruhe by x.25 through the CHINAPAC (Chinese Packed Switching Network).
      For remote sites, CANET is accessible for any academic communi-
  ty of China through the CHINAPAC ( national x.25 PDN )  or the dial
  up telephone links, at 1200 bps and 2400 bps or 4800 bps (depending
  on the cost factor ). End--user's PC  or workstations can access to
  local node machine by terminal emulation . CANET  adopts  RFC--822
  formats.
     CHINAPAC , the first national PDN in China , was operational in
  the end of 1989 , it is authorized  by the goverment and run by the
  Ministry  of Posts and Telecommications of China.This network is
  based on x.25 . At persent , it is still on the first stage and has
  3 node-machines ( Package Switching Node ) and 8 package multiplexers
  which are  located  at 11 major cities in China. It has international
  link through the satellites.
     All amchines of CANET implement  Internet  DNS ( domain naming
  system ) syntax.
     The top level domain --- " CN " for China has been  operational
  since Jan.1991 . Currently, the international mail delivery usually
  takes half a day . At present , 16 sites have been connected within
  CANET. It is true , many institutions and universities have estab-
  lished their private local network in the compus, most of them are
  interested in joning CANET.But, there are the financial boundaries--
  ---lack of the funds. If the funding is available, CANET will be
  growing rapidly.
---------------------------------------------------------------------
  Frankly speaking,the CANET has not been a part of the Internet yet,
because it does't implement the TCP/IP protocol suite to link with the
Internet via the leased line directly.that is why CANET is unable to do
FTP and R-Login recently.Also,this is the reason that CANET's user has
to pay the international communication fees not only for sending mail
but also for receiving mail.
  I hope these will be of some help to you.
Best wishes!
Qian,tian-bai

===============================================================================


---------------------------------------------------------------------------
                                   ::   :: .        :;       ,,,,,;.,,,,:.
Huang, Chih-Hsien, E.E.83        ''::'''::'''  ,,,,,;;,,,,;, ::.:., ', ,:
                                   ;:...:;          ::       ::.,.:  ,':,
Email:                         ,,,,,,,,,,,,,;,      ::   .   ::.:...'   ':'
 7911013@TWNCTU02.BITNET         :........;;,   '''''''''''   :.......::,
 7911013%VS3540@TWNCTU01.BITNET  ::   :   ::     :. :.        ::......::
                                 ::''':'''::    :::  ;, ';.   ::......::
National Chiao Tung Univ.        ;:...:...:;   :'::   ' : :;  ::......::
Hsin-chu, Taiwan, R.O.C.        ..;''   '';,  '' ':::::::'   ..;''   '';,

From CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu Mon Sep 23 06:59:01 1991
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Date:         Mon, 23 Sep 1991 18:50:00 +1000
Reply-To: "Huang, Chih-Hsien" <7911013%TWNCTU02.BITNET@uga.cc.uga.edu>
Sender: Chinese Computing Network <CCNET-L%UGA.BITNET@uga.cc.uga.edu>
From: "Huang, Chih-Hsien" <7911013%TWNCTU02.BITNET@uga.cc.uga.edu>
Subject:      Re: Taiwan Domain Name
Comments: To: ccnet-l@UGA.BITNET, U7911013@CCSERV.CC.NCTU.EDU.TW
Comments: cc: cmlee@cory.berkeley.edu
To: Multiple recipients of list CCNET-L <CCNET-L@UGA>
Status: RO

> A friend asks me what is the domain name of Taiwan for the email address.
> Does anyone know about this?
>
> I thought that Taiwan has been on BITNET for while no?  Are they getting
> Internet as well now?
>
> Thanks for the help.
>
> - Tom Chen-Ming Lee
> - cmlee@cory.berkeley.edu

Dear Lee,

Yes, Taiwan has been on BITNET since June, 1987.  In fact, now there are 19
BITNET nodes in Taiwan.  Here is a listing:

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Ref# Conn  Nodeid   Site name
---- ----  ------   ---------
2529 89/05 TWNAS886 Academic Sinica Computing Center VAX8530
2530 88/10 TWNCTUCS National Chiao-Tung University Computer Science and
                    Information Engineering Computer Center
2531 88/09 TWNCTU01 National Chiao-Tung University Computer Center VAX1
2532 91/02 TWNCTU02 National Chiao-Tung University Computer center VAX2
2533 90/03 TWNCU865 National Central University - Computer Center
2534 91/02 TWNFCUC1 FENG CHIA UNIVERSITY - INFORMATION CENTER
2535 90/03 TWNIAMS  Academia Sinica - Institute of Atomic and Molecular
                    Sciences
2536 90/07 TWNIII1  Institute for Information Industry --Computer Center
2537 89/03 TWNITRI1 Industrial Technology Research Institute
2538 91/02 TWNMOCTL TELECOMMUNICATION LABORATORY -- COMPUTER CENTER
2539 87/06 TWNMOE10 Ministry of Education Taiwan
2540 88/08 TWNMOE20 Ministry of Education Taiwan
2541 89/01 TWNNTIT  National Taiwan Institute of Technology Compter Center
2542 87/09 TWNSCU10 Soochow University
2543 89/11 TWNSRRC1 Synchrotron Radication Research Center
2544 90/11 TWNTKU10 TAMKANG UNIVERSITY--INFORMATION CENTER
2545 89/07 TWNTTIT  Tatung Institute of Technology
2546 89/01 TWNTUCC1 National Taiwan University Computer Center VAX2
2547 89/01 TWNTUCC2 National Taiwan University Computer Center CYBER 825
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

Also, Taiwan will be on Internet soon and top-domain "TW" has been registered
for Taiwan.  From whois database:

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Taiwan (TW-DOM)

   Domain Name: TW

   Administrative Contact:
      Chen, Wen-Sung  (WSC1)  ZCHEN@TWNMOE10.BITNET
      886-2-737-7011
   Technical Contact, Zone Contact:
      Liu, Han-Chai  (HL65)  COLOR%TWNMOE10.BITNET@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU
      +886 2 737 7011

   Record last updated on 31-Jul-89.

   Domain servers in listed order:

   HARVARD.HARVARD.EDU          128.103.1.1
   LILAC.Berkeley.EDU           128.32.136.12

   For information concerning this domain, please consult
   the Administrative Contact listed above.
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

Hope this may help you.

Greetings,

---------------------------------------------------------------------------
                                   ::   :: .        :;       ,,,,,;.,,,,:.
Huang, Chih-Hsien, E.E.83        ''::'''::'''  ,,,,,;;,,,,;, ::.:., ', ,:
                                   ;:...:;          ::       ::.,.:  ,':,
Email:                         ,,,,,,,,,,,,,;,      ::   .   ::.:...'   ':'
 7911013@TWNCTU02.BITNET         :........;;,   '''''''''''   :.......::,
 7911013%VS3540@TWNCTU01.BITNET  ::   :   ::     :. :.        ::......::
                                 ::''':'''::    :::  ;, ';.   ::......::
National Chiao Tung Univ.        ;:...:...:;   :'::   ' : :;  ::......::
Hsin-chu, Taiwan, R.O.C.        ..;''   '';,  '' ':::::::'   ..;''   '';,

From CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu Thu Jan 16 14:14:04 1992
Received: from uga.cc.uga.edu by sirius.ctr.columbia.edu (5.61/5.10) with SMTP id AA00954; Thu, 16 Jan 92 14:13:50 -0500
Received: from UGA.CC.UGA.EDU by uga.cc.uga.edu (IBM VM SMTP R1.2.2MX) with BSMTP id 2464; Thu, 16 Jan 92 14:12:32 EST
Received: from UGA.BITNET by UGA.CC.UGA.EDU (Mailer R2.07) with BSMTP id 9955;
 Thu, 16 Jan 92 14:12:14 EST
Date:         Thu, 16 Jan 1992 14:10:48 EST
Reply-To: Qiru Zhou <qzhou%LORELEI.ECE.DREXEL.EDU@uga.cc.uga.edu>
Sender: Chinese Computing Network <CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu>
From: Qiru Zhou <qzhou%LORELEI.ECE.DREXEL.EDU@uga.cc.uga.edu>
Subject:      Re. Li Peng's computer address
Comments: To: ccnet-l@uga.cc.uga.edu
To: Multiple recipients of list CCNET-L <CCNET-L@UGA>
Status: RO

Any host address ended by .cn can be responsed like a valid address by
using "host" command on unix, for example:
$host garbage.cn
will have the following reply:
$garbage.cn mail is handled by irun1.ira.uka.de

It does not mean garbage.cn is a valid host. It only tells you that
mails to domain .cn are relayed by irun1.ira.uka.de. The method to
make sure Li Peng has a real e-mail address is to send a mail to him
with path tracking. You cannot "ping" a site which is relayed to the
net.

QZ

From sol.ctr.columbia.edu!caen!sdd.hp.com!cs.utexas.edu!solo.csci.unt.edu!iex!neptune!john Wed Mar 20 16:55:28 EST 1991
Article: 26897 of soc.culture.china
Xref: sol.ctr.columbia.edu soc.culture.china:26897 soc.culture.taiwan:10451 soc.culture.hongkong:9704
Path: sol.ctr.columbia.edu!caen!sdd.hp.com!cs.utexas.edu!solo.csci.unt.edu!iex!neptune!john
From: john@neptune.iex.com (John Ho)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china,soc.culture.taiwan,soc.culture.hongkong
Subject: Re: Internet SITES in China, Taiwan, or Hong Kong
Message-ID: <john.669482178@neptune>
Date: 20 Mar 91 15:16:18 GMT
References: <1991Mar7.194228.28299@prism.poly.edu> <12165@pasteur.Berkeley.EDU>
Sender: news@iex.uucp (USENET news)
Organization: IEX Corporation
Lines: 33
Status: RO

c60a-ej@amazon.Berkeley.EDU (Won Namgoong) writes:


>	I am looking for internet sites in China, Taiwan and Hong Kong.
>If you have any internet IP addresses for these locations, please email me.

>Thanks!

I posted this before but I saw a couple more postings asking the
same questions, so I decided to post again.

 
 City Polytechnic of HK                  user@cphkvx.bitnet
                                         user@cphkvx.cphk.hk
 
 Chinese University of HK                user@cucsc.bitnet
                                         user@cucsc.cuhk.hk

 HK Baptist College                      user@bc750.bitnet
                                         user@bc750.hkbc.hk
 
 HK Polytechnic                          user@hkpcc.bitnet
                                         user@hkpcc.hkp.hk
 
 HK University of Science & Technology   user@usthk.bitnet
                                         user@usthk.hkust.hk
 
 University of HK, Computer Center       user@hkucc.bitnet
                                         user@hkucc.hku.hk
 University of HK, CS Dept.              user@csd.hku.hk
 University of HK, EE Dept.              user@hkueee.hku.hk

 John Ho


From sol.ctr.columbia.edu!sal.wisc.edu!uakari.primate.wisc.edu!ames!sun-barr!sh.wide!kogwy!cs-keio!li Fri Sep 18 18:53:02 EDT 1992
Article: 67686 of soc.culture.china
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china
Path: sol.ctr.columbia.edu!sal.wisc.edu!uakari.primate.wisc.edu!ames!sun-barr!sh.wide!kogwy!cs-keio!li
From: li@hara.cs.keio.ac.jp (Shiao-Chieh LEE)
Subject: address about mainland of china
Message-ID: <LI.92Sep17172016@aries.hara.cs.keio.ac.jp>
Summary: e-mail address of Beijing,Shanghai,etc.
Keywords: e-mail address
Sender: news@sync.cs.keio.ac.jp
Nntp-Posting-Host: aries.hara.cs.keio.ac.jp
Organization: Postgraduat school of Keio University, Japan.
Distribution: soc.culture.china
Date: Thu, 17 Sep 1992 08:20:16 GMT
Lines: 30
Status: O


   I have gotten some e-mail addresses about CHINA. It is said that 
"The Chinese Research Network (CRN), founded in 1987". I am sorry,
I kown these in 1992.


Help desk addresses are:
- Beijing:
  * CRN's Help Desk                          helpdesk@crn.cn
  * North China Institute of Computer Tech.  helpdesk@nci.crn.cn
                                             helpdesk@cnlab.nci.crn.cn
  * China Academy of Electr. & Info. Tech.   postmaster@cc.caeit.crn.cn
  * Computer System Engineering Institute    postmaster@dep9.cse.crn.cn
  * Computer Software & Serives Corperation  postmaster@lel.css.crn.cn
- Shanghai:
  * Fudan University                         postmaster@cnl.fudan.crn.cn
  * Shanghai JiaoTong University             postmaster@ee.sjtu.crn.cn
- Shijiazhuang:
  * Shijiazhuang Communication Lab           postmaster@tcl.scl.crn.cn
- Chengdu:
  * Southwest Communication Institute        postmaster@tulip.sci.crn.cn



--
----------------
Shiao-Chieh, LEE        Department of Computer Science,  
                        Postgraduate School of KEIO University, 
                        Yokouhama,JAPAN
E-mail:                 li@hara.cs.keio.ac.jp


From CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu Sun Sep 20 14:54:35 1992
Received: from uga.cc.uga.edu by sirius.ctr.columbia.edu (5.67/5.10) with SMTP id AA24639; Sun, 20 Sep 92 14:54:27 -0400
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   with BSMTP id 3153; Sun, 20 Sep 92 14:51:47 EDT
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 6172; Sun, 20 Sep 92 14:51:46 EDT
Date:         Sun, 20 Sep 1992 13:41:08 CDT
Reply-To: yuan <A10RYT8%NIUCS.BITNET@uga.cc.uga.edu>
Sender: Chinese Computing Network <CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu>
From: yuan <A10RYT8%NIUCS.BITNET@uga.cc.uga.edu>
Subject:      Donations needed by CANET
To: Multiple recipients of list CCNET-L <CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu>
Status: RO

   This message was retrieved from tw.announce, a local newsgroup of TANet.
 This forwarded message was not approved by the original senders, but
 anyway is intented to promote something. If this is not your scope
 of concern, please simply ignore it.       --yuan
----------------------------Original Message---------------------------
=========================================================================
Path: twnmoe10!color
Organization: Ministry of Education, Computer Center NETNEWS system V2.3
Date: Saturday, 19 Sep 1992 14:32:05 EST
From: <COLOR@TWNMOE10.BITNET>
Message-ID: <92263.143205COLOR@TWNMOE10.BITNET>
Newsgroups: tw.announce
Subject: E-mail to mainland China

    The academic network in mainland China, CANET, has an X.25 link
to a mail gateway in German. The following is a message from the
administrator for CANET.                                 --Liu Zi-Di

 Dear Mr. Liu,

     I am very sorry to tell you that I can't provide more information about
 member list of CANET for you. The reason is that CANET has not got the funding
 from goverment to establish a leased link to Internet, at present, CANET just
 is a store-and-forward e_mail system via X.25 line. So, each member of CANET
 has to pay the international communication fee to PTT not only for sending
 e-mail but also for receiving each mail from abroad. That is why they don't
 want to distribute their e-mail address in order to avoid the extra expense.

     For this situation, may I sugeest:

 1.  Could you please collect the requests of your users who need to communicate
 with university in China mainland and list all destinations they want to
 contact with? Then forward this list to me by e-mail. I will pass these request
 to the destination-university by e-mail or post mail. Perhapse, this is the
 better way to promote the communication between us.

 2.  Could you try to find some people or organizations in Taiwan who are
 interested in Communicating with colleagues or partners in China mainland and
 are able as well as willing to make donations to CANET funding? Because CANET
 is planning to establish an international leased link to Internat in order to
 reduce communication cost, this is the only way to extend and promote CANET
 service but we have not got the enough funding to do this yet. We try to get
 help from outside.

     Thank you again for your letter.
     best wishes!

 T.B.Qian CANET

From sol.ctr.columbia.edu!caen!uunet!sun-barr!sh.wide!wnoc-tyo-news!etl.go.jp!ume!sakura.cc.tsukuba.ac.jp!saito Fri Sep 25 01:04:21 EDT 1992
Article: 1206 of talk.politics.china
Xref: sol.ctr.columbia.edu soc.culture.china:68024 talk.politics.china:1206
Path: sol.ctr.columbia.edu!caen!uunet!sun-barr!sh.wide!wnoc-tyo-news!etl.go.jp!ume!sakura.cc.tsukuba.ac.jp!saito
From: saito@sakura.cc.tsukuba.ac.jp (Saito Tsuneo)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.china,talk.politics.china
Subject: E-mail to china is possible(with e-mail address)
Message-ID: <16346@ume.cc.tsukuba.ac.jp>
Date: 22 Sep 92 00:16:44 GMT
Sender: news@ume.cc.tsukuba.ac.jp
Followup-To: soc.culture.china
Lines: 125
Status: O



	
>From xiaofan.zhao@crn.cn Mon Sep 21 16:53 JST 1992
Return-Path: <xiaofan.zhao@crn.cn>
Received: from ixgate (ixgate.gmd.de) by sakura (4.1/SMI-4.1.1)
	id AA03917; Mon, 21 Sep 92 16:53:04 JST
               Mon, 21 Sep 1992 09:50:07 +0200
               Mon, 21 Sep 1992 09:24:40 +0200
X400-Received: by mta ixgate.gmd.de in /PRMD=GmD/ADMD=DbP/C=DE/; Relayed;
               Mon, 21 Sep 1992 09:50:07 +0200
X400-Received: by /PRMD=crn/ADMD=/C=cn/; Relayed;
               Mon, 21 Sep 1992 09:24:40 +0200
Date: Mon, 21 Sep 1992 09:24:40 +0200
X400-Originator: xiaofan.zhao@crn.cn
X400-Recipients: saito@sakura.cc.tsukuba.ac.jp
X400-Mts-Identifier: [/PRMD=crn/ADMD=/C=cn/;920921152440]
X400-Content-Type: P2-1984 (2)
Content-Identifier: 4
Conversion: Prohibited
From: Xiaofan ZHAO <xiaofan.zhao@crn.cn>
Message-Id: <"4*/G=xiaofan/S=zhao/PRMD=crn/ADMD= /C=cn/"@MHS>
To: "(Saito Tsuneo)" <saito@sakura.cc.tsukuba.ac.jp>
In-Reply-To: <9209210259.AA01278@sakura.cc.tsukuba.>
Content-Type: text
Content-Length: 4472
Status: R

Dear there,

Following is some information about CRN for your reference.

Regards,
--------~~~~~~~~========********####@@@@####********========~~~~~~~~--------
Name:           Xiaofan Zhao
Organization:   North China Institute of Computing Technology (NCI)
Titles:         Director of Computer Networks Lab, NCI
                General Manager of Chinese Research Network (CRN)
                Member of Chinese OSI Technical Subcommittee
Postal Address: P.O. Box 619, 100083 Beijing, China
Phone:          +86 (1) 201 7661 Ext. 646
Fax:            +86 (1) 201 8902
Email:          X.400:    C=cn; PRMD=crn; S=zhao; G=xiaofan
                Internet: xiaofan.zhao@crn.cn
--------~~~~~~~~========********####@@@@####********========~~~~~~~~--------

The Chinese Research Network (CRN), founded in 1987, aims at

	* Providing electronic communication means, based on
	  the PSDN and any available communication networks,
	  to the Chineses scientsts, engineers, professors and
	  other reaserchers to facilitate them in exchanging
          information and coordinating cooperation with their
	  partners in China and abroad.

	* Supporting and coordinating the development and promotion
	  of OSI conformable applications ammong Chinese scientific
	  and research community.

	* Organizing the cooperation among CRN members and their
	  foreign partners.

Eight members of CRN have been interconnected at present, including research
institutes, universities and academic organizations in Beijing, Shanghai,
Chengdu and Shijiazhuang. More institutions will join CRN in the future.

MHS (email), VT (PAD), FTAM and X.11 have been installed at the member
institutions on VAX/VMS, VAX/ULTRIX, SUN/UNIX and APOLLO/UNIX.
CRN has established tens of direct MHS connections with the member
countries of European Research Networks (RARE), including Germany, Norway,
Switchland, France, Sweden, Italy, England, Nethelands, and could exchange
e-mails with almost all the research networks, eg Internet, in the world
via RARE gateways.

Chinese MHS (CMHS), dased on DFN-EAN and enhanced by CRN, with
Chenese characters and encryption capability, has been also installed
at some CRN's member institutions on VAX/VMS and SUN/UNIX systems.

The electronic mail service provided by CRN is CCITT X.400 (84) comformable.
The email exchange between CRN and other email systems, eg INTERNET, BITNET,
UUCP, is routed by RARE gateways. The direct connection between CRN and
INTERNET will be set up when the agreement is reached.

The CRN's WEP (Well-know Entry Point) is located and maintained at NCI
(North China Institute of Computing Technology), Beijing.

The CRN Board consists of the representatives from her member
organizations, which is responsible for
	* Developing CRN's plans and rules
	* Helping academic and research institutions to join CRN
	* Maintaining the services provided by CRN
	* Helping CRN's members to solve technical problems
	* Organizig and coordinating the development projects
	* Contacting and coopreating, on behalf of CRN, with the peers
	  in China and abroad

At present, the cost of sending messages to CRN members is paid by the
calling partners while the messages are stored and forwarded. The outgoing
messages sent from CRN members to any other hosts are paid by the original
user's institution.

The CRN's mapping rule between X.400 O/R address and RFC822 address is
	C=cn; ADMD= ; PRMD=crn	<====>	crn.cn

Help desk addresses are:
- Beijing:
  * CRN's Help Desk                          helpdesk@crn.cn
  * North China Institute of Computing Tech. helpdesk@nci.crn.cn
                                             helpdesk@cnlab.nci.crn.cn
  * China Academy of Electr. & Info. Tech.   postmaster@cc.caeit.crn.cn
  * Computer System Engineering Institute    postmaster@dep9.cse.crn.cn
  * Computer Software & Serives Corperation  postmaster@lel.css.crn.cn
- Shanghai:
  * Fudan University                         postmaster@cnl.fudan.crn.cn
  * Shanghai JiaoTong University             postmaster@ee.sjtu.crn.cn
  * East China Institute of Computing Tech.  postmaster@cnl.eci.crn.cn (1993)
- Shijiazhuang:
  * Shijiazhuang Communication Lab           postmaster@tcl.scl.crn.cn
- Chengdu:
  * Southwest Communication Institute        postmaster@tulip.sci.crn.cn
- Nanjing:
  * Southeast University                     postmaster@cims.seu.crn.cn (1993)

Note: The email systems at ECI and SEU will be put into operation in 1993.



From @CUVMB.CC.COLUMBIA.EDU:CHINANET@TAMVM1.BITNET Tue Oct 20 21:55:19 1992
Received: from cuvmb.cc.columbia.edu by sirius.ctr.columbia.edu (5.67/5.10) with SMTP id AA09899; Tue, 20 Oct 92 21:55:17 -0400
Received: from CUVMB.CC.COLUMBIA.EDU by CUVMB.CC.COLUMBIA.EDU (IBM VM SMTP V2R1)
   with BSMTP id 5082; Tue, 20 Oct 92 21:55:24 EST
Received: from RICEVM1.RICE.EDU by CUVMB.CC.COLUMBIA.EDU (Mailer R2.07) with
 BSMTP id 4988; Tue, 20 Oct 92 21:55:22 EST
Received: from RICEVM1.BITNET by RICEVM1.RICE.EDU (Mailer R2.08 R208004) with
 BSMTP id 5032; Tue, 20 Oct 92 20:55:24 CDT
Date:         Tue, 20 Oct 1992 18:49:40 MST
Reply-To: "CHINANET: Networking In China" <CHINANET%TAMVM1.BITNET@CUVMB.CC.COLUMBIA.EDU>
Sender: "CHINANET: Networking In China" <CHINANET%TAMVM1.BITNET@CUVMB.CC.COLUMBIA.EDU>
From: Qiang Alex Zhao <azhao%CS.ARIZONA.EDU@CUVMB.CC.COLUMBIA.EDU>
Subject:      Re: Address for Tsinghua University, Beijing
X-To:         CHINANET%TAMVM1.bitnet@ARIZVM1.ccit.arizona.edu
To: Multiple recipients of list CHINANET <CHINANET@TAMVM1.BITNET>
In-Reply-To:  <199210210139.AA28950@optima.cs.arizona.edu>; from "Pamela
              Knight" at Oct 20, 92 9:34 pm
Status: RO

		Networking to China
		===================

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
1) UseNET Newsgroup: fcs.info-nets
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: 9 Apr 92 09:00:32 GMT
From: kuang@rdsparc2.CSELT.STET.IT (Kuang Jiaxing)

There are two E-mail network effective in China, CRN and CANET.

CANET	Chinese Academic Network (CN-DOM)
    Try asking Qian@ica.beijing.canet.cn for details.

CRN	China Research Network
   CRN is a X.400 based network, as far I know, there are a few
   universities and institutes connected to CRN, they are NCI
   (NorthChina Computing Institute), Fudan University, Shanghai
   Jiaotong University, SCI (30th Institute), SCL (54th Institute), ECI
   (32th institute), more universities and institutes are connecting to
   CRN, for details contact postmaster@cnlab.nci.crn.cn or
   xiaofan.zhao@cnlab.nci.crn.cn

Good luck
Kuang

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
2) WHOIS Database at NIC of DDN
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
CANET Chinese Academic Network (CN-DOM)
   c/o ICA
   P.O. Box 2418-26
   Che-Dao-Gou Street
   Beijing
   PEOPLE'S REPUBLIC OF CHINA

   Domain Name: CN

   Administrative Contact:
      Qian, Tian Bai  (TBQ)  QIAN@ICA.BEIJING.CANET.CN
      +86 841-3654
   Technical Contact, Zone Contact:
      Rotert, Michael  (MR78)  Rotert@IRA.UKA.DE
      +49 721 608 4221

   Record last updated on 05-Mar-91.

   Domain servers in listed order:

   IRAUN1.IRA.UKA.DE		129.13.10.90
   NS.EU.NET			192.16.202.11
   NS.UU.NET			137.39.1.3

   Top Level domain for the People's Republic of China

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
3) From: "Herman J. Woltring" <UGDIST@nici.kun.nl>
-------------------------------------------------------------------------

As an editor of campus magazine with a special report on network
connection to mainland China, I tried very hard to find out any
possibly way for sending e-mails to there.  I got help from kind
netters, from whois database, knowing that CANET(Chinese Academic
Network) users actually have e-mail access with Internetter.  So I
contacted Mr. Qian, the administative contact of CANET via e-mail and
personal letter.  Finally, I got response after Mr. Qian got my
personal letter.  (Now, people in Taiwan can mail letters to mainland
China indirectly, via Hong Kong.)

Mr. Qian gave me some introduction of CANET, and eventually mentioned
the main problem is lack of funds, so people on CANET have to pay fees
for both receiving and sending e-mail abroad.  In this case, after you
reading this message, PLEASE DON'T TRY TO SEND E-MAILS TO MR. QIAN
ASKING ABOUT FURTHER DETAIL, SINCE I CAN NOT MAKE SURE MR. QIAN ALSO
HAVE TO PAY FEE FOR HIS E-MAIL OR NOT.  I am afraid the mail flood will
cause another big problem to him.  Thank you.

=== Original message from Mr. Qian

From:   cn%"QIAN@ica.beijing.canet.cn" 20-AUG-1991 19:18:57.92 To:
7911013@twnctu02.bitnet CC:  Subj:   reply

Received: From DEARN(MAILER) by TWNCTU02 with Jnet id 6317
	  for 7911013@TWNCTU02; Tue, 20 Aug 91 19:18 U
Received: from DEARN by DEARN (Mailer R2.08) with BSMTP id 1915; Tue,
20 Aug 91
 09:37:08 CET Received: from ira.uka.de by vm.gmd.de (IBM VM SMTP
R1.2.2MX) with TCP; Tue, 20
 Aug 91 09:36:51 CET Received: from ica.beijing.canet.cn by
iraun1.ira.uka.de id aa10842;
	  20 Aug 91 9:32 MET DST
Date: Tue, 20 Aug 91 15:06 CHINA TIME +100 From:
QIAN@ica.beijing.canet.cn Subject: reply To: 7911013@twnctu02.bitnet
Message-id: <29780B1EE25F00002B@ICA.BEIJING.CANET.CN> X-Organization:
ICA BEIJING CHINA X-Envelope-to: 7911013@twnctu02.bitnet X-VMS-To:
IN%"7911013@twnctu02.bitnet",QIAN

Mr.Huang, Thank you for your letter of Aug.5. Some time ago I received
an email from you, and I'm sorry I have been unable to answer it
sooner. Thank you for your paying great attention to the CANET
project.  Herewith I'm encluding the brief introduction to CANET.
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .

      CANET , co-initiated by ICA ( Beijing  Instutute  for  Computer
  Applications ) and the University of Karlsruhe ( Germany ) began in
  1986. Its purpose is to integrate chinese academic communities with
  the worldwide computer network, and to promote information exchange
  and technical cooperation with the rest of the world.  The  initial
  service provided by CANET is international E-mail delivery.
      The first connection with CSNET was actually set up in Sep.1987.
  The central machine  located in ICA , Siemens 7,760/ BS2000 running
  PMDF/BS2000 software, was successfully  connected  with the  E-mail
  systems all over the world by means of a relay machine at the  Uni-
  versity of Karlsruhe.
      Since then ,  CANET  has  been operational and has provided the
  worldwide E-mail service for some academic communities within China.
      In 1990 Oct. ,  the  top  level  domain ---" CN " for China was
  registered with DDN SRI--NIC by ICA . This is a very important step
  for the development of CANET.
      CANET is a store and forward electronic mail network .
      Recently,the central machine in CANET is a Micro VAXII--cluster
  system under VMS 4.7 running PMDF 3.1/VMS,which acts as an interna-
  tional gateway linking the main domain server located at Uni. Karl-
  sruhe by x.25 through the CHINAPAC (Chinese Packed Switching
  Network).
      For remote sites, CANET is accessible for any academic communi-
  ty of China through the CHINAPAC ( national x.25 PDN )  or the dial
  up telephone links, at 1200 bps and 2400 bps or 4800 bps (depending
  on the cost factor ). End--user's PC  or workstations can access to
  local node machine by terminal emulation . CANET  adopts  RFC--822
  formats.
     CHINAPAC ,  the first national PDN in China , was operational in
  the end of 1989 , it is authorized  by the goverment and run by the
  Ministry  of Posts and Telecommications of China.   This network is
  based on x.25. At persent, it is still on the first stage and has 3
  node-machines ( Package Switching Node ) and 8 package multiplexers
  which are located at 11 major cities in China. It has international
  link through the satellites.
     All amchines of   CANET implement  Internet  DNS ( domain naming
  system ) syntax.
     The top level domain ---  " CN " for China has been  operational
  since Jan.1991 . Currently, the international mail delivery usually
  takes half a day . At present , 16 sites have been connected within
  CANET.  It is true , many institutions and universities have estab-
  lished their private local network in the compus,  most of them are
  interested in joning CANET.But, there are the financial boundaries-
  ---lack of the funds.   If the funding is available,  CANET will be
  growing rapidly.
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .

Frankly speaking,the CANET has not been a part of the Internet yet,
because it does't implement the TCP/IP protocol suite to link with the
Internet via the leased line directly.that is why CANET is unable to do
FTP and R-Login recently.Also,this is the reason that CANET's user has
to pay the international communication fees not only for sending mail
but also for receiving mail.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
4) From GEAND@educ.umass.edu Thu Apr  9 18:23:22 1992
-------------------------------------------------------------------------

This will get you started.  Yes, it is EXTREMELY costly and for that
reason I will NOT tell people E-mail addresses in China.  The archives
of this list should contain some of the traffic this posting caused.

......................................................................
China network observations from October, 1991, visit        1/12/92

The Institute of Computer Applications (ICA) at 10 Che Dao Gou,
Haidian District, Beijing, was created to provide data processing
and computer services to small and medium organizations that could
not afford their own computer installations.  The ICA office is
extremely difficult to find; it is "hidden" at the rear of a complex
whose main mission appears to be quasi-military, and whose neighbors
"don't know anything about it."  ICA is under the Ministry of
Machinery and Electronics Industry.

Contact was established by E-Mail to SYSTEM@ICA.Beijing.Canet.CN
Qian Tian Bai, Vice-Chief Engineer, P.O.Box 2418-26, Beijing, China
100081, phone 841-3654, is the contact person.

Chinanet is very small, and VERY EXPENSIVE.  Costs are 8000 Yuan
to join, 2000 Yuan per month maintenance, and 10 Yuan per KILObyte
of information sent OR RECEIVED.  For comparison, the average
Professor's salary in PRC is 150 Yuan per month.  This explains
why some Internet information Qian Tian Bai wanted is being sent
by regular mail rather than E-Mail.  Those of us who view Internet
as a big, free resource need to realize that casual communications
elsewhere, and especially to China, may NOT be welcome by the
recipient because of the cost.

FAX is much more prevalent than E-mail throughout Asia, partly because
the character set in Japan, China, Hong Kong, Korea, Taiwan, Singapore,
etc. is not amenable to western style keyboarding, nor is the use of
English (Roman characters) that widespread.  As a side note, a major
data base research problem in Beijing is how to produce a telephone
directory!  To get a home telephone number, even if I knew the full
name and address and could pronounce it correctly in Chinese, I had
to go through the place where the person worked;  most work places
have an agreed upon Pinyin or English name that CAN be sorted on,
listed, and retrieved electronically.

Chinanet nodes exist in Beijing, Harbin, Shanghai, and Hangzhou, with
dial-up connections other places.  Most users are businesses or
Chinese Academy of Sciences;  practically none are Universities.
University computing centers (Computer Science Departments) seem to
be in some sort of communication with each other using something
called CNPAC, which is entirely graphic due to the nature of the
natural character set of China.  This might explain why gateway(s)
to Chinanet or Internet don't seem to exist.

Chinanet's connections to the outside world are via a 2400 bps link
(sattelite) to University of Karlsruhe, using PMDF protocol.  Call-ins
are done twice a day for exchange of international mail.  ICA hardware
includes VAX 8700, Siemens 7760, and MVAXII cluster.

The University of International Business and Economics in Beijing has
a massive computer-based communication facility, installed for the
Asian Games last year, and maintained (but not used) in support of
Beijing's bid for the Olympics.  Connections go throughout China, Asia,
and much of the rest of the world.  My guess is that this machine could
host an extensive and inexpensive E-mail network with practically no
additional capital investment!  I said this to everyone who would
listen in other agencies I visited;  perhaps that may have some effect.
Unfortunately, I visited ICA before I visited UIBE and could not get
ICA's reaction to the idea.

Without knowing it when travel plans were made, a major conference
on telecommunications was to be held in Beijing about Nov. 1.  ICA
suggested they could get me in if I were in Beijing at the time, but
I had already accepted a "Soviet" Academy of Science invitation for
November.  I have not been able to find out what transpired at that
conference, although I have been promised a copy of the proceedings.
Perhaps someone who was there could enlighten me (and any others on
the network) about serious interest in moving China forward with
global networking.

As an interesting aside, one of the major U.S. planners of the Nov.
conference also created a large share of international use of
Chinanet in the previous month, and was pointed out to me as someone
insensitive to what their costs were.  My personal reaction was that
action was needed to drive down costs (or get them subsidized) because
what I saw represented to me exactly the kinds of interchanges the
networks were designed to facilitate.

Addtitions, corrections, interpretations, and comments welcome.

     G. Ernest Anderson               GEAND@EDUC.UMass.EDU
     University of Massachusetts

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
5) List CHINANET: Networking in China
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: kuang@rdsparc2.CSELT.STET.IT (Kuang Jiaxing)

Some sites in China have registered IP network number, unfortunately,
due to finance, they have not connected to InterNet directly.

The two major E-Mail network in China are CANET and CRN.

  CANET was setup about 1987 and registered in 1990, it is a subscriber
  e-mail network about 10 Yuan per kilobyte plus phone fee, user loging
  via PSDN or other, it seems there are no subdomain users, as far I
  know there are lots of Universities and Institutes have account on
  CANET.  It cost a huge amount of money to CANET users :-) 10 Yuan per
  kilobyte whatever incoming or outgoing email.

  CRN is a OSI multi-protocol experiment network, e-mail system of CRN
  is based X.400(84 version), it has some universities and institues
  connected via China CNPAC(X.25), each site pay its X.25 fee (quite
  expensive) for outgoing mail, it is mere experiment network, due to
  political and financial reason, it seems impossible to become a real
  research network, ...  For CRN sites, they pay their X.25 fee, usual
  they pay their outgoing emails, Darmstadt.gmd.de acts as InterNet
  <--> X.400 gateway for CRN, it pays most emails to China, and its
  administrator protest high charge, the policy may be changed in
  future.  X.25 is a quite expensive service, it charge you per segment
  you send/receive and per minute you use, Usual each site pays about
  2000 yuan per month if no high volume data transfer.

Some Universities are planning to build Campus network, Tsinghua
University, ZheJian University, Fudan University, ..., I am sorry I
don't know details except Fudan.

I heard that China PTT is planing to build China E-Mail network, and
Shanghai PTT is just beginning to provide such service, it sounds to be
the official e-mail network in future, but I don't know more about it.

For details about CANET, contact Qian@ica.beijing.canet.cn, who is
Administrative Contact of CANET.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
6) First Hand Material: From <xiaofan.zhao@cnlab.nci.crn.cn>
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
>From xiaofan.zhao@cnlab.nci.crn.cn Sun Apr 12 17:19:05 1992
Received: from optima.cs.arizona.edu by caslon.cs.arizona.edu; Sun, 12 Apr 92
 17:19:03 -0700
Received: from ixgate.gmd.de by optima.cs.arizona.edu (4.1/15)
	id AA28511; Sun, 12 Apr 92 17:18:59 MST
Received: by ixgate.gmd.de id AA13488; Mon, 13 Apr 92 02:12:05 +0200
Date: 13 Apr 92  8:11 +0800
From: Xiaofan ZHAO <xiaofan.zhao@cnlab.nci.crn.cn>
To: Qiang Alex ZHAO <azhao@cs.arizona.edu>
In-Reply-To: <9204100052.AA03920(a)acacia.cs.arizona.>
Message-Id: <788:xiaofan.zhao@cnlab.nci.crn.cn>
Subject: Reply: Hello from Arizona (USA)
Return-Receipt-To: Xiaofan ZHAO <xiaofan.zhao@cnlab.nci.crn.cn>
Status: OR

Dear Alex,

Following is some information about CRN for your reference.

Regards,
Xiaofan Zhao, NCI, Beijing, China

==========================

The Chinese Research Network (CRN), founded in 1987, aims at

	* Providing electronic communication means, based on
	  the PSDN and any available communication networks,
	  to the Chineses scientsts, engineers, professors and
	  other reaserchers to facilitate them in exchanging information
	  and coordinating cooperation with their partners in China
	  and abroad.

	* Supporting and coordinating the development and promotion
	  of OSI conformable applications ammong Chinese scientific
	  and research community.

	* Organizing the cooperation among CRN members and their
	  foreign partners.

Eight members of CRN have been interconnected at present, including research
institutes, universities and academic organizations in Beijing, Shanghai,
Chengdu and Shijiazhuang. More institutions will join CRN in the future.

MHS (email), VT (PAD), FTAM, X.11 have been installed at the member
institutions on VAX/VMS, VAX/ULTRIX, SUN/UNIX and APOLLO/UNIX.
CRN has established more than ten direct MHS connections with the member
countries of European Research Networks (RARE), including Germany, Norway
and Switchland, and could exchange e-mails with almost all the research
networks, eg Internet, in the world via RARE gateways.

Chinese MHS (CMHS), dased on DFN-EAN and enhanced by CRN, with
Chenese character and encryption capability has been also installed
at some CRN's member institutions on VAX/VMS and SUN/UNIX systems.

The CRN Board consists of the representatives from her member
organizations, which is responsible for
	* Developing CRN's plans and rules
	* Helping academic and research institutions to join CRN
	* Maintaining the services provided by CRN
	* Helping CRN's members to solve technical problems
	* Organizig and coordinating the development projects
	* Contacting and coopreating, on behalf of CRN, with the peers
	  in China and abroad

Help desk addresses are:
  Beijing:
    CRN's Help Desk                          <helpdesk@cnlab.nci.crn.cn>
    North China Institute of Computer Tech.  <postmaster@cnlab.nci.crn.cn>
    China Academy of Electr. & Info. Tech.   <postmaster@cc.caeit.crn.cn>
    Computer System Engineering Institute    <postmaster@dep9.cse.crn.cn>
  Shanghai:
    Fudan University                         <postmaster@cnl.fudan.crn.cn>
    Shanghai JiaoTong University             <postmaster@ee.sjtu.crn.cn>
  Shijiazhuang:
    Shijiazhuang Communication Lab           <postmaster@tcl.scl.crn.cn>
  Chengdu:
    Southwest Communication Institute        <postmaster@tulip.sci.crn.cn>

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
7) CHINANET: Bin Wang <NUS40%TTACS.bitnet@ARIZVM1.ccit.arizona.edu>
-------------------------------------------------------------------------

From:
 David K. Kahaner
 US Office of Naval Research Asia
 (From outside US):  23-17, 7-chome, Roppongi, Minato-ku, Tokyo 106 Japan
 (From within  US):  Unit 45002, APO AP 96337-0007
  Tel: +81 3 3401-8924, Fax: +81 3 3403-9670
  Email: kahaner@cs.titech.ac.jp

[Dr. David Kahaner is a numerical analyst on sabbatical to the
 Office of Naval Research-Asia (ONR Asia) in Tokyo from NIST.  The
 following is the professional opinion of David Kahaner and in no
 way has the blessing of the US Government or any agency of it.  All
 information is dated and of limited life time.  This disclaimer should
 be noted on ANY attribution.]

[Copies of previous reports written by Kahaner can be obtained using
 anonymous FTP from host cs.arizona.edu, directory japan/kahaner.reports.]

ABSTRACT. A description of networking activities in PRC (China).
(F.F.Kuo, SRI)

My report on the Internetworking conference [inet.92, 26 June 1992] was
read by

        Dr. Franklin F. Kuo
        Executive Director, Asian Programs
        SRI International
        333 Ravenswood Avenue
        Menlo Park, CA 94025
         Tel: (415) 859-4116; Fax: (415) 859-6171
         Email: KUO@NISC.SRI.COM

Dr Kuo was particularly interested in the sections on China, as he has
recently completed a visit to look at the networking situation there,
and has prepared the report below detailing his trip. It provides
material supplemental to that in my report and should be of value to
those interested in the developments of international networking.

*********************************************************************


NETWORKING IN THE PEOPLE'S REPUBLIC OF CHINA (PRC)

by Franklin F. Kuo, SRI International

At the invitation of the China Institute of Communications, the Citizen
Ambassador Program of People to People International arranged a visit
for a delegation of professionals in telecommunications and networking
technology to the People's Republic of China. I was the leader of the
delegation, whose purpose was to exchange information and solidify
contacts with Chinese professionals within the computer and
communications industry.  The exchange focussed on topics dealing with
China's telecommunications infrastructure, especially on subjects
relating to current research and applications in computer networks. This
group, known as the Networking Technology Delegation, consisted of 24
members, with 18 professionals, and 6 accompanying spouses. Of the 24
there were 17 people from the US, 5 from Japan (2 US citizens residing
in Tokyo) one from Germany, and one from Hong Kong, so it was truly an
international group. Six members of the delegation were native Chinese
speakers, which made it very convenient in our travels.

The itinerary for our trip was as follows:

May 11-15, 1992 Beijing

May 15-19, Xi'an

May 19-22, Shanghai

May 22-24, Hong Kong

Our professional visits concentrated on telecommunications and on
computer networking. We visited a number of the major research
institutes and universities in Beijing, Xi'an and Shanghai. In all three
cities there was a lot of interest in computer networking, especially in
the Internet, and how to connect to it. Another question that frequently
came up was the future of OSI vs that of TCP/IP. There are a lot of
local area networks in operation in China, connecting many PC-clones,
mostly Chinese produced, to some older-generation mainframes such as
Honeywells. What we did not see were operational wide-area networks,
with the exception of a metropolitan demonstration network in Beijing.

Current Wide Area Networks

At present, the major wide area network (WAN) in China is the China
National Public Data Network, CNPAC, which is currently being developed
and implemented. CNPAC, an X-25 packet switched network is designed to
carry data at speeds varying between 1.2 and 9.6 Kbps. The hub is in
Beijing, where the network management center is located, with packet
switches sited in the major cities of Shanghai and Guangzhou, and PS
concentrators found in other major cities. The packet switches,
concentrators, and PADs (packet assembly/disassembly devices) are all
manufactured in China. At the Beijing hub, there is an international
access line to CNPAC. Since we did not see a CNPAC demonstration, it is
not clear how much of it is operational and how much is still under
development.

There are other private data networks in use in China in applications in
the railway system, banking system, civil aeronautics, etc.

In China, there is an X.25 link to the Internet using a store and
forward system via the CNPAC international access line in Beijing
connecting to the University of Karlsruhe, Germany.  To the outside
world, this link is being called "the China Academic Network (CANET)".
In addition to CNPAC connectivity, there is dial-up access to CANET from
inside China. David Kahaner of ONR Tokyo reports that he frequently
communicates with Chinese scientists via CANET. However, many of the
Chinese networking specialists we talked to have never heard of the name
"CANET", so we suspect that CANET means more to the outside world than
in China.

The major problem confronting the development of WANs in China is the
poor telecommunications infrastructure. Since the penetration of basic
plain old telephone service (POTS) is less than 1% among Chinese
businesses and households, and since local and long distance telephone
switching and transmission facilities are inadequate and antiquated, it
is difficult to build a modern computer network upon the current
telecommunications infrastructure.  It will take decades to bring the
basic telecommuncations system up to modern standards, so Chinese
networking will take a long time to come up to western norms also.

Metropolitan and Campus Networks

In Beijing, we witnessed a very impressive metropolitan networking
project called NCFC (National Computing and Networking Facility of
China). NCFC is a demonstration network in Beijing linking the two major
universities, Tsinghua and Beijing Universities to a number of research
institutes of the Chinese Academy of Sciences (CAS). Each of the
pariticipating institutions have campus networks like the TUnet of
Tsinghua University.  These campus networks are connected by NCFC as a
two level system. Currently NCFC has a 10Mbps backbone connecting the
three campus networks, which will increase to 100Mbps in the next phase
of the project. Communication protocols will be ISO/OSI, but TCP/IP is
the first phase protocol. The top level of NCFC consists of the backbone
and the network control center.  The second level is composed of campus
networks at the two universities and CAS. NCFC is the largest and most
ambitious networking project we saw in China. It is partially funded by
the World Bank and the State Planning Commission, and is in limited
operation now, with full operation expected by 1994. We visited two of
the three groups who are participating in the development of NCFC. The
first was the Computer Network Center (CNC) of the Chinese Academy of
Sciences, with its own campus network, the CASnet.  The CNC seems to
have the major responsibility for the development of NCFC, and is
staffed by 40 professionals. The second group, in Tsinghua University,
is described next.

The Tsinghua University Network (TUnet)

The most impressive university networking group we visited was at
Tsinghua University, the premier technical university in China. Under
the direction of Professor Hu Daoyuan, the Tsinghua University network,
TUnet is being developed under a well laid-out strategy based upon the
following goals:

1. It will be a universal, comprehensive campus network; its usage will
include instruction, research, administration, library, and
communications services.

2. It will be a multimedia integrated services network; messages
transmitted in the network will include not only data, but voice and
video as well.

3. It will operate under accepted international standards for
interfacing devices to the network. Emerging standards are important in
the fast changing technology of networking. Initially TUnet will operate
under TCP/IP, but migration strategies have been adopted to migrate to
ISO/OSI.

4. It will be a heterogeneous network using a variety of advanced
networking technologies (LAN, PABX, PS, ISDN and FDDI, etc) to
interconnect multivendor computing facilities.

5. It will be developed in phases, with the first phase (1987 to 1991)
concentrating on interconnection of facilties, and the second phase
(1992 to 1995) emphasizing network services.

In TUnet there are three major networking facilities:

a. A circuit switched network based upon an integrated services PABX,

b. A packet switching network based upon X.25 switches and PADs,

c. Ethernet LANs interconnected through a 100 Mbps FDDI optical fiber
backbone.

A key function of TUnet is electronic mail. Tsinghua University's
message handling system (MHS) functions includes mail, telegraph,
teletext, fax, videotex, voice, images, etc. The MHS is based upon the
EAN system developed by the University of British Columbia conforming to
the CCITT X.400 recommendation series of 1984. Tsinghua's work on its
e-mail system includes migration, Chinese localization, menu adaptation
and the implementation of remote user agents.

The work at Tsinghua on TUnet and NCFC underlines one of the basic
constraints that Chinese networking technologists must live with. Unless
you have foreign (hard) currencies to purchase networking equipment,
you've got to design and build everything from scratch, including
hardware and software. So TUnet represents in many ways a bootstrap
operation. The people in TUnet are all very well trained and dedicated.
It is unfortunate that they could not make use of technology that is
readily available in the Western world.

Local Area Networks (LANs)

In China today there are many LANs in use. Two common LAN products
widely available throughout China are Ethernets from 3COM, and Netware,
a LAN operating system developed by the Novell company. These products
are available in China because of joint venture arrangements that the
cited companies have made with Chinese counterparts. Most of the LAN
products are manufactured in China under license from US companies such
as 3COM and Novell.  At the Shanghai Jiao Tong University, Professor
Yang Chuan-hou, the Director of the Computer Network Research Laboratory
presented to us some work which dealt with an architectural design of a
gateway interconncting LANs to an X.25 packet switched network.  The
work again was developmental in nature, in that both hardware and
software designs were implemented in the laboratory.

Work like that of Professor Yang and his colleagues illustrate the
practical nature of the networking development going on in China today.
I visited China in 1984, when I was a World Bank consultant to Shanghai
Jiao Tong University.  In the intervening years, there has been an
explosive growth in both computing and networking technology in China,
which will only accelerate with the further penetration of the Internet
into China. Since the Internet is capable of bringing network
specialists and users throughout the world into a larger cooperating
community, I believe that China's networking community will soon become
full partners in this world-wide community.


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
= Qiang Alex Zhao		| azhao@cs.arizona.edu
				| Dept of Computer Science
				| Univ of Arizona, Tucson

From CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu Sat Oct 24 15:46:59 1992
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 2659; Sat, 24 Oct 92 15:43:59 EDT
Date:         Sun, 25 Oct 1992 03:48:23 WST
Reply-To: "(Huang Chih-Hsien)" <hch@NCTUCCCA.EDU.TW>
Sender: Chinese Computing Network <CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu>
From: "(Huang Chih-Hsien)" <hch@NCTUCCCA.EDU.TW>
Subject:      TWNEWS on-line system available
Comments: To: ccnet-l@uga.cc.uga.edu, info-nets@think.com,
              twuniv-l@twnmoe10.edu.tw
To: Multiple recipients of list CCNET-L <CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu>
Status: RO

[If you think any place is proper to crosspost this announcement,
 please do it.  Thanks.]

Dear networkers,

This is an announcement for the availability of TWNEWS on-line system
and the end of the TWNR(tw.* Newsgroups Redistribution) service.

I offer the TWNR service about half an year.  Thank you for your
support.  However, now I am glad to announce a new TWNEWS on-line
system and going to close the old TWNR service.

TWNEWS is sponsored by Campus Computer Communication Association,
Ncational Chiao Tung University, Hsinchu, Taiwan, and intended to
provide a place for people outside Taiwan not only reading but also
posting articles to NCTU and TW hierarchy newsgroups which are almost
only regionally accessable in Taiwan.

For access to TWNEWS on-line system:

TELNET NCTUCCCA.edu.tw or 140.111.3.21
login: twnews
(no password needed, just follow the instructions)

If you meet any unusual problems or suggestions/comments, please
report them via e-mail to hch@NCTUCCCA.edu.tw.

All the best,
---
Huang, Chih-Hsien
Campus Computer Communication Association Vice President
TWNR Moderator, NCTUCCCA.edu.tw Anonymous FTP Archives Administator
National Chiao Tung University, Hsinchu, Taiwan
hch@NCTUCCCA.edu.tw

From CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu Fri Nov  6 06:38:27 1992
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Date:         Fri, 6 Nov 1992 19:36:47 WST
Reply-To: "(Huang Chih-Hsien)" <hch@NCTUCCCA.EDU.TW>
Sender: Chinese Computing Network <CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu>
From: "(Huang Chih-Hsien)" <hch@NCTUCCCA.EDU.TW>
Subject:      Re: Eten, unix+big5
Comments: To: liucharl@PULUA.HCC.HAWAII.EDU
Comments: cc: ccnet-l@uga.cc.uga.edu
To: Multiple recipients of list CCNET-L <CCNET-L@uga.cc.uga.edu>
In-Reply-To:  <9211060843.AA27116@NCTUCCCA.edu.tw>; from
              "@TWNMOE10.EDU.TW:CCNET-L@UGA.BITNET" at Nov 5, 92 10:31 pm
Status: RO

> 	I just got a Eten Chinese program. Is there any way to display
> simplified characters instead of the traditional? can Eten read GB code
> also?

The lastest version of ETen is 3.1.  I don't know too mcuh to this new
version.  However, I was informed that simplified characters can be
displayed on ETen 3.0 CARD version as an optional function, but I am
not sure it could recognize the GB code.

> 	I am using a commucation program to call the school unix under Eten
> environment, but I am still not able to read BIG-5 code directly in unix.
> Until I download it to my dos environment, then I can read it. If I can read
 the
> Chinese in Unix directly without downloading, it will be very helpfull.
> Does anyone know about it?

To the residents in National Chiao Tung University here in Taiwan, our
FDDI campus network is connected to our dormitories, and Ethernet-links
is available at each room.  (Actually, in Taiwan, until now it is only
real and fast available at NCTU.  I don't know the situation in other
countries; maybe, someone here can kindly share me some information.)
In that case, we are using our modefied Chinese NCSA to connect to our
campus network.(the new version was finished today; I'll announce it
later on net; if you are interested in it, pay some attention on the
later announcement.)  Of course, Chinese is available, but if you are
on UNIX platform, remember to issue the command "stty pass8" to set
chars to 8-bit.

But if you are dail-up connected to your computer, the setting of your
terminal server become very important.  If it is not 8-bit available,
reading Chinese BIG-5 is impossible.  If 8-bit available, the same,
remember to issue the "stty pass8" command.

Hope it helps, and Good Luck!
--
Huang, Chih-Hsien
Campus Computer Communication Association Vice President
TWNEWS Moderator, NCTUCCCA.edu.tw Anonymous FTP Archives Maintainer
National Chiao Tung University, Hsinchu, Taiwan
hch@NCTUCCCA.edu.tw

From @UGA.CC.UGA.EDU:owner-ccnet-l@UGA.CC.UGA.EDU Sat May  1 05:40:03 1993
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Subject:      Taiwanese National Center for High Computing inf
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From: jhlee@ccms.ntu.edu.tw (Jiunn-Horng Lee)
Subject: Kahaner Report: Taiwan's Nat'l Center for High Performance Computing
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Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1993 14:53:45 GMT

[ Article crossposted from comp.research.japan,soc.culture.taiwan,comp.sys.super
[ Author was Rick Schlichting ]
[ Posted on 29 Apr 93 04:44:38 GMT ]


  [Dr. David Kahaner is a numerical analyst on sabbatical to the
   Office of Naval Research-Asia (ONR Asia) in Tokyo from NIST.  The
   following is the professional opinion of David Kahaner and in no
   way has the blessing of the US Government or any agency of it.  All
   information is dated and of limited life time.  This disclaimer should
   be noted on ANY attribution.]

  [Copies of previous reports written by Kahaner can be obtained using
   anonymous FTP from host cs.arizona.edu, directory japan/kahaner.reports.]

From:
 Dr. David K. Kahaner
 US Office of Naval Research Asia
 (From outside US):  23-17, 7-chome, Roppongi, Minato-ku, Tokyo 106 Japan
 (From within  US):  Unit 45002, APO AP 96337-0007
  Tel: +81 3 3401-8924, Fax: +81 3 3403-9670
  Email: kahaner@cs.titech.ac.jp
Re: Taiwan's National Center for High Performance Computing
28 April 1993
This file is named "nchc.93"

ABSTRACT. The opening of Taiwan's National Center for High Performance
Computing (NCHC), 19-22 April 1993, HsinChu Taiwan, is described. Also,
brief comments on a visit to Taiwan's Data Communications Institute.

I have written several times about the establishment of a new national
supercomputing center in Taiwan, even before it was built. See for
example, "taiwan12.91" 16 Jan 1992, and "taiwan3.92", 24 April 1992.
Recently, I traveled to the city of HsinChu, about one hour south west
of Taipei to participate in the formal opening of this center and the
associated conference, International High-Performance Computer
Conference (IHCC'93).  Although there are many supercomputers in Asia,
to the best of my knowledge, Taiwan's National Center for High
Performance Computing (NCHC) is the first truly national center in this
part of the world, and for this the Taiwanese science community should
be congratulated.

The National Center for High-Performance Computing in Taiwan is a two
year old effort by the government to promote and develop high
performance computing in Taiwan. It is a Division under the National
Science Council (NSC) which is similar to the National Science
Foundation in the U.S, and in fact Dr. N.H.Kuo, the Chairman of the NSC
gave the opening address. He emphasized the role of the center as a tool
for research, as a balanced resource between academia, government and
industry, and of his expectations that the center will permit Taiwanese
scientists to become more active members of the international community.

    Dr. Nan-Hung Kuo
    Chairman, National Science Council
    Executive Yuan
    19/F, 106, Ho-Ping East Road, Section 2
    Taipei, Taiwan 10636, Republic of China
     Tel: +886 2 737-7500; Fax: +886 2 737-7668

In many ways, NCHC it is similar to a National Science Foundation center
in the US and an important part of the Opening Ceremony was the signing
(by Greg Galvin of Cornell) of an agreement with their sister
organization, the Cornell Theory Center. The main effects of this
agreement are related to information and people sharing, and in fact,
several Taiwanese scientists are slated to spend some months at Cornell
in the near future.

Galvin also gave an interesting talk about new ideas in cooperation
between universities and industries. He commented that in the past have
been either bilateral (a faculty member and corporate person with
similar interests agree to collaborate) or affiliates programs in which
companies pay US$10-50,000 to receive publications, have some faculty
access, and invitations to annual review meetings. In recent years,
however, affiliates have lost some of their appeal, as interaction
between the company and academic organizations has been shown to be
limited, and in any case the information flow is all one way, out of the
university.  More recently a new model of cooperation, a partnership,
has become prevalent, and Galvin felt that it will become the dominant
form of university-industry collaboration in the 1990s.  Typically,
partnerships involve a joint definition of work to be performed, usually
over several years, and often with personnel exchanges in both
directions. He also pointed out the three points of scientific
discovery, technical leadership, and public service that need to be
emphasized, the role of university-industry collaborations in each of
these, and finally, some examples of active collaborations in place at
Cornell today.

In addition to Cornell, NCHC signed an agreement with IBM that opens
that company's research labs and will place 24 Taiwanese scientists at a
variety of three month assignments in these labs during the next two
years.

NSC has funded NCHC for about US$100M over five years.

NCHC's building is newly completed. It has 150K square feet of office
space on four floors and has plenty of space for expansion. Construction
appears to be impressive, with marble flooring almost everywhere, and
very nicely appointed offices. We were told that construction costs were
on the order of US$13M, a figure that seems quite low considering the
size and quality of the building.  The entire building is cabled with
FDDI and is T1 linked to the Universities as part of TANET . With this
connectivity it is hoped that most academic researchers in Taiwan will
be able to reach the NCHC equipment from their own office.

The NCHC is located in the HsinChu Science-Based Industrial Park. This
Industrial Park is also an effort of the Taiwanese government to promote
high technology in Taiwan.  The industrial park was founded 13 years ago
on 1500 acres and now supports about 25,000 workers in 140 companies.
Adjacent to NCHC is an almost commissioned synchrotron radiation source,
the only one in Taiwan.  HsinChu is located about 75 kilometers south of
Taipei along the main north/south highway.

There are currently 65 employees at the NCHC with plans to hire an
additional 10 people within a year. The breakdown of the total number of
employees is:

        Administration                  14
        Research and Promotion          28
        Computer Services               10
        Consultants                     11

The research and promotion staff are charged with promoting and
educating Taiwan about the benefits of High- Performance Computing. They
will also be involved in their own research. All of them have advanced
degrees, about half of them have Ph.D.s from the U.S.

The Consultants are distributed throughout Taiwan with one at each of
the 11 major Universities and Academica Sinica. They help with access to
NCHC, stabilizing TANET (the Taiwan Academic Network), optimizing
programs and training users. In fact, several training courses have
already been given, and there is a plan to allow public school students
to have some exposure to the center equipment during this summer.

The director of the Center is Dr. San-Cheng Chang who is on leave from
the Civil Engineering Department at National Taiwan University (in
Taipei). His deputy director is Mr. Kuo-Wei Wu who had been a long time
employee of Cray Research. Dr. Jin Su is in charge of the division of
Research and Promotion.  Mr Gen-Shen Lin is in charge of the Computer
Services.

Currently, NCHC has:

        IBM ES9000 (5 Processors)
        Convex 3840
        4 HP 735s
        4 IBM RS6000 model 580
        4 IBM RS6000 model 560
        4 SGI Crimsons, 4 SGI 4D/310 and a SGI 4D/35
        Approximately 150 Sun SPARCstation ELC (b/w) workstations.


I reported on the choice of IBM as a major vendor last year. This might
be a little surprising given the experience of several key NCHC staff on
Cray systems, but is mostly a reflection of the fact that there is
already a significant IBM and Convex presence in Taiwan, as well as
very active sales and marketing operations for both these companies.
However, an open procurement was done with at least one Japanese vendor
competing (NEC).

The original NCHC plan, that I described in an earlier report,
anticipated an upgrade to an SS1 machine from Steve Chen's SSI in 1995.
As most readers know, this company had significant financial support
from IBM over several years (the partnership also included DuPont,
Boeing, Electricite de France, and Ford). IBM's commitment to SSI ended
several months ago and IBM chose not to continue their funding. Chen has
attempted to obtain funding from other sources. Mostly this has been
unsuccessful, except for an offer of US$100M over one year from a joint
venture that included at least one organization that was an extension of
the Government of the People's Republic of China.  Ultimately this offer
was withdrawn, and to the best of my knowledge, Chen is now considering
other product possibilities, such as producing a high performance
workstation, etc. In any case, the possibility of a large supercomputer
in 1995 from this source seems remote and NCHC is already thinking about
their upgrading opportunities. They will be looking at the possibility
of parallel computer and also a distributed workstation environment.

During my week at NCHC several of the ELC sparkstations were available
for use for electronic mail via telnet. Access to Tokyo was quite slow
although functional, but somewhat better to the US. However one problem
was a very poor keyboard response on the ELCs, which exhibited a
tremendous amount of key bounce.  I had so much trouble that eventually
I abandoned any attempt to edit files. Most other visitors had similar
difficulties on each the available machines, and this was also confirmed
by Dr. Chang who felt that there was a design problem.  (The ELCs were
offered to NCHC at extremely favorable terms, although I am told that
there is now some effort on the part of at least one other vendor to get
NCHC to trade them in.)


IHCC '93

Associated with NCHC's opening was an exhibit and conference, IHCC'93.
A major goal of this conference was to publicize the NCHC to all Taiwan
researchers in government, academia and industry, and  to increase
communication between researchers and NCHC.  In this regard, it seemed
to me that the organizers were quite successful. The conference had
about 375 attendees for the guest speaker's tutorials. Also there were
21 vendor presentations and 21 vendor exhibits, and these were open to
the public.  There were 450 (including high school students) who
attended these vendor activities.

There were 16 guest speakers invited as experts in their own fields. They
were asked to each give presentations of a survey of their field and then a
more detailed look at their own current interests. The speakers and topics
were:

Jack Dongarra           U of TN & ORNL  Lapack and XNETLIB
Michele Parrinello      IBM             Ab-initio Molecular Dynamics
Hal Alles               SGI             ICs and ASICs
David Kincaid           Univ. Texas     Iterative Methods
Ted Belytschko          Northwestern    Nonlinear Finite Elements
Jan Andzelm             Biosym          Density Functional Methods
Iain Duff               Harwell&Cerfacs Sparse Solvers
John Larson             CSRD            Performance Modeling and Benchmarking
Robert Manchek          Univ. Tenn.     PVM
Arie Kaufman            N.Y.U.          Volume Visualization
William Goddard         MSI             Material Science
Tony Chan               Univ. Hong Kong Parallel PDE Algorithms
Michael Frisch          Gaussian        Electronic Structure Theory
David Keyes             Yale            Parallel CFD
Hans J. Hermann         KFA, Germany    Molecular Dynamics
Joseph Fisher           Hewlett Packard Compiler Technology

Thus, this conference provided the local researchers a chance to hear
and talk with known experts in a wide range of fields. There were no
Taiwanese speakers.

There were two lively panel sessions at night, moderated by Mike Ess of
NCHC.  Their topics were:

        Benchmarking: Art or Science?
        What will be the Computing Center of the Future?

The vendor presentations included the following (I didn't actually get
to all of these, so I cannot attest to the actual participation of all
the people named below).

SGI                                     Practical Parallel Processing
BIOSYM          Jan Andzelm             Quantum Chenistry, software demo
Tripos          Scott A. Gothe          Sybyl 6.0
Convex          Steve Wallach and David Keck    Metacomputing
HP              Joseph Fisher           PA-RISC
nCUBE           Bob Enk                 Forge 90
MSC/NASTRAN     Dr. Hsieh               NASTRAN Applications
DYNATECH        David Byrne             CFD software
DEC             Jeevan Kumaran          Workstation Farms
IBM             Mr. Yu and Mr. Ma       IBM RISC & ES9000
TATUNG          Mr Fan & Mr Cheng       Phoenics & FEA
HO-MEN          Mr Yang & Mr Cheng      Anvil 5000 CAD/CAM
Mentor Graphics Mr Wang                 IC Design Methodology
Abaqus          Mr Ling                 ABAQUS Applications
MSI             Mario Blanco            Polymer and Materials Science

Neither the tutorial speakers nor the vendor sessions contained any
Japanese participation. Mr Wu commented to me that Taiwanese people have
some difficulty understanding the English spoken by Japanese.  (Also, I
was told that Cray Research attempted to participate in the vendor
sessions, but only at a very late date, and it was not possible to
accommodate them.)


The format of the conference was clearly modelled after supercomputing
conferences in the West, with technical sessions, exhibits, and vendor
presentations.

Overall, I felt that just about everything concerning NCHC was smart,
for Taiwan.  There is a clear view that the center will be a focus for
applications of high performance computing, and I sensed no serious
interest in its being a testbed for new architectures or related
activities that did not have research into applications as a theme.
This makes sense given the needs in the country. Similarly, the
conference was a direct effort to bring Western experts to Taiwan to
inform Taiwanese scientists about state of the art research in a broad
collection of technical areas. As part of the opening ceremony, Prof
J.Dongarra (U-Tennessee) announced that NCHC would soon become a NETLIB
distribution center. This means, in effect, that a vast collection of
public domain software will soon be easily available to Taiwanese
scientists via electronic distribution. This is another smart example of
providing technology input to a scientific community anxious for the
information.

It will be most interesting to return to NCHC next year so hear about the
progress made by Taiwanese scientists in making use of high performance
computing for their own research activities.

The address of the NCHC is:
        National Center for High Performance Computing
        P.O. Box 19-136
        HsinChu, Taiwan
         Tel: +886 35-776-085
         Fax: +886 35-776-082

Email addresses of people mentioned in this report:

San-Cheng Chang         c00scc00@nchc.edu.tw
Kuo-Wei Wu              c00kwu00@nchc.edu.tw
Jin Su                  c00jsu00@nchc.edu.tw
Mike Ess                c00mae00@nchc.edu.tw

------------------------------------------------------------------------

DATA COMMUNICATIONS INSTITUTE (DCI)

[To be added shortly...]


For readers' information, the following statistics about Taiwan may be
of some interest.

Population:                          21M
Pop growth:                         1.2%
GNP/per capita:                 US$ 10,215
GDP growth:                            6.1%
Exports (12 mos):               US$ 82.5B
Current account surplus:        US$  7.9B
Foreign debt:                          0
Inflation CPI                         3.2%
People/telephone                      2.4

----------------------------END OF REPORT-------------------------------


--
--------------------------------------------------------------
Jiunn-Horng Lee               | E-mail : jhlee@ccms.ntu.edu.tw
Computer Center               |    TEL : (02) 3627734-257
National Taiwan University    |

