Subject: CND-US CSPA Information Exchange Package (IV), June 11, 1993

From: [email-masked]
Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1993 21:45:25 -0500

+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+   C h i n a   N e w s   D i g e s t  +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+

                               (US Regional)

 Information Exchange (IV): About Preparing to Apply for U.S. PR Under CSPA

                           Friday, June 11, 1993

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| CND-US, normally 1 or 2 issues a week, is a supplement to CND-Global and |
| has  basically no overlap with the daily news.  CND-US provides in-depth |
| information concerning Chinese students/scholars in the United States.   |
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[Editor's Note: The following is collected and edited from the information
                CND received or saw on the network, we believe it is of
                information nature.  We forward it to concerned readers
                as a timely reference service.  However, some of the
                information may need to be verified (it is beyond our
                capacity to do so).  Please consult your lawyer and use
                your own discretion before you use the information printed
                in this package to make decision(s) on related matter.

                Also, please refer to CND-US CSPA Information Exchange Packages
                (I) thru (III), date June 6, 8 and 10, 1993 for more info.
                Many questions have been answered/discussed in those issues.

                Related info is available from CND CSPA InfoBase, by anon
                ftp to CND.ORG (IP: 132.249.229.100) dir pub/InfoBase/CSPA

                Some of the e-addresses/names/ID's are withheld per sender's
                request, except for those already posted to public network.

                We welcome readers sending their info/experience to us to let
                others to share, request for anonymity will be honored.

                Due to our limited manpower resource of volunteers, we regret
                that we may not be able to answer questions from readers.

                CSPA = Chinese Student Protection Act of 1992, U.S.A. ]

Table of Contents                                                 # of Lines
============================================================================
 Information Exchange (IV): About Preparing to Apply for U.S. PR Under CSPA

1. NAFSA Officers Meeting with INS:
   Implementation of CSPA; Required Forms Can Be Photocopied ............ 67
2. Some CSPA-Related Questions and Answers and Discussions from/by CSS . 165
3. Analysis: Statistics on the Numbers of Chinese J/F Visa & PR Holders  135
============================================================================
Note: in next issue of CND-US CSPA Information Exchange Package, we will
      carry full text of the Questionnaire prepared by IFCSS's lawyer for
      CSS seeking U.S. PR under CSPA, which was originally published in
      IFCSS CSPA Info Center Newsletter No.3 and typed in for network
      transmission by a CND volunteer.

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1. NAFSA Officers Meeting with INS:
   Implementation of CSPA; Required Forms Can Be Photocopied ............ 67
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>From: frances helmstadter <[email-masked]>  Fri, 11 Jun 93 12:13:09 EDT
To: INTER-L (A List for National Association of Foreign Student Advisors)
Subject:      CAFSS-BOS INS
Forwarded by: Bo Xiong
Abridged by: CND-US

Report on a meeting at Boston INS Office with the Assistant District
Director and the Schools Officer

IMPLEMENTATION OF THE CHINESE STUDENT PROTECTION ACT (CSPA):

We are all waiting for the INS regulations to be published.  PRC nationals
who plan to apply for adjustment under CSPA can phone the INS Forms Line
(617-565-3879, press 1, then 3, then 1) and ask for the Adjustment of Status
Packet of forms, which includes Form I-485 and others.

It might also be wise to ask for Form I-765 in case the final implementing
instructions require it for employment authorization. The forms line connects
to the Eastern Service Center where there is sufficient staff to handle
requests.  The required forms can be photocopied (see 8CFR 299.4).

[Editor's note: As it's suggested in CND-US CSPA Info Exchange I, photocopies
                should be made on both sides of a sheet if the original is
                double-sided, and the orientation of the copy should be the
                same as the original, see next section of this item for
                more information]

Applications for adjustment under CSPA cannot be filed until the INS
regulations are published.

PRC nationals might be advised to get the forms and complete them, get their
medical examination (medicals are valid for one year), gather the
documentation of their continued presence in the United States, get their
birth documents - and otherwise brace themselves for the INS regulations.

It may interest you to know that employment after an application for
adjustment has been filed in a timely manner, and after the nonimmigrant
visa has expired, is not a bar to adjustment (see 8CFR 245). This employment
is not authorized, but continued employment under these special circumstances
will not prevent the granting of permanent resident status.

It is expected that the current Advance Parole procedures for emergency or
business travel after filing for adjustment will be available for PRC
nationals filing under CSPA.

Our next meeting with Boston INS:  Wednesday, July 21.
                              ___  ___  ___

>From: MX <[email-masked]>  Thu, 10 Jun 1993 23:50:01
Subject:      Photocopy of original form acceptable

I want to share the following information with you.

(1) I was told by International student adviser in my school that photocopies
of INS forms are acceptable to INS, including employment-based applications,
from her previous experience.

(2) I used a photocopy of INS form for my wife to change from F2 to F1 two
years ago.

(3) I went to local INS recently and found they put some forms in a shelf for
free pick up, including photocopies of form G-325A, which is needed for
employment based PR application. (original G-325A has four pages and carbon
copy sheets).

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2. Some CSPA-Related Questions and Answers and Discussions from/by CSS . 165
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Source: Messages posted to various CSS related mailing lists/networks
Collected and Compiled by: Bo Xiong, 6/12/93

[Editor's Note: The questions were answered by CSS networkers and are thus
                not necessarily authoritative.  Please consult your lawyer
                and use your own discretion when you make your decision(s).
                Also, please refer to CND-US CSPA Information Exchange Packages
                (I) thru (III), date June 6, 8 and 10, 1993 for more info.
                Many questions have been answered/discussed in those issues.]

Q: From:  ***@***.umn.edu Fri Jun 11 11:59 CDT 1993

I have a simple question about the Date of Last Arrival in I-485.

I had a trip to Canada in 1991 since I came to the U.S. in 1986 from China.
As you probably know, visiting Canada was quite different from visiting
other countries.

When I left for Canada my I-94 was not taken away. When I reentered the US
from Canada, I did not have a new visa (it was not necessary), and all I did
was showing the INS officer at a Canadian airport my old I-94 and form
I-20 (F-1 status). The INS officer checked my I-94 and I-20, briefly talked
with someone in their office, returned my I-94 and I-20, and then said OK.
He did not stamp or mark my I-94 or I-20. The I-94 he returned to me was
exactly the same one as I had before the trip.

My question is: Should I use this arrival date related to my trip to Canada
as the Date of Last Arrival, or just ignore it because there is no record
in INS about this trip?

A: From: *****@*****.edu  June 11

I saw an answer to the similar question in CND-US CSPA Info Exchange III.
here I would like to offer some supplement to that.

You should always use your real last arrival date in I-485, which should be
consistent with your latest I-94.  In you case, per the special treaty among
U.S., Canada and Mexico, an legal alien in the U.S. may return to Canada or
Mexico within 30 days of a brief visit to the two countries, no new U.S.
visa is needed, therefore you didn't get a new I-94.  i.e., you were treated
as if you did not leave U.S. at all.  So, you may use the last entry date
printed on your I-94 to fill out I-485.
                              ___  ___  ___

Q: From: [email-masked]   Fri, 11 Jun 1993 15:49:49
   Subject: CSPA and I-94

For those CSPA beneficiaries who went back to China, there seems some
trouble to apply PR under CSPA:

1) The original I-94 was taken away when you left U.S.. What are the other
   evidences to prove your physical presence in the U.S. before 04/01/90?

2) How to prepare the questions such as "why did you want to go back to
   China?" in the interview?

A: From: *****@*****.edu  June 11

You still have plenty of evidences: your original I-20 (or copy, certified
by your school/foreign student advisor), a letter of certification from your
school, the original visa stamp/entry stamp on your passport, a certified
copy of the original I-94 etc.  Your old bank statements, phone bills and
Apt. rents can serve the same purpose.

And, there is no reason for INS to ask you WHY you visited China, though
they may ask you when you did it, not to mention that it is widely said that
no final interview is necessary for applicants under CSPA.
                              ___  ___  ___

Q: From: [email-masked] Fri Jun 11 10:27 CDT 1993

One of my friend has following questions, he came to the US in 1988 with F-1
visa, and between 1989 and 1992, he had couple short trips to Europe,
because he need to keep his initial I-94 in order for him to still be
eligible to the executive order benefits (mainly advance parole), every time
when he departed from US airport, instead of submitting I-94 to the airline,
he explained to the airline and was able to keep the I-94, but every time
when he returned to the US, he got a new I-94 upon arrival at the US
airport.  So now, he has more than one I-94 cards on his hand, of course
with the same admission #. One question is that if it's ok to show those
I-94's to prove his entry/leave date when he talk to INS on CSPA based PR
application and when INS ask for the proof of above information.

Also when he was in China, he used to serve in the military, so the 2nd
question is that whether it's better to tell the true story in form I-485 or
not, since it is mentioned in the form to list this information if it's the
case. Any drawbacks to do so? I'm sure this may be a common question for
lots people who used to join the political party in China.

A: From: *****@*****.edu   June 11

As noted on the back of I-94, one must turn in I-94 when leaving U.S.,
unless leaving for Canada and Mexico (they don't take it if you are to
return to the U.S.).  So, officially, he shouldn't have old I-94 at all. To
avoid raising unnecessary questions from INS, he'd better use certified
copies of his old I-94, as discussed in the previous question.
                              ___  ___  ___

Q: From: Zhihong Lin <[email-masked]>  Thu, 10 Jun 1993 17:13:38

The birthday on my I-20 Forms (both current one and original one, since I have
transferred from one school to another.) is different from that on my passport.

Is it a problem when I apply PR under CSPA? If so, What can I do for it?

A: From: ****@******.edu  June 11

In this case, you would be better off if you have a birth certificate as
official proof of your birth day, it serves even better if it shows the
same birth day as your passport does.
                              ___  ___  ___

Q: From: [email-masked] Fri Jun 11 08:40 CDT 1993

(1) In case that we make an error in the forms, will the INS return the
forms to ask us to redo them?

(2) Is it necessary to hire a lawyer to help? Any estimate of the cost?

(3) What will be the conditions to be included in the number of 40,000,
which is said to be the total number of PR available for CSPA this year.

A: From: ****@*****.edu  June 11

(1) Yes, INS will return it to you for correct information, but this can
take very long, say one month, which may delay your application.

(2) Use your own judgement on this matter, check Chinese newspapers for
information about law firms.

(3) I saw some discussions in CND-US CSPA Info Exchange I thru III.
                              ___  ___  ___

>From ******@****.indiana.edu Thu Jun 10 16:55 CDT 1993

Some students scheduled physical exam, using skin test to test TB, which is
cheaper.  But when the skin test shows positive results, they have to take
XRay anyway.  The chance for a person newly arrive from China to show
positive skin test is quite high.

[Editor's note: See CND-US CSPA Info Exchange II on June 6 for more info]
                              ___  ___  ___

>From: [email-masked] Fri Jun 11 08:57 CDT 1993

Notaries public are permitted to certify copies of documents.  Copy
certifications prove that the notary compared the copy of a document with
the original and that the notary certified that the copy is a true, correct
and complete copy of the original.

In the past, INS required copies to be verified by attorneys and not by
notaries, but that requirement was dropped when INS made the change that was
referred to in CND-US CSPA Info Exchange III of June 10th.

It would be very useful for any CSS to have a notary look at his/her copies
and verify their accuracy.  As a notary myself, I have found many CSS's
copies to have been made in too much of a hurry; too light so that the red
admittance and departure stamps were not legible, again too light so that
the date of issue of the visa was not legible, or off-center so that the
page numbers do not show.

Even if the CSPA regulations do not require certified copies of documents,
it would be prudent for each CSS to have in his or her possession certified
copies of their documents.

Maggie Brooke, The University of Iowa

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3. Analysis: Statistics on the Numbers of Chinese J/F Visa & PR Holders  135
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>From: [email-masked] (FM Wu)    Thu, 10 Jun 1993 02:28:24

In the heat of form searching, photo and fingerprint taking, medical exam
taking, I did some research in TTU library and am trying to answer following
questions:

I. How many F and J visas have been issued to Chinese mainlander from 1976
to 1990?

II. How many Chinese students and exchange visitors have already got their
permanent residency?

III. How many Chinese nationals who came here as students or exchange
visitors during 1976 to April 11, 1990 have returned to China or gone to
other countries?

IV.  Approximately, how many Chinese nationals are going to apply permanent
residency this time through CSPA?

Here the answers go:

I. How many F, M and J visas were issued to the mainland Chinese from 1976
to 1990?

  Source I: [Report of the Visa Office (American Government Document)]
  Table: "Nonimmigrant Visas Issued by Classification and Nationality"

  Source II: Data in bracket [] is the number of student (spouse and children
  not included), not the number of issued visa. The data comes from the paper
  "Perspectives on China's Brain Drain" of [China's Economic Dilemmas in the
  1990s] and origins from "Newsletter, The Embassy of the People"s Republic of
  China, Washington, DC., May 12, 1990"

Fiscal year     F visa issued           J visa issued           Annual total
1976:                15                         4                       19
1977:                17                         6                       23
1978:                23                         1                       24
1979:              {900}                     {500}                   {1400}
1980:              1582?                     1077                     2659?
1981:              2678?                     3121                     5799?
1982:             {1000}                    {3400}                   {4400}
1983:              1232                      3744                     4976
1984:              1750                      4144                     5894
1985:              3211                      8827                    12038
1986:              5436                     10044                    15480
1987:              6233                     10155                    16388
1988:             (4771)                    (1159)                   (5930)
1989:              8349                     11727                    20076
                  (7386)                    (1446)                   (8832)
Jan thru May:     (1684)                     (537)                   (2221)
June thru Dec:    (5702)                     (909)                   (6611)
1990, Jan
thru April, 11:
Total:                                                                95106

(American fiscal year has been changed in the past. Now, a fiscal year begins
on Oct. 1 of previous year and end on Sept. 30 this year. For example:
1994 fiscal year will begin on Oct. 1, 1993 and end on Sept. 30, 1994. (See
Budget of American Government)

Note:  Data of 1980 and 1981 looks too big. Question marks have been added.
       Data in bracket {} is assumed, since the actual data is not available
       from TTU library.
       95106 was calculated by actual data and assumed data in {}.  Only
       exception is 1988 fiscal year, actual student number 5930 was used.

II. How many Chinese nationals have already obtained permanent residency
status since 1976?

  Source: Statistical Yearbook of the Immigration and Naturalization Service
          (American Government Document)
  Table:  Aliens who were adjusted to permanent resident status in the United
          States at entry status and country or region of birth.

Fiscal year     F1,M1           F2,M2           J1              J2      Total
(The data for 1976 thru 1981 are not available)
1982:           1895?            351?           35              26      2307?
1983:           1163?            203?           43              18      1427?
1984:            607              60            20              16      703
1985:            739              73            50              23      885

                        F                               J
1986:                  909                             70               979
1987:                  815                            105               920
1988:                 1038                            122               1160
1989:                 1162                            190               1352
1990:                                                                  {1200}
1991:                                                                  {1200}
1992:                                                                  {1200}
Total:                                                                 13333

Note:  Data of 1976 through 1981 was not available and was not counted hence.
       Data of 1982, 1983 looks too big, question marks have been added.
       Data of 1990, 1991, 1992 is assumed, since actual data is not
       available from TTU library.

Difference between I and II gives an approximate figure of Chinese nationals
who have got their F, M and J visa from 1976 through 1989, but have not got
their green card yet:

        95106-13333=81773

Several conclusions maybe be reached from above tables:

I. CSPA's assumption that about 80,000 Chinese nationals will be covered by
this act is based on the number of F, M and J visa issued, not the number of
the Chinese nationals who entered U.S. with these visas.  From American
government documents, I have not found this kind of record.  Only the
Chinese nationals who came and stayed here since will be covered by CSPA.

II. The number of visa issued to Chinese nationals is surely bigger than the
number of Chinese nationals who came to U.S. with these visas.  This kind
thing happened in 1989: it is very unlikely that 87% J-visa holders in 1989
were spouses or children.

III. Difference exists between American Government documents and Chinese
government documents, even with spouses and children considered. It looks to
me that fewer Chinese students and exchange visitors entered U.S., if we
follow Chinese government documents.

IV. Majority of F visa holders before 1989 were F1 students (see 1989 F visa
issued and F1 student came to U.S.).

A chunk of Chinese nationals who came to States during 1976 to April, 11
1990 and cannot be covered by CSPA are those have already returned to China
or gone to other countries.  I couldn't find this kind of information.
(Chinese National Educational Committee surely has this record).  I truly
hope someone can provide this piece of information. By then, my third and
fourth questions can be answered and we can also have a better picture about
CSPA implementation.

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