Subject: Ticket hell

From: [email-masked]
Date: 7 Sep 1995 21:36:30 GMT

I received  $25 ticket on July 28 for making an illegal (between 7 and
9:30 a.m.) left turn at Western Ave. and 41st Street N.W.  As the nice cop
barked the threat of additional penalties at me twice--additional
penalities if I did not pay within 2 weeks--I sent a check out before 2
weeks had passed.

A few days ago, I received a "delinquency" notice that said I owed an
add'l $25 for not paying on time. I couldn't figure out what was up (my
check had been cashed) until, on the phone to the Dept. of Public Works, I
noticed that they had recorded the date of my ticket issuance as July 8--a
Saturday. Not July 28--a Friday.  Because --thanks to the ticket--I was 20
mins. late to a meeting, I told a roomful of people that I had received
it.  I am writing a letter disputing the ticket date noted on the
delinquency letter--but I fear a mindless bureacracy ignoring me and
suspending my license (as they threatened on the notice).  

Has this ever happened to anyone else out there?  What are my chances?  I
am going to check the no-turn sign tomorrow, in hopes that the 7--9:30
restriction  is Mon. through Friday only.  If so, since July 8 was a
Saturday, I will have a speck of proof in my favor.

But if the restriction is week-long, I don't know what to do. Produce
people who will testify that I told them I received a ticket on July 28?
()@&)*(#$()#&)&!!
I haven't lived down here that long. I have never received a ticket
before--anywhere.  Any advice would be welcome.

---

From: [email-masked] (Persepolis)
Date: 8 Sep 1995 00:58:41 GMT

[email-masked] wrote:
: noticed that they had recorded the date of my ticket issuance as July 8--a
: Saturday. Not July 28--a Friday.  Because --thanks to the ticket--I was 20

Unfortunately this does happen- along with all sorts of other mistakes.  
I just got off the phone today with MCDCH regarding a citation my mom 
received.  She didnt hear anything from them since 3 months ago that she 
mailed it in requesting a hearing.  Guess what: today they tell me that 
it (the citation) was sent to a different address and returned.  Luckily 
her court date was set for the 12th and I caught this before it got too 
far out of hand.

Unless you have a copy of the citation as it was written (with "July 28" 
clearly marked on it) I strongly suggest that your course of action right 
now should be to cut your economic losses and pay the $25.  Anything else 
can potentially cost you more money unless you can provide proof of this 
mistake because your next cheapest alternative would be to take off X 
hours from work and drive out to some courthouse where you will be stuck 
for a couple of hours arguing.  Unfortunately when dealing in such 
sitatuations right and wrong dont make a difference and you have to 
minimize loss.

Either way, best of luck on this.

---

From: [email-masked] (Paul S. Wolf)
Date: 8 Sep 1995 02:35:48 GMT

>Saturday, I will have a speck of proof in my favor.

As a former Traffic Engineer for DC, I am sure the restriction is a
Monday-Friday rule.  You should have no problem.  I'd recommend a quick
CALL to the DPW, with the followup letter, as well.

-- 
Paul S. Wolf, P.E.				[email-masked]
	Traffic Engineer, Cuyahoga County Engineer's Office
	SIGOP, The Scouting Center on The Cleveland Freenet
	Honorary Pres., Great Lakes Region, Federation of Jewish Men's Clubs

---

From: [email-masked] (Chris Hill)
Date: Fri, 08 Sep 1995 21:53:18 +0700

In article <[email-masked]>, [email-masked] wrote:

> I received  $25 ticket on July 28 [in DC]

[snip]

> add'l $25 for not paying on time.

[snip]

> Has this ever happened to anyone else out there?  

Not exactly the same situation, but I got such a notice in the mail one
time, saying I had parked illegally on some DC street I'd never heard of,
on a date when I was *in France.* Not only that, but the plate number
cited did not belong to my car. I sent Public Works a letter explaining
the situation, together with copies of my registration (showing a
different plate number) and my plane ticket stub (showing I was out of the
country for 7 days before and after the "incident"). After several months
of no reply, I figured everything was hunky-dory.

However, a year and a half (!) after the date of the "infraction," I got
*another* notice in the mail saying my fine had been doubled again for
non-payment. I sent the same letter and copies again, and have again heard
nothing. The "violation" is now 3-1/2 years in the past, but I'm holding
on to my documentation just in case!

> What are my chances?

You can probably beat it if you care to expend the time end energy, but
you must also ask yourself, "is it worth it?" The latter is, of course,
what the DC gov't  (and your friendly insurance company) is counting on.

But remember that this would be considered a "moving violation," and so
would come back to haunt you in the form of outrageous car insurance
premiums for years to come. I don't know what your personal situation is,
but I would fight it even if my chances were slim, especially if I were
male, single, or under 30. To just pay the fine could cost you literally
thousands of dollars in insurance.

> I

Not "proof," but pretty ironclad grounds for throwing it out.

> people who will testify that I told them I received a ticket on July 28?

Absolutely, if they're willing. The sign is very likely a rush-hour
restriction. If you still have the ticket *with the date,* make a clear
photocopy and mail it to Public Works with a letter. Also send a copy of
your cancelled check, showing the date it was cashed. Any other supporting
documents? Throw 'em in.

> before--anywhere.  Any advice would be welcome.

That's about all the advice I can give. Good luck!

---
Chris                                 [email-masked]
What would happen if I pulled the plug on the Reality Engine?

---

From: [email-masked] (P.J. Geraghty)
Date: Fri, 08 Sep 1995 17:11:18 -0500

> suspending my license (as they threatened on the notice).  

This is a classic example of why you should ALWAYS read a ticket CAREFULLY
before paying it.

You would have had an excellent defense if you had gone to court and said
to the judge "Well, I was at _____ on July 8, so this ticket is OBVIOUSLY
incorrect."  I once beat a ticket that merely had the DIRECTION written
incorrectly (I was going east, the cop wrote west, I was late getting
home, which was due east of where I got the ticket...).

Another thing to look for (esp. on parking tickets) is the tag number.  If
they write down the wrong one, send in the ticket stating "Someone put
this on my car, but it doesn't belong to me..."

In your case, you'll almost certainly beat the deliquent fee rap, but you
could have beat entire ticket, and now you'll never get your money back
because Marion has probably already given it to some friend of his...

---
P.J. Geraghty, FF3/NR/MDEMT-P         
http://www.clark.net/pub/geraghty/
Be an organ donor...it's the chance of a lifetime!