Dear Sriman NVS Swamy : Thnaks very much . There is no doubt by the debaters even for a second about Sanskrit and Tamil being two eyes of our SampradhAyam and both requiring equal reverence .This debate was to enhance Bhagavath anubhavam . The forthcoming series on Dramidopanishath Saaram/Taathparya RathnAvaLi will attest to that point of view . By the way , as Dr.SMS Chari Pointed out , there is no such thing as Ubhaya VedAntham . There is only ONE VedAntham .Ubhaya VedAnthAchArya has to be understood as being an authority in the same VedAntham spelled out in two languages . V.Sadagopan ----- Original Message ----- From: "Deevalur Srinivasan" <vasuvadhyar@xxxxxxxxx> To: "sgopan" <sgopan@xxxxxxxxxxxx>; <vaideekam@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> Sent: Friday, September 09, 2005 6:28 AM Subject: Re: Is Sanskrit or Tamil Language Superior for Bhagavath anubhavam ? DramiDOpanishath Saaram/Taathparya RathnAvaLi : PART I > Dear Swamin, > Before reading the full message, I got excited, what > is our opinion, I questioned my self and I got the > vote for Sanskrit at the first few fraction of second > but immediately changed to Tamil but not satisfied > with that for long time. We are calling ourselves as > 'Upaya Vedhanthi' how it will be good to vote for any > one Vedham? We can not say a great example than the > eyes (Which is important left eye or right eye?). So, > finally I thought that we are having only two tastes > to enjoy bhagavadhanubhavam. So, I made my vote on > both. > I request you to kindly send a copy of all messages > from you to our (vaideekam) group also. I have made > your id as unmoderated. > I feel very very happy to see the information that you > are pllaning to put your 'porpaadham' in adiyens > 'kudisai', I am eagerly expecting for that day to have > your dharshan. > Utharo uththara abhivrudhirasthu > Samastha san mangalani sandhu. > VAsu VAdhyAr. > --- sgopan <sgopan@xxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote: > >> SrI : >> >> On this AavaNi Svathy day dear to Sri Lakshmi >> Narasimhan , adiyEn would like to initiate >> a likitha Kaimkaryam on the above controversial >> topic (!) , which was assigned as a topic for >> discussion by the Program Chairman of the AchArya >> SmaraNothsavam Committee of >> Ahobila Matam North America . The celebrations took >> place at Sri RanganAthA Temple >> at Pomona , NY on Sep 3 , 2005 . There was a >> spirited discussion , which was mediated >> by MahA Vidwaan Dr.S.M.S. Chari in an impartial >> manner . >> >> AdiyEn and Dr.Murali Rangaswamy of Boston argued in >> favor of Sanskrit and Srimans AMR Kannan >> of Syrcuse and Sri Oppili Gopalan of Washington DC >> argued in favor of Tamil . The Sanskrit Team >> focussed on Vedams , Upanishads , AchArya SthOthrams >> as the source material for Bhagavath >> anubhavam in all languages including Tamil . The >> Tamil team grounded deeply in NaalAyira >> Dhivya Prabhandham argued effectively in favor of >> Tamil being the superior language for >> Bhagavath anubhavam . After the friendly debate was >> over and a popular vote was taken , >> Dr.SMS Chari gave his impartial judgement that both >> languages are equal in superiority >> for Bhagavath anubhavam and gave the reasons in a >> scholarly manner . The debate was >> enjoyed thoroughly . We agreed with Dr.Chari's >> position . The debate was like the Kaliyan's >> Paasurams , where one ghOshti sings the praise of >> Raaman and the other of KrishNan >> as the one with greater vaibhavam . >> >> By copy of this note , I am requesting SriamAns >> Murali Rangaswamy and A.M.R.Kannan >> to summarize what they covered at the debate . >> >> After the debate was over , adiyEn thought that the >> great genius , Swamy Desikan who >> channeled his Bahgavath anubhavam in a superior >> manner in the three languages of >> Sanskrit , Tamil and Prakrutham is the best AchAryan >> to study for illumination on >> this subject (Ubhaya VedAntham) dear to Sri >> VaishNavAs . >> >> In this context , I remembered the six introductory >> postings going back to October 1996 >> in Sri Ranga Sri on Taathparya RathnAvaLi and >> DhramidOpanishad Saaram , the two >> Sanskrit Sri Sookthis of Sw amy Desikan . The topic >> of these two Sri Sookthis is Swamy >> NammAzhwAr's ThiruvAimozhi . In these two divine >> works , Swamy Desikan provided deep >> insights in to AzhwAr's ThiruvuLLam and AzhwAr's >> Bhagavath GuNAnubhavam .After the sixth >> posting in that series , adiyEn went off to other >> topics and forgot about them . This debate >> brought me back to DhramidOpanishath Saaram and >> Taathparya RathnAvaLi , the two >> central Sri Sookthis for insights in to >> ThiruvAimozhi as an anubhava grantham . >> Unfortunately , >> Swamy Desikan's detailed commentary known as "Nigama >> ParimaLam " is no longer >> available to us . >> >> On this AavaNi Swathy day , adiyEn thought that it >> will be good to get back to >> these two Sri Sookthis and connect them to Bhagavath >> GuNAnubhavam in Sanskrit >> of ThiruvAimozhi and relate them to various >> commentaries of this sacred Prabhandham >> of our Kula Pathy , Swamy NammAzhwAr . The subject >> is an ocean in size and scope . >> Remembering the proverb , fools enter , where angels >> fear to tread , adiyEn will start >> this effort and seek Lord HayagrIvan's anugraham >> to complete >> this Kaimkaryam , which may take almost an year to >> conclude >> even in a modest effort . >> >> In view of the nature of the subject , not all >> members might be interested >> in this series . Hence , adiyEn will post them in >> Oppiliappan , Saranagathy , >> Ramanuja Mission and Malolan Lists . Those of you >> who are not members of >> any one of these Four lists are requested to enroll >> as mmembers of one of >> these lists for access to future postings . You can >> always capture them >> in Sripedia?oppiliappan archives as well . >> >> Summary of my contributions to the Sep 3, 2005 >> debate at Sri RanganAthA Temple >> > ********************************************************************************************************** >> >> 1. There is enormous "PrAmANya SamarTanam " (ample >> power of PramANams / valid >> knowledge) for defending the position that Sanskrit >> Language is the best for Bhagavath >> GuNAnubhavam through Japam , SthOthram and Archanam >> . >> >> 1. Japam here is the recitation of the sacred names >> of the Lord and enjoying >> the deep and delectable meanings behind them . Swamy >> ParAsara Bhattar >> has engaged in such Japam in his Sri Sookthi , " >> Bahgavath GuNa DarpaNam" >> ( A Mirror to the GuNams of the Lord ). >> >> 2. SthOthram here is the keertanam of the Lord's >> Vaibhavam loudly as eulogy >> (with or without Music and TaaLam ) . BhAvam is most >> important here . >> >> 3. Archanam is the elaborate ritual worship or >> Bhagavadh AarAdhanam >> with prescribed Aaasanams and Veda Manthrams with >> deep Bhakthi . >> >> Bhagavath GuNAnubhavam covers Roopa , Svaroopa , >> ArchA , Vibhava >> and LeelA anubhavams as well . >> >> The Six Major GuNAs of the Lord >> ****************************************** >> Upanishads salute the Parabrahmam tersely as " >> Sathyam Jn~Anam Anantham BrahmA ". >> This Brahman of Upanishads is rederred to in AchArya >> RaamAnujA's Sri BhAshyam as >> Ubhayalinga VibhUthi NaaTan : (1) One with a Dhivya >> MangaLa Vigraham and limitless >> auspicious GuNams and (2) free from any hEyams ( >> blemishes ). All the limitles guNams >> fold in to SIX Primary GuNams . They are : >> >> 1.Jn~Anam ( Omniscience ) , (2) Sakthi ( >> Omnipotence) , (3) Balam (Strength , >> (4) Iswaryam ( Lordship) , Veeryam ( Energy ) and >> Tejas ( Splendour) . >> >> All the other GuNams like Souseelyam (Gracious >> condescense ) ,Soulabyam >> (Easy accessibility ) , Vaathsalyam ( loving >> disposition ) , KrupA (Compassion) , >> OudhAryA (generosity) , BandhuthvA ( Friendly >> Relationship ) and the numerous >> other auspicious attributes used by AchArya >> RaamAnujA in His three Gadhyams >> come under one or more of the six primary GuNmas . >> Swamy Desikan brings >> these insights in His Gadhya Thraya , CahthusslOki >> and SthOthra Rathna BhAshyams >> in Sanskrit brilliantly . >> >> When one reflects on the three gadhyams of RaamAnuja >> , Panchasthavams of KurEsa , >> Swamy AlavanthAr's ChathusslOki and SthOthra Rathnam >> as well as the profound >> commentaries of Swamy ParAsara Bhattar on (1) Sri >> VishNu Sahasra Naamam , >> (Sri Bhagavadh GuNa DarpaNam ) , (2) GuNa Rathna >> Kosam , (3) Sri Rangaraja Sthavam >> and (4) Thirumanjana Kattiyam fro RanganAthA ; Swamy >> Desikan's 28 moving SthOthrams >> and DhramidOpanishath Saaram/Taathparya RathnAvaLi >> are in Sanskrit . Now , one wonders >> why these AchAryAs chose to write in Sanskrit >> instead of in Agastya BhAshA . Swamy Desikan's >> Commentaries on PrakaraNa granthams are in MaNi >> PravALam ( a heavily Sanskritized version of >> Tamil ). The fact that they wrote only in Sanskrit >> has many answers form proponents and >> opponents of Sanskrit as THE medium of communication >> for Bhagavath GuNAnubhavam . >> That formed the core of the debate at the Sep 3 >> sessions. >> >> AdiyEn has a biassed view here to share : All of >> our AchAryAs cited above knew Dhivya >> Prabhandhams very well including PiLLAn , who wrote >> the first commentary on ThiruvAimozhi in >> MaNi PravALam ( 6000 Padi where the two thirds of >> the words are Sanskrit ) . >> Yet they chose Sanskrit for Bhagavath GuNAnubhavam >> because no other language >> has the SaguNa Texts ( pramANams ) except Sanskrit ( >> Vedam , Upanishads , IthihAsam >> and Saathvika PurANams : all of these are in >> Sanskrit ). They needed those SaguNA texts to >> celebrate >> and highlight the VisishtAdhvaithic View of >> Bhagavath GuNAs of Para Brahmam , >> > === message truncated === > > > My Best wishes! Visit our website: www.ahobilam.com > Vadhyar, Sri Vaishnava Kendram, Deevalur N.V.Srinivasan > Please contact me at 3 485 1392 if 2 485 1392 is not available! > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> Get fast access to your favorite Yahoo! Groups. Make Yahoo! your home page http://us.click.yahoo.com/dpRU5A/wUILAA/yQLSAA/XUWolB/TM --------------------------------------------------------------------~-> Yahoo! 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