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SriRangaSri List Archive: Message 00095 Mar 2006

 
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SrI:

Dear Sriman Anbil Swamy :

Thanks very much for your detailed answers .

Readers : Please browse thru Sri Anbil Swamy's
responses first ( located at the end of my mail)
to  relate to the questions and the answers .

*******************************************************
Surely , this subject would be of great interest
to AasthikAs everywhere . This is not an easy suject to
handle over the impersonal medium of Internet because
of the ongoing controversies that are clamoring for
the attention of the US Supreme Court ( Roe vs Wade etc ) .
Back in India, a doctor was convicted today for the first time
in India for using sonograms and abetting in abortion of
a female child . In one village in Punjab during this year ,
there were the birth of 39 boy babies and 19 female
babies . This is no fluke .  Many emotional issues
are also here including "test tube babies , cloning " etc.

Let us stay away from the temptation of being dragged into
these side debates and focus on what SaasthrAs say independent
of them being followed in modern day India or not .

******************************************************************
Sriman Srivatsan Narasimhan is asking some astute questions .

His six questions can be answered by competent authorities
from a neonatal , ethical and SaasthrA point of view . AchAryans are
ideal to answer these questions from a SaasthrA point of view but
we can add to the discussions and direct AasthikAs to approach their
AchAryAs for authoritative answers .

The answers to the Six questions of Sri Narasimhan are found in Upanishads ,
Sri Bhaashyam, ThiruvAimozhi , VishNu PurAnam and other source granthams .

*****************************************************************************

Question ONE is about Growth of Fetus in Mother's womb :

The answers provided by GarbhOpanishad are backed up in great detail
by Developmental Biology Tutorials by Medical Schools of U. Penn and
other Medical Schools  . Google search under embryology would give
the growth of the fertilized embryo from day 1 to the 39th week .The first
8 weeks cover the embryonic growth and the 8th to the 39th week time
frame comes under the fetal growth . At MIT during my student days ,
I took special courses in Neurobiology and it was revelatroy in the sense
that opened one's eyes about the mysteries of the miraculous clockwork like
growth of the embryo and the fetus from conception to birth over ~39 weeks .
It was staggering to see what can go wrong and how most of the cases  the
body
has its defenses to cope with the stresses of pregnancy .

The 8 week long embryonic period is divided into " 23 Carnegie Stages " ,
which are distinct phases of the growth of the embryo . Human development
charts are available from extensive studies form a Physiological point of
view :

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/embryo

Comparitive embryology Gallery is also available there for easy tracking of
human, amphibian , Fish , Drosphilia , chicken embryo growth and the time
cycles have been well studied . There is a lot of commonality among species.
The human cycle of development is about 39 weeks for the birth of a fully
developed baby and the rest of the growth takes place outside the Mother's
womb due to the space limitations .

*************************************************************************

Question 1 of Sri Narasimhan is largely about Developmental Biology . Plenty
of
information is available and the GarbhOpanishad has cast light on this topic
much before modern science entered as A nbil Swamy has pointed out . Nothing
much to add here . Plenty of detailed scientific references ( cited above)
are available .

******************************************************************************

Question 2: " When does a JeevAthma enter the embryo ? "
At the time of successful garbha DhAnam and consequent
fertilization of the egg . The transmigration of the Jeevan from
the body enveloped with the subtle elements at the time of the body
falling down  and entering another body is covered in Brahma Soohtram 3.1.1
The commentaries on this Soothram by AchArya RaamAnuja based
on the insight of PanchAgni VidhyA upAsanam are :

" dEhAnathara gamanE dEha kaaraNa bhUthai: bhUtha sookshmai: samyukthO
gacchathy. "

While attaining a different body based on residual karmAs ( for those
who have not performed an appropriate UpAyam like Bhakthi or Prapatthi
yOgam) , the JeevAthman moves in with the accompaniment of the subtle
elements/ PrANans and sense organs in their subtle forms ( BrahadhAraNyaka
Upanishad : 4.4.2 and GitA 15.7 ). Leaving the body , travelling to dhyulOka
or
Narakam to enjoy the pleasures temporarily or suffering in narakam based
on their PuNyams and Paapams are stages before being born in different
wombs ( ChAndhOgyam 5.10.7) . The JeevAthma descends with residual
karma to become embodied again . Mumukshu Jeevans follow the archirAdhi
mArgam , cros sthe Viraja river and do not return to this karma bhUmi again
.

************************************************************

Question 3:" When the Pancha PrANAs obtained by the baby ?"

The usage of the word "baby" is inappropriate .

Pancha PrANAs exited with the Jeevan at the time of exit from the worn body
.
Once it transmigrates to another womb , they come together with the jeevan .

*************************************************************************

Question 4: " Does the embryo have life during the first 3 weeks ?"

Ofcourse . The cell division is taking place . Stem cells are taking over
as early as the second day after fertilization of the egg .

****************************************************************************
Question 5: " By life , do we mean the JeevAthma or PrANan or some thing
totally different ?

JeevAthmA with prAnan and the subtle indhriyams is "Life" . The Lord is
inside the Jeevan and is not affected by the karmAs of the Jeevan .

**********************************************************************
Question 6: " Is there any reference to abortion the SaasthrAs? Do they
claim to be equivalent to killing Life ?"

" Sisu Hatthi" is a subject covered by Sage ParAsara"s VishNu PurANam
in the context of various Narakams . Those who destroy the embryo/fetus
are sent to a special Narakam called "RhOdham" , where the Jeevan
is given a body and buried alive to suffocate . The jeevan feels the
suffering .
"Aathma Hatthi" is another topic , which is also condemned by
the Bhagavath Saasthrams.

One can quote more PramANams from the Saasthrams but it will
lead to too much length in this posting .

The whole purpose of this exercise in answering is to suggest
that our Saasthrams are far sighted and are also compassionate
and provide prAyascchitthams and ParihArams .

V.Sadagopan


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Ram Anbil" <Ramanbil@xxxxxxxxxxx>
To: <Srirangasri@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Wednesday, March 29, 2006 11:37 AM
Subject: [SriRangaSri] RE: Growth of foetus and our sAstrAs


> Dear Bhagavatas:
> Iam forwarding my reply to a query by Sri Srivatsan Narasimhan
> (srivatsann@xxxxxxxxx) on the subject. Hope you may be interested in this.
> Dasoham
> Anbil Ramaswamy
> =============================================================
>
>
> Dear friend:
>
> All your questions have been answered in detail in my book "Hinduism
> Rediscovered"  published by “The Tiruvenkatam Group, Kuwait” and released
> by  His Holiness Srimad Andavan, Sri Poundarikapuram Swami Asramam,
> Srirangam,  in 2004)
>
> I am, however, giving some brief references here. As for abortion, our
> scriptures strictly prohibit it except in some special circumstances
> (These  have been extensively detailed in  Chapter 14 of the said book)
>
> “GarbhOpanishad” forms part of KrishNa yajur vEda Samhita and is imparted
> by  Sage Pippala and describes how the fetus grows in the mother’s womb
> and
> the   travails it undergoes during this period. Long before the modern
> scientists  what with their instruments, gadgets, X-Rays etc were tracing
> this; this
> Upanishad had already done it with minute details by sheer supersensory
> perception.”  (Vide page 52 ibid)
>
> The GarbhOpanishad gives a graphic description not only of the trauma and
> the travails suffered by the fetus during this process but also the pangs
> of  birth and the toils and troubles during childhood, youth and old age.
> Even
> a  cursory reading of the Upanishad would instill in us a total abhorrence
> of
> our existence before, during and after birth.
>
> “Saara Prakaasikai quotes “GarbhOpanishad” which describes the stages of
> development of the embryo in the womb of the mother thus:
>
> “Eka raatrOshitam kalilam bhavati, sapta raatrOshitam budabudam,
> ardha-maasaabhyantarENa piNDa: maasaabhyantarE kaTinO bhavati, maasa
> dvayEna  sirah kurutE, maasatrayENa paada pradESa: chaturthE gulpha jaTara
> kaTina  pradEsa: panchamE prushTvamsa: shashTE mukha naasikaa akshi
> srOtraaNi,  saptamE chaitanyam, ashTamE sarva sampoorNO bhavati, navamE
> sarva lakshaNa  jnaana karaNa sampanna:”
>
> Meaning:
> “The nondescript mass forms like a thicket (kalila) on the first day
> For 7 days, it stays in that condition
> On the seventh day, it becomes a bubble (budbudam);
> In 15 days, it becomes a handful of mass (piNdam);
> In a month it gets hardened;
> In two months the head appears;
> In the third month, the feet appear;
> In the fourth month, the knees and the tummy form;
> In the fifth month spinal chord develops;
> In the sixth month, eras, eyes and nose formations appear;
> In the seventh month, symptoms of life appear;
> In the eighth month all limbs form;
> In the ninth month, the formation of human figure takes shape in full”
>
> (Vide Page 996 0f ‘Srimad Rahasya Traya Saaram” published by Srimad
> Andavan,  Sri Poundarikapuram Swami Asramam, Srirangam (3rd Edition-
> 2000)>
> Swami Desika in “Nigamana Adhikaara” of his “Srimad Rahasya Traya Saaram”
> compares this to the processes to which cotton is subjected to right from
> the time of plucking from the plant to the stage when it is turned into a
> piece of cloth.
>
> “An interesting revelation is that when in the 9th month, the mental and
> sense faculties had fully developed, the Jiva remembers all the good and
> bad  deeds it had done during its previous births and looks forward to
> correct
> and evolve itself on birth. But, the moment it falls down on delivery, the
> strange illusion that is “maayaa” overtakes it and it forgets all that and
> starts associating with the mundane objects that lead again to rebirths”
> (Vide page 53 of “Hinduism Rediscovered, ibid)
> Dasoham
> Anbil Ramaswamy
> ==========================================================





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