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Dear Sri Dileepan:

I think you have misunderstood me. My point was not that
there have been insertions into 3000padi. My point was
that Thenkalai scholars believe (motivated or not) that 
there have been insertions. With such a belief in hand, 
how do you "prove with pramanams", when that pramanam is 
a single quote from the said document. I do not question 
the contents of 3000padi, but if it is offered as a 
pramanam I have to point out the objections that are made 
to it (right or wrong). AdiyEn is sticking to the facts 
and these are the facts in the debate.

This is why I said that it is my belief that it cannot be 
proved that Sri Pillai Lokacharya authored that thaniyan. 
And my final recommendation which I made before as well, 
is in tune with what you are saying - that each believe 
what their acharyas have told them.

Regarding the authorship or agreement on the Panchasat
grantha, adiyEn is not aware of what all Thenkalai 
scholars have to say and that is why I did not comment 
on the same. However, I think I know who the Thenkalai 
vidwan that you are pointing who does not believe that 
the work was authored by Sri Desika. May I point out 
that the said vidwan does not agree that the Desikar 
thaniyan was authored by Sri Lokacharyar either.

The only reason this email debate started was the 
statement that pramanams were required to prove the 
authorship of Lokacharya Panchasat while the thaniyan 
matter was stated as fact that Sri Lokacharyar wrote it 
(when clearly it is not universally accepted). If the
original mail had simply left it as a query about
Lokacharya Panchasat there would have been no debate.
But when it is coupled with the thaniyan note then it
had to be challenged.

I agree with you that proofs should not be demanded for 
what one sampradhayam believes in, but then that needs 
to be a two way street.

AdiyEn hs nothing further to say other than that I agree 
with you that both sampradhayams should learn to respect 
and celebrate each other.

adiyEn madhurakavi dAsan
TCA Venkatesan
http://www.acharya.org

--- dileepan <dileepan@xxxx> wrote:
> Dear Sri TCA Venkatesan:
> 
> Your position is quite understandable and
> not altogether unexpected. But, I think 
> claims of insertion in 3000 padi, etc. can 
> be viewed as motivated.
> 
> Let us just stick to facts. It is a fact 
> that recognized and traditional Vadakalai 
> vidwans unanimously affirm the authenticity 
> of the 3000 padi pramANam that was provided 
> in support of Swami Sri Pillai Lokacharya's 
> authorship of the Thaniyan. I know Thenkalais 
> do not accept this, but at least among 
> Vadakalai vidwans there is unanimity about 
> this. It is in this sense that I enquired 
> whether there was unanimity among Thenkalai 
> vidwans about Swami Sri Desikan's authorship 
> of the referred Pancasat. I have now received 
> private e-mails indicating that this is not so. 
> This claim is not universally accepted by all 
> the Thenkalai vidwans. Particularly, it has 
> not been accepted by a noted Thenkalai vidwan 
> who is well known for grantha publications.
> 
> IMHO, each side should respect the other's
> considered opinions in these matters, and,
> each side should also admit that their
> view in these matters is just their position
> and the other side may not accept it. They 
> must not then try to "prove" to the other 
> side why their view is more authentic, etc. 
> What would be the point of that? All the 
> proofs have been offerred and countered a 
> million times over. Neither side is going 
> to be persuaded by the other side. The best 
> thing for us to do is to live and let live. 
> The two kalais have much in common, but we 
> cannot start to celebrate this until we can 
> respect our differences and accept them as 
> they are. If we try to out do each other 
> (e.g. my acharya is better than yours), or 
> try to deny the legitimacy of the other side 
> (e.g. your acharya actually belongs to my 
> sampradayam, your sampradayam did not even
> exit more then xxx years ago), we have a 
> bright future in acrimony.
> 
> -- dileepan
> 
> 
> 


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