Dear "sarva-sri" Sadagopan Iyengar, V.Sadagopan and other friends, As I had warned in my very first mail on this subject of discussion, this is such a emotive issue it will be impossible to hold a debate on it without the danger of easily descending to some level of acrimony. It is easy to attack and rubbish the writer of the TOI article, Sri.Srinivasa Raghvan, especially when he is not around to defend himself. But the article itself (call it "re-hash" or whatever you want), and some of the stark facts/realities it places before the public view, simply cannot be brushed away. Facts are facts. I hold no brief for all of the TOI article but only some parts of it. I regard myself as a faithful and grateful member of the Ahobila Mutt. Hence, I would like to bring discussions on this sensitive subject to an immediate close because it will serve no further useful purpose to debate it further. I'm quite sure that if allowed further, it will invaribaly lead (as it usually always does in all these SriVaishnava cyber-forums) to hot-tempered accusations and counter-accusations between members on grounds of "AchArya-apachAram", "BhAgavatha-apachAram", this, that and much more. However, I will take the liberty to leave just a few thoughts for all of you to ponder over: (1) Sankara and Ramanuja were spiritual dynamos. They were "AchAryAs" who did not limit themselves to a religious mission alone but to strong social, popular causes too. Their imprint on society at large was deep, wide and enduring. "AchAryAs" who came after them were different. They kept distancing themselves from common humanity until finally by the beginning of the 20th-century AD, their spiritual sway extended little beyond cloistered "mutts", "ashram-s" and communities seeking exclusive identity. In other words, while Sankara and Ramanuja sought to be "inclusive" and "expanding", succeeding "AchAryAs" went into reverse gear -- they became more and more "insular" and "exclusive". (2) "AchAryAs" like Sri Ramanuja and Sankara had what might be called "spiritual charisma". They wielded enormous personal influence and appeal amidst mass following from all walks of life, not just a particular community. Succeeding "AchAryAs", although many of them were good and tall leaders, did not have such charisma. (3) "AchAryAs" like Sri Ramanuja and Sankara, wherever they went, somehow always succeeded in bridging social divides like caste, class, education and income. (Ramanuja's appeal to tribals even in the Melkote region where he was in exile for 12 long years is a fact of recorded history.) Succeeding "AchAryAs" failed to close the gap. Instead, the gap became only more accentuated over the centuries. (4) To use a phrase from the TOI article of Sri Srinivasa Raghvan, "non-brahmin "mutts" or godmen" today command ever growing following. It has never ceased to amaze me. They have virtually no tradition, no "parampara", no "sampradAya", no Veda, no philosophy, no theology, no religious literature really worth speaking of.... And yet millions of common people in India and abroad seek and find solace in them. We should pause and ask why? There is no point in saying "It is all kali-yuga at work". Is it really only because of "the politics of money-power" and the "money-power of politics"? If that is the only argument we have to put forward, then aren't we casting a grievous moral slur on thousands of people who flock to such spiritual leaders? Are we not being arrogant and self-righteous when we make such statements? Are the millions of people (some being Brahmin and SriVaishnava too amongst them!) who embrace ("hug"?!) these "non-brahmin godmen or god-women" such moral idiots and spiritual philistines that they would sell their souls for a few pieces of the proverbial silver? (5) "AchAryAs" like Sankara and Ramanuja became the beloved of the masses not so much for their scriptural erudition, religious piety or intellectual accomplishments as for their real human compassion. They were compassionate men and they made doubly sure that they reached out in many different ways to the outside world. The world felt their compassion palpably and received it too in as many ways. Succeeding "AchAryAs", although perhaps not lacking in compassion, somehow never seemed to be able to convey it in any positive or concrete way, to the rest of the world. Ramanuja and Sankara were great communicators in every sense of the word. Succeeding "achAryAs" were not quite such consummate communicators. Although at heart most of them were compassionate men, still it was chiefly for their intellectual or literary accomplishments, or for their personal piety or "AchAra-anushtAna" that they came to be remembered and venerated by their limited following. (6) It is a very common adage in the political field that some leaders are born, others are made and yet many more have leadership thrust upon them. That adage, I opine, holds equally true in the spiritual world too, whether you like it or not, and whether palatable to you or not. Once again, fact is fact. "AchAryAs" like Sri Ramanuja and Sankara were born spiritual leaders. Succeeding "AchAryAs", well, you could say, some became spiritual leaders while many, sadly, had leadership only thrust upon them. (7) I can sympathize why some of us become so vehement in condemning the TOI article. It is testimony to our professed loyalty and devotion to our respective "mutt-s", "AchAryAs" and "sampradAya". I too would take serious umbrage if somebody were to say less than nice things about my "mutt" or "AchArya". But we should appreciate that Truth has no sympathy for sentimentalism. To stick our heads in the mud and refuse to see fact and reality is to imitate the ostrich-bird. To keep saying that everything is fine with us, our community and our spiritual institutions and that we are Brahmins and therefore can do no wrong, and it is all the "brahmin-bashers" around us who are to blame for everything....etc. well, that to me sounds more "rubbish" than the TOI article itself. Regards, dAsan, Sudarshan __________________________________________________________ Yahoo! India Matrimony: Find your partner now. Go to http://yahoo.shaadi.com ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> Get fast access to your favorite Yahoo! Groups. 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