I did not, Jonathan,
Many thanks, indeed.
Vinegar at the Cross
Forum rules
Please quote the Greek text you are discussing directly in your post if it is reasonably short - do not ask people to look it up. This is not a beginner's forum, competence in Greek is assumed.
Please quote the Greek text you are discussing directly in your post if it is reasonably short - do not ask people to look it up. This is not a beginner's forum, competence in Greek is assumed.
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Re: Vinegar at the Cross
To return to this subject if I may:MAubrey wrote: That's what BDAG and L&N say, though there might be some merit to the idea of LSJ that τρώγω has taken over the function of ἐσθίω as the present verb-form for φαγεῖν. If that's the case, then the difference is actually completely grammatical (contrary to your suggestion that there is no grammatical difference): φαγεῖν is aorist and τρώγω is present.
Are there any other instances you're aware of where the present tense of a verb is supplanted by another but the aorist is retained? This seems very strange to me; if a verb 'evolves' to take over the meaning of another verb why not use its aorist, too, instead of the hybrid arrangement suggested in John6?
Many thanks
Re: Vinegar at the Cross
There are actually a number of these in Greek, where, for whatever reason, different roots provide different tenses of the verb (these are the famous irregular principal parts which students love to memorize). τρέχω, εδραμον comes to mind, as well as the φέρω, οισω, ηνεγκα or βλέπω/ορω, ειδον. I wouldn't phrase it the same way as you have above -- which root is lost and which is retained is a matter lost to the history of the language, but the end result is the same, different stems seen as semantically linked...Frank Kahney wrote: Are there any other instances you're aware of where the present tense of a verb is supplanted by another but the aorist is retained? This seems very strange to me; if a verb 'evolves' to take over the meaning of another verb why not use its aorist, too, instead of the hybrid arrangement suggested in John6?
Many thanks
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Re: Vinegar at the Cross
"Mastic" is also an English word - as in "gum mastic", the dried resin of the Mastic tree - which was the main basis of "chewing gum" before chicle took over.Jason Hare wrote:cwconrad wrote: As a sidenote, the Hebrew word for "chewing gum" is mástik (מסטיק), apparently taken from the idea of mastication ("chewing").
And, yes, it comes from the Greek Μαστίχα, - one of the main sources of gum mastic was the island of Chios.
BTW - with regard to confusion between "vinegar" and "sour wine" - they are basically the same. Vinegar is formed by further fermentation of the alcohol in wine - sour wine is partially-fermented wine, not yet fully sour vinegar. Mixed with water it is very refreshing on a hot day.