ταῦτα λέγων *ἐφώνει*· Ὁ ἔχων ὦτα ἀκούειν ἀκουέτω.
Posted: November 12th, 2014, 11:48 pm
What is the force of the imperfect ἐφώνει?Luke 8:8 wrote:ταῦτα λέγων ἐφώνει· Ὁ ἔχων ὦτα ἀκούειν ἀκουέτω.
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What is the force of the imperfect ἐφώνει?Luke 8:8 wrote:ταῦτα λέγων ἐφώνει· Ὁ ἔχων ὦτα ἀκούειν ἀκουέτω.
I think that Wes is right here: he stressed this. But I also think that the imperfect tense here suggests repetition: this was something that he would do regularly. Although Mark doesn't use the imperfect, he closes out his account of Jesus' parables with this pointed admonition about "getting the point":Jonathan Robie wrote:What is the force of the imperfect ἐφώνει?Luke 8:8 wrote:ταῦτα λέγων ἐφώνει· Ὁ ἔχων ὦτα ἀκούειν ἀκουέτω.
and Mark adds:Mark 4:21 Καὶ ἔλεγεν αὐτοῖς· μήτι ἔρχεται ὁ λύχνος ἵνα ὑπὸ τὸν μόδιον τεθῇ ἢ ὑπὸ τὴν κλίνην; οὐχ ἵνα ἐπὶ τὴν λυχνίαν τεθῇ; 22 οὐ γάρ ἐστιν κρυπτὸν ἐὰν μὴ ἵνα φανερωθῇ, οὐδὲ ἐγένετο ἀπόκρυφον ἀλλ᾿ ἵνα ἔλθῃ εἰς φανερόν. 23 εἴ τις ἔχει ὦτα ἀκούειν ἀκουέτω. 24 Καὶ ἔλεγεν αὐτοῖς· βλέπετε τί ἀκούετε. ἐν ᾧ μέτρῳ μετρεῖτε μετρηθήσεται ὑμῖν καὶ προστεθήσεται ὑμῖν. 25 ὃς γὰρ ἔχει, δοθήσεται αὐτῷ· καὶ ὃς οὐκ ἔχει, καὶ ὃ ἔχει ἀρθήσεται ἀπ᾿ αὐτοῦ.
Mark 4:33 Καὶ τοιαύταις παραβολαῖς πολλαῖς ἐλάλει αὐτοῖς τὸν λόγον καθὼς ἠδύναντο ἀκούειν· 34 χωρὶς δὲ παραβολῆς οὐκ ἐλάλει αὐτοῖς, κατ᾿ ἰδίαν δὲ τοῖς ἰδίοις μαθηταῖς ἐπέλυεν πάντα.
Something like this: As he said these things, he would call out, “He who has ears to hear, let him hear”? If so, that implies that he was saying this more than once in the telling of the Parable of the Sower to the crowd (ταῦτα λέγων)?cwconrad wrote:I think that Wes is right here: he stressed this. But I also think that the imperfect tense here suggests repetition: this was something that he would do regularly.
In verses 1-8, Jesus seems to be sowing seed, and crying out Ὁ ἔχων ὦτα ἀκούειν ἀκουέτω. If verse 9 stood alone, I would assume that none of the people who heard 1-8 got it except for his disciples, and he was keeping it secret by telling parables. But the parable suggests that the whole point of sowing seed is that some will fall on good soil, and why would he repeatedly urge them to listen if nobody would listen? I wonder if οἱ μαθηταὶ αὐτοῦ in verse 9 includes anyone who heard and accepted what he said in verses 1-8 or just the 12 apostles.ταῦτα λέγων ἐφώνει· Ὁ ἔχων ὦτα ἀκούειν ἀκουέτω.
9 Ἐπηρώτων δὲ αὐτὸν οἱ μαθηταὶ αὐτοῦ τίς αὕτη εἴη ἡ παραβολή. 10 ὁ δὲ εἶπεν· Ὑμῖν δέδοται γνῶναι τὰ μυστήρια τῆς βασιλείας τοῦ θεοῦ, τοῖς δὲ λοιποῖς ἐν παραβολαῖς, ἵνα βλέποντες μὴ βλέπωσιν καὶ ἀκούοντες μὴ συνιῶσιν.
The issues here do indeed involve the question of who really does understand what Jesus is getting at. There are questions of what Mark's text in Mk 4:9-13 means and of how -- if Mark's gospel is earliest -- Matthew and Luke render the same tradition. My own thinking on this (or what I thought ten years ago, at least) is set forth in my notes on Mk 4 in my brief commentary on Mark (http://www.artsci.wustl.edu/%7Ecwconrad/Mark/). I was deeply influenced by Frank Kermode's The Genesis of Secrecy (http://www.amazon.com/Genesis-Secrecy-I ... nk+Kermode), which revolves largely about this particular sequence in the synoptic gospels. These are matters that are really not open to discussion in this forum; anyone who wishes may go fishing.Jonathan Robie wrote:Something like this: As he said these things, he would call out, “He who has ears to hear, let him hear”? If so, that implies that he was saying this more than once in the telling of the Parable of the Sower to the crowd (ταῦτα λέγων)?cwconrad wrote:I think that Wes is right here: he stressed this. But I also think that the imperfect tense here suggests repetition: this was something that he would do regularly.
I'm trying to square this with the text that follows:
In verses 1-8, Jesus seems to be sowing seed, and crying out Ὁ ἔχων ὦτα ἀκούειν ἀκουέτω. If verse 9 stood alone, I would assume that none of the people who heard 1-8 got it except for his disciples, and he was keeping it secret by telling parables. But the parable suggests that the whole point of sowing seed is that some will fall on good soil, and why would he repeatedly urge them to listen if nobody would listen? I wonder if οἱ μαθηταὶ αὐτοῦ in verse 9 includes anyone who heard and accepted what he said in verses 1-8 or just the 12 apostles.ταῦτα λέγων ἐφώνει· Ὁ ἔχων ὦτα ἀκούειν ἀκουέτω.
9 Ἐπηρώτων δὲ αὐτὸν οἱ μαθηταὶ αὐτοῦ τίς αὕτη εἴη ἡ παραβολή. 10 ὁ δὲ εἶπεν· Ὑμῖν δέδοται γνῶναι τὰ μυστήρια τῆς βασιλείας τοῦ θεοῦ, τοῖς δὲ λοιποῖς ἐν παραβολαῖς, ἵνα βλέποντες μὴ βλέπωσιν καὶ ἀκούοντες μὴ συνιῶσιν.
In this chapter, Luke is talking about the crowd and the disciples, I don't see how he refers to people who are neither the generic crowd of people or the 12 disciples. Does οἱ μαθηταὶ αὐτοῦ include them in verse 9 or not? In verse 22, οἱ μαθηταὶ seems to be a small enough group to fit in a boat.
Last week, someone in my Sunday School class suggested that the imperfect ἐφώνει in the phrase ταῦτα λέγων ἐφώνει might also imply that Jesus told this parable many times, and would say Ὁ ἔχων ὦτα ἀκούειν ἀκουέτω when he told this parable.Jonathan Robie wrote:Something like this: As he said these things, he would call out, “He who has ears to hear, let him hear”? If so, that implies that he was saying this more than once in the telling of the Parable of the Sower to the crowd (ταῦτα λέγων)?cwconrad wrote:I think that Wes is right here: he stressed this. But I also think that the imperfect tense here suggests repetition: this was something that he would do regularly.
Mark 4:9 uses it with this parable, but then look at Mark 4:21-25; there's a suggestion that people who listen to Jesus' parables may very well hear just what they want to hear -- or something like that:Jonathan Robie wrote:Last week, someone in my Sunday School class suggested that the imperfect ἐφώνει in the phrase ταῦτα λέγων ἐφώνει might also imply that Jesus told this parable many times, and would say Ὁ ἔχων ὦτα ἀκούειν ἀκουέτω when he told this parable.Jonathan Robie wrote:Something like this: As he said these things, he would call out, “He who has ears to hear, let him hear”? If so, that implies that he was saying this more than once in the telling of the Parable of the Sower to the crowd (ταῦτα λέγων)?cwconrad wrote:I think that Wes is right here: he stressed this. But I also think that the imperfect tense here suggests repetition: this was something that he would do regularly.
Mark 4:21 Καὶ ἔλεγεν αὐτοῖς· μήτι ἔρχεται ὁ λύχνος ἵνα ὑπὸ τὸν μόδιον τεθῇ ἢ ὑπὸ τὴν κλίνην; οὐχ ἵνα ἐπὶ τὴν λυχνίαν τεθῇ; 22 οὐ γάρ ἐστιν κρυπτὸν ἐὰν μὴ ἵνα φανερωθῇ, οὐδὲ ἐγένετο ἀπόκρυφον ἀλλ᾿ ἵνα ἔλθῃ εἰς φανερόν. 23 εἴ τις ἔχει ὦτα ἀκούειν ἀκουέτω. 24 Καὶ ἔλεγεν αὐτοῖς· βλέπετε τί ἀκούετε. ἐν ᾧ μέτρῳ μετρεῖτε μετρηθήσεται ὑμῖν καὶ προστεθήσεται ὑμῖν. 25 ὃς γὰρ ἔχει, δοθήσεται αὐτῷ· καὶ ὃς οὐκ ἔχει, καὶ ὃ ἔχει ἀρθήσεται ἀπ᾿ αὐτοῦ.