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Mt.28:17 οἱ δὲ ἐδίστασαν
Posted: November 26th, 2015, 3:38 am
by Stephen Hughes
This appears to me ambiguous. Is this clear or ambiguous in the Greek?
Is it a reference to others besides the 11 remaining disciples hesitating / doubting, or an admission that some of the disciples hesitated / doubted?
Even though it only refers to one disciple, the story of Thomas may be alluded to (John 20:24-29), which is of course not a Snyoptic parallel.
Re: Mt.28:17 οἱ δὲ ἐδίστασαν
Posted: November 26th, 2015, 8:44 pm
by Stephen Carlson
Stephen Hughes wrote:Is it a reference to others besides the 11 remaining disciples hesitating / doubting, or an admission that some of the disciples hesitated / doubted?
Who else is on the mountain?
Re: Mt.28:17 οἱ δὲ ἐδίστασαν
Posted: November 27th, 2015, 4:12 pm
by Stephen Hughes
Perhaps the women by whom the command of Jesus had been given to the 11. Perhaps, perhaps, perhaps. The phrases like καταμόνας, ἐν κρυπτῷ or κρυφῇ are not used here.
What I guess I was wondering was whether this appears to be an editorial note about others hearing the account. Does διστάζειν mean doubt whether the situation that is confronting you is real or the report that you have received is plausible or credible.
Re: Mt.28:17 οἱ δὲ ἐδίστασαν
Posted: November 27th, 2015, 4:44 pm
by Stephen Carlson
Stephen Hughes wrote:Perhaps the women by whom the command of Jesus had been given to the 11. Perhaps, perhaps, perhaps.
You mean, if it said αἱ δὲ ἐδίστασαν.
Stephen Hughes wrote:The phrases like καταμόνας, ἐν κρυπτῷ or κρυφῇ are not used here.
Not sure what you're expecting, but the apocryphal literature too likes the trope that not all the disciples immediately believed the resurrection accounts.
Stephen Hughes wrote:What I guess I was wondering was whether this appears to be an editorial note about others hearing the account. Does διστάζειν mean doubt whether the situation that is confronting you is real or the report that you have received is plausible or credible.
Good question. I'm not sure I can offer a response that's not found in the usual lexica without attempting a lexical analysis of its behavior in its contexts.
Re: Mt.28:17 οἱ δὲ ἐδίστασαν
Posted: November 27th, 2015, 5:09 pm
by Stephen Hughes
Stephen Carlson wrote:Stephen Hughes wrote:Perhaps the women by whom the command of Jesus had been given to the 11. Perhaps, perhaps, perhaps.
You mean, if it said αἱ δὲ ἐδίστασαν.
Yes. I mean that if this is in reference to the mountain and not an editorial comment about the story's reception, and this οἱ δὲ is talking about others there there on the mountain then the masculine implies that it is not referring to the women who believed or were brave enough to relay the command to go and receive power.
Stephen Carlson wrote:Stephen Hughes wrote:The phrases like καταμόνας, ἐν κρυπτῷ or κρυφῇ are not used here.
Not sure what you're expecting,
If giving the commission in a public place where anyone could witness it was significant, then perhaps it was expected that others would witness it. Generally only open thoughts here at present.
Stephen Carlson wrote:Stephen Hughes wrote:Does διστάζειν mean doubt whether the situation that is confronting you is real or the report that you have received is plausible or credible.
Good question. I'm not sure I can offer a response that's not found in the usual lexica without attempting a lexical analysis of its behavior in its contexts.
It is a NT hapax legomenon. The standard lexical entries are not adequate to answer this question. Yes, further analysis would most probably help here.
Re: Mt.28:17 οἱ δὲ ἐδίστασαν
Posted: November 28th, 2015, 2:35 am
by Stephen Hughes
Besides this διστάζειν, some words to consider might include;
- ἀδίστακτος - undoubted, undisputed
δίσταγμα (= δισταγμός) - doubt, uncertainty
διστακτικός - expressive of doubt
ἐπιδίστασις - ambiguity
ἐπιδιστάζω - doubt about
The first four entries in this search of a Modern Greek dictionary come up
here. The most valuable thing in that Modern Greek evidence is the statement
διστακτικός -ή -ό [δistaktikós] & δισταχτικός -ή -ό [δistaxtikós] Ε1 : 1. που διστάζει να πει ή να κάνει κτ.:
That can be translated as hesitant / doubtful, that which is / who is hesitant / doubtful to say or to do something. In the case of Matthew 28:17, it would mean that they were hesitant to prostrate themselves να κάνει κάτι is the Modern Greek equivalent of the Koine infinitive - κάμνειν.The form δισταχτικός with χτ for κτ is a Byzantine era sound change. διστακτικός is explained to be a literary word (λόγ.) so it can retain the pre-Byzantine (κτ) phonology is some circumstances or as used by some speakers.
Re: Mt.28:17 οἱ δὲ ἐδίστασαν
Posted: December 13th, 2015, 3:39 pm
by Jody A. Rinas
I'm too late to be helpful but I'll post anyway.
ἐδίστασαν is not a NT hapax but a "twopax." The verb occur earlier in Matthew 14:31. I'll offer up that, in both verses, it means that first Peter and later the 11 "doubted" what Jesus was going to do.
Jody