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Καιροὶ ἐθνῶν at Luke 21:24

Posted: August 4th, 2021, 5:14 am
by Bernd Strauss
Lu 21:24: “Καὶ πεσοῦνται στόματι μαχαίρης καὶ αἰχμαλωτισθήσονται εἰς τὰ ἔθνη πάντα, καὶ Ἰερουσαλὴμ ἔσται πατουμένη ὑπὸ ἐθνῶν, ἄχρι οὗ πληρωθῶσιν καιροὶ ἐθνῶν.”
The phrase καιροὶ ἐθνῶν is used without the article. Does it refer to the world of mankind in general? In such case, does Lu 21:24 mean that the action denoted by the verb πατέω will continue up until the end of the world at the final judgment in the future?

Re: Καιροὶ ἐθνῶν at Luke 21:24

Posted: August 4th, 2021, 7:54 am
by Brian Gould
I don't know whether it helps, but this is what the Jerusalem Bible says in a footnote to this verse:

I.e. the period during which the pagans will take the place of the unfaithful Jewish nation; according to Paul, Rm 11:11-32, this period will end with the conversion of all Israel. An age of indefinite duration is, therefore, to elapse between Jerusalem’s destruction and the end of time.

Re: Καιροὶ ἐθνῶν at Luke 21:24

Posted: August 4th, 2021, 8:45 am
by Barry Hofstetter
Bernd Strauss wrote: August 4th, 2021, 5:14 am Lu 21:24: “Καὶ πεσοῦνται στόματι μαχαίρης καὶ αἰχμαλωτισθήσονται εἰς τὰ ἔθνη πάντα, καὶ Ἰερουσαλὴμ ἔσται πατουμένη ὑπὸ ἐθνῶν, ἄχρι οὗ πληρωθῶσιν καιροὶ ἐθνῶν.”
The phrase καιροὶ ἐθνῶν is used without the article. Does it refer to the world of mankind in general? In such case, does Lu 21:24 mean that the action denoted by the verb πατέω will continue up until the end of the world at the final judgment in the future?
I'm not going to answer the theological question, but the lack of the article does seem to have a generalizing effect in this context. Paradoxically, using the definite article in English is the best way to express this.

Re: Καιροὶ ἐθνῶν at Luke 21:24

Posted: August 5th, 2021, 8:24 am
by Bernd Strauss
Brian Gould wrote: August 4th, 2021, 7:54 am I don't know whether it helps, but this is what the Jerusalem Bible says in a footnote to this verse:

I.e. the period during which the pagans will take the place of the unfaithful Jewish nation; according to Paul, Rm 11:11-32, this period will end with the conversion of all Israel. An age of indefinite duration is, therefore, to elapse between Jerusalem’s destruction and the end of time.
Bible commentaries associate the ‘trampling’ of Jerusalem with the period from the Roman destruction of the city to some point in the future. The timing of the “times of the Gentiles” may not be exactly the same as that of the ‘trampling.’ The καιροὶ ἐθνῶν may be the period of the existence of the world’s nations which had begun before the 'trampling' of Jerusalem.

Re: Καιροὶ ἐθνῶν at Luke 21:24

Posted: August 12th, 2021, 8:24 pm
by Scott Lawson
Bernd Strauss wrote: August 4th, 2021, 5:14 am Lu 21:24: “Καὶ πεσοῦνται στόματι μαχαίρης καὶ αἰχμαλωτισθήσονται εἰς τὰ ἔθνη πάντα, καὶ Ἰερουσαλὴμ ἔσται πατουμένη ὑπὸ ἐθνῶν, ἄχρι οὗ πληρωθῶσιν καιροὶ ἐθνῶν.”
The phrase καιροὶ ἐθνῶν is used without the article. Does it refer to the world of mankind in general? In such case, does Lu 21:24 mean that the action denoted by the verb πατέω will continue up until the end of the world at the final judgment in the future?

Something a bit rare is the use of the periphrastic future ἔσται πατουμένη.