[B-Greek] Joel 3:1-2 (LXX) & Acts 2:17-18 - Why EKCEW APO TOU PNEUMATOS MOU instead of EKCEW TO PNEUMA MOU?
Blue Meeksbay
bluemeeksbay at yahoo.com
Mon May 10 09:41:30 EDT 2010
I noticed Zech. 12:10 does not include APO in describing the Spirit of grace. So it seems, (assuming Spirit of grace is equivalent to the Spirit in Joel), the LXX translators did not have the same concern they had concerning the Spirit in Joel. If that is the case, could not another possibility be that we simply have a different underlying Hebrew text in Joel than that which the Masoretic text supplies? Do the Dead Sea Scrolls help us at all?
On the other hand, if that is not the case, I just thought of this, (going back to the thoughts of George Somsel and Carl Conrad), could Isa. 11:2 perhaps, shed some light of this thought? If the Spirit was thought to be symbolized by various graces or attributes, could not the thought, indeed, be that graces are poured out upon all flesh and not the entirety of the Spirit? – (*Some of my Spirit* as Carl Conrad suggested).
KAI ANAPAUSETAI EP᾽ AUTON PNEUMA TOU QEOU PNEUMA SOFIAS KAI SUNESEWS PNEUMA BOULHS KAI ISCUOS PNEUMA GNWSEWS KAI EUSEBEIASIsa 11:2
Perhaps, in Jewish thought the entirety of the Spirit was reserved only for the Messiah, (the *whole of God’s Spirit,* as George Somsel said).
hON GAR APESTEILEN hO QEOS, TA hRHMATA TOU QEOU LALEI• OU GAR EK METROU DIDWSIN hO QEOS TO PNEUMA. Joh 3:34 Byzantine text
For he whom God hath sent speaketh the words of God: for God giveth not the Spirit by measure unto him. KJV
Sincerely,
Blue Harris
________________________________
From: George F Somsel <gfsomsel at yahoo.com>
To: Eric S. Weiss <papaweiss1 at yahoo.com>; Carl Conrad <cwconrad2 at mac.com>; b-greek <b-greek at lists.ibiblio.org>
Sent: Sun, May 9, 2010 7:54:57 PM
Subject: Re: [B-Greek] Joel 3:1-2 (LXX) & Acts 2:17-18 - Why EKCEW APO TOU PNEUMATOS MOU instead of EKCEW TO PNEUMA MOU?
I don't think that the LXX translators were stepping away from the idea that it would be God's Spirit. It rather seems that they were emphasizing the fact that it was not the whole of God's Spirit. That is why a partitive is used.
george
gfsomsel
… search for truth, hear truth,
learn truth, love truth, speak the truth, hold the truth,
defend the truth till death.
- Jan Hus
_________
________________________________
From: Eric S. Weiss <papaweiss1 at yahoo.com>
To: Carl Conrad <cwconrad2 at mac.com>; b-greek <b-greek at lists.ibiblio.org>
Sent: Sun, May 9, 2010 6:56:21 PM
Subject: Re: [B-Greek] Joel 3:1-2 (LXX) & Acts 2:17-18 - Why EKCEW APO TOU PNEUMATOS MOU instead of EKCEW TO PNEUMA MOU?
That suggests to me that the LXX translators engaged in a bit of interpretation.
Maybe for something like the "remoteness" reason Mark L. suggested?
I.e., they wanted to take a bit of a step away from the idea that it would in fact
be God's Spirit - period - that He would pour out on His people, so they added
the qualifying "some of"?
- - -
Eric S. Weiss
From: Carl Conrad cwconrad2 at mac.com
Conybeare and Stock's little Grammar of LXX Greek, §92. ἀπό. a. ἀπό [APO] in the
LXX is often little more than a sign of the genitive, like our English ‘of,’ provided that
the genitive be partitive.
That suggests that the LXX translator had the sense in mind, "some of my spirit."
See also BDAG: s.v. APO 1.f as a substitute for the partitive gen.
... ἐκχεῶ ἀ. τοῦ πνεύματός μου [EKCEW APO TOU PNEUMATOS MOU] Ac 2:17f (Jo 3:1f).
Carl W. Conrad
Department of Classics, Washington University (Retired)
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