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Oppiliappan List Archive: Message 00210 Dec 2008

 
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Respected swamy

I want to know where are you now?  Tell me- are you belong to  Rug, Yajur, Samam.

On my own interest, I would like to come forward to enable you to do Pithru Karma with full of satisfaction.  Ultimate goal is satisfaction. 

I noted all points.  I request you kindly note the following points. This practice bring you happiness on doing pithru karma.

If he is a pensioner no problem of money.  If he is not, you will take the responsibility in the following area.  Is it not.

When you are father is alive - your are providing the following.

1.  Purchase of cloth
2.  You are furnishing Morning Coffee, Food, Tiffin, Evening Food and Milk in the night
3.  He will be taken to hospital when he is not well.  (Even hospitalised)
4.  Some times he will travel also along with you (or) with somebody

Normally when he is alive his yearly expenditure will be around Rs.10000/-. (Per annum)

When he is away from you (Sri Vaikuntam), you are expenses will be maximum of  Rs.6000 only.

Kindly have a nice look the following breakup for every srardham.

1.  Brahaspathi Sambhavanai - Rs.350/-.
2.  Brahma                            - Rs.50/-
3.  Thandulam                      - Rs.10/-
4.  Anugnai                           - Rs.25/-(each Rs.5/- Brahaspathi, swamis,Thaligai)
5.  Srardha Anugnai              - Rs.25/-
6.  Swami Dakshinai             - Rs.300/- each
7.  Thaligai swamy dakshinai - Rs.400/- each (if 2) or Rs.600/-.
8.  Ghosti Dakshinai             -  Rs.50/- (Rs.10/- each)
9.   Sripada Theertham          - Rs.10/- each swamy
10.  Conveyance                   - Rs.20/- each swamy & Thaligai.
11.  Provisions etc.               - Rs.1500/- to Rs.2000/-

rounding off                           - Rs.3000/- per srardham.

We have to offer atleast 5 to 10% of our earnings to our pithrus.  This is pithru karyam should be done by every one.  We cannot escape (or) offering food for Orphanages is to be avoided.

I will inform 30 days notice to Brahaspathi & Thaligai swamy with 3 reminders.
A cotton bag will be hanged before 15 days advance with the item of Honey Bottle, Kirambu, Elachi, Jathikai, Jathi bathri, Betun pakku.

Cowdung cake and Chulli will always be available in stock.

Srardha kainkaryam in Chennai especially, Triplicane, Mylapore and other places is normally cheaper than the other city.

Also, I would like to advice the person concerned who raise the inability (or) inconvenience for srardham, have to prepare for themselves, to save an amount of Rs.700/-.

S.THIRUNARAYANAN of Karappangadu

--- On Thu, 18/12/08, Satish S <satish_69@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
From: Satish S <satish_69@xxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [Oppiliappan] Cost of srardham
To: Oppiliappan@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Date: Thursday, 18 December, 2008, 7:53 PM

I understand Sriman Kochappa's problem. I faced it myself.

Let me share my experiences from a different angle. I am 30, working, and I earn enough to support my family. My father passed away 4 months ago. I have been doing his maasiyams and sothakumbams every month without fail.

My father died at a time when my wife was 8 and a half months pregnant. All the savings for the medicines and the hospitalisation for the impending delivery went towards my father's ceremonies. Naturally, this meant I had to conduct all ceremonies on a shoestring budget.

Somehow the fact that I had just Rs. 35,000 to spend on the whole ceremony did not please the Vadhyaar swamin. Through the six days of ceremonies he made it known everyday that he found the money to be very less. (I'm not bitter at the vadhyaar --afterall he has wife and children to think of, just like me. And a life in Bombay can be pretty unforgiving! )

But this brings me to a deeper question. Why the onus on symbolism?. Sure, I went through each and every ceremony manapoorvama. But why does money have to play such a large role, when the whole thing is not about money -- its about a man's soul being laid to rest.

I disagree with Sriman Thirunarayanan when he says "if all is laid out well the swamin will do the ceremony and not do mantra lobham". In my particular case everything was in place for the ceremonies -- the swamin himself acknowledged it, but said the money was less (repeatedly! ).

Let me please add: I am religious and my relashionship with God works on a deeper, more intuitive level. My experiences (although not ideal) have not scarred me or made me bitter. And the experiences will not deter from me doing all ceremonies on schedule, as per my duty as a son/karta.

But questions that will rankle me for a long, long time: Why is money so important for a son to pray for my father's soul?
(Mind you I ask you this question as an able-bodied 30 year old man, perfectly capable of taking care of my family and quite WILLING to spare money for my father's ceremony). I have a feeling this is quite the same question Sriman Kochappa is asking.

And I have a feeling the question will not have quick answers.

Apologies if all this makes for grim reading. No disrespect to anyone or any sampradayam.
 
Adiyen,
Satish Sarangarajan



From: thirunarayanan swamy iyengar <nanu_04011955@ yahoo.com>
To: Oppiliappan@ yahoogroups. com
Sent: Monday, December 15, 2008 9:36:20 PM
Subject: Re: [Oppiliappan] Cost of srardham

Respected swamy,

Any kainkaryam / any job / any help (paropaharam) you do for others.  It should be done with total involvement.  We can called as "dedicated service".  If you do not have, then the result will not be upto our satisfaction.  I would like to say some example.

Our parents had taught disciplined / dedicated service while we do srardha kainkaryam.  Our parents won't allow us to go to school.  We have to assist the parents by procuring vegetables, cutting the same, to arrange cowdung cake and chulli, all the pre-arrangements to be done.  After srardham begins,  we will take care of postman tapals, attending telephonic calls, etc.  We should not inform any msg /  information to our parents while doing srardham.  We should be always alert that time.

We will make all arrangements before vadhyar comes.  He will see all the items kept ready and be happy.  He will not do any Manthra Loabham if Srardhai Lobayae is not.  He will happily do srardha performance.

All should do srardha kainkaryam for their parents according to Veda Sastra, eventhough the departed soul reached vaikundham.

S.THIRUNARAYANA of Karappangdu



--- On Mon, 15/12/08, srinivasan sowmianarayanan <vasans2004@yahoo. com> wrote:
From: srinivasan sowmianarayanan <vasans2004@yahoo. com>
Subject: Re: [Oppiliappan] Cost of srardham
To: Oppiliappan@ yahoogroups. com
Date: Monday, 15 December, 2008, 6:10 AM

Dear SwAmins, It is said that according to our siddhanta the departed soul either attains Acharyan Tiruvadi in Paramapadam or if not done prapatti takes re-birth. It is also said that srardha is a way of worshipping the Lord and to please pitras and not exactly feeding the departed souls. In view of the present situataion in which many retired and old persons are unable to perform srardha, why not simplify the procedure so that there is no trouble for such persons who have no income or are living in a poor condition? Now-a-days the cost of conductiong srardhams has gone up several times. Even those who have some income after retirement are finding it very difficult to perform srardhams. Our acharyas or knowledgeable persons should show a way out for such persons who have faith in such ceremonies but cannot afford to do so. Now-a-days even weddings have become a simple affair and less cumbersome and less time-consuming. Similarly observing srardhams too should become simple. If it is a sort of worshipping the Lord, why not offer some ubayam in Temples where not only poor but Brahmins also also fed?
This is a suggestion for thought. Some one has to bell the cat. No intention of offending anyone.
Regards,
dAsan
anbil SrInivAsan   

--- On Wed, 10/12/08, harsha simha <hellosimha@gmail. com> wrote:
From: harsha simha <hellosimha@gmail. com>
Subject: Re: [Oppiliappan] Cost of srardham
To: Oppiliappan@ yahoogroups. com
Date: Wednesday, 10 December, 2008, 9:34 PM

Dear Swamin,


Following from Valmiki Ramayanam, ayodhya khanda, sarga-103 and shlokas from  2-103-25 to 2-103-30  explains how Shri Rama did pinda pradhanam when he heard about his father's death during his aranya vaasam at chitrakoota. 

 

(Below translation is taken from: http://www.valmikir amayan.net/ ayodhya/sarga103 /ayodhya_ 103_frame. htm)

 

Quote â

The illustrious Rama and others painfully reached the River Mandakini, that stream of sacred fords, the enchanting one always covered with flowers, coming to a blessed ford, free from mud and offered the lustrual water to the king, saying "Father! May this prove agreeable to you."

Holding together in the form of a hollow his palms full of water and turning his face turned towards the southern quarter and weeping the great prince pronounced the traditional words saying: "O, Tiger among men! May this water without taint and incorruptible at the moment that I offer it to you, reach you in the region of your ancestors where you are."

Thereafter, the glorious Rama, resending the bank of Mandakini River along with his brothers, offered balls of food to his father. He placed the pulp of the Ingudi tree mixed with the pulp of plums on a mat of Kusa grass and overcome with sadness, weeping, spoke the following words: "O, Great King! Be pleased to partake of this, which we eat for, that which man eats, is also consumed by his gods."

 -Unquote

My point  is not that everyone should perform pinda pradhanam with the pulp of the Ingudi tree, but rather the point we should note here  is that we should perform rituals with the resources available within our limits. But in no circumstance we should skip the ritual itself.

And hence Shri Rama himself says in shloka 2-103-30, that

 

idambhuÃkÃva mahËrËja prÅto yadaÃanË vayam |
yadannaà puruÃo bhavati tadannË stasya devatËà || 2-103-30

 

"O, Great King! Be pleased to partake of this, which we eat for, that which man eats, is also consumed by his gods."

 

 

This is just my understanding of this event and if there is any misunderstanding, elders and learned scholars in the group should guide us further. I once again apologize if i have hurt anyone with my views in my previous mail. With humble pranamas,
Harsha Simha

On Wed, Dec 10, 2008 at 11:38 AM, Govindakrishnan Alagar <govindakrishnanalag ar@gmail. com> wrote:
Swamins
Kochappaa's agony is understandable. The gentlemen inspite of the pain appears to be performing srardhams to his parents and helping his sisters too. That is laudable. But given the present day conditions of cost demands from vathiar swamins and others (they too have their constrains in the costly world), I do not know whether there is any way of doing it at less cost, unless, as suggested by Kochapa swami himself that Brahmins associations take up a pool of bruhaspathis and willing swamins, and organize to depute them on standard tariffs. It would be nice if Harsha simha swami elucidates for the benefit of all,, how Sri Rama conducted the pitru srardham economically.
Adiyen
Govindakrishnan

 
On 10/12/2008, harsha simha <hellosimha@gmail. com> wrote:
Dear swamin,
I can understand your pain. But, no where it is compelled that we should go beyond our limits and perform these rituals. As you have taken pain to calculate the amount to do shraddham, you can take a bit more pain to read Ramayanam to know how Shri Rama did "pinda pradhanam"  to dasharatha, when he was in "aranya vasa".  I feel, your thought is a direct result of "performing rituals without understanding the meaning and purpose behind that".

While we should condemn those Bruhaspathis  who perform these rituals for the sake of money, we should even more condemn those who are the reeal "karthas" (responsible doer) but who want to just perform these rituals without knowing the meaning and purpose of these rituals and end up blaming the Bruhaspathis.

Because, it is nowhere mentioned in our shastras (as far as i know) that we should go beyond our limits to perform these rituals, skipping shraddham itself is not a sollution. But, we should try to understand the meaning and purpose of the ritual and then find a way out to perfrom these rituals within our limits.

If you want to *really* feed 25 mouths every year, i have a better idea. We can skip one lunch every week. By this we will save 52 lunch in a year which can feed 52 mouths every year (and not just 25). But, lets do our rituals within our limits and also with an understanding of the meaning and the purpose of the rituals.

I apologize if you find any of my views offensive..

With humble pranamas,
harsha simha

On Mon, Dec 8, 2008 at 2:19 PM, kochappaa <kochappaa@yahoo. co.in> wrote:
Respected swamins,
I want to share a haunting thought of mine. I am a retired middle
class pensioner in Banglaore. For the past 3 or so years I find
things are becoming very costly for doing annual pitru srardhams.
The charges are like this: Rs.650 for Bruhaspathi + small coins
Rs.50, Rs.600 for 2 swmingals, Rs.700 for thaligai swami and the
provisions Rs. 600. Thus the total cost of a srardham is Rs.2600. I
have to do two per year and arrange for the srardham of my poor
sister who passed away. Many middle class bramins must be facing
this kind of music. Can any middle class person can afford such
costs? Whether any other people from other religion or even other
caste people would spend like this annually on remembering the
departed souls? Rs.500 if donated to an orphanate or oldage home
would feed atleast 25 mouths. Where is our sect heading towards. I
am sure that unless our sect wakes up and rationalise and regulate
these fleecing bruhaspathis, the whole custom of peforming such
rites would quickly vanish. It is time, our mutts start some
registered body where they should register these bruhaspahtis and
swamins and fix reasonable tariff also.

adiyen
Kochappaa




--
Yours
Govindakrishnan Alagar

Hands that serve are holier than lips that pray. - Sri Sathya Sai Baba






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