Via email chat
Tuesday, August 19, 2003
Interview by Marisa Brickman
I stumbled, almost literally, on Tussle one day at a Twisted Ones show
in a junkyard next to Mighty Robot in Williamsburg, Brooklyn. Excited
by the prospect of an outside show on a beautiful summer day four blocks
from my apartment, I rounded up the troops for the occasion to hit the
event en masse.
Of course the show was BYOB, so we thought thermoses of Sangria was
just what the doctor ordered. Also on the line-up that day was the Broke
Revue, Numbers and Rogers Sisters. As the afternoon wore on, the breeze
started flowing. We got drunker and more daring (climbing roofs and
partying next door with the Dominicans in the bodega), and by the time
the sun started going down it was the perfect setting for my Tussle
inauguration.
Our crew which included the NV girls, Bike Posse, little Colin (my 13-year-old
zine-making, skateboarding prodigy rolling with us to his first rock
show EVER!), the junkyard roosters, the Dominicans next door and the
hipsters who were out in full force all came together in peace and harmony
to share the Tussle jam.
San-Francisco-based quartet Tussle plays bass-heavy, instrumental, hypnotic
groove rock that has hints of techno, dub, hip-hop and reggae. By creating
their songs from improvised jams, Tussle makes a new sort of dance music
for the person that is hip, but neither hippie nor hipster (although
you know we all have a little bit of both in us). In addition to the
regular drum set-up, Tussle has a second kit made of found plastic and
metal objects including the staple plastic bucket.
Having played in a bevy of alternative spaces (i.e. multiple basements,
SOMA, Deitch Projects and other small galleries), Tussle seemed right
at home in the junkyard turned ghetto bandshell. I had never heard Tussle
before and I was so moved by the grooves that day that I made a point
to catch up with one of the band members. I’d been dancing and
drinking Sangria all day long and didn’t hold anything back when
I accosted Alexis Georgopoulos (drums, melodica) to tell him how great
I thought his band was. Colin had a great time too, so we wanted to
thank him for making his first show experience a good one. Smiling politely
Alexis handed over a copy of their latest 12-inch single “Eye
Contact”(Troubleman) which features cover art by Chris Johansen
– hot! The record captures a more electronic and ambient Tussle
sound than what I heard live. With just a maxi-single and a track on
Frisco Styles (Deitch Projects), we’ve yet to see what these guys
are capable of, but their slowly growing army of fans is anxiously awaiting
the next release.
Look for their CD/EP Don’t Stop (Troubleman) this October featuring
remixes from Matmos (Soft Pink Truth), Barry 7 of Add N to (X) and Stuart
Argabright (Death Comet Crew). Tussle plans to tour with their San Francisco
pals Erase Errata in Europe later this year.
At the last minute, I tracked down Alexis via email and he rallied
the rest of the crew to answer some of my pressing questions in the
nick of time. Andy Cabic (bass), Nathan Burazer (sampler, drum machine,
Casio, effects) and Jonathan Holland (custom drum set, bells, plastic
buckets, metal, found objects) proved to be a witty crew of rockers.
Is the Mission District the hip area of San Fran? Like the
Williamsburg of the West or the Silverlake of the North? What makes
it special/different?
Alexis: Hmmm, yeah. It is often compared to those places. Mostly I think
because a lot of arty kids live in each of them. But I think the Mission’s
a bit more working class than either Silverlake or Williamsburg. But
I think the particular mixture of kids and families and down and out
people and cultural influences make it its own place.
Nathan: Yes, the Mission is the hip area of San Francisco, since we
got rid of the yuppies after the fall of the dot-commers. It’s
a very casual area. The Mission is probably gnarlier than those places.
We have a lot of homelessness. We’ve had a homeless man living
in front of our house since we moved in five years ago.
Jonathan: The mission is dirty, cheap, smelly, loving, hateful, colorful,
noisy, ugly and beautiful. At its best: Dolores Park at sunset, or free
shows at the BART station on 16th and Mission, or art openings at Adobe.
At its worst: walking home to find a crack-head writhing on the piss-drenched
sidewalk in front of your house, or walking up on someone shitting on
your front porch.
East Coast vs. West Coast? Why?
Andy: It’s just players and haters getting confused.
Jonathan: Exactly, why? To quote Rakim, “It ain’t where
yer from, its where yer at.” For real doe, I think we’re
more into building bridges than walls. I mean, we all came to SF from
the east.
I think of burritos when I think of San Fran – where’s
the best burrito place? Brunch place?
Andy: Dangerous question. For many, eating burritos is a sport, so saying
which aquaria you think is best is akin to picking a favorite team,
and really, they’re all pretty fucking good. Lately I’ve
been into tacos, particularly the red snapper ones at Pancho Villa.
They have radishes there as well which is always a plus. But Baja Taqueria
right around the corner from our house is wonderful as well.
Jonathan: Yes, yes. This is a very sensitive topic for many, but I’ll
have to say that Baja is my favorite because of convenience, and it’s
a bit below the radar. And, I guess I don’t do brunch.
Nathan: I lost interest in burritos about one year ago. Now I eat taco
salads, which is the same thing as a burrito, but in a taco shell. Taco
salads are not as heavy as burritos. Have you every gone into “Burrito
Coma?” It’s that bloated heavy feeling after eating a big
Mission burrito too quickly. Boogaloos for brunch if there is no line.
What is your favorite thing to do in San Fran, aside from play music?
Andy: Drop by the Adobe Bookshop and find out how everybody’s
doing.
Alexis: Yeah, and maybe have a drink at Uptown or Doc’s Clock.
Nathan: Cycling, I love going to Baker Beach or exploring areas I have
never gone to before. I also make animations or collages on a daily
basis and I like drinking tea.
Jonathan: Cycling, building stuff and painting – I’m surprised
Andy didn’t say record shopping!
What about where you live makes it conducive to playing music?
Andy: The right amount of activity – just enough to do, hear,
see, but not feel overwhelmed. Taking your question literally, three-fourths
of Tussle lives in our apartment and we practice in the basement.
Nathan: Our neighbors are younger and they don’t mind the racket.
It helps that kids here are very supportive of each other artistically.
Alexis: In the past couple of years, there has just been an incredibly
enthusiastic, supportive scene. On any given night, bands will play.
And friends will always give shit a listen. People want to be moved
and to have a good time so there is a willingness to check things out
and support friends trying new things.
How have these things affected, shaped the current music scene
– The hippie roots? The Art Institute? Rave culture/electronic
music?
Andy: That’s a lot of question. Each on their own have fine qualities,
all intertwined together would be unfortunate.
Nathan: They say that SF attracts pioneering minds. The electronic music
coming from here is fairly pioneering, like Matmos, Kit Clayton, Kid
606, etc. I am sure somehow the old hippies, the beats of the 1960s,
have left their mark somewhere on the current music scene, but maybe
it’s the DIY philosophy to making stuff happen.
What other bands do you consider your brethren and your homies?
Alexis: Coachwhips, Troll, Numbers, Erase Errata, Matmos, Deerhoof,
Devendra Banhart, Aislers Set –
Nathan: Yeah, all those plus Rebar, Tekromantik & Hello Noisy, A
Tension.
Do you guys all like to dance or do you just make music that people
can dance to?
Alexis: If there’s some Egyptian Lover on the tables, we’ll
be on the floor.
Andy: I love to watch Jonathan dance. I believe the last time we all
danced together was after we played the Knitting Factory in July, to
a set by the Crazy Rhythms Crew. That was a lot of fun.
Jonathan (blushing): Fuck yeah, I’ll throw down. I used to be
a wallflower, like so many others, but once I got my dancin’ shoes
– look out Dancin’ Outlaw! But I hate when you feel like
you HAVE to dance, like, when bands will get all militant if you’re
not dancing to their shit. Sometimes you’re just not feeling it:
it’s a sausage-fest, the grooves are wack, or some EMF wanna-be
is yelling DANCE! orders at you. But on the flip, it does suck to be
feelin’ all irie, wanting to get down, and standing all around
you are people thinking, “Oh, uh, I can’t dance.”
I call bullshit on you. Yes you CAN!!! But like I said, I can understand
why some folks wouldn’t be feelin it. For whatever reason.
You’ve performed live in a lot of art gallery sort of
spaces and alternative venues (like the junkyard, yes!). What setting
is best for Tussle and Tussle’s music?
Alexis: House parties seem to be a favorite. People are just much less
self-conscious in that context than at clubs. And the party always seems
to last much longer.
Jonathan: I think we are at our best in more intimate spaces, preferably
something more underground like, basements. It fits our sound better
than, say, rock clubs.
Nathan: Art spaces are fun, dirty and dark. Stinking clubs get old after
awhile. I think we all really enjoyed playing at the San Francisco Museum
of Modern Art, and making a loud racket. It’s usually so quiet
and dull in there.
Were any of you guys former hippies?
Alexis: Depends on what that means. If you mean, “Did any of you
get stoned and grow your hair out and listen to psychedelic music?”
Then I guess, yeah. I have been known on occasion — perhaps to
the chagrin of my bandmates — to still occasionally listen to
early Grateful Dead and Moby Grape records and get nostalgic about taking
acid in high school. But do I attend the Horde Tour? Absolutely no fucking
way! Is that shit still going?
Andy: I have never had a string cheese incident, and I don’t know
what that is. I would say, Anthem of the Sun is my favorite Dead album,
though I also enjoy Old and In the Way, but I don’t think that
counts.
Alexis: Yeah, it does.
How do you feel about the term jam band and what does that make you
think of?
Jonathan: Everything that’s bad about cocaine.
Alexis: It makes me a bit nauseous. It makes me think of the Incredible
String Cheese Incident or whatever. I mean, the scene surrounding that
stuff colors it in a very specific way. But everyone has different distinctions
when it comes to this stuff. For me, there are really distinct lines
that separate contemporary jam bands from stuff like Can and Faust or
even something like LaMonte Young. And I think it has something to do
with restraint. Bands where everyone’s shredding at the same time
just drive me insane. But when bands play an extended form of intuitive,
spontaneous minimalism, I love it.
Andy: Jam band is bad news. Me run go the other way.
Nathan: The term jam band makes me sleepy. The term jug band gets me
excited.
What’s a better name to describe the slew of bands who have found
their “inner hippie” and are letting loose, jamming with
lots of instruments, making music kids can freak out to, but who are
also intelligent and artsy?
Alexis: Ummm, do you mean people like the Animal Collective or Black
Dice or Boredoms? I feel like there’ve been bands that have been
“jamming” and being arty for a long time. Sonic Youth comes
to mind. But I mean, The Slits were kinda hippies too. There have been
a lot who’ve walked the tightrope.
How do you feel about costumes/uniforms for live performances?
What is the Tussle uniform?
Alexis: Lots of our friends are rocking the uniforms these days: Numbers,
Erase Errata, Pink & Brown (RIP). I don’t know if we will
ever rock a uniform as such. Our friend Devendra Banhart and Alissa,
Andy’s girlfriend, once dressed up in these weird chicken costumes
and danced with us onstage. That was pretty fun. But onstage, at least
these days, we tend to dress as we do in our everyday lives. Which is
to say, some pants, some shoes, a shirt. Pretty crazy, huh? Though we
have been trying to talk Jonathan into playing shirtless a la Def Leppard!
How do you guys incorporate improvisation into what you do?
Andy: Improvisation Inc.
Alexis: Um, yeah. We don’t really incorporate it, but our songs
are constructed from improvisations.
Nathan: Improvisation is a starting point. Like a sketch, sometimes
a sketch needs refinement, sometimes it works as a finished drawing
and sometimes it’s better to let it go. You may not know the difference
with us.
What is the role of visual art in Tussle? I like the animation
on the website and LOVE the album cover artwork – Chris Johansen
eh?
Alexis: I think we all sort of think of sound in abstract, visual terms
and we want our sleeve art to correspond to that.
Nathan: Yeah, CJ’s painting worked really well for the cover.
I am a visual artist more than I am a musician. The animations on the
website are my own experiments, and they will continue. I am glad you
like them. Someday it might be cool to project them at shows.
Jonathan: Well, I’d always considered myself a visual artist first
and foremost, until Tussle happened. But visual art is still probably
my main preoccupation.
What’s the deal with recording with one microphone? Do
you guys always do that?
Alexis: You must be referring to the website. Yeah, it’s not a
credo or anything. It’s really born of necessity. We just record
all our rehearsals with a minidisc player and one microphone and put
some recent song sketches on the site (tussle.org). But I mean, if we
had a full studio at our disposal, we would use as many microphones
as we could!
What’s the Tussle secret weapon?
Jonathan: It wouldn’t be a secret anymore if we told you!
Nathan: Weapon? You’re trippin’, it’s all about the
love.
Alexis: Oh no! We are hippies!
What’s your theory behind releasing CD singles and 12-inches?
How did you decide who you wanted to remix your stuff?
Alexis: Well, the unofficial way things are usually done is that bands
release albums. And electronic artists release 12-inches. We like to
blur things and thought it’d be cool to try to get our stuff to
DJs. I also like the limited edition quality of singles and think it’s
an interesting way for a band to stir interest before they’re
ready to put an entire album together.
I hear Trevor Jackson and Prefuse are fans. How did you find
that out and any plans to work with them?
Alexis: Trevor was given a white label of our first single from someone
at Rough Trade London who thought he would like it. Then he wrote to
us and told us he was sorry he slept on the demo we’d sent him
months earlier! In terms of Scott Herren (Prefuse 73), I interviewed
him for a magazine and we got to talking and got along really well.
I told him I wanted to send him some of our stuff. And after he got
it, he wrote us really enthusiastically saying he and his roommate in
Barcelona were waking up and dancing to it every morning! There is some
talk of doing a collaboration of some sort but it’s very much
in the works.
Do people always dance at your shows?
Alexis: Some body rocking definitely happens.
Andy: They do that dance where you cross your arms and nod your head.
That’s very popular, helps them keep their center of balance.
Nathan: Usually at least people will bob their head up and down –
at the least. It really fuels the music when people dance at shows.
It’s the best way to communicate with us while we are playing.
What city do people dance the most in? The least in?
Andy: Prince told us Erotic City was a cool place for dancing, but we
haven’t gone there yet. Well, Nathan has.
Alexis: Do people ever dance in Boston? That is the least fun place
I’ve ever played.
Jonathan: Yeah, Boston, getcho shit togethah...
Nathan: Why do you think they call it San FranDISCO?
Where do people seem to “get it” the most?
Andy: Groin, Rectum.
Who does Tussle make music for?
Alexis: For the people.
Andy: For the kids...of the people
What are you doing tonight?
Alexis: Our friend Simon Evans has an art opening at Jack Hanley Gallery
and he asked us to play.
Andy: I went to an art show at a friend’s apartment. I skipped
out on seeing M.Ward at Du Nord, now I’m listening to Bitch Magnet
in my room instead.
What is most exciting about the upcoming tour with Erase Errata?
Alexis: That we get to hang out with the EE ladeez and get to see them
rock it every night.
Andy: I haven’t traveled outside the states in twelve years and
I’m looking forward to some distance.