[percy-l] Percy-L Digest, Vol 30, Issue 34

Franklin Wilson fawil5 at open.org
Wed Aug 31 23:40:52 EDT 2005


To whom it may concern:
    Please disregard my previous e-mail!  I sent a private reply to the 
Percy List by mistake.
Mea culpa...
Franklin Wilson
----- Original Message ----- 
From: <percy-l-request at lists.ibiblio.org>
To: <percy-l at lists.ibiblio.org>
Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2005 7:51 PM
Subject: Percy-L Digest, Vol 30, Issue 34


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> Today's Topics:
>
>   1. Re: "What's so great about this Percy guy, anyway?"
>      (dabeck at iupui.edu)
>   2. Re: "What's so great about this Percy guy, anyway?"
>      (Patrick Lynch)
>   3. Re: "What's so great about this Percy guy, anyway?"
>      (dabeck at iupui.edu)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 20:50:05 -0500
> From: dabeck at iupui.edu
> Subject: Re: [percy-l] "What's so great about this Percy guy, anyway?"
> To: "Percy-L: Literary and Philosophical Discussion"
> <percy-l at lists.ibiblio.org>, "Karl M. Terrell"
> <kterrell at sheastokes.com>
> Cc: "Percy-L: Literary and Philosophical Discussion"
> <percy-l at lists.ibiblio.org>
> Message-ID: <1125539405.43165e4ddc04a at webmail.iu.edu>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> Karl,
> I think you're right. It is the anticipation more than the aftermath. But
> probably it is also in the moment, to some extent. Like on the battlefield
> (not that I've been there), the rush of the danger might make one more 
> "alive"
> in the moment (as I heard Jackson Browne sing the other day on the
> radio: "While the veterans, dream of the fight/While fast asleep at the
> traffic light") but that same person might have to deal with PTSD later.
> I don't have Message in a Bottle with me, but the man on the train is in 
> the
> middle of a crisis when he notices his hand for the first time. I guess it 
> all
> depends on what the outcome is.
> While slightly different, I remember a friend of mine whose daughter died
> when she was six or seven, saying that it was the most painful experience 
> in
> his life, but at the same time, the most beautiful. He said that it 
> awakened
> him to what was important and to the presence of God (and he was a 
> pastor). In
> LIR, regarding his daughter's death, More asks something like, What if you 
> ask
> God for a miracle and it happens. What then? After that he says, 
> "Samantha,
> forgive me. I'm sorry you suffered and died, my heart broke, but there 
> have
> been times when I wasn't above enjoying it." One of the strangest lines in
> Percy's fiction, in my opinion.
> Does it tie into what we've been discussing (i.e. "hurricane syndrome", 
> etc.?)
> -David
>
>
>
> Quoting "Karl M. Terrell" <kterrell at sheastokes.com>:
>
>> I think it's the approach of bad news that excites us.  The aftermath or
>> reality, however, dumps us back into ordinariness.  Hence, the
>> fundamental need to continue searching.
>>
>> Percy pointed out the weird, guilty giddiness we receive from bad news;
>> how we almost wish for it.  The media, of course, is onto this.  Several
>> weeks ago a plane crashed and all 100+ passengers walked away with no
>> deaths and few injuries.  The sense of disappointment among the talking
>> heads was palpable.
>>
>> Karl
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: dabeck at iupui.edu [mailto:dabeck at iupui.edu]
>> Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2005 11:57 AM
>> To: Percy-L: Literary and Philosophical Discussion
>> Subject: Re: [percy-l] "What's so great about this Percy guy, anyway?"
>>
>>
>>
>> I'm not sure what Percy would say about this recent disaster. I do know,
>>
>> however, that conveying this idea--that tragedy can break us from our
>> everydayness, even make life exciting again--is difficult to convey to
>> my
>> college students. Some get it; some think it's crazy.
>>  When I used to Lancelot along with Fight Club, I would point out the
>> similarities (narrator/Tyler hoping that the plane he's on crashes, etc.
>> That
>> feeling pain is better than feeling nothing, etc.
>>  I remember on and after 9/11 we had this discussion on the list. It
>> seemed to
>> be an example of where Percy's hurricane theory didn't work.  Off to
>> class. -David
>>
>> Quoting "Karl M. Terrell" <kterrell at sheastokes.com>:
>>
>> > * * This communication is CONFIDENTIAL * *
>> >
>> > Tying the two current themes together ... I was also first attracted
>> > to Percy by the sheer delight in reading his wonderfully smooth prose,
>>
>> > and the way his likable characters roam outside the mainstream,
>> buffeting
>> > about, but ultimately in search of some truer path.   The search seems
>> > to begin with awareness of the discomfort of "everydayness."
>> >
>> > I was particularly struck, early on, with his comparison (I forget
>> > where, but he returns to this in several books) of a successful man
>> > sitting in his fine home in Short Hills, N.J. on a Wednesday
>> > afternoon, birds chirping contentedly in the trees against a clear
>> > blue sky -- he should be feeling fine; the world is his oyster; but he
>>
>> > finds himself profoundly ill at ease -- contrasted with the excitement
>>
>> > one feels when a hurricane is bearing down.  Bad news takes us out of
>> > the ordinariness of a Wednesday afternoon, where you're stuck and
>> > don't know what to do, and wonder how in the hell you'll make it
>> > through the next few hours.
>> >
>> > But now the hurricane has passed, and has devastated a great city.
>> > Amidst the grief, the ordinariness of a day-to-day struggle of
>> > returning to the ordinary will take over.  I wonder how Percy would
>> > write of that experience -- perhaps he has, and I don't recall (it's
>> > been many years since I really spent a lot of time with WP).  Love in
>> > the Ruins?  Maybe someone out there can point to a book or passage.
>> >
>> > Karl
>> > -----Original Message----- .
>> > From: Dye, Steve [mailto:sldye at bluegrass.org]
>> > Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2005 10:04 AM
>> > To: Percy-L: Literary and Philosophical Discussion
>> > Subject: Re: [percy-l] "What's so great about this Percy guy, anyway?"
>> >
>> >
>> > My thoughts exactly...the New Orleans that many of have known and
>> > loved for years (and that was so beautifully written about by Percy)
>> > is gone forever...
>> >
>> > -----Original Message-----
>> > From: percy-l-bounces at lists.ibiblio.org
>> > [mailto:percy-l-bounces at lists.ibiblio.org] On Behalf Of Stuart Chapman
>> > Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2005 9:42 AM
>> > To: Percy-L: Literary and Philosophical Discussion
>> > Subject: Re: [percy-l] "What's so great about this Percy guy, anyway?"
>> >
>> > Been thinking about you, Percy, and everybody else New Orleans-related
>>
>> > over these last few days, and I hope that you are ok.
>> >
>> > It's just awful.
>> >
>> > Stuart
>> >
>> > Dave Duty <daveduty at austin.rr.com> wrote:
>> > Is no one else on the list concerned about Nikki and the other New
>> > Orleans area residents?
>> >
>> > Nikki -- if your out there -- let us know if you and your loved ones
>> > are ok -- God Bless -- Dave
>> >
>> > JHForest at cs.com <mailto:JHForest at cs.com>  wrote:
>> >
>> >
>> > >> What would you say to a young person who asks, "What so great about
>> > this
>> > Percy guy, anyway?" <<
>> >
>> > What keeps Walker Percy in print fifteen years after his death is the
>> > sheer delight of reading his books.
>> >
>> > A key word with Percy was "search." It seems to me all of his fiction
>> > and non-fiction have to do with that topic. As he said:
>> >
>> > "If I had the choice of knowing the truth or searching for the truth,
>> > I'd take the search."
>> >
>> > It's a subject of the search has been much on my mind lately if for no
>> > other reason than I'm at work on a book about pilgrimage (understood
>> > not only as making journeys to distant shrines but an attitude about
>> > being that has little to do with travel). One way of defining a
>> pilgrim
>> > is a person on a search.
>> >
>> > Jim Forest
>> >
>> > * * *
>> > Jim & Nancy Forest
>> > Kanisstraat 5 / 1811 GJ Alkmaar / The Netherlands
>> > Jim's e-mail: jhforest at cs.com <mailto:jhforest at cs.com>  (alternative
>> > address: jhforest at gmail.com <mailto:jhforest at gmail.com> ) Nancy's
>> > e-mail: forestflier at cs.com <mailto:forestflier at cs.com> (alternative
>> > address: forestflier at gmail.com <mailto:forestflier at gmail.com> )
>> > Orthodox Peace Fellowship web site: http://www.incommunion.org
>> > <http://www.incommunion.org/>
>> > Jim & Nancy Forest web site: http://incommunion.org/forest-flier/
>> > <http://incommunion.org/forest-flier/>
>> > photo web site: http://www.flickr.com/photos/jimforest/sets/
>> > <http://www.flickr.com/photos/jimforest/sets/>
>> > * * *
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >   _____
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > --
>> > An archive of all list discussion is available at
>> > http://lists.ibiblio.org/pipermail/percy-l/
>> > <http://lists.ibiblio.org/pipermail/percy-l/>
>> >
>> > Visit the Walker Percy Project at  http://www.ibiblio.org/wpercy
>> > <http://www.ibiblio.org/wpercy>
>> > --
>> > An archive of all list discussion is available at
>> > http://lists.ibiblio.org/pipermail/percy-l/
>> >
>> > Visit the Walker Percy Project at http://www.ibiblio.org/wpercy
>> >
>> >   _____
>> >
>> > Start your
>> > <http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=34442/*http:/www.yahoo.com/r/hs>
>> > day with Yahoo! - make it your home page
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> ************************************************************************
>> ********
>> ****************
>> > PRIVILEGED COMMUNICATION
>> > The information contained in this e-mail, and any attachments thereto,
>>
>> > is only for the use of the recipient(s) named above.  This message,
>> > and its attachments, may contain information that falls under the
>> > attorney-client and/or work product privileges.  Receipt of this
>> > message by an unintended recipient does not constitute a waiver by the
>>
>> > sender of any and all applicable privileges.  If you are not the
>> > intended recipient of this e-mail and any attachments, or an agent
>> > responsible for delivering it to the intended recipients, you are
>> > hereby notified that any use, dissemination, distribution,
>> > downloading, or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited.
>>
>> > If you have received this e-mail in error, please notify the sender
>> > immediately by e-mail, permanently delete the e-mail and any
>> > attachments immediately, and destroy all copies.
>> >
>> ************************************************************************
>> ********
>> ****************
>> >
>> > --
>> > An archive of all list discussion is available at
>> > http://lists.ibiblio.org/pipermail/percy-l/
>> >
>> > Visit the Walker Percy Project at http://www.ibiblio.org/wpercy
>> >
>>
>>
>> --
>> An archive of all list discussion is available at
>> http://lists.ibiblio.org/pipermail/percy-l/
>>
>> Visit the Walker Percy Project at http://www.ibiblio.org/wpercy
>> --
>> An archive of all list discussion is available at
>> http://lists.ibiblio.org/pipermail/percy-l/
>>
>> Visit the Walker Percy Project at http://www.ibiblio.org/wpercy
>>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 19:16:28 -0700
> From: Patrick Lynch <padraig at well.com>
> Subject: Re: [percy-l] "What's so great about this Percy guy, anyway?"
> To: "Percy-L: Literary and Philosophical Discussion"
> <percy-l at lists.ibiblio.org>
> Message-ID: <3787FEE1-C929-46D1-872D-D9F341742155 at well.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed
>
> Gentle Folks:
> While this all seems to be a part of what Percy said, along with the
> idea that we cannot originally experience the Grand Canyon if we have
> been over-exposed to pictures of the tourist site, the concept of
> rotation indicates more than a momentary stay against one's insidious
> life. The man on the train is confronted with a re-visioning of who
> he is. The "man asleep at the traffic light" remains asleep
> afterwards. The man on the train awakens to a different, more
> perceived self.
>
> Nonetheless, Karl's comment reaffirms the news high that many feel
> watching CNN incessantly. But it is an inauthentic substitute for the
> deeper response of the man on the train. Perhaps even a poor
> substitute for feeling compassion for those affected by a disaster
> like Katrina.
>
> Is this making sense?
> P.
> On Aug 31, 2005, at 6:50 PM, dabeck at iupui.edu wrote:
>
>> Karl,
>> I think you're right. It is the anticipation more than the
>> aftermath. But
>> probably it is also in the moment, to some extent. Like on the
>> battlefield
>> (not that I've been there), the rush of the danger might make one
>> more "alive"
>> in the moment (as I heard Jackson Browne sing the other day on the
>> radio: "While the veterans, dream of the fight/While fast asleep at
>> the
>> traffic light") but that same person might have to deal with PTSD
>> later.
>>  I don't have Message in a Bottle with me, but the man on the train
>> is in the
>> middle of a crisis when he notices his hand for the first time. I
>> guess it all
>> depends on what the outcome is.
>>  While slightly different, I remember a friend of mine whose
>> daughter died
>> when she was six or seven, saying that it was the most painful
>> experience in
>> his life, but at the same time, the most beautiful. He said that it
>> awakened
>> him to what was important and to the presence of God (and he was a
>> pastor). In
>> LIR, regarding his daughter's death, More asks something like, What
>> if you ask
>> God for a miracle and it happens. What then? After that he says,
>> "Samantha,
>> forgive me. I'm sorry you suffered and died, my heart broke, but
>> there have
>> been times when I wasn't above enjoying it." One of the strangest
>> lines in
>> Percy's fiction, in my opinion.
>>  Does it tie into what we've been discussing (i.e. "hurricane
>> syndrome", etc.?)
>> -David
>>
>>
>>
>> Quoting "Karl M. Terrell" <kterrell at sheastokes.com>:
>>
>>
>>> I think it's the approach of bad news that excites us.  The
>>> aftermath or
>>> reality, however, dumps us back into ordinariness.  Hence, the
>>> fundamental need to continue searching.
>>>
>>> Percy pointed out the weird, guilty giddiness we receive from bad
>>> news;
>>> how we almost wish for it.  The media, of course, is onto this.
>>> Several
>>> weeks ago a plane crashed and all 100+ passengers walked away with no
>>> deaths and few injuries.  The sense of disappointment among the
>>> talking
>>> heads was palpable.
>>>
>>> Karl
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: dabeck at iupui.edu [mailto:dabeck at iupui.edu]
>>> Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2005 11:57 AM
>>> To: Percy-L: Literary and Philosophical Discussion
>>> Subject: Re: [percy-l] "What's so great about this Percy guy,
>>> anyway?"
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> I'm not sure what Percy would say about this recent disaster. I do
>>> know,
>>>
>>> however, that conveying this idea--that tragedy can break us from our
>>> everydayness, even make life exciting again--is difficult to
>>> convey to
>>> my
>>> college students. Some get it; some think it's crazy.
>>>  When I used to Lancelot along with Fight Club, I would point out the
>>> similarities (narrator/Tyler hoping that the plane he's on
>>> crashes, etc.
>>> That
>>> feeling pain is better than feeling nothing, etc.
>>>  I remember on and after 9/11 we had this discussion on the list. It
>>> seemed to
>>> be an example of where Percy's hurricane theory didn't work.  Off to
>>> class. -David
>>>
>>> Quoting "Karl M. Terrell" <kterrell at sheastokes.com>:
>>>
>>>
>>>> * * This communication is CONFIDENTIAL * *
>>>>
>>>> Tying the two current themes together ... I was also first attracted
>>>> to Percy by the sheer delight in reading his wonderfully smooth
>>>> prose,
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> and the way his likable characters roam outside the mainstream,
>>>>
>>> buffeting
>>>
>>>> about, but ultimately in search of some truer path.   The search
>>>> seems
>>>> to begin with awareness of the discomfort of "everydayness."
>>>>
>>>> I was particularly struck, early on, with his comparison (I forget
>>>> where, but he returns to this in several books) of a successful man
>>>> sitting in his fine home in Short Hills, N.J. on a Wednesday
>>>> afternoon, birds chirping contentedly in the trees against a clear
>>>> blue sky -- he should be feeling fine; the world is his oyster;
>>>> but he
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> finds himself profoundly ill at ease -- contrasted with the
>>>> excitement
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> one feels when a hurricane is bearing down.  Bad news takes us
>>>> out of
>>>> the ordinariness of a Wednesday afternoon, where you're stuck and
>>>> don't know what to do, and wonder how in the hell you'll make it
>>>> through the next few hours.
>>>>
>>>> But now the hurricane has passed, and has devastated a great city.
>>>> Amidst the grief, the ordinariness of a day-to-day struggle of
>>>> returning to the ordinary will take over.  I wonder how Percy would
>>>> write of that experience -- perhaps he has, and I don't recall (it's
>>>> been many years since I really spent a lot of time with WP).
>>>> Love in
>>>> the Ruins?  Maybe someone out there can point to a book or passage.
>>>>
>>>> Karl
>>>> -----Original Message----- .
>>>> From: Dye, Steve [mailto:sldye at bluegrass.org]
>>>> Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2005 10:04 AM
>>>> To: Percy-L: Literary and Philosophical Discussion
>>>> Subject: Re: [percy-l] "What's so great about this Percy guy,
>>>> anyway?"
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> My thoughts exactly...the New Orleans that many of have known and
>>>> loved for years (and that was so beautifully written about by Percy)
>>>> is gone forever...
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: percy-l-bounces at lists.ibiblio.org
>>>> [mailto:percy-l-bounces at lists.ibiblio.org] On Behalf Of Stuart
>>>> Chapman
>>>> Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2005 9:42 AM
>>>> To: Percy-L: Literary and Philosophical Discussion
>>>> Subject: Re: [percy-l] "What's so great about this Percy guy,
>>>> anyway?"
>>>>
>>>> Been thinking about you, Percy, and everybody else New Orleans-
>>>> related
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> over these last few days, and I hope that you are ok.
>>>>
>>>> It's just awful.
>>>>
>>>> Stuart
>>>>
>>>> Dave Duty <daveduty at austin.rr.com> wrote:
>>>> Is no one else on the list concerned about Nikki and the other New
>>>> Orleans area residents?
>>>>
>>>> Nikki -- if your out there -- let us know if you and your loved ones
>>>> are ok -- God Bless -- Dave
>>>>
>>>> JHForest at cs.com <mailto:JHForest at cs.com>  wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>> What would you say to a young person who asks, "What so great
>>>>>> about
>>>>>>
>>>> this
>>>> Percy guy, anyway?" <<
>>>>
>>>> What keeps Walker Percy in print fifteen years after his death is
>>>> the
>>>> sheer delight of reading his books.
>>>>
>>>> A key word with Percy was "search." It seems to me all of his
>>>> fiction
>>>> and non-fiction have to do with that topic. As he said:
>>>>
>>>> "If I had the choice of knowing the truth or searching for the
>>>> truth,
>>>> I'd take the search."
>>>>
>>>> It's a subject of the search has been much on my mind lately if
>>>> for no
>>>> other reason than I'm at work on a book about pilgrimage (understood
>>>> not only as making journeys to distant shrines but an attitude about
>>>> being that has little to do with travel). One way of defining a
>>>>
>>> pilgrim
>>>
>>>> is a person on a search.
>>>>
>>>> Jim Forest
>>>>
>>>> * * *
>>>> Jim & Nancy Forest
>>>> Kanisstraat 5 / 1811 GJ Alkmaar / The Netherlands
>>>> Jim's e-mail: jhforest at cs.com <mailto:jhforest at cs.com>  (alternative
>>>> address: jhforest at gmail.com <mailto:jhforest at gmail.com> ) Nancy's
>>>> e-mail: forestflier at cs.com <mailto:forestflier at cs.com> (alternative
>>>> address: forestflier at gmail.com <mailto:forestflier at gmail.com> )
>>>> Orthodox Peace Fellowship web site: http://www.incommunion.org
>>>> <http://www.incommunion.org/>
>>>> Jim & Nancy Forest web site: http://incommunion.org/forest-flier/
>>>> <http://incommunion.org/forest-flier/>
>>>> photo web site: http://www.flickr.com/photos/jimforest/sets/
>>>> <http://www.flickr.com/photos/jimforest/sets/>
>>>> * * *
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>   _____
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> An archive of all list discussion is available at
>>>> http://lists.ibiblio.org/pipermail/percy-l/
>>>> <http://lists.ibiblio.org/pipermail/percy-l/>
>>>>
>>>> Visit the Walker Percy Project at  http://www.ibiblio.org/wpercy
>>>> <http://www.ibiblio.org/wpercy>
>>>> --
>>>> An archive of all list discussion is available at
>>>> http://lists.ibiblio.org/pipermail/percy-l/
>>>>
>>>> Visit the Walker Percy Project at http://www.ibiblio.org/wpercy
>>>>
>>>>   _____
>>>>
>>>> Start your
>>>> <http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=34442/*http:/www.yahoo.com/r/hs>
>>>> day with Yahoo! - make it your home page
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>> *********************************************************************
>>> ***
>>> ********
>>> ****************
>>>
>>>> PRIVILEGED COMMUNICATION
>>>> The information contained in this e-mail, and any attachments
>>>> thereto,
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> is only for the use of the recipient(s) named above.  This message,
>>>> and its attachments, may contain information that falls under the
>>>> attorney-client and/or work product privileges.  Receipt of this
>>>> message by an unintended recipient does not constitute a waiver
>>>> by the
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> sender of any and all applicable privileges.  If you are not the
>>>> intended recipient of this e-mail and any attachments, or an agent
>>>> responsible for delivering it to the intended recipients, you are
>>>> hereby notified that any use, dissemination, distribution,
>>>> downloading, or copying of this communication is strictly
>>>> prohibited.
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> If you have received this e-mail in error, please notify the sender
>>>> immediately by e-mail, permanently delete the e-mail and any
>>>> attachments immediately, and destroy all copies.
>>>>
>>>>
>>> *********************************************************************
>>> ***
>>> ********
>>> ****************
>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> An archive of all list discussion is available at
>>>> http://lists.ibiblio.org/pipermail/percy-l/
>>>>
>>>> Visit the Walker Percy Project at http://www.ibiblio.org/wpercy
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> An archive of all list discussion is available at
>>> http://lists.ibiblio.org/pipermail/percy-l/
>>>
>>> Visit the Walker Percy Project at http://www.ibiblio.org/wpercy
>>> --
>>> An archive of all list discussion is available at
>>> http://lists.ibiblio.org/pipermail/percy-l/
>>>
>>> Visit the Walker Percy Project at http://www.ibiblio.org/wpercy
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> An archive of all list discussion is available at http://
>> lists.ibiblio.org/pipermail/percy-l/
>>
>> Visit the Walker Percy Project at http://www.ibiblio.org/wpercy
>>
>>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 21:51:05 -0500
> From: dabeck at iupui.edu
> Subject: Re: [percy-l] "What's so great about this Percy guy, anyway?"
> To: "Percy-L: Literary and Philosophical Discussion"
> <percy-l at lists.ibiblio.org>, Patrick Lynch <padraig at well.com>
> Cc: "Percy-L: Literary and Philosophical Discussion"
> <percy-l at lists.ibiblio.org>
> Message-ID: <1125543065.43166c99052c7 at webmail.iu.edu>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
>> Is this making sense?
>> P.
>
> Probably more so than I am (I'm in an allergy medication fog). My point 
> about
> the Browne lyrics was not that he was "fast asleep" but that he was 
> dreaming
> of the "fight." Of course, the man on the train does awaken to a different
> self. My point is, we know that the rotation occurs in anticipation of the
> crisis, but I think it also occurs during the crisis. Afterwards, it is
> anybody's guess.
> Maybe I'm splitting philosophical hairs and need to focus on what's really
> going on. You wrote:
>
>> Nonetheless, Karl's comment reaffirms the news high that many feel
>> watching CNN incessantly. But it is an inauthentic substitute for the
>> deeper response of the man on the train. Perhaps even a poor
>> substitute for feeling compassion for those affected by a disaster
>> like Katrina.
>
> That's the bigger point. Perhaps it is a "high" for some, but it's hard to
> imagine very many people watching this disaster--knowing that it is 
> happening
> to very poor areas that didn't have much to begin with--with the 
> "interest"
> that Lance talks about regarding the plane crash. From what I hear, people 
> are
> contributing in large amounts to help these people. And, while I fear 
> bringing
> up the liberal/conservative topic, it is disasters like these that make 
> people-
> -regardless of political persuasion--forget about "sides" and come 
> together
> and help. Maybe in that way, we can all awaken to a more "perceived self."
> -David
>
>
>
> Quoting Patrick Lynch <padraig at well.com>:
>
>> Gentle Folks:
>> While this all seems to be a part of what Percy said, along with the
>> idea that we cannot originally experience the Grand Canyon if we have
>> been over-exposed to pictures of the tourist site, the concept of
>> rotation indicates more than a momentary stay against one's insidious
>> life. The man on the train is confronted with a re-visioning of who
>> he is. The "man asleep at the traffic light" remains asleep
>> afterwards. The man on the train awakens to a different, more
>> perceived self.
>>
>> Nonetheless, Karl's comment reaffirms the news high that many feel
>> watching CNN incessantly. But it is an inauthentic substitute for the
>> deeper response of the man on the train. Perhaps even a poor
>> substitute for feeling compassion for those affected by a disaster
>> like Katrina.
>>
>> Is this making sense?
>> P.
>> On Aug 31, 2005, at 6:50 PM, dabeck at iupui.edu wrote:
>>
>> > Karl,
>> > I think you're right. It is the anticipation more than the
>> > aftermath. But
>> > probably it is also in the moment, to some extent. Like on the
>> > battlefield
>> > (not that I've been there), the rush of the danger might make one
>> > more "alive"
>> > in the moment (as I heard Jackson Browne sing the other day on the
>> > radio: "While the veterans, dream of the fight/While fast asleep at
>> > the
>> > traffic light") but that same person might have to deal with PTSD
>> > later.
>> >  I don't have Message in a Bottle with me, but the man on the train
>> > is in the
>> > middle of a crisis when he notices his hand for the first time. I
>> > guess it all
>> > depends on what the outcome is.
>> >  While slightly different, I remember a friend of mine whose
>> > daughter died
>> > when she was six or seven, saying that it was the most painful
>> > experience in
>> > his life, but at the same time, the most beautiful. He said that it
>> > awakened
>> > him to what was important and to the presence of God (and he was a
>> > pastor). In
>> > LIR, regarding his daughter's death, More asks something like, What
>> > if you ask
>> > God for a miracle and it happens. What then? After that he says,
>> > "Samantha,
>> > forgive me. I'm sorry you suffered and died, my heart broke, but
>> > there have
>> > been times when I wasn't above enjoying it." One of the strangest
>> > lines in
>> > Percy's fiction, in my opinion.
>> >  Does it tie into what we've been discussing (i.e. "hurricane
>> > syndrome", etc.?)
>> > -David
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Quoting "Karl M. Terrell" <kterrell at sheastokes.com>:
>> >
>> >
>> >> I think it's the approach of bad news that excites us.  The
>> >> aftermath or
>> >> reality, however, dumps us back into ordinariness.  Hence, the
>> >> fundamental need to continue searching.
>> >>
>> >> Percy pointed out the weird, guilty giddiness we receive from bad
>> >> news;
>> >> how we almost wish for it.  The media, of course, is onto this.
>> >> Several
>> >> weeks ago a plane crashed and all 100+ passengers walked away with no
>> >> deaths and few injuries.  The sense of disappointment among the
>> >> talking
>> >> heads was palpable.
>> >>
>> >> Karl
>> >>
>> >> -----Original Message-----
>> >> From: dabeck at iupui.edu [mailto:dabeck at iupui.edu]
>> >> Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2005 11:57 AM
>> >> To: Percy-L: Literary and Philosophical Discussion
>> >> Subject: Re: [percy-l] "What's so great about this Percy guy,
>> >> anyway?"
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> I'm not sure what Percy would say about this recent disaster. I do
>> >> know,
>> >>
>> >> however, that conveying this idea--that tragedy can break us from our
>> >> everydayness, even make life exciting again--is difficult to
>> >> convey to
>> >> my
>> >> college students. Some get it; some think it's crazy.
>> >>  When I used to Lancelot along with Fight Club, I would point out the
>> >> similarities (narrator/Tyler hoping that the plane he's on
>> >> crashes, etc.
>> >> That
>> >> feeling pain is better than feeling nothing, etc.
>> >>  I remember on and after 9/11 we had this discussion on the list. It
>> >> seemed to
>> >> be an example of where Percy's hurricane theory didn't work.  Off to
>> >> class. -David
>> >>
>> >> Quoting "Karl M. Terrell" <kterrell at sheastokes.com>:
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>> * * This communication is CONFIDENTIAL * *
>> >>>
>> >>> Tying the two current themes together ... I was also first attracted
>> >>> to Percy by the sheer delight in reading his wonderfully smooth
>> >>> prose,
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>> and the way his likable characters roam outside the mainstream,
>> >>>
>> >> buffeting
>> >>
>> >>> about, but ultimately in search of some truer path.   The search
>> >>> seems
>> >>> to begin with awareness of the discomfort of "everydayness."
>> >>>
>> >>> I was particularly struck, early on, with his comparison (I forget
>> >>> where, but he returns to this in several books) of a successful man
>> >>> sitting in his fine home in Short Hills, N.J. on a Wednesday
>> >>> afternoon, birds chirping contentedly in the trees against a clear
>> >>> blue sky -- he should be feeling fine; the world is his oyster;
>> >>> but he
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>> finds himself profoundly ill at ease -- contrasted with the
>> >>> excitement
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>> one feels when a hurricane is bearing down.  Bad news takes us
>> >>> out of
>> >>> the ordinariness of a Wednesday afternoon, where you're stuck and
>> >>> don't know what to do, and wonder how in the hell you'll make it
>> >>> through the next few hours.
>> >>>
>> >>> But now the hurricane has passed, and has devastated a great city.
>> >>> Amidst the grief, the ordinariness of a day-to-day struggle of
>> >>> returning to the ordinary will take over.  I wonder how Percy would
>> >>> write of that experience -- perhaps he has, and I don't recall (it's
>> >>> been many years since I really spent a lot of time with WP).
>> >>> Love in
>> >>> the Ruins?  Maybe someone out there can point to a book or passage.
>> >>>
>> >>> Karl
>> >>> -----Original Message----- .
>> >>> From: Dye, Steve [mailto:sldye at bluegrass.org]
>> >>> Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2005 10:04 AM
>> >>> To: Percy-L: Literary and Philosophical Discussion
>> >>> Subject: Re: [percy-l] "What's so great about this Percy guy,
>> >>> anyway?"
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> My thoughts exactly...the New Orleans that many of have known and
>> >>> loved for years (and that was so beautifully written about by Percy)
>> >>> is gone forever...
>> >>>
>> >>> -----Original Message-----
>> >>> From: percy-l-bounces at lists.ibiblio.org
>> >>> [mailto:percy-l-bounces at lists.ibiblio.org] On Behalf Of Stuart
>> >>> Chapman
>> >>> Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2005 9:42 AM
>> >>> To: Percy-L: Literary and Philosophical Discussion
>> >>> Subject: Re: [percy-l] "What's so great about this Percy guy,
>> >>> anyway?"
>> >>>
>> >>> Been thinking about you, Percy, and everybody else New Orleans-
>> >>> related
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>> over these last few days, and I hope that you are ok.
>> >>>
>> >>> It's just awful.
>> >>>
>> >>> Stuart
>> >>>
>> >>> Dave Duty <daveduty at austin.rr.com> wrote:
>> >>> Is no one else on the list concerned about Nikki and the other New
>> >>> Orleans area residents?
>> >>>
>> >>> Nikki -- if your out there -- let us know if you and your loved ones
>> >>> are ok -- God Bless -- Dave
>> >>>
>> >>> JHForest at cs.com <mailto:JHForest at cs.com>  wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>>> What would you say to a young person who asks, "What so great
>> >>>>> about
>> >>>>>
>> >>> this
>> >>> Percy guy, anyway?" <<
>> >>>
>> >>> What keeps Walker Percy in print fifteen years after his death is
>> >>> the
>> >>> sheer delight of reading his books.
>> >>>
>> >>> A key word with Percy was "search." It seems to me all of his
>> >>> fiction
>> >>> and non-fiction have to do with that topic. As he said:
>> >>>
>> >>> "If I had the choice of knowing the truth or searching for the
>> >>> truth,
>> >>> I'd take the search."
>> >>>
>> >>> It's a subject of the search has been much on my mind lately if
>> >>> for no
>> >>> other reason than I'm at work on a book about pilgrimage (understood
>> >>> not only as making journeys to distant shrines but an attitude about
>> >>> being that has little to do with travel). One way of defining a
>> >>>
>> >> pilgrim
>> >>
>> >>> is a person on a search.
>> >>>
>> >>> Jim Forest
>> >>>
>> >>> * * *
>> >>> Jim & Nancy Forest
>> >>> Kanisstraat 5 / 1811 GJ Alkmaar / The Netherlands
>> >>> Jim's e-mail: jhforest at cs.com <mailto:jhforest at cs.com>  (alternative
>> >>> address: jhforest at gmail.com <mailto:jhforest at gmail.com> ) Nancy's
>> >>> e-mail: forestflier at cs.com <mailto:forestflier at cs.com> (alternative
>> >>> address: forestflier at gmail.com <mailto:forestflier at gmail.com> )
>> >>> Orthodox Peace Fellowship web site: http://www.incommunion.org
>> >>> <http://www.incommunion.org/>
>> >>> Jim & Nancy Forest web site: http://incommunion.org/forest-flier/
>> >>> <http://incommunion.org/forest-flier/>
>> >>> photo web site: http://www.flickr.com/photos/jimforest/sets/
>> >>> <http://www.flickr.com/photos/jimforest/sets/>
>> >>> * * *
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>   _____
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> --
>> >>> An archive of all list discussion is available at
>> >>> http://lists.ibiblio.org/pipermail/percy-l/
>> >>> <http://lists.ibiblio.org/pipermail/percy-l/>
>> >>>
>> >>> Visit the Walker Percy Project at  http://www.ibiblio.org/wpercy
>> >>> <http://www.ibiblio.org/wpercy>
>> >>> --
>> >>> An archive of all list discussion is available at
>> >>> http://lists.ibiblio.org/pipermail/percy-l/
>> >>>
>> >>> Visit the Walker Percy Project at http://www.ibiblio.org/wpercy
>> >>>
>> >>>   _____
>> >>>
>> >>> Start your
>> >>> <http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=34442/*http:/www.yahoo.com/r/hs>
>> >>> day with Yahoo! - make it your home page
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >> *********************************************************************
>> >> ***
>> >> ********
>> >> ****************
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>> >>>
>> >>
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>> >>
>> >>>
>> >>> --
>> >>> An archive of all list discussion is available at
>> >>> http://lists.ibiblio.org/pipermail/percy-l/
>> >>>
>> >>> Visit the Walker Percy Project at http://www.ibiblio.org/wpercy
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> --
>> >> An archive of all list discussion is available at
>> >> http://lists.ibiblio.org/pipermail/percy-l/
>> >>
>> >> Visit the Walker Percy Project at http://www.ibiblio.org/wpercy
>> >> --
>> >> An archive of all list discussion is available at
>> >> http://lists.ibiblio.org/pipermail/percy-l/
>> >>
>> >> Visit the Walker Percy Project at http://www.ibiblio.org/wpercy
>> >>
>> >>
>> >
>> >
>> > --
>> > An archive of all list discussion is available at http://
>> > lists.ibiblio.org/pipermail/percy-l/
>> >
>> > Visit the Walker Percy Project at http://www.ibiblio.org/wpercy
>> >
>> >
>>
>> --
>> An archive of all list discussion is available at
>> http://lists.ibiblio.org/pipermail/percy-l/
>>
>> Visit the Walker Percy Project at http://www.ibiblio.org/wpercy
>>
>
>
>
>
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