[B-Greek] HGERQH in John 11:29

bertdehaan at gosympatico.ca bertdehaan at gosympatico.ca
Wed Apr 2 21:56:08 EST 2003


 
> 
> At 6:54 PM -0500 4/2/03, <bertdehaan at gosympatico.ca> wrote:
> >Hi, Everyone
> > Can someone  tell me why HGERGH in John 11:29 in passive?
> >Middle or active I would have been able to understand (She got herself up,
> >or, she got up). Here is the text: EKEINH DE hWS HKOUSEN HGERQH TACU KAI
> >HRCETO PROS AUTON.

> "Carl W. Conrad" <cwconrad at artsci.wustl.edu> replied:

> It's NOT passive; as I have been arguing for some time now, the -QH- forms
> may bear either middle or passive sense, just as can the
> MAI/SAI/TAI;MHN/SO/TO forms. The active EGEIRW means "wake (somebody) up"
> or "roust up"; the middle EGEIROMAI means "wake up" (intransitive sense) or
> "rise up," HGERQH most commonly is simply the aorist for EGEIROMAI. There
> are occasions, particularly those wherein an agent construction with hUPO +
> genitive is used with HGERQH, where one will want to translate it as a
> passive, "was raised"--but without that there's not any essential
> difference in meaning between ANESTH and HGERQH. In the above text in Jn
> 11:29 ANESTH could be substituted for HGERQH with no change in meaning
> whatsoever.
 
 I do remember the discussion now. I even read your paper on this topic (I'll read it again). The one thing that stuck with me was that "deponent" verbs usually are not m/p forms with active meanings, but are simply verbs with middle meanings.  I thought HGERQH was from EGEIRW so this form has to be passive.  I forgot about the middle EGEIROMAI, even though it was this exact verb that was used as example in a previous discussion. I don't think I will forget again. Thanks for your patience.
Bert de Haan 



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