[B-Greek] Titus 1:12

cwconrad at ioa.com cwconrad at ioa.com
Wed Jan 28 07:00:56 EST 2004


At 2:21 AM -0800 1/28/04, Byron & Linetta Knutson wrote:
>Your commentary doesn't address my question, which is why the idios is
>singular.  You translate it as though it were plural. [1:12 One of
>themselves, a prophet of their own, said, ] It modifies TIS or PROFHTHS,
>i.e., a CERTAIN PROPHET HIS OWN SELF (I guess), rather than AUTWN (Cretans).
>The fact that it is singular is what is stumbling me, if it were plural, it
>wouldn't. Doesn't it normally refer back to the subject of the verb, in this
>case EIPEN/ he (a certain prophet)?  It looks to me something like this:  "A
>certain man out from among them (the Cretans) himself (or his own self) a
>prophet of them said...."
>
>Respectfully,
>Byron Knutson
>
>
>----- Original Message ----- 
>From: "Ron Snider" <ronpt at comcast.net>
>To: "Byron & Linetta Knutson" <byronk at open.org>
>Sent: Tuesday, January 27, 2004 11:05 AM
>Subject: Re: [B-Greek] Titus 1:12
>
>
>> I am attaching my teaching notes from Titus, which I completed about a
>> year ago.  Verse 12 is addressed so you can simply scroll down and view
>> the exposition of that verse.  I hope this addresses your question.

The text was EIPEN TIS EX AUTWN IDIOS AUTWN PROFHTHS: 'KRHTES AEI YEUSTAI, KAKA QHRIA, GASTERES ARGAI.'

Of course I don't know what Ron sent you off-list, but I think Harold Holmyard's reply was pretty much on target. But I'd make TIS EX AUTWN IDIOS AUTWN PROFHTHS as "one of their own mouthpieces," i.e. a native Cretan who functioned as a spokesperson regarding his countrymen, "They're all liars, etc., etc." I'd understand the syntax thus: "one of them" (TIS EX AUTWN) is the subject of EIPEN; "their own prophet/spokesman/mouthpiece" (IDIOS AUTWN PROFHTHS) is in apposition to TIS EX AUTWN. I wouldn't use the term "prophet" here, primarily because it's misleading, referring as it does to a pagan poet, presumably the 6th c. BC Epimenides of Crete (the verse cited is a dactylic hexameter) who proclaims what he perceives to be the truth about his own countrymen.

Carl W. Conrad
Department of Classics, Washington University (Emeritus)
1989 Grindstaff Road/Burnsville, NC 28714/(828) 675-4243
cwconrad at artsci.wustl.edu
WWW: http://www.ioa.com/~cwconrad/



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