[B-Greek] hUPOMONH in the Apocalypse
Harold R. Holmyard III
hholmyard at ont.com
Sun May 30 21:44:15 EDT 2004
Dear George,
I said that a more literal translation than the NIV might allow more
nuances. I admitted that I am comfortable with the NIV and perhaps
could be wrong for liking its handling of the verses you brought up.
So I am acknowledging that it is not a strictly literal translation.
When you reply that it is not the least bit literal in these verses,
you seem to be denying any literal aspect to the translation. Perhaps
it is not literal by some definitions, but a translation ought to
capture the force of idioms. "Here is the endurance of the saints,"
NIV felt, and I believe correctly, fails to convey the force of the
Greek, which is evidently an idiom. The idea that hUPOMONH means
"conviction" or something like that would need supporting evidence,
and my older BAGD does not provide any for such a meaning for the
noun. No, I think the NIV was trying to capture the implications of
the Greek phrase with hWDE. There are idioms in English that are
simple in terms of words, but which convey a different meaning that
the words might seem to carry to someone unfamiliar with them.
"Here's looking at you" is a toast, but one needs to be familiar with
the way the words are used. "That's the ballgame" can imply that
whatever event is being drawn attention to signals the end of the
effort that is underway. "That's the way it goes" can mean that this
is just the way life works, so one has to get used to it. There are a
lot of plain looking idioms, and I think that hWHE with ESTIN and hH
hUPOMONH was probably a simple idiom in Greek.
Yours,
Harold Holmyard
>Harold,
>
>I'm sorry to have to deflate your ballon, but the NIV is not the least
>bit literal here. The more "literal" translations make no sense, and the
>ones that make sense aren't literal.
>
>gfsomsel
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