[B-Greek] I Tim 2:12

Carl Conrad cwconrad2 at mac.com
Sun Jun 19 06:42:58 EDT 2005


On Jun 18, 2005, at 11:48 PM, gene baker wrote:

>   I have a question for the list re:  I Tim 2:12.  I ran across an  
> author the other day who said that this verse could be translated:   
> "I do not permit a woman to teach that she has absolute domination  
> over a man."  Now, I admit I'm not the sharpest knife in the  
> drawer, but that seems like a bit of a stretch to me.  Can OUDE be  
> understood in that way?
>
>   DIDASKEIN DE GUNAIKI OUK EPITREPW, OUDE AUQENTEIN ANDROS, ALL'  
> EINAI EN hHSUCIA.
>
> Can OUDE be taken as indicating the content of the DIDASKALIA?
>
>   Thanks for any insights.

Seems to me that this suggestion has been discussed previously; it  
looks very much like an attempt to wiggle out of what is thought
to be an unacceptable obvious sense of the Greek text; I would  
expect, if that were the sense, that it would be formulated more like:
OUDE TO AUQENTEIN ANDROS ALLA TO EINAI EN hHSUCIAi.

Also seems time to reiterate something:
At 7:39 AM -0500 1/11/03, Carl W. Conrad wrote:

> In view of the fact that every discussion of 1 Tim 2:12 on this  
> list has
> engendered not only thoughtful analysis of the grammatical  
> construction but
> also spirited and diverse expressions of opinion, conviction, and
> antagonism, it seemed to me worth calling attention to earlier  
> discussions
> of the text on record in our archives, to wit:
>
> 1/13/96    Re: GUNH EN HSUCIA -- 1Ti 2.11
> 5/15-18/98    AUQENTEIN, 1Tim2.12
> 5/18/98        Feminine perspective and BG List History (was Re:  
> AUQENTEIN
> 5/18-19/98    Re: AUQENTEIN
> 6/30/98        1 Tim 2:12
> 10/16-18/99    Re: 1 Timothy 2:12
> 10/18/99    Re: 1 Timothy 2:12 authentein
> 10/19/99    1 Tim 2:14, GEGONEN
> 10/19-31/99    Re: 1 Timothy 2:12
> 8/13/00        Hermeneutics, 1 Tim. 2:12,and AUQENTEIN
> 8/11-13/00    1 Tim. 2:12, meaning of AUQENTEIN
> 2/18-19/01    RE: OUDE in 1 Timothy 2:12
> 5/9/01    1 Tim 2:12--grammatical structure
> 7/31-8/6/01    KEFALH, hUPOTASSESQAI, H, AUQENTEIN, OUK ...
> 5/8-9/02    RE: 1 Tim 2:11-12
> 5/15/02    Lexical Semantics Methods
> 5/18/02    Titus 2:12 Explicative OUDE
> 5/20-24/02    infinitive -> finite verb

That's just a selection! One thing is sure: no matter what others  
have said and written about this text hitherto, it will continue to  
be pondered and puzzled over for many a moon hereafter.

Carl W. Conrad
Department of Classics, Washington University (Emeritus)
1989 Grindstaff Road/Burnsville, NC 28714/(828) 675-4243
cwconrad at ioa.com or cwconrad2 at mac.com
WWW: http://www.ioa.com/~cwconrad/




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