[B-Greek] Ephesians 4:18

Carl Conrad cwconrad2 at mac.com
Tue Jun 21 06:41:37 EDT 2005


On Jun 20, 2005, at 5:46 PM, David Bielby wrote:

> Dear Dr. Conrad,
>
> After talking to one of my friends on this who is a Hebrew buff,
> he suggested this may be a parallelism shining through which if true
> would essentially concur with you.
>
> His suggestion is that this is a poetic parallelism...
>
> Ephesians 4:17 b   & 4:18 a
>
> MATAIOTHTI TOU NOOS AUTWN,
> ESKOTWMENOI TH DIANOIA ONTES

That might well be, although I will confess that I think the  
formulation of Ephesians is at
several points (most especially at the very beginning) unfathomable.  
Since that's been
discussed repeatedly, I see no point in reopening that discussion.


> -----Original Message-----
> From: Carl Conrad [mailto:cwconrad2 at mac.com]
> Sent: Monday, June 20, 2005 1:34 PM
> To: David Bielby
> Cc: Big Greeks
> Subject: Re: [B-Greek] Ephesians 4:18
>
>
> On Jun 20, 2005, at 1:54 PM, David Bielby wrote:
>
>
>> Dear Big Greeks,
>>
>>
>>
>> I have some basic questions on one of the verses I'm exegeting this
>> week and
>> would appreciate input on them.  Thank you!!!
>>
>>
>>
>> GNT Ephesians 4:18a
>>
>> ESKOTWMENOI TH DIANOIA ONTES, APHLLOTRIWMENOI THS ZWHS TOU QEOU DIA
>> THN
>> AGNOIAN THN OUSAN EN AUTOIS
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> I have a few questions on this verse.  DIANOIA is said to be a
>> Dative of
>> Respect in Zerwick's Biblical Illustrations (pg 19 illustration
>> 53). Can
>> anyone explain to me how does the 'dative of respect' function?  Is
>> it a
>> just a normal accusative in function?  What options does that  
>> imply in
>> translating this?
>>
>
> Actually there's not much difference between THN DIANOIAN and THi
> DIANOIAi; both expressions answer the question "in what respect" or
> "how?" to qualify ESKTWMENOI: "in the dark in what way?" or "do you
> mean physically or literally in the dark?"
>
>
>> Second question:  ESKOTWMENOI in this verse is usually translated  
>> 'Are
>> Darkened'.at least in several major translations like the ESV (to
>> pick one).
>> Before I saw that I would have translated it
>>
>> 'they have been darkened' because it's passive in form....can someone
>> explain to me why it's not translated that way?
>>
>
> Note that the construction is with the participle ONTES, so that this
> is a periphrastic perfect participle; note also that ESKOTWMENOI
> really refers more to a condition or state that the Gentiles are in:
> 4.17 says "they walk in futility of their insight"; then 4:18 expands
> that: "since they are in the dark (ONTES ESKOTWMENOI) so far as their
> reasoning is concerned (THi DIANOIAi). It is NOT really passive: it's
> a middle participle indicating a state--just as "drunk" is if we
> should say in English, "Those fellows are drunk": technically
> speaking "drunk" is a passive participle but in this usage it's
> adjectival and indicates a state of drunkenness.
>
> Carl W. Conrad
> Department of Classics, Washington University (Emeritus)
> 1989 Grindstaff Road/Burnsville, NC 28714/(828) 675-4243
> cwconrad at ioa.com or cwconrad2 at mac.com
> WWW: http://www.ioa.com/~cwconrad/
>
>




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