[B-Greek] John 3:29 hO hESTHKWS KAI AKOUWN
George F Somsel
gfsomsel at yahoo.com
Tue Dec 19 12:47:43 EST 2006
Well, perhaps I'm retrojecting an English (American?) expression regarding "standing up" at a wedding into the situation of the time. It did seem to me, however, that the combination of AKOUWN with FWNHN was more than accidental.
george
gfsomsel
_________
----- Original Message ----
From: Carl W. Conrad <cwconrad at artsci.wustl.edu>
To: George F Somsel <gfsomsel at yahoo.com>
Cc: Richard Lindeman <oblchurch at msn.com>; b-greek at lists.ibiblio.org
Sent: Tuesday, December 19, 2006 12:42:52 PM
Subject: Re: [B-Greek] John 3:29 hO hESTHKWS KAI AKOUWN
On Dec 19, 2006, at 11:39 AM, George F Somsel wrote:
> I would take this as being an attributive participle hO hESTHKWS
> and a circumstantial participle (AKOUWN AUTOU . . . THN FWNHN)
> XARAi XAIREI. And, yes, the verb hITHMI is regularly found in the
> perfect with a present sense. The verb meant to put or set, but
> when used in the perfect it was to have set one's self or to stand.
Just to be a little bit more precise about the forms of this verb:
the present-tense forms are hISTHMI ("make stand"), which is the
active causative form of what should perhaps more reasonably be
considered the real lemma, hISTAMAI, which means "rise to a standing
position" or "come to a halt." The perfect-tense form hESTHKA (older
hESTAA) is intransitive as is the aorist form ESTHN (as opposed to
the active ESTHSA corresponding to the active causative present
hISTHMI). These intransitive perfect and aorist are forms
corresponding to the present middle hISTAMAI; they are survivals from
the period before the development of a perfect middle-passive form in
-MAI/SAI/TAI/KTL.
For my part, I'd understand the article as governing both hESTHKWS
and AKOUWN and deem the construction as the equivalent of a relative
clause: "the one who stands and listens ... "
>
> ----- Original Message ----
> From: Richard Lindeman <oblchurch at msn.com>
> To: b-greek at lists.ibiblio.org
> Sent: Tuesday, December 19, 2006 11:01:15 AM
> Subject: [B-Greek] John 3:29 hO hESTHKWS KAI AKOUWN
>
>
> John 3:29 hO ECWN THN NUMFHN NUMFIOS ESTIN hO DE FILOS TOU NUMFIOU hO
> hESTHKWS KAI AKOUWN AUTOU CARAi CAIREI DIA THN FWNHN TOU NUMFIOU
>
> "The one having the bride is the bridegroom, but the friend of the
> bridegroom, the one standing and listening for him, rejoices
> greatly because
> of the voice of the bridegroom."
>
> My particular interest is in the expression hO hESTHKWS KAI AKOUWN.
>
> Is this one substantive being encompassed by hO ? Or is this a
> substantive
> participle + a circumstantial participle? Is the perfect participle
> hESTHKWS essentially functioning as the equivalent of a present
> participle
> here? Or is there a distinction to be made between the present and
> perfect
> participles here?
>
> Thanks!
>
> Rich Lindeman
>
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Carl W. Conrad
Department of Classics, Washington University (Retired)
1989 Grindstaff Road/Burnsville, NC 28714/(828) 675-4243
cwconrad2 at mac.com
WWW: http://www.ioa.com/~cwconrad/
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