[B-Greek] John 2:1 Who was invited?

Mark Cain mark at markcain.com
Sun May 6 18:48:55 EDT 2007


Perhaps you are unaware that there is a discipline of "reading between the 
lines" as you call it.  Please accept my apologies as I reject your advice. 
But if your discipline is Greek, can you please answer for me:  "can EKLHQH 
DE KAI only be translated as additive?"

Mark Cain
Sarasota, FL USA

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Carl W. Conrad" <cwconrad at artsci.wustl.edu>
To: "Mark Cain" <mark at markcain.com>
Cc: "greek B-Greek" <b-greek at lists.ibiblio.org>
Sent: Sunday, May 06, 2007 6:19 PM
Subject: Re: [B-Greek] John 2:1 Who was invited?


>
> On May 6, 2007, at 6:09 PM, Mark Cain wrote:
>
>> Pardon me for not making my train of thought clearer.
>>
>> Since it appears to me that Mary, the mother of Jesus, assumes
>> responsibilities beyond the role of a typical guest such as 1)
>> concern for
>> the depleted wine supply and 2) access to give directions to the
>> servants at
>> the feast, could it be that she is there in a supportive role; but
>> Jesus is
>> there as a guest?  Could the words EKLHQH DE indicate this contrast
>> of roles
>> (supportive vs guest)? or are you saying that EKLHQH DE KAI can
>> only be
>> translated as additive?
>
> I think the implication of EKLHQH DE KAI is that Mary had been
> invited and that Jesus and his disciples had been invited also. Now
> that doesn't preclude that Mary is present in a larger capacity. She
> may be kin to the groom; we aren't told that. My own view would be
> that this narrative introduction tells us all that we need to know to
> make sense of the narrative that follows, i.e., that there's no need
> to try reading between the lines.
>
> Carl W. Conrad
> Department of Classics, Washington University (Retired)
>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Carl W. Conrad" <cwconrad at artsci.wustl.edu>
>> To: "Mark Cain" <mark at markcain.com>
>> Cc: "greek B-Greek" <b-greek at lists.ibiblio.org>
>> Sent: Sunday, May 06, 2007 3:46 PM
>> Subject: Re: [B-Greek] John 2:1 Who was invited?
>>
>>
>>>
>>> On May 6, 2007, at 3:36 PM, Mark Cain wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>> In John 2:1 ff we find the account of the Marriage Feast in Cana of
>>>> Galilee.
>>>> Verse 1 states that the mother of Jesus was there -- but verse 2
>>>> says that
>>>> Jesus was invited. The verb to "invite" or "call" is 3rd Person
>>>> Singular
>>>> Aorist Passive Indicative.  Would the structure of EKLHQH DE show a
>>>> hint of
>>>> emphasis with a contrast of the prior statement i.e. "was there"
>>>> vs. "But
>>>> invited"?
>>>>
>>>> My reading of the context shows that Mary may be more familiar with
>>>> the
>>>> feast than the "typical" guest;
>>>> 1) it is stated that she "was there" as opposed to being invited
>>>> 2) she is concerned with the depleted wine supply
>>>> 3) she is comfortable in directing the servants
>>>
>>> Text: 2 EKLHQH DE KAI hO IHSOUS KAI hOI MAQHTAI
>>> AUTOU EIS TON GAMON
>>>
>>> I don't see the point of your question. Verse two is not a matter of
>>> contrast
>>> but of addition: "And Jesus and his disciples had also been invited
>>> to the
>>> wedding." I think the two opening verses are simply introducing
>>> the key
>>> participants in the account being presented.
>>>
>>> Carl W. Conrad
>
>
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