[B-Greek] Thought for Thought translations

Sarah Madden sarah.r.madden at gmail.com
Mon Feb 4 03:34:45 EST 2008


Matthew --
You asked what I meant by "thought for thought" translations (e.g., NIV)
versus more literal translations (e.g., KJV, NASB). To me, the
thought-for-thought concept means that the translator interpolates what is
written between the lines and adds what s/he believes to be the real meaning
even if the word is not in the Greek. For example, if the text only has a
verb but no explicit subject (e.g., "he saw") but the context gives you a
clue that the person referenced is, say, Jesus, the thought-for-thought
translator would insert "Jesus" in place of "he" to make it "Jesus saw" --
but a literal translator would leave it at "he saw" and make the reader
figure out who the "he" is. In other places, especially more difficult Greek
passages, the translator would smooth over the words to produce better
English. I personally do NOT prefer this kind of translation even
though some people like it because it makes for an easier "read." This kind
of translation smoothing is evident in Hebrews 1, especially Heb 1:3 where
"Son" and "God" are helpfully added by the NIV, but the Greek text does not
have "Son" or "God":

Heb 1:3a hOS WN APAUGASMA THS DOXHS
Literal:  "who being the radiance of the glory ..."
NIV: "*The Son is the radiance of God's glory ..."*
*NASB: "*And He is the radiance of His glory ..."
 .

Sarah
sarah.r.madden at gmail.com

On Feb 3, 2008 3:45 PM, Matthew Blair <mpblair at gmail.com> wrote:

> Sarah,
>
> Thanks much for the documents.  I have glanced over them and I really
> appreciate the footnoting and the side-by-side comparison.  It's going to be
> some time though, before I can really delve into this to see what you meant
> by "thought-for-thought".
>
> By the way, could you please tell me how much of Mounce's BBG and workbook
> would be covered in a one-semester class?  I am almost done with the noun
> system (Ch. 14) and am getting ready to delve into verbs in the next week or
> so.  I have been working on this since Dec 2007, so about 2 full months.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Matthew
>
>   On Feb 1, 2008 8:11 PM, Sarah Madden <sarah.r.madden at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >
> > Hi, Matthew --
> > Well, in response to your request, I did a quick look at how NIV treats
> > Hebrews 1, since I am translating that book for a course this semester. Let
> > me know what you think. I'm also including my translation notebook
> > (translated only through chapter 4 so far) so you can get an idea of how I
> > handle translation tasks.
> >
> > Sarah
> >
> >
> > On Feb 1, 2008 6:09 PM, Matthew Blair <mpblair at gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > > Hi Sarah,
> > >
> > > I'm not sure I understand what you mean by a "thought for thought"
> > > translation.  Do you have an example that I could use to compare the Greek
> > > versus the NIV and the NASB?
> > >
> > > Thanks,
> > >
> > > Matthew
> > >
> > >   On Feb 1, 2008 7:53 AM, Sarah Madden <sarah.r.madden at gmail.com>
> > > wrote:
> > >
> > > > Matthew --
> > > > This is offline.It has been my experience that NIV rarely gets it
> > > > right when it comes to translating the Greek into English. NIV is more of a
> > > > "thought for thought" translation -- or even a paraphrase, if you will. You
> > > > will have better success seeing how the Greek is translated into English if
> > > > you look at a more literal English translation (e.g., NASB, KJV, or
> > > > New KJV). Not a sermon, just a thought.
> > > >
> > > > Sarah Madden
> > > > sarah.r.madden at gmail.com
> > > > Maryland
> > > >
> > > >   On Jan 31, 2008 9:37 PM, Matthew Blair <mpblair at gmail.com> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > >  Greetings again,
> > > > >
> > > > > I'm working on the exercises for Chapter 13 (demonstrative
> > > > > pronouns) in BBG,
> > > > > and the first translation exercise is a fragment from John 10:18.
> > > > >
> > > > > TAUTHN THN ENTOLHN ELABON PARA TOU PATROS MOU
> > > > >
> > > > > this the commandment I received from father my
> > > > >
> > > > > Since the demonstrative pronoun is functioning as an adjective, it
> > > > > is in the
> > > > > same case as the noun ENTOLHN.  Since ENTOLHN is in the accusative
> > > > > case, I
> > > > > translated this sentence as
> > > > >
> > > > > "I received this commandment from my Father."
> > > > >
> > > > > However, the answer key (and the NIV) translate this sentence as:
> > > > >
> > > > > "This commandment I received from my Father."
> > > > >
> > > > > Both translations are identical in meaning, in my opinion.  Is
> > > > > there a
> > > > > reason why one would choose the NIV translation?
> > > > >
> > > > > Thanks for your time,
> > > > >
> > > > > Matthew Blair
> > > > > ---
> > > > > B-Greek home page: http://www.ibiblio.org/bgreek
> > > > > B-Greek mailing list
> > > > > B-Greek at lists.ibiblio.org
> > > > > http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/listinfo/b-greek
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > Sarah
> > > > sarah.r.madden at gmail.com
> > > > work: 301.429.8189
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Sarah
> > sarah.r.madden at gmail.com
> > work: 301.429.8189
> >
>
>


-- 
Sarah
sarah.r.madden at gmail.com
work: 301.429.8189



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