[B-Greek] What to Read?

Sarah Madden sarah.r.madden at gmail.com
Sat Jul 19 13:48:05 EDT 2008


*To George Somsel --*
Yes, the paper copy for highlighting and writing one's notes is a
student's working copy when he/she is working through a passage -- it is NOT
the bound NA27.  :-) I prefer to keep my GNT clean of notes so I can read it
without distractions.

Thanks for your second comments about the value for beginning students of at
least figuring out the elements of a sentence before attempting to make a
sensible translation.

*To Eddie Mishoe --*
I agree with you that the word order is extremely important in terms of
emphasis and understanding what the Greek really means, but a student in the
first year of Greek needs to have at least some sort of order in his/her
brain, and finding the verb seems to help a lot. At this point, many
students can't even figure out whether a word is a verb, noun, or something
else entirely. If one just reads across a sentence without paying attention
even subconsciously to the function of the words (noun or verb? direct
object or subject? main verb or a participle? conjunction? adverb or
adjective?) one could come up with fractured meanings, much as a
semi-literate person does in English when some say, ""Him and I drove to the
store." Sounds awkward. If this were a Greek sentence, and you needed the
real meaning, perhaps it would change to "I drove him to the store" or "He
and I drove to the store."

Sarah
sarah.r.madden at gmail.com
Maryland. USA

On Sat, Jul 19, 2008 at 12:50 PM, Eddie Mishoe <edmishoe at yahoo.com> wrote:

> Sarah:
>
> I would actually discourage students against this 'look for the verb then
> subject.' Read it as the Greeks read it... straight across. They put words
> in a specific order for a reason. Your method tends to see learning Greek as
> a way of converting the Greek into an English gloss-like translation
> procedure in English order. To me, if you ever want to master Greek, you
> will have to abandon this notion of "translation Greek."
>
> Eddie Mishoe
> Pastor
>
>
> --- On Sat, 7/19/08, Sarah Madden <sarah.r.madden at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > From: Sarah Madden <sarah.r.madden at gmail.com>
> > Subject: Re: [B-Greek] What to Read?
> > To: manuchon1 at free.fr
> > Cc: "B-Greek B-Greek" <b-greek at lists.ibiblio.org>
> > Date: Saturday, July 19, 2008, 12:42 PM
>  > Emmanuel--
> > To read more fluidly, I find it useful to read aloud and to
> > search for the
> > verb first  then a noun in the nominative case. With these
> > two elements, you
> > often have the skeleton of the sentence. All of the other
> > items
> > (conjunctions, adverbs, adjectives) should feed this basic
> > sentence outline.
> > When I mentor fellow students as a TA, I encourage them to
> > even highlight
> > the verb on their paper copy, and they find this is
> > extremely helpful.
> >
> > Sarah
> > sarah.r.madden at gmail.com
> > Maryland. USA
> >
> > On Fri, Jul 18, 2008 at 4:05 PM, <manuchon1 at free.fr>
> > wrote:
> >
> > > Thanks to all for you help.
> > >
> > > Another question : Have you any tips on
> > "how" read ? Like in other
> > > language, I search for conjunction. I begin to realize
> > that seeing
> > > "prepositionnal phrases" or
> > "participial phrases" as a whole is useful. But
> > > are there other thing to pay attention for ?
> > >
> > >
> > > Concerning, the citation of Oscar Wilde "In
> > France, nobody speaks English.
> > >  In America, nobody speaks
> > > English well." I think it's equaly true the
> > other way : "in America nobody
> > > speaks French. In France, nobody speaks French
> > well" ;-)
> > >
> > > Regards,
> > >
> > > Emmanuel
> > > ----- Mail Original -----
> > > De: "Mark Lightman"
> > <lightmanmark at yahoo.com>
> > > À: "B-Greek B-Greek"
> > <b-greek at lists.ibiblio.org>, manuchon1 at free.fr
> > > Envoyé: Jeudi 17 Juillet 2008 18:08:42 GMT +01:00
> > Amsterdam / Berlin /
> > > Berne / Rome / Stockholm / Vienne
> > > Objet: Re: What to Read? (Was [B-Greek] Learning Greek
> > (ad nauseam and for
> > > the umpteenth time)
> > >
> > > If your goal is to understand the Greek NT and you
> > want to read something
> > > else in Greek, nothing comes close to the Apostolic
> > Fathers.  Same vocab,
> > > similar syntax, lots of LXX and even some NT quotes,
> > and, for the most
> > > part, these authors are TRYING to be understood, which
> > I'm afraid I cannot
> > > say the same for Sophocles or Thucydides.  I agree
> > that the Enchirideon is
> > > also worth reading.  There is a recent critical
> > edition which includes the
> > > Christian paraphrases, which I would recommend because
> > they are a
> > > little easier than the originial.
> > >
> > > You ask "So, what are your advices?"  I
> > think we would say, "What is
> > > your advice?"  But maybe your wording is better
> > because you are unlikely
> > > to get only ONE bit of advice on anything subject on
> > this list.
> > >
> > > Mark L.
> > >
> > >
> > > --- On Thu, 7/17/08, manuchon1 at free.fr
> > <manuchon1 at free.fr> wrote:
> > >
> > > From: manuchon1 at free.fr <manuchon1 at free.fr>
> > > Subject: Re: [B-Greek] Learning Greek (ad nauseam and
> > for the umpteenth
> > > time)
> > > To: "B-Greek B-Greek"
> > <b-greek at lists.ibiblio.org>
> > > Date: Thursday, July 17, 2008, 1:27 AM
> > >
> > > Dear all,
> > >
> > >
> > > So, my question is more WHAT to read? With all that
> > I've read of you, it
> > > seems to me that reading classical greek is
> > interesting. The point seems to
> > > be
> > > that, in reading, you will encounter a lot of
> > expressions, ways of saying
> > > things, not so common in the new testament, so when
> > you see them you are
> > > not
> > > surprised by them but have mastered them. For the
> > common expressions, ways
> > > of
> > > saying things, because they are common in the new
> > testament, you will
> > > encounter
> > > them and will have the opportunities to master them!
> > >
> > > For the moment, I went through Mounce, have read about
> > 2/3 of Wallace. In
> > > my
> > > lybrary there are : BDF, BAGD, Robertson is in its
> > way.  I try to read the
> > > pauline epistles, but I see that I can understand, not
> > because I understand
> > > the
> > > greek but because I know some english or french
> > translation of it. This is
> > > not
> > > really what I want...
> > >
> > > So, what are your advices? Are there some good reading
> > course (Athenaze???)
> > > ?
> > > Or have I to buy Liddle-Scott, a classical grammar
> > (Smyth?) and merely read
> > > anything I want? Is there some Author or texts that
> > your recommend (because
> > > of
> > > the vocabulary or anything else)?
> > >
> > > Thanks to all who will help me!
> > >
> > > Emmanuel Hechon
> > >  ---
> > > B-Greek home page: http://www.ibiblio.org/bgreek
> > > B-Greek mailing list
> > > B-Greek at lists.ibiblio.org
> > > http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/listinfo/b-greek
> > >
> > >
> > > ---
> > > B-Greek home page: http://www.ibiblio.org/bgreek
> > > B-Greek mailing list
> > > B-Greek at lists.ibiblio.org
> > > http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/listinfo/b-greek
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Sarah <><
> > sarah.r.madden at gmail.com
> > work: 301.429.8189
> > ---
> > B-Greek home page: http://www.ibiblio.org/bgreek
> > B-Greek mailing list
> > B-Greek at lists.ibiblio.org
> > http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/listinfo/b-greek
>
>
>
>


-- 
Sarah <><
sarah.r.madden at gmail.com
work: 301.429.8189



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