[B-Greek] EK TOU KOSMOU from the world, or of the world.

Iver Larsen iver_larsen at sil.org
Wed Nov 12 00:36:57 EST 2008


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Oun Kwon" <kwonbbl at gmail.com>
To: <b-greek at lists.ibiblio.org>
Sent: 12. november 2008 07:20
Subject: [B-Greek] EK TOU KOSMOU from the world, or of the world.


...
> Then, in Jn 15:19 we read:
>
> (a) EI *EK TOU KOSMOU* HTE
> hO KOSMOS AN TO IDION EFILEI
> (b) OTI DE *EK TOU KOSMOU* *OUK* ESTE
> (c) ALL EGW EXELEXAMHN UMAS *EK TOU KOSMOU*
> DIA TOUTO MISEI UMAS hO KOSMOS
>
> Three occurrences of EK TOU KOSMOU in this verse.  The first two are in the
> form of 'to be EK TOU KOSMOU (of the world; belonging to the world)'.
> While the last one is in the form of 'to chose EK TOU KOSMOU' (out of the
> world).
>
> English translations of the phrase in (a) & (b) read as '*of the world*'
> (in KJV and many), or '*belonging to the world*' (in NET and many).   ALT
> put these as *"from the world*'.  Most translates (c) '*out of the world*'.
>
> As far as I can hear in English, 'of' and 'out of' are opposite in sense. If
> they are *not *'of the world', then should mean they are* *'out of the
> world' = 'from the world".
>
> It seems strange to me that the same Greek phrase EK TOU KOSMOU be
> understood somehow in two opposite senses.  Is it because of different
> verbal phrases (with 'be' and with 'do')?   The first two are in the form of
> 'to be EK TOU KOSMOU (of the world; belonging to the world)', while the last
> one is in the form of 'to chose EK TOU KOSMOU' (out of the world).

Since you consult a number of English versions, I would recommend that you look carefully at the New 
Living Translation which will often explain more clearly implicit information.
The word EKLEGW as used in John does not focus on the decision, but on the consequent action or 
movement involved. It is bit like picking a football team from a large group of potential players. 
Also look at the preceding context and especially in 15:16 where the same word is used twice and the 
action is clear: They have have chosen/appointed to go out and bear fruit.
So, the moving away from the world is implied in EKLEGW and that is why NLT makes "to come" 
explicit: "I chose you to come out of the world".

Iver Larsen 




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