[B-Greek] What we can live with (was papyrus text)
Yancy Smith
yancywsmith at sbcglobal.net
Mon Apr 13 11:30:17 EDT 2009
I certainly agree, that is why I said "part of a system." However, the
prununciation or phonetics of natural language has its own internal
logic--a basic saw in linguistics--that facilitates the use of the
language by reducing or harmonizing otherwise difficult to pronounce
combinations. I believe that natural pronuciation can help the brain
establish pattern and connections that may also be missed. On the
other hand, educated native speakers also can "contrive" pronunciation
(or make it pedantically accurate) for the purpose of teaching the
language at time, though fluidity is usually the goal in such cases.
Some of you with more lingustic knowledge may be able to help me out
here, but it seems to me that a natural phonetic derived from native
speakers would be better for learning a language than one contrived by
non-native speakers. For example, the presence of B in MESHMBRIA (Acts
22:6) suggests that KOINE speakers trilled the intervocalic RHO much
like Spanish speakers do today. BDAG dutifully reports that the word
is a combination of MESOS + hHMERA. The E is reduced resulting in the
combination MR. Because the R is pronounced as a dental flap, it gets
represented as MBR-
Yancy Smith, PhD
5636 Wedgworth Road
Fort Worth, TX 76133 USA
On Apr 13, 2009, at 8:37 AM, "Suttles, Andrew C. (GRC-DSI0)" <andrew.c.suttles at nasa.gov
> wrote:
> Dr. Smith -
>
>> The Erasmian pronunciation scheme is part of a system that has
>> rarely produced students capable of actually thinking or much less
>> communicating in Greek. <
>
> It seems we may be asking a "pronunciation scheme" to carry a burden
> it's not capable of bearing.
>
> Andrew
> Cleveland, OH
>
>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: b-greek-bounces at lists.ibiblio.org
>> [mailto:b-greek-bounces at lists.ibiblio.org] On Behalf Of Yancy Smith
>> Sent: Sunday, April 12, 2009 4:27 PM
>> To: greek B-Greek
>> Subject: Re: [B-Greek] What we can live with (was papyrus text)
>>
>>
>>
>> Mark EGRAPSE:
>>
>>
>> I can't really explain why I can live with TA and TO sounding
>> alike but not TO and TWi.
>>
>> If you want to make a convert to Living Koine out of one of
>> the most articulate defenders of Erasmus out there (me), you
>> are going to have to convince him how he CAN live with it.
>>
>> I for one wish we could live with a higher standard in
>> teaching/ learning Greek at a seminary level. A standard to
>> which Dr. Buth's comments point indirectly. The "imprecision"
>> in the spelling of Greek in the papyri is an indicator of a
>> living language in use: something toward which our teaching
>> and learning should strive. I have used LIVING KOINE for
>> non-traditional students in seminary who have learning
>> disorders (e.g. unable to memorize the alphabet). I lament,
>> however, that we could not use it for traditional students.
>> The problem was not the students, but lack of faculty unable
>> to try something other than the dismally unsuccessful
>> traditional appraoch.
>> We should judge the traditional approach by the same
>> standard we use to determine the success or failure of any
>> other foreign language teaching program. The Erasmian
>> pronunciation scheme is part of a system that has rarely
>> produced students capable of actually thinking or much less
>> communicating in Greek.
>>
>> Success in these two areas would certainly lead to greater
>> facility in understanding the texts of ancient Christians.
>> Perhaps it would lead to greater quality in the application of
>> the fruits of exegesis.
>>
>> Yancy Smith, Ph.D.
>> 5636 Wedgworth Road
>> Fort Worth, TX 76133
>> 817-675-6033
>>
>>
>> ---
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