[B-Greek] Musings over John 1:16

Iver Larsen iver_larsen at sil.org
Thu Apr 16 07:46:26 EDT 2009


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Donald COBB" <docobb at orange.fr>
To: "Margaret Sim" <margaret_sim at sil.org>; <b-greek at lists.ibiblio.org>
Sent: 16. april 2009 11:42
Subject: Re: [B-Greek] Musings over John 1:16



> Iver, it seems to me that the suggestion "because (hOTI) we have received
> some of that 'fullness', then we have been able to perceive the greatness of
> his glory" goes in a different direction from what the prologue actually
> says. I would be more inclined to interpret v. 14b as a reference to the
> seeing that is connected to the Word becoming flesh in 14a: "We saw the
> glory of the one who put up his tent among us" (the same idea will be picked
> up again in 2:11 and elsewhere). KAI ETHEASAMETHA is the logical consequence
> of EGENETO and ESKHNWSEN. It's difficult for me to see v. 16 as the
> explication or "reason" of v. 14b. It seems more natural to see v. 16 as
> that which explains v. 17, which is introduced by its hOTI: "We have
> received a fullness of overabundant grace *because* grace and truth have
> come about through Jesus Christ". The fact that v. 18 begins with an
> asyndeton tends to isolate v. 17 as the culminating point of the preceeding
> development, i.e., the reason for the writer's and readers' "receiving
> fullness".

I do not understand what you mean by "different direction".
A hOTI connects two clauses. Usually a hOTI supports (is subordinated to) the preceding clause, but 
occasionally it can support a following clause. However, in this case, there is no clause it could 
point forward to and support, since the next clause has its own hOTI. Therefore, it has to refer 
backwards to a preceding clause which we agree is 14b.

14 a refers to the incarnation, but many of those who saw Jesus did not believe that he was the Son 
of God, full of grace and truth. 14b only applies to those few who were "born again" to use John's 
term. In my view 16a refers to that event of being born again. Then we received some of that glory 
and we have received a new grace that replaces (ANTI) earlier grace. As v. 17 implies, the grace and 
truth of Christ is far above that found in the Law of Moses.

John often uses asyndeton, and even within v. 17 you find asyndetaon between the two constrastive 
clauses. I don't think we can put too much emphasis on his asyndeton.

> So where does that leave the hOTI that begins v. 16? If it's not causal--or
> "representational", Mary, if I've correctly understood your terminology in
> my rapid perousal of your chapter (many thanks!)--then it seems to be
> hanging somewhat loosely. X. Léon-Dufour, in his commentary, translates:
> "Yes, from his fullness we have received". Could we then say, along with
> Léon-Dufour and Ridderbos, that the clause introduced by hOTI (v. 16)
> functions as a summary of what precedes (including perhaps also v. 15)?

Do these two gentleman suggest that hOTI functions to mark a summary? I am not aware that hOTI (or 
KAI) can ever introduce a summary. Are they translating the text with hOTI or the alternative 
reading with KAI, which is well supported and the majority text reading?

Iver Larsen 




More information about the B-Greek mailing list