[B-Greek] Rom 4:1
Iver Larsen
iver_larsen at sil.org
Tue Jul 21 08:52:56 EDT 2009
Your suggestion makes good sense in context. This is followed by the
God's Word translation. I won't quarrel with this general understanding of the
sense, but I don't think we can defend an "accusative of respect" with this
verb when there is no preposition. (I see now that Carl has addressed this.) I
would rather understand hEURISKW in the sense of "discover, experience" with
respect to the implied concept of justification. The word is commonly used in
the phrase "find favour in the eyes of God". I think the key verse in the mind
of Paul is Gen 15:6 (Abram believed the LORD, and he credited it to him as
righteousness.) This verse is quoted both
in Rom 4:3 - part of this context - and in Gal 3:6 where Paul talks about the
same topic.
TEV: What was his experience?
NET: has discovered regarding this matter
NIV: discovered in this matter
NLT: What did he discover about being made right with God?
What he discovered was that by faith he was counted as righteous in the eyes of
God.
Iver Larsen
----- Original Message -----
From: George F Somsel
To: Iver Larsen ; Yancy Smith ; Oun Kwon ; greek B-Greek
Sent: 21. juli 2009 11:58
Subject: Re: [B-Greek] Rom 4:1
4 Τί οὖν ἐροῦμεν εὑρηκέναι Ἀβραὰμ τὸν προπάτορα ἡμῶν κατὰ σάρκα; 2 εἰ γὰρ Ἀβραὰμ
ἐξ ἔργων ἐδικαιώθη, ἔχει καύχημα, ἀλλʼ οὐ πρὸς θεόν.
TI OUN EROUMEN hEURHKENAI ABRAAM TON PROPATORA hHMWN KATA SARKA? 2 EI GAR
ABRAAM EC ERGWN EDIKAIWQH, EXEI KAUXHMA, ALL' OU PROS QEON.
The solution which you propose fails in my estimation precisely because there is
no real connection between v. 1 and what follows (which I include above). I
would not read ABRAAM either as the subject of the infinitive nor as its object.
Instead I would understand it as an accusative of respect. It would then read,
"What shall we say we have found with respect to our physical ancestor Abraham?
For if Abraham was justified by works, he has a cause for boasting, but not
about God."
george
gfsomsel
… search for truth, hear truth,
learn truth, love truth, speak the truth, hold the truth,
defend the truth till death.
- Jan Hus
_________
From: Iver Larsen <iver_larsen at sil.org>
To: Yancy Smith <yancywsmith at sbcglobal.net>; Oun Kwon <kwonbbl at gmail.com>; greek
B-Greek <b-greek at lists.ibiblio.org>
Sent: Tuesday, July 21, 2009 12:58:00 AM
Subject: Re: [B-Greek] Rom 4:1
Sent: 20. juli 2009 23:34
Subject: Re: [B-Greek] Rom 4:1
The only analysis that makes sense to me is to take the sentence as a question
consisting of two clauses where the second clause is the complement to EROUMEN:
"What, then, shall we say that Abraham, our human ancestor, has discovered?"
Paul is here speaking to Jews who put a lot of emphasis on doing the "works of
the Torah", but - he tells them - our venerable forefather Abraham had already
discovered (only here is the verb found in the perfect tense) that he was
accepted as being in right standing with God because of his faith, apart from
works (CWRIS ERGWN, v. 6).
I am not afraid of challenging traditional analyses and exegeses, but one must
make a solid case for it, and neither Lenski, Hays nor Wright have been able to
do so.
I have now read the thread on this topic from October 2001, where Lenski is
cited as supporting your number 3. His arguments are quite unconvincing, and
Steve Lo Vullo made some good points in his responses on the list.
Iver Larsen
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