[B-Greek] The Last Trump

Timothy Lawson tslawson1 at yahoo.com
Sun Oct 3 23:51:02 EDT 2010


Thanks Louis!

     I have a hard time knowing when to give up on trying to find a way to bring 
out the idea of participation/self-interest in the middle voice.

Timothy Lawson




________________________________
From: Louis Sorenson <llsorenson at hotmail.com>
To: B-Greek List mail to all <b-greek at lists.ibiblio.org>
Sent: Sun, October 3, 2010 7:37:20 PM
Subject: Re: [B-Greek] The Last Trump



O TIMOQEOS EGRAYE......Timothy wrote...

With that kind encouragement from Mark, I'll ask a question.

How might ANASTHSONTAI be rendered/understood?  Inasmuch as the 
verb is in the middle voice and indicates a possible participation
in the action, it is difficult to imagine how the "dead" can 
participate in their own "resurrection" if it is to be rendered as 
"resurrected".

Louis says....
Think of the song by Chris Tomlin.....I Will Rise... are you doing it?...
Yes and no....you are not the agent..but the passive/active subject
(A Koine Greek version - however incorrect can be found at
http://www.letsreadgreek.com/songs/iwillrise/iwillrise.txt 


[Chorus:] 
And I will rise when He calls my name 
No more sorrow, no more pain 
I will rise on eagles' wings 
Before my God fall on my knees 
And rise 
I will rise 

TOUNOMA MOU KALOUMENON
MHT' ECWN LUPHN MHT' ALGOS 
PETHSOMAI D' hWS hO AETOS 
PRO TOU QEOU MOU TA GONATA KAMYW
ANASTHSOMAI
ANASTHSOMAI

καὶ ἀναστήσομαι
τούνομά μου καλούμενον
μήτ' ἔχων λύπην
μήτ' ἄλγος
πετήσομαι δ' ὡς ὁ ἀετὸς 
πρὸ τοῦ θεοῦ μου
τὰ γόνατα κάμψω 
ἀναστήσομαι
ἀναστήσομαι

You participate in your resurrection in that it is happening to you. Hence the 
middle voice --- 

which does not definitely state that you are the subject or object of the 
action,
but which states it is happening to you or you are doing it. The middle does not 

always mean the subject is doing the action or is the primary force behind it. 
But the focus is on who is rising --- you....

Carl Conrad calls this subject-afectedness... if I've got him correct. He has 
written a 

paper on the middle voice that all should read....


Timothy wrote...

Inasmuch as the verb is in the middle voice and indicates a possible 
participation in the action, it is difficult to imagine how the "dead" can 
participate in their own "resurrection" if it is to be rendered as 
"resurrected".

The dead will "rise" seems to be active in voice though it may be that the verb 
is considered deponent. 


  However, if the idea is that they are roused from a sleeping condition (as is 
indicated at 1Thess.4:15) then participation could be envisioned, such as occurs 

at Acts 14:7 where Peter is "roused" and told to "stand up." In that text both 
forms of the word for rise/resurrection are used. Can "ANASTHSONTAI" encompass 
the idea of being "roused" from sleep with participation implied or would that 
be reading more into the verb than is there?    
                        
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