From: Mr. Timothy T. Dickens (firstname.lastname@example.org)
Date: Sun Mar 30 1997 - 20:49:42 EST
At 06:44 PM 3/30/97 -0500, Edward Hobbs wrote:
>Dear Timothy, and colleagues of B-Greek:
> Logging in on this Easter evening after 6, I find a question about
>LXX which Carl has not already answered! So I'll tackle it.
> I have a question translating Isaiah 9:1-2. The translations of
>these two verses I came up with is:
> The people who are walking in darkness, Look! a great light! Those
>dwelling in the region (xwra) and in the shadow of death, a light will shine
>up them. Most (to pleiston) of the people, who were lead (kathgages) into
>your happiness, they will be made glad before you as being made glad with
>milk (amhtw?), (kai on tropon) taking up weapons (skula).
> My first question is how would anyone translate ("kai on tropon" in
> Is the word 'amhtw' in this sentence mean 'with milk'? I could not
>find anything better in LSJ.
> Finally is 'kathgages' a 2nd, aorist participle from katagw? It
>seems so. any replies will be appreciated.
>Timothy T. Dickens
>First off, the opening NPs are Vocatives, which look just like nominatives.
>So you have:
>"You people walking in darkness: Behold a great light!
>You who are dwelling in the region of the shadow of death, a light will
>shine upon you!"
TTD: Ed, this form is possible, i.e., nominative, masc. pl, and vocatives
are identical, but why make them vocative in this context? Are you
suggesting this from the previous lines, Isa. 8:23b onwards?
> [CORAi and SKIAi are probably appositive to each other.
> which translates better as "region OF THE shadow".]
>"The greater part of the people which you brought down in your joy, even
>they shall be joyful before you, as those who rejoice in the harvest, and as
>those dividing the spoils."
>--hON TROPON means "as"; it is in LSJM.
TTD: I noticed this later.
>--AMHTOS is "harvest"; see LSJM.
TTD: I noticed that amhtos can ALSO mean milk. Personally, I like your
translation better, but why choose harvest over milk? Help me to better to
decide which form to use.
>--KATHGAGES is plain garden variety 2s, 1 aorist, of KATAGW.
TTD: ED, I do not know if you are familiar with a reference called _Verbi
Greci_, but it lists a similiar form (KATHGAGON) as 2nd aorist of katagw.
BAG also lists this verb as 2nd. Aorist. The first aorist, rarely used acc.
to LSJ, is kathza (z=ksi). Thus, it looks like it is 2nd. aorist.
>The biggest difficulty is that the LXX translator(s) didn't really grasp
>the Hebrew, and produced a kind of drivel.
TTD: Thanks Ed, I will be awaiting your swift reply. Shall I come back to
this after the X-files?
Peace and Love,
Timothy T. Dickens
Please visit my website at:
Jesus said "Let him who seeks continue to seek until he finds. When he
finds, he will be troubled. When he becomes troubled, he will be
astonished, and he will rule over the all."
The Gospel of Thomas, saying #2, Nag Hammadi Library
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