Re: The Climax of DOXA

Date: Mon Mar 30 1998 - 01:52:09 EST

Ben Crick wrote:
> On Sun 29 Mar 98 (08:31:04), wrote:
> > One of my little back burner questions in 1:14 [EQEASAMEQA], and 21:24
> > [OIDAMEN] as well, has to do with the identity of the 'we' ~ I'd like to
> > think that it's you and me, but have so far come up without much proof...
> Thanks George. IMHO the "we" is the 'editorial we'; the writer of the 4th
> Gospel never mentions his own name, nor does he use the "vertical pronoun",
> except in 21:25, which may not be Johannine anyway. He always uses the
> periphrasis "the disciple whom Jesus loved...". Of the Twelve, John is the
> only disciple not mentioned by name. Or, the 'we' is the collective 'we';
> "I and my fellow-disciples". Compare Russian /Meui s bratamee/ 'we with
> brothers' or "my brothers and I" plus the 1st person plural verb.

Hi Ben ~

This question is probably way off purpose on this list. The 1:14 'we'
could be attributed to the contemporaries of Christ who did indeed see
him in the flesh. The last one could not, and I would be very
surprised if it were in fact an editorial we. The possibility that
this passage was added on should not be overlooked. The fact that I
believe that it is indeed you and me and the writer comes from my own
subjective experience in the course of reading this gospel, and is
utterly out of bounds for purposes of textual exegesis.

The other matter, the authorship of this work, is perhaps more
appropriately discussable. "The disciple whom Jesus loved..." seems
so obviously to me to be Lazarus that when I read a commentary review
of scholarship opinion on it, I was stunned to find that it is just
not generally accepted. I have no problem at all with the idea that
he may have 'become' John in name, but the obviousness to me that
Lazarus wrote 'John" leaves me greatly puzzled that there could even
be another view.

Is this discussible here?


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